Will Gilani survive the judicial tsunami?

Will Gilani survive the judicial tsunami?

Will Gilani survive the judicial tsunami?

no no.another pm will be appointed,game is continue upto october.then upper house elections will be finisded.he will fix his people at right places.then new elections will be declared.

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Alignment between Military and Judiciary against Democracy is not good for India.

One hopes that Gilani will survive, if the basic equation in Pakistan has to change.

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~~~~ ZARDARI & GILANI ARE THE TWO KAFIRS ~~ for ISI and army ~~ !!
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The duo of Zardari and Gilani have done the unthinkable. In a state where the Army was supreme and the ISI the queen of the Army, Zardari and Gilani committed apostasy. By willing to sell the ISI to the US in memogate.

The evil empire of the Pak Army and the ISI is now striking back thru the judiciary. Times have gone where Pakistan could have passed another coup as seasonal Pakistani wedding

Now they need the dollars and international support as never before. So the Army will probably toss of Zardari and Gilani and replace them with Imran and Shah qureshi over a period of time.

On hindishgt, the Zardari- gilani combination was the best India could have hoped for.

Imran has been called Taliban without beard by Musharraff, who should know a lot.

Sadly his ascenscion would be welcomed by our media thinking one of them– an English speaking Oxonion has climbed the throne. But then Imran would do what he did in gthe 80’s Sharjah matches.

Some ball tampering, some help from Dawood. And then a full fledged confrontation with India.

Sadly he would be cheered by a fawning India media all the time….

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This despicable post got lost in the tirade over reservations and merits a repeat airing.

Singulate, you can also be called doubulate.

4. Blacks never resorted to conversion of the whites, whereas the Muslims are even now converting Hindus to IUslam.

The post is not surprising, lack of response to it is.

India has not been ruled by Muslims for hundreds of years, however they still seem to rule B. V. Shenoy’s pea brain.

So because Muslims at one point in our history ruled India, then ALL present day Muslims, including Tamil and Malyalam ones, should be the subject of revenge discrimination.

The fact that some Muslims foolishly separated themselves into an unsustainable new nation, then those who chose to stay in India, should be discriminated, victimised and dominated by the majority.

The RSS could not have stated this garbage better.

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Banana State or what!
Maulayam has promised 1) 1000 Rsf for unemployed t youth 2) free electricity to weavers and farmers 3) Free medical care (including medicines)

A state of monkeys led by a big monkey Hanuman (no pun intended)

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Dear Ravi,

Here we are not talking about Discrimination of Muslims, but REVERSE discrimination ( Reservations). Do we have any law which discriminates Muslims on the basis of their religion. Reservations to all other communities is on the basis of assumption that they are backwards as they were discriminated in past.Have Muslims been discriminated in past on the basis of religion? Can we make any such presumptions? Even in areas where Hindu rulers were there, Muslims did not suffer discrimination.

There is no provision for Reservation on the basis of religion in our constitution.Infact if this criteria is selected, then Hindus and Buddhists should get reservation as they were badly discriminated in 600-700 years of Islamic rule. There is documentary evidence to support this. Evidence which comes from Muslim writers and Historians.

I think Mr Shenoy has given very clear and valid reasons.We shiy away from stating these reasons. There is a tendency in so called intellectual circle to make politically correct statements even when they are hopelessly incorrect statements. Like all religions are same, or all religions preach peace.

Muslim backwardness is self inflicted. It stems from there philosophy and not from any environmental discrimination. Any govt help on economic considerations should be and shall be applicable to them. Muslims have to study , particularly their girls/ women. Infact , if any reservation is to be given, let it be given to Muslim girls/women as they are the most discriminated lot.They are discriminated by Muslim society on the basis of their gender. In their case, there seems to be a valid justification.

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Dear Ravi,

Here we are not talking about Discrimination of Muslims, but REVERSE discrimination ( Reservations). Do we have any law which discriminates Muslims on the basis of their religion. Reservations to all other communities is on the basis of assumption that they are backwards as they were discriminated in past.Have Muslims been discriminated in past on the basis of religion? Can we make any such presumptions? Even in areas where Hindu rulers were there, Muslims did not suffer discrimination.

There is no provision for Reservation on the basis of religion in our constitution.Infact if this criteria is selected, then Hindus and Buddhists should get reservation as they were badly discriminated in 600-700 years of Islamic rule. There is documentary evidence to support this. Evidence which comes from Muslim writers and Historians.

I think Mr Shenoy has given very clear and valid reasons.We shiy away from stating these reasons. There is a tendency in so called intellectual circle to make politically correct statements even when they are hopelessly incorrect statements. Like all religions are same, or all religions preach peace.

Muslim backwardness is self inflicted. It stems from there philosophy and not from any environmental discrimination. Any govt help on economic considerations should be and shall be applicable to them. Muslims have to study , particularly their girls/ women. Infact , if any reservation is to be given, let it be given to Muslim girls/women as they are the most discriminated lot.They are discriminated by Muslim society on the basis of their gender. In their case, there seems to be a valid justification.

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Its fun to watch the political circus in the communally bigoted entity spawned by the communal criminal jinnah and also the discomfort of the dirty peddlers of the criminal entity here.

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MillionaireLoveLinks.COMready for love?

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Spineless Congress unable to uphold constitutional freedoms. Obliging mullahs is the name of the game. Shameful.
——-

Salman Rushdie persuaded to stay away from Jaipur Literature Festival

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/city/jaipur/Salman-Rushdie-persuaded-to-stay-away-from-Jaipur-Literature-Festival/articleshow/11517786.cms

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@ Prhalad

When are you replacing Manish Tewari?

You certainly have a spin for everything the COngress does. Now that it has stopped Salman Rushdie from coming to India, you can give credit to it for respecting Muslim sentiments.

I think it is shameful, sad a erevelation of COngress low thinking which seeks to censor the net, regulate facebook , ban Salman and then claim we are liberal !!

Wah ji wah !! Macarthyism, Maoism, Kim Sung II ism and Rahulism is all one and the same thing….

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We are all with Gen V K Singh in his fight against the Corrupt UPA govt . Why this controversy ? …Is it because of the Ineptidude of a useless and worthless Defence Minister and a titular PM ? or is there a deeper reason …the influence of a hidden hand which is not accountable but wields all the power ? … Meethinks it is the latter. Gen V K Singh’s uncrompomising stand on Adarsh scam and others , has ruffled too many feathers . . .and it has also do with the appointment of his successor.
This government of scamsters and scumsters can truly be credited with demolishing all institutions like the office of CVC , CAG , attacks on Judiciary… and now the office of Army Chief.
Last evening when the movie on Star Movies was interrupted by a longish break , I thought let me switch over to some News channel… and I saw the familiar face our friend Mr Vinod Sharma on NDTV India. Smiling …. or was it sniggering .? ..at Manish Sisodia of Team Anna . Sharma Sahib is very angry with Team Anna for the same reason as Digvijay Singh.. he finds them essentially an Anti Congress political group.. and not their professed cause…a sort of Trojan horse. We ask why should not Sharma Sahib look inwards and disclose his own true allegiance… “kyon nahin danke ki chot par kehte hain ki main T V channels par Congress party ki vakalat karta hoon ”
No … probably I am wrong … Congress has a vested Right to fund and put up Fronts like Sahmat ..Teesta Setalvad…and her cohorts.. Sanjeev Bhatt .. and so many others

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Vijay mate, your long post in the the last blog disappointed me. I gently reminded you of muslim women dying in childbirth in remote villages, I spoke of muslims living in huts while Yadavs drove around in cars.
THAT IS NOT SOCIAL JUSTICE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
All I got from fellow bloggers-
-reservation for muslims is unconstitutional
- Sardar Patel- I respect this man- said something in 1948
-Muslims were not discriminated against and so on

guys, guys, guys, you all serious ???????????????????? give your fellow brother muslim a chance , a chance to uplift himself and become a Zaheer Khan or Azim PREMJI and show his love for India
Vijay and Aaloke, dudes I make you PM of India- now think with compassion and justice

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Rizwan,

This is was Gopiji has posted. Your words.

“” Paswans riding in Toyotas, while Mrs Sharma is cleaning the factory. The unfortunate thing is that Mrs Sharma’s children will never get an opportunity.”"

This is problem with caste/religion based reservation. Lot of desvering poor people
will miss out beacuse of this.Poor people deserve and should get the benefits
of the reservation and it should not matter from which caste/religion they belong.

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Cry my beloved country!

Yesterday, three brothers killed their 16 year old younger sister because she was in love with a boy from her school.

This happened in Noida

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I was watching test cricket between Pakistan and England for a short while.
This Pakistani spinner, Saeed Ajmal is a magician. He has mesmerized the
English batsmen and no one is able to read him properly. Harbajan should learn
few tricks from him.

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Aaloke

There are many a times when I find my self disagreeing with you, yet I can not find to words and motivation to contradict you.

This may be because you operate on a higher spiritual level that I – which is not very difficult. However, here it goes.

Muslim poverty is self-inficted. I could not disagree with you more, even if I wanted it.

I suggest that you give, economic, rather than spiritual consideration to the following.

Holy city of Benares has thousands of looms upon which Muslim weavers weave world’s best saris.

City of Moradabad has many furnaces which produce Brass nick nacks, etc.

In both these examples, there are many more, take the market price of Sari/Brass Object and trace it back to the poor worker and calculate who took what amount of profit in that chain which stretches from the customer back to the worker.

Once you have done that, then tell me if the poverty is self inflicted.

If structural discrimination in our society is based upon caste and religion then so must be the affirmative action designed to counter it. Once our society is stratified purely on economic basis, then it will be appropriate for affirmative actions – designed for the upliftment of the poor – can be distributed on economic criteria.

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Dear Prahlad,

(This is response to Prahlad’s earlier post.)

Have you ever been to Gujrat. When you drive on Ahmedabad – Surat highway, almost all restaurants along the road are owned by Muslims. The restaurants are big, newly constructed , almost all offer Vegetarian fare as their clients are mostly Gujrati Hindus. Have you met Bohra Muslims in Gujrat, Maharastra, Rajasthan and parts of M.P, they are one of the best merchants and business men in states already brimming with business talent. I recently came to know about another muslim community in Gujrat who have excelled in a big way in transport business. They have gone in this business only in last 15-20 years. Before that they were not doing well as a community. There was a detailed article on this community and its progress in India Today.

Now so much is happening for Muslims in a state which so many claim is very communal, if all above examples (two of which I know personally) are possible, why is it not possible in other states. Above examples are possible because Muslims do not have any handicap for growth except their philosophy. In above examples, Muslims have modified their philosophy. Like in restaurants, they are offering Vegetarian fare in tune with Client requirements. You will not find this in UP. Bohras are very comfortable in dealing with non-muslims. Has Rizwan faced any problem because he is from Muslim community. As Gopi tells us repeatedly, In Kerela, Muslims are much better off than Hindus. Infact, Hindus come last in social ranking. First being Christians. So should we have reservation for Hindus in Kerela ? In Whole of South India, Muslims are generally equal or better placed than any other community. How has that happened. Majority of top heros in Bollywood are Muslim born. Much-much higher than muslim population percentage. If we go as per Sachar Panel logic, should we create reservation for Non-Muslims in “Hero “ roles.

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BOOM BOOM RIZWAN
_____________________________
Rizwan puttar I am going to tie you in chains, shakle yr feet and imprison u. So u never leave blog. Bhaut khush keeta, I am proud there are young Indians like you who think without prism of history, without burden.
puttar you set fire to blog. Aloke , can u read, we are NOT, REPEAT NOT talking abt rich Malyaali muslims or restaurant owners in Gujrat. We are talking about dirty poor muslims who could do with help. And Mrs Sharma, widow who sweeps floor in Rizwans factory.

I WANT TO SHOUT TO VIJAY, SHENOY, AALOK, yes reservation is esential for all poor, only poor, remove caste label. Every word of Rizwans 3 posts above reads like liquid cold , evryone pl you read it. “”Paswans and Yadavs are new brahmins and Nawaabs “”
brilliant. Thanks to gopi, manohar and mohan for clarity
PROF SHAH ALAM, WHERE R U , SIRJI, PL write here on imp issue

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@Ravi, Thanks for the upper cut delivered on my behalf to the garment factory owner from Konkan.As the discussion is veeing again towards the merits or demerits of reservation , RATHER THAN THE SHENANIGAN OF PAKISTANI JUDICIARY, LETS
REPOST IT
RESERVATION a RATIONALIST AND A HUMANIST’S PERSPECTIVE
reservation is given to a certain section of society ,SO THAT THEY CAN SEE SOME ROLE MODEL amongst them , they can aspire , and the multiplier effect to do the rest.The fundamental impediment to the progress of BLACKS in USA was their lack of self esteem and self beleif , WHICH HAVE BEEN BURIED ALIVE BY THE WHITE SLAVE MASTERS.Same situation in India , some section of society cannnot even think ,let alone try for climbing the socialladder .FOR THEY HAVE NO ROLE MODEL AMONST THEM IN THE NEIGHBOURHOOD.
But the best away to proceed is to TARGET these POCKETS , and START FROM SCHOOL EDUCATION , with GOOD NUTRITION AND EXTRA GOOD SCHOOL,preparing them for the college , WHERE THEY SHOULD GET INTO RESERVATION QUOTA , because their parents cannot afford TEN PRIVATE PRIVATE TUTORS , ONE FOR EACH SUBJECT.
But POVERTY should be only criteria and GEOGRAPHICAL AREA. not religion
but the benefeciaries will be the same , SC/ST/MUSLIMS.
Just catapulting them to middle class does reduce the chances of humiliation by a higher caste , albeit marginally.

Also some “enlightened” bloggers have suggested the old chestnut , muslim plight is self inflicted. Also ignorance galore , when they DEMAND PENANCE FROM HAPLESS MUSLIMS( BUT NOT FROM BHIWANDI FACTORY OWNER’S SON)
As to the former comment If I recall correctly form the film TO KILL A MOCKING BIRD, there is a scene where a white racist screams “What can I do if GOD has made you ugly”. AHMED PATEL , or HOsain Ali MONDAL , as the surname suggests HAS NO GENETIC OR WHATEVER CONNECTION WITH THE RULING INVADERS.
99% , I REPEAT 99% of INDIAN MUSLIMS ARE LOW CASTE CONVERTS , who left the fold due to BRAMHINICAL OPPRESSION , some were so beyond the pale (UNTOUCHABLE, as the very word suggests) , NOBODY CARED , so my theory is never had any specific religion. The Mcdonald’s of religion that is ISLAM stepped CONQUERED THE MARKET,
More later , got called to OT

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@Ravi, Thanks for the upper cut delivered on my behalf to the garment factory owner from Konkan.As the discussion is veeing again towards the merits or demerits of reservation , RATHER THAN THE SHENANIGAN OF PAKISTANI JUDICIARY, LETS
REPOST IT
RESERVATION a RATIONALIST AND A HUMANIST’S PERSPECTIVE
reservation is given to a certain section of society ,SO THAT THEY CAN SEE SOME ROLE MODEL amongst them , they can aspire , and the multiplier effect to do the rest.The fundamental impediment to the progress of BLACKS in USA was their lack of self esteem and self beleif , WHICH HAVE BEEN BURIED ALIVE BY THE WHITE SLAVE MASTERS.Same situation in India , some section of society cannnot even think ,let alone try for climbing the socialladder .FOR THEY HAVE NO ROLE MODEL AMONST THEM IN THE NEIGHBOURHOOD.
But the best away to proceed is to TARGET these POCKETS , and START FROM SCHOOL EDUCATION , with GOOD NUTRITION AND EXTRA GOOD SCHOOL,preparing them for the college , WHERE THEY SHOULD GET INTO RESERVATION QUOTA , because their parents cannot afford TEN PRIVATE PRIVATE TUTORS , ONE FOR EACH SUBJECT.
But POVERTY should be only criteria and GEOGRAPHICAL AREA. not religion
but the benefeciaries will be the same , SC/ST/MUSLIMS.
Just catapulting them to middle class does reduce the chances of humiliation by a higher caste , albeit marginally.

Also some “enlightened” bloggers have suggested the old chestnut , muslim plight is self inflicted. Also ignorance galore , when they DEMAND PENANCE FROM HAPLESS MUSLIMS( BUT NOT FROM BHIWANDI FACTORY OWNER’S SON)
As to the former comment If I recall correctly form the film TO KILL A MOCKING BIRD, there is a scene where a white racist screams “What can I do if GOD has made you ugly”. AHMED PATEL , or HOsain Ali MONDAL , as the surname suggests HAS NO GENETIC OR WHATEVER CONNECTION WITH THE RULING INVADERS.
99% , I REPEAT 99% of INDIAN MUSLIMS ARE LOW CASTE CONVERTS , who left the fold due to BRAMHINICAL OPPRESSION , some were so beyond the pale (UNTOUCHABLE, as the very word suggests) , NOBODY CARED , so my theory is never had any specific religion. The Mcdonald’s of religion that is ISLAM stepped CONQUERED THE MARKET,
More later , got called to OT

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Delhi Univ is fogged out today… but this blog is burning bright !

So the bloggers find Pakistan boring and have turned back to Muslim reservations. I too have some views on this. But let me add… at variance with that of Rizwan. I did not face any discrimination on my road to management at delhi Univ.However i feel as guilty when I see poor Muslims whose skills are limited and can only qualify for tradesman or unskilled jobs.

Rizwan bhai and other bloggers, I hope you don’t mind in case I share a bit of my story here.

My dad was well read– a doc. He took care i got a good school in Luknow and then Delhi a few years in the Mid East and then back in delhi for 10, 11th and 12th.. getting into Delhi Univ… was totally dependent on marks. The first job I did for an year in advertising on my inteview and copy skills. And coming back to Delhi univ in management dependent on my enterance exam test.

Why I am saying all this is because my road could have been totally different. I could have gone to an Urdu medium school where the emphasis could have been religious studies. I doubt I would have had this cakewalk.

I have not faced any discrimination till now. Only a bit of curiosity value… on why very few Muslims are there in my school and college.

My definate view: Society accepts a guy who walks along a certian road. It wont change to make you skilled. Market forces are ruthless. If you want to work in advertising or BPO’s, well you need to be what they want… they are not going to change their companies and setups to accomodate you.

If Muslims need to be in the corporate world… well you need English skills not Arabic. You need to interact will all religions and not be stuck up. Dont think that the corporate world will accept you in salwar and pathani suit. You need to be dressed in neckties and three pieces.

But most of all dont wallow in self pity that the world is conspiring against us. Instead embrace this world whole heartedly

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Delhi Univ is fogged out today… but this blog is burning bright !

So the bloggers find Pakistan boring and have turned back to Muslim reservations. I too have some views on this. But let me add… at variance with that of Rizwan. I did not face any discrimination on my road to management at delhi Univ.However i feel as guilty when I see poor Muslims whose skills are limited and can only qualify for tradesman or unskilled jobs.

Rizwan bhai and other bloggers, I hope you don’t mind in case I share a bit of my story here.

My dad was well read– a doc. He took care i got a good school in Luknow and then Delhi a few years in the Mid East and then back in delhi for 10, 11th and 12th.. getting into Delhi Univ… was totally dependent on marks. The first job I did for an year in advertising on my inteview and copy skills. And coming back to Delhi univ in management dependent on my enterance exam test.

Why I am saying all this is because my road could have been totally different. I could have gone to an Urdu medium school where the emphasis could have been religious studies. I doubt I would have had this cakewalk.

I have not faced any discrimination till now. Only a bit of curiosity value… on why very few Muslims are there in my school and college.

My definate view: Society accepts a guy who walks along a certian road. It wont change to make you skilled. Market forces are ruthless. If you want to work in advertising or BPO’s, well you need to be what they want… they are not going to change their companies and setups to accomodate you.

If Muslims need to be in the corporate world… well you need English skills not Arabic. You need to interact will all religions and not be stuck up. Dont think that the corporate world will accept you in salwar and pathani suit. You need to be dressed in neckties and three pieces.

But most of all dont wallow in self pity that the world is conspiring against us. Instead embrace this world whole heartedly

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As I mentioned before, it is time we approach problems and issues as local/regional rather than as “all india’.

For example, Muslim backwardness (or for that general economic backwardness) should be first tackled in UP, Bihar, West Bengal where 50% of Muslims live. However, once one dives deep,, one will find that the Muslim backwardness there is related to the general backwardness of the states. Bihar has a per capita GDP of 20000, UP 25,000 RS, West Bengal 41,000 – compared to the average southern state per capita of 88,000 Rs. So, all are doing bad in those states; just not Muslims.

Within those states, districts like Kishanganj, Purnia, Moradanbad,MmuzaffirNagar, Bareilly, Sahranpur, Murshidabad, Parganas are more poor and more Muslims.

So what is needed is not a pan-India solution ; but a focused data-based approach to specific areas, with the resonsibility born by the states.

Mayawati should be responsible for the paltry GDP of her state. May be we should amend the constitution that the President can dismiss the state ministry for not meeting certain thresholds. This will most probably take care of corruption too

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Pretty apt gopi

Our dunce price and his donkey assistant want to chop society like an Italian pizza.. Detail wont suit them.

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As I mentioned before, it is time we approach problems and issues as local/regional rather than as “all india’.

For example, Muslim backwardness (or for that general economic backwardness) should be first tackled in UP, Bihar, West Bengal where 50% of Muslims live. However, once one dives deep,, one will find that the Muslim backwardness there is related to the general backwardness of the states. Bihar has a per capita GDP of 20000, UP 25,000 RS, West Bengal 41,000 – compared to the average southern state per capita of 88,000 Rs. So, all are doing bad in those states; just not Muslims.

Within those states, districts like Kishanganj, Purnia, Moradanbad,MmuzaffirNagar, Bareilly, Sahranpur, Murshidabad, Parganas are more poor and more Muslims.

So what is needed is not a pan-India solution ; but a focused data-based approach to specific areas, with the resonsibility born by the states.

Mayawati should be responsible for the paltry GDP of her state. May be we should amend the constitution that the President can dismiss the state ministry for not meeting certain thresholds. This will most probably take care of corruption too

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, LIES DAMNED LIES AND STATISTICS.
The folly of putting too much emphasis on per capita GDP/income. MAHARASHTRA is NUMERO UNO ,in STATE GDP , THE PER CAPITA quite high , around 1800 dollars, well BONE POOR MUSLIMS live in a place called Malegaon where the blast occured.Andaman and Nicobar per capita GDP is higher than Maharashtra, not exactly an employment magnet is it.Maharashtra Finance industry doesn’t come to much use for BIDHRAVA.
If Kerala was “God’s own country” , THEN WHY 40% of MALAYALIS WORK OUTSIDE THE STATE , AND CONTRIBUTE 40% of the GDP of the state.
UP’s GDP is probably three to four times that of kerala , but the population is six times that of Kerala, thus the low per capita GDP. Punjab has benifitted from MASS EMIGRATION/REPATRIATION OF FUNDS from WEST, just like KERALA , MOST OF ITS WEALTH IS GULF REPATRIATED MONEY.
The North East has been totally neglected , there is no reason why UP /BIHAR cannot become No1, their GREATEST ASSET, there is no unionised labour, unlike the hell hole of kerala and west bengal.
Despite all the loud proclamation , gujrat is 5th on the league table of state GDP.
The ABC of economics , LAND AND PEOPLE RATIO, land denoting wealth , be it agro , mineral or OIL.
INDIA NEEDS A REVOLUTION IS AGRICULTURE, that will push GDP many fold , PROVIDE FOOD TO THE 50% HUNGRY.
There was a programme last sunday on BBC1 , CountryFile. England is mindbogglingly green with grass cover, yet it showed dairy and cattle farmer growing SPECIAL GRASS on PLASTIC TRAYS 4ft by 3ft , ROWS AND ROWS of them stacked one on top of another in shelves , drip computer controlled water and nutrients to these grasses . These are then used as cattle feed.
IDEALLY SUITED FOR INDIAN CONDITIONS , with so little grass cover

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As I mentioned before, it is time we approach problems and issues as local/regional rather than as “all india’.

For example, Muslim backwardness (or for that general economic backwardness) should be first tackled in UP, Bihar, West Bengal where 50% of Muslims live. However, once one dives deep,, one will find that the Muslim backwardness there is related to the general backwardness of the states. Bihar has a per capita GDP of 20000, UP 25,000 RS, West Bengal 41,000 – compared to the average southern state per capita of 88,000 Rs. So, all are doing bad in those states; just not Muslims.

Within those states, districts like Kishanganj, Purnia, Moradanbad,MmuzaffirNagar, Bareilly, Sahranpur, Murshidabad, Parganas are more poor and more Muslims.

So what is needed is not a pan-India solution ; but a focused data-based approach to specific areas, with the resonsibility born by the states.

Mayawati should be responsible for the paltry GDP of her state. May be we should amend the constitution that the President can dismiss the state ministry for not meeting certain thresholds. This will most probably take care of corruption too

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, LIES DAMNED LIES AND STATISTICS.
The folly of putting too much emphasis on per capita GDP/income. MAHARASHTRA is NUMERO UNO ,in STATE GDP , THE PER CAPITA quite high , around 1800 dollars, well BONE POOR MUSLIMS live in a place called Malegaon where the blast occured.Andaman and Nicobar per capita GDP is higher than Maharashtra, not exactly an employment magnet is it.Maharashtra Finance industry doesn’t come to much use for BIDHRAVA.
If Kerala was “God’s own country” , THEN WHY 40% of MALAYALIS WORK OUTSIDE THE STATE , AND CONTRIBUTE 40% of the GDP of the state.
UP’s GDP is probably three to four times that of kerala , but the population is six times that of Kerala, thus the low per capita GDP. Punjab has benifitted from MASS EMIGRATION/REPATRIATION OF FUNDS from WEST, just like KERALA , MOST OF ITS WEALTH IS GULF REPATRIATED MONEY.
The North East has been totally neglected , there is no reason why UP /BIHAR cannot become No1, their GREATEST ASSET, there is no unionised labour, unlike the hell hole of kerala and west bengal.
Despite all the loud proclamation , gujrat is 5th on the league table of state GDP.
The ABC of economics , LAND AND PEOPLE RATIO, land denoting wealth , be it agro , mineral or OIL.
INDIA NEEDS A REVOLUTION IS AGRICULTURE, that will push GDP many fold , PROVIDE FOOD TO THE 50% HUNGRY.
There was a programme last sunday on BBC1 , CountryFile. England is mindbogglingly green with grass cover, yet it showed dairy and cattle farmer growing SPECIAL GRASS on PLASTIC TRAYS 4ft by 3ft , ROWS AND ROWS of them stacked one on top of another in shelves , drip computer controlled water and nutrients to these grasses . These are then used as cattle feed.
IDEALLY SUITED FOR INDIAN CONDITIONS , with so little grass cover

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why is everybody posting the same post twice?

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I am no expert on reservation but as far as I know when constitution was formed, reservation was part of it but at the same time it said that it should be phased out in a timely manner (I think probably 30 years).

Now our politicians have made reservation as defacto permanent feature of Constitution misusing it for their own benefit.

I think including muslims in this reservation pie will make it very complex and make it almost impossible to phase out reservations.

I am of the opinion that no one except ST/SCs (poor only) should get reservation. I support reservation for them because thousands of years of discrimination requires at least few centuries of affirmative action.

All other communities have been mostly well off compared to SC/STs with every community seeing their own quota of ups and down including muslims.

According to me we should form a “Equal Opportunity Panel” that should impose strict “NO Discrimination” based on caste religion, language etc. and also including age and disability. Then it should scientifically find out (using experts not some retired judges) who have not been able to compete inspite of ‘NO Discrimination policy’. For all these communities, govt. should provide subsidized education, vocational training, financial help etc. but no reservation. The reservation will never help those who really need help. The reservations will be always hijacked by people who are rich and powerful amongst community needing help.

I have personally seen that muslims backwardness is self inflicted. I was educated in muslim institution. Even our muslim professors gave up on muslim students who rarely attended the class but were seen hanging around in the campus with GIRLS or doing some goondagiri. They all were found in our college mosques on Friday without fail. Believe me all my muslim batchmate failed in the final year and later I came to know some of them took more than 2 years to clear back papers. Our college being minority institution gave priority to muslim students. In all the sports teams, muslims formed 100% of the team. All the class representatives and University representative were muslims. Despite so much of favoritism, most of the muslim students fared very badly when it came to academics. Many of these guys were my goods friends and still are but facts are facts. By the way there were also foreign muslim students who fared equally badly except for a nigerian student who was exceptional.

What I want to say is that reservations is a failed idea because it has not delivered. We haven’t seen any dramatic improvement in conditions of SC/STs and OBCs. We need to do out of box thinking and help ALL our citizen get equal chance at achieving prosperity.

I have also seen muslim separatism first hand but that is for some other topic.

I still believe muslims coming from rural India are gem. I have met many of them and frankly they are best of the human beings I have ever met.

[Reply]

I am no expert on reservation but as far as I know when constitution was formed, reservation was part of it but at the same time it said that it should be phased out in a timely manner (I think probably 30 years).

Now our politicians have made reservation as defacto permanent feature of Constitution misusing it for their own benefit.

I think including muslims in this reservation pie will make it very complex and make it almost impossible to phase out reservations.

I am of the opinion that no one except ST/SCs (poor only) should get reservation. I support reservation for them because thousands of years of discrimination requires at least few centuries of affirmative action.

All other communities have been mostly well off compared to SC/STs with every community seeing their own quota of ups and down including muslims.

According to me we should form a “Equal Opportunity Panel” that should impose strict “NO Discrimination” based on caste religion, language etc. and also including age and disability. Then it should scientifically find out (using experts not some retired judges) who have not been able to compete inspite of ‘NO Discrimination policy’. For all these communities, govt. should provide subsidized education, vocational training, financial help etc. but no reservation. The reservation will never help those who really need help. The reservations will be always hijacked by people who are rich and powerful amongst community needing help.

I have personally seen that muslims backwardness is self inflicted. I was educated in muslim institution. Even our muslim professors gave up on muslim students who rarely attended the class but were seen hanging around in the campus with GIRLS or doing some goondagiri. They all were found in our college mosques on Friday without fail. Believe me all my muslim batchmates failed in the final year and later I came to know some of them took more than 2 years to clear back papers. Our college being minority institution gave priority to muslim students. In all the sports teams, muslims formed 100% of the team. All the class representatives and University representative were muslims. Despite so much of favoritism, most of the muslim students fared very badly when it came to academics. Many of these guys were my goods friends and still are but facts are facts. By the way there were also foreign muslim students who fared equally badly except for a nigerian student who was exceptional.

What I want to say is that reservations is a failed idea because it has not delivered. We haven’t seen any dramatic improvement in conditions of SC/STs and OBCs. We need to do out of box thinking and help ALL our citizen get equal chance at achieving prosperity.

I have also seen muslim separatism first hand but that is for some other topic.

I still believe muslims coming from rural India are gem. I have met many of them and frankly they are best of the human beings I have ever met.

[Reply]

I am no expert on reservation but as far as I know when constitution was formed, reservation was part of it but at the same time it said that it should be phased out in a timely manner (I think probably 30 years).

Now our politicians have made reservation as defacto permanent feature of Constitution misusing it for their own benefit.

I think including muslims in this reservation pie will make it very complex and make it almost impossible to phase out reservations.

I am of the opinion that no one except ST/SCs (poor only) should get reservation. I support reservation for them because thousands of years of discrimination requires at least few centuries of affirmative action.

All other communities have been mostly well off compared to SC/STs with every community seeing their own quota of ups and down including muslims.

According to me we should form a “Equal Opportunity Panel” that should impose strict “NO Discrimination” based on caste religion, language etc. and also including age and disability. Then it should scientifically find out (using experts not some retired judges) who have not been able to compete inspite of ‘NO Discrimination policy’. For all these communities, govt. should provide subsidized education, vocational training, financial help etc. but no reservation. The reservation will never help those who really need help. The reservations will be always hijacked by people who are rich and powerful amongst community needing help.

I have personally seen that muslims backwardness is self inflicted. I was educated in muslim institution. Even our muslim professors gave up on muslim students who rarely attended the class but were seen hanging around in the campus with GIRLS or doing some goondagiri. They all were found in our college mosques on Friday without fail. Believe me all my muslim batchmates failed in the final year and later I came to know some of them took more than 2 years to clear back papers. Our college being minority institution gave priority to muslim students. In all the sports teams, muslims formed 100% of the team. All the class representatives and University representative were muslims. Despite so much of favoritism, most of the muslim students fared very badly when it came to academics. Many of these guys were my goods friends and still are but facts are facts. By the way there were also foreign muslim students who fared equally badly except for a nigerian student who was exceptional.

What I want to say is that reservations is a failed idea because it has not delivered. We haven’t seen any dramatic improvement in conditions of SC/STs and OBCs. We need to do out of box thinking and help ALL our citizen get equal chance at achieving prosperity.

I have also seen muslim separatism first hand but that is for some other topic.

I still believe muslims coming from rural India are gems. I have met many of them and frankly they are among the best of the human beings I have ever met (most of them are sufis).

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the followers of ram lalla paralysed moradabad for one complete year.pakistan and korea took our trade.another feather in the cap.

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Vinod talks about Pakistan crisis, we here discuss reservations, while our politicians are taking us for a Disney ride!

India’s solution, like China’s, rests with robust economic growth. Growth does trickle down, creates motivational environment for lower rungs. We will not discuss reservation five – eight years from now if we grow at 14-15% per year. We will have other problems to discuss – pollution, overcrowding etc

Politicians are dividers/distributors. We have to have more creators, small business/medium business/large business formations, appropriate funding assistance,abundant electricity etc Other things will follow

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—————————————————————————————————————————
~~ THE PERFECT WAY OF CHOOSING– eligible people for reserrvation ~~~
————————————————————————————————————————–

@ Prahlad and others

Frankly I am not too enamoured by the idea of reservations after a certain point. They are needed to propel people with a disadvantage forward. And can be a tool for removing histrorical imbalances.

However I firmly believe that all this talk about 1000nds of years of injustice is all but state failure. In 1950 we were 35 crores. So if 50% suffered the burden of 1000’s of years of burden, then it was 17 crores.

Today we are 122 crores. Now we calim 80 crores suffer from 1000’s of years of injustice.

In case we becaome 150 crores (hopefully not! ) another 20 crores will suffer from 1000’s of years of injustice. All bloody bull…

And bad policy

We need to DEMOLISH THE CASTE SYSTEM thru aggressive anti caste sentiments in education. Thru media and social discourse.

Then only will this humbug end. As for the perfecct way to find the eligiblity criteria…

wait for my next posting. I have recieved an important cal…. on the phone….

Y

[Reply]

—————————————————————————————————————————
~~ THE PERFECT WAY OF CHOOSING– eligible people for reserrvation ~~~
————————————————————————————————————————–

@ Prahlad and others

Frankly I am not too enamoured by the idea of reservations after a certain point. They are needed to propel people with a disadvantage forward. And can be a tool for removing histrorical imbalances.

However I firmly believe that all this talk about 1000nds of years of injustice is all but state failure. In 1950 we were 35 crores. So if 50% suffered the burden of 1000’s of years of burden, then it was 17 crores.

Today we are 122 crores. Now we calim 80 crores suffer from 1000’s of years of injustice.

In case we becaome 150 crores (hopefully not! ) another 20 crores will suffer from 1000’s of years of injustice. All bloody bull…

And bad policy

We need to DEMOLISH THE CASTE SYSTEM thru aggressive anti caste sentiments in education. Thru media and social discourse.

Then only will this humbug end. As for the perfecct way to find the eligiblity criteria…

wait for my next posting. I have recieved an important cal…. on the phone….

Y

[Reply]

Vijay-
Very few political leaders of India preach and practise growth oriented agenda –

Most of the politicians are busy promoting dependency; the bureaucrats also like that idea because they get to be in charge of huge funds earmarked for “development”.

Jayalalitha, Modi, Nitin etc are exceptions. They have a vision, they are decisive, and the results are inclusive.

I was in Denver and in Silicon Valley in Dec-early Jan. It is amazing how they have these incubators connected with universities. Just imagine if we have these incubators associated with our IITs and NITs.

Indian challenges are not Hindu or Muslim or Yadav or Iyer challenges — they are Indian challenges – roads, electricity, healthcare, poverty, etc shared by all, even rich people! .

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160 posts already and IT IS ONLY TUESDAY.
In science terms this could be called RIZWAN EFFECT, hehe. Puttar well done, even my good friend from Bengaluru Shri Shenoy has slowly, agonisingly, thru clench teeth, hehe, admitted that very poor muslims should get reservation.
But vijay is right, lot of muslim problems are internal and reservation should not be a permnent baisakhi. For my southerner friends Gopi and Shenoy, Baisakhi means crutches.

Pervez, I am vaary keen to hear more details about the sermons u heard at Jama Masjid. Pl honestly report all

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17th Jan 2012, should be remembered as the day , when the penny dropped. Now we know why RajivS is so fixated with the idea , that muslims need to get their just deserts.Now everything falls into place , we can see WHERE IT WAS ALL COMING FROM. I guess his student days that he describes is from ALIGARH UNIVERSITY, WELL ALIGARH MUSLIM UNIVERSITY. Now I can understand the rich spoilt brat the erstwhile landowner’s children behave the way they behaved. THEN IS THAT AN UNIQUE CASE. Have you seen the GREAT film SHOOL by N Srinivas.
The MAWALIS in that film were also college students , SADLY ALL HINDUS AND BIHARIS. Now West Bengal dons the mantle piece of THE MAWALI STUDENTS OF INDIA(these only apply to small district colleges, though at one point during CPM’s PLAGUE rule , every college was outdoing each other in Mawaliness.

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Aaloke

As you suggest lets discuss and not argue, though I am not sure I know the difference.

It is the responsibility of the state to ensure that it creates a level playing field for women and minorities thorough preferential treatment being granted to them in the field of higher education admissions, government contracts, and recruitment for public sector jobs – such as Police, Army etc. where Muslims are disproportionately underrepresented.

This is common practice in the USA where the Civil Rights Act 1964 and several subsequent court judgments have ensured that right-wing reactionary forces do not succeed in eroding this morally defensible position.

Often the criteria used for inclusion in affirmative programmes are race, ethnicity, religion, disability and age. While the implementation of such actions vary from state to state in the USA and from country to country in Europe, the US supreme court on a number of occasions has reaffirmed the constitutionality of such programmes.

Similar Supreme Court cases have been adjudicated in Andhra and the Supreme Court of India.

A number of Minority commissions (Gopal Singh Committee) have painted a dismal picture of the position of Muslims. The panel made a large number of recommendations for its improvement through various short-term and long-term measures. But not much was ever implemented for a very long time. Sacher Committee and Ranganath Misra Commission, reported similar conclusions.

The issue in this Blog is not so much as people do not support affirmative action,They do. Their main opposition is, it being offered on the basis of religion, read Muslims. This is less than thinly disguised display of deep rooted Islamophobia. Despite being rulers of India, Muslims were the subject of social injustice during the British Raj and to some extent that legacy continued post-independence. A significant majority of them are suffering from structural disadvantage for which affirmative action is the right remedial action.

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Whatever Congressis-Jihadis say, reservation is a failed idea because it has not delivered in 63 years and will not deliver anything other than consolidate vote banks for casteists and communal parties. It is a regressive idea that should be rejected except in the case of SC/STs.

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This subcontinent has close to 450 million divided equally between Pakistan, India and bangladesh. We all know muslims are treated as first class citizen and enjoy almost 100% reservation in Pak and BD. Now if we give muslims reservation in India too, are we not fulfilling the agenda of Jinnah? If that is so what was the need to divide India.

Can someone reply?

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Quota for Muslims has hijacked the blog topic. Nothing new (as we like it this way)! I remember Ashish once suggesting Zia in his blog, he (Zia) can even write Jana Gana Mana and get away as people hardly bother:-)

Is positive discrimination required? Yes, to the deserved candidates.( I know of a weaver’s son, who was working till 9 in the morning before going to school. In spite of it, he topped the school. But even if he had got 70% againstst a 90% merit student I would consider his achievement is higher (I am not with Balwinder here. He wants a surgeon who scored no less than 90%). Can the caste/religion be a creteria? It can be part of a criteria, not the full. I mean, when a Dalit gets killed for entering a temple in rural India, positive descrimination makes sense. But if it is taken by Dalit officer’s son in a city (which is what is happening), it fails. If politicians had concerns for “real backwards”, they should have taken the creamy layour out. (That includes Dalits as well, so not in agreement with Rajeev). Without it, everything else is just a drama. While giving reservation, along with the caste, add income criteria and urban/rural criteria. People will not mind whether reservation is 20% or 40%, if they know the person who got it deserved it; whether it was a son of cobbler who was Hindu or daughter of vegetable seller who was Muslim). Whenever the topic of removing creamy layour comes in, people will speak of higher percentage of Brahmins in the jobs compared to other castes, which have a higher share in society. encouragement, historical advantage etc. But despite all remedies, if the result gets repeated.. then a politically incorrect statement..” if opportunity and talent is unequally distributed, then allowing people to exercise that talent and opportunity means more inequality… (but which would bring prosperity to country) –,Thatcher.

Prahlad’s question, how does one quickly decide who is backward; there have been scientific surveys done by committees. But nobody has the guts to implement them in the right spirit.

As far Muslims getting reservations and India getting divided, it was introduced way back in Karnataka (Mysore kingdom then), along with other backward classes by Maharaja of mysore in early 1900s. How many muslims from Karnataka migrated to Pakistan? Maharaj of Mysore (very much like Thiruvankur) had real concern for the upliftment of his people, not votebanks. Post independence also, we had Dev Raj Urs as CM, who brought social reforms and land reforms in 70s. Lot of time, people compare Dev Raj Urs with Kanshiram. While Kanshiram brought assertiveness to Dalits, what Urs did was even more. He brought the reforms to lift backward classes (while he did not belonged to them), by implementing Havanur report. Muslim quota among OBCs was introduced in early 80s or 90s (most southern states still have). But there is a difference between the one which is applied in South Indian states and the one Centre is planning. In South, creamy layours of Muslims are not included in reservation (rightfully). Shoeb might know more.

Another stupidity is how people speak about caste/religion unity, while speaking about backward groups within them. Veerappa Moily, when he was chief minister of Karnataka dared to take the creamy layour out of backward classes according to Chinnappa Reddy commission recommendations. But the caste heads (read Swami’s of Matas, to be even more precise Jagadguru of Gowdas) protested, saying government is trying to divide their community. Large rally was arranged, where villagers came in Lorries sent by somebody and shouted slogans, “We won’t let anyone break our unity”. I was passing near the ground in the afternoon, saw two elderly men in their village clothes drinking coconut in the hot sun. They didn’t seem to understand, they have gone there to protest against a law, which could have actually taken care of them against those who sent Lorry, who are making speeches in the ground. But to them, their “caste unity” was important. I see the same thing with Muslim community as well. http://www.milligazette.com/Archives/2004/16-30Nov04-Print-Edition/163011200463.htm Workers in Bhiwadi plant may need reservation. But not Parvez or Rizwan.

Ravi’s “ideal world” never exists in reality. If I were to belong to a well to do backward community family, who has got a seat in a prestigious college for a lesser marks, I won’t leave it for “some unseen boy” who could be” in a village, living under poverty.
http://www.igovernment.in/site/Creamy-layer-slab-hiked-to-Rs-4.5-lakh (Read the replies there in). Law makers should not assume an ideal situation; they have to make realistic laws which consider, it is natural for a human being to be selfish.

Recycling from my earlier post:
An instance from Bangalore, public transport buses have some seats reserved for ladies. Intention? Elderly ladies, mother of kids etc cannot compete with fit men to grab seats and some of these men are not kind enough to get up and give the seat when a needy person arrives. Result after reservation? Young and fit college girls grab it with fierce competition and some among these girls also are not kind to needy people.

Reservations- all though intentions are good, can’t lift the really unprivileged (unless governments have will power, which they don’t). It can only shift one form of exploitation to the other. (They are much like fly over which move traffic jam from one point to other). Before it could have been Forward class exploiting the backward class -> shifted to other backward class exploiting Dalits -> Now creamy layer of Dalits in city (children of Dalit officers) exploiting an unprivileged Dalits in rural area (taking the reservation seats meant for the really deserving ones).

But parties are not bothered as long as it pulls some votes in election. As for Congress’s “genuine conern for minorities”, it does not specify which classes are getting benefitted. If it puts upper class muslims and jains also under minority quota, can ansaris compete with them? Also if quota is applied to whole relegion, Supreme court will straight away bin it, as it is against constitution. But anyway, election would have been over by then.
Regarding BJP’s concern that India gets divided with such a quota system, it is existing in the state it is ruling for years and it has never bothered to alter it.
So what is the conclusion at the end? Don’t take the drama too seriously. Everything will remain same. India will not break and backwards will remain backwards.

[Reply]

Here are the real liberals taking on Islamic fundoos-
http://ibnlive.in.com/cnnibnvideos/mostviewed-us/221739.html

[Reply]

RAVI- WHY DID I LEAVE 1 YEAR AGO

In the last blog you asked a strange question- why did I leave 1 year ago? Dude you serious ????????????????????
Yes, one year ago I was still a bit immature and used to get quite disturbed by your intimidation of anyone who did not fit in with your ugly anti hindu agenda. All 3 of you hounded me outta here- dr shan, ramavtar and yourself.

shan used to use filthy language on me, the bar steward was obsessed with my foreskin which I found vulgar. But you were very mean to me too and too others who disagreed with you or cracked any harmless joke on you. YOUR FILTHY JOKE OM BALWINDER UNCLE’S SON AND WIFE WAS DEPRAVITY PERSONIFIED, YOU ARE SICK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

You seem to have toned down your act this year. Anyways this lil feller has also grown up and if you ever try your mean stuff on me again I shall come to Sialkot and strip you naked in the market square. and dont give me this new ‘I am a sikh in UK shit’ who else but a pakistani would abuse the hindu gods like you did.

we muslims in indiacondemn such attacks

[Reply]

Sharmaji,
A humble request for you and your IT folks.
Please maintain a separate blog post for folks in here to settle personal scores.
That way, those who intend to really discuss will be spared of this “fun”.
As a suggestion the blogpost may be titled – “Let Us Settle Our Personal Scores”.
While at it – we may want to consider another blog post “Let Me Guess Your Ethnic / National Origins and re-assign you a Label”.
Alternately, a single Blog-Post titled “Gaali – Let Us Exchange Abuse” should be sufficient .

[Reply]

Now that the Government has made up its mind to escalate the dispute with General Saab rather than de-escalate it and settle it discreetly, and more muck is expected to be thrown up and an offensive has been launched in the media to discredit Gen Singh . One of the prime arguments is that he should have resigned first rather than defy civilian Executive authority ( i.e the government ) and amounts to contravention of military discipline.
Well how would the proponents of this argument respond to the recent revelations about the 1971 war , when Gen Sam Manekshaw refused to attack and go to war with Pakistan in defiance of PM Indira Gandhi and the CCS. Gen Manekshaw flatly told PM Indira Gandhi that he shall can go to war only after the monsoon was over and when he can prepare the army for the the war. He did not listen even to then Defence Minister Jagjivan Ram who tried persuading him.
Here the issue pertains to the Date of Birth on the Chief , a personal detail, and has nothing to do with his obligations and duties as the Chief of the Indian Army.
But who cares ..he is dealing with a government of scamsters and scumsters..

[Reply]

Manohar-
What Karunanidhi etc handed out/promised during elections was mostly a “one time” inducement, such as a TV set, grinder etc and not a perpetual, unsustainable stream like 1000 Rs unemployment allowance, free electricity etc that Maulayam is promising now.

Now he can promise anything and execute on that.. My question is how will the state fund? Who will shoulder the short fall (centre?)?

[Reply]

HOT NEWS:

SAHARA has withdrawn its sponsorship to the Indian Cricket Team.. The new sponsor is “Whisper Ultra” as the Team is going through its worst PERIOD..

[Reply]

Shenoy Saab, MohanR, Vijay
It is most unfortunate that this issue had to come out in the public domain. A word about Defence Minister A K Antony. My complaint against him is that he is so obsessed with preserving his personal image of honesty , that he avoided going in for any new procurement to upgrade the defence forces.Whereas our main threat China is rapidly increasing its defence capabilities , India’s preparednesscapabilities are stagnant. Our Foreign policy is now so defensive and so dependedent on foreign powers especially the US that we are no longer as independent to take decisions as we should be. I have always believed that along with economic prowess military strike capabilities should also grow if India is to emerge as a strong and powerful nation .

[Reply]

For all the buglers and drumbeaters of the institution of Lokpal.

————

Setback to Modi, Gujarat HC upholds lokayukta’s appointment

http://www.hindustantimes.com/India-news/Gujarat/Setback-to-Modi-Gujarat-HC-upholds-lokayukta-s-appointment/Article1-798768.aspx

1) No Lokayukta was appointed for 8 years
2) When one was appointed (as per 1986 law), it was challenged.
3) The case has been lost in High Court.
4) The state government is going to file a petition in the Supreme Court.

What do Anna’s supporters have to say on whether the verdict of the High Court should be challenged or not. Why not let the appointee assume his duties immediately and start looking into alleged corruption cases? Who’s afraid of Mr. R. A. Mehta? Agar koi gallat kaam hi nahi kiyaa hai to Darr kis baat kaa?

I know the grounds for challenging the decision – the CM not being consulted, etc. etc. In fact. it was his duty to see that one was appointed 8 years ago. I can see that others will be blamed for the delay, but not the great man himself. It always someone else’s fault in case of …………..

[Reply]

—————————————————————————————————————————–
~~~ the perfect way of finding ~~~ PEOPLE WHO NEED RESERVATIONS ~~~
—————————————————————————————————————————–

Rizwan said that the Paswans and Yadavs drive Toyotas while Muslims are being deprived.

Prahlad felt that the resource planner needs a quick formula for fidning 176 poor people in Delhi,

Rajeev experienced reverse discrimination in a minority college.

Gopi gave sound reasons that situation varies from state to state.

Now here is my take :
——————————-

a) Use the UID number and PAN number for all property and high value vehicle and
white goods purchase. Since most of vehicles are now bank financed we can easily trace out the richer sections of the backwards and get them off the reservation list.

b) Get the local SDM to certify that the person is elgibale because of income criteria

c) Finish of caste based reservations and switch it to backward area/ low income reservations. Voter ID cards, UID can be again used to target the really needy.

d) Most of all get cheap but high quality education with scholorships available for all in the most backward districts especailly those of Muslims.

I think if we can send the Chandrayan to the moon, we can surely make a fool proof agenda for targetting the really needy.

[Reply]

Tareq Fatah blast pakistan military

Guys listen to this interview, it is long but interesting.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=26lC3A7dbgQ&feature=player_embedded

[Reply]

I can be dangerous, warns Mamata Banerjee

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/city/kolkata-/I-can-be-dangerous-warns-Mamata-Banerjee/articleshow/11531834.cms

Excerpt

Projecting herself as neutral, she repeatedly threatened that she could “turn out to be dangerous” and asked the CPM not to challenge her, find fault about her work.

————

1) This is plain Dadagiri or is it Didigiri?

2) Another megalomaniac on the eastern horizon. The triangle is complete with one lady in the north and another one in the South. No one is sight on the Western front as yet.

[Reply]

Must read, except for those who yawn at anything more than …..

The transparency paradox
Santosh Desai

http://blogs.timesofindia.indiatimes.com/Citycitybangbang/entry/the-transparency-paradox

[Reply]

Mohan has posted a wonderful video which needs repeating.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=26lC3A7dbgQ&feature=player_embedded
Tarek Fatah – Author & Founder of Muslim Canadian Congress- wrote a book called- “The jew is not my enemy”
Oh great- Maybe he should have written a book- The sky is blue, or The earth is round… but then maybe the Pakistanis need to learn ABC…It always did amaze me that most Pakistanis hate Jews so much despite never having met one in their lives.

He also lays into the Army, into the immaturity of Imran Khan . Thanks Mohan, great video- the more and more of these articulate Pakistani voices speak up- maybe only 1% of the population right now- the sooner we will see a Pakistani spring

[Reply]

RIZWAN vs RAVI dishum dishum
______________________________________
Knockout sirji, what an uppercut that was. And Ravi made limp statement and slithered away. Ravi bhai in India cedibilty is imp, its like your pagri. You loose credibilty, you loose your good name.
Blog has gone away from focus, we are not talking lokpal here, lets get back to Pakistan. In Pakistan comunity here in UK, rumour is strong that Pervez is going to join hands with Imran and army and is definitely going to return this year. When ?
Fact, if you go to Ilford in east London most taxi drivers are pakistani. They actually showed me a new building being constructed by Nawaz Sharif, benaami of course, which costs 50 million pounds. Imagine whole Pakistani quom here knows it. Pakistan needs Baba ramdev to raise issue of black money

Pervez, pl u answer, we r curious to know abt the sermons you heard in mosque. Which mosque, who spoke, bukhari?, also are there any disenting voices who argue against this ummah ****, what they say on kashmir. Blog is respectfully curious

[Reply]

why should I and why would I

[Reply]

@RajeevS, Your quest ends tonight.You asked why 75% bengalis converted to islam. Well during partition 1941, Hindus were 54% ,muslims 46%.
A caveat ,these are all speculation ,however this one is most appealing
“That explanation is that this region, along with large parts of the rest of India and places as far west and north as modern-day Afghanistan and Xinjiang, had become entirely Buddhist, and by the sixth century or so this Buddhism had also become adulterated with diverse forms of animism, occult practices, promiscuity, and the like, something in the nature of what is known in Hinduism as vamachara, and had degenerated into a loose faith
he population therefore remained Buddhist-Animist, and easily converted to Islam when the marauders from the west came to Bengal. Extensive ruins of Buddhist monasteries are found at Paharpur and Mahasthangarh in the northern parts of
present-day Bangladesh. The Buddhist priest Dipankar Srigyan had set out from a village called Bajrajogini near Dacca to convert the whole of Tibet to Buddhism. Till today Hindu Bengalis, when they choose to be abusive, refer to Muslims by the term Neray (a diminutive of Naraa, meaning shaven-headed). And a lot of Bengali Muslims do tonsure their heads, which is believed to be a custom inherited by them from the Buddhist viharas (monasteries) which their ancestors atttended. All these bear eloquent testimony to the hold of Buddhism in East Bengal.

Assam, on the other hand, remained Hindu and did not convert to Islam because of the preachings of the great Vaishnavite guru Shankara Deva (not the same as the sage of the same name from Kerala) who gave a firm faith within the Hindu fold to the Assamese. In fact the Ahoms, who came from Thailand to settle in and rule Upper Assam, embraced Hinduism and remained Hindu.

The Muslims of East Bengal are therefore, in all probability, converts mostly from Buddhism-Animism and not from Hinduism. This view is also held by the eminent historian Vincent Smith, among others. The argument finds great support from the fact that Buddhism has yielded elsewhere, as it did in East Bengal, much more easily to Islam than Sanatan (Orthodox) Hinduism. Thus once-Buddhist Afghanistan and Xinjiang eventually became totally Muslim, while Hindu India did not. Similarly, Buddhist East Bengal became Muslim-majority,
According to much abused Nirad Choudhari , muslims in East bengal were overwhelmingly peasants and are anthropologically different from hindus , HAILED FROM THAILAND. Again ties neatly with the above theory of Buddhism to quick to giveway to islam, the McDonald of religion in mass appeal

[Reply]

Enrich keeps parroting positive points of Islam and keeps slamming hinduism on many aspects. He is right of some of those things.

What I like about Islam-
1. Institutionalized Charity
2. Equality before God
3. Discipline
4. Love for Islam and Prophet

What I hate about hinduism-
1. No concept of charity..whatever is there it is only for bloodsucking Brahmins.
2. There is no equality
3. No discipline
4. No love for religion. To appease other they are ready to badmouth their own religion.

However I choose Hinduism over Islam any day because Hinduism provides flexibility to change. This is what matter. It is a dynamic religion which will never go down even after 33 crores devi devtas are discredited. Unlike Islam it is not based on personality. If Mohammad is discredited, Islam is finished..same is true for christianity but Dharmic religions will survive solely on the power of evolving ideology.

[Reply]

Dear Shan,

I find Islam, spread of Islam a very interesting topic, though an extremely tragic one. There is a view that can 1.5 billion people be wrong. Looking at so many historical situations which we have knowledge of, the most recent being rise of Hitler and behavior of educated and cultured Germans of that time,looking at Islamic history from Mohammed to this date and spread from Spain to Indonesia, we can make our deductions clearly. Infact, even 7 billion people can be wrong.

You seem to be right on conversion in Bengal. Infact what I had indicated in my earlier posts, caste system is not responsible for spread of Islam. On the contrary, in a very interesting way, it has been responsible for slowing down spread of Islam. We are time and again bombarded with statements that lower castes converted to Islam because of Islamic equality. But it seems to be a MYTH. The lowest among Hindu caste which are now covered under “Schedule Castes” compose an extremely miniscule portion of Muslims. This has been documented after proper studies.. It was so called Shudra castes who fought tooth and nail with islamic invaders and rulers . Brahmins were not much in physical fighting, Kshatriyas had been smothered and many of them were killed or forced to convert along with their fighting forces , Vaishyas mostly continued with their farming, arts and trade , they were mostly left alone as muslim rulers needed their services to run their empires ( ultimately countries run on Vaishya work ). It was these so called Shudra castes which fought . Starting with killing of Mohamad Gauri, resistance of Jats, Gujjars, Reddys , Marathas. Infact in Andhra , there are inscriptions by Reddy rulers who have with pride declared themselves born from feet of Brahma and fighting with Malechas ( Muslims ) to protect Dharma. ( This brings us to an interesting question, was” Born from feet of Brahma” considered derogatory by so called shudra castes when these Reddy kings were proclaiming it with so much pride ).

Dear RajeevS,

What you like about Islam is what you will find in all SECTS. And Islam is the biggest and most powerful Sect.

[Reply]

Early morning activism by HT staff :

The so called moderator at HT seems to get have a sprint every morning, though for a short period. And definitely a BJP sympathisor. My simple posting gets deleted ! It happened before also. Just because it had the keyword BJP !

[ I know it will not be deleted if it is posted after 6 pm. Or even 2 hours later. The so called moderator would be over with his duty by then.]

Vijay Sir and Shenoy Sir,

Something for you to enjoy with morning breakfast. Some food for thought.

BJP will not allow Rushdie.

http://www.hindustantimes.com/audio-news-video/AV-NewsX/Won-t-allow-Rushdie-in-India-BJP/Article2-796011.aspx

[Reply]

Prahlad,

Believe me, you have my sympathy. Here are some tips for the safe passage of your early morning posts and for avoiding early morning ****-ups.

Include, in your posts some mention about Hindu communalism.

Also mention 5000 or so daily rapes of dalit women by upper caste Hindus in India. Quote the BBC or the Vatican for proof.

NEVER EVER MENTION A SINGLE WORD ABOUT ANY FAKE CD ON THE BHUSHANS. Not only your early morning posts, but even late evening posts are sure to be deleted.

But, apart from the fake CD, you can, space permitting, mention about how Anna is a fake Gandhian, or how Sonia Gandhi is not a Ghandy etc.

[Reply]

shan and ravi bhai this is the history of muslims in assam,

Scope: Assam is the second largest Muslim populated state of India (in terms of percentage) only after Jammu and Kashmir. Muslims constitute about thirty percent of the state population[1]. They are historically concentrated in the south and west Assam in large numbers. Five of the six Muslims majority districts of Assam lie in these regions and also the other districts in these regions have significant percentage of Muslims[2]. Interestingly in Assam it is found that, wherever Muslim political structure once developed, has high percentage of Muslims living there. Besides, the southern and western region, central Assam (mainly in the districts of Nagaon and Marigaon) has significant Muslim populations. Presently the state has almost eighty lakhs Muslim population. History of the origin of this huge numbers of inhabitants does not represent one single period. Almost a quarter of their Islamic origin belongs to 13th to 15th century A.D., which is the timing of my study on Muslims Socio-Political History.

Since last three-four decades Muslims of Assamhave been इन the center stage of many movements and violence in the state. The allegations and counter allegations not only draw the attention of national media, politicians, and the masses but also the international media and organizations[3]. They are marginalized in every possible way. They are looked merely as invaders and intruders in history and now suspected as immigrants. This twist and criticism, however, in turn led the curiosity of some writers and historians to explore the Muslim history in the state and their relation with power. But unfortunately most of the works carried out by them are neither comprehensive nor insightful. Their writings unveiled a small part of Muslims total history in Assam. For instance, some one may writes on Assam or specifically on Muslims, but they would either forget or ignore regions other then Brahmputra valley. So their studies are confined to Brahmputra valley only, for that matter Barak valley received scant attention[4]. It became a fact that so far nobody has made any such move on any specific period to explore the history of Muslims of Assam in true sense. A systematic study from 13th century, which is the starting point of their history, is crucial in the construction of both Brahmputra valley and Barak valley’s Muslim history.

[Reply]

ravi and shanjee u will appreciare following,

Scope: Assam is the second largest Muslim populated state of India (in terms of percentage) only after Jammu and Kashmir. Muslims constitute about thirty percent of the state population[1]. They are historically concentrated in the south and west Assam in large numbers. Five of the six Muslims majority districts of Assam lie in these regions and also the other districts in these regions have significant percentage of Muslims[2]. Interestingly in Assam it is found that, wherever Muslim political structure once developed, has high percentage of Muslims living there. Besides, the southern and western region, central Assam (mainly in the districts of Nagaon and Marigaon) has significant Muslim populations. Presently the state has almost eighty lakhs Muslim population. History of the origin of this huge numbers of inhabitants does not represent one single period. Almost a quarter of their Islamic origin belongs to 13th to 15th century A.D., which is the timing of my study on Muslims Socio-Political History.

Since last three-four decades Muslims of Assamhave been इन the center stage of many movements and violence in the state. The allegations and counter allegations not only draw the attention of national media, politicians, and the masses but also the international media and organizations[3]. They are marginalized in every possible way. They are looked merely as invaders and intruders in history and now suspected as immigrants. This twist and criticism, however, in turn led the curiosity of some writers and historians to explore the Muslim history in the state and their relation with power. But unfortunately most of the works carried out by them are neither comprehensive nor insightful. Their writings unveiled a small part of Muslims total history in Assam. For instance, some one may writes on Assam or specifically on Muslims, but they would either forget or ignore regions other then Brahmputra valley. So their studies are confined to Brahmputra valley only, for that matter Barak valley received scant attention[4]. It became a fact that so far nobody has made any such move on any specific period to explore the history of Muslims of Assam in true sense. A systematic study from 13th century, which is the starting point of their history, is crucial in the construction of both Brahmputra valley and Barak valley’s Muslim history.

[Reply]

==============================================================
~!~ !~~ DR Mishra, Dr Pankaj please PLEASE prescribe diarrhea pills for Engrich ~~!
==============================================================

Engrich Please PLEASE remember why you were kicked out of various blogsites in your previous disguise as Ram Avtar and Tajendra !

People just hated the amount of nonsense you would post by picking up and cutting and pasting from various forums. On why Islam is superior and brhmns zionist etc are raping all.

Now you have done it again in this Engrich mode. If you have all this nonsense to spout here specifiaclly directed at Ravi and Shan… please email to them directly.

You have effectively destroyed this whole blog and killed the continuity. Even if you want to say something you can juist give a link. Tomorrow you would want to give the entire sermon of Zakir naik and Osama bin Laden here.

Otherwise I will be the first one to start campaighning to block you again.

[Reply]

@ Prahlad

Sadly the Indian media INCLUDING the Hindustan Times has ended up being the spokesman of the Congress party.

In my view Rushdie should be here. Now. he is a gr8 writer period. And had no religious agenda. He made fun of a lot of people including Thakrey in his books.

As an insaan he is maha tharki. Last time I saw him he was lining aup all the girls around. And not just flirting.

Fundamantalists hate him. Look at our own blog site. Only Ravi and Engrixch are against his visit.

To appease a certain sections of the Muslims the Congress took the law and order excuse. Deoband took out its customary fatwa. Simi is promising violence. BJP is a minor player.

But Gehlot will shout BJP. Digvinash SIngh and Rahul will go to thier election rallies and tell Musliims, “We did all this to respect your sentiments.”

And then to appeal to the liberal sections, Congress will depute its pyaadas in the media to say ” BJP BJP… BJP !”

What fun !

[Reply]

Some of you may be following the ‘online piracy” bill going through the US Congress.

People do win over the powerful once a while.

The US congress backed off from a strict anti-piracy bill, mainly because of the online people pressure. The “old” business lobby, including Chamber of commerce, Motion Picture Association etc spent huge sums lobbying the Congress; but eventually it fizzled out – one by one, the house members and senators who had supported the bill (because of the lobbyist pressure) backed off after the online pressure from the citizens. The shutdown by online info providers such as Wikepedia etc also had an impact.

An important milestone/turning point; but I am sure the lobbyists will “reinvent” in time, performing their usual assault on democracy..

[Reply]

RAVI AND ENGRICH

Vijay, dont get upset at engrich, he is simply trying to cover up for Ravi. When I slammed ravi yesterday, engrich came on and started bombarding blog with nonsense. They used to do that last year as well- whenever ravi gets caught with his pants down, engrich appears to distract others from ravi’s humiliation.

just curious what relationship these 2 have- do they live in same house ???? disturbing thought

[Reply]

Guys,

A request. Please leave this gentleman Engrich alone. He is a sick person,
just ignore him. Whatever we all say is not going to have any effect on him.

[Reply]

—————————————————————————————————————————–~~ TWO SICK JEHADIS WANTING TO push innoncent Muslims on their own path ~~
—————————————————————————————————————————-

The Sick outpourings of Engrich and Ravi have convinced me that they are not happy seeing Muslims celeberating thier Indian-ness.

In contraast Shoeb talks about economic growth and how India can be hte first world.

Parvez is full of success stories and management ideas.

Rizwan has got zip and Humour and questions how Muslims too can get social benefits.

This scares the two terrorists who want them to fit in their agenda.

How sick !!

Rizwan and Pervez, these guys are pensioners of the ISI also getting dole from the UK government. The more you interact with them, the more they seize an opposrtunity to enter our pure land and cause destruction

[Reply]

RAVI, you missed my post in this mountain of hot air by engerich. CREDIBILTY is mans pagri, his izzat, that is fact puttar. And in front of gram panchayat, the boy Rizwan whu you 3 used to abuse came back from his 1 year vanvaas an Amitabh Bacchan and pinned you like wrestler Sushil Kumar on akhada floor. Fair and square.
What goes round, comes round. Reflect move on.
Now back to blog, Pakitan, I have gud suggestion, invite KAYANI to India, take him to 5 star resort in Goa, let him meet Pres Kalam and Premji, show him best of India, dont drop yr guard but impress them. Show indias best, show them they are behaving like miserablejehadis, give their children reservation in AIIMS, IIT, invest for long term. WHAT DO BLOGGERS SAY ??

And ravi dont forget what I said. For a woman, lajja is best abhushan. For man, credibilty

[Reply]

A question to all cricket lovers,

Please do not ignore this.

India is dubbed by media as flat track bullies because they win only at home.

England lost all five matches in India and now are on verge of defeat against Pakistan
In Dubai. Why they are not called fast track bullies by media ?

[Reply]

HERE IS A NEW YEAR PRAYER BY A WOMAN CHEATED BY GOD!

[Reply]

Balwinder-

Your idea of providing few seats for Pakistani students at IIT/AIIMS/IIMs is a brilliant one! These students will be here for four-five years (less in IIMs case, may be they can be given 2 year job offer/internship here), get to know systems, people, democracy, etc; hopefully take the positive aspects back home as their future leaders.

I believe it has legs

[Reply]

All,
Let us make sure this blog does not die the way Zia’s blog died. Zia’s blog used to have 700 plus comments, but it degenerated, people started leaving.
Good ideas, hidden information, and noble actions have come out thru this blog.

I vividly remember BV Shenoy bringing to our attention the plight of a Jawan from kerala, organizing a help line for his Aayurvedic treatment (that the army will not pay for under some obscure rules), and many of us contributing.

So, little things, but meaningful to the party at the other end are possible.

Egrich, please keep that in mind when you go crazy about brahminism and xionism

[Reply]

Dear Friends,

As per my view, banning is never a good option. It can be done only in extreme cases.

I think Ravi has a particular view, It may be different or radically different from my and many other Blogger’s view, but it should be allowed to be aired. We are Indians, we have an ancient tradition of listening to different opinions, let that tradition remain.

However ,if we find that the Blog is getting destroyed by Garbage , abuses and crowding of Blog space( criticizing any religion with valid and logical reasons is not abuse ), then the extreme option can be tried.

Engrich as long as he keeps to one or two lines can still be tolerated.

[Reply]

—————————————————————————————————————————–
~~ BREAKING NEWS !! MIR JAFAR & JAI CHAND slain by secular bloggers !! ~~
—————————————————————————————————————————

Right now Jai Chand is celeberating. That his guru Mir Jaffar has posted such a long piece of bullshit that Rizwan’s original query has been buried.

In fact jai Chand has probably asked Guru Mir jaffar to keep Osama ji’s last speech ready for posting in case the topic again goes to termites who want to destroy India thru an ISI agenda.

Hail !! All you secular boggers who have thrown Mir Jaffar and jai Chand into the sewer pit !!

Allah hu Akbar !!

Jai Shri Ram !!

Sat Sri Akal !!

Long live Christ !!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Reply]

Good news for Congressis. Their boy Kalmadi got bail. He has been given chance to work with Congress govt. and destroy all evidences. He may also pay visit to 10 Janpath in the darkness of night and give true account of his loot and give appropriate cut to Mataji.

Second news – Rahul has questioned Uma Bharti’s origin while addressing a rally in UP. Poor fellow forgot about his mother’s origin. Uma Bharti ne Totey ki bolti band kar di. Only lady like Uma can take on low lives like Rahul and Digvijay..master and slave jodi.

[Reply]

How congressi trolls criticize actions of Congress?

IF….THEN….IF…THEN…IF…THEN…BUT BJP also does same thing.

[Reply]

Another good news for Congressi Jamaat-
Pankaj Pachauri from NDTV (a wing of Congress Sandesh) has been appointed PMO media advisor.

I have been following Pankaj Pachauri’s debate and had an inkling that he was Congress man in media. Poor Vinod Sharma lost again..I feel for Sharma. He works so hard working for Congress and what he gets in return..a haddi in the form of ‘Member of minority commission’…Poor guys must be sobbing in his basement.. Khuda unko Sabr aataa farmaye..

[Reply]

—————————————————————————————————————————–
~~ ISLAMIC FUNDAMANTALISTS ATTEMPT COUP IN BANGLADESH ~~
—————————————————————————————————————————-

news coming in that hardline Islamic fundamantlists in the bangladesh army wanted to topple the hasina government.

I wonder in the end what the hardline Islamic efundamantlists want to achieve through coups. Is it an agenda to convert all Non Wahabbi Muslims and minorities to theri Osama line of thought.

healthy discussion please. Mir jaffar and Jai Chand dont try to dilute the seriousness of the subject by mumbling ” Modi Modi rape rape” or brhmns and zionism.

[Reply]

@ Rajeev

Feel bad that you did not have a good experience in a Muslim college.

I have done most of my schooling and college where I as a Muslim have been probably about 3% of the institution. But my experince has been largely and hugely positive. Most of my friends are non Muslims. No discrimination.

The occasional banter of “katua” is amongst friends on who is going to pay the canteen bill.

I feel bad that politicians and people want us to be religious Muslims all the time. A few idiots on this blog reprimand us for stepping our of the way Muslims are supposed to write and talk.

In te end we are all human beings first. Sadly in this country everyone wants us to be Muslims first.

Rajeev, dont blame your classmates for this. There has to be more non religious friendly interaction of Muslims with others.

that is why I think reservation for Muslims as Muslims will only strengthen the religous identity and not their national identity. But classifying them as poor and unemployed or deprived will bring them closer to others.

[Reply]

Engrich posting 50 pages of non relevent nonsense was the rant of a losing duffer. A madman who needs psychological treatment. Ignore him.

[Reply]

We have another new foul mouthed member on the loose. Gopi’s appeal seems to have gone in vain, as was Pankaj’s earlier one too. They are supposed to be ‘educated’, ‘cultured’ and those sort of things. Speaks volumes about their ‘education’ and ‘culture’.

[Reply]

This is Ravi’s tolerant Islam..I hope Manohar as usual will support muslim tolerance.

‘Fatwa’ announced against Christian schools in Kashmir, 3 priests asked to leave valley

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/india/Fatwa-announced-against-Christian-schools-in-Kashmir-3-priests-asked-to-leave-valley/articleshow/11555784.cms

[Reply]

guys!

Let us stop this “which is better” religion discourse uless there is a ‘micro” subject demanding thediscussion.
Let us discuss governance, hold the legislators , bureaucrats etc responsible.

[Reply]

Congressi troll thinks that I am trying to interact with him. I guess he is delusional. Whenever he talks nonsense, I just show him the mirror.

Behind those so-called liberal thoughts, I see a communal hypocrite who wants status quo because it suits his vested interests.

A person is known by company he keeps. This Manohar is in the company of Jihadis like Enrich and Ravi and Congress trolls like Mahesh and Prahalad.

This blog shows the political alignment that we see in India..Congress-Jihadis on one side and rest on other side.

[Reply]

Gopi,
What is your opinion on Kalmadi continuing as IOA president? Is there as possibility that he will be inducted a Sports Minister by honest PM MMS? It has happened before when Vilasrao Deshmukh was asked to step down as CM after 26/11 pakistani peace initiative and later inducted into Union Ministry.

[Reply]

gopi jee,

Like the Jews, their Brahminist cousins are collectively killing all our senses and programmed us to focus on sex, violence, trivia, property, stock market, entertainment, drinking, eating, cheating — Kamasutra

do you agree with me.

[Reply]

PARVEZ/ AALOKE, ISHWAR – I AM SUTRADHAR, let me provide you with a guide to most addictive blog on planet, also called slippery minefield, haha. It is like a Indian mela, full of interesting characters-
Rizwan- he of bloodshot eyes, comes and takes on villain- yaad hai tooney mujhey bacpan main tang kia tha etc etc. All he lacks is a Kareena

Balwinder praaji and Shri Shri Shenoy, bank manager- they are in their sixties and are like jhhoomtey hue haathi, in ‘must’, look drunk, but be vaary careful, they act in unison and kill their prey with humour and by setting traps. Balwinder’s jokes on Ravi are part of blog folklore by now, and are told in campfires across India (eg taking Rizwan’s rishta to Lahore and Osama’s watery embrace)

Gopi- Malyaali christian who quotes geeta. I have been honoured to be told that my historical knowledge matches his
Vijay- Noida and Mayawati expert, went to meet Walmart MD in dhaariwaala kaccha, haha
Mohan- biggest provider of jokes on blog along with Shenoy- mera janaaza rok do, aagey daaru ki dukaan aa rahi hai, lol

Ravi- gets tripped and trussed up with regularity every week. Lives in Lahore or London or Delhi, no one knows. Says Taleban blowing up girls schools and hindus protesting Valentine cards, all same. Always on the run from Shenoy and praaji chasing him in a jeep, although this week got blown away by into outer space by ab main baccha nahin raha My name is dabang rizwan khan

Ramavtar=tajender=engrich- brahmin zionists dunnit fame
Manohar & Mahesh- hate BJP, Anna, protectors of ravi, fair enough

AND FINALLY, Dr Mishra, sailing golfing diving surfing doctor in cold and wet Yorkshire, sutradhaar, loves India and this mad mela blog with passion , annoys people by taking contrarian views- eg praising Veer Savarkar and supporting Rizwaan on muslim poor reservation- bleeds tiranga, loves saying with genuine passion Mera bhaarat mahaan- and then withdrawing to his glass of wine most nights. Good night all

[Reply]

Strong Urge to Conform

Most of us feel the need to conform to group norms. The desire is to go along with the norms of a group of people, so that one is accepted as an in-group person and not rejected as an out-group undesirable person.

Similar group dynamics have been in play in this blog for a long time. Through various fairly obvious devices, imperceptible pressure is exerted on new arrivals to encourage them to conform. This behaviour of certain self-appointed leaders of the in-group here has recently become more evident.

It is sad to see some new and returning members adopting the in-group’s values, opinions, language style, etc. One significantly noticeable example is how quickly the new comers have joined in attacking the members of the out-group, for no personal rhyme or reason. This they do in order to cement their membership of the in-group. It is also indicative of the strength of their desire to be accepted by the in-group. Personal insecurities are propped up by in-group loyalty.

On the other hand it is heartening to see one or two brave individuals who have retained their individuality by expertly practicing their ASSERTIVENESS TRAINING. I salute these individuals.

AS IF BY MAGIC THE GOOD DOCTOR FURNISHES A PERFECT EXAMPLE

[Reply]

Dear Ravi,

Continuing with our earlier exchange.

I make a distinction between Discussion and Argument.

Argument is when you come with fixed ideas which can not be altered. And why they can not be altered , because they are tied too tightly with your Ego. This Ego comes from our deep rooted inferiority complex. You look for win for yourself and loss for your adversary. It is infact a battle. A supposedly win inflates the Ego , however no one concedes loss, It is only other who thinks he has won. in actual, there is no winner and looser in an Argument.

In a discussion, you have your point of view, it could be very strongly held view, but you still come with an open mind. You are ready to listen patiently and respectfully to others point of view. You look for what is the right view even if it is against your view. In discussion, there is scope for positive contribution and positive gain of knowledge. There is no looser. Everyone gains.

Now coming to our topic of discussion ,” Should reservations or benifits be available to Muslims on the basis of their religion”.

My point is very clear, their backwardness ( Not poverty as was misunderstood last time ) is self inflicted. We see same example happening even in Muslim communities in UK and other European countries where they have immigrated. Compare this with other non muslim immigrants of similar background. The reason is very very clear. It is the hold of their religion which has kept them backward. Others have been able to un shackle hold of their religion( particularly the regressive part ) to quite an extent. There was no special discrimination that Muslims faced in British rule , discrimination that Hindu’s did not face. On the other hand, Hindus besides facing whatever discrimination was faced by all Indians, were taunted, vilified for their religious beliefs.This never happened with Muslims. That vilification is still On. Britishers as also Muslims before them having come with understanding of Abrahmnic religions could not understand supposedly complex philosphies of Hindus. After independence, there has not been any structural disadvantage that Muslims have faced except for their inward looking approach which stems from their religious philosophy.Examples of other Muslim born people on this Blog is what they can do when they un-shackle this regressive religious bond. I have my own first hand experience with many Muslim friends who have never faced discrimination in India.

Muslims have their role models who have done exceedingly well in all spheres, a very large number of them are progressing in line with progress of other communities,Muslims are also not the poorest lot,. The solution, which applies to Indian muslims as also to Muslims of Pakistan or Europe is to un-shackle hold of their regressive religious philosophy. For this Education should be top priority particularily for their Girls.Govt should definitely give additional help in this.

This country was divided on the basis of religion, which does not mean we have to take revenge by discriminating Muslims of today, but let us also not reward them for that.

[Reply]

He He …the true face of Indian Secularism…Vinod Sharma Sahib’s secularism…the Congress party’s secularism…Sahmat’s secularism…Teesta Setalvad’s secularism..Indian Media’s secularism.
Four Christian Missionaries have been ordered to leave Jammu & Kashmir. Are we talking of India ?? He He … Yes …. Parties in Power … Congress and National Conference. News reported by the secular Indian Media in 15 col cms size …in the inside pages of some Indian newspapers. Did NDTV report it …No I do not think so..He He
(With gratitude to Balwinder Praaji for borrowing his” He He” )

[Reply]

Some blogs back everyone was celeberating conversion from Hindu dharma to their fold.

Now with this ghinona harkat by Kashmir sarkar ssabki jaan nikal gayi hai. Nobdoy will mention conversion now. Come on Mr Manohar you were talking about your relatives experince. And some others too.

Only Engrich the pigs **** will say very good. Brhmns ziionism etc.

This is communal sarkar in J&K. Buddhists daily convert forcibly in Ladakh. But if Christian want to convert, grand Mufti after their Bhu_ _.

Why this conspiracy of silence by all?

Let us celeberate conversions now.

[Reply]

Vinodji,

we understand you are an extremely busy editor.

You were not so even a few months earlier. You used to find time to interact with some of the blokes here, joking, pulling our legs, criticising, admonishing, and even appreciating.

Kahaan gaye woh din?

Let me remind you that one Ram Autar, believed by most to be a jihadi plant on your blog, misused the freedom afforded by you for heaping abuse after vile abuse on Hindus, their revered saints, their gods and goddesses. After most of us persistently followed up with you, you, after much trepidation, expelled him from the blog.

Now, you know better than anybody else, what is happening here; yet you are so inexplicably silent and watching silently.

Now this Ram Autar, in his new ID engrich, has descended to unspeakable levels of abuse and here is a sample of his vileness:

“PARVEZ ur mother is fked by dogs when u are born u are true son of *****.u put bottle of whisky in ur *** when come on this blog.dont awnser or awnser why abuse.
u are pure donkey. ”

I didn’t want to reproduce this abuse, but I feel this is the only way a slumbering Vinod Sharma can be woken up. Or can it?

I leave it to your good sense and clean conscience to decide. Do you need Lord Krishna to tell an indecisive Arjun to remind of his duty?

[Reply]

Old Golimarkar had a farm
He Ha, He Ha, Ha

On that farm he had a farmer, Balwinder was his name.

He He here and Ha Ha there.

He He here, Ha Ha there

Old Golimarkar had a farm
He Ha, He Ha, Ha.

On that farm lived a Jay, Vi Vi was his name

He He here and Ha Ha there.

He He here, Ha Ha there

Old Golimarkar had a farm
He Ha, He Ha, Ha.

On that farm worked a BOY, BV was his name

He He here and Ha Ha there.

He He here, Ha Ha there

Old Golimarkar had a farm, isn’t that a shame
He Ha, He Ha, Ha. Limits its intellectual game

[Reply]

Vinodji
………………Vinodji
……………………………..Vinodji

Please ban ramautar engericj tajender, his vile abuse of Parvez and Rizwans parents would be punishable by law in UK, if his identity was known.
I want the voices of moderate muslim youth to be heard. I actually come on blog to read these 2boys as Gopi from kerala, and viju from Gurgaon. I dont have to travel TO GET VIEWS FROM 4 CORNERS OF INDIA.

BAN ENGRICH, via disqus. Ravi, I know now you are behind engerich, that is fact. When you get attacked, then u use engerich to abuse your detractors. I now think even more lowly of you. OTHERWISE RAVI GIVE OPINION ON ENGRIQUES ABUSES, no ducking weaving.
Vinodji, pl u answer

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when nakedness draws but a smile:

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This is an attempt to rescue this blog from the frivolities of dimwit bloggers whose cranium has as much functioning neurons , as indian cricket team’s chance of winning in Australia. , whose intellectual limits are defined by pleading to agent Vinod to drive away the villians
@RajeevS, Aaloke et al
I had posted few lines about the reasons for conversions in east bengal now bangladesh. I have now realised the theory about Buddhist passivity has MORE HOLES THAN THE SPOUT OF A WATERING CAN. Bit busy now , will elaborate later. But just reflect on Indonesia , and Sri Lanka , one HINDU converted en masse , that they were hindu through and through borne out by the name MAYAVATI SUKARNOPUTRI (cant geyt any clearer than that) , Sri Lanka didn’t convert . Ponder
Will elaborate later work to do

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U.S. shuts down file-sharing website Megaupload

http://www.thehindu.com/sci-tech/internet/article2815112.ece

One of the world’s largest file-sharing sites was shut down on Thursday, and its founder and several company executives were charged with violating piracy laws, federal prosecutors said.

………

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Whereas Gen V K Singh’s case is now before the SC but the govrnment continues with its campaign to descredit the General thru friendly sections of the Media and ( we have some idea about them..)
It is being touted that Gen V K Singh had given an “undertaking” to accept 1950 as the year of birth and now he has gone back on it. Strange… Instead of the evidentiary document as per Rules i.e the matriculation certificate . Can “undertakings” or “statements” of the concerned employee overrule the document submitted by him and which has not been challenged by either party . Hypothetically If Gen V K Singh had stated that his date of birth is 1952 , could the government have accepted that.
…..Now the whispers that I have heard. That Gen V K Singh had been disagreeing to certain deals of procurement and his Succesor , in case he retires on the basis of 1950 , is expected to clear them. St Anthony , like the good PM, is only a quiet non playing spectator.

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Dear Ravi,

Let me first concede my lack of English language knowledge and its articulation. You definitely are able to articulate your point of view much better. However I checked once again my earlier post. I found I have used “You” in case of “Argument” as also for “Discussion”. There definitely was no such debating strategy. I am actually not capable of one. My English language can be considered literal translation of how we speak in Indian languages.. Please rest assured on this front. However as you would agree, these are but small technicalities which can always be excused.

During discussion of our topic in consideration, I have tried to bring every one here back to the specific point. I have not discussed Muslim Backwardness and their requirement of Education in isolation. It has been discussed in reference to our topic of ,” Should reservations or benefits be available to Muslims on the basis of their religion”. Now in this I don’t have to discuss what is being done by “Orthodox Jews” or “Jehovah’s witness”. I don’t have to discuss what is percentage of girl students in Malaysia ( If it is high in Malaysia, then results also must be better).

Regarding your reasoning on Regression, well it may emanate from any source, but as long as it is there, we will have problems. We have to find solution for this regression and not let it remain and justify it. What best cure of regression than Education. Regarding your view on agitation due to deep rooted Islamophobia, well to some extent you may be right. But , it is fear, and not phobia of Islam ( phobia as per my limited knowledge is fear of something which in actual is not there or fear is disproportionate to actual). Fear of what it can do to a civilized society if regression in it is not eliminated or curtailed. But then are these fears unreal? Have’nt we faced them for last 1000 years in India and 1400 years in world.

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Ravi

You listed all those countries such as Pakistan, Algeria, Morocco, Saudi Arabia etc… So, why are most of those countries backward? They have 100% reservations for Muslims.

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u r right

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@ Rizwan and Parvez

You guys are the future of India. Just blog on. And in case some trolls abuse,
Dont worry guys !! just remember that

HIJRAS BEOME NANGA FIRST !!

On this blog two hijras becoma nanga when they lost out !

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Fake Ram Autar abuses Parvez
He wants to ape the gora Angrez
abusing others he has made his businezz
and like all jihadis yeh hai bada bad-tameez

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@ Shoeb

As usual a brilliant post. I concur with you that the Congressis want to exclude Muslims as a vote bank. I think they would end up creating dissensions in society if we divide India like an Italian pizza which the Congress wants.

The correct way would be to earmark scholorships, schools and subsideis for Muslim areas and then also allow Muslims to qualify in the backward quota which would be class based.

I would love to hear more from you om tech incubation. Your last post on technolgy got my ears up. Maybe some innovating CM in India should take it up. Ultimately we need more of the 12-13% growth rate and nto this path which the Congress is taking us on …

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@ Prahlad

now you got to answer this one seriously. Most Congressis wer celeberating Rushdie’ protest as a BJP thing . I am listing out some facts.

a) The writers at jaipur feel the Congress manipulated this for votes in elections

b) Abhishek Manu Singhvi just announced that “the law will take its course” when Hair Kunzreu and Jeet Thayill read out excerpts from Satanic verses

c) Right NOW, on TV MIM and Deobandis are chest thumping that they drove Rushdie out !

So Prahlad ji will you still say BJP?

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@ Vijay

Thanks for the kind words. And the funny ones !

No, I am not afraid of vile abuse. As college students we too have choice repartees in our quiver. However it would only sully the blog. So I have refrained from saying somthing about the fundoos’ family or their relation with their dog.

I am more worried about Rizwan who seems to be younger than me. Unfortunate that the fundoo said all that about his dad. But then the fanatics stand exposed for being the straitjacket on our minds.

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Ravi-
Neither the US Govt nor the US supreme court has sanctioned a religious (or race) based reservations/affirmative action program in USA.
The only stipulation is that nobody can be discriminated based on religion, race etc. The impetus for this 1964 Civil rights act was the outright discrimination in colleges and jobs and voting based on colour, with blacks denied opportunities just because they are blacks.

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Vinay

Just to be absolutely clear, my argument is neither to do with India or with Muslims. That would be parochial and I am not one. My focus was to rationally look at if Religion can be used – among other criteria or on its own – as a basis for targeting affirmative action.

My conclusion is that I see no reasons as to why not.

However, since you have asked specific questions it would be cowardly to avoid answering them. Political considerations aside, the function of any affirmative action, anywhere in the world is a managerial one. If a government observes – for what so ever reasons – that a certain section of the population is lagging behind, then by instituting affirmative measures it is acting responsibly. In Indian context Dalit’s, OBCs and Muslims for one reason or another have not made as much progress as would be beneficiary for our society. To correct this, affirmative actions are put in place. What the argument is, should one or any of them be targeted towards Muslim’s. I say no reason why not.

In UK single mothers with babies are given preference for subsidised social housing and in large conurbations this rule disproportionally benefits Black Young women and generates resentment among non-white married young women. Marriage, as you and I understand is not nearly as common in the Caribbean as it is in Europe and India. This is recognised as a legacy of sub-culture which developed during Slavery. Right wing reactionaries in the UK oppose any affirmative action for single mums, because it disproportionately helps Black’s more than it does white women. Their argument is that we should put pressure on them to conform to the supposed norm of 2 parent family. 300 years after slavery was abolished the sub-culture of absentee father still stubbornly sticks to the West Indian Families. Viv Richards is just one such example.

This type of affirmative action is not a long winded apology for slavery, but is there to ensure that the CHILD has a roof over its head. This prevents disadvantage being transmitted from one generation to the next. This analogy in my view also holds good for Dalit’s, OBCs and Muslims in India.

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UK- Indians vs Pakistanis””””””””””

Vinay, sorry buddy got to correct you. You said in UK, most Pakistani immigrants were factory workers while Indians were high class professionals and that explains why Indians are succesful. You obviously do not live in UK for you would not have made this major error.

1. Huge swathes of UK took poor, semi-literate Indians from Punjab and some from Gujrat- Wolverhampton, Coventry, Southall, Wembley, Birmingham, Ilford, East Ham etc. Their success story was STUPENDOUS- within 1 generation most had moved into university education, businesses and well paid jobs.

2. For 20 years, Indian and Chinese kids are on the very top in national GCSE results, even leaving whites behind.

3 Sadly, the Pakistani areas have seen ghettoisation- undereducation, crime and Islamic fundamentalisation has followed- Bradford, Whitechapel, Rusholme, Leeds, Oldham, Luton, etc

4. Yes, these has been a pocket of affluent Asians who made fortunes in East Africa and came to uk, both Indians and Pakistanis, or professionals like me- who will obviously do well.

5. Indian muslims particularly from Gujrat do much better than Pakistanis
DR MISHRA, YORKSHIRE

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TAnother PORKY from SMUG Mishra. The word INDIAN needs to be used carefully. here have been several kind of immigration to UK.The Gujratis MOSTLY are from UGANDA AND KENYA , they were MIDDLE CLASS to start with , AND FUNDAMENTAL IS THEY LET THEIR WOMEN FOLK GO OUT TO WORK, COUPLED WITH THEIR GENETIC MAKE UP , DHANDHA. This is why they are the most succesful group. Bengalis from India ARE 98% PROFESSIONAL probably 10000-15000. They have VERY VERY HIGH PROFILE PEOPLE.Mihir Bose is probably NO1 sport journalist was Editor in BBC sports. Pallav Ghosh is Science Editor of BBC.Prof Dasgupta is prof of Economics in Cambridge .
Next is SIKHS.They are several kind, The FAUJI , are the ones who served as CANNON FODDER for the British Army , settled in UK when the war ended.
Next is some sikhs from Kenya , middle class , and lastly and substantially from the RURAL HAMLETS OF PUNJAB , poor illiterate sikhs are the ones that pandit Mishra is referring to.Compared with Pakistanis(if we take away middle class professional pakistanis eg, DOCTORS etc) they have done better, BUT NO WHERE NEAR THE GUJRATIS.Also MOST SIKHS ARE IN BUILDING TRADE , which saw an astronomical growth.
Bangladeshis were MOSTLY sailors in merchant ship who simply landed when the ship moored.They were the most illiterate, thus their children did worse.
An educated Bangladeshi doctor’s son is inevitably a doctor.
GUJRATI MUSLIMS IN UK ARE AT PAR WITH THEIR HINDU PEERS, they have incredible support system with the AGA KHAN TRUST.
The sikhs have the most DRINK PROBLEM , DIVORCE AND DOMESTIC VIOLENCE.
See the film PROVOKED starring Bahu Bacchan
Anybody trying to challenge will be pelted with a shower of data

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This -Tu-Tu, Main-main is continuing in this blog. may be this is the fate/ attraction of this blog.
Drive on 405 North in California is one of the most beautiful drive. US is progressing with leap and bounds and here we waste our energy in arguments. Rightly, we have been titled as Argumentative Indians.
If, in place of talking, at Chaay adda, Daru Khana a, Bus Stop and all the places where people work or should work, then they will certainly contribute to progress of India.
Lot of divisive agenda is still going on in place of constructive suggestions.
Best of luck to all of you.

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Guys,

Nothing is happening, everybody seems to be busy. Meanwhile read this.

Electricity went off in a small town. After three days, some time at night a
frustrated lady called electricity board and said :

Aaj to kisi aadmi ko bhejo, mein teen din se mombati use kar rahi hoon.

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Dr Pankaj welcome back. Sadly blogs all over the world and comments on you tube etc do get dominated by trolls and abuse. So no need to think this tendency is limited to Indians, haha.

Parvez- educationally 3 communities are at bottom of the pile- Pakistanis, Bangladeshis and Blacks. Reasons differ for each. You asked an interesting question- any other community here that is religioulsy too orthodox- answer is yes- ORTHODOX JEWS.

Pocketed in areas like Golders Green and Stamford Hill, they are ultra religious, have very large families- 7/8 kids- and many are employed as ‘theology students’. Many therefore are very working class, buffered by the very generous benefits system of UK and also propped up in many ways by the wealthy Jewish society.

But the one difference with Pakistanis is- while many do live APART from mainstream white society, they are not AT ODDS with them. Hope that made sense PARVEZ

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Parvez/Dr Mishra

There is a huge problem/movement in Israel from orthodox Jews. They are at odds with the government on the roles of women, going back to the Torah etc.
Surprisingly, a segment of them are also against Zionism — insisting the state of Israel should be handed over to the Palestinians..

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Sharad Pawar may be appear to be mumbling whenever he chooses to speak. But, when he chooses to ’speak out’, he makes a lot of sense.

Now, PAWAR SAYS UPA II IS CRUMBLING
—————————————————————————–

http://www.indianexpress.com/news/public-perception-upa2-will-crumble-says-pawar/902190/

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So, what about this assassin story regarding the cancellation of Rushdie visit?

Is this a part of “get the votes from UP anyway you can”.. that “my father banned the book even before Ayatollah Khoemini, and now my party prevented him from visiting his homeland honouring your sensitivity”

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==============================================================
~~~ MANI SILENCER, DIGVINASH AND dunce YUVRAJ killed UPA 2~~~~
==============================================================

@ Shenoy and Gopi

I have always maintained that the grave of the three murderers of UPA 2 should have the 3 names in golden letters. Mani silencer the poison supplier, Digvinash the administrator and Yuvraj the dunce who thought to look good he needed to make MMS look bad.

Well Sharad Pawar has just broken that story now. Mani Aiyar hid his failure as SPorts Minister by repeatedly shouting 70,000 crores looted when the loot was probably only 3-4000 crore.

Digvinash makes India look weak by trying to absolve terrorists and LeT while eulogising Osamaji.

Dunce Yuvraj feels that it is okay to demolish MMS and development just to come to power.

Everything looks a failure for UPA-2 becasue fo these 3 caroon characters.

Maybe the cartoon channel needs them more than India…

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Viju
You talked about self interested groups perpetuating religious/caste divisions standing in the way of progress…

We have to thank the British for this technique of divide and rule.. They were really surprised that Jhansi Rani Lakshmi Bhai, Khan Bahadur, Tanya Tope, Begum Hazrat etc will join together and fight against them. (btw Jhansi Rani was only around 25 or so when she led the troop!) Ever since then the British was focused on destroying this unity and pitching one against the other.

And they went on it scientifically, collecting data, feeding data. All the famous emperors in India’s history took the count of its people. Akbar did, Rajaraja Chola did. But their count was about men, women, young, old.

One of the early initiatives after the direct rule was imposed after the East India company was relieved of administartion was a census of India. 1880 was the first time in the history of India, in its long lineage of great (and not so great) emperors, that the citizens were counted and categorized on religion. In fact, religion was the first question on the enumeration form.

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It is a shame that the GOI was unable to protect the Jaipur Literary festival and Salman Rushdie from the Deobandi thugs.

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open letter to ravi from PARVEZ AND RIZZY BABY
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

dude we dont get worked up when Mishraji quotes muslim ghettoes in uk and dont take digs at Parvez saying he has poisoned mind. Last year Balwinder uncle and Dr Pankaj confirmed the same. You dont live in India so you dont know something called Sachar report, this is a stark fact we do not hide from.
My gen looks at problem with clear eyes man !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!we gotta educate our women FULL STOP!!!!!!!!!!!! Parvez bhai, hope u agree I quoted u outta turn

Friends, we have some relatives visiting from Bhopal- they only wanted to do one thing in Delhi- no, not visit India gate or Lodhi gardens- they all wanted to RIDE THE METRO hahaha country bumpkins. So rizzy baby is hauled back from Bhiwadi, drives eevryone to a mall near IFFCO chowk and we get to dilli haat near INA market in 35 mins flat. now thats rocking man , whooohoooo

rissssssspectttttttt to Mr Srredaharan whatshisname , we shud name the metro after you. You see RAVI dude, we dont need your shit- wherever you hide in sialkot or timbuktu, dont come here to divide us, butt out. My country, my newspaper, my rulezzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

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Dr.Mishra, Dr. Pankaj, Balwinderji, Mohan,

the acronym ‘PIO’ has great value and respect in India, particularly with the government and the media.

While we are all locals, “ghar ki murgi”s.

Now, I had appealed to Vinodji to take note of the unmentionable abuses this engrich t..d is hurling at Rizwan and Parvez. It doesn’t seem to have any effect. In fact I doubt Vinodji has even cared to read it.

TODAY ENGRICH HAS HURLED ANOTHER VILE ABUSE AT PARVEZ, “son of a ***** keep yr a$$ shut.jahil.otherwise wait for another.”

Now, I feel the PIOs of this blog should take up cudgels on behalf of these two innocent bloggers, whom we all respect and value, and “persuade” Vinodji to handle the two pests, who know they can abuse others with impunity.

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Manohar

Do you believe that the intensity of hounding and provocation has increased recently??

Have you also noticed that these pleas are largely ignored even by those to whom they are specifically addressed.

Is this a sign of desperation.

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Manohar I attacked someones stoopid post in non vulgar language and u were upset. And yet u r silent on engerichs totally filthy language
Double standards Sirji
Shenoy saab one hundred percent support. BAN ABUSERS LIKE EGRICH and final warning to Ravi, no more abuse. This is gentelman blog

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Balwinderji/ Mr. Shenoy,

Aap logon se umar mein chota hoon. If you feel offended, I apologize in advance.

Why you both want to be compared with Engrich ?

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SInce there has been a lot of talk of offence. Here is something to think about Mahatma Gandhi

One many proved how easy it is to make a difference through very little action. Preaching a message of social disobedience through non-violent action, Gandhi made every effort to bring together the peoples of his home nation of India together. He would ‘offend’ (emphasis mine) those that preferred violent action and this would lead to his assassination. But, his legacy lives on as all you have to do is say his name and everyone will remember his ideals and his methods.

Courtesy David Furritus – http://www.helium.com/users/55687

———————————

Here is an appeal to all (yes to all) – please refrain from abuse and labeling to make the blog more congenial. Discuss and debate the issues – never mind the result – convergence or divergence of views – respect other people’s view point. If any post offends one, just ignore it.

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salaam and namaste from Delhi everyone !

Seems that the blog has moved a bit since morn !

Balwinderji, I let Enric’s abuse get out of my other ear. In fact I reminded him that “Hijra nanga ho gaya hai aur gaali bhi de raha hai…”

That should take care of him.

Rizwan, your post is indeed lively. You are a lucky guy. I have a pile of books on my table as I write this.

Ravi Sir (assuming you are much older to me) . There has to be a solution to one man unloading standard, static, meaningless answers all the time, devoid of intelligence and content. Further being hugely abusive if a Muslim boy ventures into new pastures with an open mind, wanting to trailblaze and become a community role model. And most of destroying the beauty and harmony of this blog, trying to become dominant by sheer volume of garbage.

Back to my books now. If Oil becomes 150 dollars how do we sell cars to consumers is the subject which worries me for the next two hours.

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Now back to real blogging
————————————

Now Mamata wants national holidays on Netaji, Tagore birth anniversaries

http://www.expressindia.com/latest-news/Now-Mamata-wants-national-holidays-on-Netaji-Tagore-birth-anniversaries/902422/

Excerpt

Had the Trinamool chief got her way, four more days would have been added to the Centre’s list of 17 all-India holidays.

————-

What can one say about this ‘demand’?

By having more national holidays in honour of her state’s greats, will Poschimbonga become the number one state in the country? Will the investments start flowing into the state?

I think over a period of time, she will make herself irrelevant and no one will take her seriously. She will have no one else but herself to blame?

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It seems my hunch proved to be right.
———-

‘Rajasthan police invented plot to keep away Rushdie’

http://www.thehindu.com/news/national/article2820796.ece?homepage=true

Excerpt

Maharashtra’s Director-General of Police P.K. Subramaniam went on record to deny that his force had provided information on a potential threat to Mr. Rushdie. “When we had no information that gangsters or paid assassins from [the] Mumbai underworld had planned to eliminate Mr. Rushdie,” he told journalists in Mumbai, “how could we have shared it with anybody”?

Intelligence sources in New Delhi said no threat to Mr. Rushdie’s life had been reported to the Multi-Agency Centre, the Intelligence Bureau’s hub at which all terrorism-related threats are discussed at high-level afternoon meetings.

———-

Disgusting to say the least.

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Engrich, all riswan puttar said was Do u and ravi live in same house Disturbing” I checked.
chhad yaar, inni choti si baat, but yr mountain of abuse in very filthy language on Parvez and riswan was disgusting. Dont say they are like my sons
LIKE YOUR SONS, YES YOU ABUSE YOUR SONS LIKE THAT??? What you are talking. I call spade a spade, only sikhs are totally strong and independent. Yes u should be banned. You WANT TO APPEAL, go appeal to most respected men on blog, Ashish, Gopi, Dr Mishra and Dr Pankaj and Praveen Saxena. I will accept their judgement

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@the discerning blogers(automatically excludes few tramps)
Guys I visit this blog to be enlightened , to engage and for some intellectual stimulation.
Few facts , the indian bloggers will find interesting
Recently a ROMAN coin was found a french chef working in London , whose hobby happens to be amateur archaeolgy. The incredible thing about this coin was that was used by BROTHEL KEEPER as a TOKEN.This was exchanged with proper coin. This was done so that the prostitutes cannot cheat the brothel keeper.The coin has a copulating couple engraved. This takes me to the BBC2 programme on Sicily .There is a palace circa 400AD which has the largest Roman mosaic floor and walls anywhere in the world. The incredible thing about these mosaics is that the show GIRLS IN BIKINI(so bikini is not a recent invention) with DUMBELLS.apparently there are gymnast who used to entertain the rich romans with gymnastics.
I hope you guys found this interesting.India was also at onetime such an advanced society.Just reflect on KAMASUTRA , according to KINSEY , father of scientic sexology , INDIA INVENTED SEX.

[Reply]

Dr Shan

Interesting indeed.

I hope you guys found this interesting.India was also at onetime such an advanced society.Just reflect on KAMASUTRA , according to KINSEY , father of scientic sexology , INDIA INVENTED SEX.

If Man is believed to have originated in Africa. Then what did he do for entertainment until he reached India.

We know what he did when he got to India.

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@Shoeb K ,you visit USA often.I wonder if you had seen this Oscar winning documentary, called THE INSIDER JOB, here is an excerpt
Charles Ferguson’s Academy Award-winning forensic analysis of the 2008 global financial crisis. The film traces the emergence of a rogue culture within the finance industry which has corrupted politics, regulation, and academia. At a cost over $20
trillion, the crisis caused millions of people to lose their jobs and homes in the worst recession since the Great Depression, and nearly caused global financial collapse

Apparently there is fair bit of poverty in USA , and middle class is finding it tough , with the college fees in Govt institution around 10.000 dollars , massive health insurance premiums. We are talking about ordinary folks here not Sergei Brin
Also looks like Obama may have an easy ride this time.
With each republican primary moreMUCK is coming to the fore.
Apparently Newt Gingrich’s ex wife revealed in a TV chat show that Newt wanted an OPEN MARRIAGE ,and at one time used to house his mistress and wife under the same roof.
Next will be Matt Romney’s TAX DODGE, already his BIZARRE Mormon sect and what he said to an unmarried mother is aired on the TV

On a separate note HOW MANY BLOGGERS EXCEPT ME HAVE ACTUALLY READ THE SATANIC VERSES, it is ALSO PRETTY IMPOSSIBLE TO SEE IT IN ANY SHOPSIN UK

[Reply]

@Manohar
While discussing state’s subsidies to the Kumbh Mela and comparing with Hajj subsidy; picture would have been clearer if you had also brought in the revenue collection by temples and pilgrimage tours towards Indian govt and compare them with Govt response towards churches and mosques.

@Mishra,
My question was specific. It was to compare two different religions with same class. You said, Gujarati Muslims do better than Pakistani Muslims. That is comparing same religion with different class. That does not clear my doubt. Shan answered to the point, Gujarati Muslims and Hindus do equally well. Do you agree with his reply or not?

@Ravi,
My emphasis was not on “Muslims”, it was towards “all ….” (put any community in dots, not just Muslim).
“…Dalit’s, OBCs and Muslims for one reason or another have not made as much progress as would be beneficiary for our society. To correct this…”
This is what I argued earlier. Should creamy layer keep getting benefits for any number of years, till they reach a stage where the community representation in education/job equals their share in society OR should we consider nature has distributed the talent unequally, ignore the creamy layer and pass on the privileges to more deserved ones in their community?

I will not touch the topic of social housing in UK, as I don’t feel comfortable. Nothing against single parenting; just two different cultures. I do not have any illusion that our’s is greatest. Nor I measure success of a relationship with its longevity alone. (In our society longevity dominates over mutual respect. Nothing wrong. Two different cultures. One feels commitment brings understanding, other thinks understanding will bring commitment. Both does not guarantee success. Success rate could be 30% in both). My only problem is with the idea they perceive parenting as a person’s right instead of responsibility. What people do with their life is entirely upto them. But they are willing to bring a new life onto Earth and pass on the responsibilities to the society around them. Is it a couple or a vulnarable teenage kid, it does not matter to me. My feel is, both are doing injustice to an innocent life.

@Shan,
I was expecting your next post on decline of Buddhism.

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As Vinod Sharma has spent few blogs (at least two) speaking about corrupt BJP rule in Karnataka, can we expect a response from him for this news?
http://ibnlive.in.com/news/illegal-mining-court-allows-probe-of-krishnas-role/222763-37-64.html

[Reply]

—————————————————————————————————————————–
~~ CONGRESS GESTAPO SETS POLICE AFTER WRITERS ~~~~~
—————————————————————————————————————————–

@ Prahlad

I hope you WILL answer this.

We all know nothing happens in the COngress and COngress ruled states without the consent of Digvinash and Yuvraj. SO WE all can conlcude that poor Amitava Kumar and Hari Kunzru need to phone up Digviansh and beg for mercy to get the COngress thought police of their back.

Meanwhile chest thumping Owaisi and Deobandis are proclaiming victory and want more action against free thinking writers.

Prahlad, sir, since you and Manohar had found a BJP hand in the anti Rushdie protests could I have your esteemed comments.

Please also note that this is part of the Congress grand strategy to clamp down on google, facebook and internet.

Please sir you need to remember that the COngress was the party which wanted only one channel– Doordarshan which highligeted the greatness of the Nehru- gandy families in 50% of its programs. It was only the outcast PV Rao and the BJP/NDA government which allowed all of us real internet freedoms and multiplicity of media.

But sadly the days of Gandy’s are coming back…

Should all of us now proclaim “welcome back… emergency and all those journos who crawled… when asked to bend….”

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—————————————————————————————————————————-
~~ WHAZ HAPPENING AT THE JAIPUR LIT— OpraH talks education for deprived~~
—————————————————————————————————————————-

Oprah winfrey again stressed that education was the only way out of ghettos, in her stage inteview with Barkha Dutt.

She talked about starting a school in south Africa which would create leadership roles for women.

I hope all the people who want to divide people on caste and communal lines to create votebanks or topics for fake sociological discussions are liteneing.

[Reply]

—————————————————————————————————————————–
~~ CONGRESS CREATES FAKE ASSASINATION PLOT– to scare Rushdie ~~~
—————————————————————————————————————————–

Yuvraj and Digviansh have created so many fake plots which get easily lapped by the supplicant media. They even saw an RSS hand in 26′/11. They saw RSS RSS everywhere even in batla house. And they saw RSS RSS Kali topi in the anti corruption movement.

But thye even created a fake story of an assasination plot to scare Rushdie !!

Hai re COngress. Hai re yeh trolls!!

I think this is magical realism, Rushide writes about…

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Congress backs Rahul but BJP distrustful of Varun: Book

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/india/Congress-backs-Rahul-but-BJP-distrustful-of-Varun-Book/articleshow/11587075.cms

Excerpt

“To a large extent, it boils down to the choices which Rahul and Varun and their fathers or mothers have made. While Rajiv enjoyed the goodwill of the people, Sanjay was almost hated for his policies,” the book titled ‘Rahul’ by journalists Jatin Gandhi and Veenu Sandhu says.

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UID poses national security threat: BJP

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/india/UID-poses-national-security-threat-BJP/articleshow/11583988.cms

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This is about First family of Bollywood.

Abhishek Bachchan asked her newly born daughter : Do you know who is your
grandfather ?
Baby replied : Yes, he is Big B, the star of the millenium
Abhishek : Who is your mother ?
Baby : Miss world
Abishek : Who is your father ?
Baby : No Idea sirjee.

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Of Kumbh mela and UK muslims””””””””’

MANOHAR- challenging thoughts. Should we not have the Kumbh mela next time, an event that is increasingly being covered by international media positively ? Last time it was reported and televised extensively in UK with huge praise showered on the brilliant organisational capability of the Indians involved.
If it should be held who should fund it if not the govt?

VINAY- in byte size replies it is impossible to cover the whole ground. You asked do muslims do as well as other religions OF SAME CLASS ? Easy to answer-

- At the level of doctors, barristers, accountants- most probably yes. Minor differences do creep in because even at this level because in some muslim families the lady will not work, so we are saying annual famliy income will be £100,000 instead of £ 150,000- £200,000.

- But the further one goes down the economic ladder, the wider the disparity between hindus-sikhs and muslims. A working class Gujrati muslim does much better than a Pakistani of same class, but sadly not same as a working class Gujrati hindu.

The success of the hindus and sikhs in the UK, coupled with their tendency to lead peaceful lives in general is widely recognised and lauded by society and media at large

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Dear Ravi,

My apologies for taking so long to respond. We are in the middle of bidding for some major projects . That kept me away. But even other wise, it is very difficult to spend more time on Blog .

Coming back to our topic of Discussion ,” Should reservations or benifits be available to Muslims on the basis of their religion”. Before we start, please let me know when you want this discussion to stop, we will stop it there. Similarily, when I feel we have nothing more to gain or contribute, I will stop it.

While we are on this discussion, let me answer two questions which in my opinion would create a clearer background.

First question is : Do I hate Muslims?

The answer is NO. The strongest way I can can say NO.I would request friends here to help with their better language proficiency to help me say strongest NO. I have worked, lived, laughed, fought with people who are born in Muslim families. While in my daily life, in my profession or personal life, it never crosses my mind to look at a person differently because he is Muslim born.

Second Question : Do I hate Islam ?

The answer for this is not Straight forward. I am Critical, infact highly Critical of Islamic ideology , Islamic Philosophy, Islamic History and concept of Islamic Brotherhood. As I had explained in one of my earlier posts, I do not make my analysis based on a point . I try to draw as many diverse points as possible and then let the shape on the graph emerge. A classic case from Science is Parabola which is an inverted Bell shape. If we take points from one side , or the other side only and plot, it will look like straight lines. If we take points only from middle it will appear as a curve. However, when we take maximum points from all three of above, it will start emerging as Parabola – its real shape. Similarily regarding Islam,I have discussed with Muslims, discussed with non muslims who sympathise with Islam, Discussed with people who are critical of Islam, Studied history of Islam- critical and sympathetic ones, Numerical growth of Islam in various regions of world , India and reasons for the same.Referred to recognized translations of Quran, analysed on whether what has been history of Islamic imperialism, does it still have any relevance, Is the source of Islamic imperialism Quran and Hadith or later developments, how muslim communities have lived with non muslims in past and present. The reason for this interest is , it is fascinating to understand Human and Community psychology. How it shapes society. History becomes a big source of Data for such studies. Also, Non Muslims everywhere have had problems with Islam since last 1400 years and the problem has still not abated. Either the problems are real or as is being portrayed many times as Islamophobia. Based on my wide range studies, I have made my Critical opinion of Islam.
But still, do I hate it. The answer is NO. Hatred is regressive. It harms you more than it can harm your object of Hatred. I have love and Sympathy for people born in Muslim families. It could have been me there if my ancestors had not evaded getting converted. I want them to come out from it, or atleast let them morph it into something which can live peacefully in Civilised world.

We can start our discussion with a small joke.

A helicopter with its pilot and co-pilot looses its way over Seattle city. Suddenly Co-Pilot finds people on terrace of a large building enjoying sun shine during Lunch time. He jots down on Large Playcards and displays to people on Terrace WHERE AM I . Immediately people on terrace scramble playcards and display IN HELICOPTER . On seeing this, Co pilots mumbles, Oh, this is Microsoft building. Immediately he redraws his coordinates and is able to direct pilot to land at proper place. Now Pilot is curious, he enquires, how did you know that was Microsoft Building. Co Pilot answers, it is these Computer guys who come out with Technically Correct Answers , but in actual , Totally Useless Answers.

Above was a joke , however we daily find examples of this happening around us. We hear Technically and Politically correct Statements, when in actual they are useless statements. They are missing the ESSENCE. When we are discussing on our topic, we have to keep this ESSENCE in focus.

This country has had huge problems with Islam for last 1000 years.

Islam has still not accepted and apologized for its role in Holocaust in India . ( This would be first step in their getting ready to live peacefully with other Non-Muslims of India. Like representatives or born in so called higher castes in Hindu society have accepted and apologized for their discriminations of past, SC/ST reservations are a result of that, there was no pressure from these classes when it was formulated)

This country has been divided on the basis of religion.( Which demonstrates that even 60 years back also, Muslims as a community have not accepted living with Non-Muslims peacefully. We find similar example in only Muslim majority state of India- J&K)

Reservations on the basis of Religion, particularly Islam will not go well with majority opinion.

It is not supported by our Constitution and essence of Constitution.

Above points are real points , No politically and technically correct statements.

However, there should also not be any discrimination with Muslims on the basis of their religion. They should enjoy fruits of Indian Constitution like any other . They can and should be covered under any help based on economic criteria. And there should be special emphasis on Education among Muslims and particularily Muslim women . Govt. can definitely help in that. Education will also slowly resolve above listed points. But a Strong NO to reservation and other helpto Muslims based on their religion.

My apologies for this long post.

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@ Gopi

You talked about the deterioration of the situation in Kerala. Now do you have resonable implementable solutions in mind?

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I think Kerala is a paradise and we should not be in a situation where paradise is lost.

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Islam has become a big issue everywhere. But are we talking solutions where Muslims are considered normal citizens– good or bad, ugly and handsome?

Or are we obsessed with “special needs” amd requirements of Muslims all the time?

I find all this a bit silly all the time. In UP where I come from, the issue is who are Muslims going to vote for, what policy each party has for them.

Funny, I thought all of us were normal Indians, practicing religiosn at home.

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Gopi

Nitin Gadkari bats for Narendra Modi as PM candidate and party chief

http://www.dnaindia.com/india/report_nitin-gadkari-bats-for-narendra-modi-as-pm-candidate-and-party-chief_1640961

Ruling out himself as his party’s prime ministerial candidate, BJP president Nitin Gadkari today favoured Gujarat Chief Minister Narendra Modi for the top job and promised to back his candidature as party chief.

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