All I wanna say is, they don’t really care about us



The communal violence bill is being watered down. A few of its teeth are being knocked off. Predictably, pressure from the right has worked. I suddenly remember Michael Jackson. To borrow one of his songs, ‘they don’t really care about us’.

Despite his popularity that cut through race and ethnicity, Jackson ’s songs often captured the angst of racial discrimination, even though he was born four years after the American civil rights movement had successfully ended in the early 50s. Probably, subliminally he was aware of it somewhere down the line. Our predicament isn’t very different.

The Sonia Gandhi-led National Advisory Council will re-work the draft Prevention of Communal and Targeted Violence (Access to Justice and Reparations) Bill, 2011, bowing to pressures and threats from the right-wing Bharatiya Janata Party (BJP).

It is truth universally acknowledged and amply demonstrated at home too, that minorities of all categories need an appropriate level of protection of their life, property and dignity.

Much of the hostility towards the bill relates to two distinct provisions. One seeks to make targeted violence only against minorities a punishable offence; the other seeks to give the central or federal government consolidated powers to tackle such internal lawlessness (under Article 355 of the Constitution). Both of these remarkable provisions can now potentially undergo deletion or alterations.

Let this be stated upfront. Muslims need not be apologetic at all in demanding a law positively biased towards them when it comes to the issue of targeted violence. This was what one wrote in an earlier blog. This is what needs an emphatic repetition, to the point of banality.

The BJP sees the clause – of punishment only for those who target minorities – as utterly biased. Indeed it is — and rightly so. Minorities of all categories have long needed a special legislation to protect them from guided pogroms.

Let’s be clear about this new legislation. It isn’t about preventing communal violence per se, as the BJP thinks it is. It is more about enhanced protection to groups of people, who by default, are vulnerable and prone to suffer far greater causalities, persecution and hounding during communal violence.

It is to ensure dominant groups don’t prevail over non-dominant ones when largescale violence breaks out. It is to ensure foetuses aren’t scooped out of pregnant women and the words “ Om ” stamped on them. It is to ensure that police and civil administration don’t deliberately look the other way. It is to ensure that heads of state governments don’t allow numerically superior mobs to terrorize helpless minorities.

There is no evidence to suggest that the majority community will have no remedies available. In fact, all existing laws in the legal toolbox continue to be available. It is however evident that these very laws have historically proven to be inadequate when it came to protecting minorities during riot situations. (Refer to an earlier blog in this section.)

The BJP sees Gujarat as the locus of the draft legislation. Why not, shall we ask again? Targeted violence of minorities aptly falls under circumstances requiring federal or central intervention. Laws must be reworked towards this end, if they have not already been.

So, Article 355 of India’s Constitution — which enjoins the central government to protect states against “external aggression” and “internal disturbances” – was being reworked. The draft bill sought to expand “internal disturbance” to include violence against minorities.

“The occurrence of organized communal and targeted violence shall constitute internal disturbance within the meaning of Article 355 of the Constitution of India and the Central Government may take such steps in accordance with the duties mentioned thereunder, as the nature and circumstances of the case so requires,” Section 20 of the draft legislation states.

Now, this is being removed. “If there is a slightest fear or doubt that the Centre’s powers are being consolidated by reference to Article 355 and reference to internal disturbance in Article 355, we have simply recommended to delete it,” Farah Naqvi, NAC member and convenor of its working group on the Communal and Targeted Violence Bill was reported as saying.

Clause 30 of the draft Bill, which details the objectives of a national authority to deal with targeted violence, is also being done away with. What remains?

The BJP and its ideological fountainhead, the Rashtriya Swayemsevak Sangh, have talked about the draft bill in terms of Hindus versus Muslims. Familiar reasoning?

This law isn’t about Hindus versus Muslims versus Sikhs versus Jains versus Jews versus Parsis or indeed anyone else, as is being pointed out by the BJP’s mouthpieces inside and outside the party.

If it’s about protecting a Muslim in Gujarat, it’s equally about protecting a Hindu in Kerela’s Muslim belt or in Christian-majority Mizoram. Likewise, it’s also about protecting a Bihari in Mumbai.

As Michael Jackson’s songs often pointed out, it’s simply about protecting the underdogs. Stupid.

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  • L Mirza

    This bill should not see the light of the day.

    Muslims will be at significant disadvantage; socially ostracized with “legal protection”..

    This is another example of congresss pandering — throwing bones, but not meat. Bring programs to uplift locations and communities, irrespevtive of religion, allincluding muslims will benefit.

    And how can this be even practical? Is it going to be “defined’ at the central/state level? Shouldnt it be at the Panchayat level? if so, who decides who is minority/majority? What about Panchayats where there are Jats in majority and Brahmins in minority? Will Brahmins be protected?

    The country has numerous higher priority issues — that Congress does not want to do anything about the daily corruption that is happening in daily lives and want to draft a law about communal violence – less than 100 people get killed in a year in these violences in a country of 1.2 billion people – simply unbelievable.. Then take another cause – compulsory polio vaccination, compulsory and enforced primary education etc..

    People like Zia should use his perch to uplift and develop; not to divide and benefit.

    The biggest farce in India is this belief that there is a “national” minority. Any issue if there is, should be left to states to deal with.

    And where does it leave issues like the Sikh murders after Mrs Gandhis killing? Was it a targeted minority attack or congressmen killing people belonging to the killers of Indira Gandhi? Obviously this law will not address that situation.

    congress is trying to cement its vote block with an eye towards next lok sabha. I hope this does not pass; and even if it passes, I hope Muslims do not take this into accountb when they vote. , .;[

    [Reply]

    Judge Stern Reply:

    Thanks to L. Mirza for your articulated and thoughtful comments. I hope that the sane minds rather than the forked brains of Zia Haq and his like prevail at the legislative and judicial levels. India has lots of unpatriotic and vested interest elements, and it is very difficult to weave through the maze of those nefarious elements to get to the right destination. The ruling party has time and again sown the seeds of destruction of the country’s ethos and harmony in many disdainful ways. It is India’s misfortune that the successive governments have kept the significant portion of India’s population in illiteracy to advance the interests of the corrupt people in governments, judiciary and the media!

    [Reply]

  • L Mirza

    This bill should not see the light of the day.

    Muslims will be at significant disadvantage; socially ostracized with “legal protection”..

    This is another example of congresss pandering — throwing bones, but not meat. Bring programs to uplift locations and communities, irrespevtive of religion, allincluding muslims will benefit.

    And how can this be even practical? Is it going to be “defined’ at the central/state level? Shouldnt it be at the Panchayat level? if so, who decides who is minority/majority? What about Panchayats where there are Jats in majority and Brahmins in minority? Will Brahmins be protected?

    The country has numerous higher priority issues — that Congress does not want to do anything about the daily corruption that is happening in daily lives and want to draft a law about communal violence – less than 100 people get killed in a year in these violences in a country of 1.2 billion people – simply unbelievable.. Then take another cause – compulsory polio vaccination, compulsory and enforced primary education etc..

    People like Zia should use his perch to uplift and develop; not to divide and benefit.

    The biggest farce in India is this belief that there is a “national” minority. Any issue if there is, should be left to states to deal with.

    And where does it leave issues like the Sikh murders after Mrs Gandhis killing? Was it a targeted minority attack or congressmen killing people belonging to the killers of Indira Gandhi? Obviously this law will not address that situation.

    congress is trying to cement its vote block with an eye towards next lok sabha. I hope this does not pass; and even if it passes, I hope Muslims do not take this into accountb when they vote. , .;[

    [Reply]

    Judge Stern Reply:

    Judge Stern Reply:

    June 27th, 2011 at 2:12 am

    Zia should be strongly condemed for his divisive and pathetic article without an appropriate understanding of the socio-religious and socio-political circumstances of the minorities in India vis-a-vis those in USA! His myopic understanding as reflected in his article is deplorable and this kind of semi-skilled writer should not be employed by a national newspaper like the HT.

    Thanks to L. Mirza for your articulated and thoughtful comments. I hope that the sane minds rather than the forked brains of Zia Haq and his like prevail at the legislative and judicial levels. India has lots of unpatriotic and vested interest elements, and it is very difficult to weave through the maze of those nefarious elements to get to the right destination. The ruling party has time and again sown the seeds of destruction of the country’s ethos and harmony in many disdainful ways. It is India’s misfortune that the successive governments have kept the significant portion of India’s population in illiteracy to advance the interests of the corrupt people in governments, judiciary and the media!

    [Reply]

  • L Mirza

    Well, lok sabha elections are coming and congress is doling out another appeasement. Bones, no meat.

    Why won’t, for a change, Congress bring a truly developmental item for the disadvantaged instead of poopoos like this.

    People like Zia, is using his perch to promote division and destruction instead of development and uplifting.

    Any minority issue should be left to states. How will one aadminister this? Will it be at panchayat level (it has to be)? What if teh Pnchayat has only one religious group- let us say Hindus- but 75% is Dalit and 5% Brahmin and 20% Visya.. Or a community of Muslims with a minority Khojas.. who decoides what is a minority..

    India has too many other priority number 1s.. That congress does not want to do anything about corruption that is eating the country and want to deal with a non-issue — only less than 100 people per year get killed in communal violence in a country of 1.2 billion- is simply, “congressy”..

    It is even ironic that Mrs Sonia Gandhi, an Italian Christian woman, who has never been insulted by the country for her foreignness and religion, will bless this..

    This bill should not see the light of the day.

    Muslims will be at significant disadvantage; socially ostracized with “legal protection”..

    This is another example of congresss pandering — throwing bones, but not meat. Bring programs to uplift locations and communities, irrespevtive of religion, allincluding muslims will benefit.

    And how can this be even practical? Is it going to be “defined’ at the central/state level? Shouldnt it be at the Panchayat level? if so, who decides who is minority/majority? What about Panchayats where there are Jats in majority and Brahmins in minority? Will Brahmins be protected?

    The country has numerous higher priority issues — that Congress does not want to do anything about the daily corruption that is happening in daily lives and want to draft a law about communal violence – less than 100 people get killed in a year in these violences in a country of 1.2 billion people – simply unbelievable.. Then take another cause – compulsory polio vaccination, compulsory and enforced primary education etc..

    People like Zia should use his perch to uplift and develop; not to divide and benefit.

    The biggest farce in India is this belief that there is a “national” minority. Any issue if there is, should be left to states to deal with.

    And where does it leave issues like the Sikh murders after Mrs Gandhis killing? Was it a targeted minority attack or congressmen killing people belonging to the killers of Indira Gandhi? Obviously this law will not address that situation.

    congress is trying to cement its vote block with an eye towards next lok sabha. I hope this does not pass; and even if it passes, I hope Muslims do not take this into accountb when they vote. , .;[

    [Reply]

  • shan

    first congratulation L MIRZA for such a honest riposte.
    @Zia , probably the most REACTIONARY article , which surpassed his own benchmark.
    To compare the situation of blacks in USA with MUSLIMS in india is simply breathtaking in falsehood.
    You will qualify for NISHAN E PAKISTAN award.
    The bottom line is communal violence is like RAPE , doesn’t matter who is doing to whom , it is driven by lust, similarly communalviolence is driven by SOME THUGS with the motive of violence against people against whom they harbour hatred, ALSO LOT OF IT IS MOB PSYCHOLOGY. Mobs do not follow any rational trail of thought.
    To allow minority angle COLOUR the bill , would have undermined the very purpose of the bill
    TO SEND A MESSAGE ANY COMMUNAL VIOLENCE WILL INCUR SEVERE PUNISHMENT.
    As for blacks and muslims in India , ZIA PLEASE TYPE DEGANGA IN GOOGLE.
    This is CHEAP STUNT by CON gress , whose love for muslims is wellknown and whose role was exposed during BHAGALPUR RIOTS , BABRI DEMOLITION AND ALL THE RIOTS IN INDEPENDENT INDIA , overwhelming majority of that period under CON gress rule.
    What a bunch of tossers.
    Fifteen women dying everymonth in MP while delivering children , doesn’t make the CONgress take stock of the gravity of the situation of healthcare in India
    HOW ABOUT ALL THE INNOCENTS KILLED BY TERRORIST IN INDIA , A LAW TO FORCE THE HAND OFTHEGOVT OF DAY TO TAKE MILITARY ACTION /ECONOMIC SANCTIONS AGAINST THE SPONSERS

    [Reply]

  • Binoy Hegde

    Shan/Mirza/Zia

    Comparing the Black situation to Muslim situation in India is pathetic—

    No wonder Zia was denied a visa to US.

    The whole tea party movement here is to get the country away from “hyphens” (sucha s African-american, Muslim-american etc and to “American”

    [Reply]

    Funny Side Reply:

    The other day, Salman Khurshid made a relevant remark – that the protection of minorities’ rights is just not the responsibility of one ministry, all other union & state ministries are equally responsible in their own way. Minorities need legal protection of course – as well as the three Ts promised by the BJP: Tahaffuz, Taleem & Tijarat. When there is a serious and sincere move for the upliftment of the Muslims, it will automatically bring in the votes – there is no need to make foxy moves of appeasement and then dodge the issue when it comes to the crunch. The same Salman Khurshid also said the Sachar report is not sacrosanct like the Quran – this statement says it all. But then, the Congress was able to win so many elections as it always believed in soft Hindutva – don’t do anything concrete for the Muslims while keeping the drama of doing much going on.

    [Reply]

    shan Reply:

    @Funny Side TRUTH HURTS

    [Reply]

  • Mohan R

    Is this guy Zia really a journalist.? Is HT a mainstream Indian news paper.? How can such
    article is allowed to be published . Full of hate. Are minorities suppressed so much in our
    country ? Is India a Taliban ? Ridiculous . What minorities is he talking about.?
    Abdul Kalam, Sonia Gandhi, Man Mohan Singh, YSR, Digvijay Sing, Shah Rukh Khan SalmanKhan,
    Aamir Khan, Azzarudin, Navjot Siddhu . I can name many many more.
    This guy Zia is a very dangerous person if he remains free to write all this rubbish.He should be in
    asylum . Disgusting .

    [Reply]

  • http://- Rajeev

    I think there should be a terror violence bill too. As a rule, muslims commit maximum terrorist activities so next time there is any terror activity the muslims should be held accountable.

    [Reply]

  • http://- Rajeev

    This bill will never be passed and if it gets passed, muslims will be the loser in the long run. Why does Zia not advocate for such protection for hindus in pakistan and bangladesh.

    The muslims have acted very strangely. In all muslims countries, they have laws favoring muslims and now same muslims want laws favoring them in non-muslim countries.

    No wonder they have been object of ridicule all over the word for such lopsided thinking.

    [Reply]

    Shoeb K Reply:

    Rajeev

    This is an ill-advised plan. I am of the belief there should not be any special deal for anybody, except the lowest economic cadre of the country.

    However, we should not use Pak, BD , oherr Muslim coutries etc as models. What Pak does or does not do is not one we shpould follow.

    And there is no meaning in Muslims for this; it is congress doing this. They do not have to do this.

    It was congress, if you remeber, instituted the Haj subsidy during the first oil shock; and see what it did to Muslims.

    [Reply]

  • Naveed

    BJP/RSS politics based on violence against the minorities. At least in two states it is in power because it resonates with Hindu Majority. Modi would never have won 2003 elections if he had not organized genocide of Muslims. Similarly Naveen Patnaik would not have won Orissa if he had not organized violence against the Christians in 2007. That is the reality of Indian politics. Now if India is serious about protecting minorities it must bring Narendra Modi to trial for his inspiration of mobs to commit genocide in 2002.

    [Reply]

    Binoy Hegde Reply:

    Naveed
    U r nuts. Why do u want to get into discussion on India..U have enough issues to solve there i n Karachi and co.

    Packing off christians and Muslims (as Pak has done) would have been possible if Hindus wanted it. Hindu culture and the larger Indian culture (including Indian Msulims/christians) is not one of exclusionj, it is one of inclusion.

    The Christian violence in Orissa ended up with 8 people getting killed …. Both Hindus and Muslims died in Gujrat, although more Msulims died.

    20 deaths here, 800 deaths there — is not a critical matter for a country of 1.3 billion people. nevertheless, everything should be done to minimize these.

    Last time I checked, a foreign born christian woman is the most powerful person in India. Its defence minister is a Christian. Its Vice president is a Muslim. Air Force chief is a christian. The most popular CM in andhra Pradesh recent history was a Christian. And now his son is siphoning votes away from congress.

    The reason why there are so many vcapable and influential christians compared to Muslims in Indian politics is that you Muslims are focused only on muslims, and Sharia, and Afghanistan and iraq and all that ****; or stick with Muslim parties, instead of joining mainstream parties like Congress or BJP aand work towards leadership.

    Get out of your hate programs…

    btww Modi will be the prime minister next. Let us see your argument then. ypou loser

    [Reply]

    Naveed Reply:

    How would a Hindu_Extremist respond to valid criticism based on facts. Look at the post by Binoy Hegde. For him a few hundred people butchered and burned alive does not matter. For me it matters a lot. It keeps the entire community in fear and backward. In Gujarat thousands of Muslims were killed and many more thousands were injured and it pushed Muslims of Gujarat back by a few decades. A Hindu ****** like Binoy measures the cost in a few hundred dead. A more intelligent and humane person looks at what it does to the community. Most important aspect is that has India ever punished a Hindu who has committed such heinous crimes against Minorities. As far Criminal Modi becoming Prime Minister, International Criminal Court is getting ready for people like Modi and Binoy Hegde at the same time.

    [Reply]

    shan Reply:

    @naveed , WOULD YOU GIVE YOUR ESTEEMED OPINION ON GODHRA, MUMBAI BLAST
    AND THE ARCHITECT OF MUMBAI BLAST getting son in law treatment in F uckistan.
    Amazing you guys dont learn do you , or is it Taquiya in full swing.
    How about salman tasser , and the rose petals showered on his killer by the LAWYERS.
    Ulta chor dantey kotwal ko.

    Binoy Hegde Reply:

    Naveed

    Nobody is condemning butchering and killing. We dop not live in a perfect world. And harmony cannot be imposed. It ahs to come from behaviours.

    Orissa incident had its roots in forced conversion. It also had its rooots in police not taking acttion on the attack on the swami. To blow it up as a crusadfe against christians is simply unwarranted and uncalled for. Whu do you think Mr Ak Antony will be appointed as the Defence Minister – even though he did not win an election – after nominating through the rajya sabh.. Will a country bent on destroying christians do this?

    Gujrt happened because Muslims burned a bogey. Now there are hundreds of reasons andd enials. But it was a classic acse of action and reaction.

    Listen, a Sri Lanka can happen in India where the minorities are decimated. every time when teh government creates special favors for minorities, India will eb inching towards teh Sri Lankan situation rather than an utopia fro Msulims.

    Nobody will touch Modi. he will become PM and will travel all over the world. Any countrty, including US, which denies him visa, will be doing at its own peril, choosing to close out a growing market.

    Deaths and killings are bad, But if Muslims are afraid ebcause of Gujrat killings, they deserve to be afraid.

    FYI, Muslims from other “safe” states are moving to gujrat for the ample jobs. Given a choice, Muslims, liek anybody else, will choose a supporting economy and peaceful life. Although what happened in Guj was bad, the good thing is thatGuj has been peaceful ever since. Sometimes a carnage (you said it) helps to enshrine peace. Just liek teh atomic bombas of second world war.

    Will u please get back to PAkistan and solve tehir problems.., u fruking ISI agent– how many times you wat to be humiliated

  • Naveed

    @Shan,
    I can give you opinion on Godhra, Kashmir, Mizoram, Tamil Nadu Telengana, Mumbai whatever you like as long the discussion is honorable without use of foul language. To me using invective is for low life people. Discuss issues based on facts and your opinion. People with low intellect resort to foul language and bring religious beliefs to prove that they are superior. My opinion on Godhra is that it was planned and executed by RSS/BJP. Narendra modi then mobilized state authority to carry out Genocide. Mumbai 26/11 is an act of terrorism. It was a retaliation to Samjhota Express blast. There are more people involved in it then just Kasab and the planners in Pakistan. India is unwilling to disclose the local accomplices of the attackers and it has stymied any investigation. Before India has the moral courage to ask for Punishment of Mumbai terror attacks, India should punish the perpetrators of Sikh Genocide of 1984, Muslim Genocide of 1992 and 2002 and Christian Genocide of 2007. India lacks moral credentials to ask anybody for anything. India has never punished any HINDU ever in its history for violence against minorities. Such is the shallowness of Indian secularism and democracy. Sikhs were slaughtered between 1984 and 1992. 25% of all Sikh Population either was killed, jailed or they left the country. There is not even a single Hindu ever tried for such atrocities.

    [Reply]

  • shan

    @naveed, IGNORANCE IS BLISS
    A court in Bhagalpur on Monday convicted 14 accused persons, including a police officer, in connection with the killing of 116 people at Logai village under Jagdishpur police station during the 1989 Bhagalpur communal riots.
    Among those who were pronounced guilty under sections 147, 302, 201, 436, 380 and 295A of the Indian Penal Code was Ramchandra Singh, who was serving as officer in-charge of the Jagdishpur PS when the incident took place.

    The others convicted were Kuldeep Mandal, Arjun Mandal, Prabash Mandal, Sukhdeo Mandal, Ajablal Mandal, Subash Mandal, Shivlal Mandal, Naresh Mandal, Jaddu Mandal, Ramdeo Mandal, Suryug Prasad Singh, Thakur Paswan and Jai Prakash Mandal.

    GARV SE KAHO MERA BHARAT MAHAN

    Blaming RSS for GODHRA NASSACRE IS LIKE BLAMING JEWISH CONSPIRACY FOR 9/11
    If Mumbai blast is revenge for samjhauta , then how about a GUJRAT part2 in revenge for AKSHARDHAM and MUMBAI CARNAGE 26/11 .
    Pathetic and Sad are appropriate words that comes into mind when describing you.
    The problem is pakistan is fIgting a lost cause , A PARITY WITH INDIA . It is like trying to look for cure of cancer in religious texts.

    [Reply]

    Naveed Reply:

    @shan,

    Tell how many Hindus have been convicted for Sikh Genocide in 1984, Desecration of Ayodhia mosque and subsequent massacre of Muslims in 1992 , Gujarat Genocide planned and executed by Chief Minister Narendra Modi and 2007 Massacre of Christians in Orissa (Odhisaa). You give one obscure persecution and conviction of Hindu Terrorist and claim a moral ascendancy. It is indeed very deceitful and below the dignity of humans. Indian democracy, secularism and Justice system is to preserve Hindu Theocracy and support stranglehold of upper caste Hindus over everything in India. Sikhs have been reduces to third rate citizens.

    If you missed the news, there were 25,000 Sikhs in London demanding a free homeland fro Sikhs. Can Sikhs do that in India?
    I do not know what Pakistan seeks. Again it shows your total lack of understanding. You do not want any Muslim in India to speak out of the terror they live in. Your writings would be amble reason to call you a Hindu_Terrorist.
    No Hindu-Terrorist will ever repeat Godhra again just watch your threats and then do not blame others.

    [Reply]

    Binoy Hegde Reply:

    Naveed

    My brief advice to you- get a life
    Desecratyion of Ayodhya mosque???? Is it Ok to desecrate a place of worship on which Baber built his mosque? Or if you take a pure pure nationalistic and rligipous view, should Hindus allow any non-Hindus in India..just a rhetorical question… Who was ther first?

    Do not manufavcture problems. Odissa massacre is 7 people! How many guys and girls get kille din your country every day by the suicide bombers?

    What the frucjk are you talking about Hindu theocracy??wwho is the hindiu “maulavi” all Hindus are listening to? Frucking Hindus can worship Allah, Jesus, Krishna or nobody..
    You are religious blinded ISI frucker..get out of here.. Will you be happy India ibecomes like Pakistan…

    Ask Ar rehman what dscrimination and crucifixion he faced..Ask Shah Ruh..Ask Dr Abful KAlam..ask the Kerala Sysrian Christians.. Ask Mrs Sonia Gandhi/ Ak Montek Singh…Ask Manmohan Singh../…

    Muslims are frucked up because of people like you!..

    [Reply]

    Rajeev Reply:

    Binoy,
    The general rule that muslims follow is that in all circumstances muslims should dominate over non-muslims whether it is muslim country or non-muslim.

    In non-muslim country they present themselves as eternal victims asking for secularism and in non-muslim country they hold Quran in their hands and proclaim superiority over non-muslims. The Islam itself is name of communal politics where non-muslims are accorded status of second-grade citizen also called Dhimmis.

    The NAC bill is typical congress technique to get muslims back into its fold especially 19% muslims of Uttar Pradesh which can get them atleast 50 Lok Sabha seats. The muslims who are welcoming this appartheid against hindus are inviting trouble. Remember Khalistanis killed hindus for years but when hindus could not take it any longer, they retaliated. When muslims burnt 57 hindus alive in Godhra, same thing happened.
    The congress is going to use muslims for its own political purposes and in the end innocents from both sides with loose life..one in riot and other in terror violence.

    If this bill passes, then govt. should bring in terror violence bill where muslims will be presumed guilty till proven innocent as most of the blasts (for now 90%) are done by muslims.

    Rajeev Reply:

    Please read “in non-muslim country they hold Quran in their hands” as
    “in MUSLIM country they hold Quran in their hands”

    shan Reply:

    @naveed , I dont know if it is worth wasting time trying to enlighten you.As they say YOU CANNOT WAKE A PERSON PRETENDING TO BE ASLEEP.
    Have you heard of Teesta Stalvad, Best Bakery Judicial enquiry , SIT , these all relate to gujrat riots. Do you know about Modi being interrogated by special panel appointed by SUPREME COURT.It is not a islamic theocracy , WE DONT STONE WOMEN OR AMPUTATE LIMB OF THEIVES, we are a SECULAR FUNCTIONING DEMOCRACY, unless proven in a court of law , the ACCUSED HAS A RIGHT TO BE LET FREE.

    [Reply]

    tajender Reply:

    116 people at Logai village under Jagdishpur police station during the 1989 Bhagalpur communal riots.
    HE SHOULD HAVE BEEN HANGED IN 1990.JAIL TERM AFTER 21 YEARS IS DENIAL OF JUSTICE.

    Blaming RSS for GODHRA NASSACRE IS LIKE BLAMING JEWISH CONSPIRACY FOR 9/11
    SHAN BOTH ARE RIGHT.9/11 TOOK PLACE ON JEWISH NEW YEAR AT TIME WHEN NO JEW IS SUPPOSED TO BE IN OFFICE.

    AKSHARDHAM and MUMBAI CARNAGE 26/11 .
    ADVANI WAS CHEROGRAPHER OF AKHRDHAM.KPS GILL RESIGNED AFTER THSI.26/11 WAS ORCHESTRATED BY CIA MOSSAD AND SACRED BRHMNS.to kill karkare and ignite hindu muslim riots in india and pressurize pakistan to attack their own people.2 objective achieved third failed.jihadis murdered almost every burqa clad women at cst while showing helping brhmns to reach exit doors at taj and oberoi.

    congress is brhmnst party.bjp is bania,thakur aur nang.

    [Reply]

  • http://- Rajeev

    I am posting again as I simply can not believe that HT employs an open ideological Jehadi as a journalist. No wonder US refused to give him Visa.

    He is basically a Islamofascist.

    [Reply]

    Naveed Reply:

    Rajeev,
    You have little tolerance for opposing point of view. You shallowness is evident from your comments. The matter of fact is that you are a Fascists who tries other people from speaking out.

    [Reply]

    Rajeev Reply:

    Naveed,
    In Islamic countries you want laws favoring muslims and in non-muslims countries too you want similar laws.

    Is this not fascist then what is?

    You pakistanis have decimated 25% of the minority and you come on Indian blogs talking about minority rights.

    The muslims should be last person to talk about Secularism and Law. All you desire is for dominance over non-muslims. When 9/11 happens, you spin jewish conspiracy, when 26/11 happens, it becomes RSS Saazish and when Osama is found inside pakistan, it becomes American conspiracy.

    I totally agree with George Bush Jr. that Islamofascism is the biggest threat to world peace. If you people have so much problems with non-muslims, why don’t you all move to 57 muslim countries? There you will have full right to murder minorities and get away with it using some ****** Sharia laws.

    [Reply]

    tajender Reply:

    rajeev no islamic country in the world in run by islamic.in all muslim countries including saudi arabia everybody is equal before law.last week they excuted one indonesian muslim women.

  • Rakesh Katyal

    What protection you have in mind for the victims of Mumbai riots and 26/11. Most of the mafia running Mumbai unfortunately is your clan. What protection do you propose for them. The bill is completely silent.

    [Reply]

  • Candor

    Muslims firstly keep in mind that it is not their nation though they were allowed to stay after crafting Pakistan out of India for muslims. Further, they should avoid contention with Hindus on removing muslim excesses from all Hindus places including religious if they really want to avoid a communal divide. Indian govt. is also responsible for allow people to people contact with Pakistan otherwise, Indian muslims should have been made to live and relate itself upto India only. Hindus have given a place to muslims and they should understand Hindus sentiments and develop a society to live in harmony understanding each other rather than polarizing everything. Then only, India can move on as a united society.

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  • Dr Mishra, UK

    Naveed, agree with you that abuse has no part in any debate. You have every right to post your views here. But, you should also display an open mind and absorb facts, and then maybe admit that a lot of what you say is too outlandish.
    This statement of yours can only come if you are living in Pakistan, where brainwashing of public is at an extreme. I know, because I blog a lot on Pak newspapers- you say ‘ 25% of all Sikh Population either was killed, jailed or they left the country ‘

    Come on man, this is falsehood on an astronomical scale, reduce your anti Indian hatred so that you can get a proper, not a shrill worldview on world politics.

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  • farid

    Uniform –civil law — is enough to protect –weaker and oppressed civilians, irrespective of caste,creed or religion.The oppressor is a violator of law and law should be enforced impartially,that is enough.
    No special law can guarantee — a weaker//oppressed ones.
    It would have been better if Mr.Zia proposed —better education,progressive //scientific education for —

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  • Rakesh Katyal

    Mr Zia is does the bill care for Professors like Joseph whose hands were chopped off in Kerala. I didn’t see any of you writing anything that time. Conveniently all of you go into a hiding that time. High time we get out of our insecurities and start behaving like ordinary Indian citizens.

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  • RAMESH AGARWAL

    MR ZIA PREVIOUS DRAFT WAS PARTIAL SND DECROLIAN IN NATURE.IT NEEDS REDRAFTING.ALL RIOTERS IRRESPECTIVE OF TRIBE/CASTE/RELIGION SHOULD BE PUNISHED IF FIND FOUND GUILITY AND NOT MEMBERS OF ONLY MAJORITY COMMUNITY.MUSLIMS ARE BEING TREATED AS STATE GUESTS THAT IS EVEN ON FALSE COMPLAIN IT IS GIVEN WIDER PUBLICITY.ALMOST ALL KASHMIRI PUNDITA HAVE BEEN EXPELLED FROM VALLEY AND STILL LIVING AS REFUGEES IN THEIR HOMELAND, HINDUS ARE KILLEDIN KERLA AND IN NE STATES NO PUBLICTY.WHY 5CRORES ILEGAL BENGLADESHIES ARE NOT EXPELLED?WHY THERE WAS NO PROTEST AND CONDEMNATION ON THE BURNING OF 58 HINDUS IN A RAILWAY COACH AT GODHRA?SIMPLE REASON BECAUSE THEY ARE HINDUS.IN PAKISTAN HINDUS ARE REDUCED FROM 15 %TO 2%BUT NO ONE CONDEMNED NOT EVEN HT OR ZIA HAQ?THERE SHOULD NOT BE ANY BIASED BY MEDIA AND IMPARTIAL VIEWSSHOULD BE EXPRESSED,

    [Reply]

    tajender Reply:

    mkiop

    [Reply]

    tajender Reply:

    ramesh,PUBLICITY.ALMOST ALL KASHMIRI PUNDITA HAVE BEEN EXPELLED
    no kashmiri pundit was expelled from kashmir.still thousands are living and many are returning.
    they were removed by goverment to avoid the pain of round the clock curfew and commit all typre of atrocities on remaining population.operation was done under jagmohan a hindu nazi.dont forget on 6th nov 1947 250000 muslims were mascared in jammu by rss goons and army of raja WHO himself participated in the mascare/
    under raja rule punishment to kill cow was death.while killing kashmiri was 16.5 ruppes was 16.5.out of which 14 was taken by overment as processing fees.kashmiri were not allowed to walk on streets.
    hindus are killed in kerala……it is lie.hindus are killed in delhi by hindus

    [Reply]

  • Abhi

    “One seeks to make targeted violence only against minorities a punishable offence;”
    Nobody should object that minorities should be protected. However, today in India, everybody is a minority. The Brahmins are a minority, the banias are a minority, the obc’s are a minority, the sc/st’s are a minority, the muslims are a minority. The only majority are Khans, the Shah Rukh Khan, the Amir Khan, they are everywhere.
    Let us not loose the focus. The greatest danger to India today the culture of corruption which is eating into the vitals of of the country. The media is to be congratulated for its success in turning the issue of corruption into the issue of color of the clothes of a person. Almost Two TRILLION DOLLARS Dollars stashed away in the swiss banks! And you think the British looted India?

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  • Prashant Saxena

    Zia Al haq
    You are a paranoid isolationist who is driving yourself and your community into a self imposed exile, not allowing your community to merge with mainstream India. People like you are the reason Muslims are suspected, feared and loathed.
    I am a moderate with several muslim friends and am grateful none of them is like you. If instead of demanding separate laws to govern yourself, and generally carving out a separate identity, you just spent more time being yourself the person and not yourself the muslim, people would appreciate you for your personal qualities.

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  • Dr Mishra, UK

    DEAR ZIA

    Normally this blog is full of very disparate people who fight each other a lot. But it is rare for all to be united and criticise you for taking a stance which is actually retrogressive for your own community.
    What is particularly touching is the views of the muslims like Shoeb, Farid and Mirza above who have called it a minority appeasing gimmick.

    Any chance ZIA, that you could come on this blog section, like you used to, to debate, or in this case to say sorry that you got it so badly wrong ????

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  • http://- Rajeev

    I think most of you must have seen this documentary on 26/11. Two things that stand out are-
    1. Incompetence of Mumbai Police
    2. Irresponsible media who helped pakistani handlers guide 10 terrorists.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3s34koAajDQ

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  • Mohan R

    FUTURE NEWS

    Kasab dies at 85 in jail.

    Golmaal 27 will be released next month. Tushar Kapoor is still unable to
    speak or act.

    Sharad Pawar and his family owns half of the world.

    A girl in Delhi travels 50 feet safely.

    Lakshdweep Tigers to be the 63rd team to join IPL.

    Facebook is declared a country.

    Grandson of A.Raja along with daughter of Priyanka Wadhera involved in 8G scam.

    Pakistan wants Tamil Nadu and China has staked their claim on Mahrashtra. Our PM says
    that these issues can be resolved by peaceful talks.

    [Reply]

    Dr Mishra, UK Reply:

    Mohan R
    made my day, I shall copy this shamelessly

    [Reply]

    Rajeev Reply:

    Mohan R,
    Excellent. Can we also add this one?

    “Ottavio Gandhi great grandson of Rahul Gandhi ready to become PM at the age of 15″..This was announced by Ranvijay Samuel Singh great great grandson of Digvijay Singh.

    [Reply]

    Mohan R Reply:

    Rajeev ,

    Nice one . :)

    [Reply]

    Rajeev Reply:

    and also-

    Jumma-Ul-Haq terrorist leader (great grandson of journalist Zia Haq) was liquidated in an encounter in Afghanistan.

    [Reply]

  • tajender

    GOOD NEWS INDIA IS A TRUELY DEMOCRATIC COUNTRY.’2002 riot records destroyed’
    HT Correspondent, Hindustan Times
    Ahmedabad, June 29, 2011 Email to Author

    First Published: 23:46 IST(29/6/2011)
    Last Updated: 01:09 IST(30/6/2011)Share more…22 Comments Email print

    In a startling revelation, the Gujarat government has told the Nanavati Commission probing the 2002 Gujarat riots that all official documents pertaining to the period of the riots were destroyed four years ago. “As per general government rules the telephone call records, vehicle log book, the office r’s movement diary and are destroyed after a certain period. The state intelligence bureau records were also destroyed in 2007,” state government counsel SB Vakil said during the commission proceedings on Wednesday.

    Sanjiv Bhatt, who was deputy commissioner of police (Gujarat intelligence bureau) in 2002, had asked for the documents to be able to make a “meaningful deposition” before the inquiry panel. He was summoned by the commission in May. During Bhatt’s cross-examination, Vakil told the IPS officer that he had “crossed his limit” by levelling allegations against chief minister Narendra Modi.

    Bhatt had filed an affidavit in April alleging that Modi had told top police officials and bureaucrats to “let Hindus vent out their anger” after the Sabarmati Express was set on fire near Godhra railway station on February 27, 2002, killing 59 people. The incident triggered massive communal riots across Gujarat.

    Meanwhile, in a separate development, the Gujarat high court has asked the commission to clarify by July 8 whether it had summoned Bhatt as a witness or an informer

    [Reply]

    manujsk Reply:

    So? Whats the point? Are you trying to say that had those not been destroyed, you wpuld have grabbed Modi’s neck? Stop day dreaming. Those records were there for 5 years for any one to see. No one did. Tht says so much about the records. You are just looking for a reason to justify why you lost to Modi. Losers :)

    [Reply]

    tajender Reply:

    fascist state could go so mean that it will destroy all documents to save themselves.in any civilized country modi would have been hanged long ago.but modi is contrlloed by blood thiesty brhmns of nagpur.they too must have been in jail by now.

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  • tajender

    Every war is preceded by a lie using mass communication. One day Bush threatens Venezuela and Ecuador. Tomorrow, Iran? Then who else? (…) Let us remember just how many times the same United States and by the same means have manipulated us. Every major war was “justified” by what later (too late) is shown to be deliberate misinformation. A quick inventory:

    1) Vietnam (1964-1975)
    MEDIA LIE: On 2 and 3 August North Vietnam attacked two U.S. ships in the Bay of Tonkin.
    WHAT WE LEARNED LATER: This attack did not happen. It was an invention of the White House.
    Goal: Prevent Vietnam independence and maintain U.S. dominance in the region
    Consequences: Millions of victims, genetic malformations (Agent Orange), massive social problems.

    2) Grenada (1983)
    MEDIA LIE: The small Caribbean island was accused erecting a Soviet military base and bringing danger to the lives of American Physicians.
    WHAT WE LEARNED LATER: Absolutely not. President Reagan coined these pretexts.
    Goal: Prevent the democratic and social reforms of Prime Minister Bishop (later assassinated)
    Consequences: Brutal repression and restoring trust in Washington.

    3) Panama (1989)
    MEDIA LIE: The invasion was intended to arrest President Noriega for drug trafficking.
    WHAT WE LEARNED LATER: A CIA agent, Noriega claimed sovereignty over the canal ending the agreement, which was intolerable to the United States.
    Goal: Keep the U.S. control over this strategic line of communication.
    Consequences: The U.S. bombing killed between 2 and 4 million civilians, ignored by the media.

    4) Iraq (1991)
    MEDIA LIE: The Iraqis would have destroyed part of the motherhood of Kuwait City.
    WHAT WE’VE LEARNED LATER: Total invention of the advertising agency
    0
    SharePrint version Font Size Send to friendHill and Knowlton, paid by the Emir of Kuwait.
    Goal: Prevent the Middle East resistance to Israel and it behaving with independence from the United States.
    Consequences: Countless victims of war, after a long embargo, including medicines.

    5) Somalia (1993)
    MEDIA LIE: Mr. Kouchner appears on the scene as a hero in a humanitarian intervention.
    WHAT WE LEARNED LATER: Four U.S. companies had bought a quarter of the Somalia subsoil rich in oil.
    Goal: To control a militarily strategic region.
    Consequences: Unable to control the region, the United States will maintain it in total chaos.

    6) Bosnia (1992-1995)
    MEDIA LIE: The American firm Ruder Finn and Bernard Kouchner disclose the existence of Serbian death camps.
    WHAT WE LEARNED LATER: Ruder Finn and Kouchner lied. Those camps were for prisoners. The Muslim president Izetbegovic admitted it.
    Goal: To break a leftist Yugoslavia, to eliminate its social system, and submit the area under multinational control of the strategic routes of the Danube and the Balkans.
    Consequences: Four years of horrendous war for all nationalities (Muslims, Serbs and Croats). Provoked by Berlin, prolonged by Washington.

    7) Yugoslavia (1999)
    MEDIA LIE: The Serbs committed genocide against the Albanians in Kosovo.
    WHAT WE LEARNED LATER: Pure NATO invention as admitted by Jamie Shea, its official spokesman.
    Goal: To impose the power of NATO in the Balkans and its transformation into the world’s policeman. Install an American military base in Kosovo.
    Consequences: Two thousand victims of NATO bombing. Ethnic cleansing of most non-Albanians from Kosovo by the KLA, protected by NATO.

    8) Afghanistan (2001)
    MEDIA LIE: Bush wanted to avenge the September 11 and capture Bin Laden
    WHAT WE LEARNED LATER: There is no evidence of the existence of this network. Moreover, the Taliban had offered to extradite Bin Laden.
    Goal: To militarily control the strategic center of Asia, to build a pipeline that would allow control of the energy supply in South Asia.
    Consequences: Long term occupation and greatly increased production and trafficking of opium.

    9) Iraq (2003)
    MEDIA LIE: Saddam has dangerous weapons of mass destruction, Affirmed by Powell at the United Nations, showing evidence.
    WHAT WE LEARNED LATER: The White House ordered the falsification of these reports (attention to subject Libby) or manufacture of them.
    Goal: To control all the oil and blackmail rivals: Europe, Japan, China …
    Consequences: Iraq submerged in chaos and barbarism, and the women returned to submission and obscurantism.

    10) Venezuela – Ecuador (2008?)
    MEDIA LIE: Chavez supports terrorism, imports weapons, he would be a dictator (the ultimate excuse seems not to have been chosen yet.)
    TRUE OBJECTIVE: The multinational wants to keep control of oil and other riches of Latin America, fearing the democratic and social liberation of the continent.
    Consequences: Washington leads a global war on the continent: coups, economic sabotage, blackmail, establishment of military bases close to natural resources

    11) Libya – it’s up to the international community to stop the lies and the attacks. We’ve shown there’s no “innocent civilians” being attacked, but heavily armed terrorists. There is no “popular” rebellion as the British media would portray the big lie. It’s just the opposite, this “rebellion” is not popular. Water, oil, vast resources are the target, as well as re-establishing bases and control of the continent.

     

    [Reply]

  • abhi

    There is so much minority appeasement going on in India today, that all the communities, Brahmins, Banias, Jats, OBC’s, SC/ST’s and others, they all want to be classified as minorities. If they do not start agitating in a meeaningful way today, these communities could become second class citizens in their own country. They better wake up and start ALL KINDS of strikes and other actions before this “secular” government makes India a truly communal country.

    [Reply]

    tajender Reply:

    abhi,

    india is secular only on papers.it is neither secular nor communal,it is only corrupt.enemy of weaks irrespective of caste or religion.

    regarding apeasement,this is rss propaganda based on lie to provocate high caste hindus,and incite others.if u have any proof to support ur claim pls divulge.

    full form of rss is RUMOUR SPREADING SOCIETY.it is expert in spreading lie and hatred.

    [Reply]

    abhi Reply:

    My dear Tajender,
    Thank you for your comments.
    The very fact that there is a special provision in the Constitution for protection of “minorities” implies minority appeasement. The same provision also implies discrimination against other communities. Today, there must be more than five hundred groups in India which differ from each other on the basis of language, ethnicity, occupation, color of skin and what have you. To lump all these under the banner of “majority” and deny them the same privileges as given to some ‘minorities” is clearly a case of discrimination against them, As long as these people do not wake up and realise this hideous discrimination and start stopping trains and buses to fight this discrimination, or put up a fight in some other way, like many groups are doing to get reservations, these groups could well become second class citizens in their own country. It is the duty of all of us today, when more and more groups are coming ‘out of the shadows’, to make sure that in India, everyone, repeat, EVERYONE, has the same status, and reaffirm the dictum that ‘all are born equal”. As long as this does not happen, we shall fight each other for all time to come, and India will remain a democracy in the name only.

    [Reply]

  • tajender

    Temple treasure worth Rs50,000cr
    HT Correspondent, Hindustan Times
    Th’puram, July 02,

    govt of india should follow the path of mahmood of ghaznavi,who looted somnath.then spent all money to build infrastructure and cities in his area.govt should confisacate the entire wealth of all temples and dargahs and invest this in development of india,money looted by vediks through religion and power must be rechannelled in our economy.

    [Reply]

  • Anil

    It’s really sick when this sort of vile against any community passes as journalism..

    Hope better sense prevails if not there awlasy is supreme court the basic tenete of criminal justice system which considered ppl inocent till proven guilty irrespective of their religious belief must be uphelp.. Jihadis call for protection of jihadists notwithstanding

    [Reply]

  • Abc

    **** off,u muslim(mullah) motherfucker zia(madarchod)

    [Reply]

  • Impi

    Sigh. I am mentally exhausted from reading all the corruption problems that Indians are beset with. And its not as if we do not know what’s going on. Why are our politicians so vulgar and corrupt in their dealings with their own motherland?

    [Reply]

  • AetheistIndian

    Another frivolous piece & completely biased piece of legislation which cannot be implemented. Uniform civil code, everybody is just Indian.

    [Reply]