Puppets on a string



Bal Thackeray’s maverick ways have always led both his friends and rivals to underestimate him politically. But if they at all needed evidence for how finely he tunes his strategies, they only have to look at how, once again, for no rhyme or obvious reason, he has outwitted his ally, the Bharatiya Janata Party, over his support to Pranab Mukherjee, the UPA’s presidential candidate, as well as kept his own base intact with his voters.

For a couple of days after his public endorsement of Mukherjee, he has now railed against Bihar chief minister Nitish Kumar’s call for a secular prime minister with his own – for a Hindutvavadi one. And by no means is that Hindutvavadi prime minister of his Narendra Modi – he perhaps does not even have a name or face for the job. All Thackeray wishes to do is reassert his right-of-centre position while killing another bird with the same stone. For, much as he hates Modi for attempting to usurp his own fondly self-proclaimed position as the Hindu Hriday samrat (emperor of Hindu hearts), he is also putting Kumar in his place for all his past remarks against the Shiv Sena’s anti-Bihari/anti-Uttar Bharatiya policies of recent years. So he keeps his Marathi Manoos base alive as well as extracting from the Congress a promise for his support, which perhaps the Congress was only too happy to make.

The one fear that now drives the Shiv Sena supremo is that his bete noire, Narayan Rane, might one day end up as chief minister of Maharshtra. And for all that the Congress and the Shiv Sena have been at loggerheads over the years, it is also true that they have also been dealing with each other over issues convenient to both – the Sena could never have got to where it is today, without some covert and at times overt support to Thackeray by various Congress party stalwarts in Maharashtra.

But Thackeray can neve expect similar accommodation from Rane, who – as he loves to state — he kicked out of his party for his troublesome ways (though Rane tells it differently – that he quit the Sena on his own, driven up the wall by the younger leadership’s allegedly corrupt ways). Last time, Pratibha Patil’s candidature for Rashtrapati Bhavan had offered a convenient cover to Thackeray to enforce the same deal with the Congress for his support to the UPA candidate – that Patil was the first Maharashtrian to be nominated to Rashtrapati Bhavan and so she deserved the Sena’s support.

This time there is really no explanation why he should break ranks with the BJP, so he attempted to project the NDA as an alliance in disarray who could not even come up with the name of a credible candidate. There was really no tearing hyurry to endorse Mukherjee; he could easily have waited a day or two like everybody else for things to fall into place. But, even though now they have got their act together, it is unlikely that the BJP will be able to persuade the Sena to vote for Purno Sangma, who has been declared as their candidate for the job. Thackeray was always the cat with nine lives and his survival instincts are now at their best: he has borrowed from the Congress’s book to describe Sangma as a `borrowed’ candidate and reiterated he will stick with Mukherjee, no matter what.

Amid reports that Sharad Pawar might have sealed the deal between Thackeray and the UPA, it is easy to see how the arrangement benefits all: almost everybody in the Congress hates Rane for his usurping ways and they do not wish to see him become Chief Minister – I am told that there is even a report sent to Congress president Sonia Gandhi that making Rane CM at any point would sound the Congress’s death knell, for this former Shiv Sainik does not exactly have a Gandhian reputation and is a law unto himself. Rane’s aggression has also proved detrimental to the interests of Pawar and his NCP in the past years, so the Maratha warlord would only have been too happy to quickly seal the deal. I am sure the promises will be kept by all sides.

But while Thackeray might be looking out for his basic survival, believe Sharad Pawar hs a larger game plan. It is rather difficult to believe in his rather tame reaction to Sangma’s rebellion – under other circumstances, Pawar has been known to destroy such challengers to his authority.

I have always suspected that Sangma was deliberately put up by Pawar with 2014 in mind. For, the two chief ministers who first forwarded his candidature for the presidential elections – Naveen Patnaik an J Jayalalitha – are considered rather close to Pawar; they also had alliances with the NCP at the 2009 Lok Sabha elections. That was deliberate strategy by Pawar who was misled into thinking that the UPA would be voted out of power in 2009. He is sure they will be in 2014 and so the BJD and the AIADMK are his insurance for the future – in his bid to become Prime Minister at he head of a Third Front alliance. So is the BJP – for Pawar knows that Congress president Sonia Gandhi ahs already decided that in case of reduced numbers, her party will not support a Third Front government but will allow the mismatch between the BJP and other regional parties to mess it up in such certain fashion that the voters are left with no alternative but the Congress at the consequent/subsequent elections.

Even six months in power, like Charan Singh or Chandrashekhar, would be enough for a man who, even today, has a desperate need to go down in history s India’s prime minister, however short-lived that tenure may be or however fractious his alliance –h believes the can keep them all stitched together by the sheer force of power. I wonder, then, how not many people have spotted these brilliant moves by this master puppeteer.

Pawar keeps his goodwill with the Congress by seeming to meekly vote for Sonia Gandhi’s candidate for president; at the same time he builds bridges with the BJP by sending Sangma their way (while also weakening the saffron party, in case of a future bid, by showing it up as bankrupt of suitable leaders and candidates).

Both the Congress and the BJP, I believe, are yet innocent of the ways of this very astute politician and, even if they lose nothing, there are no gains for either national party from all this jostling for the top job in this country. But whichever way the presidential stakes go, Sharad Pawar would be sitting pretty, a winner all the way through. Bal Thackeray might be the only one able to measure his gains but even he, as all other players, including Patnaik and Jayalalithaa, are just puppets on Pawar’s strings — and Pawar is the grandmaster of them all!

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  • Guest

    Government formation after the next election will be a completely Machiavellian exercise. Team Anna ain’t seen anything yet.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    “Team Anna ain’t seen anything yet”.

    Good one.

    [Reply]

  • Anonymous

    Lucky to be the first one.

    Very smart analysis, Mr. Sharma. Put the BJP on par with Congress on the issue of corruption.

    Heera Chor = Kheera Chor!!

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    @ Ishwar

    Ha aHA… its like telling everyone who objects to the COngress– ja kheera khaa

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Kheera chor machaye badaa shor
    heera chor banaa khazaana lutera.

    [Reply]

    Vinod Sharma Reply:

    @ishwar
    It is a bipartisan analysis. No need to read extra meaning here.

    [Reply]

  • Anonymous

    Vinodji

    Very well analysed.

    A large section (read sycophants) of the Congress have never accepted Dr. Manmohan Singh as the Prime Minister – these loyalists (who are more loyal than the King himself) only wish to see only a member of the family in that position or themselves and no other. That is crux of the problem and that is why it has been presenting the opposition with one opportunity after another to take them to the cleaners. Disaster keeps striking it with regular frequency.

    First, the BJP has become a “reactionary” party. It only reacts – with disastrous results – to events. Haven’t seen any (original) initiative (OK, OK, except farcical ones – fast and rath yatra, what else is new, if one may ask) emanating from the party on any of the major problems and issues confronting the nation. Second, the tussle for the numero uno position is normal in any party – should not be an issue. In any case, this tussle should not be given any importance and has no relevance – when the time comes, Mohan Bhagwat & Co. will decide who will occupy that chair.

    The infighting in the CPM will not cause any reverberations – at the moment the party has lost its relevance and the people would not to be too bothered with the shenanigans there within. A mere side show, if you ask me.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Manohar

    Ya, left is a side show.. I do not think anybody is going to seek them out for partnership in the next Lok Sabha election, may be except in kerala, where they can still get 10-15 seats out of the 20 with a partner…

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Gopi

    Unless there is some dramatic improvement in the fortunes of the national parties (I do not see that happening as of now) , there is going to be real potpourri in the next elections – then parties with even single digit strength will play a significant (accompanied by disaster) role. 10 to 20 seat parties will almost become king-makers.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    “A large section (read sycophants) of the Congress have never accepted Dr. Manmohan Singh as the Prime Minister – these loyalists (who are more loyal than the King himself) only wish to see only a member of the family in that position or themselves and no other.”

    WHAT ABOUT YOUR OWN SELF?

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    You will never learn – given your intelligence deficit. You just keep coming back for jabs with unfailing regularity – perhaps that is what your doctor chelas and fans ordered for your well being or perhaps your motto is ” Main nahin sudharnewaalaa”.

    Anyone other than Modi and Advani is acceptable to me.

    If you need another jab, reply to this and wait, I will not disappoint you.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Shenoy,
    You are PATHETIC !!!!
    Looking for Congressis at all the wrong places and wasting the debate.
    You just wasted the opportunity to debate how hopeless the political class has become.
    Qite likely it is inline with your Sanghist outlook – try looking beyond it. It could be of some help.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Mahesh

    As you very well know –

    Debate + Shenoy is an oxymoron.

    Anonymous Reply:

    what is wrong in him asking manohar his preeremce

  • Pankaj#1

    Agree with you Vinod. Good analysis.

    [Reply]

    engrich Reply:

    here i agree with u and vinodjee very good analysis of the situation.i think drama of anna hazare was carried out to deflect attention from issue of swiss bank account.i salute sonia jee for handling the crisis in a courageous way and practically doing what anna jee wanted.i hope new party will emerge with name TIHAR JAIL PARTY.

    [Reply]

  • Anonymous

    Is there a prize from Congress high command for this comments ?

    “Things might somewhat improve in the Congress now that Sonia Gandhi’s back after a surgery abroad. In her absence, the ruling party was like a waist belt without a buckle, unable to hold up its trousers.”

    Meanwhile, I would advice Mr Sharma, whose loyalties to Congress far exceed any loyalty to anything else ( thats the conclusion I draw based on his blogs for last 1-2 years where he is simply incapable of critically examining Congress corruption and communalism, without dragging others in ) , to restrict himself to commening about things he knows, like Congress and Amar Singh ( who allegedly often supplies Mr Sharma with doctored CD’s and is a distributor of choice for them )

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    If wishes were horses, Vinod Sharma would ride one upto the gates of 10 Janpath, to show the rejuvenated Rajmata what a great supporter of the party he is, while all the party veterans are indulging in street brawls, with the captain asking himself to be kept at arm’s length from the disputes.

    [Reply]

  • Anonymous

    Marxists would have won in Kerala, if not for their in-fightings. They lost only by four seats; many seats they lost were only by less than five hundred votes.

    Right from the beginning of the last administration, the corrupt wing of the party (led by Party Secretary Vijayan) was against Achuthanadan, a clean politician. They won the number of seats they got because of Achuthanandan, youngsters really liked his simple living and non-corruptible positions.

    hey are still the largest party in the state; congress won only because of the solid Muslim support – Muslim League won almost 25 or seats (out of the 136 seat assembly). In fact, Kunjalikutty, the Muslim league senior minister is the de facto chief minister, and not Ommen Chandy of congress.

    The marxist infighting still continues; now the corrupt wing is after Dr Thomas Isaac, another clean politician.

    But the ruling UPA (UDF here) has too many issues– people and media give them another 3-6 months before they will collapse and a left front to come back.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Gopi,

    Vinod Sharma’s reference to the Left in the context shows, sadly his rather shallow appreciation of the ground realities. His grasp of the politics is limited to the Hindi belt, which he says, is a belt without a buckle.

    In fact, Achuthanandan has made his party proud with a solid performance despite the Muslim league playing vote bank politics. It is also a fact, that it is the Amul Baby who has come off badly bruised in the Kerala elections.

    [Reply]

  • Anonymous

    After hounding members of Anna’s team now it is Swami’s turn.

    http://news.outlookindia.com/item.aspx?737141

    [Reply]

  • Anonymous

    @ Vinod Sharma

    You have to admit that the UPA shot itself in the foot over the past one year. Just last year, after the obama visit, veryone was on a high.

    And now the UPA is at its lowest.

    Why did you not name the villians.

    1) Mani Silencer Aiyar, who failed as sports Miinister and then wanted his revenge by
    shouting 70000 crores looted

    2) Digvijay and Amul Baba pitching for the PM’s seat for which they wanted to show MMS was weak

    3) Two old men– Pranab and Chidu doing kushti for the hot seat.

    4) All the possible scams which could have been easily tackled but the ofensive spokesmen fo the party like Manish Tewari ended up alientaing the people of India and making them feel that the government was hiding something

    These are lessons which future governments must learn…

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Vijay Kumar,

    what is the most preferred vehicle of the UPA ministers?
    Ans: The wheel chair.
    Ques:Why?
    Ans: they have shot each other in the foot and all are in plasters.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Fantastic !

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    @ Shenoy, Mohan and Vijay

    I think the nation is suffering becasue fo poor governance.

    Private industry moves on the profit motive and so one part of the country moves on. But wherever government intervention is required, we have now stagnated.

    There is no comprehensive plan to tackle law and order, nor to tackle terrorism. Competitve populism will soon tacke a toll of economic growth.

    Anonymous Reply:

    Can I add a small piece?

    The image of India, in our own eyes, and that of the world has literally rolled down the slope in the past one year….

    Anonymous Reply:

    Shenoy,

    Ha ha very nice .

    [Reply]

    Vinod Sharma Reply:

    @Vijay_Kumar
    Structurally, blogs are better received and understood if written concisely. So I find your protest over I not naming the people you have named a trifle misplaced.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    @ Vinod Sharma

    I think it would be a good thing for the Congress to identify the bad apples.

    a) One attack by Makan on Mani Aiyar, has sent him reeling and probably made him look like an idiot who feels superior becasue of his English. Somebody could have done that an year back. :) If you remember I had been raising this issue an year back.

    b) The actually figure of 1760000 crores loss is an oxymoron. Had the COngress conceded that about 3-4000 crores has gone as kickbacks and the actul losses cannot be computed because hindisght wisdom is easy but the policy was univerally accepted then, it could have saved the situation.

    Instead it sent its Don quixote’s and Sanchos to attack the public, alienating everyone.

    c) The antics of Rahul Baba in making light of the LeT threat and Digviansh of cutting down MMS’s authority have only made the government look weak and corrupt. These are self goals UPA scored and will suffer for it.

    I guess you are firmly aligned to the UPA. However in case you and the UPA needs serious advice on PR… you can always hire me !

    [Reply]

  • Anonymous

    The partry discipline in all parties is a thing of the past. However, the ranks will align to a strong leader who can discipline the troops, a moralistic leader behind whom the country lines up behind).
    Congress is in a bad shape. That does not mean it will be an effortless ride for others.
    There are several trends :
    - A general dissatisfaction with all parties — evidenced by Anna Hazare success. This is an universal phenomena, tea party in US, jasmine power in the arab land, strikes in europe etc all point to a worldwide dissatisfaction with status quo
    - a general feeling that Congress does too much appeasing; to the extent that Islamic radicals can do what they want
    - Development is needed before any social justice issues
    - India could be better , stronger, richer — the political class is blocking (BJP may win this argument)
    - India /US should have better stronger relations (Cong and BJP may be equal here).

    More later –

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    gopi

    u r right — regardg ur observation abt dissatisfaction with political class — Us is experiencing wide protests thru Tea Party movemt, and last two weeks a general protest against WallStreet/busmess lobbies..
    I bet the Hazare etc movement is a similar expression of deep rooted dissatisfaction with status quo; fed up abt something deeper than political systemso

    [Reply]

  • Anonymous

    Manohar and Gopi,
    The trouble is – the official political class has ceased representing people.
    Congress might be on its way to disintegration post 2014 elections given the pulls and pressures it is experiencing from several “quarters”.
    As for CPM and CPI – these were my personal favourite candidates and I have to admit having placed bets on losing horses as far as “representational polity” is concerned.
    p.s. for Shenoy : BJP doesn’t even count when it comes to economist perspective. Maybe you may want to have a discussion on economics in your Sangh Shakhas.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Mahesh and Gopi

    I would not predict the disintegration of any party including the BJP. Ups and downs, yes.

    In 2004, the pundits did not give the Congress any chance and Advani – based on his party’s secret survey (never made public) – lamented the fact that the Grand Old Party would not even win 100 seats. What actually transpired is history.

    The present situation in the Congress is precarious indeed. Sonia Gandhi may be the cementing force, but is not politically savvy. Perhaps, she needs to change her political advisers – Sharad Pawar types. The real Sharad Pawar runs his own party and yet has maintained his clout (with just 9 MPs) – he is 3rd in the official pecking order in the Cabinet – a fact the Congress sycophants resent tremendously and these sycophants keep making noises every few months about the desirability of NCP’s merger with the Congress with sole purpose to show him his “place” – that is just one of them.

    For the moment the Comrades have become irrelevant, but who can predict the future – they may bounce back (after a total rethink and revamp, especially on the economic front, on their part), perhaps after many down the years – not in 2014.

    What can one say about the BJP? The best is by our friend here Gopi – the BJP works overtime to lose elections. How come? Is it because it is intrinsically intertwined with their core deology or the leadership is inept? Any answers!

    [Reply]

    AshishC Reply:

    Mahesh,
    The economic policy of BJP does not even count?
    On the strength of the one full term BJP completed in power- I do remember a few very significant initiaitives.
    I will concede though that during the Vajpayee era, I used to read Dubashi’s economic prescriptions and wonder if he actually is a member of the CPM! Luckily, such people were kept out of policymaking and government.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    “On the strength of the one full term BJP completed in power- I do remember a few very significant initiaitives.”
    Care to enlighten me and others ?
    p.s. : Nothing personal . We both know it.

    [Reply]

    Pankaj#1 Reply:

    Mahesh;
    I picked up this without even reading you. have not interacted with you since long. man, it is a treat to interact with you and manohar, though, we are not on the same page all the time. bhai, jindagi main kuchh to halchal ho!!

    AshishC Reply:

    1. The Fiscal responsibility act
    2. The Golden Quadrilateral
    (No disclaimers needed :) ; not from you anyway.)

  • AshishC

    Vinod,
    The questions I’ve raised lack novelty. They are as old as the Himalayas. So are the answers to these posers.
    Vinod, it is worth reading your post only for the above line.
    Congress is corrupt; so is BJP.
    Congress is riven with factionalism; so is BJP. Et tu, CPM!
    If Argal is BJP’s whistleblower; then Bhatt is Congress’.
    Pranab and Chidu fighting? Oh, come on! Isn’t Modi undermining Advani?
    Essentially, guys- nothing to choose between Congress and BJP on corruption and discipline.
    Now that Soniaji is back, discipline in Congress will return. Jai ho!
    Wah, bhai wah. Brilliant analysis. Repeat ad nauseum blog after blog.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    @Ashish,
    Thats a good analysis. I read Mr Vinod Sharma’s blog to see how someone who is a professional journalist, can week after week, churn out weak blogs lacking substance, insight. Are there no minimum standards to be met ?
    But I have not given up hope.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Ashish,
    Sharmaji’s post betrays Congress Party’s over centralised decision making. Something more than at par with BJP-RSS relationship.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Another question -
    Do you really , I mean “really”, see BJP or CPI/CPM as an alternative ?
    Try being honest when you answer this. Maybe – a quick run through at policy positions (if you find any) could be of help.

    [Reply]

    Ravi Reply:

    BJP and policies. What are you expecting. They form hardly a credible parliamentary opposition.

    Try asking about Rath Yatra, and other street theaterics.

    [Reply]

    AshishC Reply:

    Mahesh,
    I plan to indulge in some seasonal “bong-ness”/ “mad-ness” (is there a difference?) today and tomorrow- it is Durga-puja time.
    I promise to come back to this- if possible tonight or by Dussehra. To all Bongs, honorary Bongs, honorable Bongs and the dishonorable ones too (!)- happy Durgapuja. To all others, welcome to the nearest Pandal for Anjali and Bhog, specially the Bhog.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    I will be going to the one in east london ,, in pajama punjabi , just because somebody has invited me.Durga puja in Delhi , I wonder is it the same feeling in london. NDTV does all kinds of shows NEVER EVER A FULL LENGTH PROGRAMME ON DURGA PUJA, the artistic work in calcutta surely cannot be replicated in Delhi. The pujas in Uk get splintered all the time , Classical bengali cockroach syndrome , SOME KNOW IT SO WELL THEY ACTUALLY PRACTICE IT.

    Vinod Sharma Reply:

    @AshishC
    When history repeats itself, it has to be reported, You may find it comical or farcical. What I have written is a chronicle.

    [Reply]

  • Anonymous

    My perspective (along with many in my age group — below 35) is that BJP has a huge potential, either alone, or with partners, to win the next elections.

    We also feel that they(BJP) should not force a mid-term election; things should go its natural direction – a totally dysfunctional central govt, existing and new corruption scandals, inflation, deceleration of growth – all these will culminate into a natural state when people will vote for anybody but congress.

    BJP should stray from the fray and focus on differentiating items. Yatra etc is neither a vote puller nor a branding vehicle. Advani should be dissuaded, especially when his party hands are involved in the mining scandal.

    They should leverage the post Anna mood – clean administration, love for the country. Should hammer on unsolved terrorist cases, should compare and contrast BJP states growth vs others (put Mayawati in her place too). If Gujrat, with all its industry, can deliver electricity 24 x 7to residential and industrial customers, that should be in their electioneering slogan

    Nation’s wealth, nation’s youth, nation’s food, nation’s security — appealing messages delivered with consistency by telegenic personalities, coupled with feet on the ground, with capable partners like Jaya and Nitish; may be Naidu too — should play well. Keep Gadkiri behind the scenes.

    The 40 plus seats of Andhra Pradesh is a wild card. Telengana, Jagan, and other factions make it possible for a BJP alliance to win few seats there. Couple it with the 39 Jaya will deliver, and maintaining/improving the Karnataka position (BJP won comfortably in the koppel byeelection) — BJP alliance should be able to obtain 65-70 seats from South India.( vs a 20 or below for UPA)

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Shoeb,
    “My perspective (along with many in my age group — below 35) is that BJP has a huge potential, either alone, or with partners, to win the next elections.”
    IMHO, you are basing this on Congress screw-ups . correct ?
    I will skip your subsequent paragraph as it amounts to same – BJP not cashing on Congress problems.
    “BJP should stray from the fray and focus on differentiating items. Yatra etc is neither a vote puller nor a branding vehicle. Advani should be dissuaded, especially when his party hands are involved in the mining scandal. ”
    Huh ? Say again pal – Rath Yatra and Mining Scandals , all in one breathe ? As much as you as an Indian percieve the politics of BJP I do as well. My own perception has mostly associated Advani’s Rath Yatras with rioting , where did you find this new found association with mining scandals ? Are you alluding to the point that Advani may have gotten a bit too old for all those past rioting ?
    “They should leverage the post Anna mood – clean administration, love for the country. Should hammer on unsolved terrorist cases, should compare and contrast BJP states growth vs others (put Mayawati in her place too). If Gujrat, with all its industry, can deliver electricity 24 x 7to residential and industrial customers, that should be in their electioneering slogan”
    Ahoy pal !!! Wouldn’t it be rather pathetic reflection on BJP that it did wait for a mood-swing against corruption ? What was BJP waiting for ? As for Economic growth – does the word “recession” and its associated challenges ever ring in BJP circles ? Ever ? I am curious about BJP’s past history – when did they ever fight elections on purely economic issues ?
    “Nation’s wealth, nation’s youth, nation’s food, nation’s security — appealing messages delivered with consistency by telegenic personalities, coupled with feet on the ground, with capable partners like Jaya and Nitish; may be Naidu too — should play well. Keep Gadkiri behind the scenes. ”
    Wasn’t Pramod Mahajan Telegenic ? And Vajpeyeeji – could BJP ever get a better icon ? More importantly, is it about marketing the agenda ? just marketing agenda ? Is Anna Hazare Telegenic ?
    “The 40 plus seats of Andhra Pradesh is a wild card. Telengana, Jagan, and other factions make it possible for a BJP alliance to win few seats there. Couple it with the 39 Jaya will deliver, and maintaining/improving the Karnataka position (BJP won comfortably in the koppel byeelection) — BJP alliance should be able to obtain 65-70 seats from South India.( vs a 20 or below for UPA) ”
    I am yet to find a serious policy discussion emanating from BJP. If you are really serious about NDA – push , in whatever capacity you can, that they bring back discussion on economic policies back to the public discourse. With masses as the focal point.
    p.s. : As I have said to Ashish as well , nothing personal. Sorry if it feels so. Just feeling a bit harsh on established polity.

    [Reply]

  • Dr Mishra

    @ SHOEB

    Nice analysis, Bjp would be a fool to foul this up. I had grave reservations about Modi’s fast but the wily bugger pulled it off. The presence of Gujrati muslims in large numbers at his fast was an indication of people wanting to move on.

    His comment about not giving special treatment to any group but to treat everyone as a Gujrati was bold stuff indeed- given the caste riven electoral politics post Mandal. Hope Jaya too does not foul it up, although her toxic interview with abrasive Karan Thapar shows she stiil has to become media savvy- she has to learn how to swim past snappy alligators.

    BTW, I am staying at Radisson’s in Mahabalipuram this thurs-sat for a wedding, on the rare chance you are around it would be nice to treat you to a drink or meal ?

    [Reply]

  • Ravi

    Sorry guys this gem got lost in the last blog.

    It deserves your full consideration.

    ____________________________________________________

    This was posted by RajeevS

    F.U.C.K Mohammad. and F.U.C.K his Islam.He should have visited Rajghat..
    A Like Reply 1 day ago in reply to engrich 0 Like
    F .

    ____________________________________________________

    Dr Mishra…I do not expect a comment from you, but I am eternal optimist.

    [Reply]

    Pankaj#1 Reply:

    OK Ravi;
    I will answer this.
    This was felony.

    [Reply]

    Ravi Reply:

    Do you suppose there would be a call for expulsion, ban etc.

    Or are we in hypocrisy territory

    [Reply]

    Ravi Reply:

    Pankaj

    I am conscious of the fact that you may be missing some of the context.

    Both RajeevS and Dr Mishra were extremely enthusiastic in their condemnation of my blasphemous rant. In fact, they have not let me forget it, despite public apology.

    I rest my case. No more will be said about this.

    Pankaj#1 Reply:

    Ravi;
    We are not on the same page but I will not say or bad mouth anything about Prophet. He was a revolutionary in his time, for betterment of society. I can only go that far.

    Ravi Reply:

    Your friend has no such reservation.

    Note absence of names who have not joined in with you for condemnation.

    Draw your own conclusions.

    Anonymous Reply:

    “Note absence of names who have not joined in with you for condemnation”.

    Fair weather friends. Anyone?

    Ravi Reply:

    Manohar

    When I said some thing unpleasant against Ram. RajeevS, Dr Mishra, BV Shenoy, Balwinder, etc joined in the chorus of condemnation.

    Now that RajeevS has been grossly abusive the Prophet of Islam, these people are silent.

    People can draw their own conclusions.

    Anonymous Reply:

    should mot have — gods, holy people etc should be no-n0

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Binoy, Mishra, Pankaj, Rajeev,

    I agree that great men or holy men including prophets of other communities should be spared criticism of vile nature. But then, it should be applied to Hindu gods, saints, holy men also

    [Reply]

    engrich Reply:

    u can criticize but not abuse.

    Anonymous Reply:

    Ravi,
    I was sure that you will pick this up. It was meant for you…A sikh getting worked up if Islam is bashed but uses most foul words himself for hindu gods and doesn’t care a bit about sikh gurus.

    Why don’t you accept that you are a muslim and stop this nautanki?

    [Reply]

    Ravi Reply:

    I rest my case.

    I also rest the case that Dr Mishra is severly compromised. His status as a lay preacher for Hinduism is confirmed.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Super like – a la Facebook!!

    Kya Miliye Aise Logon Se,
    Jinki Fithrath Chupi Rahe,
    Nakli Chehera Saamne Aaye,
    Asli Surath Chupi Rahe…

    [Reply]

    Ravi Reply:

    So Ishwar, let me see if I understand what you are SUPPORTING here.

    1. You believe, like RajeevS, that I am a Muslim hiding behind a Hindu identity.
    2. You believe Rajeev said those foul words about Mohammad, not because he believes them, but because in a Machiavellian way it was trap set for me, into which I have fallen.
    If any of the above two statements are correct then they speak volumes about you, and bugger all about me.

    Thank you and bye.

  • Dr Mishra

    BOOM BOOM”””””””’

    The man in the khaki shorts stands alone, a figure of scorn.

    And yet when there is the earthquake in Gujrat or when the Sikhs are being murdered in Delhi, or when the bihari labourers are being slaughtered by the khalistanis, the cadres are the FIRST to arrive on the scene.

    The first to donate blood when 1962 and 1965 wars broke out. Rewarded by Nehru by inclusion in the ? ‘1963 republic day parade. Dr Ambedkar (my hero) enthused about them for their abolition of caste in the shakhas. They trained dalits to become temple priests.

    I could go on and on about their good points- their weak ones are too well known. For 99% of Indians who enter politics do so to make tons of money. And therefore joining the congress is logical for them, ideology be damned. Not so for the unsung cadre, not unlike the nameless faceless lakhs who agitated behind Anna.

    If only there was a way of harnessing the good in these cadres to make them a political force

    [Reply]

    Dr Mishra Reply:

    I was of course referring to the RSS. Dr Pankaj, this was to answer your query. I had already two weeks ago praised the heroic and yet tragic story of the great Marathi playwright, Veer Savarkar.

    BOOM BOOM. I do not come to this blog to make friends or join cliques. I fire away on unfashionable topics. Will come back later with more, right now I got to pack for Mahabalipuram- the hotel is bloody expensive. 300 dollars a night- Shoeb- can you pull some strings in Chennai and get me a discount ? ha

    [Reply]

    Pankaj#1 Reply:

    Mishraji;
    When I asked about sins of Savarkar, there was obfuscation. Tell me about his sins and not BS.This is for one you know whom.

    [Reply]

    Ravi Reply:

    I will not intrude on personal grief.

    Pankaj#1 Reply:

    Ha!

    engrich Reply:

    dr misra and pankaj,another piece of great bravery by veer savarkar,extract from his apology letter,

    What else can you expect of RSS? Deception is their game. Look at their credentials as a nationalist party. Veer Savarkar their icon as a freedom fighter wrote a clemency petition to the British govt:

    “Now no man having the good of India and humanity at heart will blindly step on the thorny paths which in the excited and hopeless situation of India in 1906-1907 beguiled us from the path of peace and progress. Therefore if the government in their manifold beneficence and mercy release me, I for one cannot but be the staunchest advocate of constitutional progress and loyalty to the English Government, which is the foremost condition of that progress… . Moreover my conversion to the constitutional line would bring back all those misled young men in India and abroad who were once looking up to me as their guide. I am ready to serve the government in any capacity they like, for as my conversion is conscientious so I hope my future conduct would be. By keeping me in jail nothing can be got in comparison to what would be otherwise. The Mighty alone can afford to be merciful and therefore where else can the prodigal son return but to the parental doors of the government? Hoping your honour will kindly take into notion these points.” Mark the words “loyalty to the English government.”

    This shows that Savarkar offerred to collaborate with the British. No Congress freedom fighter icon did. They never asked for clemency. Never offered to collaborate with the British

    Anonymous Reply:

    Doc Mishra/ Dr Pankaj
    Please have this crazy guy’s head examined!

    engrich Reply:

    binoy challange if anything is wrong.his apology letter is avilable in archive.main crime of modi ,was not his involvement in riot.he trumpled the democratc institutions.tried to covert india into somalia.

    Anonymous Reply:

    @Binoy TRUTH HURTS, what you have read is a FACT

    engrich Reply:

    ravi bhai u will agree that,
    Hindutva, the unique Indian form of Indian fascism, is the modern incarnation of Brahminism. Although it projects itself as the defender of the ‘Hindu’ community against imagined ‘enemies’, such as Muslims and Christians, it is actually premised on an unrelenting hostility towards the vast majority of the so-called ‘Hindus’ themselves-Dalits, Shudras and tribals. The very basis of what is today called Hinduism is the caste system, which is specifically geared to preserving and promoting ‘upper’ caste hegemony that is based on the systematic exploitation and oppression of the so-called ‘lower’ castes. Hindutva, therefore, is not to be characterized as ‘Hindu communalism’ as such, as it does not represent the interests of all so-called ‘Hindus’ as such. As numerous writers have pointed out, a more apt description of Hindutva is that it is the contemporary form of Brahminism. In other words, Hindutva may be defined as Brahminical fascism.
    This being the case, Hindutva cannot be countered simply through pious appeals to ‘Hindu-Muslim unity’. The fatal mistake that secularists have consistently been making is to see Hindutva as simply ‘Hindu communalism’. Consequently, they have been trying, ineffectively, to combat it simply by invoking a common ethical impulse that they argue underlies the different religions. Since Hindutva represents the contemporary agenda of Brahminism, it poses an immense threat not just to the Muslims of the country, but equally, or perhaps even more so, to the vast majority of the so-called ‘Hindus’ themselves-the Dalits, Shudras and tribals, who, taken together, form more than 70 per cent of the country’s population as a whole-the Bahujan Samaj. Clearly, Hindutva aims at preserving and promoting ‘upper’ caste rule and ‘lower’ caste slavery, inspired by a vision that draws on the cruel laws that the Brahminical scriptures prescribe for the ‘lower’ castes. the
    Hindu Right aims at ‘denying [.] Dalits of all human rights’[1], and the same applies for its implications for other members of the Bahujan Samaj. The most effective way of countering Hindutva is, therefore, to mobilize these marginalized groups against the Hindutva forces by exposing the grave threats that the Hindutva agenda poses for them. In other words, highlighting the menacing implications of Hindutva for the Dalit-Bahujans is the surest way to combat Hindutva, for it is they who are today being so assiduously used by ‘upper’ caste forces as foot-soldiers in their pogroms against Muslims and Christians, thus threatening to drive the country to the brink of civil war. The Dalit-Bahujans account for the vast majority of the Indian population, and if they are able to see through the Brahminical designs behind the Hindutva project, Hindutva would die a natural death.
    This booklet is a critique of Hindutva from a Dalit-Bahujan perspective. It focuses on what Hindutva means for the Dalit-Bahujans, showing how it is essentially geared to preserving and promoting ‘upper’ caste Hindu rule and suppressing the stirrings of revolt that are now becoming increasingly visible among the ‘low’ caste majority low caste majority.

    engrich Reply:

    savarkar was homosexual like most of jew.he was fighting for national unity and liberation of india from britishers before going to jail..in andaman jail he was brainwashed by zoinist jailer.who converted him fascist.then he joined hands with british occupiers,was spying for them and responsible for the arrest of many many sincere freedom fighters.mainly responsible for partition blood bath.

    Anonymous Reply:

    Pankaj

    The best is to Google and do some selective reading from a variety of sources, to get a balanced perspective.

    He has been a controversial figure, hence there may be very extreme views on him.

    Here are two links for you to take view on him.

    http://www.savarkar.org/

    http://www.hvk.org/articles/1196/0047.html

    Pankaj#1 Reply:

    Manohar;
    I will. I do not speak with preconceived ideas, but life makes everyone a cynic, particularly in present day times.So much Makkari is all around.

    engrich Reply:

    pankaj and doc mishra,WHAT RSS IS CAN BE judged by the circular which they distributed to their members,

    . In his incisive study of the Hindutva phenomenon, titled Saffron Fascism, Shyam Chand, a Dalit scholar and activist who served for many years as member of the Haryana Legislative Assembly, quotes from a secret circular sent out by the RSS to its preachers. It clearly indicates the sinister Brahminical strategy of using the Dalit-Bahujans to attack the Muslims and Christians, while at the same time aiming to keep the Dalit-Bahujans under the permanent slavery of the ‘upper’ castes.
    Excerpts from Secret Circular No.411 issued by the RSS:
    [.] Scheduled Castes and Other Backward Classes are to be recruited to the party so as to increase the volunteers to fight against the Ambedkarites and Mussalmans.
    Hindutva should be preached with a vengeance among physicians and pharmacists so that, with their help, time expired [sic.] and spurious medicines might be distributed amongst the Scheduled Castes, Mussalmans and Scheduled Tribes. The newborn infants of Shudras, Ati-Shudras, Mussalmans, Christians and the like should be crippled by administering injections to them. To this end, there should be a show of blood-donation camps.
    Encouragement and instigation should be carried on [sic.] more vigorously so that the womenfolk of Scheduled Castes, Mussalmans and Christians live by prostitution.
    Plans should be made more foolproof so that the people of the Scheduled Castes, Backward Classes, Musslamans and Christians, especially the Ambedkarites, become crippled by taking in [sic.] harmful eatables.
    Special attention should be given to the students of Scheduled Castes and Scheduled Tribes so as to make them read the history written according to our dictates.
    During riots the women of Mussalmans and Scheduled Castes should be gang-raped. Friends and acquaintances cannot be spared. The work should proceed on the Surat model.
    Publication of writings against Mussalmans, Christians, Buddhists and Ambedkarites should be accelerated. Essays and writings should be published in such a way as to prove that Ashoka was opposed to the Aryans.
    All literature opposed to Hindus and Brahmins are [sic.] to be destroyed. Dalits, Mussalmans, Christians and Ambedkarites should be searched out. Care should be taken to see that this literature do [sic.] not reach public places. Hindu literature is to apply [sic.] to the Backward Classes and Ambedkarites.
    The demand by the Scheduled Castes and Scheduled Tribes for filling in the backlog vacancies in services shall by no means be met. Watch should be kept to see that their demands for entry and promotion in government, non-government or semi-government institutions are to be rejected and their service records are destroyed with damaging reports.
    Measures should be taken to make the prejudices amongst Scheduled Castes and Backward people more deep-rooted. To this end, help must be taken from saints and ascetics.

    Attacks should be started with vigour against equality, preaching communists [sic.], Ambedkarites, Islamic teachers, Christian missionaries and neighbours [?].
    Assaults should be made on Ambedkar’s statues with greater efforts.
    Dalit and Muslim writers are to be recruited to the party and by them essays and literature opposed to the Dalits, Ambedkarites and Mussalmans written and preached [sic.]. Attention is to be paid to see that these writings are properly edited and preached [sic.].
    Those opposed to Hindutva are to be murdered through false encounters. For this work the help of the police and semi-military [sic.] forces should always be taken.”[2]
    *
    In the face of this circular, no more evidence is needed to show what Hindutva actually bodes for the Dalit-Bahujans. It circular very clearly indicates that Hindutva aims essentially at preserving the oppression of the Dalit-Bahujans, in addition to the Muslims and Christians, on which the entire edifice of Brahminism stands.

    [Reply]

    Bliss22 Reply:

    All lies. No such circular. Imagination runs riot. Untruth. lies. fabrication.

    Anonymous Reply:

    @Bliss22, a sweet kiss to you, WHY NOT VERIFY FOR YOURSELF, go to WIKIPEDIA, or just type RSS and DALIT, your ignorance will disappear

    engrich Reply:

    Historical Roots of Hindutva

    The Rashtriya Swayamsevak Sangh (RSS) was established in 1925 by K.B.Hedgewar, a Maharashtrian Brahmin. Initially, almost all its members were Brahmins, and even today, its top level leaders are almost entirely from the ‘upper’ castes, particularly Brahmins. The RSS was founded at a time when Maharashtra was witnessing a powerful movement of revolt among the ‘lower’ castes against ‘upper’ caste tyranny led by such stalwarts as Mahatma Jotiba Phule and Dr. Ambedkar. The establishment of the RSS at this time was hardly coincidental. Rather, it is apparent that the rise of ‘lower’ caste consciousness and protest against ‘upper’ caste hegemony was a key factor in the setting up of the RSS. The spread of the RSS in other parts of the country can also be explained on similar lines. Feeling increasingly threatened by the growing awareness and militancy among the ‘lower’ castes, ‘upper’ caste leaders found in the ideology of Hindutva a convenient way to co-opt the ‘lower’ castes and to divert their wrath from their real oppressors (the ‘upper’ castes/classes) onto imagined enemies in the form of Muslims, Christians and communists. By appealing to the notion of an imagined ‘Hindu nation’ and ‘Hindu community’, Hindutva ideologues (almost all Brahmins) sought to deny the existence of internal caste and class contradictions among the so-called ‘Hindus’. This denial aimed at drawing the ‘lower’ castes behind the ‘upper’ castes, and to destroy ‘lower’ caste movements of protest against ‘upper’ caste hegemony. Accordingly, the plight of the ‘lower’ castes was sought to be explained away as a result of alleged Muslim or Christian ‘persecution’, while the ‘Hindu’ period of history was glorified as a ‘golden age’. In this rewriting of history, the oppression of the ‘lower’ castes that saw its genesis in the so-called ‘golden age’ was completely ignored. So, too, was the inconvenient fact that the oppression of the ‘lower’ castes is specifically mentioned and prescribed in all the Brahminical scriptures.
    Yet, the projection of the notion of a united ‘Hindu nation’ was only at the level of rhetoric. In actual fact, the proponents of Hindutva sought to carefully preserve the exploitative caste-class system by conveniently remaining silent on it. And this continues to be the case till today. Not surprisingly, the Hindutvawadais have never taken up any militant struggles for the rights of the Dalits, for distribution of land to the poor, for the rights of workers and tribals and so on. Instead, they have consistently supported the interests of the capitalist-feudal-Brahminical elites. Not surprisingly, the core support-base of the Hindutva movement since its inception onwards has consisted of landlords, former rulers of princely states, industrialists, merchants, priests-’upper’ castes in general, all of whose interests are diametrically opposed to the Dalit-Bahujans’, and whose hegemony is based on their systematic subjugation.

    [Reply]

    Ravi Reply:

    St John’s Ambulance does all that, rather more quietly and furthermore they do not riot.

    [Reply]

    Pankaj#1 Reply:

    Mishraji.
    hundred percent with you.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Dr.Mishra,

    In 1996, there was a mid-air collision between Saudia Airlines and kazhakhastan airlines planes, killing 350 passengers.over a village in Haryana. The RSS volunteers were the first on the spot who organised retrieval of dead bodies and assisted the civil authorities in all possible ways so as to reduce the grief of the family members.

    In my native place near Mangalore, River Nethravathi causes floods every year. And every year it is the RSS volunteers who are trained to render evacuation of families and belongings to safe places. A number of Muslim families (as well as those congressmen who hate RSS too) get assisted. Ours was one of the families who hated the RSS in those days but still took help from them in the hour of need, because when the town gets flooded in the night, the people only pray their respective gods to provide the services of these much hated RSS chaddiwalahs.

    [Reply]

  • Ravi

    Ashish

    Do you like my Avatar.

    I had it made just so I could put a smile on your face.

    [Reply]

    AshishC Reply:

    LOL, welcome Mohan Bhagwat..

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    your “avatar” is Ram Autar. Is there anything to like him?

    [Reply]

    Ravi Reply:

    I will settle for that.

    Like Ram is not bad at all.

    However, since you are a south Indian, you probably look like Ravan.

    [Reply]

  • Anonymous

    one more humble attempt to make Pandit Mishra NANGA and flog him , in this blog. HE WAS GOING GA GA ABOUT RSS AND ITS LOVE FOR DALITS. Can snake not bite even if feed them milk.
    Excerpts from the Secret Circular No.411 issued by the RSS:

    […] Scheduled Castes and Other Backward Classes are to be recruited to the party so as to increase the volunteers to fight against the Ambedkarites and Mussalmans.

    Hindutva should be preached with a vengeance among physicians and pharmacists so that, with their help, time expired [sic.] and spurious medicines might be distributed amongst the Scheduled Castes, Mussalmans and Scheduled Tribes. The newborn infants of Shudras, Ati-Shudras, Mussalmans, Christians and the like should be crippled by administering injections to them. To this end, there should be a show of blood-donation camps.

    Encouragement and instigation should be carried on [sic.] more vigorously so that the womenfolk of Scheduled Castes, Mussalmans and Christians live by prostitution.

    Plans should be made more fool-proof so that the people of the Scheduled Castes, Backward Classes, Musslamans and Christians, especially the Ambedkarites, become crippled by taking in [sic.] harmful eatables.

    Special attention should be given to the students of Scheduled Castes and Scheduled Tribes so as to make them read the history written according to our dictates.

    During riots the women of Mussalmans and Scheduled Castes should be gang-raped. Friends and acquaintances cannot be spared. The work should proceed on the Surat model.

    Publication of writings against Mussalmans, Christians, Buddhists and Ambedkarites should be accelerated. Essays and writings should be published in such a way as to prove that Ashoka was opposed to the Aryans.

    All literature opposed to Hindus and Brahmins are [sic.] to be destroyed. Dalits, Mussalmans, Christians and Ambedkarites should be searched out. Care should be taken to see that this literature do [sic.] not reach public places. Hindu literature is to apply [sic.] to the Backward Classes and Ambedkarites.

    The demand by the Scheduled Castes and Scheduled Tribes for filling in the backlog vacancies in services shall by no means be met. Watch should be kept to see that their demands for entry and promotion in government, non-government or semi-government institutions are to be rejected and their service records are destroyed with damaging reports.

    Measures should be taken to make the prejudices amongst Scheduled Castes and Backward people more deep-rooted. To this end, help must be taken from saints and ascetics.

    Attacks should be started with vigour against equality, preaching communists [sic.], Ambedkarites, Islamic teachers, Christian missionaries and neighbours [?].

    Assaults should be made on Ambedkar’s statues with greater efforts.

    Dalit and Muslim writers are to be recruited to the party and by them the essays and literature opposed to the Dalits, Ambedkarites and Mussalmans written and preached. Attention is to be paid to see that these writings are properly edited and preached [sic.].

    Those opposed to Hindutva are to be murdered through false encounters. For this work the help of the police and semi-military [sic.] forces should always be taken.granted.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    shan–

    did not know you had secret access to secret circulars of these parties/orgamizations — any secret circular from PDP, Jamat islami, Deoband, Congress?? or at this time limited to RSS ???

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    I HAD DEROBED DEOBANDI IN PREVIOUS BLOGS, if you are a regular follower for two years you should know. DEOBANDI is BIGOTRY INCARNATE, RSS IS BRAMHINICAL HEGEMONY

    [Reply]

  • Pankaj#1

    Vinodji;
    Khase badmash ho. Purana blog abhi tak response le raha hai!!!. Would like to meet you in Delhi. Hindustan Times building is a land mark at KG Raod, Am I correct? I take a right or left turn at Scindia house and there you are. Once I crossed my path with Sardarji, You knpow, khushwanta.

    [Reply]

  • Anonymous

    Smelly cockroach Dr Shan of darnley street, aapka hi intezaar tha. This secret RSSdocument, how did u find it . Somehow any posr from you which does not have white arsee worship from u, seems strange.
    You feeling okay, forgotten to take your penicillin today ??

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Balls , I wrote in the last blog that somebody even with the IQ that of balwinder, can make out that saudi is stuck in year hizra one.
    THAT WAS MEANT TO BE A COMPLIMENT

    [Reply]

  • Anonymous

    i am posting something which everybody knows BUT WILFULLY DENIES, LET HONESTY PREVAIL
    ‘THE SECOND OPEN LETTER OF TRUE RAM SEVAKS’

    “Let the Ambedkarite Harijans who oppose the Hindutva ideology understand. We will not allow them [to] mix with even the soil of Hindustan. Today, time is in our hands. Hindutva is the ideology of true Hindus [and] it never accepts the Harijans who are the offspring of the untouchable Ambedkar. The Ambedkarite Harijans, Bhangis, Tribals and the untouchable Shudra castes who believe in Ambedkar do not have any right to give speeches or criticize the Hindutva ideology in Hindustan, because as a dog raises its leg and urinates whenever there is a question or discussion related to the Hindutva ideology these Ambedkarites, Harijans, Bhangis, Adivasis and other untouchable low castes sling their dirt on the Hindutva ideology or show their caste [their low birth] by speaking abusively about it.

    Now Hindutva has become aware [sic.] and it is time to teach these Ambedkarite untouchable Harijans a lesson. Not even the Miyans [Muslims] can come to their aid now. Understanding the Hindutva ideology requires a large heart. What will these untouchable Ambedkarites, who raise their leg and urinate, understand of the Hindutva ideology?

    The fact that the Honorable Narendra Modi has gained a large victory in Gujarat has been because of the Hindutva ideology, not because of the untouchable Harijans [or because of] the Ambedkarite ideology. Narendrabhai has gained victory single-handedly in Gujarat because he explained the true ideology of Hindutva [..]

    Vishwa Hindu Parishad, 11 Mahalaxmi Society, Paldi, Karnavati-380007.[4]

    [Reply]

    Pankaj#1 Reply:

    Shan;
    Source please. And if it is correct, even in Gujarat, I am ready to do Pigsticking, a forgotten game.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    @Pankaj#1, http://www.orkut.com › … › Government & Politics › World Politics › Forum

    [Reply]

    Pankaj#1 Reply:

    Thanks;
    I will read it.

    Anonymous Reply:

    Darned Shaan Nirad Babu,

    now you have truly spoken like a Tajender possessed by the spirit of Osama.

    [Reply]

  • Anonymous

    @Mahesh, manohar, ravi , etc(serious open minded bloggers)
    First a disclaimer PREDICTION IS AN IMPERPECT SCIENCE
    India’s Next general election
    Congress is in deep s h i t . It is mired in all negative news. The next election will see the POLITICAL GRANDEES all retiring, MMS, Pranab, Chidambaram , they have said so.
    Sonia gandhi is NOT WELL , she didn’t go to have her gallbladder whipped out.
    Congress without Sonia , I THINK GEN NEXT (scindia, pilot, jindal) will fight Digvijay, Gulam Nabi ,kamal nath and the lot. It may not be a foregone conclusion that Rahul will take over.
    BJP despite shoeb’s wishes WILL ONLY PANDER TO ITS CORE CONSTITUENCY.
    Also BJP currently is full of DULLARDS, they all speak in monosyllables. THEIR STAR ORATOR IS MODI, who will not be invited in Patna.
    In fact there is a schism devoloping in BJP , is modi an asset or liability.
    Excise Modi , No one can drag BJP into gujrat riot , is this the reason Modi was given cold shoulder.
    There is NO PAN INDIAN PARTY , lots of regional party will play part in horse trading.
    All the above on the presumption that the EVENT CURVE is following a staright curve.
    THEN THERE ARE SO MANY CURVES TO REPRESENT SO MANY DIFFERENT SCENARIOS.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Shan
    i believe party solidarity is a goner..
    One of the charasteristcs of US politics has been the emergencce of senators/congressmen who are RINOs and DINOs (repubs aNd democrats In name only).. democratic senator Nelson from Nebraska, dem senator Marie Laudreu from Louisiana, etc) They always vote based on their constituencies and not bon any party basis..

    Looks like Imdia is moving in a similar track with regional parties, or more indepemdent politicos within the major paryties…may not be necessarily bad

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    We too have COINS-congressmen in name and shame.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    That was really a good one , Shenoy Saab

    Ravi Reply:

    Pankaj

    Shenoy: Phuuurrt (Passes wind noisely)

    Pankaj: Wah Wah, Kya yeh Raag Malkauns Tha.

    Anonymous Reply:

    Ravi

    It is a season of CTs.

    Pankaj#1 Reply:

    Wow, Manohar, this Jugalbandi!!!

    Anonymous Reply:

    Pankaj

    Good one.

    Yahaan par to “Full Orchestras” aadi chalte hain, to ek jugalbandi kyaa cheez hai. !!!

    Pankaj#1 Reply:

    Manohar;
    This is your complaint or observation? why you have support of only Ravi?

    Ravi Reply:

    :)

    Anonymous Reply:

    Observation.No offence meant towards you.

    I am not here to seek support, if no one supports me, so be it. I stand by whatever I post, even if I am in a minority of one on the issues. Some agree with me and some do not – that is life. It is about debates and enriching oneself – you get to know other view points.

    Anonymous Reply:

    @Binoy Hegde , This is the reason why American senators can vote independently without toeing the partyline.

    While members of Congress often vote along party lines, the influence of the whip is weaker than in the UK system. For one thing, much money is raised by individual candidates, and members of Congress are almost never ejected from a party. In addition, because preselection of candidates for office is generally done through primary elections open to a wide number of voters, it is difficult for the national party to deselect a member of Congress who defies his party in a way that pleases his or her constituency.

    Because members of Congress cannot serve simultaneously in executive positions, a whip in the United States cannot bargain with a member by using as an inducement the possibility of promotion or demotion in a sitting administration. There is, however, a highly structured committee system in both houses of Congress, and a whip may be able to use promotion or demotion within that system instead. In the House of Representatives in particular, the influence of a single member individually is relatively small and therefore depends a great deal on the member’s seniority—that is, in most cases, on the length of time the member has held office.

    Whips in the United States, then, are less menacing in their techniques than in the United Kingdom.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    The only consolation is that this political crisis has occurred midway during the life of the Parliament.

    Hopefully, the national parties will realise the gravity of the situation and go for a major course correction in their discourse and action. Their time starts now.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Nirad Babu, why did you forget the name of engrich among the “serious bloggers”?

    [Reply]

  • Ramesh Talwani

    bernard shaw ’s remark that “POLITICS IS THE LAST GAME FOR SCOUNDRELS” IS APT EVEN TODAY.
    WHAT ABOUT JOURNALIST?
    MY QUESTION TO YOU MR SHARMA IS ,WHY DONOT YOU TALK OF REAL ISSUES?
    WHY DONOT YOU TALK OF CONTINUED CHINESE INTRUSION OR SUCH IMPORTANT ISSUES?
    ANY HOME OR PARTY WITHOUT REAL LEADER IS BOUND TO BE THE WAY CONGRESS PARTY BEHAVES.CRISIS OF LEADERSHIP IS THERE.
    FOR US NATION IS IMPORTANT NOT INDIVIDUAL PERSON OR PARTIES.
    WHY DONOT YOU TAKE ONE ISSUE AND PRESENT IT THREADBARE AS KARAN THAPAR DOES!

    [Reply]

  • Anonymous

    Cockroach DR SHAN wasted my time, came up with a silly link. Look at your idiotic shrill comment below “”"prediction of election is imperfect….”"”
    then u come up with 4paras of complete $hit, shrieking boasting like he is saying something imp. Last blog he said jews are one race, forgot about black african jews. Moron, forget tajender. Ban dr shan instead for boredom

    [Reply]

  • Anonymous

    All,

    It looks like this format allows a free access to Ram Avtar /Tajender/Gingrich/Lakshman to abuse the intelligence and common sense of the participants. This rabid Islamist destroyed Zia’s blogs; he will do the same here, with his ranting on Jews, Brahmins, Zionists, Upper Caste, you name what.

    I do not want to see/read that; so I have decided not to blog here until his access is disabled..

    All the best for you!;

    [Reply]

    Pankaj#1 Reply:

    Benoy;
    Do not do that. that will be defeat of intelligence and victory of dumbs. just ignore him.

    [Reply]

    engrich Reply:

    dear benoy, if anything is wrong pls tell me.savarkar apology letter is avilable u can check it.circular was distributed in haryana assemly.moreover they are doing this.a doctor who injected 57 muslim ladies with hepatitus b injection is made minister in modi ministry as a reward.he is minister today.

    from last 10 year they were keeping the bombs while blaming on muslims.game was like this,
    1.rss goons will plant the bomb
    2.brhmnst of intellence burea will leak wrong information saying IM HUJI LET are involve.media will quickly publish this and repeating this again and again.muslim boys will be arrested.those who can pay are nationalist those who cannot are terrorist and shot in false encounter.

    from last 15years 20000 muslim lads are languishing in various jails of india.muslims were declared as terrorist,my samdhi with hindu wife has to bring 10 bania guarantors to get accomodation in delhi.
    when karkare caught the laptop of purohit and dayanad pandey he found that military training to overthrow democratic goverment was goining on in 53 places.
    they wanted to convert india into another somalia.anna movement was an effort in this direction.i salute sonia jee for saving india.she is great lady.LEKIN BAKRE KE MAA KAB TAK KHAIR MANAE GEE.manmohanjee also showed his maturity and wisdom in handling this crisis.
    what can i do pundit hegde.truth is sour.u people will never leave habit of biting biting and biting.

    [Reply]

    engrich Reply:

    just ignore him.

    u people
    have no other option.as truth is not with u.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Binoy

    If you do not like / approve what he writes, you have the option to ignore him. Do not give him or anybody else any undue importance by calling for expulsion.

    Having said, there are few others here, who are better candidates for such an action – based on grounds you have mentioned.

    [Reply]

  • Dr Mishra

    Benoy Hegde is right, this blog is going the Zia way. The Islamophobic statements as well as statements like this are rancid- engrich- savarkar was homosexual like most of jew….’

    Vinodji, your blog, you decide. I leave.

    SHOEB, waiting to hear from u reg Mahabalipuram (see below)

    [Reply]

    Vinod Sharma Reply:

    @Dr Mishra
    I respect your right to state your views. You must appreciate that others too have that right. So please don’t quit. Stay put and argue. That will show your democratic spirit. I will certainly intervene when anybody insults you or gets (God forbid) abusive.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Dr.Mishra,

    Tajender was as abusive of Hindus and Hinduism then as the Gingrich the gangrene is today abusive of the same things. What, then is the difference then, when he was expelled, and Now?

    [Reply]

    engrich Reply:

    tell me what i abuse.rss is fascist political organiztion.nothing to do with hindus in general

    engrich Reply:

    i dont abuse but i hate rss

    engrich Reply:

    dr saheb savarkarwas homosexual.chitpavans and khazari jew have same dna.even same habits.they are also vegetarians.chitpavans came to india from same area.both are evil planners and secret instigators of all the holocausts.capitalists of new york created communism to kill christians.hindutva is fabricated to kill indians.today news has has come that hitler died in argentinain 60s.he was jew. .among them it is like disease.it is because of their influence in american establishment ,that homosexuality has been given respect.. hegdewar too was homosexual.ur rss leaning has hurted me.being a doctor u should be life giver not taker.i may have difference of opinion but i like u and resoect u.it is because of this link that butchers of america and europe are supported only and only by high caste indians.other part of world they are met with shoes.

    [Reply]

  • Anonymous

    @Engrich naam , islam jiska jaam.
    I will agree that what you write, there is fair bit of truth in it , AS ALSO UTTER RUBBISH OF JEWISH JAILOR TEACHING SAVARKAR LESSONS IN FASCISM.
    However PLEASE WRITE ON THE CURRENT STATE OF ISLAMIC WORLD.
    Would you concede that all the ILLS THAT BEDEVILLS islamic world is due to ADHERING to a GARBAGE called HADITH written 800 yrs after prophet’s death from HEARSAY. also would you agree WITHOUT OIL, islamic countries WOULD BE ALL GREATER SOMALIA . That unless all ISLAMIC countries become SECULAR and give its citizens FULL FREEDOM OF EXPRESSSION , they will be of only interest to the HUMANITY AT LARGE, TILL THE OIL LAST. If a substitute is found , ISLAMIC COUNTRIES WILL REVERT TO ZAHILIA.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Shan,

    I was shocked to read the secret curcular of RSS which you posted earlier.
    If it is true and if RSS is following this path than this organisation should
    be banned immdiately . I would like to know when this circular was
    written and when did this came in lime light.? Has any senior leader of
    RSS confirmed the authentication of this circular. ?

    [Reply]

    Ravi Reply:

    It has been banned twice in 60 years.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    @ MOhan

    I am not a RSS guy. But I can tell you it is a fake circular. created by the Congress disinformation cell some years back.

    [Reply]

    Ravi Reply:

    Ha ha ha.

    So we must add one more category to the excuses offered.

    Oh this is a fake circular.

    Fake Ravi, Fake Tajinder, Fake Prabhat, Fake Blog, Fake Walrus Mustache, everything fake except innane tuk bandhi’s by the Kavi Raj from VyasKot.

    Anonymous Reply:

    Ohh!! The only thing original out here is an ISI fundoo called Ravi who emerges out of T U R D Tajendar’s petticoat !!

    Ha haha !!

    Ravi Reply:

    Is that the best you can do.

    Pathetic in C minor

    Anonymous Reply:

    Pasthetic in c minor is better than Ravi in T U R D Tajendar’s petticoat !!

    HA HA AHAH !!!

    Anonymous Reply:

    @MohanR, It is not a FAKE circular.In the internet if you search, there are articles just on the AUTHENTICITY of the document. It fist appeared in Assam in 1995 . I am not sure if it originated in NAGPUR, or was it some local SHAKAS gone crazy. Though I have not seen a clear cut rebuttal from Nagpur from that period, perhaps I need more time to research.
    However THERE IS NO DOUBT , RSS is BRAMHMINICAL HEGEMONY BY BACKDOOR..
    I will join RSS , the day they have a MUSLIM president or preferably a Gen Secretary

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    What does a Muslim preident has to do with Brahminical hegemony… just trying to understand where you are coming from.

    BTW, I would stop supporting the RSS the day I know someone like you is a member.

    Anonymous Reply:

    By the way i dont support RSS , precisely because it is full of people like you.Having a Muslim as president iof RSS will throw the spanner in the works of bramhinical snakes. Difficult for you understand , like why play high up in the pitch and not defend on the box.or to put it otherway what is offside trap.

    Anonymous Reply:

    ????

    It is like a Muslim saying that he would start voting for BJP if he wears a “Katwa Cap”.

    engrich Reply:

    modi is on their foot.17%of muslim votes goes to bjp modi or no modi.

    engrich Reply:

    u should join only if they change their ideology.but they will not.if i hurt a dog i apolige to him.here 4000 were murdered 50000 are languishing in dirty camps.MODI CANNOT SAY EVEN SORRY TO VICTIM.
    this is called fascism.

    Pankaj#1 Reply:

    Mohan;
    This reminded me about a circular flaunted by Ram autar, in the possession of a minister in haryana. So as in gullivers travels, people are running helter-skelter to collect these circulars( sound more impressive).
    gotta go.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    I have serious doubts on the authenticity of the circular.
    I will do my research.

    engrich Reply:

    u cannot believe.they people are worst than this.can u believe a doctor who injected 57 muslim women with hepatites-b injection is made minister as reward for this great act.during many muslim injured were murdered on operation table by surgeons.
    there are stories that they were snatching infants from the laps of their mothere cut them into pieces mix with tarcoal and paste on the road.

    i advise u to see who killed karkare on u tube.
    also read a gorgotten mascare on 6th november 1947,
    at jammu.they are available on internet.

    If any good-hearted, far-sighted, impartial, noble historian were to come in future, she or he can write the sordid, atrophied, violent, criminal past of India only in letters of blood

    engrich Reply:

    pankaj circular is right i told u.in fact they are doing.rss ia crowd of gangesters murderers wife swappers hawla dealers,infant burners thieves and rapists.
    all these skill they show during riot.

    engrich Reply:

    Has any senior leader of
    RSS confirmed the authentication of this circular

    they never denied.they dont sorry to victims of riots shows their attitude.

    [Reply]

    engrich Reply:

    AS ALSO UTTER RUBBISH OF JEWISH JAILOR TEACHING SAVARKAR LESSONS IN FASCISM

    it is right.

    garbage is ur and your mother ***.son of a *****.

    [Reply]

  • Anonymous

    Guys,

    Just ignore this guy Tajender/Ramautar/engrich. The problem with Zia’s
    blog is that there is a guy Jai Khosla who responds to him with his own garbage
    which riles him up and he comes up with more of his BS. By ignoring he may
    realise his mistake — will he realise ? — and may stop bloging here .

    [Reply]

  • Anonymous

    VINOD ji

    Some of your bloggers border on genius. Their rangr of knowledge and the links they provide is what makes your blog read by all my friends from Uk to Amritsar. Last week Rajiiv and Mishraji set blog on fire with their info on Jonnah and Pakiistan.
    Before that the two pundits Ashish and Mishra argued vaary nicely about Bengal commies. Gopi and doc are masters at Indian history. Gopi and Shoeb sre blogs south indian experts . Etc etc. BUT TO MAKE THEIR REFINED VOICES HEARD, THE SNARLING OF LESSER MINDS MUST BE CENSORED.
    I do not have patience to sit thru miles long manusmriti cut paste from engrich, I will go to nihilistic dalit hate filled websites if I want that.
    So Vinod ji count me out again. Never thought that tajender who violatef spirit of our brave CAPT UNNIKRISHNAN would find way back on blog

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    If your decision to ban him was correct 2 months ago, then it cannot be undermined by change to new format. Tajrnder also brings out eorst in Ravi and rajeev for different reasons.
    Also it is not as if this blog is all in agreement. I startrd two votes last week
    = Modi and cap
    =Kandahar, rrlease or not
    and there was healthy disagreement. Mishraji has provoked by praising Savarkar, Ashosh says commies are not all bad etc etc
    so blog will debate and fight healthily without egerich. BAN HIM
    GOODBYE

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    This gangrenous gingrich was thrown out by Vinod Sharma for overstaying his welcome as also for misusing his blog’s seva to denigrate Hindus, Hinduism and all Hindu gods and saints. It was on popular demand.

    Now either Vinod Sharma is too preoccupied with UPA

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Now Vinod Sharma is either too preoccupied with the misfortunes and travails of the UPA to notice the re-entry of a gangrene, or he now believes that it is an example of secularism, making the blog free for all.

    The problem is that like Sonia Gandhi Vinod Sharma too is on maun vrit and nobody knows when he will break his vrit.

    Anonymous Reply:

    Balls your lines “Some of your bloggers border on genius”
    That depends on your standard.
    Like take this genius sardar
    A man is crying at the scene of bomb explosion”Oh God My hands have been blown off”
    Sardar to this man who is crying:”Stop crying , Look at the other man , HIS HEAD IS BLOWN OFF , is he crying.
    Birds of feather flock together

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Nirad Babu,

    what a weird kind of joke is this?

    [Reply]

    engrich Reply:

    capt unnikrishnan died oerforming his duty everybody respect him including me.but those killed at cst has same soul.how kasab escaped when 119 gunmen were there.why u are not hurt for them.not asked enquiry for this.

    [Reply]

  • Anonymous

    ==============================================================
    ~~~ A POEM DEDICATED TO ENGRICH the EUNUCH ~ !!! :) :) :) ~~~
    ==============================================================

    Here is a poem for everyone to enjoy :

    T U R D Tajendar ke petticoat se nikla yeh Engrich
    Sab ko lagta hai.. yeh hai ek Eunuch, ek Eunuch

    Wah wah !! Wah !!!

    Iss se debate ka kya fayada
    Dimag nahi hai iska zaida
    Yeh toh hai eunuch, ek eunuch !!

    Ha ha ah !!! HA!!

    ISI ka pyaada hai
    cut and paste ka shezaada hai yeh
    Yeh toh hai Engrich, Engrich

    Yahoo Hahaha !!

    ISI ne jab kiya thaa isko khassi
    Tab Jehad ki talwar di iskko asli
    Yah toh hai Engrich Engrich,
    Asal mein ek unique eunuch…

    Ha ha ha ha !!!! :) :)

    [Reply]

    Ravi Reply:

    भरत व्यास की इस रचना को, वसंत देसाई ने स्वर बध किया है.

    “राम तेरी लीला निराली” अथूना धिन्ध्वा मैं १२० हफ्ते चली

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    ISI Fundoo Ravi ka naya pyaar
    Eunuch Engrich se kiya Ikrar

    T U R D Tajendar ke petticoat mein
    Fundoo Ravi aur Fundoo Engrich ne li angraadyi

    ISI ko yeh situation
    Bahut pasand aayi ! :)

    Vijay Kumar, Ved Vyas ko
    Apni Kitaab, The THREE FUNDOOS ki
    second chapter ki yaad aayi !!

    HA HAHA !!

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Quite funny…

    I hope Engrich gets the message to have concise, relevent postings and not the entire charter of LeT in each posting

    [Reply]

    engrich Reply:

    vjay,

    badal kar faqerron ka bhais hum ghalib
    tamashae ahle chaman dekhte hain

    [Reply]

  • Anonymous

    Vinod is of the opinion that now since Sonia is back, she will put the house in order…

    This precisely is one of the issues with Congress – one leader, no democracy in the party, no emerging leaders… This was not the case with the party until few years into Smt Indira Gandhi’s PM ship. Shrimathi Gandhi successfully managed to destroy the “syndicate”, and other leaders like Morarji, crushed the local/regional leaders and powerful CMs, and cancelled/postponed party elections, three/four years into her PMship. People like Barua who sensed “either with me or get crushed” started singing praises like Diggie is doing now.

    The great party of Gandhiji, Nehru, Patel, Azad became a plaything for Shrimathi Indira Priyadarshini Gandhi to settle scores, to cement political gains, garner advantages.

    Shrimathi Indira Gandhi made sure that there will be only eunuchs as cabinet ministers and party dignitaries; they will not let one of them become PM, and that will force them to always go to the family for the next leader. Her plans have lived on, and the eunuchs have performed the way she dreamed — even beyond her wildest dreams — that they will not find a leader in the land of 1.2 billion people, and the mantle of leadership “had to be awarded” to the foreign born bereaved widow, who was never in politics, quite possibly not even a party member.

    Even in her wildest dreams, Shrimathi Indira Gandhi would have imagined the eunuchs will be so well trained and indoctrinated that they will settle for her diminutive Italian daughter in law, instead of one among themselves. And we criticize the Chinese Communist party?

    The tragedy (or comedy?) is that she (Sonia) has proved to be temperamentally more fit for the leadership rather than these clowns. And she has picked on the Indian mythology and ethos – She is a well-revered Bhishma who sacrificed the crown. (one more plus, she even left her native country) – Bhishma Pithamaha’s sacrifice is always glorified; however, nobody ever talks about whether that sacrifice was worth anything– Bhishma continued to rule the country through proxy, as the de facto king, in effect not sacrificing anything.

    And then she knows in a land where some Bahus are burned to death, other Bahus are more than welcome and given the keys of the house, even the Kingdom!.

    What a country!

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    correction – “even in her wildest dreams, Smt Gandhi would NOT have imagined…….”

    I should say the only time period when Govt offices functioned for the citizens was during the emergency. As they say “trains were on time”.
    Come to think of it, may be Smt Gandhi was contemptuous of democracy – how little it delivers, how long it takes.
    In a sense it is a big loss that she did not live long to write about all these – the motivation to go after syndicate, Chief Ministers, party leaders, declaration of emergency etc

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Gopi
    The Congress ceased to be a Party long time back . It is a Family Zamindari ,where people wait at the doorstep of the Mai- Baap , to have a share in the loot, big or small.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    AFAIR, the severity of the emergency was inversely proportion to the radial distance from Delhi.

    The emergency was more to do with suppressing freer flow of information and suspending fundamental rights of anyone opposed to her than about trains running on time or the government offices functioning properly (bonus or unwanted benefits!).

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    your memory fails you when remembering the emergency days. Its severity was widespread, uniformly arbitrary and touched all sections of society. In the south, including Kerala and Karnataka too several thousand people were arbitrarily arrested and tortured for long months.

    The emergency was, in fact more of midnight knocks, nasbandi, and breaking the spirit of India than mere suppressing of information flow and fundamental rights.

    Anonymous Reply:

    No, it does not. I know what I am talking about. Try and understand what I am saying.

    As rightly said – you cannot read on the lines nor between. And it surely is your problem, I cannot help you nor the intent to do so.

    Anonymous Reply:

    Gopi

    Nothing to be surprised about.

    We have discussed inner party democracy in India in earlier blogs. It is non-existent or at most a naaTak is staged for public consumption. There are remote controls and remote controls (RSS, Thakres) or the head of the family dictating (Sonia Gandhi, Mulayam Singh, Karunandhi, Badals, Lalus, Jayalalitha, Patnaiks etc). Perhaps, the comrades are little more democratic than others – are they?.

    Whether Sonia will put the house in order only time will tell. As I mentioned in another thread here, IMO she needs a new and different set of advisers.

    [Reply]

  • Anonymous

    Sanjeev Bhatt’s wife is deeply hurt and anguished . She believes that her husband , a highly celeberated whistleblower for those , who cannot accept and tolerate those who the people of Gujarat elect to be in power in that state , should not be investigated even if he charged with serious offences .She wants the Law to act with deference and respect , towards Mr Sanjiv Bhatt as he occupied a high office. He , should not be interrogated , premises should not be searched , rather he should not be investigated. After all he is an IG rank officer in the Gujarat Police. He should have the freedom to confine ,coerce and force a constable to file wrong affidavits and give false evidence.
    He posseses a lot of information. First it was the Gujarat Riots , and how Narendra Modi fanned those riots.So what if no court was willing to accept nor rely on those affidavits Now he knows a lot of Haren Pandya’s murder. But surpisingly he never provided that information to the CBI all the while it was investigating that Murder . Now CBI cannot be tarnished by Mr Bhatt with the same brush which he uses against the Gujarat Police.
    But what was Vaghela doing at her residence. Guiding her on her next move…what she should say to the media …or something more…and a hint was there in a newspaper that he was there to save the skin of another senior Gujarat Congress man.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Praveen Saxenaji,

    This Bhat chap is the modern day version of Kumbh Karn. He has a habit of going to sleep for long years.

    He slept for nine years and suddenly remembered, after a head massage by Teesta Setalvad, that he was present in Modi’s house on 27th Feb., 2002, when Modi was said to have ordered the police to look the other way when Hindus killed Muslims. Additionally Bhat was angered by the fact that Hindus had killed several thousands of Muslims when he had gone to sleep.

    Now after some years, he remembers about Haren Pandya’s murder too, even though he was asleep when the murder took place. This too he remembered after he got a body massage by Teesta Stalvad.

    Naturally, the police too want to know what else he remembers, if he is given some more “body massage” in the traditional police style. What is wrong in the police demand for his custody?

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Shenoy Saab
    None should be surprised if we find Mr Sanjiv Bhatt fighting the next election as a candidate of the Congress Party , provided courts allow him.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    @ Shenoy

    It is possible that Teesta might have been reading out Engrich’s outporings while givingthe head massage…

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Praveen
    Was there a report that Vaghale was in the Bhatt house?
    This Bhat guy belongs to Congress!

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Yes Gopi , News channels had shown this story . Vaghela had gone to her residence and given full support of the Congress Party.

    [Reply]

  • Ravi

    Today’s International Herald Tribune carries an article celebrating the achievements of Swami Vivekanand. Worth a read.

    [Reply]

  • Anonymous

    Zias blog in peak was 800 comments average. LAST ZIA BLOG WAS 33 comments, 24 by egerinch tajender , 5 by lovely DR IDIOT SHAN.
    Only persons missing were Bobby Darling and Dolly Bindra who are of tajenders intellectual level and SHANs cultural level

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    @Balwinder,
    Its rumoured that it was upon reading ( some say smelling ), Tajinder and Shan/street that Shakespeare remarked “scums of the same stink, stick together”

    [Reply]

    engrich Reply:

    it is wrong.

    [Reply]

  • Anonymous

    The loud chorus singing has started again – engrich haTaao.

    If he is banned (I am against all types of ban), then there are two or three more here, who also need to be given marching orders. In any case, Vinod Sharma has mentioned that he will intervene if required, so why the clamour?

    [Reply]

    Ravi Reply:

    It is a power game.

    As Dr Mishra has demonstrated, either he goes or I go type of childish play

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Intolerance and bigotry on display. Nobody is forcing them to read his comments.
    ————-

    Here is a partial list of things banned in India. Let us see how many of those (if they choose to respond) demanding ban on engrich support the list.

    Press

    In 1975 Indira Gandhi government imposed censorship of press in The Emergency. It was removed at the end of the Emergency rule.

    Books

    1) In 1989, Salman Rushdie’s The Satanic Verses
    2) In 1990, Understanding Islam through Hadis by Ram Swarup
    3) Shivaji by Jayant Lele
    4) The Polyester Prince, a biography of the Indian businessman Dhirubhai Ambani was banned.
    5) In 2003, Dwikhandito (split in two) by Taslima Nasreen banned by West Bengal Govenment.

    Drama

    1) In 1999 Maharashtra government banned the Marathi play ‘Me Nathuram Godse Boltoy” or ‘I am Nathuram Godse Speaking”

    Films

    1) In 2004, the documentary Final Solution, which looks at religious rioting between Hindus and Muslims, was banned. The film follows 2002 clashes in the western state of Gujarat, which left more than 1,000 people dead. The censor board justified the ban, saying it was “highly provocative and may trigger off unrest and communal violence”. The ban was lifted in Oct.’04 after a sustained campaign.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    What about gutter scoundrels, who are against ‘ban’ but for ‘blasphemy’ ?
    Some of them stink on this blog.lol

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Are you speaking about yourself?

    [Reply]

    Ravi Reply:

    You mean like this one….

    Sorry guys this gem got lost in the last blog.

    It deserves your full consideration.

    ____________________________________________________

    This was posted by RajeevS

    F.U.C.K Mohammad. and F.U.C.K his Islam.He should have visited Rajghat..
    A Like Reply 1 day ago in reply to engrich 0 Like
    F .

    ____________________________________________________

    Dr Mishra…I do not expect a comment from you, but I am eternal optimist.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Sensitive Sikhs..whose blood boils when Islam is questioned…Nautanki..

    Anonymous Reply:

    Rajiv,
    All this business of respecting all religion is bogus..The maximum a person can do is to TOLERATE all religions which I do to but no one can force me to respect ideologies that I don’t agree with you. In fact I find Islam is RSS politics + religion. I don’t agree with either.

    [Reply]

  • Anonymous

    MANOHAR, only for u I respond.
    1. Blog must have minimal intelectual standards. Comments like savarkar and jews are gay, or Inian jews are disguised as brahmins, are stooopid.
    2 Abuse of individuals or religion is intolerable. Many here are cultured, many here revel in abuses.
    3. My time is valuable. Cant waste on Rakhi Sawant shows or shan.
    4 ravi, shan and tajender have abused each other, partic shan vs others, maabehen stuff, only when they got lonely and rebuked by all, did they find refuge with each other

    [Reply]

    Ravi Reply:

    More than half of this is a complete lie.

    The only person who has ever did ma Behan is Dr Mishra.

    RajeevS has abused other peoples religion on this very page, and you ignored it.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Jankhe..kya aurton ki tarah ro raha hai..You did same to hindu gods after Ayodhya verdict…Nautanki queen..

    Unlike you, I am not bashing any god (Allah) but cartoon called Mohammad and his political ideology Islam disguised as religion.

    I am all for Sufi Islam minus arabic hocus-pocus.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    1. “Blog must have minimal intelectual standards. Comments like savarkar and jews are gay, or Inian jews are disguised as brahmins, are stooopid”.

    First of all I am no one’s keeper. I have mentioned earlier – what one does within four walls of his/her bedroom is of no relevance and should not be anyone’s concern..
    In an earlier blog – RajeevS was talking about Gandhiji’s sexual orientation – why did you not object then and why now?

    I only wish you would insist on minimal standards from all – not selectively.

    2. “Abuse of individuals or religion is intolerable. Many here are cultured, many here revel in abuses.
    3. My time is valuable. Cant waste on Rakhi Sawant shows or shan”.

    Isn’t that what I have been saying for the last couple of days. If your time is precious, ignore him or whoever else you wish to – their names appear on top of the posts – just skip. Let me tell you something – I have never bothered to read what engrich or some of the others write, perhaps a line or two and then move on. Show me one post of mine where I supported him or denounced him, by responding to his posts.

    4. “ravi, shan and tajender have abused each other, partic shan vs others, maabehen stuff, only when they got lonely and rebuked by all, did they find refuge with each other”

    What abut others- RajeevS for example – if you ask me, he is the most fouled blogger here. Why the double standards – tolerant for “your” own side and intolerant of “other” side? in his new avatar – the postings of engrich or whoever he was/is (I do not care) looks like an angel compared to RajeevS’ vitriol. It is quite clear, many of the bloggers feed on each other.

    I had posed this question to Dr. Mishra – who did not care to respond – (no problem – if someone does not bother). Here goes – kis kis kaa munh band karoge?

    Sorry, I am not on the same page as you.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Zenanaiya ro rahi hein… :)

    [Reply]

    engrich Reply:

    we fight and forget.ur war on ravi and shan is continous.

    [Reply]

  • Pankaj#1

    Manohar;
    Link to Savarkar was a revealation. Such a brave and patriot. He also appear to have initiated abolition of untouchability. what is your grudge??

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Only a link. There were two links. Did you go to the other link?

    In any case, I cannot force (and have no intention to) my views on you or anybody else. You think he was a brave and a patriot, I have no problem.

    My views on him, I will post at leisure later.

    [Reply]

    Pankaj#1 Reply:

    Manohar;
    yes, I read the first link only, did not read the second one, not deliberately, I have work also to do. However, I will go there as well and waiting for your reply.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Pankaj

    No problem. I would suggest you read both – we can wait to discuss it and it will easier for us to refer to any context we may refer.

    engrich Reply:

    manohar can u ask him to give any tale of his bravery.as he is not indian so he dont love india.he prepared grounds for future blood bath.which we see from time time.

    [Reply]

  • Anonymous

    @MANOHAR_T,

    No I did not imply that you are a “gutter scoundrel”. But its obvious from your response that you consider/suspect yourself to be so. I dont think I have read enough of you to reach a conclusion. If you desire, I will let you know if and when I reach that conclusion.

    Anyway, I am not for banning opinions , irrespective of how abusive and False it may be ( 5000 dalit rapes in UP every day ? ). Neither does so called blasphemy or any abuse hurled at my religion, ethnicity or caste offend me. Its just not my concern. They are only as vile as the person making them is. Let Tajinder/Shan/Manohar (?) or any other gutter scoundrels opinions stand for them.

    Bye the way, gutter scoundrel stands for those that support laws that punish so called blasphemy ( like in the criminal entity Pakistan ) but are against banning disruptive and abusive posters at HT blogs !!!

    However, I am for banning bloggers, who are like a vagabong who walks into a restaurant and starts yelling and throwing stuff , and prevents others from conducting their business. Bye that I mean , if a blogger, does excessive cut and paste jobs, filling up the blog so much that other bloggers cannot read the blog , such disruptive behaviour, where the blogger is not engaged in discussion but in unilateral cut-and-paste ( often without acknowledging the source ) or using caps lock liberally in all posts , – such disruptive bloggers should be banned after warning.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    I do not give a damn, what you think of me or later form a firm opinion. Keep such views to yourself, who cares.

    I will not waste my time in responding to the rest of your message – I have better things to do in life and not worth responding to, as I have expressed views elsewhere on this blog. In fact I do not ever bother to post rejoinders of many of you, unless a specific post is addressed to me. Got that?

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    So don’t get your tail in a tizzy and concentrate on ‘better’ things you may have to do !!

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Tizzy, huh!

    Who you think you are to tell me what I should do or not do? maan naa maan, main teraa mehmaan, wah!

    Anonymous Reply:

    chal phoot yahan se…RTO office ke bahar dallagiri kar

    Anonymous Reply:

    Darr gayaa kyaa? Asking me to go away.

    And in any case, who the hell you too think you are to do so. This blog does not belong to you or to your family (I hope you understand what I am hinting at, if not never mind)?

    Anonymous Reply:

    I know it belongs to your Paa Vinodji..

    Anonymous Reply:

    Good – you have shown a tiny bit of “common sense”, that it does not belong to you and I hope you have some more tiny bit of “common sense” and refrain from telling others to scoot. I am only hoping.

    Anonymous Reply:

    don’t you have better things to do? ;)

    Anonymous Reply:

    Do not worry, I am a multitask person, can take handle several things (one is the likes of you) at the same time. Any more questions. then shoot?

    ——-

    Response to your comment below -

    My question remains –
    what is it you? Work, take bribes,etc. None of your business. Mind your own business (if any)..

    Anonymous Reply:

    So you work and take bribes at same time..Good going.

    Anonymous Reply:

    If you take bribe then it is my business..You should be in jail for being corrupt.

    Anonymous Reply:

    Re:comment bleow

    If I should be in jail, What ar e you waiting for, file a complaint or are you expecting a shar e of the loot?

    engrich Reply:

    manohar this man is half mad allow him to bark.

    Anonymous Reply:

    Better things to do..means conning people..after all he is Congress man,..in short conman.

    Anonymous Reply:

    As I had told you in the earlier blog, I may be a congress man, a conman, whatever you can imagine, first of all what is it you and second you cannot do anything about it – except rant. Keep on, you have your full support of your orchestra.

  • Anonymous

    I once again repeat when it comes to international diplomacy, people should stay away from OVERT display of their faith. What stopped Saudi king to read Fateha for Gandhi? Is it not an Islamic tradition?

    Secondly I don’t consider Islam as traditional religion because it clearly has political side to it. In fact all the rituals such as Hajj and Namaaz are meant for organizing muslims for political achievement i.e. rule of Islam.

    As for Mohammad, I consider him as a shrewed politician of 7th Century..He as a king without crown but his claim to prophethood were bogus. If you read about his violet deeds and sexual exploits, it will be an insult to other prophet if we call Mohammad a prophet.

    I have all the respect for his as military general, political genius but as prophet, he is a joke.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    @RajeevS,
    You are certainly entitled to your opinion. Some people may think even worse of him and some may consider him perfection incarnated !!!

    However, its only when someone keeps repeating the same stuff again and again in a blog, its only then that it becomes disruptive in my opinion.

    [Reply]

    Pankaj#1 Reply:

    Rajeev;
    do not have contempt for either of them. they are product of their times. the difference between them is that One Organization claiming that its philosphy is immutable, not even a dot can be changed, it is 7 century, all the way in 21 century and other organization is ready to change with changing times. A universal law is that change is inevitable, and nothing remains standstill.

    [Reply]

    engrich Reply:

    rajeev try to understand why half the follow this great prophet(pbuh).inspite of this relentless propaganda their followers are increasing.message is very strong.try to understand difference between mohamdans and muslims.followers are called muslims not mohammadans.so character assination makes no effect.he is harday samrat of half the world.

    [Reply]

  • Anonymous

    When Ravi abused hindu gods especially Rama, why did people not ask for banning him.

    He seems to be a unique sikh who has accepted that he knows very little of sikh history but he knows Islamic history and Islam throughly…Wah kya baat hai…Padosi ke maa-baap ko mohabbat karata hai aur apne maa-baap ko pehchanta bhi nahi…Kamaal hai.

    It means slamming hindu gods is game but any bashing of political faith Islam is big NO-NO.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Only idiots ( or is the word gutter scoundrel better ? ) would claim all religions are equal or deserve equal respect ? Is communism, democracy, fascism, wahabism equal and deserving of equal respect ?

    However, all people, irrespective of religion, or their opinions ( including scoundrel idiots ) deserve equal protection under the law. Every human being deserves justice and fair treatment.

    However, everyone should be free to criticize any religion , prophet and characterize them as he judges them. I pick and choose all the gems that I find in Hinduism or offshoots of it or any other religion and am free to reject those that I do not agree with. Neither do I see a need to defend the almighty.

    [Reply]

    Ravi Reply:

    So F.U.C.K is a valid criticism

    [Reply]

    engrich Reply:

    vedic religion is the only rligion which says that man is born unequal.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Yes Pakistani criminals are born unequal as crippled thugs, based on their bad karma that the bigots have collected following a intolerant, primitive ideology.

    ________________________________

    engrich Reply:

    ram was king not god.

    [Reply]

  • Anonymous

    Let me be more specific for people like Ravi. I see Islam and RSS as mirror image of each other because both believe in supremacy of their faith and rejection of other faiths. Both are intolerant and not in sync with modern time.

    Islam has a fixed prophet whereas RSS has changing prophets. Both are based on nationalism that excludes others and their right to live peacefully.

    My contempt for Islam and RSS is equal.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Rajeev

    I do not subscribe to that. RSS may have problems, but its problems are entirely of a different nature than Islam’s problems.

    RSS, more than nationalism, ascribes to a civilizational framework. Of course, one can disagree with those basics.

    Borders, boundaries, affiliations etc are there for countries , people.. One can then argue why dont India, Pakistan unite–for that matter all South Asians..

    The key issue is whether the boundaries are set on impinging on some other’s fundamental rights

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Gopi,
    There are lot of similarities between Islam and RSS. They are very obvious. I have requested Shan to take up this project. I’ll pitch in when I get time.

    [Reply]

  • Anonymous

    Fake Ravi,

    I am surprised at your slip about the RSS. Being ISI trained, you should have been up-todate with the banning of the organisation. Therefore, let me refresh your memory.

    The RSS was banned thrice. The first time was in 1948, when Nathuram Godse assassinated the mahatma. The courts ruled the ban illegal.

    The second was during the emergency. The ban was lifted when in 1977, the dictator herself was thrown out by the people of India.

    The third was when the disputed structure at Ayodhya was demolished by VHP workers. Then too the courts held the ban illegal.

    But, here is an interesting piece of information:

    Field Marshal Cariappa, when he was invited to their function, in his speech to RSS volunteers said “RSS is my heart’s work. My dear young men, don’t be disturbed by uncharitable comments of interested persons. Look ahead! Go ahead! The country is standing in need of your services”

    [Reply]

    Ravi Reply:

    Real Jagat Behnoi

    Thanks for correcting my perception and

    CONFIRMING THAT RSS IS UNIQUELY, AN ORGANISATION WHICH OTHER PEOPLE FEEL THE NEED TO BAN.

    There is something about its philosophy and modus operandi that other people find it reprehensible and are inspired to ban it.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    “Other people……..inspired to ban it”
    Only the government can ban an organisation.

    It is only the congress government which banned it all the three times and lost face every time.

    On the contrary, SIMI was banned and still stays banned.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    I think we should not ban Eunuch Engrich… just restrict his poting to one line to know how brainwashed T U R D S function.

    or for that matter see what lies below the petticoat of T U R D Tajendar wherre two fundoos Engrich and rav are having a rav-shing time… :)

    engrich Reply:

    vijay now keep ur a$$ shut otherwise i will awnser u.

    Ravi Reply:

    SIMI should be banned and should remain so.

    Anonymous Reply:

    Shenoy-

    retd Justice Thomas of the Supreme Court recently had a glowing tribute to RSS – that he came to know about their service activity when he was a district judge, how they have been maligned by “picking and choosing” etc.. it was a thumbs up coming from a Justice who is known for his jurisprudence.

    RSS, like any other political and non-political organizations, has to attract a meaningful “market share”. They never focused on that leaving others to define them as they wanted.

    It is high time they define themselves and market appropriately. Justice Thomas may be a start.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Gopi,

    Justice Thomas is a rare human being, who says what he feels to be true. What, however, I am unable to reconcile with is Nehru’s invitation to the RSS for participation in the Republic Day parade of 1963. Nehru cannot be accused of being ignorant of the stigma attached to the organisation, of being complicit in the Mahatma assassination.

    what made the most secular Nehru do an unpardonable sin of calling Gandhi’s murderer to parade, in their chaddi and kaali topi in front of the whole nation?

    [Reply]

  • Anonymous

    Does Jinnah’s politics of communal hate and Gandhi’s policy of communal harmony deserve equal respect ?
    Does the entity born out of Jinnah’s communal politics and cold blooded murder of direct-action day and the largest, secular democracy in the world deserve equal respect ?

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    According to dimwits like Ravi and Manohar, both ideologies are EQUALLY respectable…This is what fake-intellectuals do.. Appease everyone who is enemy of ideology they are opposed to.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Well then by deductive reasoning you may have arrived at your definition of “scoundrel thugs” .

    [Reply]

  • Anonymous

    Shan,
    I usually do not agree with your abusive language however when it comes to substance you do have logical view.

    Here is a topic for you. I am addressing this to you because you have neutral view most of the time.

    Can you list of similarities between RSS and Islam? No one can do this better than you.

    [Reply]

  • Anonymous

    Shenoy/Manohar:

    I was a young man during emergency days (so also Shenoy, not sure about you Manohar; I think you are much younger) ..

    Smt Indira Priyadarshini Gandhi’s strong man Karunakaran was the CM in kerala. Several bad things happened; the notorious one being the murder of Rajan, a REC student; the only son of a college Sanskrit professor.

    It is there for history. Google Rajan case. Look into Wikepedia on emergency.

    The Malayalam movie “Piravi” (birth) in 1988 by the famous director Shaji Karun was based on this story. It won the national award for the best film that year; it also won the best actor (thespian Premji), best director, and many other awards.

    I recommend movie buffs to see this.

    Again, as I get older, I am wondering what political form of govt is the best for a country.. What is democracy when people can be manipulated easily.. In this regard, I want to bring up a rule the King of Travancore had many many centuries ago. His decree was that only educated people can choose to convert to Christianity because choosing a religion/life style (and relinquishing one) is an extremely difficult one; and only educated people can make that decision. Almost all the syrian christians were all converts from the educated class (and in those days by default mostly nairs because there were not too many Brahmins in kerala) because of this rule.

    I have been thinking of what form – benevolent king, army, dictator, party mode like Chinese, Presidential form of democracy etc- is appropriate for India and its people for growth and liberty. Poverty is the worst form of “discrimination”, and how do we raise peoples living standards… because for sure, lot of our problems will wither away if economic well being improves. A lot has been accomplished, but a lot remains. We created generations of poor people thru our bad economic policies till mid 90s. So, a lot to make up; and collectively we have to decide whether the current political system is upto snuff.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Gopi

    We have discussed earlier as to which system of governance is better.

    Now, let us take specific alternative types.

    1) Benevolent King – where do we find such a saint and who decides whether a person is a saint and will be so in the future?

    2) Army – I think the example of Pakistan should be enough for us to desist from ever imagining that they will accelerate growth and poverty will be a thing of the past.

    3) Dictator – Saddam Hussain, Idi Amin, Pol Pot, ……. Is that an option?

    4) Chinese style one party system. No elections. The communist party is a closed system. The party decides who gets in and who does not. Common man has no say. Also it is one way street – the party speaks and people must listen. If people speak a different language, then it is hell/jail for them.

    5) Presidential System – has its merit. It needs a two party system and all the regional and interest group specific parties must vanish, so that the winner 50%+ of the vote. Is it possible in India? I do not think so.

    6) Parliamentary- the best. Of course with better quality of people manning the key positions in the Executive, the Judiciary, the Bureaucracy, etc. Plus decentralisation of power to the lowest levels -panchayats and zilla parishads or Taluka parishads..

    What are your views on each of the systems?

    About emergency, I have already posted my views earlier. Ruling with emergency powers is out of the question – it is another form of dictatorship.

    Yes, I agree – poverty is the worst form of violence /discrimination.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Now that a Congressi Atma has entered my body, all the answers are clear to me…
    1) Benevolent King – Bad except for Nehru-Gandhis..

    2) Army – Bad except for Nehru-Gandhis..but can Nehru-Gandhi ever be in Army,

    3) Dictator – Bad except for Nehru-Gandhis..

    4) Chinese style one party system: Bad except for Nehru-Gandhi’s Congress Party

    5) Presidential System – Bad except for Nehru-Gandhis..

    6) Parliamentary- Bad except for parliament dominated by chamchas of Nehru Gandhis..

    All systems can work in India provided they are run by super competent (in corruption) Nehru-Gandhis.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Gopi,

    I have known the sad story of Rajan, who was killed by Karunakaran’s Gestapo. The infamous aeroplane punishment was repeatedly administered to Rajan as it was to several thousands of RSS workers in Karnataka too.

    Ironically, during the emergency days, I was working right below the PM’s office in South Block, where I had my branch.

    [Reply]

  • Anonymous

    —————————————————————————————————————————–
    ~~ WHY THE RSS CIRCULAR IS FAKE AND LAUGHABLY FUNNY !!! ~~~
    —————————————————————————————————————————-

    There are still people in the world who want to believe that 9/11 was a Jewish conspiracy and maybe a CIA plot to capture the oil resources of the middle east. This RSS circular, supposedly secret falls in the same mould. Disinformation which the Engriches and tajendars would want to flaunt to shame an organisation.

    Had such a circular actually existed, Manish Tewari would been dancing the salsa and Digviansh Singh doing rock and roll, twist and bhangra by turn.

    This is just a poorly crafted, badly worded attempt to confuse people. To anyone familiar witht he mandal masjid politics of the 90’s this would be the sort of disinformation which would drive people to the VP Singh coalition which was purpodely consisting of minoirties, and lower castes versus the higher caste Hindus.

    At that point the bJP was trying to build a votebank of Hindus telling them that they were being discriminated agaisnt in India. Whiel his opponents, mostly from the VP Singh movement — Mulayam, Mayawati, Bukhari, Shahabuddin– were trying divide this mass b y weaning away the scheduled castes from this huge mass.

    The whole pamphlet is worded in such a manner that anyone who does not fall into the so called ‘high caste” Hindu bracket would immediately hate the RSS and BJP. And also the Ram Mandir movement.

    I think you need to be dumb, if you take this pamphlet seriously

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Viju

    Absolutely. Do not waste time responding to these c—p. Employ few people, give them an opportunity, and make money during that time.

    You are doing a great service to the country..keep it up

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    ——————————-Thx Gopi !—————————————————-

    [Reply]

    engrich Reply:

    There are still people in the world who want to believe that 9/11 was a Jewish conspiracy

    1200 intellectuals of america has issued signed letter confiming that 9/11 was inside job.if u have slightest of mind ,tell me how a building with 200million tons of steel can fell in 57 minutes.

    rss circular is old.it is nothing new.may be for it is new.actually they do it.if u read the stories of riots.
    rss is crowd gangesters murderers homosexuals infant burners rapists hawala dealers scamoperators and financial thieves.

    any type of derogatory adjectives is nothing as compare to their deeds.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Is Amar Singh an RSS too?

    [Reply]

    engrich Reply:

    money corrution is least harmful corruption.mental corruption is the most harmful.

    Anonymous Reply:

    Vijay,

    Yes it looks like a fake to me too.

    [Reply]

  • Anonymous

    I am a Sikh….but I don’t know Sikh history..I support Congress on 1984 sikh massacre. I get all worked up if Islam is criticised..but I abuse hindus and hindu gods whenever I can. I have 3 land lines but no cell phone..I send 10 emails to Balwinder to prove I am MONA Sikh…earlier I was sikh and before than I was Hindu. My ancestors were hounded out of SIALKOT by HINDUS. I use ‘WE’ when defending Islam..I find Tajender as best debater. When cornered I plead for help and support from people..especially from corrupt Congressis. I justify Islamic terror and have mourned death of Osama like his widow..I never condemn Pakistan’s terror in J&K but support right of J&K terrorists to breakaway from India. I am secular while abusing Hindus..I see Jinn of RSS everywhere…

    WHO AM I?

    I am deceitful liar and morally corrupt Ravi.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Aur mein Janani bhi hoon…Kaun hun mein?…Mona Sikh Ravi…

    [Reply]

  • Anonymous

    Pranab today stated that Rahul is ready to be the PM —

    Isf this is the ‘emerging” India, the envy of the world? (okok, lot of things to fix; but they like our eco growth)

    Well, Srimathi Indira Priydarshini Gandhi must be beaming – amazed at the eunuch tradition she set in place surviving even after 30 years of her death!

    I will take even Prakash Karat against the boy!

    God bless India..

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    “Pranab today stated that Rahul is ready to be the PM”

    There is no shortage of sycophants in the Congress. Search for one, you will get 100s and 1000s.

    Also, it is his way telling what he thinks of Dr. Manmohan Singh.

    [Reply]

  • Pankaj#1

    Manohar;
    Thanks for the links. I not only opened second link but there are two links below the article of krishnan dubey( ?), strange name. I will advise every friend to go through these links, even for a brief while and you will realize, how people take pleasure in ridiculing great people. Savarkar, who spent 13 years in jail, gave away lucrative career of being a barrister, for country. His sufferings in jail are illustrative. Compare him to other freedom fighters/Rajbhogis and then you get the bigger picture.
    Comment are welcome, Manohar included.

    [Reply]

    Ravi Reply:

    Pankaj

    I could, but the gap between us is of canyon proportions, and I am not as young as I used to be.

    I am sure you have already formed your own opinions.

    Savour them.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    @Pankaj#1 , FACTS ARE STRANGER THAN FICTION.
    That savarkar begged the british to free him from Andaman is as true as vinod sharma writing the blogpiece in HT.
    Also savarkar was a conservative bramhin who beleived in hindu orthodoxy on caste etc.

    [Reply]

    Pankaj#1 Reply:

    Shan;
    By now, you must have realized that I do not support caste system. In present times, as we can not dwell on excesses commited by moghuls/ muslim invaders, and transfer those excesses on present muslims, by the same token, excesses commited by brahmins can not be transferred to present day brahmins, who are a caricature of long gone era. It is a new brave world, where only merit,and integrity will flourish. rest are Chimera.

    [Reply]

    engrich Reply:

    pankaj indian was ruled by muslims.indians were ruled by brhmns.can u produce one paper in which brhmns have protested moghul excesses.this story of of excesses was fabricated after muslim lost power.like what is happening in libya.tulsidaass never metioned existence of any ram temple in ayodhya.he introduce ram to people of ayodhya.before they never heard of rama as ayodhya was budhhdist place later occupied by jainese.vedics are late comer.nawab wajid ali shah popularize this cult through ramlila.terrorist sangh parivar used this for vote bank politics.now they are boycotted by holy of ayodhya.they have bring cadres from neighbouring district to organize,as they are hated locally by people of ayodhya.

    i am against brhmnsts not brhmns because they are thieves,murders and local agent of international devisive forces in india.

    Anonymous Reply:

    Shaan Nirad Babu,

    is it stranger than Shivaji begging Aurangzeb to permit him to perform poojas and distribute sweets, and when so permitted, he escapes from the clutches of the tyrant?

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Pankaj

    The first link http://www.savarkar.org obviously is a site by his admirers and followers, so they will only highlight at many of his positives (no problem with that per se) and there were many. That is one perspective, but not balanced. It is similar to website of a Company – we are this good, we are that good, blah, blah, blah. No one would want to show one’s warts.

    As Shan says, his “deal” with the British in1920s, so he could walk free, is true and that is very big black mark against him. Many of the documents in this connection are available with the National Archives, New Delhi.(see link below)

    Perhaps, his apologists may argue that he seeking clemency was a trick, so that he could once again actively devote himself to the freedom movement.
    ——————

    This is what Dr. B. R. Ambedkar summarises Savakrkar’s position

    “Mr. Savarkar… insists that, although there are two nations in India, India shall not be divided into two parts, one for Muslims and the other for the Hindus; that the two nations shall dwell in one country and shall live under the mantle of one single constitution;… In the struggle for political power between the two nations the rule of the game which Mr. Savarkar prescribes is to be one man one vote, be the man Hindu or Muslim. In his scheme a Muslim is to have no advantage which a Hindu does not have. Minority is to be no justification for privilege and majority is to be no ground for penalty. The State will guarantee the Muslims any defined measure of political power in the form of Muslim religion and Muslim culture. But the State will not guarantee secured seats in the Legislature or in the Administration and, if such guarantee is insisted upon by the Muslims, such guaranteed quota is not to exceed their proportion to the general population”.

    Some more links

    1) The full text of his apology (scanned from the National Archives).

    http://www.scribd.com/doc/14790262/Savarkars-Apology

    2) http://www.hindu.com/fline/fl1915/19151160.htm

    BTW, the second link (article by Krishnan Dubey & Venkitesh Ramakrishnan) I had mentioned http://www.hvk.org belongs to HIndu Vivek Kendra – A resource center fo the promotion of Hindutva.

    —————-

    Having gone through many resources and articles, I do not consider him to be a role model.

    [Reply]

    Pankaj#1 Reply:

    Thanks Manohar;
    I am really enjoying this debate. Now please go to your post above and read Savarkar’s position, line by line, as summarised by Ambedkar. Now , with what stance of Savarkar, you disagree. One man one vote? Congress (Gandhiji’s idea), No privilage on the basis of religion, very enlightened ideaMuslims getting Guarantee of following their religion etc. Which is the corner stone of even present day Indian polity. any positive discrimination should be on the basis of poverty and such conditions. Both the links, below Krishnan’s article, do not criticize Savarkar. the only thing mentioned there that he asked for clemancy, which after sufferings he had in the prison. 6 mo nth’s isolation, even one weeks isolation in jail is like 7 years outside. paon main bediya for god knows how many months. kala Paani etc. How many of our past rulers have gone through this rigor?? Compare his sufferings to Kasab, Afzal Guru etc and that too at the height of british power, when there was no ray of hope,of liberation for another 500 years. that will break even the strongest will.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    I deliberately put the summary by Dr. Ambedkar.

    I do not practice bigotry – that I will point out only the good or only bad side of a person. This discussion is not about trying to convince you to have the same view on Savarkar as mine – it is for you to take an independent view.

    He had his positives, however overall I do not consider him to be a role model.

    Suffering! – see my reply above.

    Pankaj#1 Reply:

    he is not my role model either. what I am trying to say, why this demonization of him?

    Anonymous Reply:

    One need not listen to the people who demonize him, nor one should accept hook, line and sinker what his admirers and followers say. Sorry, if I sound patronising, one should hold onto to one’s views, even if one is in a minority of one.

    I too agree with the summary by Dr. Ambedkar. No issues at all.

    The only reason I can think of he being demonized is because of that apology. Of course, he was also one of the accused in the assassination of Mahatma Gandhi, but was set free due to lack of proof – fair enough, the government did not harass him after until his death in the 60s.

    Ravi Reply:

    Plus the fact that Nathu Ram Godse visited him in Bombay, just days before Gandhi’s murder.

    There is anecdotal evidence that he gave Nathu Ram his blessings.

    There is more than just suspicion that he gave his approval to the political assassination of Mahatma.

    Pankaj#1 Reply:

    Manohar;
    I am not trying to change anything in your thinking or such. I am not in conversion business. I was only trying to understand negativity surrounding savarkar. situations in1900 could be very difficult for every one. british power was at its Zenith. I feel, lesser people would have done any thing to get barristership from Great Britain. But enough of Savarkar. I consider this chapter as closed.

    Anonymous Reply:

    Done.

    engrich Reply:

    he should not be demonized.but his participation in freedom struggle should not be hyped.i wrote above on hazrat mohani,fist president of communist party of india.he suffered far more but never asked for pardon.u wrote that he was ferocious fighter,in what way and where he fought with britishers.

    engrich Reply:

    getting Guarantee of following their religion etc. Which is the corner stone of even present day Indian polity

    BUT MUSLIM KILLERS GO UNPUNISHED.EVEN THEY DONT SAY SORRY AS KILLING THE HUMAN BEING IS THEIR FUNDAMENTAL RIGHT.

    engrich Reply:

    pankaj and shan,

    the following is part of speech by menachem begin in israeli parliament.this is mindset of hindutva also being twin brother,

    Our race is the Master Race. We Jews are divine goods on this planet. We are as different from inferior races as they are from insects. In fact, compared to our race, other races are beasts and animals, cattle at best. Other races are considered as human excrement. Our destiny is to rule over the inferior races. Our earthly kingdom will be reuled by our leader with a rod of Iron. The masses will lick our feet and serve us as our slaves.”

    THIS IS WHY MODI/HINDUTVA GOONS ARE REFUSING TO SAY EVEN SORRY TO VICTIMS OF GUJRAT RIOT.

    Anonymous Reply:

    Pankaj ji,

    you are right on several points. I for one, couldn’t find anything amiss in Ambedkar’s views on Savarkar. They are very rational, practical and unbiased. It could as well have come from any real secularist.

    Anonymous Reply:

    Pankaj

    You wrote

    “Savarkar, who spent 13 years in jail, gave away lucrative career of being a barrister, for country”.

    What is so unique about it? – Gandhi, Nehru, Patel, Prasad and scores of others gave up lucrative careers to plunge in to freedom movement. These people spent many years in jail too and without seeking any clemency.

    [Reply]

    Pankaj#1 Reply:

    Manohar;
    Think about your own words. Gandhi, Nehru, Patel, Prasad, every one was a great person, no doubt. But has anyone suffered the way Savarkar has suffered? has savarkar got any recognition for his sufferings, in the twilight years of his life? Can you compare him and all the illustrive people you mentioned above? Their power and privilages. it is clear that savarkar started has life as a ferocious fighter against Britishers. he awas a close confidente of Tilak, Ram prasad bismil and Shyamji Varma, all people, who are held in great esteem. What is Savarkar’s sin??

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    The degree of suffering! Measuring greatness by the level of sacrifice made!

    Other people have suffered more – for example, Bhagat Singh and his team, they did not ask for clemency and to had to pay by their lives.

    Come on, Pankaj.

    Pankaj#1 Reply:

    Yes Manohar;
    Agree that Bhagatsingh and others died. it is easier to die in dignified manner than suffer physical torture for innumerable years. Having said this, even now everyone hold them in high esteem, why this demonization of Savarkar??

    engrich Reply:

    maulana Hasrat Mohani participated in the struggle for Indian Independence (end of British Raj); and was jailed for many years by British authorities. soiltary confinement.He was the first person in Indian History who demanded ‘Complete Independence’ ( Azadi-e-Kaamil) in 1921 as he presided over an annual seesion of All India Muslim League. He was not only a practising Muslim but also a strong supporter of the communist philosophy, as he could see that British could be possibly defeated by following its principles. Therefore, he was among the founders of The Communist Party of India. He was also imprisoned for promoting anti-British ideas especially for publishing an article against British policies.BUT HE NEVR SUBMITTED APOLOGY OR REQUESTED HIS FREEDOM AGAINST SOME DEAL.

    Ravi Reply:

    Along with many many great Indians mentioned here in this blog, Hasrat Mohani’s name should be included.

    Anonymous Reply:

    But, Mahatma Gandhi and the congress party he led, trivialised Bhagat Singh’s supreme sacrifice by asking the people not to ‘honour’ his memory.

    engrich Reply:

    savarkar looks like twin brother of heobbles.india has no muslim problem it has serious hindutva problem.god save our country from these rascals.
    they create different ideolegies to create problem and perpetuate blood bath.

    they invented communism which killed 5 crores russians.proleteriat revolution was planned and financed by capitalists of new york.
    here also foriegners are planning the future of india.

    savarkar sins startyed when he left andaman jail.where he was brain washed was converted from nationalist to fascist.his sins can be seen in the deds of his followers.A DOCTORS KILLING HIS PATIENT ON OPERATION TABLE.WOMEN ARE RAPED AND BURNT ALIVE.

    later part of his life he was a british spy.he is not indian.zoinists are liars of highest order.i doubt what is written about him is true.

    it is because of people like him 4millions were killed during partition.it is because of vilness that india had 600 communal riots.they have capacity to convert man into animal.

    SIN WAS IN HIS MIND AND PEN.

    guest Reply:

    heobbles pls read geobbles

    engrich Reply:

    if u see the face of savarkar he looks twin brother of geobbles.he was godless jew pretending to part of hindu culture.
    jews created problems in europe.european solved this problem by sending thm to middle east where indian jews should be sent.i dont know.
    india has serious hidutva problem not muslim problem..they are pushing muslims to become terrorist.
    their media neither take rest nor give respite.

    [Reply]

  • Anonymous

    @Vijay, Gopi, Pankaj etc
    People on this blog are not divided by religion. They are divided by country they support. I am yet to see an Indian muslim on this blog who has been abusive of India or its religions. The most abusive ones are those that root for Jinnah-Let-Jaish-e-Mohammads Pakistan. Some of them openly or covertly peddle the case of Pakistan and every criminality that it represents and want to discuss everything except the conduct of the criminal entity that there loyalties lie with.
    You will find the peddlers of the fake-RSS pamphlets running around like rabid dogs as if they received it directly from the hands of their prophet ! Tajinder , the pakistani, has a bus load of those which he carries around and feeds these dogs.

    Just watch and enjoy.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    The above rant is that of a paedophile , trying to justify child abuse , by portraying it as special love for children. Only that the love happens to be of a sexual nature. This pathetic and sad PUNDOO , an utter failure in life NOW USES FLAG WAVING to hide his criminal face.
    This idiot should remember what Dr Johnson said PATRIOTISM IS THE LAST REFUGE OF A SCOUNDREL.
    People who are grounded in science analyse things OBJECTIVELY , that includes HISTORY , they refuse to be mouthpiece or a PROPAGANDIST.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Just one of the rabid dogs I mentioned. I just throw some stale meat and they flock. Love that.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    The paedophile i mentioned , got rattled , started writing in with anxiety tremor , thus using the word flock , for in his mind he is thinking of FROCK , of a young innocent girl which he defrocked

    Anonymous Reply:

    @ Shan

    I think you should pick up a debate on the issue rather than get into persoanl abuse. What did you gain out it?

    maybe a moments thrill.

    But you have lost a lot of people who could have read your post.

    You can notice that nobody else is abusing at a personal level

    Pankaj#1 Reply:

    Rajiiv;
    You are so correct.One does not need 6th sense to make out these psuedos.

    [Reply]

    engrich Reply:

    rajiiiv i am indian muslims .respected muslims will not come. u are 3r rated indians.i can withstand ur stupidities and abuses.because i can give u more if needed.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    In your before-expulsion-from-Vinodji’s blog avtar, you were professing to be a Hindu, (a fake Hindu, actually), with the holiest of holy name of Ram Autar. How have you now become a Muslim? Do you think that by telling us that you are an Indian Muslim, all the s.hit you are peddling here will be more acceptable?

    What a bewaqoof Muslim are you!

    [Reply]

    engrich Reply:

    i am only writing truth but it is not good for stooopids of this blog.what can i do.

    engrich Reply:

    ram autar is not holy name.ram was king in an epic not god.this shows your poor knowledge on hinduism

    Anonymous Reply:

    Entirely agree

    [Reply]

  • Pankaj#1

    Shenoy Sahab;
    A simi module, which was trying to establish contact with JeM in pakistan has been busted. that is where I said, finish first Jihadis in India then, aspire for Afghanistan.

    [Reply]

  • Anonymous

    Rajiv S today addressed this to me
    Shan,
    I usually do not agree with your abusive language however when it comes to substance you do have logical view.

    Here is a topic for you. I am addressing this to you because you have neutral view most of the time.

    Can you list of similarities between RSS and Islam? No one can do this better than
    you.

    Well I will try my best. Though let me relate some relevant experience today.
    I was invited to a durga puja is East London near BOW. I have been to other pujas in the past..There is one in Camden , incredible it may seem SHARMILA TAGORE AND SOHA ALI KHAN was gracing the podium .I am certain both had all air fares plus a tidy sum paid up for the appearance.There is aPUB opposite the town hall. There was incredible scenes of women straight out from the anjali and prasad , heading to the Pub. managing Pallu with one hand John Smith with another.
    Now BOW was fascinating. Here not a single house or probably very few are private houses. 90% of the flats are COUNCIL HOUSES. But the flats are so neat and nice , who needs to own house . All of the residents are from either Sylhet , bangladesh or every muslim country you can think of , somalia , eratrea , yemen , you name it.
    This made me realise PARTITION REALLY DESTROYED BENGALI HINDUS , they are treated like second class citizens , and the Muslims in Bangladesh with the exodus of hindus as well as being on their own are like an orphan.
    In UK bangladeshi muslims have recoiled into the morgue called fanatic islam.
    What was interesting in this puja was two GORAS selling books on krishna.
    Hare krishna society is india’s most visible spiritual brand in the world. Sylhet is where from the fountain head of this movement came from ,his name was chaitanya mahaprabhu.I am an aethist , But his message is one I am prepared to listen.
    He said “You dont need God , You dont need Temples , You dont need Scriptures,
    ALL YOU NEED IS TO GIVE LOVE TO YOUR FELLOW HUMAN BEINGS

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Sharmila Tagore and Soha Ali celebrating Navaratri in London, so soon after the passing away of the Nawab is shocking as well as revealing.

    Either, the pull of Navaratri is too strong for a Bengali, even a converted Bangali
    Or, the pull of a free trip with all expenses paid was too much to resist.

    [Reply]

    Ravi Reply:

    Crumbs of comfort, alas

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Sharmila and Soha at Camden Puja, THAT WAS FEW YEARS AGO.

    [Reply]

  • Anonymous

    RSS and Islam
    Well the similarities are striking. BOTH ARE ORGANISATIONAL, islam is organised religion with politics in its DNA , RSS is a organisation with religion as its DNA.
    Both are LED by IDIOTS , whose knowledge of science and rationality is that of an monkey.Both attract people with false assurance of security and brotherhood.Both use VIOLENCE as its tool to meet its objective. Both are ANTI MODERN , both are viciously MISOGYNIST. Both are led by PRIEST, and every civilization where priest class got upperhand , went down the slippery slope, be it Persian , jewish , CURRENT ISLAM vis a vis Mullah, and the GREATEST HINDU CIVILIZATION and its downfall

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Shan,
    Great job. So every criticism of RSS is valid for Islam and vice versa.
    When people like Ravi Slam RSS, they are actually slamming its twin ideology Islam.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Rajeev,

    you mean, when Ravi abuses Balwinder’s wife and child, he is actually abusing his own wife and child?

    [Reply]

    Ravi Reply:

    How very intelligent….

    I did not abuse Balwinder for nothing. Are you aware as to what he said.

    No because you dont care what your friends say.

    That is te issue. You go after only those who you do not like.

    And you do not like liberals.

    The rest is just hog wash

    Anonymous Reply:

    Currently only one things differentiates RSS and Islam..a proven case of terrorism… Once terror case against RSS is proven, it will become equal of Islam.

    I fail to see how people can support RSS. They may be doing some social work but it is a fact that they want non-hindus to be second grade citizen. I’m sure majority of hindus don’t want Islam type of rule in India imposed by RSS on India.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Rajeev,

    you can’t be more wrong. Vajapayee and Advani were and still are RSS swayamsevaks and they have never once disowned or disavowed their affiliation. And they have ruled India for six years and not even the worst crypto fundoos like Fake Ravi can say with any proof that they have acted against the interests of Muslims or India in general.

    You are plainly prejudiced.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    @ Shenoy

    You are right. The Vajpayee era was among the brightest of the post independece India.

    Ravi Reply:

    In what way was it brightest?

    Anonymous Reply:

    This was the time there was not talk of leaders grooming therir children for succession.

    The foreign policy was revolutionised with India using policy for dealing equally witht he world, rather than being a side show player

    Econominc growth was good. Liberalisation poicies were on and there were no 2G type of scams.

    Anonymous Reply:

    Yes, “Shining India!”

    “and there were no 2G type of scams”.

    Really?

    Anonymous Reply:

    Not rally. It is only now that there are no 2G scams. We now have 2Gs.

    Anonymous Reply:

    “We now have 2Gs”.

    And that really discomforts you. Right?

    Anonymous Reply:

    My discomfort is nothing compared to the comfort congressies like you find in having them as the dispensers of the nation’s destiny.

    Anonymous Reply:

    Reconfirming your discomfort – that they (and not Modi)happen to be dispensers of nation’s destiny. Of course, we all look for comforts in life.

    Anonymous Reply:

    BVS

    Do you by any chance own a printing press?

    I wondering, because the number of and the frequency with you distribute certificates of character, background, inclinations, patriotism, nationalism and for everything else under the sun to all and sundry. Paper must be really cheep (*)

    See – on the above post, you have issued certificates to three people in one breadth.

    At the last count, I think you have issued 4 such certificates to me in last couple of days. Can I have one more just for fun?

    (*) cheap.

    Ravi Reply:

    It is part of a tactic which goes something like this.

    1. Like minded people are OK, chat with them as one chats with friends.

    2. Those who have different opinions, then do not argue on opinions, just condemn them as Fake, Muslim, Alien, what have you.

    Hence the need, not only to issue certificates, but also to issue, all too frequent, reminders that certain individuals are fair game to attack.

    Anonymous Reply:

    Vajapayee and Advani do not need my certificates of any human trait that they possess or don’t possess.

    Ravi is on a self promotion trip, I don’t have to give him any. But calling a spade a spade helps to remove the cobwebs in the minds of certain types of people practising psedo secularism. You just happen to be one of them.

    Anonymous Reply:

    If they did not need your certificates, then why?

    I was talking about Ravi, but RajeevS – At least sometimes you should read the posts a bit more carefully.

    Pseudo -secularism!
    What do you practice – pseudo Hinduism, better know Hindutvaism?

    It is better to be pseudo secularist than a hindutvawadi.

    Anonymous Reply:

    RajeevS

    In spite of our slanging match yesterday, I salute you for your comment here.

    Any type of fundamental and exclusive ideology is a danger to the society.

    [Reply]

    engrich Reply:

    no muslim country in the world,except pakistan,claim that they run on islamic principle inclding saudi arabia.
    u people are so vocal about islam why silent on christian country where religion plays important role inn politics.
    when bush ordered his army to destroy iraq their army was led by pastors having gun in their hands not bible.

    muslims are most tolerant ruler.only in istamboul dubai and jakarta u will find temple mosque churh and synogouge side by side.

    i never saw any muslim ruler visiting clergy and advertising it hindu rulers and rich do it and show it.even mms has gone to see satya sai baba ,king of frauds.
    for indira it was regular.muslims are most secular in practice.dubai has become hindu majority city nobody complain.no movement.

    HUM AAH BHI BHARTEHAIN TO HO JATE HAIN BADNAAM

    WOH QATL BHI KARTE HAIN TO CHURCHA NAHIN HOTA.

    mr mohan i will request ur awnser.

    [Reply]

    engrich Reply:

    swarsati the godess of knowledge was illetrate.hindu name is imported has no civilization only war stories.

    [Reply]

  • Anonymous

    @Pankaj,
    Well you are right when you call these scoundrels as ‘fakes’. But that’s an understatement.

    [Reply]

  • Pankaj#1

    Ravi;
    Your quotereference to: Paadna: and : Dakar: lena betrays you. Your felicity with english language is no substitute to manners, up bringing and culture or for that matter, intellect. I will interact with you on intellectual basis only, otherwise I can conveniently ignore you, as I ignore Tajinder.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    You see these people who come from Jahil background will never forget their aukaat even if they wear golden crown. Did you watch rude interview of Shoaib Akhter?
    Same kind of crudeness was displayed by Afridi after world cup defeat.
    Jahil Quom can never change no matter how much govt, helps them..Chor Uchaakke kabhi sudhar sakte hein..

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Rajeev,

    Dont say anything against Shoaib Akhatar. There is a airport
    named after him in London. HE THROW.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Mohan,

    are you sure? I thought the airport is named in honour of the greatest of all. throwers, Malinga

    Ravi Reply:

    You missed the Raag Malkauns and you propensity to wah wah even the mundane if it comes from BV Shenoy.

    Happy to be labelled bad mannered than to be sycophant.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Pankaj ji,

    very well put. Fakes aakhir mein fakes hi hote hain. In the past he tried to impress you and gain access into your accepted circle by talking about Air Force Public School, Dhaula Kuan, Roshan Di Kulfi in Karol Bagh etc., but that is the veneer he puts on on his jihadi core, which comes out only when cornered and/or exposed.

    [Reply]

    Ravi Reply:

    Moogle Maps squire Moogle Maps.

    [Reply]

    Ravi Reply:

    My preference would be for you to ignore me. The reason is very simple. I rather deal with BVS directly.

    It would also be one less chore for me to do.

    Why do I get this feeling that we have been here before.

    Let me once again re-iterate, what you do, is entirely under your control, though repeated attempts are being made for you to surrender this independent WILL to BV Shenoy. Signs of your capitulation are all too visible.

    [Reply]

  • Pankaj#1

    Every one.
    India is resuming responsibility for governance and security after withdrawal of Nato forces. Music to my ears. Long live Manmohan. Why BJP should be judged differently, escaps me. They will look after India’s interest, as nicely as Manmohan government, minus some tweeking, that is basically, internal. Foreign policy is bipartison, is long cherished goal of India.

    [Reply]

  • Pankaj#1

    My quarrel here is with: Soldiers of Allah:. who come in different guise and : AVTAR:.
    I have no quarrel with people who are soldiers of humanity.

    [Reply]

  • Pankaj#1

    Everyone;
    My quarrel is with : Soldiers of Allah: Who come in many disguise and :AVTARS:. Soldiers of humanity are OK.

    [Reply]

  • Anonymous

    Dr Mishra:

    I apologize. Picked up your note only today. I have been out traveling; will be back only after few weeks.

    Hope you had a good time. Just imagine, Pallava Kings of yesteryears, and their invited guests, enjoying enchanting Bharat Natyam dance performed by the elite performers from the kingdom on a moonlit night with the sound of waves in the background. They used to have dance “competition” at the present day rock temple, with the king crowning the best artists.

    The whole development from Adyar to Mahabalipuram and beyond is all in the last 15 years!

    Did you get a chance to visit KalaKshethra and KCS Panicker’s artist village (the first of its kind in India where artists from all over can live and do their craft in the same place)..

    In Chennai, one can still be in the “old” India of music and dance easily merging into the “new” India.

    [Reply]

  • Dr Mishra

    @ Shoeb, I will be at the Radisson Mahabalipuram till Saturday eveing. If you are free to meet up there then pl let me know.

    This blog has once again descended to chaos.

    Darnley street Dr Shan- please do desist from attacking Rajiiv in sick language of paedophilia, frock etc- our profession demands nobility of us at all times. You are a doctor, set a standard

    [Reply]

    Ravi Reply:

    Dr Mishra

    Perhaps you would be kind enough to remind us all as who was the first person to use the MC galli on this blog.

    While we are being archaeological about things, who was the MC aimed at.

    [Reply]

  • Anonymous

    Yesterday here in Dubai prosecution dropped the charges against five Indians
    who took part in the procession in favour of Anna Hazare movement. The reason
    given was tht their act was not against the State.

    [Reply]

  • Ravi

    Compare and be exonerated

    A comparison between Islam and the RSS has been drawn. Organisation similarities have been noted and the focus has been successfully moved from blasphemy and unwarranted insult of a prophet to Islam as a whole. Such training in managing ones PR is standard in the RSS circles.

    Had the comparison been made between Islam and the Boy Scout Movement, the Mormon Church, The Tibetan Buddhism, the International Olympic Committee, etc. the list of similarities would have been much the same.

    Freedom of an orphan

    As you may have read that previously I have declared myself as an orphan. It is a function of age rather than a symbol of pride. But I must say that it does give me relief from undue parental and peer group pressure. This means I can say what I want, without fear, so long as it is within the bounds of decency. My decency.

    Throwing the galli MC at me is therefore academic. Similarly, making an assumption that I am a Muslim and then to go on to criticise and insult Islam, hoping that it would hurt me, is an entirely futile exercise. It not only fails to hurt me (because I am not a Muslim), but instead it lays bare the writers Islamophobic stance.

    Continue talking to the hand, but the hand isn’t listening.

    Civilisation is the gap between me and my Jahil self. Every now and then when I do meet the Jahil me, the noble savage, I like him more than I like the civilised one. Try it and you will reacquaint yourself with some of the forgotten joys.

    [Reply]

  • Anonymous

    Futile to compare Islam with RSS
    ————————————————-

    An interesting question has been raised. how do we compare Islam with the RSS. In my opinion, Islam cannot be compared as it is a religion which needs to adopt to the present century while RSS was a social movement which wanted to protect Hindus from an assualt by foreign forces and forces of conversion.

    It would be correct to say that in some ways the role of Islam was that of an agressor in India and the RSS chose to take up the mantle of the defender.

    Unfortunately both need to reform. Islam has become the garb of dictators and kings to rule as well as subjugate women and minorities. RSS, which does exemplary work needs to adopt itself to the modern idiom and recognise that India is a multireligious country now and so it should accept that.

    While indivdial Muslims have no problems in living with other religions, the mullas and the maulvis want Islam to remain a converting and conquering force, putting it at odds with the rest of the world.

    The RSS would want to outgrow its image of a defender of HIndus to a defender of India of all religions and creed…

    [Reply]

    Ravi Reply:

    Vinoo

    Totally agree with you.

    Well articulated mon ami

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    @ Ravi

    Well you have agreed to agree with me at your own risk! I am an atheist but do follow Hinduism once a while.

    I think the basic issue is religion being a tool for supression. All religions need to adopt/change or wither away. Texts written in another age cannot become a dogma today.

    If I were to have the biblical belief that the world was crreated by Adam and eve, how do I explain the dinosaurs and the human bodies of ten thousand years age?

    If I as a HIndu, were to believe that the karma of my previous birth makes me what I am today… well I dont have to do good now. Its all been done before.

    But most of all the harsh, obscene and violent intrepretation of the texts done in some Muslim societies is not only bad, but scary as it will eventually lead to a clash of civilizations of the nuclear kind.

    God save the world from religion !

    [Reply]

    Ravi Reply:

    Vinoo

    Having read your second post.

    I still substantially agree with you.

    There is nothing that you have said, that I do not believe myself.

    I oppose LITTERAL interpretations of any text. Sacred or otherwise.

    Anonymous Reply:

    @ Ravi

    What about rights to walk out of the religion and becoming an athiest ?

    Does the state have any role when a Sikh wants to become a Muslim.

    A muslim wants to become a Hindu

    A Hindu wants to become a Christian

    And the CHristian wants to become an athiest.

    And all of them want to critscize each others religion…

    This is the cause fo the fights. Now are you getting ready for it. Assuming you belong to ONE of these relgions, what is your reaction now?

    Ravi Reply:

    Vinoo

    Religion is a private affair; state has no role to perform in it.

    Any one can CHOOSE to walk out of their birth religion.

    If a Sikh wishes to become a Muslim, then that is their personal affair and state has no role in it. Individual freedom is sacrosanct, if you pardon the expression.

    Same applies to all other such scenarios that you have listed above.

    Sensible criticism of all religions should be permitted. Those who oppose such criticism are LITTERALISTS. Like believing that Jesus is the only son of GOD, or that Quran is the message dictated by GOD.

    I am a liberal Mona Sikh (though there are others who would try to persuade you otherwise), and strictly adhere to liberal values.

    My personal views are as expressed above.

    Anonymous Reply:

    well, the only problem is that a muslm will be killed by his fellow muslims if he converts. be it in islamic country or in any other country…sas we speak an iranian is sentenced to death sentence for convertg to christianity

    Anonymous Reply:

    And when a proselytised Christian is reconverted to Hinduism, the whole world comes down on India calling it intolerant.

    Ravi Reply:

    You sound like a convert.

    Are you?

    engrich Reply:

    well, the only problem is that a muslm will be killed by his fellow muslims if he converts

    in pakistan millions converted.ur claim is wrong.it is many indian states which has banned conversion.

    Anonymous Reply:

    As self promotions go, this takes the cake for duplicity.

    Ravi Reply:

    All because it does not fit with the flase image of me that you want to portray.

    The only one here who is duplicitious, is YOU.

    Anonymous Reply:

    Vinoo

    I am too an atheist. Your views are a welcome change.

    In the last decade or two, the only people who seem to have made a noise about conversions – the parents of the person concerned (probably), the immediate society and the VHP/BD/SS (in case the conversion is from Hinduism to any other, especially Islam and has accompanied by violence, threats and intimidation) and the Mullahs (here too use of violence, threats and intimidation).

    Religion is a private affair – one should keep it within the four walls of one’s home/heart and in temples, churches, mosques, etc. Outside of that – it must cease to matter and must not be exploited.

    engrich Reply:

    u should oppose ban on conversion in many states of india.

    Anonymous Reply:

    vinoo-

    You ate too generous. God save the world from Islamic religion, the way the world is going now!

    Anonymous Reply:

    @ Raju

    I did not want to say anything harsh against any particular religion. But yes, I am disturbed by the way a monolithic version of Islam is being financed and forced all over the world.

    This version of Islam only welcomes ENTERANTS to Islam and punishes and murders anybody who disagrees or wants to convert away from islam.

    This is used as a tool by depsots to rule over their empires and also subjugate religious minorites and women by stating that they are only third class citizens becasue it is written in a book.

    Now that is what i said in my first posting. That it is time religious texts are seen with a bit of humour…

    For at times… they do read like jokebooks…

    engrich Reply:

    millions of muslims have converted to christianity in pakistan.who was killed.
    this is only propaganda.

    engrich Reply:

    God save the world from Islamic religion, the way the world is going now!

    and save india from rss .

    Anonymous Reply:

    @ Vinoo

    Vinoo59 reminds me of Vinoo Mankad, who played cricket in the fifities!

    Anyway, you are pretty correct. It was only when countries interacted, without letting religion coming in the way, did the present world evolve.

    Wish it would remain the same way…

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Vijay Kumar, Vinoo,

    I used to simply worship Vinoo Mankad, the wizard of off spin and holder of the world record for the first wicket partnership.

    I had hundreds of paper clippings of his during my school days.

    [Reply]

    engrich Reply:

    vinoo mankad was first brhmn cricketer.i was his fan.

    Ravi Reply:

    How does it matter if he was a Brahmin or not.

    He was a great cricketer. That is sufficient. He was repersenting India and not his caste or his relgion.

    engrich Reply:

    i agree with u.he was one of greatest cricket this sport has produced.i was his great fan.but i added word brhmn to please the brhmns on this blog.

  • Anonymous

    Is Tajmahal collapsing ?

    http://www.dnaindia.com/india/report_taj-mahal-in-the-danger-of-collapsing-within-5-years_1595183

    [Reply]

    engrich Reply:

    who cares.

    [Reply]

  • Anonymous

    Rajeev-
    You obviously are aware of Ravi’s constant raising of RSS to any ills of India, his equalization of Jehadism to Hindu terrorists etc. You yourself have labelled him jehadi/ISi etc based on his extreme views on India and rationalizing views on Pakistan.
    There were three occasions when his true coloue came out while blogging in Zia’s blog.
    - He talked about how the vicious Hindus drove his family away from Sialkott to Dlhi.. (he had an altercation about this with Ashish, later he got away saying he was tired and di miswrote)
    - on a discussion of Muslim extremism in UK and the west, he stated “it is because WE have been invaded”
    - on a blabbering by Ram avtar, he advised Ram that “although THEY worship many Gods, THEY will not convert to OUR religion”

    I am not a blog extraction expert. But if you are, you can pull out these from Zia blogs.
    Ashish had pulled the Sialkott item; however, he said he did not want to question Ravi’s explanation and will take his word.

    [Reply]

    engrich Reply:

    raju kurien rss is terrorist organization,it is far bigger threat to unity and stability of india than anyother movement.including muslim terroism,which to my opinion dont exist in india atleast now.simi,im huji all are on paper to catch and rob muslims..

    [Reply]

  • AshishC

    I finally hunted down the “offending comments” about Ram in a past blog (Zia’s) by Ravi.
    First, a disclaimer- I am a non-practicing, non-scriptured Hindu, an atheist- now that the fear of failing in exams has been behind me for almost a quarter century or more.. so….

    Firstly, I question Ram’s divinity. He is only an avatar of Vishnu. That does not make him divine (unless Gopi comes up with some scriptural justification attesting to his divinity)- because Vishnu also had Kurma, Matsya, Varaha etc as avatars- surely they can’t all have been divine? Forgive the frivolity, but there is something about religion that brings out the devil in me :-)
    Secondly, freedom of expression..
    Third, “Ashish’s law of divinity” states that if He needs your protection, then He can’t really be God.
    Needless to say, all the above applies as much to Ram as to any other religious and/ or mythological figure of any religion.
    Does that mean I support or encourage bad language or abusing anyone? No. But, in my view, such abuses demean the abuser while doing nothing to the recipient.

    One would expect some active moderation in this forum- but, IMO, Vinod Sharma chases eyeballs (like Zia self-confessedly did) on his blog. Succh fights are good for traffic.

    [Reply]

    Ravi Reply:

    Ashish

    I know what I said.

    I apologised for saying it, almost immediately after saying it.
    The reason why the whole incident is being revived again is because of the following post made by RajeevS.

    I would like you to observe the contrast between the reactions when a Hindu god was offended and when a Muslim Prophet is offended.

    My issue is with the two differing levels ferocities with which the regular blogers have dealt with both these incident.

    Major culprits in my opinion are, Dr Mishra, Balwinder Sandhu, and BV Shenoy.

    **************************************************************************************

    Sorry guys this gem got lost in the last blog.

    It deserves your full consideration.

    ____________________________________________________

    This was posted by RajeevS

    F.U.C.K Mohammad. and F.U.C.K his Islam.He should have visited Rajghat..
    A Like Reply 1 day ago in reply to engrich 0 Like
    F .

    ____________________________________________________

    Dr Mishra…I do not expect a comment from you, but I am eternal optimist.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    I have never insulted Islam or their prophet, even though the historical fact of the prophet marrying a nine year old girl baffles me.

    What I have exposed is the fake Ravi’s duplicity, his defence of another fake, Tajender, whose incessant outpourings against Hindus and particularly brahmins and upper castes, which became intolerable even to Vinod Sharma, who is otherwise very tolerant towards fake secularists.

    What I also took strong objection to was fake Ravi’s making extremely vulgar, obscene and explicitly sexual comments about Balwinder’s wife and son. Unfortunately, unlike in the Tajender’s case, when Vinodji took positive action, here he simply refused to respond.

    [Reply]

    Ravi Reply:

    This is a complete lie. Total lie.

    It is precisely within the context of “The 9 Yr Old Bride” that I mentioned but what about child marriages in India.
    There was a deluge of attacks on me, for merely mentioning it. What is acceptable in this blog is a constant feeding of 8% growth stories and none about Child marriages, Dalit Oppression, etc etc.

    What miffed you is that I punctured you hegemony over this blog, which even Vinod mentioned soon after I arrived here.

    Since then you have made several, attempts at least once every change of blog to persuade people that I am a Muslim, a ISI agent come here to spoil your little party.

    It is laughable to think that ISI is reliant upon some one like me to conduct their business.

    You live in a fantasy world.

    OH BTW… What is it like to be a child bride? This is what the BBC say.

    30% of child marriages in the world take place in India.

    …. http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-15082550

    You have also forgotten about your shwatelingham.

    How does my vulgar language make me a Muslim/ISI agent etc.

    You are a Fake Guru.

    Anonymous Reply:

    What Amarnath yatris see in the cave is Shwethalingam. There are many people who are named Amrithalingam, Ramalingam, Mahalingam etc. Shivling is the one every Hindu worships.

    So, why are you making a song and dance about my uttering the word ’shwethalingam’?

    engrich Reply:

    ling is made through refrigeration cycle.there is nothing divine in it.i am talking of amarnath.

    engrich Reply:

    shenoy i attack brhmnst which means sangh parivar.i am not against brhmns.my wife is brhmn.but i have deep hate against brhmnst.u have not be brhmn to be berhmnst.advani is sikh as per his daughter-in-law.but he is brhmnst.i hate him because he is notorious.he used to melt ram temples offered to him and convert them into crockery while in public he will cry for revenge.i have not seen any brhmnst who is not notorious.he dont love india as he is from pakistan.came to india to make his career.using india.

    AshishC Reply:

    Pankaj,
    I think your analysis of what makes a book/ personality holy in our mind is spot on. It may not be desirable- but, as the bible has receded in importance in the lives of common Europeans with the advent of economic freedom, one probably can expect similar reactions from Indians, in the coming years.
    Ravi,
    Let me make this black and white.
    I do not abuse anyone (well, to be honest, I do abuse; but in a clever sort of way- using words you can not take an exception to!). Vulgarity turns me off.
    However, refer above to Ashish’s law: God, if He exists will deal with you. I don’t effing care; and neither should you.
    However, resorting to vulgarity in a public forum is not on; but, since you apologised, that chapter should be considered closed.
    I hope Rajeev considers expressing regret for his rather out of the blue outburst against Mohammed. Go ahead, use you analytical skills to tear his legacy to shreds and I defend your right to say it. But, use of vulgarity in a public forum is not on.

    [Reply]

    Ravi Reply:

    Ashish

    So would you agree with the following:

    1. Vijay is wrong in repeatedly using the word T.U.R.D. and PakS1tan1 when referring to Tajinder as well as me.

    2. Do you think Dr Mishra was wrong when he used his famous MC galli towards Shan.

    3. Do you think that RajeevS does not resort to vulgarity at the drop of a proverbial hat. Has any one asked him to apologise.

    4. Is Balwinder’s, taunts and language above minimum standards you allude to.

    5. Shan is not above using obscenities, however like me mostly in retaliation.

    6. Do you think that repeatedly, pointedly and perpetually calling some one a Pakistani, based upon dubious linguistic analysis, deliberate lies, and misinterpretations. (At least in one of them your name is almost always sighted as the person who can authenticate my lies.) is not provocation enough for the target to resort to abusive behaviour.

    7. Was’nt BVS’s Shwatelingham, uppham, etc. not close to the bone. No pun intended.

    Or was this sermon just meant for me, because the other offenders are your political soul mates.

    I guess I know the answer, but still best to make sure.

    AshishC Reply:

    Ravi,
    now you are being tireseome.
    I am not the blog-master or lokpal or whatever.. I have my own way of dealing with abuse or pointless rants.
    What sermon are you talking about anyway? However, resorting to vulgarity in a public forum is not on; but, since you apologised, that chapter should be considered closed.
    I hope Rajeev considers expressing regret for his rather out of the blue outburst against Mohammed. Go ahead, use you analytical skills to tear his legacy to shreds and I defend your right to say it. But, use of vulgarity in a public forum is not on.

    There, I bolded the relevant words- so that they are visible even without your misplaced reading glasses.
    Pointwise:
    1. I would not use such words.
    2. Mishra apologised for that the next day; very graciously. I consider his racial slur on Bengalis and loose comments on “commies” far more damaging; an apology has not been forthcoming, however. I have given up on him.
    3. Rajeev has been asked to tone down, many times by old timers in Zia’s blog- many of them, who you would call his “ideological soul-mates”.
    4. I will not comment on Balwinder.
    5. Likewise, I shall not comment on Shan. except to say, that on this very blog I have published entreaties to both of them to stop abusing each other and their communities.
    6. “Pakistani bhi aadmi hota hai”- take it on your chin and move on. I have told you this before.
    7. Shwethalingam- I find funny. You don’t?

    Ravi Reply:

    Ashish

    I do not doubt your even handedness, in all of this.

    It is the bias of others, that I am concerned with.

    Moving on is easy to say than it is to do. Considering that, it is used with monotonous regularity.

    Moving on.

    Anonymous Reply:

    And, Ashish, in one of his worst, racist comment, this fake said of me, ” because you are from the South, you must be Ravan”.

    Pankaj#1 Reply:

    Ashish;
    Good analysis. I am also a non practicing Hindu and as a globe trotter has come in contact with many religions, cultures, etc. Why some body holds a person in high esteem, to the level that they are worshipped?? In my opinion, it is because of their qualities. Why holy books are holy? do they have some aura? no sir, but because they teach some thing good, by no means everything good. but those people and holy books were kind of unique in that day society and their good impact was of such a great measure, that people started worshipping them. that was/ is not a happy state of affairs. IMO, peole should learn from those books and personalities rather than worshipping them. Having said this, no body has any right to denigrate any such books/ personalities to hurt others.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Ashish

    My research and study indicates that Hindus worship only the human and semi human Avatars; this Matsya, Kurma, Varaha are not worshiped. However, as you know, starting the fourth, Narasimha, the avatars are worshiped; with some of them Rama and Krishna, widely, while others not that much.

    Also there are regional variations. Narasimhan used to be a popular name among Tamilians (esp Tamil Brahmins); while Parasuram is a very rarely used name all across India, may be because of Parasuram’s violence, as a killer of his mother, and a mass murderer of kshatriys. There are also very few temples for Parasuram, I think again due to our ancestors’ aversion to violence.

    Vamana, I believe, is a very rarely used name, possibly because it signifies a very short man. (there is a temple for Vamana in Ernakulam – Thrikkakara temple).

    But Gods, worship etc take mysterious forms. The most popular Hindu deity/God in kerala is not Rama or Krishna; but Ayyappa, also known as ManiKanta; the son of the union between Shiva and Vishnu (when Vishnu was Mohini) – yes, illogical, with the standards of then or now, or future; but those are the inscrutable ways mind works. And the worship of this God must have started after 650 or so, because there is a small temple for Wavar, a Muslim companion of Ayyappa, as the first stop to the mountains. A local Muslim family takes care of this temple for Wavar, also called Wavar Swamy. The first Muslim traders came to kerala coast in 650s, so Wavar has to be after that; so also the worship of Ayyappa.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Another interesting observation is that the first three non-human forms of Avatar are not used by any other Indian Gods as their “vehicles”; so, the ancestors who wrote these stories may have wanted to provide some divinity to the non-human forms.

    We have Ganesh and mouse; Shiva and bull; Dharmaraja and his buffalo; Vishnu and Garuda; but as far as I know no Indian God rides on Matsya, Kurma, or Varaha.. My gut is that the writers must have felt that using the three as vehicles for others may diminish one of the trinities.

    [Reply]

    AshishC Reply:

    After posting my piece, I talked to my mother (should have done so earlier!) and she seconds you Gopi on worshipping only the human and semi-human forms.
    As for the rest of your piece, thanks a ton. You seldom disappoint.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Gopiji,

    Interesting . Thks.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    how about HANUMAN, how about HANUMAN CHALISA, also SHIVA’S BULL nandi is worshipped. In fact in UK in a hindu mandir run exclusively by goras, there was a fracas some years ago. This was about a BULL in the temple , that was ALLEGEDLY showing signs of TB , and the vets wanted it to be put down. Gora Sadhus who had named the bull SAMBO (actually meant to be shambhu), HAD A RUNNING BATTLE WITH THE AUTHORITIES with physical violence involved. At the end this being UK , and the religion involved being NOT ISLAM , THEY HAD TO GIVE WAY TO THE AUTHORITIES

    [Reply]

    Ravi Reply:

    Shan

    I was only this morning talking to my friends about this.

    Inetersting issue is, does one only worship a GOD. If the answer is yes, then Tulsi, Peepal, in addition to Nandi are cases not covered by Gopi and Ashish’e mothers definition of Humanoid gods.

    However, if the answer is NO, then does that mean that any thing can be worshiped?

    Anonymous Reply:

    Apparently YOU AND ME are GOD , (i would certainly exclude some characters in the blog )Gopi Thomas has posted some half baked knowledge.HOW ABOUT NAG DEVTA. Actually the upper echelons of Hindu Philosopohy , the concept of GOD is abstract , and also hinduism is only religion which considers EVERY LIVING ORGANISM as part of the supreme manifestation. Thus you can be reborn as a cow or a dog.
    BOTTOM LINE IS, RELIGION IS OPIUM OF THE MASSES, THOUGH I THINK GODDING IS A VERY GOOD FORM OF PSYCHOTHERAPY and there is a need for that.
    BUT ONLY THING THAT WILL ANSWER OR PROVIDE SOLUTION IS SCIENCE

    engrich Reply:

    in ramanaya ram is king.how he became god.if he is god why there is no ram mandir dedicated to him anywhere in india.
    ashish i will be thankful if u clear this doubt.i am sure u will not ignore me here.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    here are some famous Rama temples in the South. Triprayar and Thiruvangad in kerala, Badrachaam in AP etc. Hopefully our Hindu friends can fill in more.

    [Reply]

    engrich Reply:

    u told me u were in delhi,did u ever saw ram temple.in entire uttar pardesh and bihar i never saw or heard about ram temple.
    ram in hindi speaking belt is worshipped through hanuman.thare are hanuman temples.please make sure whether these 2 temples are hanuman temples or ram temples.
    even in ayodhya there is no ram temple.

  • Anonymous

    ==============================================================
    ~~ ARE RELiGIOUS WARS LIKE THE COKE AND PEPSI WARS??? ~ ~~
    ==============================================================

    Raju Kurien’s posting that an iranian is being killed for converting to Christianity, reminded me of the COke and Pepsi wars.

    Mera customer kahin aur naa jaaye…

    It seems that custodians and priests fo religions will never tolerate a liberal regime which can debate out issues. Without meaning to hurt Muslim feelings I would like to state that Liberal Muslims and Non Muslims in cetain countries need to seize initiatve and hang or at least de-fang the perpetuators of blasphemy laws.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Viju

    Regarding Pepsi/how they are helping farmers:
    There was a report about th magnificent work done by pepsi and a NGO (ADI) in the village of Wahaegon, near Aurangabad, Maharashtra..The land was not used much, drought etc etc. Looks like Pepsi and this group did some ingeneous work on irrigation, multi-crop farmg, year round farmg etc.. So the farmers are growing roses, garlic etc in addition to cotton– the yield has gone up from Rs 1.5 lakh/per acre to Rs 2.5 lakhs/acre

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Vijay,

    “‘ Mera customer kahin aur naa jaaye…”‘

    Yes you are right its all business.

    [Reply]

  • Anonymous

    Manohar,

    i forgot to answer to your query on forms of government–

    You are right, in the sense, there is no ideal system -
    1) Benevolent King — you are right, how to spot one, ensure it will continue in perpetuity.. We had great kings in mythology (such as Mahabali in kerala (the story about Vamana) , Lord Rama (Ramarajya), contemporary history likek RajRaj chola, Harsha, King of Travancore (who ddi not bother to touch a rupee of the jewels).. Kings of Jordan and Morocco seem to be OK, however they are small homogeneous countries. This is not an option fro India

    2) Army – I do believe Gen Maneckshaw, Cariappa etc would have steered the country right way..However, they did not have to intervene because there were towering leaders like Nehru, Patel, Pant, Maulana during their time. As the Adarsh fiasco has shown, we have many eunuchs in the army; we do not want them to rule.
    3) Chinese Model — I sort of like their “Rotary club” model – President, VP in waiting to be president, another one behind him etc.. There is democracy within the party, but not outside. Leaders do not remain for ever; neither they can draft their children at top levels. They get rotated out. Anybody who becomes the chief has lots of experience as an understudy, so they are quite prepared about the challenges at home and outside home. There is continuity. Frankly, it may not be bad fro India for a while, but the problem is that we do not have a disciplined party.
    4) Dictatorship- Yes, bad experience throughout the world.. Chavez seems to be OK; but he is destroying the nation’s wealth. Mustafa Attaturk was sort of a dictator, but he had a definite vision/timeframe; and the context of the country at that time needed one like him. History shows it has paid of well.
    5) Presidential a la US – I like the US primary system model; so party bosses do not have any clout; people choose whom they want to contest etc.
    6) Parliamentary like we have now– It is a broken, totally dysfunctional system, other than elections every five years. It should be changed/strengthened drastically to meet the aspirations of a nation with a growing percentage of youngsters below 30.
    More later

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Gopi

    1) Benevolent King – The names you mentioned are from history – everyone is wiser after the event. We are supposed to be worrying about present and future and it is impossible.

    5) Presidential form – what you say is a matter of detail. Unless, we ensure that there will be 2 at most 3 candidates only (the regional outfits have to be folded up), then it can be option.

    6) Parliamentary system – In addition, less Government at the top (centre and states), more at the local level (village, taluka, zilla), which I have been advocating it since couple of blogs.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Regarding the two Field Marshals, how can one be so sure? No disrespect to them – I am proud of and salute them. Moreover, commanding an army and running the country are two different ball games – hasn’t it been proved time and again in Pakistan? Perhaps they would have made excellent Prime Ministers, but we will never know.

    I am not sure about Chavez, he at one time asked for life-long appointment from the people. Why? Hegemony! IMO, he too one day will have to thrown out by his own people.

    [Reply]

  • Anonymous

    It is quite natural that “centralized” parties will lose their clout when regional issues arise and regional parties spring up to seize the opportunity. DMK, Telugu Desam etc were “state born” parties or splits-away from national parties because of unique situation that national parties did not resolve on a timely basis.

    It is inevitable that regional or state specific (or even affiliating group specific) parties will rise up with a sizable following.

    Coalition is a must; national parties who form alliances with like minded (60-70% match) local parties stand the chance to win.

    Growing middle class, improving communications (TV), better education etc will bring the hypocrisy of national parties and their alliance out. For example, Congress cannot say Muslim League in kerala is not communal in the same breath as BJP is communal.

    [Reply]

    engrich Reply:

    bjp or parivar is fascist and murderer not only communal.

    [Reply]

    AshishC Reply:

    Good points Gopi..

    [Reply]

  • http://dealstop.co.uk Larry

    Vinod Sharma says “…the focus wasn’t as much on corruption as on Modi and the 2002 riots he often uses to consolidate his communal base within Gujarat.

    The part in bold is where the notorious Sharma’s propaganda seeps in. For the past 5 years Gujarat’s average GDP growth rate has been 13.4%, agricultural growth rate 8% – and unlike Bihar these growth rates are based on already high base. Modi has talked development and delivered it. He is on his way to make Gujarat the automobile hub of India with Ford, Peugot, Tata and Maruti building plants in Sanand. Farmers in Gujarat now get 24 hour electricity

    Unlike what Congress stooges like Vinod Sharma would like the world to believe, Modi has focused on development rather than communal politics to become the star of Gujarat, and India. Let Vinod Sharma point out even one communal statement by Narendra Modi in the last 7-8 years and I might believe what he says about the Gujarat CM.

    [Reply]

    guest Reply:

    Gujarat’s average GDP growth rate has been 13.4%, agricultural growth rate 8% – and unlike

    but poverty has increased as money was siphoned by rich.

    [Reply]

    Larry Reply:

    Really bot, can you prove what you just said or you’re just going to fire from your butts?

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    1) If someone does not abuse others for 7-8 minutes (overlooking the fact that he did abuse someone 9 minutes back), is he to be labeled as a saint?

    2) Modi has talked development and delivered it.

    He has also talked justice and communal harmony and not delivered it.

    3) BVS, you have a potential new recruit – unless he is an avatar of someone you and we already know.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Manohar_T

    “he has talked— communal harmony and not delivered”….
    How does one measure that? Gujrat is one of the very few states where there was no communal flare up in the last eight years.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    “Gujrat is one of the very few states where there was no communal flare up in the last eight years”.

    Probably because, there is no Advani at the centre as the DPM and HM, to protect, defend and justify like he did 2002.

    Why the cut off is 7 to 8 years (very convenient one should say) , does the history of Gujarat and Modi start in year 2004?

    There has been no riots for much more time in other states – Delhi for example, has not seen one after 1984? So what are you talking about? I do not wish to see any riots in any state – including Gujarat.

    What about justice for the innocent victims from both the communities? Why the silence?

    Very very strange and selective.

    Anonymous Reply:

    Manohar_T

    The cutoff was post Godhra.

    Many states, including Marxist led West Bengal and Kerala, had major communal issues; with many people dying as a result of the riot or police firing. Gujrat, after post Godhra, has been very quiet.

    Anonymous Reply:

    Who has given you the authority to decide the cut off date?

    Anonymous Reply:

    Manohar_T

    I meant the statement (8-10 yr scenario) I made was based on a cutoff at Post Godhra.

    engrich Reply:

    godhra was perpetuated by same people to provide reason for riot.RIOT WAS PLANNED MONTHS BEFORE.LIKE MURDER OF MAHATAMA GHANDHI.

    Larry Reply:

    Oh yeah? Are you a bot then?

    engrich Reply:

    There has been no riots for much more time in other states

    after arrival of mutinational it is difficult to continue riot for long.
    riot is replaced with bomb planting bussnes.same who used to perpetuate riot started planting the bomb.more clan work and more effective.fetch bigger fortune.

    gujrat ki shanti qabaristan kee shanti hai.

    Anonymous Reply:

    Manohar,

    earlier, you said Gopi Thomas is Narendra Modi in disguise, because, as per your warped thinking, a Thomas cannot, ever, say anything in praise of Modi.

    Then you asked Shoeb, whether he was really a Muslim, because, again, your small mind couldn’t digest the fact that even while being a Muslim, one could praise Modi.

    Now comes Larry, the new entrant to this blog and with his very first post, your petty pseudo secular mind has begun slotting this Larry chap into us and them.

    [Reply]

  • Anonymous

    @Raju Kurien,
    Let me get this straight. Did Ravi ( the many-times proven anti-India , liar, propogandist ) say that his family had to leave Sialkot in West Pakistan ( a criminal entity that had reduced Hindu-Sikh population to 1-2% from 22-25% in perhaps the largest religious cleansing in known history) because of Hindus ?

    I have not seen a disclaimer from Ravi , either way.

    Now why would someone say such a blatant, criminal lie ?
    Or did he not say it ?

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Rajiv

    Yes, he did say that. Ashish confronted him on this. He said it was a slip, that he was tired when he typed in that remarks. Ashish was magnanimous, he accepted the explanation.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    There is a difference between being gullible and magnanimous. Ravi’s posts, which are mostly lieful anti-India, anti-Hindu propoganda ( like criminal apologists of the thug-Jinnah state indulge in ) suggest that he lies even when he says its a ’slip’.

    [Reply]

  • Anonymous

    @Larry,
    You said
    “Let Vinod Sharma point out even one communal statement by Narendra Modi in the last 7-8 years and I might believe what he says about the Gujarat CM. ”

    Well V Sharma often lies and hides. Its a standard Congress operating procedure.

    However do not under-estimate the fake RSS panphlateers who run around this blogs like rabid dogs. They have a bus load of fake stories. Ask them, if the criminal Jinnah, who has been quoted numerous times making communally inflammatory statements, the architect of the cold-blooded murders of “direct action day ” is a secular or a communal criminal ?

    [Reply]

  • Anonymous

    ==============================================================
    ~~ ENGRICH SCARED BY POEMS AND MAZZAK becomes guest !!!!!!!!!!!!
    ============ ================ ============

    Seems that eunuch egrich has changed his petticoat again…

    he has been made fun off… and converted his name to GUEST !!!!!!

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    It could be Engrich or any of the other rabid-pro-pak-jinnah-communal dogs here.

    [Reply]

    engrich Reply:

    if iam dog u are *****.son of a *****.

    [Reply]

  • AshishC

    Mahesh,
    You wanted me to do a bit of crystal ball gazing on the possibilities of CPM/ BJP to become serious contenders for power at the centre.
    Firstly, I hope the only reason you slotted CPM/ BJP together is to juxtapose the Right and Left (and not Wrong and Wrong!) in your mind. Take away the Gandhi name- and you can pose the question to me with Congress included in the same question.

    I think getting back to strong national parties is an imperative but I don’t see this happening soon. BJP and CPM have the cadre- BJP has it across a much wider geography- what they do not have (in varying degrees)
    - a standout (visionary/ charismatic) leadership that can rally the troops
    - a standout (distinct from others) socio-economic-political program that will sell

    The Congress has better technocrats at the centre- but, poor political management, disorganized cadre, zero inner party democracy and finally, poor leadership characterized by infighting, corruption and so on.
    How will BJP come to power?
    In the foreseeable future it can be only partnering with other parties. What the BJP does not sell enough is its club of performing CMs and contrast their performance with the Congress CMs.
    How will BJP increase its seats to beyond 200? Especially on a sustainable basis?
    BJP does not yet, get the demographic shift – it is not doing enough to position itself as a young party, for the young, for the aspiring. BJP does not have a cool factor, yet. But, if it does?
    What other scenarios are possible?
    I think there is some possibility that Congress will crack, as will the BJP and a unique 3rd front might emerge. But, it will be hamstrung by a lack of cadre and will continue to be plagued by lack of leadership.
    Your thoughts?

    [Reply]

    Ravi Reply:

    Ashish

    As I have discussed this with you before.

    I believe that BJP can only succeed if it has a full programme of centre right policies. Which at present it is miles away from achieving.

    Public, in India have become more sophisticated and have – in droves – moved away from communal politics. Whilst Congress is not without its experiments in communalism, it is the BJP that is strongly associated with communal politics. Classical example is, despite being a successful CEO Modi is still reviled as a communal leader.

    Then we come to my favourite subject, the RSS. For BJP to succeed, it has to grow out of its ideological parent, the RSS.

    There are not very many examples in history, where extreme left and extreme right have made successful electoral pacts. Public is not that stupid.

    [Reply]

    AshishC Reply:

    Did I ever suggest that CPM and BJP or for that matter any extreme right and extreme left party in India are getting together in an electoral alliance?
    Those reading glasses; you must find them, quickly.

    [Reply]

    Ravi Reply:

    No you didnt. My contention was based upon the following.

    Such combinations are often talked about, based on this notion that parties at the extreme ends of the polical spectrum are often closer to each other, than they are to the more centerist parties.

    Anonymous Reply:

    “…based on this notion that parties at the extreme ends of the polical spectrum are often closer to each other, than they are to the more centerist parties.”
    This is one aspect that intrigues me too. The parties on extreme ends might indeed be closer – perhaps borne out of posturing to signal absolute dis-dain and hatred of “compromising political positions” adapted by centrists.

    Pankaj#1 Reply:

    Ashish;
    You naughty man.

    Anonymous Reply:

    Ashish has put his photo on display
    and look how with words he does play
    in the photo we only see his dome
    we see few hairs hardly needing a comb

    what, Ahish, we want to see is your mug shot
    with a smile and it will be a hit, sure shot.

    Pankaj#1 Reply:

    Shenoy sahab.
    One can certainly depend on you to put back this blog to life.
    This was a good one.

    AshishC Reply:

    Mock me not, for I am an old, old man….

    AshishC Reply:

    Naughty forties, Pankaj; naughty forties!

    Anonymous Reply:

    Ashish,

    in the VP Singh government, both BJP and the Left supported him from outside.

    Anonymous Reply:

    “The Congress has better technocrats at the centre- but, poor political management, disorganized cadre, zero inner party democracy and finally, poor leadership characterized by infighting, corruption and so on”.

    You forgot to mention – sycophancy, which allows nincompoops to rise in the party, hold important positions in the party/government ( ability, talent and skills be damned).

    The other cause is the High command culture, which prevents growth of state-level leadership. In practically all the states, whenever there emerges a potential leader, these high-command-walas, set up a rival and they merrily set out to destroy each other (this must be their “idea” of inner party democracy). The people in most state do not know, who will be the CM, if they decide to give the party a chance.

    As mentioned in the earlier blog, Sonia Gandhi needs a new and different set of political and organisational advisers – Sharad Pawar types.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Manohar,

    some similar thoughts have been voiced by Shekhar Gupta, in the following link:
    http://www.indianexpress.com/news/decide-on-the-doctor/854125/0

    When Mahatma Gandhi was leading the congress party, he envisioned Ramarajya for India.

    As soon as power came in his hands, Nehru bid good bye to Ramarajya.

    When he was seriously ill and couldn’t run his government, he brought Kamaraj(ya) plan to get rid of some of the bosses who were waiting, rather impatiently, for him to call it a day.

    The situation now is not very dissimilar. Sonia Gandhi is ill and MMS may any day call it a day. Therefore, Sonia Gandhi should, as Shekhar Gupta pleads, bring in a Kamaraj plan II, which will get rid of some of the bosses and pave the way for yuvraj to take the reins in his hand.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Yes, yes – great minds (*) think alike.

    * That unfortunately does not include you.

    Anonymous Reply:

    Ashish,

    I think stand out economic programmes are giving diminishing returns. The congress had garibi hatao, which, after firing the imagination of the poor, left them poorer. “Congress ka haath aam aadmi ke saath” was another, whch as a slogan did bring votes, but is now showing itself to be one of the shallowest of “economic programmes”.

    In the recent past, we had dispensations like those of VPSingh, Chandrashekhar, Deve Gowda and IK Gujral, who had no party, no MPs, no programmes and no philosophies of their own except giant egos and overriding ambitions. Therefore, compared to these nincompoops, the BJP is a hundred times better placed in all departments. And now with the Sonia charm fading fast and yuvraj charm nowhere in sight beyond jhompdies of some remote villagers, the people will naturally look at choices available.

    Ultimately, the Lokasabha will be won by bonding with winnable parties like TDP, AIADMK, JDU, BJD etc and also leaders like Jagan Mohan Reddy. In these aspects, the BJP certainly looks better placed than the congress, which has only Trinamool to give it respectable numbers.

    [Reply]

    AshishC Reply:

    Shenoy,
    the prospect of aligning with Jagan Mohan Reddy should scare all BJP well-wishers. Doesn’t BJP have enough of the problematic Reddys? Not to mention Yeddy?
    Surely you do not want another Jharkhand play?
    I am in agreement with your second paragraph; largely.
    Slogan writing is not economic programs- the Congress’ slogans have underlying programmes- though, we can debate both their intent and execution.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Ashish,
    Let me start with Congress. Other than its self-proclaimed role of being a centrist and secular (the operative word here is “self proclaimed” , given that it hasn’t been exactly averse to playing communal card) – Congress’s biggest success stems from its ability to co-opt and absorb (mostly co-opt) different political forces emerging from the fringe. This is the kind of flexibility that BJP has been lacking.
    From the economic policies perspective – sans a bit of flirting with Swadeshi – BJP’s economic policies have mostly been evolving out of the same DNA as that of Congress. So, not much differentiation here as well.
    Given this background – if I were to represent the moneyed classes , my bets would definitely weigh heavily in favour of Congress. It would be naive , actually far far naive, to assume that the political parties competed merely on electoral canvass. A much murkier world beneath it renders the canvass by lending its financial muscle power to do several things including co-opting on the electoral front.
    The picture gets even more interesting and intriguing when faults emerge between moneyed classes. I have a vague sense that the past year or so of crises Congress has been experiencing might be a result of these fault lines. To be sure, my argument doesn’t hint at Congress being a victim – just a plain stage of conflict for different actors involved. The reason I argue about Congress cracking up is this – representing far too many actors with Conflicts.

    Another interesting aspect of political parties is ease of entry. Earlier in Maharashtra – it was easy for anybody who was Marathi to become a Shiv Sena activist (in whichever capacity). Gaining Membership is still easy in case of Left Parties and BJP . Congress and Shiv-Sena , in comparison, have higher entry barriers. That explains lack of active Cadre in case of Congress.

    Having said all of the above, we are still left with a large section of electorate who intend to reclaim their space in Political Process and yet don’t find apt means to do so. It is these that emerge as fringe. For instance, in case of tribals the political voice emerged earlier in Ms. Patkar’s leadership as Narmada Bachao Andolan, the newer avatar of this voice being Maoists. Similarly, Middle class most likely found a means to reclaim its space in Anna Hazare’s movement.
    It is precisely this set of “outside the established polity” forces – that will keep continually challenging the established polity , at times getting confrontational and at times getting co-opted. The parliamentary party that has flexibility , wherewithal and expertise in handling these forces will emerge powerful.

    One last thing about “technical expertise” in Congress – Nothing unusual here and is only to be expected given that Congress has had such a long experience in governing the country. In fact, NDA should be worried – very very worried , as and when Congress starts gaining in strength from alliances with local players.

    These are my own two bits .

    p.s. : Am currently working against a very very aggressive work schedule, hence my responses in discussion would be very sparse. Also, as and when time permits in forseeable future – we could resume discussion on Fiscal Responsibility Act and BJP’s econ. policies.

    p.p.s.: Shubh Vijaya Dashami to you and others here on this blog.

    [Reply]

    Pankaj#1 Reply:

    Excellent analysis Mahesh.

    [Reply]

    AshishC Reply:

    Mahesh,
    good luck with the work sched.. and thanks for the long post.
    I will post some responses anyways; respond (or not) in your free time.. there is no hurry.
    1. Congress as the great canopy (ref: tropical rainforest :) )
    Does the Congress appreciate that this is what is its strength? If so, why is it that it is unable to retain even Mamata Banerjee in its fold? Or, why is it that so many rebellious congressmen abound?
    At least BJP has strong and performing regional leaders; none of whom are pushovers- there are good and bad sides of this- it took a few days for Chavan to fall, like so much rotten tooth; while Yeddy hung on for months.
    2. Faultlines in the moneyed class support:
    you could well be right; as a corollary, one has to expect all governments now on to be subject to these pulls.
    We discussed how policy formulation will be increasingly the new frontier of corruption- because all policy formulation is “in camera” and not subject to public scrutiny.
    3. Cadre availability related to ease of gaining entry
    I have really no knowledge – but, perhaps you can substantiate this with the actual processes and the rigours of the screening process before one becomes a member of a national party (BJP, CPM, Congress).
    4. Outside the established polity forces..
    This is an interesting point and I thought this one through. Other than the fact that these forces have come into our consciousness recently- courtesy the Maoists and the Hazare movement- they have always existed. Many of these movements do not last or grow into something substantial or have lasting impact.
    Many do not even morph into a political force- some do.
    5. Congress might start gaining from regional partners..
    For a party that is showing signs that the centrifugal forces are currently overpowering the centripetal ones? Which regional partner will allow Congress to gain from it?
    Shubho Bijoya; as they say in “aamar bangla”.

    [Reply]

    Pankaj#1 Reply:

    This is the kind of discussion, I am looking for. Thanks Ashish.

    [Reply]

    AshishC Reply:

    Pankaj,
    actually thank Mahesh.
    Every time I lapse into frivolity, he tweaks my ear that little bit and forces me to think before writing :)

    [Reply]

  • Pankaj#1

    The blog is silent since last one hour or so? what I should do? Praise Shenoy, that will surely bring lot of mails here. I will praise him and Vijay, my friend. I have started respecting Ashish for his Candid writing. I have given up on Ravi. Manohar and Mahesh are my favorite soundboard. Shan, Yes and NO. Does not mean so many people, whom I admire,Rajeevs included. Immediately Parveen Saxena comes to mind. Hey people, it is silence here. Do not deprive me of my Fun.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Pankaj ji,

    it is 9.15AM here and I am already posting on the blog, because today being Vijay Dashmi, there are no newspapers. And everywhere in Karnataka today is a total shut down.

    Yes, Ashish is very sensible,liberal, witty and lucid. His posts mostly approximate our own. It is his style which even jihad fundoos sometimes like and approve.

    Mahesh has perfected the art of writing long posts, matching those of Tajender and still make people wonder what was all that about, unlike Tajender, where you know instantly that it is outpouring of some anti-Hindu drivel.

    It is, however, Manohar, who, with his unwavering faith in the Rajmata and her progeny, who is very likely to be co-opted by Vinodji for a suitable place in HT, NMC, CWC, CWG, NHRC or even AI.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    I feel truly “honoured” by being on the “top of the charts” of Shenoy’s list of hate-objects.

    I wonder who I have displaced! Answers, anyone?

    [Reply]

    Pankaj#1 Reply:

    Thanks Shenoy sahab.
    It is 3 in the morning here, but as I had to make some important calls overseas, I am writing this. Yes, we are living in a democracy and every one is entitled to his views. With some, I agree and with some I do not. Again, with some, I strongly disagree, but then, I do not read or respond to them. I have no vested interest in Indian politics or may be I have, as still a large part of my extended family is in India.

    [Reply]

    Ravi Reply:

    Thank you Pankaj.

    [Reply]

  • Pankaj#1

    OK, I tried.
    What I read is Spanish Police busted a ring where Chinese prostitution ring and drug connections busted. Pakistanis have strong presence in Barcelona. Any connection?? Deprived peoples’ solidarity???

    [Reply]

  • Pankaj#1
  • Anonymous

    I have immense liking for Ashish’s thought process because I see a striking similarity between my thinking minus Ashish’s positive views on CPM.

    He has asked me to regret these words “F.U.C.K Mohammad. and F.U.C.K his Islam.He should have visited Rajghat..”

    I regret for my choice of words but I have contempt for all ritualistic religions especially Islam and Christianity. The christianity is bit better than Islam because it doesn’t issue death sentence to people who insult Jesus. Whereas Islam is very intolerant faith. There are many good things in Islam especially equality before god and charity..but overall Islam-Mohammad and Christianity fail to inspire me or make me respect those faith.

    I love to be hindu because no one can force me on any issue but certain aspect of hinduism make me extremely uncomfortable. The kind of behaviour priest indulge in Temple, your homes and cremation ground make me puke. The caste system is a curse…but then there is scope to reject caste system..shun priests. The child marriage is another aspect which doesn’t gel with modern time.

    Now coming to my words “F.U.C.K Mohammad. and F.U.C.K his Islam.He should have visited Rajghat..”, I just wanted to say that one should not bring religion in public space. Why did Saudi king not consider visiting Rajghat just as diplomatic gesture? If I visit a muslim country and their is some national monument that is respectable in that land, I’d show my respect to it and not bring my religion as an excuse.

    The Mullah who offered Modi skullcap wanted to put Modi in a spot..He was basically playing politics on behalf of some one. Modi by not accepting skull cap basically rejected display of religion on public forum. I’d also like to see all govt. function devoid of any hindu symbolism including lighting lamps.

    Coming to RSS, it never inspired me. I tried to understand it and found that it want hindus to behave like muslims..intolerant and full of religious garbage. The kind of history taught in RSS shakhas is basically fairy tales devoid of any historicity. The only things that I like about RSS is its nationalism and social services. They should discard pajamachaap culture (compared to Tableeghi Jamaat culture) and embrace modernity.

    One more observation, I have seen muslims compete with each other to prove who is better muslim whereas hindus compete with each other to prove that they are non-practicing or athiest. I was under the impression that there is nothing to Practice to be a hindu and being atheist too is hindu.

    Can some one explain how does one become non-practicing hindu?

    Sorry for long post because matter of bread and butter keep me away from this blog.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Rajeev,

    “‘ One more observation, I have seen muslims compete with each other to prove who is better muslim whereas hindus compete with each other to prove that they are non-practicing or athiest “”

    Yes, you are right. I have also observed similar thing and in both the cases
    I have noticed a tinge of arrogance among the people who claim to be better muslim or an atheiest. But thats the beauty of all people that
    we are different . Thats why all this discussions, arguments, cursings and
    sometimes abusing – I wish there was no personal abusing – .
    It takes all types of people to make this wonderful world and in our case
    this wonderful blog.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    @ Rajeev and Mohan

    Rajeev you indeed did make a very perceptive observation when you said “One more observation, I have seen muslims compete with each other to prove who is better muslim whereas hindus compete with each other to prove that they are non-practicing or athiest. I was under the impression that there is nothing to Practice to be a hindu and being atheist too … ”

    these are the sort of gems you dont get in mainstream media, but only get in blog sites. Surely made my day !

    [Reply]

    AshishC Reply:

    To Rajeev:
    Why I call myself a non-practicing Hindu
    Stray thoughts; not sequential or even logical.
    1. I go for Anjali every Ashtami; and eat the prasad with gusto. All the time while the anjali mantras are being chanted, my mind is finding faults with the Pandit’s rendering – wrong, wrong, all wrong.. eshah sa-chandanah becomes esham sa-chandanam and I cringe.
    My mind is not on the Goddess in front; it is happy being analytical.
    2. The same me, have spent 4 years in Varanasi and never went and even saw the Vishwanath temple. Though, the temple in the college campus was often visited.
    3. My wife prays; I don’t. My children don’t.

    I guess, I am saying the same things as you are saying. I do what I please; and what pleases my near and dear ones. I don’t ever ask myself if my actions square with any religion- actually, I think, this is the heart of being a Hindu.
    I am uploading a picture along with this post- this is from the Puja Pandal next to my home. This, to me is Hinduism at its best- Sister Nivedita, Vivekananda and Aurobindo sharing space inside the pandal with Mother Teresa.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Aashsih/Rajeev,

    Thats the beauty of hindu religion – is there such thing as hindu religion ? – that there are no compulsions of dos and donts.

    [Reply]

    engrich Reply:

    hindu is basically samaj it is not religion.i dont understan why when an atheist can be hindu,quran reading cannot.hindu is nationality ,why it is denied to muslims and christians.

    a zoinist game to create tension for nothing.britain or american cannot be religion.

    Anonymous Reply:

    Ashish,
    Beautiful post.
    Point 1: I am guilty of same..I too get very sinful thoughts while doing ritualistic pujas…I admonish myself but ignorance of pundits and their behaviour puts me off.
    Point 2: I went to Bhubaneshwar on business trip and had some work in Puri. I stayed in a hotel around 100 meters from temple. I could see temple from window but I didn’t visit..I regret that arrogance even today because I missed a wonderful opportunity to see this ancient temple and pay respect to Lord Jagannath.
    Point 3: My wife prays so do my kids and I when forced.

    Great Picture..Just a day back I was reading an article on Vivekananda in NYT or some other paper..The kind of impact he made on minds of people who met is amazing. I’ll call him modern day prophet.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    “One more observation, I have seen Muslims compete with each other to prove who is better Muslim….”

    Bang on target. This competition is only on the surface. – trying to be mirror images of the mullahs – skull cap, kurta, three quarter pajamas and long beards, and show of regular visits to the mosque – no doubt there may be some genuinely devote, but would be in small minority. Among women it is a competition as to whose burkha hides more.

    Obviously, peer and mob pressure is working overtime here.

    [Reply]

    engrich Reply:

    “One more observation, I have seen Muslims compete with each other to prove who is better Muslim

    because islam is morality based religion.one of my family member is very rich.in start of his bussines he took interest from the people.this happened many many years ago,even now nobody drink water in his house.u people abuse arabs,u have rightbut i have seen the contractors who take good sum of money from manpower supplier and return this to workers when they arrive here.most of benefiary are hindu labour.
    they know labor has to pay x amount money so they take 80%of that money and return on arrival.

    we people should fight for better of salaries in india.what a teaboy get in dubai 3-4 year experience engineer get in india.this is the biggest dishonesty with people of india.while indian capitalist are many timemore richer than dubai
    nobody speak about this.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Tajender,

    You have admitted that you are a Muslim.

    Now, tick any of the following as applicable to you:

    1.you are an Indian Muslim jihadi working for ISI.
    2.You are a Pakistani jihadi working for ISI
    3.You are a fake Indian but genuine jihadi
    4.you are like fake Ravi.

    Ravi Reply:

    Tajendar

    While you are there please tick on the following as well.

    1. Indian Muslims are no better and no worse than Hindutavawadi’s Like BV Shenoy

    2. B V Shenoy has his own personal definition of who is a Hndu, which is not universally accepted.

    3. Who gives a damn as to what BV Shenoy thinks any way.

    4. All RSS wallahs are Saffron Terrorists.

    5. To those who die, does it matter that a Jihadi bomb Killed them or a RSS inspired Riot.

    6. RSS is just as bad for India as Jihad is.

    Anonymous Reply:

    Correction-
    6. RSS is just as bad for India as fanatic muslims are.

    engrich Reply:

    the awnser is **** off

    Pankaj#1 Reply:

    Good post Rajeev.
    Yes, I also proclaimed that I am a non practicing Hindu. When I say non practicing hindu, I meant, I do not go to temple very often, Just accompanying my wife some time. Do not do daily Pooja, but take prasad, whenever, it is offered. For me, hinduism embrace all humanity and not people sporting hair tuft, Janaiu, Tilak or such outward manifestations.

    [Reply]

    engrich Reply:

    in india those who abuse muslims are called hindu and those who abuse hindus are called muslim.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Whatever you have described makes you practicing hindu. As a hindu you are not suppose to irritate god with 5 prayers a day..and take his name on every damn thing.
    This is what makes hinduism fluid and personal for everyone. My hinduism can be totally different than yours but at the end of the day we are hindus who love our freedom.

    [Reply]

    Pankaj#1 Reply:

    OK Rajeev;
    If that makes me practicing hindu, I am happy.

    Anonymous Reply:

    You see..I converted you to hinduism..I’ll get 72 tight a$$ed apsaras in Swarg.

    engrich Reply:

    which will include ur mother as well.

    engrich Reply:

    rajeev hindu is not a religion actually it is nemesis of all religion.only hindu gods are loaded with deadly weapon come to destroy the oppressed.

    engrich Reply:

    blogg is excellent.rss is nazi party.they behvave evrywhere like this.brhmnsm is father fascism and nazism.rss will hurt hindus 1000 times more than muslims.muslims have nothing to loose.in ayodhya they have planned civil war between followers of sviva and vishnu.muslims were hurt when mosque was demolished later forgot.as this does not their daily life.a sikh advani was inciting masses to demolish mosque.this is zoinism or brhmnsm.capitalists of new york were supporting financing october revolution in 1917.idea was to hurt russian.later they killed 10million ukranians by destroying their crop in stalin time.
    hindu is basically samaj not religion.vedas prohibits idol worshing.

    u say u agree to spiritual side of islam.u can critisize prophet mohammed(pbuh)but abusing even servant is not a good form.we are not mohammadans
    we are muslims.message is very strong that is why half the world follow this.

    had the muslims being intoleran 2 crores non-muslims would not have been working in muslim countries.

    so rethink.u know about islam atleast more than me.

    friendship kisi bhi kar lo,dushmani sonch samajh ke karo.at the end u will become like ur enemy.

    one shree laxmi acharya jee from kanpur abused muslims most part his life.after he understood the thing.left rss.and wrote many articles and book apologing muslims.

    [Reply]

  • Anonymous

    I am still of the view that RSS and Islam are mirror image of each other…RSS is just missing two dogmas..a formal way of worshipping and promoting terrorism in the name of struggle (called Jihad in Islam).

    [Reply]

  • Anonymous

    Shenoy,
    You said that both Advani and Vajpayee are RSS members..I think they WERE RSS members. Vajpayee dumped RSS as soon as he became PM and Advani by his Jinnah Chalisa.

    [Reply]

  • Anonymous

    Let us compare the incident of Saudi king refusing to pay respect to Gandhi and Modi refusing the skullcap (never mind the intentions of Mullah who offered skullcap).

    There are three definitions of secularism-
    1. Indian Secularism: Respect or pretend to show respect to all religions (except may be hinduism) both publicly and privately. This secularism is absolute must for hindus but people from semitic faiths are exempt from it.

    2. Western Secularism: Absence of religion and/or religious symbols from public life (but judeo-christian culture is directly or indirectly imposed on others)

    3. Islamic secularism (oxymoron): Respect only Islam and convert to Islam to be treated like human being.

    According to 1st definition, Modi was wrong but Saudi king was right.
    According to 2nd definition, Modi was right and so was Saudi king.
    According to 3rd definition, Modi is wajib-ul-Qatl (fit to be killed) and Saudi king was right.

    This secularism animal seems to be like Idiyyappam…I can’t make out if we can ever have secularism without bias.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    In the Indian context, therefore, the first and third are co-terminus, identically practised.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Raveev,

    Wow. Very nicely put. I couldnt have said it in a better way.

    [Reply]

    AshishC Reply:

    Rajeev,
    when you can write like this; who needs the F’ word?

    [Reply]

  • Anonymous

    Steve Jobs is no more..a very sad day indeed..RIP Steve Jobs.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    @ Rajeev and eveyne

    A very sad day! He was the guy who truely revolutised the word and the world… My salute to him

    [Reply]

    engrich Reply:

    he was the son syrian arab muslim.was not christian as it appears from name.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Does that strengthen or minimize his accomplishments and contributions?

    engrich Reply:

    IT IS AWNSER TO THOSE WHO THINK THAT MUSLIM/ARABS ARE MINDLESS.

    Anonymous Reply:

    It also proves that whosoever leaves islam/arabic garbage can do wonders.

    engrich Reply:

    he never left their arabic root and culture.

    Anonymous Reply:

    He actually disowned his biological father and refused to meet him…He shunned arabic culture and its primitive religion.

    Anonymous Reply:

    Both Steve Jobs and Obama left Islamic faith and became great…You can too.

    engrich Reply:

    none of them left.qualities to become,they got from their islamic teachings and mother.

  • Anonymous

    —————————————————————————————————————————–
    ~~~Petition to Hon Jan LokPal Ashish on accusations by Ravi ~~~~
    —————————————————————————————————————————–

    Hon’ble Justice Ashish, on this shubh din of Dusshera I beg to submit the following

    a) I have been accused By petitioner Ravi of calling Tajendar, Engrich and somtimes him as T U R D S. Yes sir I am guilty and PrOUD !!

    b) I have been accused by petitioner Ravi of calling his country Pakistan as PAK-shit – stan. yes sir, i am proud of this too as Pak-shit-stan sends terrorists and bombers to india. ;)

    c) I have often called Ravi an ISI fundoo as he attacks India, hindus and parrots lies of rape rape all the time . YES Sir, I am guilty of this offence. And further state that I will continue to do so…

    justice Ashish, the guilty accused stands before you…. will you pronounce the judgement and break the nib of your pen…?

    Hum toh besharam hai..
    Bass watan ke rakhwale hain….

    [Reply]

    Ravi Reply:

    Hum annath aur besharm hain, har anne ka duani mein jawab dein gae

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Vijay Kumar,

    Fake Ravi will now tom-tom that judiciary in India is committed to Hindu Rashtra, 5000 dalit rapes are ignored, rapists are walking free from courts. Example:Justice Ashish’s court, from where last year alone1345 rapists were set free and another 599 are out on bail.

    [Reply]

    Ravi Reply:

    You are doing a better job than I ever could.

    You continue to be a rancid Saffron Terrorist, a Hindu Fundo

    [Reply]

  • Anonymous

    This calls for a new thread

    Shenoy

    Either you are brainless id..t (in caps) and cannot even read the lines nor between them or attempting to be too clever by half by indulging in your favourite occupation – spreading lies, falsehoods, untruths, innuendos (a la RSS) – picking up sentences and meanings out of context – trying to put words and meanings in other people’s mouths and proceeding to slam them.

    Wasim was right, couple of blogs ago, when he called BVS a “particle of disgust”, so was Prabhat, who called him a caricature. Take your pick gentlemen (you can choose both).

    ————–

    Shenoy wrote one hour ago and by rejoinders therein

    “Manohar,

    1) earlier, you said Gopi Thomas is Narendra Modi in disguise, because, as per your warped thinking, a Thomas cannot, ever, say anything in praise of Modi.

    This what I had written

    PS: Are you by any chance Narendra Modi and using an alias Gopi Thomas? Just joking.

    2) Then you asked Shoeb, whether he was really a Muslim, because, again, your small mind couldn’t digest the fact that even while being a Muslim, one could praise Modi.

    This was the exchange

    Shenoy’s post

    Shoeb,

    he will now ask you whether you are a Hindu in the guise of a Muslim! A while ago, for opposing him, he called Gopi Modi in disguise!!

    My reply

    Yes, Shoeb, I have been wanting to ask the question since 1916, but kept forgetting to do so I am really really “grateful” to BVS for reminding me, after nearly a century.

    3) Now comes Larry, the new entrant to this blog and with his very first post, your petty pseudo secular mind has begun slotting this Larry chap into us and them”.

    The above is in response to what I had written

    BVS, you have a potential new recruit – unless he is an avatar of someone you and we already know.

    Shenoy has no iota of knowledge of finer nuances of languages – such as tongue-in-cheek comment. It seems, crudity is his hallmark.

    This man surely is in severe need of counseling.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    You forgot to add that ‘just joking’ was an afterthought.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    In light of the “defence” you have come up with, to call you a brainless idiot would be insulting the rest of the idiots of this world. Nor I can call you a liar, because the liars of the world will take offence.

    You still have time to come with a “solid justification” in defence of Shoeb’s post and make yourself still a bigger laughing stock. Go on. The world is waiting with baited breadth for the spectacle.

    Then some more time for Larry’s post.

    [Reply]

  • Ravi

    C O N G R A T U L A T I O N S – ASHISH

    Your pay-as-you-go membership of the Hinduatavwadi Group has now been regularised.

    The Chairman BV Shenoy has printed a certificate; it is now in the post. The citation reads – His posts mostly approximate our own. It is his style which even jihad fundoos sometimes like and approve. He is our own.

    A Black Topi has been couriered to you. A photograph of you wearing it should be pasted on your new membership card. I can imagine how handsome you would look in full regalia. I hope you don’t mind me giving you some advice.

    Point 8 of a 10 Point Morph – I suggest that you take a pictures of Tarun Vijay and Subhash Chandra Bose, and subject them to a 10 point morph. At point 8 the topi would have become black and the walrus pup moustache would have taken root. Transformation complete, I hope you would share this picture with us.

    Looj cannon has now been lassoed and tethered to a single, homogeneous, if slightly discredited ideology.

    Loss of independence is a small price to pay for Full Membership of an up and coming powerful club.

    Badhai ho, Badhai ho. From this day on, today will be known as Ashish Doshami.

    [Reply]

  • Anonymous

    Two very intelligent contestants together lost 50 lakhs on KBC on two successive days.

    One, a lady, wanted to control everything through remote control, including her husband. She wanted to close an educational loan and the rest of the prize money was to be just “udha doongi”.

    The other was a policeman, humble, poor, needed the money for house building, marriage etc.

    Both lost.

    The first was felled by her arrogance and the second by his greed.

    [Reply]

  • Anonymous

    —————————————————————————————————————————-
    ~~~ THERE IS AN INDIAN CONNECTION TO STEVE JOBS…. ~~~
    ————————————————————————————————————————–

    There is an India of babas and Yogis which Ravi loves to make fun of ans many an American comes here for solace. The beatles were here for TM and hash…

    And so was Steve Jobs !!

    he links this experience to the products he made and the free thinking he had.

    let us quote the genius himself for wikepedia..

    In autumn 1974, Jobs returned to California and began attending meetings of the Homebrew Computer Club with Wozniak. He took a job as a technician at Atari, a manufacturer of popular video games, with the primary intent of saving money for a spiritual retreat to India.

    Jobs then traveled to India to visit the Neem Karoli Baba[33] at his Kainchi Ashram with a Reed College friend (and, later, the first Apple employee), Daniel Kottke, in search of spiritual enlightenment. He came back a Buddhist with his head shaved and wearing traditional Indian clothing.[34][35] During this time, Jobs experimented with psychedelics, calling his LSD experiences “one of the two or three most important things [he had] done in [his] life”.[36] He later said that people around him who did not share his countercultural roots could not fully relate to his thinking.[36]

    Jobs returned to his previous job at Atari and was given the task of creating a circuit board for the game Breakout. According to Atari founder Nolan Bushnell, Atari had offered $100 for each chip that was eliminated in the machine. Jobs had little interest or knowledge

    ———————————————————————————————————————

    Apple and its founder’s life style was a product of the spiritual and free thinking experience….

    [Reply]

    Ravi Reply:

    Vijay

    Is there anything that Ravi does not make fun off.

    Is there anything in India that you do not UNCONDITIONALLY accept as scrosant.

    And Khap engineers go to Soho for recreation. Say no more.

    भारत की इज्ज़त अब इन भगवा गुंडों के हाथ में है.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    @ Ravi

    i only read about soho and NOT availed any services and crossed it while walking to oxford street or to Piccadilly.

    I did see a 62 year old cross dresser who was soliciting. Was it T U R D Tajendar or Engrich or… _ _ _ _ ? I wondered…

    [Reply]

    Ravi Reply:

    Keep wondering that is what Khapistani Engineers do.

    Anonymous Reply:

    :) They like to unhinge… Pakistani fundoos :)

    Ravi Reply:

    Like most other projects of such kind, they fail miserably and you run away with the deposit money.

    Anonymous Reply:

    Aapne ek anna ka jawab khotta sikka se diya..

    Ravi Reply:

    Jab hamare hath se gai to duanni thi, Hawale walle ne usko Khota Sikka Bana diya

    Pankaj#1 Reply:

    Vijay;
    Pyaj ki parten khulti ja rahi hain. Bhagwa gunde??

    Ravi Reply:

    Pyaj nahin Millefeuille kaho.

    Anonymous Reply:

    @ Pankaj

    Probably a phrase dictated by Hafeez Saeed in his latest guidebook for ISI fundoo internet trolls…

  • Ravi

    _________________________________________________________________
    ~~~~~~~THERE IS AN INDIAN CONNECTION TO Wozniak as WELL~~~~~~
    __________________________________________________________________

    It is not very well known that Steve Jobs friend Wozniak has Indian connection too.

    It appears that his hippy mother used to show the neonate Wozniak world ATLAS, so as to broadedn his horizons.

    One night the mother went to check if the baby Wozniak was sleeping comfortably, she noticed that an ATLAS had fallen on the floor and the open page was showing the map of India.

    Such strong connections to India are worth celebrating.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    @ Ravi

    In the same way as Cross dresser T U R D Tajendar’s petticoat fell on Engrich and crossdresser Engrich’s petticoat fell on ISI Fundoo Ra_ _ !! *

    * Look Ravi I have not named you. But however if you are ISI Fundoo with name starting with Ra then only u should feel aggrieved …

    [Reply]

    Ravi Reply:

    Like wise you should only feel aggrieved if the Kahpistani Engineer mentioned has a name starting with Vi…

    Meanwhile I am just as close to being an ISI Fundo as you are a भगवा गुंडा, but then again annay ki duani banani to hai hi.

    Good game, good game, lets continue.

    I do not make empty threats or seek approvals from the likes of you.

    As I said the price demanded by you is far too much.

    मैं तो इखलाक के हाथों ही बिका करता हूँ
    और होंगे तेरे बाज़ार में बिकने वाले

    [Reply]

    Pankaj#1 Reply:

    Vijay;
    The mere mention of Steve and an Indian connection made some people intensely jealous. Two names come to mind immediately. One claiming him to be an Arab Muslim and another making fun of that connection. The relationship is obvious.

    [Reply]

    engrich Reply:

    steve was the son of muslim syrian professor.he was not christian as his name show this is true.

  • Anonymous

    Shenoy-

    You mentioned BJP joiing Jagan in the next Lok Sabha elections in AP.

    Jagan Rao will be toxic for the 2013 Lok Sabha elections. Congress there is quite weak with the murky TRS situation, YSR group dissidence. BJP strategy there has to be an all out “anti corruption” forum joining Chandrababu of Telugu Desam, nailing the favourite son, the late YSR to Congress corruption – YSR gives the fodder on selling the state, with the knowledge and blessing of Congress..This has to be ruthlessly taken advantage of. (Chandrababu the builder vs YSR the destroyer)

    Telugu Desam/BJP should be able to garner 20 out of the 42 seats (if not, BJP should fire Venkaia Naidu). With this, BJP and its allies will get 83 seats from South India (I estimate they should be able to do better in Karnataka by capturing 5 additional seats to 24, Tamil Nadu 39).

    What is your opinion about kerala seats? I have a feeling that Marxists will have a secret understanding with BJP, to position them retake the seats they lost to Congress-Muslim League alliance in the last election. In that case, there is an additional backing of 17 seats. (2004 Marxists number)

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Shoeb,

    It has been a long held political philosophy in India that communalism is more dangerous than corruption. Even today, that is the line the congress party and other seculars take.
    Therefore, when the NDA was getting formed, most of the non-congress parties had faced this existential question of how to join hands with the BJP, a unsecular, communal party. That the question was conveniently over-ridden by political expediency is a different matter.

    Hence it now falls to the BJP’s lot to decide whether Naidu or Jagan will be a safe bet, because, if congress can take Jagan back, the bJP too can do business with him.

    But, I do agree with you that TDP is a far better party to partner with.

    In Kerala, the bJP has a transferable vote bank of around 8-10% and it can always go the CPM way at crunch time. In the last state elections in Kerala, Achutanandan performed exceedingly well only thanks to the BJP vote going to the CPM candidates.

    [Reply]

  • Anonymous

    IS HINDUISM A RELIGION
    No it aint. At least according to Prof dawkins.it aint. It is more of a set of ethical behaviour.
    Certainly it is not a ORGANISED religion , NOR IT HAS ANY CORE BELEIF, it has the left the existential question WIDE OPEN, thus exhorts to you to SEEK ULTIMATE TRUTH , beyond MAYA.Thus according to hindu beleif the ultimate aim is for dissolution of ATMAN with BRAMHAN (that is cosmic consciousness), not the turds of the blog.
    Also ATHEISM as advocated by CHARBAK is part and parcel of the different strands of thought amalgated together known as HINDUISM

    [Reply]

    Ravi Reply:

    Shan

    That is the beauty of Hinduism that it is not organised.

    Is it not the ambition of the RSS to give hinduism an organisation shape so that it can be manipulated easily. The outcome of this exercise will result in Hinduatva and not Hinduism as it is universally understood.

    [Reply]

  • Anonymous

    Guys, Steve Jobs WAS inspired by the spiritualism of India. He had a dig at Bill Gates about his cosy life , and once remarked “Has he lived in a ashram , what does he know about life”. But so far his company is concerned , it had minimal outsourcing from India. This is because I think , the indian software devolopers propelled Bill gates by using PC platform , and not using Mac.
    He had quite a RARE tumour , I dont have details, but going by his symptomps , he most likely had INSULINOMA of the pancreas. He underwent surgery, these tumours are TINY yet produces so much insulin , everything goes haywire. Also one compound called STREPTOZOCIN is specific for these particular cells in pancreas , in fact give it to a normal person and he becomes diabetic. YET when these cells become cancer , it is not that effective. It then spread to his liver , he had liver transplantation , did well for 3 yrs , looks like it recurred with vengenace and not much could be done .
    This one illness medical science is finding impossible to crack. Any query on this topic will be answered with the command similar to tendulkar with his bat

    [Reply]

  • Anonymous

    Happy Dusshera to all but I am feeling acute sadness today… I am afraid of mortality after hearing Steve Jobs demise…Even techies (pure souls) die..

    [Reply]

    AshishC Reply:

    Death will come to us all.. it’s what we do in life that matters..
    If any of us achieved even a tiny fraction of what Steve Jobs achieved and if we learnt how to live life in the face of adversity, Steve would not have lived in vain.
    RIP, hero.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    True..Death is inevitable and may be the only truth in life.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    No it aint, when heart attack and cancer is cured , people can safely expect to live beyond 100yrs and in a healthy state,
    As for death , given the mind boggling progress in stem cell research in 300yrs time , there may not be natural death , only unnatural ones

    Anonymous Reply:

    I’m pretty sure that I won’t live to see a day when people will die only of unnatural deaths.

    Anonymous Reply:

    Nor will I

  • Anonymous

    To all those who have discussed RSS here:

    Vijay Dashami is also the birthday of RSS and today it is its 86th birth anniversary.

    Both these facts I learnt from a long term RSS friend just two hours ago.

    [Reply]

    Ravi Reply:

    On that account alone, a very sad day then.

    On this day then the foundation of an ideology was laid down which directly lead to the murder of the Father of our nation, Mahatma Gandhi.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Shenoy,
    I hope and pray that RSS re-calibrates its approach towards true secularism. It should issue a categorical statement that non-hindus especially from semitic faith are equal citizen of this country never mind their anti-hindu and anti-national mindset.

    RSS has to reform itself because it looks like sophisticated version of Tableeghi Jamaat.

    [Reply]

  • Ravi

    BV Shenoy

    Now that you have admitted that you are a RSS member and have some friends who are members as well, then perhaps you can tick on the following.

    1. Is it true that RSS has an official policy to use communal riots to frighten innocent Hindu’s into submission?

    2. Is it true that the RSS is a secretive organisation which does not even keep an orderly register of its members.

    3. Can you enlighten us how many cases of murder and riots committed by the RSS are pending in various Indian courts.

    4. When does the RSS plan to set its political front the BJP free of micro management.

    5. RSS’s Hinduatva and pan Islamic Jihad are actually the same, with the exception that one is vegetarian and the other is a non-veg variety.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    You will get all the answers to these and many other questions in the busload of “secret circulars” you and your other fundoo partner have collected.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    you will also get “proof” about the 5000 daily rapes of dalit women and children by caste Hindus in this busload of secret RSS circulars.

    [Reply]

    Ravi Reply:

    I keep secret RSS circulars in the same ring binder file which contains the ISI Manual on how to sustain a fake identity and fool simpletons like you.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Almost all the questions are valid for Islam too…This uncanny similarity is unbelievable.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Some more

    1) Wants to define a nation (Hindu rashtra) on the basis of religion.

    2) What this nation to have a monolithic culture and religion (as interpreted by them) – in the process wanting to destroy the diversity of this country. That is Hindutva for you.

    3) Has unilaterally declared from time to time that Sikhism, Buddhism and Jainism as a subset of Hinduism and wants the adherent of these religions to accept the suzerainty of the Vedas.

    4) By means of communal riots, attacks on churches and mosques (Babri Masjid for example), intimidation, threats and coercion it also wants to beat the minorities into submission and in its scheme of things the minorities would be second class citizens at the mercy and largesse of Hindutvawadis.

    5) Speaks as if it is the sole authority to represent 80 crores+ Hindus. Huh!

    Anything spoken to the contrary to the above by the RSS/BJP/etc. is only a lip service.

    [Reply]

  • Anonymous

    Guys ,
    Why you engage mad-communal-Jinnah-dog bloggers like Ravi ?
    Do you think you will get a balanced opinion on any issue from him ?
    If so, you need to doubt your own faculties.
    After engaging him a few times you should have realized he is a liar, thug , anti-India propogandist ?

    Leave him to discuss his anti-India, anti-Hindu garbage with fellow scums from Engrish to the rabid-dog Shan.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Rajiiv,
    The Ravi’s arguments are OK if they are posted with honest intentions. He is basically a mischief-maker who posts stuff just to grab some eye balls. I have always loved reading venomous posts against India & hindu, below the belt posts on pakistan forum and to tell you the truth, I did enjoy those posts because I know people posting those thoughts are ignorant but are at least honest in their identity.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    @Rajeev ,
    This blog attracts some of the vilest Pak peddlers and supports of the criminal regimes and the ideology on which the criminal entity of Pakistan is based.
    Only one thing is constant, for any one posting anti-India, anti-Hindu garbage here, you can expect Ravi to bark for them.
    THat says all I need to know about his intentions.
    Just as Pakistan is China’s cheap lap-dog on leash to bark at India, Ravi is lap-dog for all anti-India, anti-Hindu garbage here.
    On top of that he is a proven liar.
    So I see no reason why anyone, who is rational, would engage a thug like him.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    @ Rajiiv

    I think Shenoy does NOT want to engage with him. But Raavi comes into his path everywhere. …

    Anonymous Reply:

    Thats true of rabid dogs too. There may be a way to respond without engaging or giving any consideration to the communal garbage these posters post.

    Ravi Reply:

    He is free to ignore me. After all I do, to a few here.

    He comes across my path nearly every day.

    Anonymous Reply:

    Both Ravi and his twin Tajender are thugs who manipulate every argument to bash India and hindus. I seriously don’t care about their views because they come from the culture where blaming others for their own failure has been cornerstone of their civillization.
    However when well-intentioned Indians get swayed by these two vermin and speak the same language as these thugs, the atmosphere becomes very polluted. Both Congress and RSS are part of India and the fight between two is healthy one and that too internal. These thugs coming from outside should not take advantage of our ideological differences.

    Anonymous Reply:

    Your points are valid about Ravi and the other such elements. Despite repeated provocation, how many of the Indian bloggers here scour the internet for anti-Islam documents, links, quotes from Qoran and other such Saudi scriptures/Hadith etc and post it here ? Almost none and rarely. Thats the right thing to do.
    On the other hand you have vile comunal anti-India and castist propogandists who may be collectively referred to as Jinnahs-communal-dogs.
    While some extrimist elements are fringe elements of other states, jinnah-communal-dog ideology is the mainstream ideology of states like Pakistan . These are states whose constitution is based on criminal communalism and thuggism of the medieval ages.

    Anonymous Reply:

    Just like we should leave you in company of child molesters and pimps, and villians YOUR BROTHERHOOD

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    @ Darnleystreet

    Unfortunate that you have to use this sort of language. neither is it funny… but it gives more badnami to you than to Rajiiv.

    [Reply]

    engrich Reply:

    yes they both are dog and ***** also son of a bich.

    [Reply]

  • Anonymous

    —————————————————————————————————————————–
    ~~~ DID THE LAPTOP KILL ITS FOUNDER– STEVE JOBS? ~~~
    —————————————————————————————————————————–

    To shift the subject from the repeated RSS RSS everywhere chants of the blog, let me throw light on the genius– a work maniac– a hard to please fanatic boss– Steve jobs.

    In college I had his blow up on my hostel wall.

    But…

    Did the laptop on his lap, his gadgets which give us all the benefits, yet also emit waves of dangerous frequenices harm steve?/

    I know of Xray technichians who have developed cancer.

    I know of a cousin of mine, who used the mobile phone 6 hrs a day a lost his hearing. More fascinatingly, once he stopped the mobile use, his hearing was restored over a period of 4 months.

    So did the laptop, always placed near his pancreas, finally eneded up harming its creator?

    And how do we balance the benefits of technology with the obvious health issues…?

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    You are right..Excessive use of gadgets can be harmful. I have been on computer for last 20 years at least 10-15 hours a day and I have seen effects of it on my health.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    @ Rajeev

    yes there has to be a balnce. And there has to be counter excercises.

    By the way what sort of keyboard do you use?

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    A normal laptop.

    Anonymous Reply:

    @ Rajeev

    After a certain point in case work demands heavy computer use… a desktop is a better option. Go for a microsft keyboard… as a laptop keyboard is always cramped.

    The screen too puts a heavy strain on the neck as it forces you to keep looking down.

    Laptops placed on the Lap have been known to reduce sperm count, induce strains in the skelatol system and also cause pemanent aches becasue of electronic frequencies.

    Always do Yogic kriya… means yogic neck and hand excercises every few hours. They take a few minutes. Just consist of rotation of joints as well as stretching and tightening.

    Well… I was part of team which was designing appropirate computer furniture an year back. One of the partners has filed for a patent on furniture and computer screens in california.

    SO one day if you do come across the ergonomic computer angles and furniture, just remember this pal out here.!

    Anonymous Reply:

    That prolonged use of computera will produce SHOULDER STRAIN is no rocket science.Any muscle of the body subjected to ODD posture and stress will will produce strain

    Anonymous Reply:

    I think we are talking way beyond shoulder strain. it is about the skelatal system re booting to accomodate gadget use, In the end the repiratory and cardiovascular sytem are affected,

    I hope you can get the big picture.

    Anonymous Reply:

    Yes if you are talking about SEDANTARY lifestyle, then yes.

    Anonymous Reply:

    No it didn’t.Look into the internet about a science called EPIDEMIOLOGY.And cancer epidemiology is a MASSIVE SCIENCE.Just by using statistical anaysis scientist have PROVEN BEYOND DOUBT 90% of the Lung Cancer ONLY happens to SMOKERS. This was proven by Sir Richard Doll, along with linkage between Chronic Bronchitis and smoking ,Same with ASBESTOS exposure and MESOTHELIOMA .
    Mobile phone use over a very very long periods everyday does give rise to INCREASED incidence of BRAIN TUMOURS.
    Background radiation does produce cancers.There is a place in TURKEY where a particular cancer is2000% above the world average.THE WHOLE VILLAGE WAS ABANDONED , and it was thought due to high background radiation. Ask like a chela , will get answer like a guru.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    @ Darnley street

    I think you should keep your mind open for new things. It is always easy to qoute figures of what has already been proved. i put a question mark against my idea. that did it?

    That doctors and researchers have been known to tailor their research postulates as per industry pressures is well known. If you search the internet, you will find many ads of Camel cigarettes right till 1960 in which doctors SUPPORTED the use of camel or some other cigarette.

    As for usage of mobile phones and body hugging electronic equipment the verdict will not come out for next two decades becasue the time frame for statistical proof is small, As it was for cigarettes, right till 1990.

    Till then many a million will lose their lives.

    My thesis is simple. yes, wwe cannot live without these gadgets. But we can build in our safety measures, like keeping them away from directly touching our bodies and also re-tooling our furniture and our lives to accomodate them ergonomically.

    And yes, you may be a doctor. But on this planet there is only one NON rocket scientist, who combines a passion for biophysics, pyschology and engineering. And maybe he wont be very very wrong…

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    As regards mobile phone , massive data had been accrued as a result of PROSPECTIVE WELLPLANNED STUDY. And the advice is given based on that analysis. Are you aware the CATHODE RAY TUBE television generated 100000volts and had carcinogenic radiation if we you stayed too close.
    The bottom line is RADIATION is ubiquitous , a glass of milk has radiation . Few cancers, we know has clear cut association .Stomach cancer used to be quite common in the west , but gone down to the floor, still high in japan and korea, .the link. is SALT
    . prior to refrigeration ,meat used to be preserved in salt ,
    japanese still use MASSIVE amount of salt in their food.There was programme in nippon tv (english) showing Japanese food.
    One of the delicacy was a raw fish , cleaned stuffed with rice and then the entire thing kept under a mound od salt AND BURIED IN THE SOIL foe six months to ferment.
    no wonder high incidence of stomach cancer .
    Similarly COLON cancer is exclusively linked to eating day in day out BEEF , and there is no ifs and buts about it.
    Eating lot of fruit and vegetables and generally eating less and avoiding smoking will prevent a lot of cancers

    Anonymous Reply:

    I rthink u should go oer your own postings boasting about your love for beef and pork…

    Pankaj#1 Reply:

    your analysis is correct.

    Anonymous Reply:

    If there are no ifs and butts, don’t eat the butt part, eat something else.

  • Anonymous

    @Rajeev, Vijay
    Your points are valid about Ravi and the other such elements. Despite repeated provocation, how many of the Indian bloggers here scour the internet for anti-Islam documents, links, quotes from Qoran and other such Saudi scriptures/Hadith etc and post it here ? Almost none and rarely. Thats the right thing to do because we do not want this blog to be a communal blog but a blog to discuss national issues and Indo-Pak relations.
    Is there a dearth of mad-mullahs that can be quoted here to portray Islam ?
    You wont even need to resort to fake pamphlets and dubious links for that.
    On the other hand you have vile comunal anti-India and castist propogandists who may be collectively referred to as Jinnahs-communal-dogs.
    While some extrimist elements are fringe elements of other states, jinnah-communal-dog ideology is the mainstream ideology of states like Pakistan . These are states whose constitution is based on criminal communalism and thuggism of the medieval ages.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    @ Rajiiv

    becasue it is almost 12 and I am enjoying a shot of Teaachers after celeberating the death of Ravan in true Hindu- atheist – HIndu style, let me throw a red herring.

    how do we know they are not Chinese spies? :) After all China has 3 million dedicated people on the net to change opinions on the net !! And by talking as Pakistanis they mught be serving the China cause like sheep in wolves clothings 1 ( I wanted to type out ! but ended up typing 1 because my teacher made my head sway… )

    But maybe Engrich and Ravi are one 1 . Taking 2 different names…

    Maybe it is some Mr Ravigrichungwa sitting in a Communist office in guangdong typing under different names ! Maybe I can have good fun throwing this theory around tommorrow !!!

    But Rajiiv, I think let us take this as an opportunity for understanding how they think,

    I think india and Indians outside are bound to rise to the top in the next 2 decades desptie the decadent politcs of this country. yes we just need to make sure that the desperate jehadis dont nuke us…

    Out of sheer jealousy !

    Anyway it is always good fun to rile these guys up. Sont take them too seriously. …

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    I think to think of them as anything more than dirty communal dogs , would be flattering them. Good night.

    ( Bye the way, to portray Pakistan, I do not need to quote a rabid-mullah from Sialkot. I can just quote Jinnah the architect and communal criminakl of direct action day )

    [Reply]

    Ravi Reply:

    Rather fanciful but mildly amusing.

    However, not very original.

    I was also wondering, with such a large software development industry in India, is it possible that Raja Shenoy and His Rani Vijay are actually one.

    This first hermaphrodite member of the RSS is here to preach us the rubbish out of date Hinduatva sermon with missionary zeal.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Ravi bachche , aaj tu bach gaya…
    Aaj ki shaam, mere teacher ke naam hai

    You should celeberate it in the petticoat of T U R D tajedar
    Having fun with Engrich and getting kicked by balwinder !

    3 fundoos on the net are engrich, tajendar and Ravi
    Vijay cuts them to shred Kal aaj aur kal bhi,,,, :)

    Ravi Reply:

    Khota sikka vappas a raha hai.
    Is sharabi ka dimag bhujta ja raha hai.

    Pankaj#1 Reply:

    Vijay;
    I am with you. Now this MF Hussain is trying my patience. He has to be shown reality.

    Anonymous Reply:

    Viju

    We should do well with the growth trajectory in place. The growth will be 11-14% if Modi becomes PM.

    Something has to be done with UP and other real backward states. Again, I believe, if Modi becomes PM, he will institute a central/state joint program to improve the UP metrics

    [Reply]

    engrich Reply:

    rajiiiv 80%of the blog is full of anti-muslim venom.as u people have nothing to offer.hate is ur duty and lie a staple food.
    hinduism is conglemeration of hundreds of frauds.rajeev is specially mad.i think some muslim has fucked his mother.

    sketch of durga was prepared by a bengali kayasth.i think he got this idea of from shanghai.i have seen carricatures like over there.
    frauds made her god to make money.
    ur gods come to destroy oppressed.in bhagwat geeta pandav kill kurav because they from lower caste.

    bramns brought parusram to kill all khatris of world kerala is called parusram shruti.

    [Reply]

    engrich Reply:

    only thing which hindus offered to world is kamasutra.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    You owe your existence to same kamasutra…Had you abba not tried different positions, you would have not been born? :)

    Anonymous Reply:

    @ Rajeev

    Seems engrich is a product either of the Donkey or the piggie position !

    Anonymous Reply:

    probably Piggie position, donkey has much longer weapon whereas muslims cut whatever they have :)

    Just joking..

    Pankaj#1 Reply:

    Rajeev;
    You have been posting nicely. leave this **** alone. I like your courage, you can go agains twhat is politically right. do not bring your self to this level. This is my request. having said this, if this wretched does not improve, i will support all the your efforts. bhay bin hot na preet. Now this ba…. will listen only to fear.Isko Shahid hone ka jajba hai to phir maro.

    Anonymous Reply:

    Pankaj,
    I have debated with muslims for more than over a decade and one thing that I have found which is consistent is that they resort to abusing hindu gods at a drop of hat. Their favorite insult is that Hindus are peshab piyakkad..many hindus don’t know how to counter this..but according to one of the hadiths mohammad recommended camel urine as best medication for various ailments.

    engrich Reply:

    my abba used to fk ur mother.

    Anonymous Reply:

    This is Islam for you..where people like engrich f**k their own mothers.

    [Reply]

    engrich Reply:

    one ur bhagwan vashishta used to fk his mother.bloody idiot.

    Anonymous Reply:

    your bhogwan mohammad did same.

  • Anonymous

    The cancer that steve jobs succumbed to , was known for last 100 yrs. And it was present long before computers were invented.There is no evidence to suggest that this RARE cancer is linked to laptop use. Patrick Swaze also had pancreatic cancer , the common variety , so had emperor hirohito. I don’t think anybody knows the cause , other than those who have chronic pancreatitis are definitely more prone to it.
    FAR MORE IMPORTANT is PROSTATE CANCER which is like a epidemic in the west.most likely due to HIGH CALORIE , HIGH SATURATED FAT DIET

    [Reply]

    engrich Reply:

    shan is there any cure for prostate cancer.what is its symtoms.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Just type prostate cancer in google , you will know everything

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    He is permitted by ISI to google only dalit rapes, daily rapes in India, rapes by RSS, etc. If he googles beyond these, he will not get his dole and daily fix.

  • engrich

    rajiv i am sure some muslim has raped ur mother that is u are writing non sense against muslims.ask dr pankaj to check ur brain nd a$$ both.

    [Reply]

  • Anonymous

    I guess IT department at HT is as incompetent as Vinod. If memory serves me right rabid mad dog now known as engrich was banned…what happened to that ban?

    How can he allowed to post when he is painting pornographic pictures of his own mother? How low one can stoop?

    [Reply]

    engrich Reply:

    yes i am rabid dog and ur mother i my *****.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    “ur mother is ur *****”..what kind of person are you?

    [Reply]

    engrich Reply:

    idiot u will know what i am.

  • Anonymous

    ——————————————
    Jogender Nath Mandal
    ——————————————
    ( the scheduled caste leader from Bengal who supported Muslim League with horrendous consequences for himself and his supporters )

    When the Jinnah’s pre-planned communal riots happened in Bengal, Jinah’s Muslim League was in power in Bengal. The majority in the Calcutta assembly of the Muslim League depended on the support of 4 Hindu legislators who belonged to a scheduled caste party. Jinnah had promised the moon and the heavens to anyone who would support his demand for Pakistan. Jinnah had also offered the Sikhs , anything they wanted,, if they joined the demand for Pakistan. Unlike Sikhs, some of the SC legislators fell to Jinnah’s devious ploys. The most prominent among them was Jogendernath Mondal.

    Here are first few lines about Jogender Nath Mandal, and how his love for communal criminal Jinnah and his Muslim LEAGUE ended , from Wikipedia.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jogendra_Nath_Mandal

    “Jogendra Nath Mandal (Bengali: যোগেন্দ্রনাথ মণ্ডল) (1904–1968) was an Indian and later Pakistani statesman who served as the first minister of law and labour in Pakistan. As leader of the Scheduled Castes, Jogendranath had made common cause with the Muslim League in their demand for Pakistan, hoping that the Scheduled Castes would be benefited from it and joined the first cabinet in Pakistan as the Minister of Law and Labour. He, however, realized his folly in 1950 when thousands of lower caste Hindus were massacred in East Bengal generating a wave of refugees to India. He himself fled to India and submitted his resignation to Liaquat Ali Khan, the then Prime Minister of Pakistan……”

    He finally fled to Calcutta from Pakistan in October 1950, to save his life. In his own words he stated something like that the genocidal criminals of Muslim league had not left a Hindu women untouched between the ages of 13-40 in Jinnah’s Pakistan.

    His long resignation letter , should be read by all interested in the history of India and criminal entity called Paksitan. However, the course of history may have been different if the 4 SC legislators in United Bengal assembly in 1946, had not aligned themselves with criminal Muslim league.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Resignation of Jaginder Nath Mandal ( in his own ) words.
    This letter, gives great insights into the politics of that period and how a single legislator, who was previously unknown, was used by the Muslim League in its designs and how the course of history of Partition and division in Bengal, may have been different if he had not succumed to Muslim League inducements.

    His resignation letter should be a must read for students of history.

    http://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Resignation_letter_of_Jogendra_Nath_Mandal

    [Reply]

    engrich Reply:

    yes u are right,**** punjabis being narrow minded dont know howw to rule.it is not joginder singh mandal leave them.muslim bengalees too left them.because of them future of pakistan is bvery uncertain.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    The resignation letter of Jagindra Nath mandal from the cabinet of liaqat Ali, listing how the Pakistani state was systemetically commiting genocide of Hindus, must be a compulsory reading . This is the same Jagindra nath Mandal who had been most loyal to Pakistan.

    [Reply]

    Pankaj#1 Reply:

    Rajiv;
    I had read this article about a year back. Very sad and hurtful chapter in Indian history. This has been an SOP for Muslim leaguees and other jihadists to look for fAULT LINES IN ANY SOCIETY, TAKE ADVANTAGE OF THEM, SUBVERT THE SOCIETY AND take advantage of that. This has been going on since hundreds of years or since millenium or more. A prominent muslim scholar lamented that Islam ka Safina, hindustan mai aakar doob gaya. North Indian hindus put a brave resistance and because of their stronger spirituality and inner strength, were able to resist very aggressive religion/ creed.
    Same game is still being played. One Tajinder, the imposter, says I am muslim, Dalit and tribal and every ruse to further the fault lines, while people with wisdom in India trying to erase those fault lines. You can see mischief mongers’ nefarious game even in this blog. A group of certain people, Aag main ghee dalne ka kaam kar rahe hain.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    @Pankaj,
    Its difficult to find a politician more loyal to Pakistan , than Joginder Nath Mandal in the 1940-48 period. In his resignation letter, he lists the deceit, the duplicity and the brazen criminality that the Muslim League governments have inflicted upon Hindus and on him since partition. Its difficult to read the littany of government sponsored and supported abuses and genocide of Hindus.
    In India, Nehru-Gandhi were working to promote communal harmony and make Muslims feel secure. Very few Muslims migrated to Pakistan after the initial wave of migration in 1947.

    In Pakistan, the situation was just the opposite. The Pakistani politicians and Muslim League , were working on a clear plan to expell Hindus, kill or convert them. Thats why Hindus continued to flee Pakistan , both from West and East in the 1948-51 period.
    Its difficult to read Mt JoginderNath Mandal’s letter.

    The greatest indictment of the criminal entity spawned by Jinnah’s communal hate comes from the greatest loyalist to the idea of Pkaistan : Mr Joginder Nath Mandal.

    Please read his letter in full when you get some time. It will move you at the state sponsored barbarity visited upon innocent people in Pakistan.

    [Reply]

    engrich Reply:

    North Indian hindus put a brave resistance and because of their stronger spirituality and inner strength, were able to resist very aggressive religion

    north indians could never stop any agressor.they showed their a$$to everybody.delhi was attacked by sikhs and muslim punjabis.

    battles were fought at panipat with 90%of time foreign invaders won.

    [Reply]

  • Anonymous

    Why is that whosoever has joined cult of Islam, goes thru downfall to the darket depth of humanity whereas whosoever leaves Islam becomes a bright star?

    May the people who leave Islam save lot of time by shunning 5 times prayers and bak-bak in Nukkad and masjids and use this saved time to do something constructive.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    @Rajeev
    When you get some time, please read Joginder Nath Mandal;s resgination letter from Liaqat Khan’s minitry in 1950. I have provided the link in one of my posts below.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    I did..and believe me it makes me believe that Gujarat riots were nothing compared to genocide committed by muslims. The incidents narrated by Mondal are very upsetting.
    There is a book by SGPC on riots that were witnessed during partition. It has detailed account of all the riots and how inhumanely hindus and sikhs were treated.
    This is the reason I feel no sympathy for muslims who get killed by various regimes, govt,. groups etc. because they don’t deserve it.

    [Reply]

    engrich Reply:

    we dont need sympathy from idiot and donkeys like.we keep people like u on my foot.during partition 60% of the victims were muslims.

    Anonymous Reply:

    You are wrong here. More than 70% were hindus.

    engrich Reply:

    even then percetage wise it is more as muslims were 1/3 of indian population.

    Anonymous Reply:

    The Gujrat riots were mob riots in response to Godhra carnage, just as 1984-riots were reaction to Indira’s assasination and years of Hindu killings in Punjab. They were not pre-planned and the state put a stop to them in 2-3 days. Gujrat , at best was 1 second in the life of minorities in the criminal entity pf Pakistan.

    The irony is, the criminal Pak state knew that Gandhi-Nehru-Hindu India could never descend to the level of pre-planned genocide of its own citizens that the Islamic state would have no problem indulging in. Thats why they killed and expelled Hindus, Sikhs without any accountablility and justice or repurcussion.

    India cannot formulate right policy about handling Pakistan unless we correctly appraise the nature of that entity.

    Pankaj#1 Reply:

    Rajiv;
    yes, you are right here. Muslim leaguee knew that hindis will not turn as savage as muslims can be. As indian leaders and indians in general, consider everyone Indian first and religion is secondary or even tertiary for them. for leaguees, religion was forst and nothing else mattered. Killing of muslims was painful for Gandhi and all congress leaders. In bengal reprisals, when biharis massacred muslims, nehru threatened to bomb bihar by Air force. So that was the standard between criminal leaguees and Congress. that is what emblodened jinnah that we are more beast than you can ever be.

    engrich Reply:

    250000- muslims were mascared in 2 days in jammu.on 6th nov1947.hindus are peaceful but brhmnst not.

    engrich Reply:

    ur writing is ur imagination not truth.opposite is true.

    engrich Reply:

    bengalees cannot work with punjabis.muslim punjabis have no experience of ruling.

    [Reply]

    engrich Reply:

    who is asking u to do.but dont dont insult.otherwise i will fk ur mthr.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Apki ammijaan ko aap f*** kartein ho…doob maro paani mein..

    [Reply]

    engrich Reply:

    if u dont like dont do who ask u do.but all the time showing the a$$on blog shows u are maniac and stupid.
    u consider urself bright star.u are idiot.

    [Reply]

  • engrich

    rajeev if u dont know i tell u,hinduism is corporation of frauds a circus of 33 crore devtas
    ram was king who never existed on indian soil(as per effeidveit of bhardwaj in supreme court.how he became vishnu avtar and when.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Allah was a pagan god stolen by Mohammad…kaaba was a pagan temple..also stolen and occupied.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    @Rajeev,
    If I may request , pleasse ignore engrich. You would NOT like to go to descend to the levels where he and the rabid-dogs live.

    Regarding Pakistan, in India we have not fully appraised the total criminal and evil nature of that entity. If its was genocidal and criminal state in 1947-51 , its 10 times more so today.

    All this talk of engaging Pakistan , is the same foolishness that Joginder Nath Mandal demonstrated , with genocidal consequences.

    [Reply]

    engrich Reply:

    things changes with time ayodhya prayag kashi and mathura were buddhist places of worship.contructed by them occupied by vedic.

    [Reply]

  • Anonymous

    Shenoy/Shoeb

    1) Shenoy – Will BJP alliance get 5 more seats in the next Karnataka Lok Sabha poll?
    2) I second Shoeb’s assessment on AP. In fact I would think they will get more, may be another 5 or so
    3) Regarding kerala – Shenoy, I do not think BJP did sway the election Marxists’ way.
    However, with the Muslims vote solidly behind Congress alliance (Muslim league is a partner in UDF – kerala’s UPA), and with four more Muslim “sure win” seats in Malappuram dist (the first “Muslim” district in India), Marxists have to align with small parties like BJP who will provide the needed margins.. Marxists lost a large number of constituencies for mere 5,000 or less. BJP should be able to provide that margin, and in exchange BJP will get a few assembly seats (from 0 now) in the next assembly election, and possibly one parliament seat in the next Lok Sabha.

    Marxists will remain the largest party, but will not be able to form ministry ever in future without somebody like BJP (in fact there is nobody else who will bring 15,000 to 30,000 votes per constituency) in their alliance.

    Marxists can say BJP is not communal in Kerala as Congress says Muslim League is not communal in kerala! There have been stranger bedfellows.

    In fact with their dismal performance in West Bengal and Tamil Nadu state elections, Marxists in kerala (and even at an India level) may want to rethink whether they can remain a national party or whether they should morph into a state/regional shape.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Gopi,

    I agree with your prognosis. In the context of Kerala, what I meant was that the Hindu vote swung in favour of the CPM, in some seats decisively, because of the Muslim league’s vote bank politics. This has been acknowledged by pollsters too.

    In the next parliament elections, the CPM and to some extent CPI too have to confront the existential question. They can rationalise about joining hands with the BJP just like, in 1942, they joined hands with the British in India, going against the popular Quit India movement.

    [Reply]

  • Anonymous

    I take Pankaj advise and leave enuchrich alone.

    [Reply]

    engrich Reply:

    if u will not go i will make u go rubbish punjabi.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    You 2 cent convert..don’t think that you came from outside…Your great grandmothers were gang raped by invading muslims and this is the reason you are muslim…

    Why don’t you stick to Zia’s gutter blog where you are whipped by Khosla?

    [Reply]

    engrich Reply:

    95%are convert.correct ur self.

    Anonymous Reply:

    So you agree 95% of them are product of gang rape by earlier muslims..

  • Ravi

    शीनोय है राजा और विजय है रानी

    माँ लोग सुन रहें हैं ऐसी कहानी
    इसमें शीनोय है राजा और विजय है रानी

    यह आम हिन्दुओं की कथा नहीं है,
    यह है इक निराले हिन्दुअत्व की कहानी
    इसमें शीनोय है राजा और विजय है रानी

    गाँधी जिसमे है एक बरडा दुर्जन
    यहाँ मोदी की होती है बहुत मेहमानी
    इसमें शीनोय है राजा और विजय है रानी

    दलितों पर किये अत्याचार न हों अंकित
    तब ही बन जाये गी हमारी झूठी कहानी
    इसमें शीनोय है राजा और विजय है रानी

    मनोहर ने लगाय दो ऐसे चांटे
    एक को नज़र आने लगी दूसरे की नानी
    इसमें शीनोय है राजा और विजय है रानी

    बहता है झूठ इनके लब्हों से ऐसे
    जैसे बहता है मीना कुमारी की आँखों से पानी
    इसमें शीनोय है राजा और विजय है रानी

    हालात आपने तो सुधर ही जाते
    अगर न होती मुसलमानों की परेशानी
    इसमें शीनोय है राजा और विजय है रानी

    [Reply]

    engrich Reply:

    great ravi bhai.

    [Reply]

  • engrich

    Rashtriya Swayamsevak Sangh (RSS) supremo Mohan Bhagwat has admitted that the RSS had actively participated in the Anna Hazare-led anti-corruption agitation earlier this year.

    now it clear that anna movement was zoinist brhmnst attack on our democatic institution with the help of zoinist control media.

    [Reply]

  • Pankaj#1

    @ Everyone;
    As I try to evolve in being better human being, turds come here in this blog and force me to reconsider my resolve.

    [Reply]

    engrich Reply:

    discuss political issues dont involve urslf in muslim bashing or abusing muslims.u will be like my brother.i can have different view on things.but i dont use abusive language.

    rajeev is mad man.everytime abusing islam.u people who were so sensitive on ravis comment on rama are silent on him.

    u are better human being.i read ur blogs.why u feel u were not better before.man changes with time.

    i am critical of rss because of their misdeeds and fascist divisive ideology.
    but u have have full right to differ with me.

    if u will become bad human being,u will hurt urslf.i take ur name with respect u call me ****.

    [Reply]

    Pankaj#1 Reply:

    Engrich;
    much against my decision, i am replying to you. have I ever spoken against islam or its Prophet?? Never. have i spoken any time against Muslims?? never. it is the jihadi mentality and anti India instance of them, that i am dead against. You be civil and I will return compliment.

    [Reply]

    engrich Reply:

    pankaj bhai,

    there is no jihadi here.u are doctor.labelling is wrong and easy.
    awnsering is difficult.i dont remeber u or even dr misra ever speaking against islam.that way record of our balwinder praajee is most clean.
    but there should be no double standard.when ravi spoke something bad about rama ,entire blog was condemning him.
    when rajeev abused our prophet all of them were silent.making friendship with him.first of all we should not dicuss religion here.we should concentrate on social and political issues aim should be to promote national unity and integration.we are passing from bad time.
    i give my view with full honesty and sicerety.u have right to differ and argue.

    when i say b.rhmnst it does not mean brhmn,i am slave of brhmn(mywife is brhmn).but i hate brhmnst as i know they are baddies an very harmful for country and society.thanks for reading.

    Pankaj#1 Reply:

    No, you are wrong here. I never supported any one who denigrated prophet. In fact, I opposed that. You can see my post or you can do cut and paste any post where I have supported any one ridiculing your prophet.

    engrich Reply:

    u are right.i agree with u.

    engrich Reply:

    pankaj bhai media is more powerful than atom bomb.i was afraid that anna will take crowd to parliament and occupy this and rss will declare hindu rashtra.
    but they did not had enough support hence the courage.anti corrution slogan was a deceit as it was oming from the most corrupt of our society.
    i apolige for bad language.i was not in control that time.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Read the comments of the bloggers below and determine for yourself, what kind of bloggers you should never engage, unless you are capable of the vile that comes naturally to Jinnah’s communal dogs.

    [Reply]

    Pankaj#1 Reply:

    Rajiv;
    Most of the time, I agree with you. what I do not like is Obscene language. be it from Indians or pakistanis. Believe me, my work suffers, as I come to this blog to my detriment. I am no lokpal. what I try is to disabuse preconceived notions people have about hindus and Indians. Talking to Tajinder is part of that exercise. It does not mean, I agree with him. I will not reply to his rants, but if he has some notions, and he speaks about them in a civil language, I would try to argue with him in a civil language. do not condone his ideas. I have seen/ met, and still, I have many top class people, who profess Islam, minus its bigotary.I have faith in humanity.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    If politics is discussed then muslim community will be discussed because politics is part of their religion. How can you discuss Congress-BJP without bringing muslims into it? Are muslims not the one who consume maximum airwaves?

    [Reply]

    Pankaj#1 Reply:

    Rajeev;
    Agree with you. Political Islam is very aggressive, cruel and unforgiving. Its manifestation is Jihadi Islam. Do not worry. I had been there and know, how to deal with it. Many muslim goons rue the day, they confronted me.

    [Reply]

    engrich Reply:

    Political Islam is very aggressive, cruel and unforgiving. Its manifestation is Jihadi Islam

    jihadis were creation of americans,who have no support among muslims.ossama was hiding like rat in pakistan.
    seprate truth from propaganda.90%of terrorists were caught by
    pkistan army only.
    actually u people have nothing to write so always bring muslims in discussions.

    pankaj bhai,forgivenes is the supreme virtue of islam.from where u got this notion please tell.jihadi islam exist only american occupied.it is their response to occupation.

    Ravi Reply:

    Political Hinduism is just as bad.

    In fact any mixture of Politics and Religion is bad.

    engrich Reply:

    u do whatever u want but dont use abusive language.95%of muslims are voting to regional parties.not congress.scenerio has changed.why muslim should vote bjp when they have nothing in their programm for them.dont behave like a maniac.dont attack spiritual part of it.

    [Reply]

    AshishC Reply:

    Engrich,
    why Muslims should vote BJP?
    Has it struck you ever that a political party is also shaped by its support base?
    If the BJP had a strong Muslim support base- it would have to start being much more accommodative.
    Yaar, Congress ne 60 saal se ullu banaya hai; abhi bhi akkal nahi ayee?

    AshishC Reply:

    I spent more than 2 years on Zia’s blog and learnt only that Indian Muslims need to be protected from secularists and other Muslims (clergy)..
    That’s not the way “secular Muslims” like Zia see it- they need protection, special treatment, special education, separate everything.. special everything..
    So, I quit that forum. Not worth getting your blood-pressure up for nothing.

    [Reply]

  • Anonymous

    Today Obama on Pakistan .
    —————————————

    President Barack Obama returned to front-foot batting in the ongoing crisis of the U.S.-Pakistan relationship, when he said at a White House news conference on Thursday that Islamabad was hedging its bets in terms of the post-drawdown denouement in Afghanistan, in particular by associating with “unsavoury characters.”

    In a rare departure, Mr. Obama explicitly alluded to Pakistan’s role in its troubled history with India, saying Pakistan saw its “security interest threatened by an independent Afghanistan, in part because they think it will ally itself to India and Pakistan still considers India their mortal enemy.”

    “Part of what we want to do is actually get Pakistan to realise that a peaceful approach towards India would be in everybody’s interests,” he said.
    ..

    Now Do you think Obama would say something like “get Pakistan to realise ” , if he had any understanding and knowledge of the history of Pakistan and the nature and character of trhe completely evil and criminal entity that it is ?

    Most of India and USA’s failure to understand the entity called Pakistan originates in their inability to comprehend the monstrosity of this entity. A good starting point would be the letter of Jagindra Nath Mandal, who was a minister in first Pakistan cabinet of Liaqat Ali Khan and had a complete knowledge of the functioning of the Jinnah-state.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Rajiiiv
    Obama was quite public about his criticism of Pakistan – the unsavoury ties between ISII/terror networks, proxy groups etc. he did say that US knows who in the military have connections with the terror networks, and they have conveyed to Pakistani authorities, and will check whether they will take actions.

    India , with or without US assistance, should man its affairs vis-a-vis Pakistan in an aggressive mode. The first and foremost item on the list should be some way of denuking that terrorist country.. However that will be extremely difficult. US, Israel, and India should work together on the denuking project . We should also do targeted assassinations, that way things will remain hush hush without escalation. Border security, intelligence gathering…

    We should not have talks with anybody, because nobody is in charge there. There is no sense in continued discussions until there is a clear authority in place.

    [Reply]

    engrich Reply:

    gopi ,tell me why america is there.they are occupying force.if people are so bad he should vacate this area.why in libya they killed 200000
    people afghanis have never thrown even a stone on america.they have
    financially destroyed america.for what.libya will be their waterloo.western press has already started comparing khamis ghaddafi(son of ghaddafi) as marshal zukhov of 21st century.nato and its rats are surrounded in almost every city.from 7 months they are bombing mostly civilian targets.now they are running short of bombs.obama or any other western leader leader should be ashamed of their deeds.not teach lessons.people of that areas lived in peace from thousands year.allow them to live peacefullywe are neighbour should learn how to live peace.we are not religious brother but we are blood brother.we should be rationale not just hater.

    [Reply]

    Ravi Reply:

    Gopi

    I made the same point twice in previous blogs.

    Can dig them out if you mistrust me.

    [Reply]

    engrich Reply:

    ravi india isreal america pact anywhere will be kiss of death.india pakistan iran will be natural alliance against rising china.this will boost our trade and employment facilities in that region.

    Anonymous Reply:

    Gopi,

    nobody can fault your analysis or your thesis about how to tackle the terrorist nation called Pak.shitstan. But we have to contend with a PM like MMS and FM like Krishna, who are showing no sign of changing the course of our foreign or defence policies. When the terrorists in Pakistani army actually come to possess the nukes and actually test them on one or two of our cities, like Hiroshima and Nagasaki, our government would be caught with its pants down.

    [Reply]

  • Anonymous

    Breathtaking , THAT IS HUMAN NATURE. When people generally low in spirits at the passing away of Steve Jobs , which also tells us all this religion , nation , malaki is essentially complete BAKWAS. Yet some IMBECILE cannot have their food digested unless he can bring up and have a go at pakistan . I am not sure these guys are any different from Taliban , totally bereft of any insight , infact totally bereft of any sight , IN OTHER WORDS BLIND from ignorance and bigotry.Humanism is a word hated by these gross and crude characters.

    [Reply]

    engrich Reply:

    i told to blogger about his racial regional and relious past of steve.bloggers should know that intellegent and enlightened people can come from any region.
    if u are not married go to his country and see the most beautiful women of the world.

    [Reply]

  • Anonymous

    Shan,
    Can you put ENGRICH to sleep? He is suffering from rabies…

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Rajeev,

    sare you giving supari to Shaan on the cancerous, gangrenous Gingrich?

    [Reply]

  • Anonymous

    ENGRICH है राजा और RAVI है रानी

    Allah लोग सुन रहें हैं ऐसी कहानी
    इसमें ENGRICH है राजा और RAVI है रानी

    यह आम Musalmano की कथा नहीं है,
    यह है इक निराले Jehad की कहानी
    इसमें ENGRICH है राजा और RAVI है रानी

    गाँधी जिसमे है एक बरडा दुर्जन
    यहाँ Mohammad की होती है बहुत मेहमानी
    इसमें ENGRICH है राजा और RAVI है रानी

    Shiaon पर किये अत्याचार न हों अंकित
    तब ही बन जाये गी हमारी झूठी कहानी
    इसमें ENGRICH है राजा और RAVI है रानी

    Shenoy ने लगाय दो ऐसे चांटे
    एक को नज़र आने लगी दूसरे की नानी
    इसमें ENGRICH है राजा और RAVI है रानी

    बहता है झूठ इनके लब्हों से ऐसे
    जैसे बहता है मीना कुमारी की आँखों से पानी
    इसमें ENGRICH है राजा और RAVI है रानी

    हालात आपने तो सुधर ही जाते
    अगर न होती Hinduon की परेशानी
    इसमें ENGRICH है राजा और Ravi है randi

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Thx Rajeev

    You said what many a people wanted to say here!!

    [Reply]

    Ravi Reply:

    Did they!!

    Has the cat got your tongue….aaj ka anna khan hai, kya teacher ne khainch liya hai.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Rajeev,

    it is a piece of real poetry. I wish you would pen more of them and more often. Keep it up.

    [Reply]

    Ravi Reply:

    What you meant to say was keep copying my real poetry.

    What you write is cod’s wallop

    [Reply]

  • Anonymous

    I don’t want to interact with gutter rats ENGRICH and RAVI…but who can tolerate pests for very long?

    Both have been perfect representative of primitive faith that they practice.

    [Reply]

    engrich Reply:

    keep ur a$$ shut or i will ask doctor to stich it.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    You got your stiched already…Now I know why you are so full of gas.

    [Reply]

  • Anonymous

    Rajiv,
    Mondal was very brief in describing plight of hindus in east pakistan. Here is the book from Dr.Gurucharan Singh Talib (SGPC) that has details of every muslim league attacks on hindu and sikhs in great detail.
    One of the things that will surely catch your eyes is that during those days muslims allowed hindus and sikhs to alight the trains but once they were inside the bogies, muslims used to set fire to those bogies roasting unsuspecting hindus-sikhs. This modus operandi was again tried by muslims in Godhra but as usual hindus never learn from history and gave muslims benefit of doubt.

    The chapters are at the bottom of this link-
    http://www.sikhiwiki.org/index.php/Muslim_League_Attack_on_Sikhs_and_Hindus_in_the_Punjab_1947

    [Reply]

  • Anonymous

    LINK to the book detailing genocide of hindus-sikhs by muslims during partition.
    http://www.bharatvani.org/books/mla/index.htm

    [Reply]

    engrich Reply:

    there are same with muslims.may be more.can u write one paragraph without mentioning islam or muslims.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Yes. When we talk of progress and tolerance we don’t need to mention your community.

    [Reply]

  • Anonymous

    This is for all those muslims who have romantic view of Pakistan and Islamic brotherhood…

    Indian Mohajir
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZD_wdVQVBHA&feature=related

    [Reply]

    engrich Reply:

    rajeev u are maniac.new generation of muslims hardly know any thing about pakistan.they see no difference between pakistan and cuba.

    [Reply]

  • AshishC

    Vijay Kumar,
    Missed your submission in my court :) Shubho Bijoya to you and all others-
    I will go against tradition and keep the operative part of the judgement for later.. probably never :)
    Let me fill up the space with, as in all judgments, some homilies and gyaan.
    This goes out to Rajiv, Rajeev, Shenoy, Raju Kurien.. et al
    To me it does not matter what Ravi is- though I am 100% sure that he is what he says; a 62 year old who has lived in UK for 40 years, a Mona Sikh from Delhi. He has, sometimes, very weird notions about Indian politics and society- that does not make him a Pakistani- my own family is very unsure about my religion; that does not make me anything but a Hindu.
    Yesterday, I read a lovely quote by Vivekananda- an atheist is one who does not believe in himself. There! I told myself- I have a path to salvation!
    As for Ravi’s views: he is still a 22 year old as far as Indian politics is concerned. It’s like the 40 year old American tour guides that told you that India is a land of snake-charmers, Maharajas and you will reach your hotel atop an elephant from the airport (and oh, by the way, carry your own toilet paper!).
    I read Ravi (other than to appreciate his English- I would pay to read him, if he ever wrote a book) to appreciate how far we have progressed in this country in the last 40 years.
    If we do not doubt the Indian-ness of Ram Puniyani, Zakir Naik, Kancha Illaiah, DT Rajsekhar.. all of whom say far more tendentious and plain wrong things about India, Hindu-Muslim relations, Dalit issues and frankly are counter-productive to the idea of India- why doubt that of Ravi?
    There are other, and more productive ways of cutting his ideas to shreds.

    [Reply]

    engrich Reply:

    ashish again good piece of writing.actually they hardly know anything except what is told to them in shkhas.blame game is easy cutting ideas to shred require intellegence and mind which they lack.

    meantime,

    TEL AVIV, Israel — Half a million protesters against the economic and political system – and that in a country of 7 million inhabitants.
    Jews, Arabs, foreign workers, refugees and students marched together chanting “The People demand social justice.”

    http://ocelott.tumblr.com/post/11092218487/openourminds-tel-aviv-israel-tonight-half-a

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    @Ashish

    In the middle of a conference… would reply in detail later.

    Till then let the fundoo have fun… for a few hours more…

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    If Ravi ever wrote a book, you can predict, with 100% accuracy what it would contain: graphic details of 5000 rapes in India, daily, of Dalit women and small girls. For the vicarious pleasure of his readers he may add, of Dalit men and boys too. He would even give visuals and facts and figures, names and addresses of the raped and the rapists. (these details are, of course there in Tajender’s bus-load of secret circulars)

    It is also not beyond him to write in the book that all the rapists were RSS goondas with walrus mustaches. The photos would prove the charges beyond the courts like the one Ashish is conducting.

    There will be a fictional character called Tajender urf T.urd, who, as ambassador of Pak.shitstan to India, saved the lives and honour of 3 million Bangladeshi dalit Muslims, who, as refugees in WB, were being raped and plundered by Bengali Hindus.

    [Reply]

    Ravi Reply:

    Absolutely correct.

    I will also include the following.

    1. RSS will identify an over enthusiastic individual, and develop him like a patsy. Tell him that it is his Patriotic Duty to restore the Hindu pride by rioting, destroying places of worship and killing Muslims and Christians. Then totally deny that he ever was a member of the RSS.

    2. Collecting Mobs to line-up the streets when Advani’s Rath Yatra passes through streets.

    3. Distributing inflatable trishuls, bought from a Halloween joke shop.

    4. Be always present on Blogs and telling everyone that Hinduism (About 80% of India’s population) is in mortal danger of being over taken by over-breeding Muslims.

    5. Panchon unglian brabar nahin hoteen, type of argument to oppress 200 million dalits.

    6. Sell poor people the idea that they are poor not because RSS sahukars are ******** them, because it is written in their kismet.

    7. How the Hinduatvvwadi’s never tire of telling people about 8% growth and sweeping under the carpet the fact that in this day and age 30% of ALL Child Marriages take place in the world, take place in India.

    8. How Hinduatvawadis deny the fact that almost all crimes committed against Dalits are never recorded by the police, so that their story can never be corroborated.

    9. Rape is a weapon used by oppressors to demoralise the oppressed, and it has been used against the Dalits for centuries. RSS is not excluded from this, neither are other powerful elements of the society.

    You would not understand any of this, because you a devotee of the RSS.

    [Reply]

    AshishC Reply:

    Dear Ravi,
    I know you love reading and internalising a certain type of literature. May I recommend, in case you have not already read it, a certain book called “Mother India” written by Katherine Mayo in 1927.
    Never mind that Gandhi called it a “drain inspector’s report”- in fact that is all the more reason you must read it- as so much grist to your mill.
    To quote from Wikipedia:
    Mayo pointed to the treatment of India’s women, the untouchables, the animals, the dirt and the character of its nationalistic politicians. Mayo singled out the “rampant” and fatally weakening sexuality of its males to be at the core of all problems, leading to masturbation, rape, homosexuality, prostitution and veneral diseases and, most importantly, to too early sexual intercourse and premature maternity.
    Explains everything, does it not?
    We the debauch- the weak, venal specimen of barely manhood.
    Ms Mayo would be pleased, were she still alive, to know her thoughts live on.

    Ravi Reply:

    Ashish

    Will happily read the book.

    One word of caution here. Both Wendy Doniger and Martha Nussbaum have been dismissed bu people here by glib statements. What do white people know about Hinduism. Forgetting that both are eminent professors of long and distinguised careers.

    I have their works by my side right now.

    Do you still want me to read it??

    However, in relation to my post above, I missed the point you are trying to make.

    I am aware of the generaly held theory that post independence some Political Hindus feel the need to re-assert their masculinity – it having being supressed by the Muslim and Christian rulers.

    I am fascinated by this type of analysis as well as our reaction to it.

    engrich Reply:

    another good stroke.

    samajhne wale samajh gaye

    jo na samjhe woh anadi hai.

    Ravi Reply:

    I think I am beginning to get the angle you would like me to accept.

    I GUESS what you are trying to say is:

    1. Because Katherine Mayo’s book on India is little more than an exercise in imperial propaganda. Then

    2. Other books on India written by other westerners are similarly a form of cultural imperialism – the modern day equivalent of imperial propaganda.

    If that is the case, consider your goods as remained unsold.

    I have a feeling that things are never as cut and dry as one would like them to be. Ms Mayo may be a child of her own times, and that fact alone does not even come close to explaining away the facts that she observed and recorded. Even if some of her conclusions were drafted to please her masters.

    AshishC Reply:

    Am in office on a Saturday and banging away .. too much work.. will come back to this blog when I have some time.

    engrich Reply:

    You would not understand any of this, because you a devotee of the RSS

    ravi dont blame him ,he is brain washed.good piece of writing.

    Anonymous Reply:

    You forgot the catch-all slogan, “Modi, Modi, rape, rape”

    Ravi Reply:

    No I did’nt, it will right behind Amul Baby, Sikh Riots, ISI agents and other cliches you peddle here on hourly basis

    Anonymous Reply:

    Replace-
    RSS with Islam
    Hindus with muslims
    Hindutva with Islamists

    All the points are valid for Islam too.

    engrich Reply:

    ashish ,for them hate is duty if u dont hate muslims and abuse pakistan ur credentials are in doubt

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    To know Ravi, his motivations and intentions, all you need to know is people for whom he acts as cheer-leader.
    The most vile Tajinder
    The most dirty Engrich
    The most empty Shan

    Thats all that I need to kno to appraise him.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Ravi is like pakistan…sits in the lap of Tajender (USA), and then Shan (china)…a prostitute..always needing a chest to lie on.

    [Reply]

  • Anonymous

    Shenoy
    Conversation thread of this new format is all screwy.
    I had put in some queries regarding your/Shoeb’s analysis of potential outcomes in LokSabha elections.He felt BJP alliance will obtain five more seats in Karnataka for a total of 24. What is your reading?

    [Reply]

    engrich Reply:

    gopi i feel bjp will form next goverment at centre.

    [Reply]

    engrich Reply:

    gopi nair ,any comment on this report,

    EVEN AS the Justice BK Somasekhara Commission report on the 2008 church attacks gathers dust, Christian missionaries continue to bear the brunt of violence unleashed by right-wing extremists in Karnataka. So far this year, 24 incidents have been recorded in which pastors were attacked and cases foisted on them for allegedly indulging in religious conversion.

    In a recent incident, Rev Sangappa Hosamani Shadrak, 28, a resident of Mudhol in Bagalkot district, was attacked by 20 Bajrang Dal activists on 21 August when he was conducting mass at a parishioner’s house. After the initial attack, Shadrak was forcibly taken to a nearby village where he was tied to a tree. What rankles the minorities is that the BJP government has turned a blind eye as Hindu fanatics wreak havoc against clergymen.

    The government’s apathy can be gauged from the fact that it is yet to discuss the Somasekhara Commission report — which was submitted in January — even though rules stipulate that it should act within six months. The report hasn’t been discussed in the Assembly either.

    Replying to TEHELKA’s queries, government officials blamed bureaucracy for the delay. “There were issues with the report because a large section of the minorities had opposed it,” says NM Jamdar, principal secretary (home). “The report was sent to the law department for reexamination. We cannot say when action will be taken.”

    The communal conflict that engulfed Karnataka in August-September 2008 saw 55 attacks on churches and Christians in different parts of the state such as Davangere, Udupi, Mangalore, Chikmagalur, Shimoga, Kolar, Kodagu and Bengaluru. Justifying the attacks, then Bajrang Dal state convenor Mahendra Kumar had said it was “a last-ditch attempt to stop forcible conversions”.

    When civil society raised a hue and cry, the BS Yeddyurappa regime did what governments usually do to stall — it ordered a commission to probe the attacks and identify those responsible for the violence. After spending 28 months and Rs 3 crore, holding 300 sittings and examining 800 evidences, the commission submitted its report.

    “There is nothing substantive in the report to nail the accused,” claims lawyer Byatha N Jagadeesha, who represented the Christian community before the commission. “The commission has betrayed its mandate. It gave a clean chit to the Sangh Parivar by concluding that neither the Bajrang Dal nor the Hindu Jagran Vedike are part of the parivar.”

    According to the report, “there is no basis to the apprehension of the Christian petitioners that politicians, Sangh Parivar, BJP and the state government are involved in the attacks, either directly or indirectly”. In fact, the most striking observation of the commission was that “no real Hindus are behind the church attacks”.

    “In its interim report, the commission held the state government responsible for the attacks. But it made a U-turn in its final report,” alleges PB D’sa, state president, People’s Union for Civil Liberties. “On one hand, the government has withdrawn 76 cases filed against Bajrang Dal activists. On the other, 338 cases filed against Christians for peacefully protesting against the attacks haven’t been withdrawn.”

    Justice Somasekhara was non-committal when asked about the next step. “Once we submit the report, our relationship with the government is over. I have no idea about the report’s fate,” he says.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    In fact, the most striking observation of the commission was that “no real Hindus are behind the church attacks”.

    ———–

    How very true? Hindutvawadis (read RSS/BJP/VHP/BD/Rame Sene/HJV/etc./etc.) are anything but Hindus (forget the real part).

    [Reply]

    engrich Reply:

    general indians are most peacefull people.hindutwavadi are criminals and notorious.

    Anonymous Reply:

    Gopi,

    I agree with Shoeb. Going by the current showing, the BJP has no challenge. Sadanand Gowda is doing OK, taking shaky steps, trying to come out of Yeddy’s shadow, etc. The opposition in Karnataka is emasculated, with all over-the-hump leaders not knowing whether they should oppose Gowda or allow him some time. Shoeb may have put his finger on the pulse of Karnataka.

    [Reply]

  • Anonymous

    THREE APPLES HAVE CHANGED THE WORLD:
    ADAM’S, NEWTON’S AND STEEVE JOBS’.
    (TOI)

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    @ Shenoy

    My three apples were Zeenat Aman ( my first harmonal strirrings)
    Goldie hawn in my school days
    Sushmita Sen… now and then….

    [Reply]

  • Anonymous

    Advani’s Rathyatra : 14 special aircraft and six helicopters

    The name rath yatra may give you the impression that L K Advani is going to undertake an all-land march, until you learn about the list of flights the Bharatiya Janata Party veteran would use as part of his nation-wide trip. He will be using 14 special aircraft and six helicopters for his Rath yatra !!!

    [Reply]

    engrich Reply:

    good.yatr at the cost of indian poors.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Ab kyaa karen! One needs these props for “high flying” nauTanki.

    or is it a convenient way to dodge uncomfortable questions about corruption in BJP ruled states, no Lokayukta in Gujarat for 8 long years, etc.?

    [Reply]

  • Ravi

    Ashish

    Katerine Mayo observations and Today’s India

    In 1927 Katherine Mayo put significant emphasise on the practice of CHILD MARRIAGE in India and summarily condemned it.

    It appears that my mention of this subject has caused Ashish to suggest that her ideas (condemnation without understanding) are still alive and are being re-presented by me.

    Just to correct that erroneous perception and to put Ashish right:

    My renewed interest in the subject was inspired by an article written – in support of a TV programme – by Nel Hedayat.

    NOT IN 1927, BUT IN 2011.

    Here are some extracts from her article and a link.

    Some 10 million girls a year are married off before the age of 18 across the world, according to a Unicef report released this year.

    Some 40% of the world’s child marriages take place in India. In the northern state of Rajasthan I witnessed the wedding of two sisters who were about six and 11 years old.

    Child marriages are illegal in India, and are punishable with a fine of Rs100,000 (£1,300) and two years in prison for anyone who performs, conducts or negligently fails to prevent a child marriage. But this didn’t seem to bother any of the guests who danced merrily or the priest who solemnly chanted the wedding rites.

    • There are 10 million child marriages a year worldwide

    • There are at least 50 million married child couples around the world and this will double by the end of the decade

    • The top three countries with the highest proportion of child brides are Niger, Chad and Mali

    • Bangladesh is fourth and India is 13th in the world table of child marriage statistics by proportion

    • An estimated 14 million adolescents between 15 and 19 give birth each year. Girls in this age group are twice as likely to die during pregnancy or childbirth as women in their 20s

    What ever one may think about Kathrine Mayo, the issue is still alive in India, perhaps not in baithaks where Teachers freely flows over the rocks.

    Katherine Mayo may have had an imperial axe to grind, I am not so sure about Nel Hedayat.

    Lets see who dismisses this article as anti India propaganda carried by some one who is:

    1. A Muslim woman
    2. A JNU type film maker.
    3. Some one selling her country, for a grant, or a place in US University.
    4. Etc Etc.

    …. http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-15082550…..

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    You should worry about 5000 daily rapes of dalit women and children.
    India stands at no.13 in the list of highest no.of child marriages.
    You have not said where your country, Paks.hitstan stands in the list.

    [Reply]

    Ravi Reply:

    Rest assured I am worried about the 500000000000000000 rapes of Dalit women.

    Because under pressure from the likes of Y O U, the crime of raping a Dalit woman is not always recorded. But you would not acknowledge that ever, will you. Because you are thick as pig shit.

    As you know only earlier this week scores of people in Tamilnadu were convicted of systematic Daly rapes.

    “All our homes were destroyed. They killed our animals for food and dumped the leftovers in our wells. As a result all the water was contaminated.”

    Some of them were Policeman.

    You bet I worry.

    Don’t you.

    My country is at number 13.

    India abuse: Scores guilty of Dalit rape and torture

    …http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-south-asia-15106778…

    __________________

    Here is some more….

    Discrimination against Dalits

    Crime against Dalits occur every 20 minutes in India. Every day 3 Dalit women are raped, 2 Dalits are murdered and 2 Dalit houses are burnt down! These figures represent only a fraction of actual incidents since many Dalits do not register cases for fear of retaliation by the police and upper-caste Hindu individuals. Official figures show that there are still 0.343 million manual scavengers in India from Dalit community. More than 165 million Dalits in India are simply abused by their Hindu upper castes for their birth! . [HRW Report2007]

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    You must be in shock and grief!
    your oft-trumpeted figure of 5000 dalit rapes a day has dramatically dropped to a mere 5!!!!!!

    Now start worrying about your own Paks.hitstan, you Islamic jihadi fundoo!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

    Ravi Reply:

    But not nearly half as oft as you have repeted them

    You have always ignored the point that almost all of crimes against Dalit’s are not recorded, so 5000 can easily be 50 000.

    You are a cretin, a Hindu Fundo

  • Anonymous

    In Islamic country it is valid for a men to take 6 year old wife following the tradition set by Mohammad. The men can be 60 years plus and they can enjoy sex by various means. It has been described in detail (Sunnat).

    http://answering-islam.org/Silas/childbrides.htm

    [Reply]

  • Anonymous

    WIth Digvijay, Bukhari and Thackray on one side opposing Anna, I am convinced that Anna is on right path.

    [Reply]

  • Anonymous

    Caution : Do not respond to the anti-India ( hich for them is synonomous ith anti-Hindu ) propoganda by vile engrich and Ravi.
    As you alk the street you may see lot of trash. Its not necesary for you to engage it.
    If you want to play there game, you may have to use the same tactics of looking for all vile anti-Muslim, anti-Sikh material on the net and post it here ?
    Are you ready to stoop to the gutter level where dirty dogs like engrich , Ravi and communal Jinnah-Pakistan communal dogs live ?
    If so engage them.

    [Reply]

    engrich Reply:

    son of a ***** ur mother is my *****

    [Reply]

  • Anonymous

    The Islamic countries rejected “Universal Declaration of Human Rights (UDHR)” and came up with their own Islamic human right in accordance with Sharia. The human rights of non-muslims under sharia are that of a slave.
    When muslims themselves have rejected universal definition of human right, how can they take refuge under same human rights in case of Gujarat and other cases.

    Here is Islamic definition of Human rights (Cairo Declaration on Human Rights in Islam)-

    “The CDHRI does not discuss freedom of religion, assembly, association or the requirement of free consent to marriage, the right to a fair trial, prisoners’ rights, minority rights, the right to a nationality, suffrage, social security, trade unions, strikes or participation in cultural life.[1] The Cairo Declaration also includes several crucial limitations, including all rights being bound by Islamic law; it allows the right to take a life, inflict bodily harm, that the education of children be in accordance with sharia, that there are rights that can be claimed from children or kin, restriction on freedom of movement and the ability to deny refugees protection whenever permitted by sharia.[1]”

    “Article 24 of the declaration states: “All the rights and freedoms stipulated in this Declaration are subject to the Islamic Sharia.” Article 19 also says: “There shall be no crime or punishment except as provided for in the Sharia.”[6]”

    The CDHRI has been criticised for failing to guarantee freedom of religion as a “fundamental and nonderogable right”.

    [Reply]

  • Anonymous

    All

    Pakistan has charged the doctor (Afrid?? who assisted the Americans in confirming the identity of bin Laden) with TREASON.

    That is Paksitanis and Pakistani system for all to see! The guy does a humanitarian service of assisting to capture the number one terrorist, and he is considered a traitor!

    What fru….. chance then the minorities – Hindus, christians, ahmadiyas, shias etc have if the govt is willing to go this extreme to “defend” a terrorist! Not just any terrorist, but bin Laden!

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    On one hand pakistan called Osama terrorist an enemy of humanity to please world community, on other hand it is punishing an honest person for exposing Osama’s presence in pakistan.

    It looks like focus of all these investigation is to find out how did US come to know that pak was hosting Osama, not on who allowed Osama to stay in pakistan.

    It is pretty obvious that Pakistan was making a fool of US all these years and was keeping Osama safe from American wild goose chase in NWFP.

    Why did pakistan do this? The answer lies in the holy book…

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Gopi

    That is the real face of the Pakistani establishment and perhaps also of the section of its population.

    This is also a warning to others, who may be “foolish” enough decide to become whistle-blowers in name of humanity.

    [Reply]

    engrich Reply:

    mohan jee i think indian army will act in same manner if indian army officer pass on secrets to foriegn forces.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    We have two Pakistani whistle blowers here, fake Ravi and Gingrich, but they blow their whistle from the other end.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Gopi,

    Jinnah, the father of Pak.shitstan was there only for a few months. For a long time after his death, the country, led up the garden path of a hate-Hindu programme, were feeling the absence of a fountainhead. Zia appeared at the right time and then on Pakistan never looked back while marching on the self-destructing path, with the twin objectives of destroy India and destroy self with terror. Then, with his “timely” demise, they were again left without a father figure.

    Therefore, with the advent of Osama, Pakistan finally found the real fountainhead of terror and they took him as their own father. Therefore, whoever is found to have helped in the killing of this father figure, will now be dealt with in the true spirit of the terror, which Osama helped Pakshitstan to perfect.

    You can now hear fake Ravi and gangrene gingrich gloating at this punishment to the doctor who is a traitor to their cause.

    [Reply]

    Ravi Reply:

    Keep imagining, because you have nothing better to say, other than state and oft repeat the blindingly obvious.

    [Reply]

    engrich Reply:

    gopi if army doctor contact americans and deal directly with anybody bypassing chain of commands.i think indian army will prosecute him as well.like in the case of purohit.

    pls awnser

    [Reply]

    engrich Reply:

    i am waiting ur awnser on karnataka minority commission report.

    [Reply]

  • Anonymous

    This is great example of decaying hindu spirituality-

    http://khabar.ibnlive.in.com/news/60781/3/20
    देवी के गले से सोने की चेनें चुरा ले गए बाप-बेटी
    वार्ताPosted on Oct 07, 2011 at 06:08pm IST | Updated Oct 07, 2011 at 06:14pm IST

    चेन्नई। तमिलनाडु की राजधानी चेन्नई के उपनगर पल्लावरम स्थित देवी पेरियापलायातन्नम मंदिर में दर्शन करने पहुंचे पिता-पुत्री ने पुजारी को झांसा देकर देवी के गले से सोने की दस चेनों पर हाथ साफ कर दिया।
    पुलिस सूत्रों ने बताया कि आधुनिक कपड़े पहने 16 वर्षीय लड़की 55 वर्षीय एक व्यक्ति के साथ चमचमाती कार से मंदिर पहुंची और पुजारी को 500 का करारा नोट देकर आरती के लिए कहा। इस पर खुश पुजारी सेंथामाराई (70) उन्हें मंदिर प्रांगण में भीतर ले गया। उस व्यक्ति ने पुजारी से कहा कि वह उनकी पुत्री के लिए विशेष पूजा अर्चना कर दे।
    मंदिर में भीड़ होने के कारण पुजारी ने उन्हें पूजा के लिए अगले सप्ताह आने के लिए कहा। इस पर पिता-पुत्री वहां से चले गए। पुजारी ने उनके जाने के बाद पाया कि देवी की मूर्ति से सोने की दस चेनें गायब हैं। उसने फौरन इसकी सूचना पुलिस को दी। पुलिस ने जांच शुरू कर दी है।

    [Reply]

  • Anonymous

    This blog is not about Hinduism, Islam or Sikh extrimism.
    The Jinnah-communal-dogs from Ravi to Engrich, would want to debase this blog and reduce it to there levels.
    So just as engagenmgement has never worked with Pakistan ( because its a wilfully criminal entity ) , similarly engagement wont work with wilfully vile pro-pak or anti-India elements here.
    Just isolate them. Thats the only approach that can mimimize the damage they would do to the blog.

    However if you want to be a Kuldip Nayar or DigVijay Singh , its your choice.

    [Reply]

  • Anonymous

    This blog is not about religion. This is about Indo-Pak relations and geo-political issues.
    If you want to discuss religion please go to some blog titled
    http://www.most_discredited_and_scorned_religion.com
    If you can’t find the link, make one !

    Meanwhile, this is what Karzai had to say today about Taleban and Pakistan ( the communal entity founded by its mass-murderer Jinnah )

    “Definitely, the Taliban will not be able to move a finger without Pakistani support,” he said,

    http://tribune.com.pk/story/268856/taliban-will-not-be-able-to-move-a-finger-without-pakistani-support/

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    a modern day Ravan vadha

    [Reply]

  • Anonymous

    Guys WHY DO WE NEED TO DISCUSS PAKISTAN, there is plenty to discuss about INDIA. First the good news , The TABLET made in India is going to be sold for 1500Rs to students. THIS IS SOME ACHEIVEMENT,
    next the bad news, 1 in 2 children in INDIA is malnourished.
    As for Ravi’s constant reminder about child marriage , I WAS QUITE IMPRESSED , India is 13th.As for PAKISTAN read this
    They discovered they’d been promised in marriage to their enemies when they were children, a practice in Pakistan known as vani.

    “When we grew up we came to know that a great injustice had been done to us,” says Abda Khan, now 18.

    “Vani is equal to a murder. If we were to marry those boys, it would be the same as killing us.”

    Vani is a tribal custom in which blood feuds are settled with forced marriages.

    The bride spends her life paying for the crime of her male relatives.
    Also NO DENYING CHILD MARRIAGE IS A PROBLEM IN INDIA which govt is trying to address
    Quote: According to “National Plan of Action for Children 2005″ (published by the Department of Women and Child Development of India), a goal has been set to eliminate child marriage completely by 2010. This plan is proving to be successful,
    though it is still difficult to monitor every child due to the sheer population of India.[17]
    60% of Indian population is still involved in agriculture , yet AGRICULTURE contributes 14% of GDP. This anomaly needs to be addressed.
    Start with REVOLUTION IN FARMING. This would mean INDUSTRIAL SCALE FARMING , with all plot holders giving up land to a corporation/co-operative in lieu of a share in the company. AGRO SCIENTIST , SOIL SCIENTIST dictating the FARMING PRACTICE.
    COMPULSORY LAW ENFORCED EDUCATION FOR ALL TILL AGE 16
    We need all the TOP BRAINS like Nilekani, Pai, Azim premji etc and not the OLD FARTS of the planning commission.
    It will take napeolinic effort , BUT IT IS WORTH THE EFFORT..
    massive scope for PIG FARMING, poultry farming to be expanded, and to some extent dairy farming.
    AGRICULTURE as seen by me in UK is light years ahead of India.
    However , just to disseminate this knowledge.Potato is GROWN IN BAGS , SO IS TOMATO, AND herbs in POTS and sold atraight to supermarket.AND I HAVE SEEN MYSELF FISH FARM IN WALES JUST A TANK.
    Also enclosure made around the sea shore and fish cultivated.
    Chillies are sold in supermarket as a plant on the pot with chillies sticking out. this can be done like a cottage industry , dont need open fields.
    FOR HIGH TECH visit http://www.thanetearth.com , some 30miles from where I live

    [Reply]

    Ravi Reply:

    The reason why they are Pakistan fixated is because they are islamophobe Hindu Fundos.

    The reason they do not want to talk about India (poor India) is because they are Hindu Fundos.

    [Reply]

    engrich Reply:

    there is another good news which i read recently about UP is that the girl population is increasing.but still they are less than boys

    [Reply]

  • http://dealstop.co.uk Larry

    ==============================================================
    ~~~BREAKING NEWS – VINOD SHARMA DISCUSSED ON FACEBOOK~~~
    ==============================================================

    I have recently discovered a slightly recent discussion that someone started on The Newshour’s Facebook Fan page (The Newshour is Times Now flagship debate program hosted by Arnab Goswami).

    This is how it starts:

    DONT CALL VINOD SHARMA ON THE NEWSHOUR

    Nitish Bhardwaj
    lately i have been seeing too much of Vinod Sharma( political editor hindustan times) on your show THE NEWSHOUR…he seems too much biased and he should better introduce himself as journalist who is close to “congress”…as Swapan Dasgupta does..Vinod sharma seems like an unofficial spokesman of the congress…..in this era of scams where congress is undisputed leader vinod is trying to seek legitimacy for congress…may be a rajya sabha seat be his intent…..but with his illogical bytes he is making no one fool……so better not call him on your show….

    There are a total of 87 replies on that thread. Make sure you check it out

    facebook.com/topic.php?uid=250933355730&topic=16762

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Vinod Sharma , as far as I can understand, is a Congress spokes-person of the Sonia-DigVijay-AmarSingh faction. I think in his free time, he also sometimes works at HT.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Vinod Sharma is Chandan Mitra of Congress minus Rajya Sabha seat plus useless position in National minority commission.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Rajeev,

    there is a competitive TV journalism between Vinod Sharma and Kumar Ketkar. It is difficult to say who is more pro-congress. Between the two, I feel Vinod Sharma deserves the Rajyasabha seat more, for rendering service to the party and government of Sonia Gandhi rather selflessly (?)
    In the NCM he has not taken any salary. And if given a chance to serve the party in the R

    Anonymous Reply:

    And if given a chance to serve the party in the Rajyasabha, he would certainly continue to serve the interests of the party and its government to the best of his ability.

    The country would also gain, because I am sure, unlike Chandan Gupta, he may not take any salary.

    He may also ask to be given an ols Ambassador car to drive him home. He may also pay the driver from his own pocket.

    Anonymous Reply:

    I know of Chandan Mitra and Kanchan Gupta. Yeh Chandan Gupta kaun hai?

    Am I going to hear words like “inadvertently” in defence? It was used once earlier.

    Anonymous Reply:

    Now it is insulting to compare Vinod Sharma with Kumar Ketkar. For all our differences, I consider Vinod SHarma far more sophisticated whereas Kumar Ketkar is pure Ghati variety…The way he looses his cool while defending congress can shame even Vinod Sharma…Kumar Ketkar lacks class.

    Anonymous Reply:

    If one supports Congress and others, he/she becomes a villain.
    If one supports RSS/BJP, he/she is a hero.

    Ab kyaa karen! Double standards kaa sawaal hai.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Double standards kaa sawaal hai.
    2G aur 3G ka bawaal hai
    inka corruption bemisaal hai
    yeh chal raha salon-saal hai
    Imandaari inke liye halaahal hai
    Desh ka haal behaal hai

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Now you must be surely waiting for “taalis”, “waah, waahs” and pronouncements like “mazaa aa gayaa” from your fair-weather fans and chelaas here, who seem to reveal in CTs.

    Their time starts now.

    Anonymous Reply:

    Manohar,

    you must know for every taali or ‘wah, wah, there are ten silent appreciations. Same goes for brickbats, getting which, you come at number 3 after fake Ravi and gangrene Gingrich.

    Anonymous Reply:

    Pity. That is what you need from your well-wishers. Your mindset is such that it would never occur to you that there could 10+ silent jeers / gibes.

    By talking about only about appreciations, you have proved my point – double standards – one for you and your side (all goody goody) and one for the others (all evil evil). Now one would wonder on whose side are you are – time and again confirming what others are saying.

    About rankings – you can keep that rankings to yourself. Keep all those rankings and certificates for your side and those who may hanker after them. I do not give a damn of what you think of me, nor your ranking.

    Anonymous Reply:

    I know of Ravi and Engrich on this blog.

    Yeh Gingrich kaun hai?

    Are you referring to the former Speaker of the US House of Representatives, Newt Gingrich, by any chance or it is that ” inadvertently” business?

    Pankaj#1 Reply:

    Tum ne pukara aur hum chale aaye.
    Shenoy sahab;
    Tusi sahi main great ho.

    Anonymous Reply:

    Shenoy Saab

    As usual a good one

  • Anonymous

    ————————————————————
    Killer Qadri, Killer Ilm-ud-din, blasphemy and Jinnah
    ————————————————————

    Today there have been violent demeonstrations in Pakistan , in support of Qadri.
    http://tribune.com.pk/story/268901/enraged-protestors-demand-release-of-mumtaz-qadri/#comments

    Mr Qadri, the body guard of Pak Punjab governor, gunned down Pak Punjab governor Mr Salmaan Taseer.

    However, people who mock and criticize the violent communal Pakistani protestors forget that
    communal Jinnah did something very similar in 1929.

    On 6th Sep 1929, a Muslim fanatic, by the name Ilm-Ud-din, murdered in broad day light a Hindu publisher in Lahore by the name
    of Raj Pal, alleging that he had committed ‘blasphemy’.
    The British courts handed down death sentence to the fanatic
    ( fanatic – who must be just like the jinnah’s communal dogs, Ravi, Engrich here ) .

    Now Who appered in defense of that fanatic in courts , pleading for mercy ?
    It was none other than Muhammad Ali Jinnah, the same butcher who planned the cold blooded murders of direct action day and
    showed no mercy to the tens of thousands his Muslim league goons killed.

    Pakistan and its apologists are not vile by accident.
    Pakistan today is not the vilest entity by accident.

    Those who criticize killer Qadri or criticize those defending him forget that Qadri, Taleban are rightful heirs of the communal ,mass-murderer Jinnah

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Not only was Muhammad Ali Jinnah the defender of Killer Qadri Mumtaz of 1929 ( also known as Ilm-Ud-din ) , he was joined in it by none other than anathor apologist for the murderer Ilm-Ud-Din, Mr Allama-Iqbal himself !!!

    The following is quoted from wikipedia

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ilm-ud-din

    Muslims from the whole city and millions from adjoining areas attended his funeral. Ilmuddin’s father requested Allama Muhammad Iqbal to lead the funeral prayer. Dr. Allama Iqbal replied, “I am a sinful person not competent to do this job to lead the funeral of such a great warrior and referred Syed Deedar Ali Shah the founder of Hizb Ul Ahnaf Lahore for the Namaz e Janaza and Burial.”[citation needed] The Janazah Prayer was then led by the Imam of the Mosque Wazeer Khan, Imam Muhammed Shams-ud-deen, Syed Deedar Ali Shah because of the crowd Namaz e Janaza had to be offered three times, Allama Iqbal, Syed Deedar Ali Shah along with many notable Scholars Drove Ghazi Ilm Ud Din Shaheed into His Grave. It was among the largest funeral processions seen by Lahore.[citation needed] He was buried at the Grave yard of Miani Sahib Bahawalpur Road Lahore, Pakistan. A mosque is also built in Mianwali Jail, Mianwali Pakistan called Ghazi Ilmuddin Shaheed Mosque to offer him tribute.[citation

    So how are fanatics and lawyers in Pak , protesting the death sentence to blasphemy killer Qadri, different from the defenders, Jinnah and IQBAL of anathor blasphemy killer Ilm-Ud-Duin ?

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Death for the Judge ?

    The judge who sentenced former Punjab Governor Salmaan Taseer’s assassin, Malik Mumtaz Hussain Qadri, to death has been forced to go on leave after threats, banners and slogans at rallies proclaiming him a non-Muslim and an Ahmadi.

    http://tribune.com.pk/story/268509/incitement-goes-unchecked-as-hatred-is-spewed-at-rallies/

    ( Bye the way, I dont need to quote a rabid mullah from Sialkot or a fake pamphlet of RSS. I can just quote Jinnah, Iqbal or the constitution of Pakistan to make my point about the character of Pakistan )

    [Reply]

    engrich Reply:

    what u will say about fake judgement on ayodhya by 3 judge high court judges.they did after threats from hinu fascist.this judge was brave enough to issue right judgement.

    in same circumstances dara singh was given life imprisionment.justice sabarwal has written in his judgement that capital punishment to afzal guru is on public demand.3-bench high court has rejected cbi claim.

    rss pamphlet is right.they are doing everything which is instructed in that pamphlet.
    u are propaganist and liar.jinnah was not communal,britishers wanted to divide power between dalits muslims and hindu.ghandhi nehru nexus ate evrything.
    division of india was against interest of indian muslims.jinnah was true nationalist.godless hindu zoinists were the secret instigators of voilence.

    engrich Reply:

    BJP on Friday pegged Goa mining scam at Rs 25,000 crore, and claimed that the profits of the scam were being routed through companies in tax haven countries like Mauritius and Cayman Islands.

    BJP national secretary Kirit Somaiya alleged at a press conference in Panaji on Friday that “this is the biggest illegal mining scam in India, running into Rs 25,000 crore in the period of just two years”.

    He also alleged that senior members of the government were involved in the scam.

    “Like the 2G scam, the scam money is being routed through companies set up in tax havens like Mauritius and Cayman islands,” Somaiya said.

    He said the party would be handing over evidence related to the scam to Chief Vigilance Commissioner, and Comptroller and Auditor General of India (CAG).

    “We will also file a case with CBI in Goa,” Somaiya added.

    He also demanded that a special investigation team — to be monitored by a High Court judge — be formed within fifteen days to probe the scam.

    Goa Assembly’s Public Accounts Committee (PAC), which has extensively investigated the illegal mining trade in the state, has pegged the scam at Rs 4,000 crore. It was headed by BJP leader Manohar Parrikar.

    [Reply]

    engrich Reply:

    nationalist deed of of deshbakhts.

    engrich Reply:

    rampal deserved what he got on the instruction of britishers he was publicily abusing prophet mohammed.if i publicily abise ur holy figure u will do the same to me.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    I think this guy Rajiiivst , beats HITLER , KLU KLUX KLAN , and osama bin laden hands down. His hatred towards pakistan is more virulent than hitler’s hatred towards jews, and more persistant than klu klux klan ’s hatred towards blacks, and more focussed than bin laden was ever towards america

    [Reply]

    Ravi Reply:

    I am glad that you recognised that.

    [Reply]

  • engrich

    छत्तीसगढ़ की राजधानी रायपुर के बूढ़ातालाब में प्रतिवर्ष सिर्फ गणेशोत्सव में विसर्जन के अवसर पर हजारों किलोग्राम मिट्टी , ऑइल पेंट , केरोसिन तेल , तारपीन तेल , प्लास्टिक , पॉलिथिन , लकड़ी , प्लास्टर ऑफ पेरिस और बांस डाला जाता है। इसके अलावा सिंदूर , अभ्रक , धागे , कपड़े , सिक्के , तेल और अन्य खराब पदार्थ भी तालाब में डाले जाते हैं। बूढ़ातालाब में विसर्जित की जाने वाली सामग्री का आकलन जब हमने किया तो अचंभित रह गए। मूर्तिकारों व सजावटकर्ताओं से चर्चा में पता चला कि शहर में करीब दस हजार मूर्तियां स्थापित की जाती हैं , जो एक किलोग्राम से पांच सौ किलोग्राम तथा इससे भी अधिक की होती हैं। इनमें करीब 24 हजार किलो मिट्टी तथा प्लास्टर ऑफ पेरिस , ढाई हजार लीटर ऑयल पेंट तथा एक हजार लीटर तारपीन तेल व मिट्टी तेल प्रयोग किया जाता है। इसके साथ ही हजारों किलो पुआल , लकड़ी , बांस , रस्सियां , कांच , पॉलीथिन , प्लास्टिक और थर्मोकोल भी पानी में विसर्जित होते हैं। इससे तालाब का पानी एकदम प्रदूषित हो जाता है।

    हमारे यहां तालाबों की बहुलता रही है जिससे यहां का भूजल स्तर भी काफी अच्छा रहा है। लेकिन पिछले कुछ दशकों में तालाबों की संख्या में न केवल आश्चर्यजनक रूप से कमी आई है बल्कि वे उथले और प्रदूषित भी होते जा रहे है। विकास तथा शहरीकरण के दौर में अनेक बड़े – बड़े तालाब पाट कर कॉम्प्लेक्स बनाने , तालाब की भूमि पर अतिक्रमण करने के कारण काफी तालाब अदृश्य हो चुके हैं , वहीं कुछ सामाजिक परंपराओं के गलत अनुसरण के कारण भी तालाब प्रदूषित होते तथा पटते जा रहे है। कुछ तालाब जलकुंभी फैलने और आसपास की फैक्ट्रियों से खतरनाक रसायनों के प्रवाह के कारण बीमार हो रहे है।

    [Reply]

    engrich Reply:

    gopi i want ur opinion on above.brhmnst is destroying india from every possible way.
    anything they touch become mud.

    [Reply]

  • Anonymous
  • Anonymous

    Ajay,

    I have merely reproduced a good quote from Times of India, which in turn has sourced it to an internet chain message.

    However, I too am racking my brain for something equally quotable.

    [Reply]

  • Anonymous

    Mohan,

    you had asked a question , “Is Tajmahal collapsing ?

    Here is something for you to chew on:

    We know that Taj Mahal is a symbol of Love but not the lesser known facts:
    1.Mumtaj was Shajahan’s 4th wife out of his 7 wives
    2.Shahajan killed Mumtaj’s husband to marry her.
    3.Mumtaj died during her 14th delivery
    4. After Mumtaj’s death he married her sister
    So where the hell was love?

    [Reply]

    engrich Reply:

    bullshit.everybody knows these facts.hindu/sikh kings used to have far more no.of wife.this was usual those days.

    [Reply]

  • Anonymous

    =======================================================================
    ~~ While Vijay Kumar was Away, jehadi trolls and internet fundoos had a field day!!~~
    =======================================================================

    I am at a conference, but just glanced at the blog and realised

    That OUT OF THE LAST 100 POSTINGS, T U R D ENGRICH AND HIS ISI FUNDOO LOVER Rav have posted 62.

    They may think this is wisdom and they are doing the task assigned to them by ISI, but they have ended up making the blog boring. For example if I want to read Rajiv or Pankaj, I have to wade thru ten of engrich’s nonsensical typed t u r d s and Ravi’s RSS rape rape cries.

    How sick and boring.

    Binoy and Dr Mishra had to leave the blog becasue of this dirt.

    It is sad that person like Ravi has been reduced from Shan’s kuttar to Engrich’s and Tajendar’s Kuttar and behnoi

    @ Ashish

    yes I read ur post. I appreciate what ur saying. That let sleeping T UR DS and Jehadi Dogs sleep. But remember what is happening to this blog now.

    A joint attack by Jinnah and LeT.

    Ravi giving it a sophiticated veneer like Jinnah and Omar Khalid Sheikh. While Engrich and Tajendar attack like the scum LeT…

    Anyway, got to deliver a small lecture now…

    have fun !

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Vijay Kumar,

    Fake Ravi has exposed himself as the biggest liar visiting this blog from the Paks.hitstani side. For months he has bombarded this blog with the falsehood of 5000 rapes of dalit women and children daily. Now he says the figure is 3 dalits raped and two killed!!!!!!!!

    I am afraid, he may run away from this blog out of sheer shamelessness and hide his head in shame under Gingrich’s petticoat.

    [Reply]

    Ravi Reply:

    You have been peddling false RSS propoganda for much longer than that.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    @ Shenoy

    Ek shair suno

    Engrich ke petticoat mein se
    Ravi aur T U R D Tajendar ki aayi aawaz
    Mohabbat zindabad… Mohabbat zindabad !!

    ———————————

    [Reply]

    Pankaj#1 Reply:

    Vijay;
    Being younger person you catch the essence and say in more forthright way than me, asI am from the time when, political correctness was very essential.

    Anonymous Reply:

    Yes, this blog is getting spoilt in content with repeated evocation of RSS and atrocities by Hindus, in amechanical repitative manner to overshadow all other content..

    Since the primary blog was about India and Pakistan and the subject under discussion is is about politics of distrust, I think it is a shame that the atmosphere is gerting vitiated by Engrich’s postings which are taking so much physical space.

    Ravi, seemed to be an educated person. Ravi, if you go through your own blogging wont you feel bad that you have converted this place into a battlefield to score brownie points? Even if you feel provoked, I think you should desist from obscenity and personal attack as it came out from your attempt at poetry.

    At the end of the day, we are all here to enjoy the richness of writing and wit. In case the wall gets so spoilt that you have to keep scrolling to get meaningful content, then it is sad for all of us.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Vinoo,

    you are 100% right. We all can make this blog interesting and the debate lively. But, there is a bad side to it too. This Gingrich fellow, who was earlier Ram Autar, became Tajender and now he is Gingrich. He was driven away from this blog totally discredited and discarded, by none other than Vinod Sharma himself. But now he is back to muddy the atmosphere here, with able and sustained support fromRavi and Manohar.

    If you recall the Mahabharata war, however bad and evil the Kauravas were, still the Pndavas had to fight the war with them on equal terms; meaning they have to descend to the level of the evil for good to triumph.

    [Reply]

    Ravi Reply:

    Vinoo

    Let me first acknowledge the truthfulness of your observation, but this is what I would like to offer in my defence.

    1. RSS – The arguments presented here roughly divide themselves into TWO board categories. Liberal and Conservative. For conservative, here read Hinduatva POV and almost rabidly islamophobic. That is the reason why the RSS invariably and unavoidably creeps into the discussions.

    2. Brownie Points - I hope you would agree with me that there are people here who prefer to attack other people rather than counter the points being made. This is lazy form of blogging, why display your intellectual bankruptcy, by countering the points being made, when you can attack the person. Their hope is, by attacking the person they will succeed in drawing other people’s attention away from the point being made.

    3. Obscenity- I am not the only one who is obscene here. I consider obscenities written by Shan and I as retaliatory. There are others who also use obscenities, I DO NOTE THAT YOU DID NOT MENTION THEM. I can, but will not accuse you of making a partisan judgement.

    4. Poetry- I believe that poetry gives me an opportunity at coining creative phrases, which I hope give some people pleasure, who are able to respond to this form of expression. Two examples I would pin point here are:

    एक को नज़र आने लगी दूसरे की नानी

    जैसे बहता है मीना कुमारी की आँखों से पानी

    This poem did not include in it any phrase that one could even vaguely describe it as obscene.

    When all is said and done, Vinoo I respect your opinion, even when it is chastising me.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Ravi

    I think you are falling into a trap when you keep invoking the RSS even when it not needed or related to the subject.

    1) Most people may not share your views on the RSS which they find as an old fashioned organisation which comes to prominence during flood relief or to which Hindus turn too when they feel cornered. By continously invoking it, and creating a paronia about it, only bores other participants on this blog.

    2) The RSS has nopthing to do with the current subject matter of the blog. SO why drag it here?

    3) By dragging in RSS inot subjects which are more subtle, the debate gets hijacked by fight between you and people who have a favourable opinion of the RSS

    4) I think you are capable of better blogging than the current pieces filed by you. Why dont you broaden your horizon by seeing that the larger danger to the world is currently because of the terror and terror plans of Pakistan in league with current global forces of jihad which were at one time fed by the US.

    By getting the RSS into this, you end up NOT seeing the big picture.

    It is like a school student who runs away from a big bully and then instead fights with his grandpop at home…

    Ravi Reply:

    Vinoo

    I disagree with you on almost every single point.

    In the interest of other blogers entertainment. For now I will leave it at that.

    I believe that the RSS is the big picture.

    Anonymous Reply:

    @ Ravi

    Sorry, if I hurt you, which was not my intention.

    I was talking in the interest of improving your blogging and making the area more harmonious.

    For this you have to see the big picture. From the bombings on the London tube to 9/11 to 26/11. and to the numerous terror ttacks all over the world, it is NOT RSS.

    It is the terror of Pakistan.

    That is the big picture.

    Pankaj#1 Reply:

    Vinoo;
    i find it particularly intriguing that in the presence of pakistani danger, which is recognized by world and any dispassionate observer, some people are doing every effort to point towards RSS, without any real evidence. We can call them propagandaists or some thing worse.

    Ravi Reply:

    Vinoo

    Pakistani terror is there for all to see.

    The fact that Pakistan is India’s enemy, and a terrorist state is neither news nor it is anything more than a detail in the big picture.

    What you call a big picture is little more than your own perspective.

    THE BIG PICTURE, is the growth of Religious Extremism and the terror it fuels.

    In that respect, Pakistan as well as the RSS use Religion as a mere weapon to pursue their right wing political agenda.

    That is big picture.

    Blaming everything on Pakistan terrorism and ignoring major social issues which have dogged Indian society for centuries, is not the big picture.

    You did not hurt me, he do not have that power, but you did betray your own inner prejudices.

    Anonymous Reply:

    Thesis stated above/// tested !

    Ravi Reply:

    Your comprehension is akin to that of a walrus pup

    Anonymous Reply:

    Vinoo thanks for calling a spade a spade.

    There are mny frauds out here who are basically low level ISI operatives who want to obfuscate the terror and evil of Pakistani perfidy by invoking the RSS.

    You will see for yourself that the moment you mention ISI terror, these T U R D S start shouting “blasphemy blasphemy” !

    In fact if these morons had their way they would want to believe that 9/11 in US was a RSS plot and so was the hanging of Bhutto in 1977. !!

    I think if bayer or Cipla were to make a mind laxative, they should test them it on these cereberum constipated T U RDS !

    Anonymous Reply:

    @ Vinoo

    Very well written. I think you have explained in simple words why jehadi trolls have made this blog dirty and repitative.

    You are right that when a dispassionate reader wants information or update on say a Lok Pal or crises in Paksitan on this blog, most likely he will read cries of RSS RSS rape rape.

    Yes, the big picture is the fundmantalist state of Pakistan. And the fundoos it has bred. we need to re-educate them. Bet as you will see on this blog, Engrich and Ravi, who are basically terror supporters have their mind shut…

    They will NEVER NEVER see the big picture….

    Ravi Reply:

    Not forgetting that it was previously made dirty by Hindu Right Wing Fundos like you, who tirelessly repeat the 8% growth, KM long Malls, whilst totally forgetting all that makes our society still stuck in medieval times.

    Those who mention such ills are automatically classed as Jihad’s, Paksh1tani’s etc.

    Coming from a Khapsh1tstani, this is big.

    Vinoo, sorry if this bores you. I suggest you stick to reading Vijay and Shenoy.

    Anonymous Reply:

    Vijay Sir,

    You are not helping the cause either. Even my inexperience mind says you are capable of offering better views than indulging in silly writings.

    May be you will find my writing silly. It’s ironic that we always find others’ act silly and ours appropriate.

    Hope you will take my observations in right spirit.

    We newbies want to learn [ good blogging ] from you senior bloggers.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    But, Prahlad, you have begun blogging on a wrong foot. Tehelka is the worst example of yellow journalism and you seem to be having great admiration for it.

    [Reply]

    Ravi Reply:

    You have just proved the very point that Prahlad has made.

    To you anything that is not anti congress, anti Gandhi’s and anti Islam, is plain wrong.

    The reality is that it is you who is more often than not, plain wrong.

    Anonymous Reply:

    Shenoy Sir,

    You do not like Tehelka because it exposed Bangaru Laxman, BJP president taking bribe on camera !

    Or, it showed through Audio recording that the BJP MP’s were desperately calling people and middlemen just before 16 hours of voting to come and bribe them so that they could prove that the UPA was involved in horse trading !

    Sir, Tehelka is a good magazine. It has very dedicated journalists. We must not degrade investigating journalism. Like Anna is fighting corruption, Tehelka is also fighting/exposing corruptions.

    I fail to understand why you are against Tehelka.

    Anonymous Reply:

    Prahlad

    “Like Anna is fighting corruption, Tehelka is also fighting/exposing corruptions.

    I fail to understand why you are against Tehelka”.

    ———-

    The “mishtake” Tehelka made was to expose Modi – recall the string operation involving Babu Bajrangi and others, some years ago. That was “high treason” according to Shenoy.

    I suspect, even Anna Hazare must be on the radar now – having contested Mohan Bhagwat’s claim re: RSS support and active participation in the former’s crusade against corruption.

    Ravi Reply:

    Shenoy has also previously condemned Amnesty International, for much the same reasons.

  • Ravi

    And you are an arse licker

    [Reply]

  • Anonymous

    Pratap Singh Rane is following the footsteps of his leader Manmohan Singh. Who in turn followed the footsteps of his late leader Indira Gandhi…. A pliant Judiciary … a pliant bureaucracy … a pliant Press .. So when the Mining Scam in Goa broke out what did Rane do … he removed Parikkar as Chief of PAC and brought in a legislator who is keen to join Congress. This is the gift of the Congress Party, which has just paid its tributes to Mahatma Gandhi.
    And nothing to speak of the what its government in Rajasthan is upto . A FIR has been filed gainst its Cabinet Minister , but neither he has resigned nor he has been asked to resign .. and another 6 Ministers are involved in different scams , but CM comes on TV and says he is giving “sushasan ‘ But where are the vigilant guardians the Senior Commentators and the Editors from the Free Press … looking the other way

    [Reply]

  • Anonymous

    Rajiv,

    I read about Gopinath Mandal from the link you had provided. These lesser known
    events of partition should be discussed more frequently to have the true perspective
    of those time. Thanks. And where Pakistan is concerned it seems that it has gone from bad to worse by looking at the recent happenings over there. The rallies being taken out in support of Qadri is very disturbing .

    [Reply]

  • Anonymous

    India and Pakistan

    I suppose many of you must have already read it.

    Shekhar Gupta’s National Interest

    http://www.indianexpress.com/news/national-interest-be-very-afraid/857168/0

    [Reply]

  • Anonymous

    Pakistan and the great danger it poses — to us and the world
    —————————————————————————–

    Thank you Manohar for the link. Yes, Shekhar Gupta’s article predicts a showdown and maybe continous terror attacks on us from Pakistan. It is highly possible that the failed state would do anything to grab attention.

    It is indeed sad that our government is weak and has not got its counter terror strategy in place. In fact our crown prince has absolved the LeT , literally and tried to shift focus of terror onto RSS! how funny. Something which I was seeing on this blog too.

    We need to stand together and if need be give a strong counter punch to Pakistan as was done in 1971. WE NEED TO REMEMBER THAT THIS TIME THE WORLD AND US WOULD BE WITH US.

    How can this be done?

    a) encourage breakup forces in Baluchistan and sindh THROUGH the US. As such US and NATO would find this the best strategy of winding up pakistan. They are not going to swallow the insults of their troops and theri Afghan strategy butchered by the Pakistanis. So we could give them ideas and help them finance this .

    b) Strenghten ourselves with the latest equipment and be on high alert for terror and direct attacks.

    c) Give NATO bases in case they laucnh a Libya type attack on Paksitan.

    The great game has begun.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Vinoo

    I would respond to you in the morning, feeling a bit sleepy now. Good night.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    gnight!

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Vinoo

    Shekhar Gupta is one of our finest journalists.

    1) I am not sure that Baluchistan breaking away is going to happen soon – the principal reason being Baluchis are geographically spread across – Iran, Afghanistan and Pakistan – and to break away and become independent from three countries is surely going to be well nigh impossible. The other point to note whether the Baluchis have covert or otherwise support from across the world or not.

    Addendum : The question is to ask also whether such an independent entity would turn out to be worse (more extremist and fundamentalist) than what it is today.

    2) Sindh – I have no idea whether the locals have any firm aspirations and the means to get independence from Pakistan.

    3) The North-West Frontier region have never been under effective control of anybody. They do as they please.

    So it seems balkanisation is not going to happen in the near foreseeable future and we should not pin any hopes on it, but one never knows.

    4) Strengthen ourselves!

    a) We must, but our netas are not going to let that happen easily – the security forces are “used” for their personal prestige (and not security), the more the merrier.

    b) The netas use the security forces for their own nefarious purposes and suspect agendas. Plus the police themselves have become so used to breaking the law themselves, what hope do we have!

    – In many states, if a woman (age does not matter) ever makes a mistake of approaching the police for justice, more often than not is gang-raped and made an accused by the policemen themselves.

    – This I have mentioned (earlier). in Maharashtra, come 9-30 PM and 1000+ policemen in Bombay and Thane alone, have to go around bars to make sure that women employees leave (as per the guidelines of the Home Minister, who is more at home playing moral policing than detecting and preventive serious crime), as if at 9-31 PM, these women would become criminals and terrorists. As it is there thousands of vacancies in the policemen in the country – 1200+ shortage in the IPS cadre alone.

    – Allowing key witnesses to escape so that the cases against political class get weakened – the version given out by the police is even more bizarre than what is shown in a Hindi film.
    The latest is Sylvester Daniel.

    http://www.indianexpress.com/news/Key-Sohrabuddin-encounter-witness-flees–arrested/857607/

    These are three cases at random. How do you expect the country to be prepared and ready to face any challenges?

    5) Rahul Gandhi has not absolved LET and other across-the-border-rogue elements. He has merely stated which is a greater danger in his opinion and one may or may not agree with him. Prima facie one does not doubt someone from among ourselves – bagal mein chhoori – kind of thing. Danger emanating from a person you least expect and then it is too late.

    PS: If you go through this blog and perhaps earlier ones carefully, you would realise who attempts at every available to maneuver any discussion / topic into an RSS-vs-the Rest kind of discourse.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    @ Manohar

    Thank u for the considered reply.

    Manohar, there are two ways at looking at the situation. The first is a purely defensive one, wait like sitting ducks. The second is to influence events.

    we tend to play the first way. And end up being attacked again and again. Even Shekhar Gupta predicts stronger and bigger attacks than 26/11. So should we ait for the vil forces from Pakistan to attack us? they are already doing it all the time as we see in Afghanistan and as it happened in the Delhi HC blast case.

    manohar, we must not forget that the US is itching to obliterate Pakistan from the map of the world. The Pakistani nukes are preventing this possibility. We can at least help the US achieve its objectives.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    @ Manohar

    My opinion is that the threat from Paksitan would be faced by all of India– Hndus and Moslems together. However there is a concentrated attempt by certain Congress elements (not all ) to make Muslims feel that the actual threat is small and maybe nil.

    You have to remember the dirty role played by Antulay and Digvijay Singh after 26/11. And also by Shiela Dixit, on Afzal guru. And by Amar, Mulayam, Arundhati gang on batla house encounter.

    how can a nation ever be safe with such callous brutes inside us?

    Anonymous Reply:

    Vijay Kumar,

    it would be wasting your time and energy to wake up some of these congressies to the great danger waiting to happen to India.

    NONE IS SO DIFFICULT TO WAKE UP AS THE ONE WHO IS PRETENDING TO BE ASLEEP.

    Pakistan has since the Bhutto days declared it as its state policy to destroy India by a thousand cuts. If anybody in India forgets this, it would be at his own risk.

    Therefore, if the US has plans to destroy the nukes Pak has accumulated, we must facilitate the implementation of that plan, rather than bleat about like lost sheep, saying whether it is the state or its people etc, etc. These are signs of atrophied thinking.

    Anonymous Reply:

    Do you wish me respond or the reply by your Guruji answer is sufficient and who also suggests that it is waste of your time to interact with me – “congressi jo thehraa” as per his lexicon.? Please let me know.

    Anonymous Reply:

    “we must not forget that the US is itching to obliterate Pakistan from the map of the world”.

    1) obliterate what? Pakistan as a state! The millions of people who live in area called Pakistan! anything else!

    and how?

    2) I have no knowledge of whether US is itching to do so. Perhaps, you know better. As I see it, it is trying to discipline an errant (very dangerous at that with nukes in his hands) schoolboy.

    3) As I stated earlier, unless our security forces are made independent of our netas, our intelligence gathering, putting up proper defences, reaction time, etc. against such attacks will always be found wanting.

    Anonymous Reply:

    I think Vinoo meant do an Iraq or an Afghanistan on Pakistan. In comparison to the sins of Iraq and the sins of Afghanistan, the Pakistnai sins in the American eyes are greater.

    In fact with Osama caught living with wives and condoms in Abbotobad, the Afghan operation does look silly. It always needed a pakistna operation afet 9/11

    Anonymous Reply:

    Vijay

    You have to see the situation in individual cases/

    1) Aghanistan’s demographics and army (if there is one under one unified command) are in insignificant numbers.

    2) Iraq – its army did not have enough fire power (due to sanctions), did not have nuclear weapons and perhaps many in the army were not totally loyal to Saddam Hussain.

    3) Pakistan – they have a unified command and the armed forces (nearly a million + god alone knows how many sleeping terrorist outfits, waiting to be activated) seem to cohesive, have a civilian government in place (totally discredited if you like), has nuclear weapons. Do you think it would be a picnic for US army + NATO forces to just walk in and say we are in command?

    Moreover, the common people may have all the contempt and hatred towards its government and the army, but in my view, it does not exceed their hatred for the Americans.

    I do not think that Osama’s wives and condoms have anything to do with it, unless I have failed to see the connection. Would you like to elaborate and clear my doubts?

  • Pankaj#1

    @ Everyone;
    do we some people ere as : Ashik e Rasool?:

    [Reply]

    engrich Reply:

    half the world is ashike rasool.on the blog i am.dont go any furthet otherwise doctor will become mareez.

    [Reply]

    Pankaj#1 Reply:

    Abe Zahil Mareez.
    So you are Kadri of Pakistan, which waqs being saved by lawyers calling him Ashik e Rasool. He got noose, when is your turn?

    [Reply]

    engrich Reply:

    u should have used word qadri.ashike rasool is half the world.even steve of apple was aslo (he died as muslim).. ashike rasool.
    salman taseer was an idiot.usaualy **** liberals are highly corrupt and not in touch with people.he was asking,what happened to him.he was drinker womaniser and country seller.
    his sons are homosexuals.pakistanis are 10 times more corrupt than indians.they have stolen and sold all their institutions.even railway engines are stolen.u only see the people from one angle forgetting the pain of common people.

    i heard his interview,at that time i told he will be murdered.

    qadri will never be hang.they have kidnapped his son.

    samunder mein rah kar magarmachch se bair nahee lete.
    this is simple intellegence.he was governor,should not have indulged in politics.

    thank u for awnsering &reading.

    engrich Reply:

    Abe Zahil Mareez

    i forgive u next time dont try this.

    Pankaj#1 Reply:

    Thanks for forgiving me. I just pray, you do not come in person against me. I will not be able to control myself.

    engrich Reply:

    pankaj jee iam not against anybody.

  • engrich

    GUILTY OF AN UNSOLVED CRIME ?
    The Supreme Court acknowledges that Mohammed Afzal Guru is not a terrorist and that they have no direct evidence against him. Is he on death row on the basis of a shoddy probe? Mihir Srivastava looks at critical questions still unanswered

    The thoroughness of the probe can be judged by the court’s remarks. It pulled up the police for faking arrest memos and doctoring telephone conversations
    December 13, 2001. “Five heavily armed persons stormed the Parliament House complex and inflicted heavy casualties on the security men on duty. This unprecedented event bewildered the entire nation and sent shockwaves across the globe. In the gun battle that lasted thirty minutes, these five terrorists who tried to gain entry into the Parliament when it was in session, were killed. Nine persons including eight security personnel and one gardener succumbed to the bullets of the terrorists and 16 persons including 13 security men received injuries. The five terrorists were ultimately killed…” — From the Supreme Court judgement.

    Six years and three judgements later, we still do not ‘reliably’ know who attacked Parliament on December 13, 2001. What we do know is that Mohammed Afzal Guru, the alleged conspirator, was awarded the death penalty but is he being made a scapegoat? Is Afzal being held guilty for a crime that is still unsolved?

    Consider this: the ‘comprehensive investigation’ of the attack on Parliament was completed in 17 days flat by the investigators — the Special Cell of the Delhi Police. The prosecution story of who attacked Parliament, which is popularly believed to be the real story, is based on the confession of the main accused Afzal Guru to the police under the Prevention of Terrorist Activities Act (POTA). The Supreme Court has dubbed this confession, and thus, in effect, the conspiracy theory behind the attack floated by the police, as “unreliable”.

    There are 12 accused in the Parliament attack case. Five of them — Mohammad, Tariq, Hamza, Rana and Raja — were killed when they tried to lay siege on Parliament. The other three — Gazi Baba, Masood Azhar and Tariq, allegedly the masterminds behind the attack and Lashkar-e-Toiba (let) and Jaish-e-Mohammad (JeM) operatives — were never arrested. Gazi Baba was shot in an encounter with security forces in 2004. His body was recognised by Afzal’s brother. Only four accused were arrested: Afzal Guru, his cousin Shaukat Hussain Guru, Shaukat’s wife Afsan Guru and SAR Geelani, a teacher of Arabic in Delhi University. Geelani and Afsan were acquitted. Not one of them was convicted under POTA charges. Afzal does not belong to any banned terrorist organisation. Shaukat was sentenced to 10 years rigorous imprisonment because he knew about the conspiracy. Afzal was given the death sentence on the charges of murder and for waging war against the State.

    Quick probe but no direct evidence against Afzal

    The thoroughness with which the investigations of such an important case were carried out can be judged by the remarks made by the Delhi High Court. The court has pulled up the investigators for the production of false arrest memos, doctoring of telephone conversations and the illegal confining of people to force them to sign blank papers. Despite these observations, “the courts did not pass any strictures against the officers for their shoddy and illegal investigations,” says Nandita Haksar, Geelani’s lawyer.

    There is no direct evidence against Afzal. None of the 80 prosecution witnesses ever even alleged that Afzal was in any way associated with or belonged to any terrorist organisation. He has been awarded the death sentence entirely on the basis of circumstantial evidence. Afzal did not shy away from admitting the possibly incriminating fact that he brought Mohammad from Kashmir and that he accompanied him when the latter purchased a second-hand Ambassador, two days before the attack. The Supreme Court in its judgement observes that even when his lawyer attempted to deny this fact during the trial, Afzal insisted that he indeed had accompanied Mohammad.

    They didn’t need to die: Parliament staff pay homage to security personnel who died in the attack

    The former Thane Police chief claimed that they had arrested Hamza and handed him over to J&K cops in December 2000

    Why was the STF’s involvement not probed?

    In the same vein, Afzal maintains that he did this at the behest of the Special Task Force (STF) of the Jammu and Kashmir police. Afzal alleged in a letter to his lawyer Sushil Kumar in the Supreme Court that Davinder Singh, Deputy sp of Humhama, in Jammu and Kashmir, asked him to take Mohammad to Delhi and arrange for his stay there. “Since I was not knowing the man, but I suspected this man is not Kashmiri, as he did not speak Kashmiri,” wrote Afzal. “The facts of the letter were never put on record before the courts,” charges Haksar.

    It is clear from the case records that Afzal is a surrendered militant, who gave himself up to the bsf in 1993. Further, Afzal told the court that he was frequently asked by the STF to work for them (a senior police official has confirmed this to Tehelka). He said the STF extorted large sums of money from him for not arresting him. But he was detained in as late as 2000 and was offered the job of a special police officer. He met Tariq (a co-accused, who is absconding) in the STF camp, where the latter was working. It was Tariq who introduced Mohammad to him in the STF camp. The alleged role of the STF in the Parliament attack, as per the court record, has not been investigated at all. Davinder Singh confirmed that no investigator ever got back to him and sought clarification on his alleged role in sending Mohammad to Delhi with Afzal’s help. “Why will they ask me this? He (Afzal) is saying this to save his own skin,” said Singh.

    In his reply, Singh denies the allegations. “Do you want to say that we are behind the Parliament attack,” he asked. Singh acknowledged that he had once detained Afzal for interrogation. “We had reliable information that he knew the whereabouts of Gazi Baba, one of the most dreaded terrorists in Kashmir (and an accused in the case). But we couldn’t get anything out of him and let him go.”

    The Delhi Police Special Cell had only Afzal to identify the bodies of the five assassins gunned down in Parliament. There is no other corroborative evidence that sheds light on the identities of these five terrorists. Later in court, Afzal denied identifying them. “I had not identified any terrorists. Police told me the names of the terrorists and forced me to identify them,” Afzal told the court in his statement made under Section 313 of the Criminal Procedure Code.

    In the absence of any direct evidence against Afzal, the Supreme Court said in its judgement: “The incident which resulted in heavy casualty, has shaken the entire nation and the collective conscience of the society will only be satisfied if capital punishment will be awarded to the offender.” Haksar does not agree with the court’s view. “The Supreme Court has not passed any strictures against the corrupt officers for their shoddy and illegal investigations and has held that there is no direct evidence against Afzal. However they have confirmed the death sentence because they believe that this death is necessary to assuage Indian citizens.”

    [Reply]

    engrich Reply:

    IN LIGHT OF ABOVE SAHOULD AFZAL GURU BE HANG.

    [Reply]

  • Anonymous

    When it comes to having fun at others’ expense, our cricket team is second to none, never mind the total wash out they suffered in England. Poking fun at the prospective captain, they are asking one another, “what is the opposite of ’smiling Buddha?”

    the answer is “Gautam Gambhir”.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Shenoy,

    Very good one. :)

    [Reply]

    Pankaj#1 Reply:

    Shenoy Sahab;
    Kahan se fursat main baith kar dhoondh late ho? Wah.

    [Reply]

  • Anonymous

    Anna above Parliament, can pressurise it: Kejriwal

    http://www.hindustantimes.com/Anna-above-Parliament-can-pressurise-it-Kejriwal/H1-Article1-755216.aspx

    What next, Mr. Kejriwal?

    He has surely has gone bonkers. Did he check with Anna Hazare whether the latter too felt that way? One should no more be surprised at his next pronouncements/declarations.

    With colleagues like Mr. Kejriwal, Ms. Bedi and Co, Anna Hazare does not need enemies and opponents.

    Amazing India.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Parliament is not such a holy cow as you would like us to believe. It has more than a hundred criminals in it who also occasionally make laws for the people. And many times the laws they make stink, like Shah Bano amendment, and the proposed bill against communal violence. At other times most of them enjoy their life and privileges at people’s cost. Manmohan Singh has only yesterday, denied permission to dozens of ministers to go on foreign junkets!

    Anna Hazare is the only hope for the vast humanity that is the Indian praja and no amount attempts at trivialisation of the anti-corruption movement can work now.

    Anna Hazare has said that he doesn’t take help from the RSS. Just like the LeT gives support to Digvinash Singh and Amul Baby, without their openly asking for it, Anna Hazare too gets support from all quarters, including the RSS. There is nothing the congress can do about it except bleating , “foul, foul”.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    As I had told Vinoo to check, as to who attempts to turn every discussion/topic into RSS-vs-the Rest slugfest, he does not have to go far. You last para gives you away.
    Pity you for surviving on such staple diet.

    Rest of your comments, I do not agree with.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Manohar,

    Shekhar Gupta last week said, “Here are the three most popular political questions these days: is UPA 2 dead, or not quite dead yet but gasping for breath, and whether it is possible to revive it or not. There isn’t a fourth possibility in this equation….”

    It would soothe your ruffled feelings if you read the article:

    http://www.indianexpress.com/news/decide-on-the-doctor/854125/0

    Anonymous Reply:

    I have alleged that you cannot read on the lines nor between them – now I am convinced you do not even wish to read.

    Anonymous Reply:

    Manohar_T,

    yesterday, you had asked a question about the Anna Hazare and RSS and today you again raised Anna Hazare’s movement.If you have forgotten what you wrote, here it is:

    ……………………………………………………………………………..

    “1) RSS was part of Anna stir: Bhagwat

    http://www.hindustantimes.com/...

    2) Anna denies RSS support to Ramlila stir.

    http://www.hindustantimes.com/...

    Both cannot be speaking the truth. Can anyone tell me who is lying?”
    ………………………………………………………………….

    I have replied to both of your posts, since nobody bothered with your complaint about Anna. Why do you get upset if you get a fitting reply?

    Anonymous Reply:

    No one (that has includes you) has replied to my question yesterday – who is lying about RSS support and participation? Let us have your answer to this, right here and now.

    It does not concern me if no one bothers to reply to my posts. That is for the insecure types.

    Me getting upset! Huh! You giving a “fitting reply”, when did you do that? Now that is double huh.

    Anonymous Reply:

    Here is the reply to the question whether Anna is right or Bhagwat is right. You said both cannot be right. I think both are right.

    1. The RSS has many million followers all over the world, who may not be shakha-attending, chaddi-cap-wearing; nonetheless, they are supporters. It is these supporters who gave whole hearted support to the movement aginst corruption in the UPA and also helped make the fast a resounding success. It also made the government look silly and confused.
    So, to that extent Bhagwat is right.

    2. Anna has openly asked the whole country to support him, in his fight against the UPA, but has said he will not ask, nor take support from communal organisations. BUT HE HAS ALSO ADMITTED THAT HE HAS RECEIVED SUPPORT FROM THE LEFT, THE CENTRE AND ALSO THE RIGHT.

    That he still got large scale support from the sangh and parivar, doesn’t take away from Anna’s stated position.
    Therefore he is rigtht in his claim that he has not taken RSS help.

    Ravi Reply:

    This is the kind of arguement one expects from a total looser.

    Chit mein jeea aur Pat toon hara.

    Now every one is a RSS supporter.

    Anonymous Reply:

    Both are right ???????????
    Amazing. Logic, anyone?

    Now you should realise, why no one else replied to my question.

    In your case, it is like fools rushing in where even angels fear to tread. Enjoy yourself.

    engrich Reply:

    anna was supported by most corrupt people of society.now he is acting as blackmailer.he was hped by zoinist media.to perpetuate blood bath.

    rss is storm trooper of hindu fascism in india.they say that they want to finish caste.this is zoinist slogan.they want to finish(physically)all the tribes and castes.only jewish tribe and their slaves are in judea century.
    christiandome is finished.main aim to attack iraq afghanistan haqqani group and libya is finish ,aboriginals.first nation shoild go to heaven.like in america canada newzealand and australia.

    Pankaj#1 Reply:

    Manohar;
    It is getting late in the day and I do not know whether I am doing it right or wrong. Mahesh, though, young, very cerebral is not around, and I will not be my self, as working week is approaching, and work is supreme. I know, we do not see things eye to eye, but any new issue, I can discuss withyou? sorry, that is my Fix. I have given up on Ravi, Your Pal. but, I would like discuss with you. I may be erratic in my answer in sense and and time, but I am missing engagement with you.

    Anonymous Reply:

    I appreciate your post.

    Ravi is no friend of mine. It so happens that I share the same views, thats about it.

    You are most welcome to put questions or initiate debates – I will be always be a game.

    engrich Reply:

    anna is blackmailing.nobody is above parliament

    [Reply]

  • Anonymous

    Here is some relief from the Gingriches and cockroaches of the blog:

    A married Irishman went into the confessional and said to his priest, ‘I almost had an affair with another woman.’

    The priest said, ‘What do you mean, almost?’

    The Irishman said, ‘Well, we got undressed and rubbed together, but then I stopped.’

    The priest said, ‘Rubbing together is the same as putting it in. You’re not to see that woman again. For your penance, say five Hail Mary’s and put $50 in the poor box.’

    The Irishman left the confessional, said his prayers, and then walked over to the poor box.

    He paused for a moment and then started to leave.

    The priest, who was watching, quickly ran over to him saying, ‘I saw that. You didn’t put any money in the poor box!’

    The Irishman replied, ‘Yeah, but I rubbed the $50 on the box, and according to you, that’s the same as putting it in!’

    [Reply]

    Ravi Reply:

    This seems to have been written by a genital louse, that normally inhabits a tight longoat.

    [Reply]

    Pankaj#1 Reply:

    Shenoy Sahab,
    Ek Meri Taraf se Bhi.
    A Lawyer and a senior citizen are sitting next to each other on a long
    flight.

    The lawyer is thinking that seniors are so dumb that he could get one over
    on them easily.

    So, the lawyer asks if the senior would like to play a fun game.

    The senior is tired and just wants to take a nap, so he politely declines
    and tries to catch a few winks.

    The lawyer persists, saying that the game is a lot of fun….”I ask you a
    question, and if you don’t know the answer, you pay me only $5.00. Then you
    ask me one, and if I don’t know the answer, I will pay you $500.00,” he
    says.

    This catches the senior’s attention and, to keep the lawyer quiet, he agrees
    to play the game.

    The lawyer asks the first question. “What’s the distance from the Earth to
    the Moon?”

    The senior doesn’t say a word, but reaches into his pocket, pulls out a
    five-dollar bill, and hands it to the lawyer.

    Now, it’s the senior’s turn. He asks the lawyer, “What goes up a hill with
    three legs, and comes down with four?”

    The lawyer uses his laptop to search all references he can find on the Net.

    He sends E-mails to all the smart friends he knows; all to no avail. After
    an hour of searching, he finally gives up.

    He wakes the senior and hands him $500.00. The senior pockets the $500.00
    and goes right back to sleep.

    The lawyer is going nuts not knowing the answer. He wakes the senior up and
    asks, “Well, so what goes up a hill with three legs and comes down with
    four?”

    The senior reaches into his pocket, hands the lawyer $5.00, and goes back to
    sleep.

    *********************************************************************************************************

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    I like it.
    It may even make fake Ravi laugh and disturb the position with Tajender, whose lingam he has inside for safe custody.

    [Reply]

    Ravi Reply:

    He has not said anything of any interest thus far, so what makes you think suddenly he will become Woody Allen.

    So long you do not Bobbitt Vijay’s Lingham.

    The world is safe.

  • Ravi

    As an aside, there is a poetry competition going on in this blog.

    The leading contender here is Vijay Kumar Khapsh1tstani.

    He receives more adulatory votes – from the hard of hearing – than any one else here.

    To support my testimony – to the bard of the blog – I present his latest sher, that he was heard narrating to his fellow conference delegates at the ICA in Delhi.

    इकतालीस बिआलिस तिरतालीस चुआलिस
    पिन्तालिस झिआलिस सिंतालिस अड़तालीस

    To enjoy this sher fully please musically narrate it while emphasising the third word of both lines.

    [Reply]

  • Anonymous

    =======================================================================
    ~~ POETRY AND VIJAY KUMAR–
    =======================================================================

    Yesterday night after a conference I was attending, a college friend whom I was meeting after a decade sang an old song, which I must pen out here, I dont know the name of the lyric writer, but the original was sung by Manna Dey.

    I hope I get the lyrics right !

    kasme vaade pyaar wafaa sab
    Baatein hai, baaton ka kya

    Two lines really made me feel nostalgic.

    Hoga Messiah… saamne tere
    Phir bhi tu naa bach paayega

    Teraa khoon hi aakhir,
    Tujhko aag lagayega

    Aasmaan mein udne waale
    maati mein mil jayega….

    —————————————————-

    As I drove back home very late in the night, the lyrics kept resounding in my head. And I thought of Steve jobs and even wondered that with all the ambition which we all have…

    Aasman mein udne waala… maati mein mil jaayega….

    [Reply]

    Ravi Reply:

    I rest my case

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Kuch standard ki baat kar ravi…

    [Reply]

    Ravi Reply:

    Standard ki hi baat kar raha tha.

    Isi liye award aap ko hi diya hai

    Anonymous Reply:

    you are talking like a lawyer who carries his brief case to the court daily, but has no briefs.

    [Reply]

    Ravi Reply:

    At least I do not have Vijay’s lingham up my briefs like you do

    Anonymous Reply:

    We all know where ‘up’ you keep **** Tajender’s lingam for ’safe custody’.

    Ravi Reply:

    At least his is there for safe keeping.

    You keep wanting to Bobbitt Vijay’s

    So scared is he, that he has become senti.

    Pankaj#1 Reply:

    shenoy Sahab;
    Tusi wakai great ho. You will not be allowed to be killed( metaphorically) by Jaidrath and others this time.

    Ravi Reply:

    Shenoy Sahib Ji.

    Bilkul, tusi bahut grate ho

    Ravi Reply:

    THE KLEENEX AWARD for the BARD of the BOG

    Goes to Vijay Kumar Kahpsh1tstani, unopposed.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Vijay Kumar,

    the song is from the film UPKAR.
    This picture also changed Pran’s image from a haiwan to an insaan.

    [Reply]

    Ravi Reply:

    Sadly no such miracle for you.

    Your image remains like that of a right wing Hindu Haiwan.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    For once you have spoken the truth. Congratulations are in order.

    “Shenoyji, tusi great ho”.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    @ Vijay

    Beautiful song. As I read the lyrics today, for the first time a new meaning came in for me, which I had missed 40 years back.

    Teraa apnaa khoon hi aakhi
    tujh ko.. aakhir aag lagaayega..

    At fifty one does not think of death yet. But the evocative words, reminded me of the day when I lit the funeral pyre of my father.

    @ manohar

    I read your reply on Pakistan and terror. I think we have differences on the approach on how to tackle it. But both of us do understand the danger it poses to the world…

    Anonymous Reply:

    Vinoo

    That is what discussions are meant for.

    Anonymous Reply:

    @Vijay and Manohar

    I wonder why the present batch of lyric writers cannot write the way an older generation did. Frankly the last set of lyrics which moved me were from 1942 a love story. And they were written by javed Akhtar…

    Pankaj#1 Reply:

    No comments.

    [Reply]

  • Anonymous

    Vinodji said, “Premature though, the most fascinating battle for power is within the BJP. .”

    Being, an impartial, unbiased, uninterested, fly on the wall watching the goings on, Vinodji’s observation may gladden the heart of some of the congress supporters here.

    But, read this:

    The Pranab VS Chidambaram fight is not yet over.(Only, it has moved to the inside)
    Montek Singh Ahluwalia VS Nandan Nilekeni is getting eye balls.
    Pawar VS K.V.Thomas war is getting uglier by the day.
    Jairam Ramesh VS all others including MMS but excluding the 2G’s is a daily affair.
    Lalith Maken VS Mani Sankat Aiyer VS the cricket lobby in the cabinet is still on.
    Jaipal Reddy VS Telangana lobby.
    Congress VS allies.

    THE FIGHT GOES ON
    BUT THE MEDIA IS SILENT, SULLEN, CHUP, FOR FEAR OF UPSETTING SONIA GANDHI’S ‘DELICATE’ HEALTH.

    [Reply]

    Ravi Reply:

    So please tell us who has appointed you – a proven Saffron Fundo – as an impresario of Congress political punch-ups.

    Was this in this mornings RSS “What to say in the Blogs” briefing document.

    I read my ISI detail and nothing like this was mentioned. It identified some more bumb visphot targets.

    [Reply]

  • Anonymous

    WEEDS AND ROSES
    Vinodji, agar gulistan ko hara bhara vekhna hai, then you have to control the weeds. No gopi, ashish, vinay or mishraji to set blog alight.
    Vinodji, nurture the pundits and scoop out the weeds.
    Ravi, what happens to you when egerich comes ?? Even Ashish says you have become tiresome.
    Vinod ji pl u control attacks on rajiiv from DR SHAN darnley garbage street.
    ASSI YAHAN BORED HO GAYE

    [Reply]

    Ravi Reply:

    Balwinder Ji

    Engerich does nothing for me or to me.

    BV Shenoy aur Vijay ki baat karo.

    As I said before and will say it to you again. If jibes such as Paksh1tani, Jihadi, ISI, etc continue.

    I will and do poison this blog.

    Let me for the umrpteenth time remind you, you say nothing against them two.

    Here is another prediction you do not reply to this either, because you know how one sided your condemnation is.

    If you want this blog to become healthy again, then you know what to do.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    koi gal nahin puttar- lo-
    Vijay pl u stop calling idiot engerich ****, pakshitisatn, petticoat etc. let us bring blog back to life.
    vinodji, ban engerich – otherwise the ROSES do not come back

    [Reply]

    Ravi Reply:

    Balwinder

    That is really funny.

    So Vijay can stop abusing Engrich, but can continue abusing me.

    That is OK. I can handle as you know.

    Har aane di duani da vada kita si

    [Reply]

    engrich Reply:

    vinodji, ban engerich – otherwise the ROSES do not come back
    A

    balwinder, i never used any bad word about u or mishrajee.i could not understand mishreejee,he supports ghandhi and his murderer savarkar.
    savarkar was the prime suspect of ghandhi murder case.

    u can give ur ideas i will respect ur views.

    ashish is coming.

    dr was angry because of my comment on savarkar.he and hegdewar were homosexual.this is fact.

    why he is against me.any reason.

    [Reply]

    engrich Reply:

    balwinder when i give respect to u why u call me idiot.i ignore vijay abuses as they are meaningless.

    [Reply]

  • Anonymous

    Prahlad,

    I really admire your ardour for Tehelka and also your simplicity.

    The stings Tehelka carries out are all paid jobs it soes for the congress party. It has, in the case of the army officers hired prostitutes to destroy the life of the officers.

    The SC didn’t take any cognisance of the expose’s on Modi it flaunted on the TV channnels with the “dedicated” journalists flourishing their ware. This single instance shows its credibility.

    When the whole country was agog with expose’ after expose’ in the CWG, 2G, Adarsh, etc amounting to over Rs.2 lakh crores, Tehelka didn’t even get a whiff of any of the huge scams!!!!!!! And it was and is still gloating over the 1lac Bangaru Laxman took as donation for party work.

    MOST IMPORTANTLY, WHETHER IN THE BANGARU CASE, OR THE GENERALS’ CASE, IT WAS ALL IMAGINARY CONTRACTS. NOT A SINGLE CASE OF BRIBERY IS MADE OUT IN ITS SO CALLED EXPOSE’S IN REAL CONTRACTS.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Shenoy Sir,

    I would not like to debate hard with you. But I would like to point out the famous Tehelka sting operation was well planned with a proper firm seeking order from the army and in the process it exposed the wrong doings that usually happen in army. Jaya Jaitley, Bangaru all fell for their greed.

    On the other hand take the case of “Cash for Vote”. BJP took the help of colourful “Hindustani” guy [ I request all bloggers to search and just see the person's photograph to know the kind of company Shri Sudhir Kulkarni, Arun Jaitley and L K Advani keep to get their dirty work done] and called middlemen to connect the politicians from Congress. They failed. Then they started contacting SP and got access to Amar Singh. All these things happened just 16 hours before the Voting in the parliament. The fixers’ desperate attempts were all caught on audio tape.

    I must say Mr Advani really took a very low level approach to realise his dream of discrediting UPA and fulfill his own ambition to become the PM.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Shenoy Sir,

    I would like to invite my Dad and show him my arguments on this forum. But I am not able to do it because some bloggers are using very foul language.

    Senior bloggers must ensure that this blog remains family friendly. I request you to take the initiative.

    [Reply]

    Ravi Reply:

    Prahlad

    I am one of the people who could – rightly – be accused of using inappropriate language.

    I can assure you that this is almost always in retaliation for similar language used by others. You have named one and the other is Vijay and I have noticed that even Pankaj has started to follow suite.

    I promise you that any steps taken by them to stay away from abusive language and name calling would be responded in equal kind. I will also stop.

    Meanwhile I hope you understand.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Ravi Sir,

    I am glad you are willing to take the initiative. I am sure others will follow.

    Pankaj#1 Reply:

    Prahlad;
    I am wonderstruck. Any proof of inappropriate language? ask anybody, give an example of my post. there are lies, white lies and statisticks, as saying goes.

    Anonymous Reply:

    Prahlad,

    in my responses to you or the many others, if I have used foul language, please point out the same. It however excludes two posters fake Ravi and Gingrich who have been replied to in the language they employ for me and the others.

    The Tajender pest was expelled by Vinod ji from his blog, but he has sneaked back into the discussions here with his obscenities. And the fake Ravi, who really is an ISI plant here, goes all out in support of the pest.

    This is what ails the blog.

    But, I can assure you one thing, and that is that this situation cannot remain static. It has to change. If we cannot get the change all want, then we have the hig highway to take, which Binoy Hegde and Dr. Mishra took.

    I hope yo

    [Reply]

  • Ravi

    Mr Shenoy

    It seems that it is now your turn to start shouting Modi Modi, Rape, Rape.

    Have a read of this.

    Patriarch of Hindu nationalism the Rashtriya Swayamsevak Sangh (RSS) has lent its support to BJP President Nitin Gadkari as their candidate of choice for prime ministerial position in the 2014 elections instead Gujarat Chief Minister Narendra Modi.

    So how is this fight between Modi Vs Gadkari panning out.

    Isn’t it a bit premature.

    Which hospital in California will he go for a complete charisma Transplant?

    [Reply]

  • Ravi

    I understand that Arun Jaitley is saying “There is a need for electoral reforms“

    Do we know what kind of reforms does he have in his mind?

    [Reply]

  • Ravi

    Vinoo

    I hope the following is something that you may consider as a part of the big picture.

    In BJP’s internal politics, is the RSS performing the role of an Umpire or the Twelfth man?

    Hitherto, Mohan Bhagwat has publicly stated – which had only ever been accepted by those who whole accept anything he says – that the RSS has abandoned the non-interference policy and will now follow a much more interventionist policy. It has decided that it will chose personalities that the party will project. In this regard it favours Gadkari over Modi.

    [Reply]

  • engrich

    Today there was a funeral of RSS activist and creating a horror in mind of public when lot of RSS workers started to march with arsenal like, rods, pistols, rifles and kirpans, within the street of Barnala district of Punjab on the occasion of celebration of Dusehra and squad by Punjab Police.

    This a agreat message for all moolnivasi if we will revolt against baramanwad who is governing us for about 2300 years then they will crush us with weapons like this as they crushed ours ten emperors moolnivasias ( Ravans) by PUSHWAMITAR (RAM Brahmins)

    Please be beware of RSS terrorist activities helped by various agencies.

    [Reply]

  • Anonymous

    =======================================================================
    ~~~ RAVI FINALLY AN FULLY DIAGNOSED ~~~
    =======================================================================

    As a senior blogger Vinoo59 pointed out this blog has fallen in quality ever since sophisticated TU rd Ravi and Pak-shit-stani Engrich have taken over the physical space.

    Out of the last 50 posts, this madcap duo of Osama and Al zawahari have posted 30, making the blog tiresome for others.

    As a person with more than a passing interest in psychology I have diagonosed Ravi’s problems. On this blog itself he has confessed that he has not been able to see his manhood for 20 years becasue fo a huge beer belly.

    I think this has resulted in him becoming a fan of **** Engrich and his manhood !! :) :)

    No wonder he starts singing Engrich’s song every second !!

    To him I would suggest.”Buy a big bathroom mirror, Ravi… and get over it !! ”

    H AHAHAHH HAAA !! :D !! :)

    [Reply]

    Ravi Reply:

    Prahlad

    Here is what I suggest you need to read.

    In the interest of your father, I will let this one GO.

    But believe me I have a promise to return ever anna of his with a duani.

    Regards

    Ravi

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    I am very disappointed with Ravi. Of the fifty or so postings he and engrich have taken the bulk of the space.

    ravi, if you cannot say anyting in a thousand words, you probably wont be able to say it a million. I think you can do better than this,

    The message in all of the postings is same , An anti RSS theory and abuse towards fellow blogmates. As a dispassionate observer I can tell you that this is not healthy bloggging, but just abuse fo teh space the HIndustan Times gives us all,

    for example vijay had written the stanzas of a song– kasme Vaade pyaar wafaa– a song which I used to sing in school. Now all of us could have enjoyed the verse and the imagery…

    But you chose to be abusive.

    Can’t you just leve your past behind and try to change in life…?

    [Reply]

    Ravi Reply:

    Vinoo

    I am bitterly disappointed in you, and will consider you as being hostile to me.

    THE ONE THING THAT YOU ARE NOT, IS DISSPATIONATE

    Here is why.

    1. I did not say ANYTHING about the stanza from a song. My comments were about Vijay’s previous attempts at poetry. Diabolical, does not cover the half of it.

    2. I have explained to you, that you would not know the BIG PICTURE, if some one wheeled it in front of you. You consider title tatle as big picture.

    3. As clearly explained to you, not only by me but also by Manohar, that eventually the big picture only starts when one includes the RSS in it.

    4. Like other like-mided people like you, you do not notice the ABUSIVE BEHAVIOUR OF Shenoy and Vijay, but pointedly mention mine. That makes you a bent juror.

    You have been proven partisan in this arguement, you are some one who just imagines being dispassionate, but does not know the meaning of it.

    Nothing can be farther from the truth.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    I have no intention of getting into an arguement with you. I was just trying to help you into a better relationship with your blogmates.

    For a moment stop thinking you are ravi but instead a Mr Rakes, Salim or an Anthony and then go over the last 50 or so postings. You may then appreciate what I am saying…

    Ravi Reply:

    Thanks for your advise, but consider it not adhered to.

    It will not be listened to until, you are FAIR in your criticism.

    Feel free to call for my expulsion. I will leave but will not suffer indignities piled upon me without me retaliating.

    I suggest that you read the entire blog and you will apperciate what I mean.

    ______________________

    Here are some examples:

    Pasthetic in c minor is better than Ravi in T U R D Tajendar’s petticoat !!

    Ohh!! The only thing original out here is an ISI fundoo called Ravi who emerges out of T U R D Tajendar’s petticoat !!

    ISI Fundoo Ravi ka naya pyaar
    Eunuch Engrich se kiya Ikrar

    T U R D Tajendar ke petticoat mein
    Fundoo Ravi aur Fundoo Engrich ne li angraadyi

    4.you are like fake Ravi.

    Hon’ble Justice Ashish, on this shubh din of Dusshera I beg to submit the following

    a) I have been accused By petitioner Ravi of calling Tajendar, Engrich and somtimes him as T U R D S. Yes sir I am guilty and PrOUD !!

    b) I have been accused by petitioner Ravi of calling his country Pakistan as PAK-shit – stan. yes sir, i am proud of this too as Pak-shit-stan sends terrorists and bombers to india. ;)

    c) I have often called Ravi an ISI fundoo as he attacks India, hindus and parrots lies of rape rape all the time . YES Sir, I am guilty of this offence. And further state that I will continue to do so…

    In the same way as Cross dresser T U R D Tajendar’s petticoat fell on Engrich and crossdresser Engrich’s petticoat fell on ISI Fundoo Ra_ _ !! *

    * Look Ravi I have not named you. But however if you are ISI Fundoo with name starting with Ra then only u should feel aggrieved …

    Anonymous Reply:

    Vinoo

    I have one question

    Is the RSS some kind of a “holy cow” that cannot be criticised or taken to the cleaners?

    I do not know whose side you are on or whether you are dispassionate observer (and I do not wish to know it does not matter to me – what matters is what you or anyone posts, but picking up on one for blame-game and blind to others’ shenanigans (ignore the message/topic and attempt to shoot the messenger is one such – many times in an uncivilised manner and wishing the other side will remain gentlemanly), is just not done. There is no one-way street in discussions. I wish you could go through a couple of blogs (not the last 50 or so postings) and check who is doing what, then perhaps you will get the true picture.

    BTW, my sincere advice to all for the past couple of blogs – if you do not like/disapprove a post – the best policy is to ignore it, but it seems here is the case of the two monsters feeding on each other and enjoying it.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    @ Manohar

    I think there is no holy cow in this world… except the cow i drink milk from!

    No , I think RSS can be discussed, debated, liked or disliked.
    As can the Congress, BJP or left. My irritation starts when the word RSS is used as a ploy to cover up the jehadi and nefarious attacks on India and HIndus and the corruption of the Congress.

    I think fro the safety of this world, for the purity of India from corruption, we should now allow idiots to hijack debates by shouting out RSS RSS needlessly.

    Anonymous Reply:

    Vinoo,

    for some of these people RSS bashing is a ‘peshaa’. If it was in their power they would have it banned, expelled, disbanded and destroyed. NOT THAT THEY HAVE’NT TRIED.

    Since it is not in their power, they are doing the next thing that comes naturally to them : RSS bashing.

    engrich Reply:

    what is wrong in calling bad a bad.i am boring because i disturb ur dream as u have no proper awnser.

    [Reply]

    engrich Reply:

    dr vijay kee jai ho.

    [Reply]

  • Anonymous

    engerich, problem is you bring out worst in Rajeev, vijay and Ravi- in different ways
    Ravi becomes boring- you are crypto hindu fascist etc
    Vijay starts saying **** etc- vijay pl u stop using THAT word
    Rajeev and u start bad personal war

    and we humble bloggers who have seen best of Ashish, Vinay, Sheob, Mishraji, Rajiiiv, Mirza are left starved
    pl do not take it personal- but both enegerich and ravi should probably leave- or maybe make one post every 3 days
    SORRY

    [Reply]

    engrich Reply:

    engerich, problem is you bring out worst in Rajeev, vijay and Ravi- in different ways
    i am only against satanic forces.so u shoild not worry much.

    [Reply]

  • Anonymous

    Gopiji,

    Missing your interesting postings since last few days. You have always brought
    a different and inteligent flavour to this blog. I hope everything is fine with you.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Thanks Mohan.. I am fine. I retreated because “purists” took over.

    (Viju was referring to how Jagjit was treated as “not pure enough” by other singers/some music lovers)

    We have a bunch of purists on this blog whop insist RSS is behind worldwide violence…..

    [Reply]

    engrich Reply:

    rss is voilent brhmncl organiztion doing bad for india.their stanic cousins are responsible international voilence like now in libya.

    [Reply]

  • Anonymous

    Sad news for music lovers. Jagjit Singh is no more. One of the best gazal singers
    I have ever heard. First time I heard him live was in 1978 or 79 at Indian Sporsts
    Club in Dubai. What a singer. R I P .

    [Reply]

  • Anonymous

    —————————————————————————————————————————-
    ~~~ ~~ MUSIC & MELODY in Times of distrust ~~~~ ~~
    —————————————————————————————————————————-

    Sorry guys, I am about to take a diversion.

    The death of Jagjit Singh just reminded me how fickle life can be … but how your words can speak evocatively even after you are no more.

    “Mere geet amar kar do…” was Jagjit Singh at his best. And definately his songs will soar in the sky forever.

    For a madcap like me who liked to shake his body at a Disco on English pop or Daler’s Bhangra rap, the introduction to Jagjit really came through a ghazal night at Siri Fort, where Jagjit’s melliflous voice got etched into my heart and emotions for forever.

    Even though my own musical voice has been often been blamed to have a glass cracking effect, I still would still like to list a personal favourite, a song which my ex boss sang for his bride, at a private gathering a day before his marriage..

    Tumko dekhaa to ye kayaal aayaa
    zindagii dhuup tum ghanaa saayaa
    tumako…

    aaj phir dilane ek tamannaa kii – (2)
    aaj phir dilako hamane samajhaayaa
    zindagii dhuup tum ghanaa saayaa…

    tum chale jaaoge to soche nge – (2)
    hamane kyaa khoyaa- hamane kyaa paayaa
    zindagii dhuup tum ghanaa saayaa…

    ham jise gunagunaa nahii n sakate – (2)
    vaqt ne aisaa giit kyuu n gaayaa
    zindagii dhuup tum ghanaa saayaa…

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Vijay Kumar, Mohan,

    it is indeed a sad day for all music lovers. Jagjit Singh was a decent human being, a man with the rich resonant voice like Hemant Kumar. He was never loud. Melody was his second name. I join millions of music lovers in mourning his death. His songs and ghazals will always remind us of his special place in our life.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    @ Shenoy

    Yes, indeed very sad. Jagjit had faced tragedy earlier in life when his son had died in an accident. Certainly an everlasting voice which sang songs of all emotions…

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    @ MOhan

    Yes, the couplet you qouted was amongst his best.

    Another thing ironical about Jagjit Singh was how he was rated for “not being pure enough.’ I remember a discussion I participated in, where somebody said that Jagjit Singh could not be called a ghazal Singer becasue he was not a “purist’ in terms of raag and classical music. Say as compared to Gulam Ali or Mehdi Hasan.

    While I do believe that Jagjit Singh did have a sound classical background, I always felt that he had actually got the strains of classical melody to my generation reared on English and HIndi pop.

    Is’nt it ironical that sometimes we dont value our best in thier lifetime?

    His “ahista… ahista…

    is a song I would and everybody should sing on their honey moon..

    sarakatii jaaye hai ruKh se naqaab ahista ahista
    nikalataa aa rahaa hai aaftaab ahista ahista

    jawaaN hone lage jab vo to ham se kar liyaa pardaa
    hayaa yakalaKht aayii aur shabaab ahista ahista

    shabefurkat kaa jaagaa huuN farishton ab to sone do
    kabhii fursat men kar lenaa hisaab ahista ahista

    savaalevasl par unako uduu kaa Khauf hai itanaa
    vo honThon se dete hain javaab aahistaa aahistaa

    hamaare aur tumhaare pyar men bas fark hai itanaa
    idhar to jaldii jaldii hai udhar aahistaa aahistaa

    vo bedardii se sar kaaTe “ameer” aur main kahuuN un se
    huzuur aahistaa aahistaa, janaab ahista ahista

    [Reply]

  • Anonymous

    One of the best of Jagjit Singh.

    Aah ko chaahie ek umar asar hone tak
    Kaun jeetaa haii tere zulf ke sar hone tak

    [Reply]

  • Guest

    A simpler explanation could be that Reliance is helping out an old friend.

    [Reply]

  • Guest

    A simpler explanation could be that Reliance is helping out an old friend.

    [Reply]

  • Anonymous

    is this a paid article?

    [Reply]

  • Sumit Bose

    Sunita, the tone and texture of your article (rather non-article) is mschievous. The photo is of Raj Thakeray, and not of the vandals who attacked police in Mumbai, Pune and Lucknow. Now Raj Thackeray’s protest march met “official” dead-ends but the Raza axcademy was given a carte-blanche to hold their rally against the supposed killings of the Rohingyas in Mynanmar. So many policemen injured and so many vehicles and properties set to flames. While Raj Thakeray’s protest march was absoloutely peaceful!
    The organizers of these violent rallies are roaming scot free! The originators of the threatening SMSes are also roaming scott free. Several scores of thousands have been compelled to leave their jobs and rush to safety and the Home Ministry announces that the SMSes originated from Pakistan!
    The ‘dalals’ as you are not calling the bluff of the Government that does not want any action taken againt these organizations that sent out the hate and terror SMSes or oganized violent protests, and you are planting a red herring with subtly shifting the onus on Raj Thackeray.
    Shame on you.

    [Reply]

    Gray Grace Reply:

    I completely agree with your sentiments. And it is time now when the educated hindus come forward to protect our way of life which is in great danger. Dharmo rakshati rakshitah. We must preserve our value system which had been strength of our civilization.

    [Reply]

  • Sumit Bose

    @Rajesh, I always thought till yesterday that Raj Thakeray was an ar*#-hole, but now I am beginning to see he is not all that bad, in all this official calumny and devious distortion for minority-protection he is one honest voice that has decided will not let lies overtake us all.

    [Reply]

  • http://www.lovemypetsupply.com/ Halloween dog costumes

    There was really no tearing hyurry to endorse Mukherjee; he could easily
    have waited a day or two like everybody else for things to fall into
    place. But, even though now they have got their act together, it is
    unlikely that the BJP will be able to persuade the Sena to vote for
    Purno Sangma, who has been declared as their candidate for the job.

    [Reply]

  • S Suresh

    As usual, spot on

    [Reply]

  • Dr. K. Ghosh

    Love all neighbors but continue enlarging and modernizing your armed forces for permanent peace. Fire AGNI-6 ICBM as quick as possible.

    [Reply]

  • Sachin

    Sending the right message to the Chinese is fine and dandy….how about setting the right China policies in place? The Chinese incursion occurred within weeks of assertion by NSA Shiv Shankar Menon that there’s very, very little chance of India China war. Should this be dismissed as a mere coincidence? If India’s ‘foremost’ China expert has no clue what the Chinese are upto; should he continue to guide India’s China policy, much less India’s National Security policy? Would India be better off getting advice from a sensible individual capable of a realistic assessment instead of a Chinaphile masquerading as a China ‘expert’?

    [Reply]