Bring on the Dancing Girls!

hi Renuka,
Nice one and really enjoyable.

As you have written that apsaras were sent to spoil the tapasaya of sages just wanted to know what used to happen to sages who lost to apsaras.Were they morally allowed to start their tapasaya again ? Does this use to be a black spot on their reputation and how was this considered to be on on the losing side against apsaras.
Similarly what used to happen to apsaras who were not able to do so.do they use to get some punishment from Indra or some negative marking in their roles and responsibilities.

[Reply]

renuka Reply:
May 2nd, 2009 at 10:27 am

Thanks, Anurag

[Reply]

when ur tapasya gets stopped midway due to any reason, you have to start all over again.this was gods way of testing your committment towards your tapasya.
you can restart your tapasya , but all meditation you did in the last two years will go down the drain.you will be starting from scratch.

there is no punishment for apsara.she didnt succeed meant the yogi was committed in his meditation, and that is all the god wants to know

[Reply]

renuka Reply:
May 2nd, 2009 at 10:26 am

Right on, Richa!

[Reply]

Lovely (and educative) piece. Of course, we know that there is so much more to women than meets the eye. Please bring on some more?

[Reply]

renuka Reply:
May 2nd, 2009 at 10:26 am

Thank you, will try

[Reply]

Very informative.
Your writing has raised mine interest in studying life and works of apsaras. It will be nice if you can suggest us something from where we can pick more.

[Reply]

renuka Reply:
May 2nd, 2009 at 10:24 am

Thanks. Wish I knew! This is stuff I’ve culled from a number of places over time.

[Reply]

Ms Renuka,

I have to ask you something. I looked for “Cradle Tales of Hinduism to see what it says. I am not sure even if I am reading the right stuff. Just have a look at few of the opening lines and let me know if this is the thing you were talking about.

Heading: Yudisthira in Heaven

“Once there were five brothers. One of them was an archer. One day he won a bride as a his price in a shooting-contest. The moment he came home with her he eagerly told his mother that he had won a great price in a contest, and the mother, who was busy otherwise, said to him, “Fine. Now share the price with your brothers.”
The mother’s word had to be obeyed, so the woman became the wife of the five brothers. Later the brothers engaged in a devastating war, which they won. But nearly everyone in their army got killed first, and the opposite side was wiped out. Their world seemed dark and bleak since then on. And finally they understood that their time was ended. The brothers had lived for long, and now it was time to leave the world. They wanted to go up in the heights of Himalaya to do it.”

Let me know is this one of the stories in that thing?

Thanks

[Reply]

Anil Reply:
May 5th, 2009 at 10:49 pm

The ‘woman’ or the ‘prize’ that you are referring to was no ordinary female species, Her name was Draupadi or Panchali. She represents the true character of a woman. It’s not just polyandry also. Google search Draupadi or Panchali.

[Reply]

That’s the one. Though the original would spell ‘price’ as ‘prize’.

[Reply]

Pyare public, here’s one of my favourites, in its charming old language from 102 years ago. As you read, you will see that Sister Nivedita retold these tales for English children (since the Indian ones knew them already).

Cradle Tales of Hinduism

The Judgement-Seat of Vikramaditya

(a village tale retold by Sister Nivedita)

FOR many centuries in Indian history there was no city so famous as the city of Ujjain. It was always renowned as the seat of learning. Here lived at one time the poet Kalidasa, one of the supreme poets of the world, fit to be named with Homer and Dante and Shakespeare. And here worked and visited, only a hundred and fifty years ago, an Indian king, who was also a great and learned astronomer, the greatest of his day, Rajah Jay Singh of Jaipur. So one can see what a great love all who care for India must feel for the ancient city of Ujjain.

But deep in the hearts of the Indian people, one name is held even dearer than those I have mentioned — the name of Vikramaditya, who became King of Malwa, it is said, in the year 57 before Christ. How many, many years ago must that be! But so dearly is he remembered, that to this day when a Hindu wants to write a letter, after putting something religious at the top — “The Name of the Lord,” or “Call on the Lord,” or something of the sort — and after writing his address, as we all do in beginning a letter, when he states the date, he would not say, “of the year of the Lord 1900,” for instance, meaning 1900 years after Christ, as we might, but he would say of the year 1957 of The Era of Vikramaditya.” [The name of this era is Samvat] So we can judge for ourselves whether that whether that name is ever likely to be forgotten in India.

Now who was this Vikramaditya, and why was he so loved? The whole of that secret, after so long a time, we can scarcely hope to recover. He was like our King Arthur, or like Alfred the Great — so strong and true and gentle that the men of his own day almost worshipped him, and those of all after times were obliged to give him the first pace, though they had never looked in his face, nor appealed to his great and tender heart — simply because they could see that never king had been loved like this king. But one thing we do know about Vikramaditya. It is told of him that he was the greatest judge in history.

Never was he deceived. Never did he punish the wrong man. The guilty trembled when they came before him, for they knew that his eyes would look straight into their guilt. And those who had difficult questions to ask, and wanted to know the truth, were thankful to be allowed to come, for they knew that their King would never rest till he understood the matter, and that then he would give an answer that would convince all.

And so, in after times in India, when any judge pronounced sentence with great skill, it would be said of him, “Ah, he must have sat on the Judgment-Seat of Vikramaditya!” And this was the habit of speech of the whole country. Yet in Ujjain itself the poor people forgot that the heaped-up ruins a few miles away had been his palace, and only the rich and learned, and the wise men who lived in kings’ courts, remembered. The story I am about to tell you happened long, long ago; but yet there had been time for the old palace and fortress of Ujjain to fall into ruins, and for the sand to be heaped up over them, covering the blocks of stone, and bits of old wall, often with grass and dust, and even trees. There had been time, too, for the people to forget.

In those days, the people of the villages, as they do still, used to send their cows out to the wild land to graze. Early in the morning they would go, in the care of the shepherds, and not return till evening, close on dusk. How I wish I could show you that coming and going of the Indian cows!

Such gentle little creatures they are, with such large wise eyes, and a great hump between rheir shoulders! And they are not timid or wild, like our cattle. For in India, amongst the Hindus, every one loves them. They are very useful and precious in that hot, dry country, and no one is allowed to tease or frighten them. Instead of that, the little girls come at daybreak and pet them, giving them food and hanging necklaces of flowers about their necks, saying poetry to them, and even strewing flowers before their feet! And the cows, for their part seem to feel as if they belonged to the family, just as our cats and dogs do.

If they live in the country, they delight in being taken out to feed on the grass in the day-time; but of course some one must go with them, to frighten off wild beasts, and to see that they do not stray too far. They wear little tinkling bells, that ring as they move their heads, saying, “Here! here!” And when it is time to go home to the village for the night, what a pretty sight they make!

One cowherd stands and calls at the edge of the pasture and another goes around behind the cattle, to drive them towards him, and so they come quietly forward from here and there, sometimes breaking down the brushwood in their path. And when the herdsmen are sure that all are safe, they turn home-wards — one leading in front, one bringing up the rear, and the cows making a long procession between them. As they go they kick up the dust along the sun-baked pah, till at last they seem to be moving through a cloud, with the last rays of the sunset touching it. And so the Indian people call twilight, cowdust, “the hour of cowdust” (Godhuli).

It is a very peaceful, a very lovely moment. All about the village can be heard the sound of the children playing. The men are seated, talking, around the foot of some old tree, and the women are gossiping or praying in their houses. Tomorrow, before dawn, all will be up and hard at work again, but this is the time of rest and joy. Such was the life of the shepherd boys in the villages about Ujjain.
There were many of them, and in the long days on the pastures they had plenty of time for fun. One day they found a playground. Oh, how delightful it was! The ground under the trees was rough and uneven. Here and there the end of a great stone peeped out, and many of those stones were beautifully carven. In the middle was a green mound, looking just like a judge’s seat.

One of the boys thought so at least, and he ran forward with a whoop and seated himself on it. “I say, boys,” he cried, “I’ll be judge and you can all bring cases before me, and we’ll have trials!” Then he straightened his face, and became very grave, to act the part of judge.

The others saw the fun at once, and, whispering amongst themselves, quickly made up some quarrel, and appeared before him, saying very humbly, “May your Worship be pleased to settle between my neighbour and me which is in the right?” Then they stated the case, one saying that a certain field was his, another that it was not, and so on. But now a strange thing made itself felt. When the judge had sat down on the mound, he was just a common boy. But when he had heard the ques tion, even to the eyes of the frolicsome lads, he seemed quite different. He was now full of gravity, and, instead of answering in fun, he took the case seriously, and gave an answer which in that particular case was perhaps the wisest that man had ever heard. The boys were a little frightened. For though they could not appreciate the judgment, yet his tone and manner were strange and impressive. Still they thought it was fun, and went away again, and, with good deal more whispering, concocted another case.

Once more they put it to their judge, and once more he gave a reply, as it were out of the depth of a long experience, with incontrovertible wisdom. And this went on for hours and hours, he sitting on the judge’s set, listening to the questions propounded by the others, and always pronouncing sentence with the same wonderful gravity and power. Till it was time to take the cows home, and till he jumped down from his place, and was just like any other cowherd.

The boys could never forget that day, and ever after when they heard of any perplexing dispute they would set this boy on the mound, and put it to him. And always the same thing happened. The spirit of knowledge and justice would come to him, and he would show them the truth. But when he came down from his seat, he would be no different from other boys. Gradually the news of this spread through the countryside, and grown-up men and women from all the villages about that part would bring their lawsuits to be decided in the court of the herd-boys on the grass under the green trees. And always they received a judgment that both sides understood, and went away satisfied. So all the disputes in that neighbourhood were settled.

Now Ujjain had long ceased to be a capital and the King now lived very far away, hence it was some time before he heard the story. At last, however, it came to his ears. “Why,” he said, “that boy must have sat on the Judgment-Seat of Vikramaditya!” He spoke without thinking, but all around him were learned men, who knew the chronicles. They looked at one another. “The King speaks truth,” they said; “the ruins in yonder meadows were once Vikramaditya’s palace!”

Now this sovereign had long desired to be possessed with the spirit of law and justice. Every day brought its problems and diffculties to him, and he often felt weak and ignorant in deciding matters that needed wisdom and strength. “If sitting on the mound brings it to the shepherd boy,” he thought, “let us dig deep and find the Judgment-Seat. I shall put it in the chief place in my hall of audience, and on it I shall sit to hear all cases.Then the spirit of Vikramaditya will descend on me also, and I shall always be a just judge!”

So men with spades and tools came to disturb the ancient peace of the pastures, and the grassy knoll where the boys had played was overturned. All about the spot were now heaps of earth and broken wood and upturned sod. And the cows had to be driven further afield. But the heart of the boy who had been judge was sorrowful, as if the very home of his soul were being taken away from him.

At last the labourers came on something. They uncovered it — a slab of black marble, supported on the hands and outspread wings of twenty-five stone angels, with their faces turned outwards as if for flight — surely the Judgment-Seat of Vikramaditya. With great rejoicing it was brought to the city, and the King himself stood by while it was put in the chief place in the hall of justice. Then the nation was ordered to observe three days of prayer and fasting, for on the fourth day the King would ascend the new throne publicly, and judge justly amongst the people.

At last the great morning arrived, and crowds assembled to see the Taking of the Seat. Pacing through the long hall came the judges and priests of the kingdom, followed by the sovereign. Then, as they reached the Throne of Judgment, they parted into two lines, and he walked up the middle, prostrated himself before it, and went close up to the marble slab.

When he had done this, however, and was just about to sit down, one of the twentyfive stone angels began to speak “Stop!” it said: “Thinkest thou that thou art worthy to sit on the Judgment-Seat of Vikramaditya? Hast thou never desired to bear rule over kingdoms that were not thine own?” And the countenance of the stone angel was full of sorrow. At these words the King felt as if a light had blazed up within him, and shown him a long array of tyrannical wishes. He knew that his own life was unjust. After a long pause he spoke. “No,” he said, “I am not worthy.”

“Fast and pray yet three days,” said the angel “that thou mayest purify thy will, and make good thy right to seat thyself thereon.” And with these words it spread its wings and flew away. And when the King lifted up his face, the place of the speaker was empty, and only twenty-four figures supported the marble slab.

And so there was another three days of royal retreat, and he prepared himself with prayer and with fasting to come again and essay to sit on the Judgment-Seat of Vikramaditya

But this time it was even as before. Another stone angel addressed him, and asked him a question which was yet more searching. “Hast thou never,” it said, “coveted the riches of another?” And when at last he spoke and said, “Yea, I have done this thing; I am not worthy to sit on the Judgment-Seat of Vikramaditya!” the angel commanded him to fast and pray yet another three days, and spread its wings and flew away into the blue. At last four times twenty-four days had gone, and still three more days of fasting, and it was now the hundredth day. Only one angel was left supporting the marble slab and the King drew near with great confidence for today he felt sure of being allowed to take his place.

But as he drew near and prostrated, the last angel spoke: “Art thou, then, perfectly pure in heart, O King?” it said. “Is thy will like unto that of a little child? If so, thou art indeed worthy to sit on this seat!”

“No,” said the King, speaking very slowly, and once more searching his own conscience, as the judge examines the prisoner at the bar, but with great sadness; “No, I am not worthy.”

And at these words the angel flew up into the air, bearing the slab upon its head, so that never since that day has it been seen upon the earth

But when the King came to himself and was alone, pondering over the matter, he saw that the last angel had explained the mystery. Only he who was pure in heart, like a little child, could be perfectly just. That was why the shepherd boy in the forest could sit where no king in the world might come, on the Judgment-Seat of Vikramaditya.

…….

[Reply]

Ms Renuka,

By reading this script, I was compelled to look for “Ujjain” and “Vikramaditya” on google. To me these names of kings and locations are unknown. My google search revieled the location of this city called Ujjain in Madhiya Pradesh (which I did not know earlier) and Vikramaditya had his rule from Bali to Iran or so.

I thought the invading dynasties only came from Central Asia, Afghanistan and Iran to rule India and attacks only took place from historic Western borders (Peshawar and Punjab region) to Eastern plains in Northern India to Central India.

But somewhere in the net, it was said that Vikramaditya had his rule from Bali to Middle East (probably Iran).

What I could not find however was that was Vikramaditya an Aryan or Drividian!!

[Reply]

Omar Reply:
May 3rd, 2009 at 11:50 am

Also what I forgot to mention is that I am amazed that such a huge area (from Bali to Iran) was ruled back then (102 BCE to 15 CE). I mean, it makes me go “wow” when I try imagining those old times and his huge empire.

Ms Renuka, I was thinking to learn hindi through the net. I have already started doing this. Would this help? and would you have wanted me to learn hindi if was to ask you?

[Reply]

Harsha Vardhana had an empire too with his capital in Thaneswar, across the Gangetic Plains. You’ll still find Indian boys called ‘Harshvardhan’…
And Rajendra Chola – pronounced ‘Shola” or “Shozha” of the Chola dynasty of South India – son of Rajaraja the First (capital at Thanjavur in the Delta of the River Kaveri) , went up to the Ganga in the north. He also sent a deepsea navy from India out to the Straits of Sumatra. This was to fix the local king, Vijayatunga, who was harassing Indian merchants en route in their trade with China. He built and trained the navy after his merchants (Chettiyaar…Tamil for ‘Seth’, merchant) came to him in a deputation and urged him to take action. After that expedition, many kings in the region of Southeast Asia sent him tribute.
This happened in the 11th century CE.
It’s up to you if you want to learn Hindi.

[Reply]

Omar,

My suggestion to you is to look for a more authentic source than ‘Cradle Tales of Hinduism’ to understand what really happened centuries ago.
Ofcourse, all of us are guessing when it comes to historic facts, but things like ‘Apsaras in heaven’ are more likely just symbols than actual humans.

Also, if you are learning a language from scratch anyway, Sanskrit may be a better choice when it comes to understanding hinduism. Hindi doesnt give you a lot of advantage over English because I dont know of ‘authentic’ hindu literature that was available in Hindi but not in English. Obviously, I am not a language expert or a historian (or an expert in hinduism) so I could be wrong.

[Reply]

Your blog this time has bhang my tapasya. All these Apsaras wow ! In no mood to start another Bharat or Mahabharat. I am sure your great granny would have made rasam out of bhoot jhalokia spiked with vile and venom. But why apsaras our devgans also were somtimes woken out of slumber or brought to their senses, not by apasaras but by goddesses. For this they took affront. Some times they would test the purity of women by some strange demands. That’s how Bramha, Vishnu and Mahesh became Dattatratrey. Brahma himelf cursed not one but four goddeses and that’s how Panchali was born. He was jested by goddesses none other than Parvati, Shyamala,Usha and Sachi.

It is interesting to note that the throne of King of the Gods, Lord Indra was always shaken if some mortal who stood one legged. Vishwamitra’s tapasya bhang is symbolic of the fact that no mortal can create pratishrishti (parallel universe). It is better to attain salvation.

Comparing apsaras to bar girls is also symbolic. Come to think of it the bar girls are doing one of the most honest jobs on this earth. No deception here. You get what you pay for. No emotional sentiments or attachment like apsaras. On top of it they are supporting their familes in villages. That’s a social aspect. After all they are being shown all over bollywood, five star hotels weddings. It also tells us about another upanishad saying . “Tyen tagthen bhunjitha..” Only those who have indulged know what tyaga is. Can’t find an appropriate word for it in english for tyaga. Renunciation would come nearest.

Vikram and Vetal stories, I think, also relate to same Vikramaditya. I am not too sure. But ‘Godhuli’ reminded me of the beautiful movie made by B V Karanth.

I hope some sensible Government comes to rehabilitate these Bar girls !

“Desh ki Nani Zindabad”

[Reply]

Mr/Ms K

Thanks for suggestion. My worst constraint is that not everything is available to me to consult, even if I go to book stores here in Canada. I thought Internet could be good source of knowledge but again, I need to be sure that I am not wasting my time by reading some kind of **** that is so often uploaded on internet.

I had started learning Hindi two weeks ago but I still asked Ms Renuka so that I would know if that would be of any help. I can now read and write (with lots of spelling mistakes) but ofcourse with lots of mistakes.

However, I have a Hindu book (I dont own it though) which I thought I would have a look at it but sadly the language used there is beyond my comprehension. That is in Hindi but unreadable for me.

I am thankful to Ms Renuka and few others who have given me their recommendations and I am looking into it. Good thing is that whatever people here talk about, makes me search on google and wikipedia.

[Reply]

Interestingly the Sanjay Khan directed Jai Hanuman(derived from many sources) portrays Punjikasthala (in a rebirth caused, as usual,by the anger of a sage) as Anjana, the mother of Hanuman.
This was of course much after he was conceived by Shiva and Vishnu. Not sure if this is an accepted version though
Prasanth

[Reply]

renuka Reply:
May 8th, 2009 at 12:03 am

The Purans run riot! And the Ramayana has more than 350 versions, it’s a living text. As far as I know, Shiva-Vishnu combined energies while Vishnu was in the guise of Mohini (after he had saved Shiva from Bhasmasura) and the result was Sri Ayappan, deity of Sabarimala in Kerala. Been there twice as a little girl when I lived in Cochin: very, VERY special. The route is thru three grand Shiva temples, Vaikom, Kaduthuruthy/Kazhuthuruthy and Ettumaanoor.
Ambalapuzha, Chottanikara Amman (the powerful Bhagavathi temple where you go to be cured of madness), Uadayanapuram (to Karthikeya, near Vaikom) and the only temple to Rama’s brother, Bharata, in Irinjalakuda, Sri Padmanabhaswamy in Trivandrum and the crown jewel, Sri Guruvayoorappan’s temple in Thrissur, the cultural capital of Kerala, so many more…Kerala overflows with exquisite places. Some could do with a spot of reform, though, a second Temple Entry Movement.

[Reply]

I would like to cite one thing.

In kalyug also, once a king, to check that whether its really Guru Nanak or not, he sent diamonds and platinums to Guru Nanak, but guru didn’t gave an eye to that.

Then he finally sent these apsaras and Guru ji suddenly opened his eyes and called them “Come here my sweet daughters, i was waiting for you only,” and then, they also called guru ji as their father.

I wrote this to tell you that don’t you dare to point out finger on sikh religion as it would be like wasting your own time.

But still go ahead, while researching about them, you will chant their name so many times, and it will ultimately wash off all your sins.

Want to know any thing about sikhism, just drop a mail above given address.

I am not offending you, you are sweet.

[Reply]

Sat Sri Akal. Love the Gurus, esply Chadar-e-Hind Sri Guru Tegh Bahadur and Sri Guru Gobind Singh. For a landmark event in my life, I did shukrana with kirtan and langar at my colony gurdwara. Don’t know why the Gurus have such a hold on my heart, but they do…perhaps it’s because of their unflinching courage and because they talked straight even while feeling intensely,…. ‘yaarde da sannu sattar changga, bhat khediyan da rehna’, as GGS wrote, whose essence I also find in the Bible: ‘better a dinner of herbs where love is than a fattened ox and hatred to go with it’.. Proverbs, 15:47.
Let me write the verse for the happiness of saying it:
Mitter pyaare nu haal mureedan da kehna
Tudh bin rog rajjaiyan da odaan, nag nivasan da rehna
Sool surahi, khanjar pyala, bing kasaiyyan da sehna
Yaarde da sannu sattar changga, bhat khediyan da rehna.

And this one gives me courage every time:
Deh Shiva var moh ihe
Shubh karman se kabhon na taron
Na daron arson jab chahe ladon
Nishchai kar apni jeet karon.

[Reply]

Oops, that’s Proverbs 15:17

[Reply]

Dear Renuka,
Hi. I am still in Kerala, we finished Siddharth’s Upanayanam on 6 th and was busy with guests . I did visit Padmanabha Swamy Temple and Srikanteshwar Siva Temple and also conveyed your namaskarams to the Lord. This time I was able to show both my kids the Murals around the temple. When I made a mistake on one of the murals an elderly gentlemen corrected me I mistook Nataraja can you believe it. He was also kind enough to show other murals there was Seetha in Ashok van and a very large mural of Sri Padmanabha . Me and Siddharth scooted off to Sri Chitra Art Gallery to see more murals and mainly Raja Ravi Varma. I want to go to the one near the temple . You have the Lady with the lamp , which has a 3 D effect. We also saw the Big museum in the zoo-museum complex. I saw a Bhiksha Dana Murthy of Siva. What is the Eidhikam behind this ?

Also am busy teaching Siddu his 3 Sandhyas, there is a book by MB Publishers. My brother-in-law is a better teacher since he knows the intonations correctly. But when he is not there I have to take over, Siddu is very happy when the tone is flat it is faster . When I go back I have to look for a CD. But he is sharp most of the mantras he has already grasped.

Regards from Siddharth and me

[Reply]

Hi Latha, Good to hear your news and very best wishes to Siddharth. Will call Dikshitar about the Aitihyam (history/legend)….was it Shiva at Kashi getting bhiksha from ‘Annapurne Sadapurne..’?

[Reply]

Dear Renukaji

I think that “cant tell” is a silly ***. What does he mean by saying -

“I wrote this to tell you that don’t you dare to point out finger on sikh religion as it would be like wasting your own time.”

There wasn’t any reference to Sikh holy figures in your article on fully Sanatani apsaras.

I am glad you explained your love and reverence for Sikhism, but i believe these insecure, intellectually shallow self-styled defenders of the faith, of whatever religion they may be, need no explanations.

Anyhow, I would love to meet an apsara – just imagine

1. meet uber-hot chick
2. Get to know her, in the biblical sense
3. Move along without the kachda that goes with man-woman relationships

I mean how good does that get?

[Reply]

Just to restore perspective, apsaras were rewards for “deserving” men

[Reply]

Trust the men folk to get all excited about having a ‘no- ties’ relationship with the apsaraas!! What about the rewards for deserving ladies eh?

Renukaji- fabulous post as always. Love the variety that you dish out here. This one took me from a heavenly journey to the earthy shabads…. kudos!

[Reply]

Trust the men folk to get all excited about having a ‘no- ties’ relationship with the apsaras!! What about the rewards for deserving ladies eh?

Renukaji- fabulous post as always. Love the variety that you dish out here. This one took me from a heavenly journey to the earthy shabads…. kudos!

[Reply]

thanks Diva! Somebody asked me the name of the son born to Urvashi and Pururavas. It’s ‘Ayush’.

[Reply]

nice

[Reply]