Hyperbole pey halla bole



The midnight police crackdown on Baba Ramdev’s peaceful assembly at Ramlila Maidan cannot be supported especially when the government had gone out of the way to set up talks with the Yoga Guru. There can also be no two opinions on his anti-corruption agenda especially the demand to repatriate funds stashed in foreign accounts.

I’ve known Ramdev personally, have had many telephonic conversations with him, been the judge in three different episodes in India TV’s Rajat Sharma’s Adalat and delivered at his Patanjali Vidyapeeth a lecture on the aberrations that ail the Indian media. I was brutally frank when asked to take the stage on that occasion, telling the Baba that among the worst offenders of the paid news scourge were owners of media houses who shared the stage with him. The Baba, to be fair, never interrupted me, lauding instead “the fire I had in my belly” despite my advancing years.

I consider therefore my duty to raise in bullet form the points on which the Baba, the government and the BJP owe an explanation. I’d also try and correct, from my perspective, the hyperbole over the police action and in the UPA’s take on Ramdev:

1. If the Baba, as Digvijay Singh claims, is a thug, then why the government laid out for him the red carpet on his arrival in Delhi for the Ramlila Maidan show? I deliberatively refrain from calling it a yoga shivir (for which Baba had the police go-ahead) or a satyagraha attended by thousands.

2. The BJP’s top brass and civil society activists on Anna Hazare’s side have compared the police action with Emergency and Jalianwaala Bagh. Is it not an insult to Jayaprakash Narayan’s total revolution and a gross misrepresentation of the struggle for freedom from the British Raj?

3. References to lathi charge by the media, the Opposition and Ramdev and his supporters were suggestive of two points. It’s either deliberate propaganda or total ignorance of how such use of force works. Lathi charge was the one in which Lala Lajpat Rai died. Police also use lathis as barricades by holding them horizontally in both hands to prevent crowds from surging ahead or caning people mildly to clear the area. There is no “moving picture” evidence of a brutal lathi charge as alleged in different quarters.

4. For his part, Ramdev has talked of a conspiracy to eliminate him and cause casualties among his supporters. He also claimed the police opened fire on peaceful protestors. There is no evidence to back both assertions.

5. The buzz is that the RSS and BJP are using Ramdev to whip up an Ayodhya type movement against corruption. Are such fears genuine or is the UPA merely raising the specter of a communal gang up to prevent an anti-Congress front of the kind witnessed after the Emergency in the 1970s and over the Bofors issue in the 1980s?

6. Is an anti-Congress front with BJP-RSS participation possible in the backdrop of Ayodhya and Gujarat that happened over the past two decades? Perhaps not unless, of course, the UPA keeps postponing concrete actions against corruption.

7. Fanning contradictions in the Opposition spectrum isn’t likely to help the Congress. Its salvation is in credible anti-graft action, be it the Lok Pal Bill or legislative and institutional steps to get back unaccounted money in foreign banks. The party should bear in mind that it’s either now or never.

8. The BJP too needs a makeover. It inspires no confidence as anti-graft crusader with Shibu Soren in Chattisgarh and Yeddy and Bellary brothers in Karnataka, over whom Sushma Swaraj publicly fought with Arun Jaitley.

9. The Baba also must explain as to why he’s focusing only on illegitimate wealth in foreign banks? Why has he
downplayed the need to unearth black money within the country? Is it a quid pro quo for his Indian donors?

10. About time somebody told the dramatis personae that hyperbole is not substitute for halla bol on corruption.

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  • Rajiv

    Most points have self evident answers

    1. Digvijay Singh is a petty thug. Period. That should end all discusion about who is a thug.
    2. the midnight raid, firing tear-gas shells on commoners who have come to support the agiation against blaqck money/corruption, was draconian. It was not JB or Emergency, but a draconian response neverthless.
    3. This was a case where no police action was called for. A totally unprovoked ( unless criticizing congress is provocation enough ) use of force against people exercising their right of free speech and assembly.
    4. Yes, there is some exagerration from Mr Ramdev ,on the extent of the callous and thuggish police action ordered by Sonia-Sibal cabal led hoodloms.
    5. Articulaing peoples’s demands, thats the job of the opposition. BJP would be derelicting its duty if its not championing the demands of Anna Hazare and Ramdev.
    6. Congress has tarred itself as a protector of the corrupt and its deliberate inaction to proceed against the corrupt. This is exposing congress and it will pay a political price , the extent of which will be known after next elections.
    7. Congrtess is pralyzed. As I had quoted earlier from a report in Hindu that there are various legal options open to Manmohan administration to address the issue of Indian , undisclosed accounts in Swiss banks. Does Congress suspect that Sonia may have such an account so it does not want to open that can of worms ? Thsi question will be asked increasingly.
    8. BJP has failed so far to properly articulate and offer a clear alternative on this issue.
    9. No Baba does not have to explain that why he is not agitating about numerous other problems, Its a dumb question.
    10. Its time somebody told Congress leadership that its not the time for police action, delaying tactics but time to act honestly and transparently on the issues articulated by Anna Hazare, Ramdev etc.

    [Reply]

    Rahul Reply:

    Excellent points Rajiv

    [Reply]

    shan Reply:

    I dont think Baba’s agitating is illegal, but baba’s fasting unto death is, Also assembling million people does pose a law and order problem, should things get out of hand,
    Bloggers should keep in mind INDIA IS A FUNCTIONING DEMOCRACY, we DONT NEED JASMINE
    CEDAR , ORANGE whateverREVOLUTION. Also we have inherited all our laws customs, national language , and even traditions from a rather cold and grey island, One should keep in mind that particular island STANDS OUT IN THE CONTINENT as the one which never had REVOLUTION , but had evolution in societalmatters.
    There are plenty of ways for the people to address their greivance. The MP’s can raise the matter in parliament , BRING IN PRIVATE MEMBERS BILL, FILE PUBLIC INTEREST LITIGATION(which is being heard at the moment in supreme court)
    and MOST IMPORTANTLY BABA SHOULD ENDORSE ANY PARTY WHO WILLFULFILLALL HIS ANTICORRUPTION AGENDA come election.
    This is how a CIVILIZED country functions.
    NARA BAZI and blogging is one thing ,ground reality is another.
    Also govt is not made up of people from the mars , they are all Indians.I bet there were scores of people in Baba’s mela or melee , who are not averse to take a backhander or two.
    Why not ask for a NATIONAL COMMISSION made up of intelligent people (sorry there aren’t many) and all the lefties , who are more than happy to see these crooks booked.

    [Reply]

  • Raju Kurien

    Vinod, you can criticize Congress without having to criticize others along with it..You are using Ravi’s trick about bringing Devdasis in when anybody articulates a current ISlamic problem.

    1. BJP and Ramdev do not owe any explanation. Govt does. Ramdev does, only to the extent he wants to communicate to his followers.
    2.I cannot believe you will stoop so low. “journalistc Integrity” on comparisons and words? This is like Jews and jewish lobbies jumping on anybody who uses the word holocaust – ie the Rwandan holocaust, Sudanese holocaust etc – that those situations do not deserve to be called holocausts, because nothing in history compares to the Jewish holocaust.
    3. I cannot believe you will stoop so low
    4. How can you say so categorically there is no evidence. The best you can do is to ask for evidence from Ramdev,a nd declare there is no evidence if he does not provide. I will not put it beyond doubt considering how stupid Congress is
    5. The anticorruption drive will go on irrrespective of political parties
    6. Either BJP or groups of regional parties will definitely capitalize. Congress be careful if his fast and protest goes nationwide
    7. Absolutely righty, and good advice to your masters
    8.. BJP is stupid too; but it looks like they are trying to make over.. Congress doesnt even try
    9. Ramdev does not have to explain anything to anybody. Also, he can choose what he wants as his fighting issue. You should ask your paymasters in congress about why they are not addressing these huge issues. Ramdev can focus on foreign money, get that taken care of, then he can focus on domestic black money or whatever. It is your arrogance to suggest that there is some side story in him not focusing on xyz.. Can then one corelate that by Congress not addressing x, y, z they all have some hidden things (which they have)..

    [Reply]

    Ankit Reply:

    Comments from both Raju Kurien & Rajiv are better than the blog itself.

    [Reply]

  • Mohan Ramchandani

    .”"The Baba also must explain as to why he’s focusing only on illegitimate wealth in foreign banks? Why has he
    downplayed the need to unearth black money within the country? Is it a quid pro quo for his Indian donors?”"

    I have two friends Ramesh and Suresh. Both are in financial problem . I help Ramesh but
    not Suresh. Now I am being critisized for not helping Suresh. No one is appreciating the fact
    that I have helped Ramesh.

    [Reply]

    Ashish Reply:

    @Mohan Ramchandani
    classic :)

    [Reply]

    Balwinder Sandhu Reply:

    MOHAN VERY WELL SAID

    [Reply]

    Ravi Reply:

    Mohan

    I agree with you.

    Choosing what to protest about and what not, is often a good guide to the underlying motivation of the protest leader.

    Your question is very apt; one could have also asked when many states in our country are suffering from the scourge of female foeticide, why Ramdev did not chose to protest about this significantly important social ill.

    Why?

    [Reply]

    Sandeep Reply:

    The people who are indulging in female foeticide are criminals at individual level.
    Are they elected by people ? Is their any political pressure not to punish them ? Do you know them ? You can not compare issues of corruption and female foeticide.

    Launching a counter attack on those who want the Govt to be seen acting againt the corrupt is not a solution to congress problems, if you are here to defend congress.

    [Reply]

    Akka Chandar Reply:

    It is not entirly true that Baba is not concerned about domestic black money. If it were so, he would not have asked for denotifying 500 and 1000 rupee notes. The black money abroad is in lump sum amounts and easier to detect wheras domestic black money is in small amounts and not as easy to detect. Also, black money abroad is a total loss to the Indian economy wheras domestic black money is not. Baba is doing the right thing by focusing on blackmoney abroad.

    One must also appreciate that Baba is willing to stand for a public cause. Compare that with the attitude of middle and rich class in India who do not want to even take the trouble of voting in elections.

    [Reply]

  • Mohan Ramchandani

    Congrats Mr. Sharma you have done it again. Whatever the subject you cannot stop
    yourself from bringing in Gujarat and Yeddy.

    [Reply]

  • http://- Rajeev

    1. Digvijay is a loose canon who has no creditibilty in his state MP and in rest of India. He is basically a thug who plays communal politics. He assumes that all muslims will be fooled by his OSAMAJI C*RAP.

    2. The BJP has habit of using hyperbole. I totally agree with Sharma on this. Let us not stretch our imagination. It was a brutality but not on the scale of emergency.

    3. There was lathi charge and you can see that in media footage too. Moreover one of innocent victim is fighting for her life in Delhi hospital.

    4. Whether there was any conspiracy to eliminate Ramdev or not but the fact is the mid-night swoop would have caused stampede resulting in death of Ramdev and his followers.

    5. What is wrong if RSS/BJP are trying to take advantage of this movement? Has congress not done so in past? The political parties are suppose to look for an agenda and work on it. Does Mr.Sharma expect RSS?BJP to stay quiet and do Bhajans? On one had people like Vinod accuse opposition for not being active and when they become active, journos go on hyperdrive to muzzle voice of opposition.

    6. The time for congress is up. If Ramdev is was irresponsible then Rahul was equally irresponsible in Bhatta Parsaul intigating crowd to indulge in violence by cooking up death figures.

    7. Mr.Sharma is panicking at the thought if Congress doesn’t address corruption now, BJP aa jaayega.. What kind of journo is he?

    8. I agree BJP too needs to clean up its house otherwise congress mouthpiece like Vinod will keep deriding BJP comparing BJP’s peanut corruption with Congress’s mega corruption.

    9. The Baba should only focus on agenda set by congress agents like Vinod because if he concentrates on foreign money then our bharat mata tyaag ki Devi Sonia Gandhi and her son get dragged in.

    10. About time somebody told the dramatis personae that hyperbole. I think this applies for chamchas like Digvijay and Sibal. The true drama queen and prince are Sonia-Rahul who keep doing nautanki acting as internal opposition to the govt. Nothing moves without their permission but everytime govt. goofs up, these mafia Maa-Beta distance themselves awat.

    [Reply]

    shan Reply:

    Congress has institutionalised corruption. Congress likes big ones . Sukhram , win chaddah/bofors, Admiral nanda’s progeny and naval contract, adaarsh, Telgi and the maharashtrian congressi colluders , 2G balwa.
    Muslims seem to be involved in crookery in far higher number of scams , than what their share of population of india would suggest

    [Reply]

    Funny Side Reply:

    All political parties like to make money – its Congress’s fortune that it is in power during our economic growth. More growth would lead to more corruption.
    -Your quote: Muslims seem to be involved in crookery in far higher number of scams , than what their share of population of india would suggest. Unquote.
    - May be Hindu politicians trust their muslim henchmen more – that is why they ask them to safe-keep their ill-gotten wealth and carry out other crimes – simple matter of reposing trust in a person of faith than trusting a Kafir. As a filmi line goes: “Be-imaani ka dhanda badi imaandari se karna padhta hai”.
    - From the days of Haji Mastan & his gang, the media picked on muslim gangsters to demonize the Muslims of India. India Today, Sunday etc sold millions of copy with Haji Mastan or Dawood Ibrahim on their cover. The degree of exposure & publicity that the muslim gangsters enjoy, non-Muslim gangsters don’t. Helps in demonizing and discriminating against that comunity.

    [Reply]

    Pankaj#1 Reply:

    Funny side;
    Saying no funny thing but dead serious matter with this false name? You are starting wrong. yes, it is matter of surprise, why Muslim goons are so very powerful in secular india? there is a long list and I am willing to provide, if you are interested. Had this community been supressed, they would not have dared to indulge in such practices. They do not have modern education, hence can not compete in job market. do not want study beyond ? middle school. However, in uchakkagiri, they have expertise, may be some atavastic traits from Arabs, where Caravan looting had ,if not religious then traditional sanction. Funny side, more after your answer.

  • shan

    @vinod sharma, sibu soren is not from chattisgarh , he is from Jharkhand.
    Also I still can’t understand what’s the sticking point. We copied everything from british, all the present laws are british , if that is so , then lets remind Bloggers about magna carta circa 1200
    THE KING IS NOT ABOVE THE LAW.
    Making law is the simpler part , getting money back as I understand is pretty impossible.
    Also Baba cannot blackmail with his fast unto death , it becomes the era of victoria regina.
    He can organise marches , create awareness , but cannot cause mayhem.
    As Gunnar Myral commented INDIANS LIKE TO TALK ABOUT CORRUPTION , without taking the trouble to address it

    [Reply]

    vinod sharma Reply:

    @shan
    My apologise. It was an oversight.

    [Reply]

    vinod sharma Reply:

    @shan
    My apologies. It was an oversight.

    [Reply]

  • B.V.SHENOY

    If I know you, Vinodji, as much as you claim to know Baba Ramdev and somebody on this blog calls you a thug, I would call that person a rogue or mentally imbalanced.

    You must have seen Digvinash Singh calling Ramdev a thug, the scene was shown repeatedly on all channels. You were present, live on CNN-IBN for several hours, but NOT ONCE YOU OPENED YOUR OTHERWISE EAGER-TO SPEAK OUT MOUTH AND SAY THAT DIGVINASH SINGH WAS WRONG IN CALLING RAMDEV A THUG.

    There is an idiom: calling a spade a spade. You saw a spade and said there is NOTHING.

    [Reply]

    james Reply:

    Shenoy Sir
    Fullly agree with you. It seems that Vinod ji has two faces – one for TV and one for this blog

    [Reply]

    vinod sharma Reply:

    To all fellow bloggers
    I am the only person on this blog whose identity is known. Most who visit this site frequently have not ever introduced themselves to others so that we get some idea of their background. .
    Will it not be proper that all those who insinuate or read meaning into a stance or an averment first give their visiting card. That will help us know from where they are coming?
    Are you there Mr James?

    .

    [Reply]

    james Reply:

    Yes Sir, I am here, aappkkeee ke sewa main…prastut hai
    But Sir, identity itnee imp nahi jitne ke views…
    I hope my recent replies to your post have at least dispelled your notion that I am a BJP/RSS sympthiser. You gave me an occassion, and I wrote against them.

    vinod sharma Reply:

    @james
    Does it mean you don’t have a postal address? Or are you running from the law :) )

    Praveen Saxena Reply:

    My name is Praveen Saxena ,aged 53 years , holding a degree in Business Management as well as Law . I work for mid-sized EPC company and my area of activity is Commercial and Indirect Tax laws.

    Pankaj#1 Reply:

    Digvijay calling Ramdev thug? Then who he is?? Dacoit.

    [Reply]

    vinod sharma Reply:

    @BV Shenoy
    You are wrong. I said on News X in response to a pointed question that I do not approve of the langauge Digvijay used. On CNN IBN there wasn’t an occassion or a question. I choose my own line of argument in a discussion which might be different but is closer to my relative truth.

    [Reply]

    B.V.SHENOY Reply:

    Vinodji,

    I accept your point of view. But, Sir, will you tell your readers here, how great a damage Digvijay Singh has caused to his party and government by his incessant attacks on Baba Ramdev’s personal character in the crudest manner?

    Second question: why Sonia Gandhi is still putting up with a person who is causing embarrassment for her on a daily basis?

    Third question: has this Ramdev bungling by an inept MMS government given the RSS a larger than life image, like being capable of shaking this mighty UPAII govrnment to its roots?

    Fourth question: will you please answer the above questions honestly acquit yourself creditably?

    [Reply]

    vinod sharma Reply:

    @Shenoy
    Ha ha ha. Do you really expect me to submit to your inquisition?

  • Balwinder Sandhu

    Rajiv with an I
    Raju Kurien
    Mirchandani

    Thank you, good responses above.
    Dont know if anyone remembers, riswan last week raised some pertinent points-
    1. Is he the only English seaking urbanite without a swiss bank account
    2. He lost respect for SRK because he trashed ramdev
    3. Why is BJP silent

    In his ruminations, riswan has actually found a common thread, ie, BJP, SRK, Congress- EVERYONE HAS SOMETHING STASHED ABROAD- maybe BJP families like Mahajan have 50 crores and Congressy bigwigs and Mayawati have 100- who knows?

    But that explains this conspiracy of silence.
    I for one think riswan is underrated here- I like the boy, his patriotism and his total disdain for the junglees on this blog who attack his prepuce anytime he outwits and debates them, is commendable
    khush keeta, riswan puttar

    [Reply]

    Balwinder Sandhu Reply:

    forgot to mention the context of my comment above- it is well known here in London that SRK has bought a property worth tens of millions of pounds behind Park Lane. Now I for one will say maybe that property is Kosher, ie no black money, but sometimes people just get nervous about tax people in India just giving you a hard time
    so eevn if SRK has nothing to hide, maybe he just trashes Ramdev because he is told by Congress to do so- in return he continues expanding his huge empire abroad

    [Reply]

    Rajiv Reply:

    @Balwinder,
    You are right. Rishwan is pretty mature and thankfully not easily provoked.

    One thing, people need to understand is that there is nothing wrong in having an account in Swiss bank , if SRK has one he need not worry, as long as the account is disclosed in tax returns and subject to any applicable taxes.

    The government , needs to give a 3-6 month window for all Indian citizens to disclose any foreign bank accounts, with a sum of more than say 10,000$ ( Thats the requirement US tax laws have ) and pay income tax on that amount to regularize the account.

    After that period impose stiff penalties for those who it can find with undisclosed foreign bank accounts. It needs to be well defined, transparent process.

    For some reason, Congress wants to take no action.

    [Reply]

  • Balwinder Sandhu

    also Riswan, if upper class folks like you were sitting there in Ramlila ground, along with people from Defence colony and friends colony- then I dont think govt would have sent the marines charging in at 1 am

    [Reply]

  • http://- Rajeev

    I am surprised to see Balwinder talking about real issue..I thank waheguru for this miracle.

    [Reply]

  • Balwinder Sandhu

    finally SHAN- your comment about Shenoy having his ears up his arse was disgusting.

    For once I will not attack you or crack jokes at you- I will simply say that I have not seen anyone attacked so vigorously by so many for so long. You have become an object of ridicule. You were verily demolished over this weekend

    The people who scolded you were some of the most mild mannered and respected voices on this blog- Dr Pankaj, Shoeb, Ashish, Rajiv with I, Mishraji etc. Doctors should have a dignified demeanour and should be repected as pillars in society.
    Think before you speak puttar, I talk as freind. Remember what Shoeb said- try not to give an opinion on everything. TRY AND WRITE SO WELL THAT YOUR FATHER BACK IN BENGAL WOULD BE PROUD OF YOU.

    [Reply]

    shan Reply:

    @ballswinder Bhondhu, the dimwit buffoon
    To much cheap daru courtsey of sneaking into uk has destroyed your upper half , do rememember it also shrivels the dangly bits , though as you describe your conjugal life , there is not much use of that
    Do heed the following advise
    James T Cassidy says:
    July 23, 2010 at 7:39 pm

    A humble advice to my friends

    Do not cross your swords with Shan. There is only one outcome! And you know what it is.
    If you are polite, you will get an equally polite and well researched answers. If you choose to go the abrasive path, be ready to receive what is launched at you

    [Reply]

  • ishwar

    While we must discuss Baba Ramdev and the midnight brutality oh his agitation, we should equally spare a thought for the issues he raised. How about finding a way of getting the Swiss money back to begin with? Is there even 1% of the money being talked about in the Swiss banks or other tax havens? Is our democratically elected govt. too weak to get it back?

    Mr. Sharma, do you have a solution?

    [Reply]

    shan Reply:

    @Ishwar, even your NAMESAKE hasn’t got an easy solution. The swiss banking is famous for precisely this kind of service. I remember I was in geneva, I wanted to withdraw some money from ATM. I saw a bank , I went in . I couldn’t locate an ATM machine . So I asked a rather pretty lady(okay there were few , but i unknowingly drifted towards her) about the ATM . The lady said we only do PERSONAL BANKING.So the operative word is personal.
    And if swiss banks hand over all the cash in bags , SWISS ECONOMY WILL IMPLODE.
    Also stashing away cash in swiss banks and OFFSHORE BANKS is quite legal in UK.
    Many people do it to avoid taxes , michael caine did it , Danny fizsman , the late ARSENAL majority shareholder used to do it.
    BUT THERE IS A CAVEAT. You need to be out of UK for six months.
    The indian scenario is different , IT IS BRIBES, KICKBACKS , AND SIMPLE THEFT.
    sSo if India had an TRULY INDEPENDENT AND COMPETENT organisation like USA or UK has SERIOUS FRAUD OFFICE which will need expertise of highest order , THEN THESE CROOKS CAN BE BROUGHT TO BOOK IN NO TIME.

    [Reply]

    Rajiv Reply:

    @Ishwar,
    Existiong Swiss laws allow Indian government to get a percentage of the deposits of Indian citizens in Swiss banks, as interest income. Germany, France are using that law toi get about billion $ every year from Swiss banks.

    The bank wont disclose the account holders, but will share a percentage of that interest income with Indian government.
    Its apre-defined % , so as soon as Indian govt applies for it and gets the 1st check, it would immediately know the total value of money stored in Swiss banks.
    There was a detailed article on this in the Hindu a link for which I had posted earlier.

    [Reply]

    shan Reply:

    @Rajiv, before your excitement gets the better of you let me remind you , India asked for details of lotus and another code name bank account during the bofors saga. It was swiftly returned back. The reason, Incompetent twerps at the Indian Govt couldn’t even write a proper letter rogatory.
    At least you have now come down from the roof top screaming “bring back all the money in swiss banks” to mere asking for a cut from the interest rates.
    Prevention is better than cure.

    [Reply]

    vinod sharma Reply:

    @Ishwar
    The UPA must immediately start implementing what they committed in writing to Ramdev. And that includes a law declaring funds abroad as national property.

    [Reply]

  • james

    This is fine balanced piece by Vinod Sharma. (or is it ghost written by some one else????) But what happens when you get on TV??? Do you loose your balance???? Today I heard you on NDTV profit implying that RSS was responsible for Mahatama Gandhi death. Come on…you are political editor of a national daily. After Mahatma’s death, Congress government of Nehru appointed judicial commission to go into this allegation, and they gave RSS clean chit. And now, you as Goebells fantastic, now try to mislead whole nation on this. What adjective should be used for you???

    [Reply]

    vinod sharma Reply:

    @james
    I mentioned Hindu Mahasabha and the Sangh. You should not quote selectively. By the way, why are you silent on the singing and dancing in a punjabi wedding style at the Raj Ghat. is that the way to protest at a venue where one goes, offers flowers and meditates.
    As for adjectives, some schools of thought teach only four letter adjectives, not the langauge or the idiom. Go ahead please. I am listening Mr James.

    [Reply]

    B.V.SHENOY Reply:

    Vinodji,

    when it comes to selective “viewing”, our TV channels can beat the Pakistanis 10to1.

    Sushma Swaraj was dancing “punjabiwedding style” to the singing of a patriotic song, which none of the channels showed. what kind of a visual idiom is this?

    [Reply]

    vinod sharma Reply:

    @Shenoy
    Kaun sa gaana tha? Aapko bangaluru mein sunaye de gaya aur hamen dilli mein nahin. What a miracle. Shenoy itna pyaar achcha nahin hai pyare. :) )

    nirav Reply:

    @BV shenoy,

    The song was” yeh desh hai veer jawano ka”…
    Obviously Mr vinod and congress can dance only to italian tunes …so far are they from patiotic feelings….

    james Reply:

    No, I saw that dancing – let me name the person – it was Sushma Swaraj, in crowd of females, and one man, who I assume is some office bearer from Himachal Pradesh, they were giving thumkas, as you say in punjabi wedding style. And it was on Rajghat, at BJP’s dharna. At least this what I understood from the TV visuals. I really cannot say, which this news channel was.

    Thumkas at political dharna – it was very odd. Now, I have to make a presumption. I assume, it was escape of BJP’s glee at having successfully cornered the government. Though it is a presumption, I am sure, this was the case. If it was so, I think it was SHAMEFUL. And moreso, after an agitation in which ppl have been seriuosly injured. An on top of that, by a very very senior leader of the party. Very shameful indeed.

    I hope the above clarifies to an extent your doubts that I am a BJP/RSS sympathiser.

    [Reply]

  • Vijay Kumar

    @ Vinod

    This is a more balanced writeup than the stance you had taken sitting next to Shabnam Hashmi on CNN. You will agree for sure that Ramdev commands more respect all over India than Yuvraj, Sibal and Digvijay combined.

    For the crores who follow Ramdev and pranayam he is their father figure. The guy who gave them good health where medicine came to a dead end. And made complex Yoga simple and free. His sermons at the camps wer NOT COMMUNAL.

    The talk is about Bhagat Singh, Sardar Patel, a New India and swadeshi.

    THE PEOLE WHO CAME TO DELHI ALONG WITH RAMDEV DREAMT OF A CORRUPTION FREE INDIA ON SARDAR PATEL”S VISION.

    Unfortunately Digvijay Singh insulted these crores by calling Ramdev a thug. The congress and Sibal arranged a Lathi charge. Cries of rape rape RSS RSS were created thru its supplicant mediapeople.

    The end result is COngress must suffer a huge drop in its vote share. Let it be prepared to be wiped out.

    yes there were other ways of taking on Ramdev. And these are

    a) Actually getting the kickback money back fro foreign shores

    b) explaining thru debate that it is not possible to go swadeshi again. That MNC’s are necessary.

    c) Getting him on board for the coalition against corruption.

    Ramdev my guess is wants a clean prosperous India. He does not want to become the PM or somthing. But just wants a strong prosperous India.

    Unfortunately by attacking him the Congress should be prepared for the worst….

    [Reply]

  • Balwinder Sandhu

    well SHAN I did try and put some sense into you (others see above) . You came back with a cut and paste from some Casidy who praised you in the past.
    SHAN, we have seen that c/ paste million times by now, sorry no one is impressed. It also sadly reveals a bit of white ar-se licking as if a comment by a gora absolves you.
    SEE- we are interested if you can come up with praise from the RESPECTED PILLARS ON THIS BLOG- see above for a list of who they are
    SIGH

    [Reply]

    shan Reply:

    @balls , this one from , where you expect least , and not too long ago in zia’s blog
    Ravi Reply:

    May 9th, 2011 at 12:42 pm

    This one kills two birds with one stone.

    Respect

    [Reply]

  • Ankit

    In the most predictable manner this scum of a man decides to throw mud at baba ramdev, protestors and the opposition in order to deflect attention from the brutal actions of his employer, namely the upa government. if there was no lathi charge, how did someone got spinal cord injury and is in coma, how are dozens of people with broken bones ? this is the most pathetic blog that i have read from vinod sharma, and sharma has the knack of writing some pretty crass, insensitive and shamless blogs.

    But then what can you expect from a loser who did not speak a word when fellow member of minority commission was caught protecting a mass murderer of 1984. it is not a surprise that vinod sharma talks in the same tone as digvijay singh who referred to the biggest mass murderer bin laden as osamaji.

    people like sharma, full of so much hate, will rot in hell for sure.

    [Reply]

  • james

    Mr Vinod Sharma. Let me give you some facts that I saw on some TV channels. Mr Madani, Vice Chancellor of Deoband and one father from some church, also shared the stage with Baba Ramdev on Ram Lilla maidan, and spoke in his favor. Now, you cannot call these persons as RSS ppl – they would not support a cause which is purely communal and only RSS based. In my view, you are guilty of grave professional misconduct as a journalist by just harping on RSS and BJP support to this movement. As a journalist, your duty is to be balanced and objective and present all sides of issues, as far as possible. You have pathological hatred for RSS and BJP, and that is conflicting with your duty as journalist. Sure, RSS and BJP are supporting this movement, but they are not the only ppl. I hope you would highlight the fact that Mr Madani, Vice Chancellor of Deoband also spoke in favor of Ramdev in this agitation

    [Reply]

    Rajiv Reply:

    @James,
    Very well said.

    [Reply]

    vinod sharma Reply:

    @James
    Pl don’t expect me to read the script you want to write. Your arguments are very similar to the Sangh’s. I stand firmly by my views about their agenda. Any problems dear?

    [Reply]

    james Reply:

    Madani was my best argument. I rest my case after that. I may not differ very much from your views that Sangh’s agenda is communal. But lets not get into that right now.

    [Reply]

  • Vijay Kumar

    ~~ :D :D ~~ DIGVINASH AND congress SHOULD REMEMBER BRINDA KARAT AND ndtv ~~~ :D :D ~~

    Even as Digvijay Singh wants to show his manhood by bashing up a supporter of Ramdev, he might have lost the Congress another few lakhs of votes. Suddenl it is being seen as a party which rejoices in the inuries on Rjabala malik.

    Remember what happened to Brinda Karat? Using English and her public school accent she levelled false charges against Ramdev. And NDTV and she got wiped out…

    So will the Congress….

    [Reply]

  • Ravi

    Godbole in protest.

    Civic protests wishing to influence political agenda and to accelerate social change is nothing new. While discussing Ramdev led protest movement, we need to keep the following in mind.

    Ridding India of its culture of corruption is comparable to ending apartheid in South Africa, winning women the right to vote, ending segregation in southern states of the USA, etc. Clearly the task taken on by Ramdev is not insubstantial. To achieve such a momentous change, will probably require similar amount of resources as were needed to eradicate other social ills.

    1. If Ramdev is serious about protests, then these need to be diffused to a number of other locations outside of Delhi. He has large enough following to achieve this. Suffragettes, courted arrest in several cities of Britain and for several years before they were able to gain some political influence. Similarly, the black population of many cities in the USA held regular sit-ins for several years, before segregation was ended in the southern states of the USA.

    2. No matter what the intended objective of the protest is, there will always be freeloaders who will either piggyback on the movement or hijack the agenda. Both environ mental as well as Iraq war demonstrations were hijacked by anarchists who vandalised selected businesses in London.

    3. Political movements use protests as an agent for change. Rarely, a political movement is born out of a protest.

    4. If Ramdev is serious then we are in for a long period of protest, perhaps decades, before our culture of corruption will end.

    [Reply]

    shan Reply:

    @ravi, changing culture is the airy fairy communist ideal , dictatorship of proletariat or whatever malaki.
    I prefer ANGLOSAXON model. You are found breaking the law , THE LAW WILL TAKE CARE OF YOUR TRANSGRESSIONS.

    [Reply]

    shan Reply:

    Ravi your words “Rarely a political movement is born out of protest”
    Not quite true, BOSTON TEA PARTY , leading to american independence movement ,
    the much derided infamous naxalite movement was born out of a protest by farmers against the land owners in a place called Naxalbari in Jalpaiguri in North Bengal.
    Civil rights movement started with the protest by the ROSA PARKS ,refusing to vacate her seat for a white passanger in Alabama.

    [Reply]

  • Vijay Kumar

    @ Ravi

    I am closley monitoring your utterences in this current blog. In case you have a hidden agenda to make fun of Hindus and India behind polically correect posturing, watch out.

    However if you are decent as in the above comment you would flourish :D

    [Reply]

    Ravi Reply:

    I have no hidden agenda, but like you I have an agenda.

    My agenda is openly liberal, as am I.

    Tell me who here does not have an agenda, I will tell you he is a liar.

    What gets stuck in your throat is that my agenda is not the same as your agenda.

    If my flourishing is dependant upon your patronage, I would choose to perish.

    [Reply]

    Vijay Kumar Reply:

    @ Ravi

    If we about communal harmony one should not use a pyaada and hurt Hindu and Indian feelings thru a mouthpiece called Tajedar

    [Reply]

  • Dr Mishra, UK

    @ Balwinder praaji, I think that flying belan from your wife did some serious damage to your head, I mean look at your SERIOUS SONOROUS MONTAGE – ‘….I will simply say that I have not seen anyone attacked so vigorously by so many for so long….’
    Praaji, hope you will not mind me for saying you are copying Winston Churchill here, ha

    [Reply]

  • Dr Mishra, UK

    OF UPPERCUTS AND HOOKS
    It is a million dollar question- where is the moolah hidden and how much? Maybe we should call it the trillion dollar question.
    But saying loudly again and again, we are going to unearth it, is like sending a telegram before launching an uppercut. So they are, perhaps even as we speak, frittering the money away from Switzerland to Bahamas, Isle of Man, Jersey Island etc
    Dont know wheter to cry or laugh. Like that iconic scene in the film- The good, the bad and the ugly- where the man shoots his assailant first- and says- If you have to shoot, shoot. Dont talk

    [Reply]

    Pankaj#1 Reply:

    Mishraji;
    You speak damn correctly. 3/4 of the battel is surprise.

    [Reply]

    james Reply:

    @Pankaj#1 …voww stategy master…..masterstroke…

    [Reply]

  • Dr Mishra, UK

    I have a legal offshore account myself and at the few clicks of a mouse, I can move it elsewhere !!
    I like Baba Ramdev, but he is way out of depth here. The Swiss govt has frozen accounts and returned money, albeit rarely- there are precedents, but that is when it involves Mr Muscle USA.

    If it started returning money willy nilly to African and Asian despots, its economy would shake !!

    [Reply]

  • Dr Mishra, UK

    @ravi, I can see Vijay warming to you, hope you will not let him down. I second Vijay’s appreciation of your post, particularly ‘…Political movements use protests as an agent for change. Rarely, a political movement is born out of a protest….’
    Thought provoking, can see why you had a couple of fans in the embassy. I am going to chew on that for now

    [Reply]

  • Pankaj#1

    @ Everyone;
    Met with Baba Ramdev in North America. Huge following here. Not impressed with him. This guy can not be entrusted with complexities of governance. But, that is not the question. He has raised certain points. UPA was at the helm of affairs since last so many years and before that congress was in power. This Swiss bank accounts and financial corruption is going on since decades. Pygmies have manipulated themselves in the power and sucking this country dry. In the name of democracy, every body has a free run and taking pot shot at power. No commitment, No Auquat, just a lust for power and how to make money.

    [Reply]

  • Mukesh

    Even today – Mr. Sharma your slip/bias is showing and you once again stand xposed. While the issue is about corruption and black money – like a paplu you have to bring Gujrat into your argument and once again you get busted. If you want to bring in Gujrat and communalism in your every write-up then you must be fair and also write about anti-sikh riots and hindoos of Kashmir unless your masters have directed you not to do so………

    [Reply]

  • Das

    Vinod Sharma and his many of his ilk, and there are many in India, denigrate the novel profession of journalism by their nauseatingly partisan pro-Congress agenda. These intellectual midgets are obligate congress lackeys who have yet to learn that a fundamental requirement for vibrant democracy is a free, fair and non-partisan media. But from recent events it’s clear that many of the so-called journalists, who’s who Indian media, are working as nothing more than Congress party’s agents.

    [Reply]

  • RP from Germany

    Your arguments are so poor in quality and logic that even a first semester student of my university would throw you out of the lecture hall and burn and throw this piece of your manuscript into dustbin. If people like you are journalist in India, no wonder that the poor people of India has to suffer under goons like Kapil sibal, Digviajay and Sonja Antonia Maino Gandhi (the Italian Mafia). For you people are like cattle and you want to rule them in your brutal way. The congress and journalists like you always try to color every problem with hindu fanatism which here least the case is. Why can’t you simply stick to the problem and discuss on the some solution then just making a hochpoch of everything for the sake of this corrupt government? It by now universally well know that the present Indian govt is the most corrupt govt in the history of free India. The heinous act of Indian govt that took place on 4th June 2011 is another 1975 act of congress that was led by Indira Gandhi the mother-in-law of Sonja Maino Gandhi. I wonder was you get from people like Digvijay Singh, Kapil Sibal, Sahrad Pawar, Abhishek Singhavi, Sonja Gandhi and Chidambaram so that you do not show your intelligence on commenting on their corrupt carrer and whole bunch of fake life. Show some of your intelligence and bring out some investigative document on these corrupt people and expose them in front of Indain public.

    [Reply]

    shan Reply:

    HOT AIR

    [Reply]

    vinod sharma Reply:

    This RP from Germany must return home to change the system.And before he arrives, he better learn to respect the flip view.

    [Reply]

  • nirav

    Mr Vinod,

    You have today proved that you can be as shameless as MMS to defend an act as barbabric and inhuman as the one that happened…
    My question would be to you and your master/mistress,

    1)If britishers lathi charge and fire tear gas at indians is it more deplorable or indians doing it to indians???
    2)can a PM of billions of people say that it is unfortunate like a spineless coward and a licker of italian boots ….i had no option but to stamp and massacre thousand of peacefully sleeping indians……
    3)Are you even worthy of the paper on which you write when you justify one wrong with another…..especially when it deals with human lives…
    4) HAve you even done any anti corruption movement???If ramdev is working for foreign unaccounted money….why cant you take the cause of the money inside the country….A raja, kalmadi ….are not to your knowledge or just yeddy is what you know…

    This movement is a turning point in the history of india….
    MR vinod pick your side and fight for a cause not a person….
    Atlease redeem yourself in your last few years…..

    Rahul said he is ashamed of being an indian in UP….what does he have to say now….???

    What a shame two pillars of democracy are now completely corrupt….one being goverment and other is YOU-the media…
    And do check you blood ASAP…you may find out it has turned into water……

    [Reply]

    shan Reply:

    @nirav your words
    This movement is a turning point in the history of india…
    No it is not , there have been many such NARA BAZI , ram mandir,JP ,and countless others.
    There is no doubt many more “turning points” will come.
    But timeless india goes on ,because MERA BHARAT MAHAN

    [Reply]

    nirav Reply:

    @shan

    when gandhi was thrown out of a train we know how such a small incident triggered a huge change….
    do you know what happened to congress in elections after the jp movement….

    besides Mr vinod can speak for himself so please dont be a proxy.
    thanks,

    [Reply]

    shan Reply:

    @Nirav, Do you know what happened to congress after two years of “what happened to congress “.
    New to this blog , you will gradually get to know me I will not remain Nirav(quiet)
    As for me being proxy, let me spare you the trouble of scrolling upwards
    shan Reply:
    June 6th, 2011 at 9:54 pm

    Congress has institutionalised corruption. Congress likes big ones . Sukhram , win chaddah/bofors, Admiral nanda’s progeny and naval contract, adaarsh, Telgi and the maharashtrian congressi colluders , 2G balwa.
    Muslims seem to be involved in crookery in far higher number of scams , than what their share of population of india would suggest

    vinod sharma Reply:

    @Nirav
    You compare this yoga teacher with Gandhi? Shame.

    Raju Kurien Reply:

    @Vinod

    You are way off the base…
    Nirav did not say ramdev is Gandhi..Gandhi’s evolution started when he was thrown out of the train. He became an agent of change, grew after that incident.

    Nirav is saying that the New Delhi expulsion is such a trigger and the man will evolve into a national leader reflecting aspirations an dideals of a populace.

    Who knows? A half naked fakir liberated us of foreign occupation; another half naked baba may liberate us out of the corruption clutches of Sonia and company

    vinod sharma Reply:

    @nirav
    I have no mistress. If you have one,. please send her across.

    [Reply]

    nirav Reply:

    @Vinod,

    Oh so you only directly report to the amul baby…not sonia…(oh and i overestimated you as ranked higher in congress)
    That makes you a male governess/Aaya:)

    One day you will get your doodh ka karz:)
    AS padmashri/NCM life membership apart from undercover perks…
    BTW did you get your blood test done???i guess you can atleast do PH test with water:)

    @Ravi,

    Vinod ,will find any thing to divert the topic but will never have logical and substantial arguements.
    He is more naked in clothes now than Ramdev without:)..and like congress he is shameless and cold.

    @shan,

    I know your shan and sham on this blog..and i have read what other bloggers have to say about you.
    So please excuse as i donot want to waste my time with you.

    [Reply]

    shan Reply:

    @Nirav, stay nirav

  • jai vaidya

    Hyperbole par halla bol. The left has learned it’s lesson. It will not join any halla bol.

    This is as centrist as Vinod Sharma can get. without inviting the wrath of yhe Congress. He has mentioned the usual suspects, RSS, Modi , Gujarat,etc.

    The use of tear gas in an enclosed area is against UN convention and the Geneva protocols. Had it been any other government, the Congress and the pink chadiwala brigade would have rushed to the UN and all internatiioanal forums. Wonder where cash-rich human rights NGOs are.!

    This time Congress has aligned itself withthe high poker game of international finance capital to shove “dwvelopment “down our throats. Democracy be damned. in the process.

    [Reply]

  • Vijay Kumar

    Vinod Sharma might hve posted a centrist blog. His paper is meanwhile trying to create paronia against the baba by creating false impressions in all ways. Like cheating, money laundering etc etc.

    I think it only reflects the great traditions of the HT which once had Amar dalal singh as its employee :D

    [Reply]

    vinod sharma Reply:

    @Vijay Kumar
    Since you are so well informed, may I ask where is Ramdev’s number two—Balkrishna? Haven’t seen him by the Baba’s side since their eviction from Delhi. The guru isn’t even alleging that he has been kidnapped. Also, it is true that he is a Nepali and has many passports? Can you please check with your sources and let me know please?

    [Reply]

    shan Reply:

    @Vinod sharma, it is expecting too much from balakrishna , given that he has to run a 150MILLION DOLLAR company

    [Reply]

    Praveen Saxena Reply:

    Mr Vinod Sharma
    Assuming without admitting that Balkrishna is a fugitive of law, how come the govt came to know about this only now ? All the inquiries being initiated against Ramdevji’s trusts only now ? Is it not a repeat of the same tactics as we saw when we read the story about the fake CD about Shanti Bhushan in your esteemed newspaper? Why does your newspaper seek to bury that story behind a purile argument that wait for the other forensic report , Will the other forensic report ever come. ?
    What about Q when he ran away from India ably assisted by the govt you always seek to protect?
    And what are the fears of this govt that they have denied permission to Anna Hazare to hold a one day fast at Jantar Mantar.
    Do you think Gandhiji if he was alive would be happy with the way this govt is behaving.
    If Ramdevji is a thug how come thre senior cabinet ministers were hosting and talking to him for 3 days.?
    We can see the thugs of the day , but a at a loss to understand those who seek to protect those thugs?

    [Reply]

    vinod sharma Reply:

    @Praveen Saxena
    If you don’t have the answer please do not intervene. Are you okay with the idea that a nepali who had a fake passport was running 35 companies in India for your beloved Baba? You might be. But I aren’t. The Bhushan CD was run by all channels and its excerpts carried by all newspapers not just the H’T. So stop this falsehood.

    Praveen Saxena Reply:

    Mr Vinod Sharma
    But it has still not been answered how come the Govt was hosting and talking to the same Nepali holding fake passports for 3 days at the Claridges and taking undertakings in writing from him which they are now using in their defence . Did they come know of Nepali origins and fake passports only after the shift in the strategy towards Ramdevji ?

    And what about your comfort with a Nepali Congress MP by the name of Subba , prswent in our in our Parliament as a lawmaker against whom the Supreme Cort has orderd action ?

    vinod sharma Reply:

    @Praveem Saxena
    The Government committed a mistake. Now what should it do to the Nepali? Will you host him the way Mullah Omar hosted Osama? Arguing with your kind is a wasteful exercise.

    Praveen Saxena Reply:

    I can see the reason for your annoyance . It is not this which is wasteful but your other exercise of defending the thugs which is wasteful

    nirav Reply:

    @Vinod,

    so when will you go to a government lab and get a stamp on the fake passport or his nepali citizenship??

    Havent you got you travel allowance from congress this month???
    and if Government can make a mistake with all the boot licking machinery it has cant ramdev make an error in associating with this guy…

    Bistandards or substandards you do confuse me:)

    [Reply]

  • jai vaidya

    Vijay,
    I heard this before from you. What capacity did Amar Singh work in HT?

    [Reply]

  • Vijay Kumar

    @jai

    I was told that Amar Singh worked as a liason guy for them and the Birlas. He was a small Congress rabble rouser and crowd collector who did dirty jobs for Digvinash Singh– and he still does the dirty jobs for Digvinash and Congress as the fake CD controversy shows.

    I was also told that when he liasoned with Mulayam Singh, Mulayam immediately spotted his talent. Amar on his part showed him better ways to make money then through kidnapping and extortion– the sort DP yadav and Mukhtar Ansari did for Mulayam. :D

    Sadly if you see Bollywood films you would have heard dialogues that , “sacha pyaar,,… hameesha rehta hai..”

    The Amar Singh saga shows that many a heroine was willing to sell her body for one sacha pyaar — money of the powerful !! :D :D

    [Reply]

    shan Reply:

    @Vijay You are spot on.Amar Singh started his political education in the harvard of politics , CALCUTTA.
    He was a YOUTH CONGRESS president of BARA BAZAAR (marwari area) in calcutta.
    This is where he became the conduit for Birlas. bengalees are not good in this sort of work, else there would have been some mukherjee ,mitra or bose elbowing him out.
    Though pranab mukherjee did do AMBANIS selective favour , but that was to fill the coffers of congress party.He himself is clean. His son used to work for SAIL(unheard of in the history of India)
    At the moment there is a GUJU bramhin in mamata’s party through which marwaris are channeling money.,
    I would really love to see some bengalees in big time corruption ,like Raja , sukhram, or why bengalees cant be like punjabis such as WIN CHADDAH , Nanda grandsons, .We should invite punjabis to calcutta(the ones domiciled there have become like bengalees) to really teach us how to become corrupt and how to expunge any moral dilemma that so often is a barrier.

    [Reply]

    Pankaj#1 Reply:

    Shan;
    This is a joke, but has a kernel of truth.
    A bengali was fishing by river side and the fish had taken the bite. Float was sinking and coming up, seeing this, a punjabi, who happened to passing by, went to him and shook him from his reveries, pointing the state of float, to pull the fish up and simultaneously, undid the fish from hook, put another bait, threw the line in the water again and, went his way. While coming back, he saw the repeat of the situation, went through the whole ritual, and asked him, why does not he marry, so that he may have a son and who will do all these chores for him. bengali said, where I can find a pregnant woman , so that I may have a son??( Strictly a joke, with minimal regional overtones).
    Big time corruption needs, lot of industriousness, sharp wit and total lack of moral. Not many bengalis fullfil all these critewria.

    [Reply]

    Rajeev Reply:

    :)

    Let me add Tamilians and Keralites to this category.

    shan Reply:

    @vijay WISH WIN CHADDAH ,NANDA GRANDSONS WERE ALL JOKES , WOULD HAVE BEEN GOOD FOR THE COUNTRY
    As for your lines
    Big time corruption needs, lot of industriousness, sharp wit and total lack of moral. Not many bengalis fullfil all these critewria

    cant think I have heard such extolling of bebngali virtues, MANY MANY THANKS
    hope this brings back second bengal renaissance

    shan Reply:

    Sorry the above post was meant for Pankaj#1

  • Rakesh Katyal

    The events are so much similar to 1975. Mr Sharma you know it too well whenever Congress is totally insecure it has nothing else to fall back on but bring in the RSS. I also want to know English press opinion on Does the RSS have a right to raise its voice against corruption ? I think rather than getting into debates the government will do well if it shows some positive steps against corruption. Till now government is only trying to pull down those who are raising their voice against corruption.

    [Reply]

  • Rizwan

    RAJIV and balwinder paaji, thx for compliments
    There must be a reform of police services- fine, once they receive an order they have to implement it. But then the final tiomeline and details must be carefully thought through between DIG and DM. This clumsy approach cud hv backfired- we could hv had deaths and a stampede.
    THEY CUD SIMPLY HV DISCONNECTED THE ELECTRICITY DURING DAYTIME AND PREVENTED FOOD AND WATER GOING IN- how long cud the protest hv continued then.For sure the women and children would hv voluntarily gone home then -remember it is 40 degrees outside

    this is like op bluestar in 1984- no intelligence, no planning, clumsy execution. police and army urgently need reform

    [Reply]

  • Vijay Kumar

    @ Katyal

    Well said. The Congress thrives on its allies like Muslim League and pretends that they are secular !! Wah Wah WAH!! :D

    This whole drama of branding someone secular and someone else communal is the birthright of some fake journos and Congmen. Tehelks too I believe is being tapped to create a sting of a fake communal secular nature.

    Yes meanwhile the same people will defend till death their Rani Arundhati ROy and SAR Gilani who protested in Delhi to break up India !!

    Wah WAH !! wAH !! :) :)

    [Reply]

  • Mohan Ramchandani

    Everyone has become very serious . Let me lighten it up.
    Please read the link below.

    http://jezebel.com/5808672/obedient-wives-club-teaches-women-advanced-doormattery-skills

    Last night I made a huge mistake by asking my wife to join this club, but I had forotten the
    belan in the kitchen ( now it is kept in bedroom ) which is bigger than the belan used by
    Balwider Sandhu’s wife. Praji you are right they no more make them pativrata.

    And praji once again I am Ramchandani not Mirchandani.

    [Reply]

  • Ats

    There is no doubt this govt. will go down as exceptionally corrupt one, inspite of having a manmohan singh- well the professoor was brought in for this purpose only by Sonia. The incidents as Anna and Baba have proved that India despite having english educated “cattle class”, constituions, independent judicary etc , is no different from the autocratic middle east but with a difference, – there too they are fighting for corruption, and the FAMILY, there too innocent protestors are being brutalised, – yet they have persisited with their protests, mobilised international support and – won ( Eqypt is a remarkable case after Gandhi & JPs revo) and some are about to win.

    In India it is otherwise, indian public is usually silent except for a few regular idiots on tv channels dressed in Fab india kurtas and harping uselessly nothing worthwhile comes out. Unless there is a persisitent pressure BY PEOPLE Sonia , Sushmas, Sibal, ( new kid on the bloc) will go on.

    BJP, BSP and congress have much to loose if they let Anna or Baba have their way. So folks accept corruption , foreign accounts. Guess why BJP kept mum., because mum supports the brothers in AP.

    [Reply]

  • B.V.SHENOY

    Friends,
    here is an interesting article by Pratap Bhanu Mehta in today’s Indian Express. Worth a look in.

    http://www.indianexpress.com/news/second-time-as-farce/800228/0

    Here is ann excerpt:

    “There is the old RSS canard. The Congress’s use of the RSS card reveals its own bankruptcy. For, in a way it is admitting that it now has nothing to offer by way of an agenda, programme, argument. All it can draw upon is the hope that residual fears of the RSS will somehow mobilise support. It is also dangerously misreading the national mood. Sure, the vacuum in politics has given room for all kinds of elements. But at this moment it is the Congress that seems to be itching to play the communal card: taint the anti-corruption movement with the politics of Hindutva. To its credit, much of civil society has seen through this patent nonsense. The Congress also seems to be forgetting that it has always been the RSS’s best friend. Like in the 1970s, the fatal combination of a moral vacuum, arbitrary use of state power and the free publicity that Congress leaders give to the RSS will do more to legitimise it than anything that Baba Ramdev does. Just as civil society was beginning to overreach, the Congress made them look so good again”.

    [Reply]

    rajiv Reply:

    well said

    [Reply]

  • Balwinder Sandhu

    @some chandani, wear a turban, gives good protection from flying beluns. Anyway I have decided to marry second time, to Hard Kaur , she will sort out my vottee

    @mishraji, the belun effect lasts only 24 hours. Churchillian – I like that. hehe
    I did try and be Churchill to SHAN, he dont listen so maybe he will get the sardar treatment from me again.

    but seriously- mishraji could not agree with your lines more – “”"But saying loudly again and again, we are going to unearth it, is like sending a telegram before launching an uppercut. So they are, perhaps even as we speak, frittering the money away from Switzerland to Bahamas”"”

    sab saala drama hai – storming the ramlila grounds, all a smoke screen- the money is fleeing the Alps in jute ki boris- aap dhoondtey rahiyaega baad mein

    [Reply]

  • james

    “The buzz is that the RSS and BJP are using Ramdev to whip up an Ayodhya type movement against corruption. ”
    FACT is that Maulana Madani of Deoband and at least one father of Church in Delhi, is also supporting this movement. (These are apart from billions of Indians). So, Mr Vinod Sharma, why you are igoring these facts. Can you show at least one of your writings or utterances where you have highlighted these facts??? Is it not a professional misconduct on your part as a journalist??? Are you not promoting communal hatred by just harping on RSS and BJP??? And what is your arrangement with NDTV??? How come you get so much time there to spew venom???
    I have often heard you say that “this is one of the perspectives, and it has to be heard”. I presume, that is going to be your defence. But then as a journalist, are you not supposed to have some sembelance of objectivity and balance???
    I think case of jounalist like you and Barkha Dutt, NDTV Hindustan Times, etc should also be looked in to by corruption panel of Anna Hazare.
    Some fear of god has to be put in journalists like you

    [Reply]

    vinod sharma Reply:

    @james
    Can I have your visiting card please?

    [Reply]

  • shan

    @guys , a rumour making rounds .SRK has suddenly become jittery about BABA RAMDEV , because
    MORANIS have chanelled the 2G LAUNDERED MONEY in his latest film RA1. apparently it cost 190 CRORES with 50 CRORES FOR PUBLICITY

    [Reply]

  • ram

    FOCUS ON ALL THE BLACK MONEY AND ON GETTING CORRUPT CONVICTED AND BANKRUPTED INSTEAD OF FIGHTING PETTY SQUABBLES AND ALLOWING CONRESS CENTRAL GIVERNMENT AND CONGRESS PARTY ESCAPE? Somebody should remind them that Central Government exists due to mandate of People of India as per the Constitution and not due to the machiavellian politicians and lawyer ministers of UPA Government. India has become LAUGHING Stock of the world instead of the imaginary superpower of false Indian Govt propaganda!

    WHY DOES PM SINGH DEFEND ACTION AGAINST BABA RAMDEV INSTEAD OF COMING OUT WITH TRANSPARENT POLICY TOI COMBAT CORRUPTION AND BLACK MONEY?WHY IS PM SINGH, SUPREMO MS>SONIA MAINO GANDHI AND CONGRESS PARTY AFRAID TOTAKE THE BULL BY THE HORNS? Any bright ideas Vinodji as lets focus on real ISSUE!

    Regards

    Ram
    Singapore

    [Reply]

  • Ryan Paul

    Though this is out of context, but I couldn’t resist posting this link. Worth listening to and then deciding who is what ?

    http://tazeen-tazeen.blogspot.com/2011/06/heavenly-orgy.html

    [Reply]

  • tajender

    vinod and ram,

    With Idli-sambarwala vegetarian Brahminists, who know nothing but bluffing and bragging, will they be able to face two external enemies like the beef-eating Pakistani Muslims and China, already a super power — and many furious internal enemies like Dalits, Muslims, OBCs, Sikhs, Mongoloid North-Eastern tribals?

    When a country is internally so weak and also hostile, how can it face the powerful external enemies?

    Lately, the Jews have also come to know the true character of the untrustworthy “Jews of India”.

    Yes. The “Jews of India” are not at all bothered. What do they care if India is defeated and destroyed? After all they don’t belong to India. They are Eurasians and foreigners. Hence they don’t love India.

    There is no point in blaming the alien “Jews of India”. They have been oppressing us from centuries. This is because we have allowed them to oppress us.

    [Reply]

    vinod sharma Reply:

    @Tajender
    Haven’t you got to know me yet. I can be a terminator. Stop this sill imagery or else you will be out of here.

    [Reply]

    Vijay Kumar Reply:

    @ Vinod :D

    Good one. Terminate this guy who spoils a good discussion.

    I have requested bade paaji Ravi to stop his chotta paaji mutandar hussain Tur-d from spoiling the fun here

    [Reply]

    shan Reply:

    @tejender, please follow the link provided by ryan paul and give your comments, a case of bramhinist zionist plot at work

    [Reply]

  • Pankaj#1

    Shenoy Sahab;
    I so often hear about RSS and BJP and their hidden and not so hidden agendas. Can you shed some light on those agendas? I am kinda out of touch.

    [Reply]

  • Balwinder Sandhu

    pankaj , brilliant joke above- hehe- bengali said, where I can find a pregnant woman , so that I may have a son??

    DEAR MR VINOD SHARMA, you are getting unncessarily worked up over tajender. Listen to this chutkula-
    What does SHAN , Tajender and Max Mosely of F1 GRAND PRIX racing have in common ??

    they love to have their bottom spanked in public hehe

    [Reply]

    Balwinder Sandhu Reply:

    in fact as the report says, the orgy took place in a restaurant, but the Bangladeshi owner ran away and has not been traced since.

    hmmm, let’s see, maybe they made a mistake- maybe it was not a Bangladeshi- maybe it was a hindu bengali by name of shan

    our very own- spank-my-bottom-I-love-it-my-name -is-khan shan

    hehe- Shenoy saheb, this was for you, after shan had done badtameezi with you. hope u enjoyed

    [Reply]

  • Balwinder Sandhu

    Dear Mr Vinod Sharmaji

    Hope you do not mind my non veg jokes, I just like to add some garam masala when things get too serious or boring. I also think some of the urchins here get a bit rude sometimes, so I kill them off with humour.
    but if you feel I cross line, then you please let me know.
    Also, you see Mishraji told us that this blog is being followed at Indian embassy and they like SHENOY’S poetry and my jokes. Now only 1 padma shree is available for that so I am competing with Shenoy saheb !

    [Reply]

    Rajeev Reply:

    “blog is being followed at Indian embassy”

    :) sure.

    This place is full of Gappis.

    [Reply]

    B.V.SHENOY Reply:

    Balwinderji,

    you take the padmashri, just get me ordinary ’shree’ by way of a DDA plot in Vasanth Vihar.

    [Reply]

    B.V.SHENOY Reply:

    I meant real estate, not the Brahminist, Zionist plot this Pakiturd speaks about.

    [Reply]

  • rajiv

    Guys , discussing individual bloggers here will make this place uncomfortable for all.
    Sure, Mr Sharma’s so called ban is worse than pak ban on terrorist organizations, so just ignore him and please discuss issues.

    [Reply]

  • Pankaj#1

    Mishraji;
    for combatative sports like boxing, an good/effective punch or hook, one has to be nearer to opponent and your thrust should get him nearly at the MIDDLE of an arc or linear distance. Taking this analogy forward to combat corruption, you have to catch the scoundrels by the scruff of neck.

    [Reply]

  • http://- Rajeev

    After the Baba Ramdev episode, it is clear that-
    1. Ramdev’s agitation was political and had the backing of RSS/BJP.
    2. Congress tried to buy Ramdev with the intention of putting Hazare on the sidelines.
    3. Congress planned mid-night swoop well in advance in case Ramdev did not toe govt. line.
    4. A section of media (NDTV-HT-IE etc.) is with govt. and is defending the indefencible.
    5. BJP has been exposed thanks to dance performance by Sushma and Nautanki co.
    6. Sonia very cleverly is trying to distance herself from this undemocratic crackdown as is her nature.
    7. Rahul Gandhi as usual is silent and doesn’t want to be a HERO.
    8. Digvijay Singh is turning into a political terrorist who needs to be curbed but it looks like he has blessing of Tyaag ki murti Sonia.
    9. Govt. has come out in open against anything remotely connected to hindus. This kind of phobia will finally hit minorities. Remember when Godhra happened, the general view of Congress and its media was that hindus deserved it. Same is happening now which can result in massive backlash.
    10. The level of politics played by super corrupt-communal congress and communal-nautanki BJP is disgusting to say the least.

    Lastly I think Anna Hazare should not try to be politically correct (prove his secularism) and try not to get influenced by pro-maoist, anti-national and hinduphobic elements. I have a feeling that either Anna or Ramdev was trying to have a deal with Congress. I am pretty sure that not both of them are against Congress.

    [Reply]

  • shan

    @rajeev, this balakrishanan guy is a pufta , that is okay , but he came out as a complete joke 0n TV.
    as for CONgress ,I think the Minority protection Bill will be its undoing.

    [Reply]

    Rajeev Reply:

    I think Baba Ramdev’s style of agitation is very similar to that of Rahul Gandhi..Both are lot of air but no substance. This aide Bala Krishna seems to be equivalent of Digvijay Singh.

    [Reply]

  • http://- Rajeev

    Balwinder with WIND,
    Someone has told me that Alien embassy has been following this blog…Keep posting your chutkulas…Aliens need some entertainment.

    [Reply]

  • shan

    @Balls scratcher Bhondhu, To every action there is an unequal and ferocious reaction

    There was a sheep in delhi. It smelt so horrible than people hundreeds of yard away would run for their life. So it was kept in a room. A competition was arranged by baba ramdev .Whoever can enter the room and spend most time can have his LEARJET. A bengali was passing by, he could not tolerate the smell and left some yards before reaching the door. Bihar did a little better , tamils improved on it by entering the room ,but swiftly came out. a sindhi surpassed that record a stayed for few more minutes .NEXT ENTER SOMEBODY CALLED BALLWINDER SANDHU.
    He entered the room and stayed on and on . After FOUR hours people saw something coming out of that room(everybody was watching this from a distance , because of smell). Was it ballwinder , NO IT WAS THE SHEEP WHICH HAD COME OUT OF THE ROOM , WITH BLEEDING FROM ITS BACKSIDE

    [Reply]

    B.V.SHENOY Reply:

    Shaan,

    a very crude and smelly joke only a man with a demented mind can dish out.

    [Reply]

    shan Reply:

    @shenoy , read the opening lines

    [Reply]

  • Balwinder Sandhu

    Dr SHAN , nice try, but your jokes fall flat. Never do something that does not come naturally to you. You can see that SHENOY and myself get a lot of appreciation- now lets see how many quality people like your joke.
    Shabba khair, babu moshai, till we meet again
    i-tell-joke-no-one-laugh-my-name-is-shan-PARESHAN

    [Reply]

    shan Reply:

    @Balls , would you like another one ,or lets keep it for another day.

    [Reply]

  • http://- Rajeev

    Watched debate on TimesNow. Abhishek Manu Singhvi called Rahul Gandhi Divine….I can’t stop laughing…if being comic is divine, I’ll call Jagdeep Jaffery divine.

    [Reply]

  • B.V.SHENOY

    @Shenoy
    Ha ha ha. Do you really expect me to submit to your inquisition?

    Vinodji,

    you are right again. I really didn’t expect you to answer my five questions, which were on the lines of Ram Jethmalani’s 100 questions to Rajiv Gandhi.

    Just as Rajiv Gandhi didn’t have any answer to even a single question, your stock in the reply department may be pretty low right now.

    Perhaps, when the tide turns for the beleaguered congress party, you may well be inclined to remember my questions and also find the time and also answers for them.

    [Reply]

    vinod sharma Reply:

    @BV Shenoy
    You are trying to arrogate on this blog a status that isn’t yours for the simple reason that you propagate the political line or thought that’s dictated from elsewhere. In one go you are Ram Jethmalani, in another Shah Rukh Khan and in yet another a self-appointed conscience keeper.
    There is no space for disagreement in your vicinity.That is why you treat the other view with disdain and contempt.

    [Reply]

    B.V.SHENOY Reply:

    Vinodji,

    you are being unfair to me in the extreme.

    Disagreement with you on many issues-yes.
    Reservations on several of your propositions-yes too
    disdain towards opposing points of view-most certainly NOT WITH YOU. I only show disdain towards anti-national terrorists like you know who.
    contempt too not for your views, however extreme they may be, because you only reflect an ideology with which I differ. Nothing more.

    And everybody likes Bollywood. I don’t much like Shah Rukh Khan, but I greatly admire Aamir Khan and his cinema.

    [Reply]

  • http://- Rajeev

    If you are looking for some comic relief, Vinod sharma is right now in a debate on TimesNow.

    [Reply]

    vinod sharma Reply:

    @Rajeev
    You didn’t listend to the respone of your fellow sanghis —- chandan and swapan?

    [Reply]

    vinod sharma Reply:

    @Rajeev
    Thanks for being my promoter. Shall tip you well.

    [Reply]

  • Vijay Kumar

    @ Ravi

    I am grateful that you have put a lidd on the fake tajendar and real mootandar HussainTur-d.

    Things are making more sense now…

    [Reply]

  • Vijay Kumar

    @ Everyone

    Don’t ever underestimate Ramdev. I have attended his camps and seen the visible health benefits. The crores who follow his yoga will be a huge factor in the next elections…

    [Reply]

    Rajeev Reply:

    I am not questioning his Yoga and ayurvedic skills but his arguments on Black money are very simplistic. He is more in for a show than solution.

    Both Anna and ramdev represent true mindset of Indian..indisciplined, preachy, Chaotic and at the same time totally morally corrupt.

    Our country is a joke and that is why our opinions are dismissed at world stage because pragmatic world politics doesn’t believe in Indian style of posturing.

    [Reply]

    Gopi Thomas Reply:

    Rajeev, Vijay

    Nirav somewhere here referred to Gandhi being pushed out of the train by South African authorities. That triggered the thoughts in Gandhi about mans self worth, independence etc. Thus a ground based , people based movement was born.

    Ramdev may be a simplistic, uneducated man – but he can get the educated and uneducated moving. There is a yearning in this country, and sooner or later clean people like Anna or Ramdev or somebody else will undo Congress looting of this eternal country.

    And the stupidity of congress and many others dont have any limits – Why is Ramdev not going after this? What about the m oney people give him (arrest him if he is doing anything illegal), what about that island….

    I do not have an issue if BJP nd other parties support him. However, he should not involve any political party in the satyagraha, they should be onlookers. The participants and drivers should be ordinary frustrated housewives and their husabands and their children.

    Rajeev — u r against everything and seems like the old Bobby – do you have any implementable suggestions to make things better…

    Ramdev’s requests in areas such as technicxal education in local language etc is a non-starter. He knows that. It is essentially an anticorruption movcement, people have bought into that.. An earlier generatiuon remebers the attempt the present Mrs Gandhis mother in law did at curtailing freedom. She was trounced in the next elections.

    Congress, if theyw ere smart, would have coopted Ramdev, made some immediate changes and would have got the appreciation of the public

    [Reply]

    Rajeev Reply:

    Gopi,
    I am against posturing.
    1. Anna – This movement started well but then under the influence of pro-maoist and hinduphobes, he did secular posturing by condemning Modi’s governance. He should have kept both right wingers and fake seculars out. The issue of corruption has no religion including secular posturing.
    2. Ramdev – He made the cardinal mistake of using religious symbols in his campaign. He should have not used religion.

    My solution is very simple..Let anti-corruption campaign be free of any religious or secular posturing. Both Anna and Ramdev have played in congress hands. The only thing that congress wants is to maintain status quo which I think is no more acceptable. It is time we Indians forget our differences and not get fooled by political terrorists like Digvijay Singh who wants to divide ant-corruption civil society in secular and communal.

    Gopi,
    I am against the basic mentality of India..We talk and talk, we are not honest in our personal life. We don’t even teach our kids to respect domestic help. We teach arrogance and indiscipline to our kids..we teach casteism to them…We are already corrupt in our thoughts and actions because of our slavish mentality but the least we can do it not pass our poison the next generation. That should be our mission.
    When I see YOUNG govt. officials indulging in corruption, I get disturbed because I see no change on ground. Having a car and fat bank balance is not progress, real progress is how you behave in society. Have you ever wondered how many people file their IT returns honestly?
    Don’t think that I am preaching all this…I actually practice this in real life and this is the reason I have contempt for many people because I can see dishonesty in their thoughts and action.

    If you take a poll on this blog, I can bet 90% of the people do indulge in financial and moral corruption.

    Vijay Kumar Reply:

    @ Gopi and rajeev

    Of course many of Ramdev’s demands are silly and stupid. They are impractical– like demonetisation or going back to Indian languages. neither can India pull back to the days of restricting foreign investments.

    But…. On the plus side

    a) He rediscovered yoga for India and the world. and simplified it to reach all.

    b) started the movement against colas, a movement which ahs reached the shores of the US

    c) Is clean heareted and has genuinly helped crores regain their health

    So in the end we really have to take him as the Bharat face of India.. He may not be educated but has moblisied people as never before.

    He has been the BIGGEST factor in galvanising people for getting our kickback money from foreign banks.

    Dont be too surprsied if the Congress gets wiped out in this battle.

    shan Reply:

    @Rajeev 1000% agree, YOU HAVE SAID THE LAST WORD,hope the east delhi citizen is reading.

    [Reply]

  • Vijay Kumar

    @ Vinod Sharma

    You may joke about Balakrishana’s citizenship…

    But I hope you have the courage to joke about the citizenship of an Intalian lady who did not want to become an Indian… yet only after her husband become the PM she became one. And now the digvinashes around her use her goonga status to achive their own ends…

    Very very very Funny !! :D

    [Reply]

    Rajeev Reply:

    You nailed it. Vinod will make all irrational argument to justify Sonia and her foreign origin. After all Sonia is white where as Bala Krishna is bloody neplai chowkidaar.

    [Reply]

    B.V.SHENOY Reply:

    Vijay Kumar,

    you are absolutely spot on.

    Our parliament is a strange place for people of doubtful nationalities to get elected to.
    The Italian lady didn’t take Indian citizenship for sixteen long years after her marriage into the first family of India. At the first signs of rouble she took refuge in the Italian embassy and wanted to run away from India with her children. Another Nepali, Subba even hoodwinked the election commission and seven lakh voters of Assam and got elected to the parliament as a CONGRESS MP.

    Have we forgotten all these things about “NATIONALITY”?

    [Reply]

    Vijay Kumar Reply:

    @ Rajeev and Shenoy

    how about placing bets whether Vinodji will give any comments on why an Italian lady who was reluctant to take Indian citizenship was being begged by the Congress to became the Prime Minister. ??

    I am signing a cheque of Rs 5100 to Bofors investigation comittee in case he does !! :D :D :D

    [Reply]

    Rajeev Reply:

    Same here.

    vinod sharma Reply:

    @BV Shenoy /Vijay Kumar
    Stop this Hum Dono act. You are spot on, what a line Shenoy sahab, vijay is brilliant, he’s so quick on the uptake….there is no end to it. And then you are joined in by an extra with ambitions of a bigger role. It is a blog messers, not bollywood.

    [Reply]

    Vijay Kumar Reply:

    @ Vinodji

    Cmon boss I am too seasoned to react to this provocation. And yes… what about your views on the Italian lady’s citizenship? :D

  • B.V.SHENOY

    Vinodji,

    you said,

    “To all fellow bloggers
    I am the only person on this blog whose identity is known. Most who visit this site frequently have not ever introduced themselves to others so that we get some idea of their background. .
    Will it not be proper that all those who insinuate or read meaning into a stance or an averment first give their visiting card. That will help us know from where they are coming?”

    My name is B.V.Shenoy
    (copy of ration card enclosed)

    and I am not a terrorist, though I have met two of them on this blog.

    I have no a-genda and I love genda (phool)

    I also often sing “फुल गेन्दवा न मारो, न मारो
    लगत करेजवा में चोट

    हे दहका हुआ ये अंगारा, अंगारा हाँ
    दहका हुआ ये अंगारा
    जो गेन्दवा कहलाये है
    अजी तन पर जहाँ गिरे पापी
    वहीं दाग़ पड़ जाये है
    अंग-अंग मोरा पीर करे और कर के कहे
    फुल गेन्दवा न मारो”

    [Reply]

    tajender Reply:

    and I am not a terrorist, though I have met two of them on this blog.

    though we call spiritual fascism as non voilence.

    bjp walon,

    afzal guru gaejao,
    rasgulle peeche se khae jao,
    maal dubai udao jao,
    dubai se swiss bank liye jao,
    ram deo ko dhata batae jao,
    modi ko dil mein basai jao,
    dange fasad karae jo,
    bum rakh ke musalmanon
    ko phnsaejao
    afzal guru gae jao.

    roz subeh syrya pranam ke baad
    parivar kee prarthna,

    jai jai kunjbihari kee,
    maa kee ch..t pujaree kee
    gale mein latke zhnton kee maala,
    aage latke l..nd kunwara

    shree golmalkar jee purohitjee aur maharishi ibnsina jee hamesha jeevit rahen.
    obama jee ko hamara pranam.hindu rashtra ban k e rahega.

    tajender tere hazaro naam.

    [Reply]

    vinod sharma Reply:

    @BV Shenoy
    My Name is Shenoy and I am not a terrorist—- so much similar to My Name is Khan and I am not a terrorist. Bollywood again. Nautanki again.

    [Reply]

  • Balwinder Sandhu

    Well DR SHAN also known as i-tell-joke-no-one-laugh-my-name-is-shan-PARESHAN, lets see what others are saying about your joke or you-

    Nirav Reply: @shan, I know your shan and sham on this blog and i have read what other bloggers have to say about you. So please excuse as i do not want to waste my time with you.

    B.V.SHENOY Reply: Shaan, a very crude and smelly joke only a man with a demented mind can dish out.
    —————
    shabba khair, babu moshai

    [Reply]

  • Azmat karim

    enough is enough ! appeal
    please leave all the issues we will live in the corrupt world but in the undisciplined society.its quite a disturbing and humiliating when a senior people are fighting and shouting at National TV for what ? why? what they want to prove .People of this country understand well . who is who and they dont want to become fool again and again . no matter wether a political party or civil society of india we dont trust any one of them. they are all the same . please leave us in the corupt but peacefull world where corruption is also done with the more honesty and loyality example recent AIIMs Pg examination and many more examples.

    [Reply]

  • Vijay Kumar

    @ Ravi

    Your protege Fake Tur-d inder has posted very obscene and offensive language. I hope you tell him not to get porno filth in this family blog again.

    @ Vinodji

    This Tajendar has posted very bad offensive aqnd vulgar language here. I hope even this ID is taken of by your IT guys. I further feel that with continous losses the ISI is getting frustrated and hence ral vulagrity being spewed by low lwevel agents :D

    [Reply]

  • http://- Rajeev

    Gopi,
    There is one more thing…Why are we not straight talkers? If we talk about 2002 riots, we should also talk about 1984. When we talk about Gujarat riots, why don’t we talk about Godhra?
    When we talk about village idiot Baba ramdev, why don’t we talk about city idiot Rahul Gandhi?
    When we talk of 26/11, why don’t we question how come no local help angle was investigated? When we talk about Kandahar, why don’t we talk about media and congress at that time?

    Let me make it very clear, I may sound supporting BJP and this is because I can see that both media and congress are trying to edge out principal opposition party out of this picture. Both Anna and Ramdev suited congress because they helped them sideline BJP and rest of opposition but when they become difficult to handle, congress wants elected people to fight this battle with congress.

    [Reply]

    Rajiv Reply:

    @Gopi,
    Your chicken-and-egg theory may be okay. But I take exception to one thing, regarding investigating any local help received by 26/11 attackers. That angle has been investigated and two past LeT local contacts were hauled before courts, with the most flimsy evidence.
    The only evidense against them was suppose to be some maps found in their pockets. Even those maps were presented in the court, the judge saw that the maps were never folded , as you would have to fold to put in your pocket. Obviously the case did not stand scrutiny. The 2 suspects from UP were rightfully released.

    Besides our local police, Pakistan had every intent to implicate any locals involved so as to take the heat of themselves. No evidense has been presented.

    In US courts, where 26/11 attack got the most public hearing and Daood Gilani/Headley identified many contacts and handlers that knowingly helped him in the 26/11 attack, none of them were Indian and all of them Pakistani, including severel Pak army and ISI officers.

    So we should go where the evidense takes us.

    Also its important to differentiate between riots and pre-planned carnage, just as courts differentiate between cold blooded murder or unplanned altercation leading to murder.

    For example, the regular cold blooded murder of civilians by Khalistanis under Bhinderwale’s control, by removing them from buses and trains in braod day light, lining them up and killing them, because they belongwed to a certain community, was cold blooded murder. It went on for years as the entire nation watched in horror and seethed in anger.

    The 1984 riots, in which many innocent people of a certain community were killed, was a heinous, shameful chapter in our nations history. But it was not pre-planned cold blooded murder even though political opportunists and criminals , took advantage of the rage that had built up because of regular slaughter of people of a certain community in Punjab for previous 4-5 years and then the assasination.

    Similarly, the killings of Kashmiris by seperatists in Kashmir, under the patronage of Pakistan and motivated by jihad, went on for severel years, was cold blooded murder. It resulted in cleansing of a certain community from Kashmir valley and also took lives of many non-seperatist muslims. Thats cold blooded, politically motivated, pre-planned murder and not indefensible mob-rage leading to murder

    The Godhra carnage, as the evidense suggests, was anathor incident of cold blooded, pre-planned murder. The subsequent riots, that took lives of about 1500 civilians, Muslims and Hindus, was heinous and shameful, but it was not pre-planned, cold blooded murder.

    [Reply]

    Rajeev Reply:

    Rajiv with an I,
    There was talk of Dawood’s men in Mumbai involved in logistical support to 26/11 attackers. If you remember the footage where NSG commandos were taking out trunks out of Taj Hotel. The terrorists had so much firepower that they kept fighting NSG for 60+ hours. How did such arms and ammunition make it to rooms of terrorists? I am talking about the local help that terrorists might have developed after landing in Mumbai. Why was no one of significance from politics to corporate to Bollywood was in any of the hotels attacked?
    There is definite a local angle to it. May be headley and Rana are not aware of these local contacts but I am sure 9 dead and 1 half terrorists definitely knew few locals.

    [Reply]

    Rajiv Reply:

    @Rajeev,
    I followed the case closely. I see no evidense. The terrorists who landed in Mumbai, off their boats, were carrying big cotten bags with them. In fact, some locals at the beach were quoted to have asked them what they were carrying to which they just replied that those were books and they were students. This has been confirmed by Kasav , who would have been aware of any local help.

    So its better to go were the evidense takes you.

    I am apalled at what congress spokesman digvijay singh has said and his propogation of most heinous, conspiracy theories, with intent to communalize the terrorist attack and give solace to LeT/ISI. In any other country, he would be most likely hanged along with kasav.

    Vijay Kumar Reply:

    @ Rajiv

    I hope our headmaster at this blog, Vinod Sharmaji at least acknowledges that Digvijay SIngh hurt the feelings of Hindus, Muslims and Christains when he tried to pass the blame onto the RSS for 26/11.

    Why was Sonia aunty silent?/

    Rajeev Reply:

    Rajiv,
    I disagree with you. Can you explain how huge cache of arms and ammunitions made it to the rooms of terrorists passing thru hotel lobby?
    There was some local help and out of 10 terrorists some came few days before and checked into hotels that were later attacked.

    Rajeev Reply:

    Vijay,
    Why are you forgetting that Vinod sharma is part of Amar-Diggi-Vinod trinity (CD producers)?
    Vinod is langotia yaar of digvijay.

    Vijay Kumar Reply:

    @ Rajeev

    A man is kown by the company he keeps. In case someone subscribes to the Digvinash- rahul school of thought which makes light of the terror attacks India faces I think he is plain dumb.

    In my view Vinod Sharma will not disrespect the tremendous sacrifice the Indian soldiers make when they take on the suicide bombers and jehadis who want to destroy India and its values.

    However as far as Digvinsh and Rahul are concerned — they are just too shallow to understand the large conspiracy of dividing India…

  • http://- Rajeev

    Vijay,
    I think your reading of political situation is bit simplistic. The congress has firm support of atleast 10% minority votes whose only ideology is hinduphobia.
    Did you listen to Shabana Azmi and Shahrukh Khan on Ramdev? They opposed Ramdev not because of ideology but because of hindu religious symbols in his background.
    Did you read how secular like Javed Anand find picture of Bharat Mata objectionable in Anna’s movement?
    Even if this country goes to dogs, hinduphobics will keep voting congress and I hold BJP/RSS responsible for this. They are biggest jerks in our political landscape.

    [Reply]

    shan Reply:

    @rajeev, here is a fact that resonates with you write.
    in UK and i am sure there is a brand called HACKETT.it was modelled on the taste of upper class english. The shirt , the trousers ,the tie ,and blazer and the polo shirt as you would see the toffs wearing. It was priced accordingly to cater to this class. that was its image.
    Now the labourer class in uk having made some money wanted to climb up the sartorial ladder.
    So you saw these hooligans turning up in football matches wearing HACKETT scarf. it became so bad , THAT HACKETT SOLD OFF ITS BUSINESS AS IT WAS TARNISHED BY ASSOCIATION.
    Similarly Hindu identity because of some bumkins are tarnished in such a way , that you have to be apologetic to be a hindu.

    [Reply]

  • http://- Rajeev

    “i am the most honest and patriot person.”

    True. With respect to Pakistan and pakistani version of Islam.

    [Reply]

  • Vijay Kumar

    Rajeev

    Well it is not so simplistic !! My work makes me interact with at least 50 people every day. And I know for sure that Ramdev does have a fair share of support with Muslims. Three muslims working for me send their children to Yoga classes AFTER seeing Ramdev Yoga and lectures.

    If you punch in Ramdev and Pakistan you will discover at one point he was the most popular Indian in Pakistan above Amitabh Bachchan and rahul gandhi.

    Don’t underestimate his appeal. ESPECIALLY IN SMALL TOWNS AND VILLAGES. The Bharat which the English speaking India does not often understand. :D

    All the dirt which the fawning media will dish out may make him stronger in the end. At one point Brinda karat, Prannoy’s sister In law had levelled fake charges against him. NDTV lost a huge chunk of its viewership them.

    It is at the forefront of the disinformation campaign :D :D

    iN CASE THEY JAIL HIM… THE CONGRESS GETS REDUCED TO 50 SEATS FOR SURE…

    [Reply]

    Rajeev Reply:

    Want to bet if congress will get less approx 50 seats in 2014?

    Take it from me, Congress will come back in 2014 and it will get RSS men convicted of terror before that. This is what will bring them back to power.

    Regarding Ramdev, I take your word on his popularity and impact but he is not in a position to address Black money issue because he is too political and religious.

    [Reply]

    shan Reply:

    i cannot beleive ramdev having a following in pakistan, that will be the day.

    [Reply]

    Vijay Kumar Reply:

    @ Shan

    u can check it out on the internet in cawse you dont believe me..

    [Reply]

    Pankaj#1 Reply:

    Vijay;
    You are right. many Muslims here are coming to shivir of Ramdev. He says, to concentrate, in place of OM, they can say Allah. Yog is not communal.
    In 50s, Scion of Kolhapur, who was ambassador to Egypt, had popularoized Surya Namaskar in Egypt.

  • Gopi Thomas

    Rajeev

    A man has a God/religion etc. There is nothing wrong in Ramdev keeping those in the background (his PR people must have requested him to have a non-controversial backgrounund for the platform; I am sure a new PR advisor will have an opportunity!)..
    Shabana etc criticizing this as a Hindu movement will only backfire on her.

    He did not say he is doing this because his God wanted this, or he is doing this for Hindus. Of course charlatans like Digvijay jumped on this as a political opportunity.

    Ramdev will recover, and recover strongly. He is a simple man, street saavy, with genuine followers. Henever said he is a Guru or sanyasi — it is others who label him that way. And whether he is a Guru, Sanyasi, or teacher or ordinary man, he has all the rights in this country to organize and mobilize. Srimathi Indira Priyadarshini Nehru GAndhi, with all her political skills , lost miserably after her clamp down. While this clampdown is not as exhausitive as the emergency, many people consider it an affront.

    It just shows how stupid and out of touch congress is. It also shows the dilemma in their party – MM Singh and ministry being always cornered by “outside the goovt” personalities like Digvijay. What right Digvijay has to comment on the law and order situation or threat posed by Ramdev?

    [Reply]

    Rajeev Reply:

    Gopi,
    Believe me, I see no hope in India because the young generation whom we are banking are ignorant and arrogant. They can’t see beyond their iPhones.

    I hope that you are right. We want real people (lower class and lower middle class) to stand up and set the course of our politics in right direction.

    I meant no disrepect for Ramdev but let me tell you any use of hindu symbols make our hinduphobic minorities cringe and even genuine movements gets sullied with the help of biased media and their political master.

    I think India also lacks unbiased, objective media interested in serious journalism. Our media is full of congress supporter and some are BJP supporters. Mr.Sharma by no stretch of imagination can be called a neutral journalist and same is true for Chandan Mitra. The only difference is that Mitra is open about his political leaning whereas Mr.Sharma is not.

    [Reply]

    Gopi Thomas Reply:

    Rajeev:

    While some of the concerns you raised are right, I see many positives and a real good future for India rooted in pride of its ancestry, diversity, achievements etc. Actually I feel more than satisfied.

    I am 60 and can compare about youngsters now and in my college days and early career days. I never did any social service, I was so focused on job security etc. None of my friends did any service either, Fast forward – now there is a competition among youngsters to provide service – feeding, cleaning, hospital, education etc etc – in metro areas. My HR people in Bangalore would list all the charity services happening in the city, and by Thursday most of them were filled by volunteers. Of course, networks and economics and opportunities do make a difference. BUt I can categorically say that these kids are much more India/society oriented than what I was and what my friends were.

    A growing economy has allowed many of these youngsters to pursue their extra-curricular interests with gusto, be it poetry, dance, stage.. Just last week, a young Christian nun here gave her Carnatic music “arangettam”. There is a famous temple festival here – Thrissur Pooram.. You may have seen it on TV – 15 decked elephants on each side with drums and colourfull umbrellas etc.. (the legend is that the Lord of that particular temple receives the procession from two temples of female dieties, and they have to compete for his attention). In my childhood it waas a relatively small function, with very little audience, mostly Hindus. Now it has grown into an “our own” Thrissur’s/Kerala’s/and may be even india’s festival.. Young men and women of Hindus and Christians (and few Muslims) organize to make it a huge success. I see a lot of pride in many things that was not there before.

    Of course you are right about young IAS guys becoming corrupt. But I also believe (And know of) many dedicated guys who really believe in and act upion country’s progress.

    I sense there is a change, young people have more nobler aspirations, they want a healthy country, and they are willing to give their all. Rahul Gandhi’s speech here in Kerala during electiosn was given to half-empty stadiums. In contrast, the 87 year old Achuthanandan ’s speeches were given to stadiums overflown with youngsters. Achuthanadan was able to prevent a west bengal experience for his party because people accepted him as a clean, committed leader. Especially the young ones went in big numbers for him.

    News media is opportunistic as we know from Vir Sanghvi Barka episodes. These are huge businesses, they follow a business angle.

    You are correct that many Indians do not practise what they preach. However, i do believe all (lower class, moiddle class, rich class) are disgusted by the breadth, depth,a nd extent of corruption – asking questions , how much is enough? When flats supposed to be built for jawans are taken over by generals and politicians, when Kanimozhi steals zillions of crores of rupees, when national pride is tarnished by mishandling of funds in commonwealth games etc – a limit is reached ; and it is no more “chaltha hai”.

    be optimistic. therer are lots of reasons.. I see a more inyttegrated country .. a country celebarting together and grieving together. .We are on the right track; but wish we speed up!

    [Reply]

    Rajiv Reply:

    @Gopi,
    Good points. It often boil down to, is the glass 1/2 full or 1/2 empty ?
    Like you, I see it as 1/2 full and increasing.

    Also, I certainly see India more integrated today, than ever before.
    With education and travel, people are becoming more aware of the possibilities and the desirable.

    Rajeev Reply:

    Gopi,
    I want to believe in your hope but my reading of Indian youth is very different from you. We can disagree on this without further argument.

    Being optimistic is good but it should have right mix of realism. India and China started together on were neck to neck on most economic and other indicators but now China is way ahead. It is impossible for India to catch up with China. The reason is simple…We Indians believe in ‘SANTOSH’…We are happy with our under-achievement. We are happy to beat our rag tag neighbors.

    I think we will remain a THIRD WORLD country for centuries to come evenif our economy becomes second biggest after china.

    Optimism is an empty word…Action with honesty and discipline is more important which we never plan to follow.

    Gopi Thomas Reply:

    rajeev-

    China comparison is not an appropriate one — are we going to give away to an autocratic rule so decisions can be made unilaterally (property acquisition, land rights, rights to approach a courte tc) .

    I bet India and Indians will do better under an autocratic, non-demovcratic rule. We have chosen democracy, and democracy is messy.

    Chinba’s progress, which is deemed unsustainable was caused by 1) one child policy 2) No legal underpinnings and 3) lack of institutions/banking clarity 4) state control and no individual voice

    Rajeev Reply:

    Gopi,
    Everytime we talk about China, we Indians start flashing our democracy. What is our democracy except for one VOTE that you cast? The final govt. formation is not as per wishes of the people but as per the deals between parties. Does govt. listen to voters in between two elections. The votes are bought in our democracy both from electorate and MPs. Ours is a sham hollow democracy which doesn’t serve any purpose. Today 70% of the Indian make Rs.20 (50 cents) a day. In India you can not afford even breakfast with this money.
    MNREGA is a scheme to loot country at rural level. Our police is corrupt. Our laws biased..e.g. 498A which is gender biased (assumes that man is always guilty). I don’t this you and others voted for this kind of biased law.

    China is one party brutal dictatorship but the chinese standard of living is far better than that of India.

    Have you ever realised whenever natural disasters happen anywhere in the world (Japan recently, China few years back), how many naked people do you see on road eating from trash? But if something of that sort happens in India, we see naked people all around roaming like beggar, running after truck carrying the supply.

    Dil Bahalane ke liye democracy ka lollypop achcha hai, par isse pet nahi bharta gareebon ka.

    shan Reply:

    @Gopi Thomas , you have a habit of looking through tinted glass. There is no denying India is infinitely different than what it was in 60’s 70’s 80’s . but we are talking about India becoming FIRST WORLD. my estimate is, it will take 150yrs. A few college students here and there is no indicator of progress , the real progress is when no malayali leave the shores of india for work
    As for comparison with china , the problem is we dont know much about china other than there is no labour union , no wage mobility , no enviornmental laws and NO FREEDOM., but it has become the factory for the world.Though One child policy will kick in at some point ,DEMOGRAPHERS are scientists and when they say something one has to pay heed.
    Also will INDIA remain as a single unit after 100 yrs , wellprediction is an imperfect science.
    @rajeev,I fully agree with you , hindu civilization has some inherent weakness , the caste system ,the dietary fads , dowry /female foeticide , and non organisational character, and WIMPISHNESS.Then again my guru (not ramdev) GUNNAR MYRDAL commented , there are leaders who come once in a while and change the course of history.
    We live in hope.

    [Reply]

    Pankaj#1 Reply:

    Shan;
    I say, India is united because of Sanskrit and Hinduism.
    Criticism is welcome.

  • Vijay Kumar

    @ Rajeev

    Where is the Congress actually winning elections except the HT and NDTV office ??? :D :D ??

    It won 2009 because of a negative BJP campaign which was poorly planned.

    Let me tell you the channels may try to project Rahul as a gora chitta fairy who is born to rule but every time Rahul opens his mouth… well the world cries :D I am still hunting for his 70×70 feet pit !!

    The Rahul curiosity value has evaporated.

    The NDA needs to get its act together– project a younger man like Jaitley or Nitish Kumar as the PM and win…

    [Reply]

    Rajeev Reply:

    In the next lok sabha election, we may see Nitish dumping BJP…Congress will buy MPs either by Note or CBI.
    The only way NDA can fight back is by discrediting Maa-Beta…and they have to find a way to do it.

    By the way NDTV-IBN are more of less Congress’s channel..BJP needs to develop/buy some people in media.

    [Reply]

  • http://- Rajeev

    Vijay,
    Abhishek Singvi today declared on TimesNow that Rahul Gandhi is DIVINE…
    What Mr.Sharma has to say about divinity of low IQ Rahul Gandhi?

    [Reply]

    shan Reply:

    @Rajeev ,
    Agar woh kare to sala ras lila hai(divine )
    hum kare to sala character dhila hai

    [Reply]

    Vijay Kumar Reply:

    @ Shan

    Are u hinting at some sort of raas lila?

    [Reply]

  • Vijay Kumar

    ~~ :D :D ~~ I THINK THE RAHUL STROY IS MORE OR LESS OVER ~~ :D :D ~~

    After producing one hit– in UP in 2009– Rahul is all misses now !!

    Now people are questionin whether the UP hit too was an accident caused by rejection of mayawati’s policies.

    The sad fact is Indians still do fall for white skin. Rahul’s skin tone may have made some media houses in delhi feel that he is one of us. Angrezi speaking and groomed and all that. but I have still not seen one interview of Rahul where he has actully answered press questions. That by itself speaks something of his IQ. Is the Congress afraid that its crown prince will be exposed?

    As it is right from Libya and Egypt to India, ruling as a matter of right and dynastic succession is being rejected. So if has some IQ Rhul should give up claims to the topseat…

    I think we really have a wealth of talent in this country which needs to be supported by cadre based politcal parties. And instead of hunting for dynasties let us hunt for talent elsewhere.

    [Reply]

    B.V.SHENOY Reply:

    Vijay Kumar,

    The coterie surrounding Amul Baby Rahul has actually kept him under house arrest, lest he opened his mouth and put his foot in it.

    Still, a journo friend (his name is Swayambhoo) got a brief interview with him when Digvinash Singh was not looking. SMS I got from him:

    SW: Rahul Baba, tell me what you think of this Ramdev movement?

    RG: It is a very serious matter. If my great grand father was alive today, he would have rushed to the UN, because it involves Swiss banks.

    If my grand mother, that is, of course, Indira Gandhi, was the PM, she would have nationalised all Swiss Bank branches in India. I would not put it beyond her thinking, if she nationalised all foreign banks in India.

    SW: And, if your father, Rajiv Gandhi were the PM……?

    RG: Of course, he would have called an emergency meeting of the Dharma sansad of the VHP and would have passed an ordinance for the immediate construction of Ram Mandir at Ayodhya, at the same time also calling a most urgent meeting of all Islamic terror organisations to declare that they can come overground and apply for office space.in all state capitals………

    [Reply]

    Vijay Kumar Reply:

    @ Shenoy

    Brilliant :D

    [Reply]

  • Vijay Kumar

    # Tajendar the Tur-d

    Sell this stroy to Digvinash Singh !! :D

    And dont post it here… u will get turdified !! :D

    [Reply]

    Rajeev Reply:

    Vijay,
    Ignore this guy…He see everything thru the a*se of Osama.

    [Reply]

  • http://- Rajeev

    Reminds me of Maulvi in Burqa and Islamic panties.

    [Reply]

  • Vijay Kumar

    @ Everyone especially Shenoy who created the name — Digvinash !!!

    BREAKING NEWS !! EUREKA !! BREAKING NEWS !! EUREKA !! BREAKING NEWS !!!

    ~~~ :D :D ~~~ WHERE DOES DIGVINASH GET HIS THEORIES ON TERROR ETC ??/ ~~ :D :D ~~~

    Answer: Like Osama was hiding in Abottabad, we have in our very midst the guy who gives digvinash all the unbelievable theories of 26/11 being caused by the RSS and need to call Osama, Osamaji.

    And this genius teacher is none other than Our dear old far-t
    Ladies and gentlemen a big hnd for The one and only

    TAJENDAR THE TUR-D !! :D :D :D

    [Reply]

  • http://- Rajeev

    Vijay,
    On a serious note, I watched the video in which congressmen and their media was thrashing Sushil Kumar who dared to SHOW shoe to Dwivedi.
    You can clearly see DIGVIJAY singh kicking that person not once but several time. He is clearly engaging in gundagardi that Mahatma Gandhi’s congress is known for.
    Is there some provision by which such assault by politicians can be brought to the court?

    [Reply]

    B.V.SHENOY Reply:

    Rajeev,

    I would request you not to speak about Mahatma Gandhi’s congress, which died the day he died.

    Digvinash is moving in the fast lane on his drive to self destruction.

    His encouragement to SIMI in the Batla House shooting, his support to LeT, attributing the Mumbai 26/11 terror to Hindu terror, and now abusing Ramdev in the vilest manner all are a series of steps he has taken under a planned self destruction scheme.

    His latest gaffe about Balkrishna is likely to antagonise the entire Nepali nation against India, like Rajiv Gandhi did, when he blocked vital supplies of essential items by putting up an unprecedented blockade.

    [Reply]

  • http://- Rajeev

    Here is the link to the video where you can see Digvijay kicking the guy. Is this the democracy of Congress?

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YrYTy2ZOb3k

    [Reply]

    Rajiv Reply:

    I fail to understand, why a criminal case has not being filed against D Singh the congress spokesman for this assault.

    Is the person assaulted, stil in police custody ?
    D Singh, was quoted in a news paper , to have instructed the Delhi police commissioner to ‘throughly investigate and question’ the person assaulted. That could mean, torture and intimidation.

    [Reply]

    Rajeev Reply:

    This is the real face of congress. No other media outlet has shown this video.

    [Reply]

    ankit Reply:

    maybe vinodji can also tell us why his boss digvijayji referred to bin laden as osamaji :)

    [Reply]

  • Vijay Kumar

    @ Rajiv

    All the government agencies are being used to promote the Congress and dynasty interests..

    [Reply]

  • Pankaj#1

    Shenoy Sahab;
    I so often hear about RSS and BJP and their hidden and not so hidden agendas. Can you shed some light on those agendas? I am kinda out of touch.

    @ Shenoy;
    Shenoy Sahab, in the last page , I had asked you, about so called agenda of RSS and / Or BJP. You did not come out with an answer. Now, I would like to ask it to any one who cares, including Ravi.

    [Reply]

    B.V.SHENOY Reply:

    Pankaj ji,

    a little earlier, I have attempted to answer your query. It may not be exhaustive or even satisfactory. But it is a brief response.

    [Reply]

  • Pankaj#1

    Shan;
    I say India is united because of Sanskrit and Hinduism.
    Criticism is welcome.

    [Reply]

  • Pankaj#1

    Rajeev;
    You asked me about China in last blog. If you can acces a book, written by ” George Friedman”, title is : The Next 100 years:. This guy has more insight than our Ramn and has much more influence on decision makers than Raman.
    Criticism is welcome.

    [Reply]

    Rajeev Reply:

    Thanks.

    [Reply]

  • http://- Rajeev

    Pankaj,
    I personally feel RSS’s idea of India is outdated, the organization itself is outdated. I have never been to any RSS sakha but have seen some RSS guys talking. One of their favorite topic is that Nehru-Gandhi dynasty is actually muslims and then they have their own version of ancient Indian history.
    Congress dumped Gandhi and then Nehru and has moved on to pragmatic opportunistic politics but RSS is still stuck in Hegdewar’s time. RSS needs a complete makeover right from ideology to clownish dress.
    But nobody can question their patriotism and social service but all this gets undone by their refusal to embrace minorities and bad press that keeps tainting RSS.

    I consider them class fool in the present time. If they can’t handle Digvijay kind of person then how can they tackle other disruptive elements.

    [Reply]

    rajiv Reply:

    The problem in my opinion is the undefined relationship between BJP and RSS.
    Aas long as they are not completely independent organizations, both will be compromised and both fail.

    BJP needs to be an independent party where the party president and officials are only answerable to the party workers who elect them.

    Similarly RSS should be independent with its own agenda. Since it does not field political candidates, its a social organization and that should be the focus. Its the mxing of a social organization like RSS with a political organization, that has domed and paralyzed both.

    India needs a centristm nationalist party. I had hopes that BJP would fill that role. However, for it to do that role effectively, it has to project an image and policy where no community doubts that it favours a certain community.

    So BJP needs to dis-associate itself organizationally with RSS and define a more inclusive , centrist agenda. India badly needs it.

    [Reply]

    B.V.SHENOY Reply:

    Rajiv, Pankaj ji, and Vijay Kumar and also Rajeev,

    Rajiv’s analysis is somewhat superficial. RSS has been the bulwark against encroachment by Christian missioneries and also Muslim fundamentalism both of which have received state patronage for over a century now. This patronage has continued till today.

    The work RSS is doing in the social field is stupendous. It has no parallel in India’s history. It has stood for pan-Hindu unity at the social level and culturally it considers everybody who respects Indianness and Indian culture as an Indian, which is derided by the pseudo seculars as Hindu fundamentalism.

    RSS, like many other institutions has changed over the decades. Today, you don’t have to be a brahmachari, a chaddi-wearing, lathi-weilding, kaali-topiwala to be called a swayamsevak. Anybody who believes in the broad philosophy of the organisation can be called an RSS. By the way, it is now occupying the centre stage of India’s political discourse thanks to the congress party’s Hindu-phobia and also Ramdev’s movement. And its strength has grown enormously compared to the Brahmin-centric organisation that it was in the 30’s and 40’s.

    When you consider its inadequacies, you must also take into account what would have happened to India if there was no RSS.

    [Reply]

    Praveen Saxena Reply:

    I agree with every word that Shenoy Saab has stated about the RSS.

    Ravi Reply:

    I dis-agree with every single word that Shenoy Sahib has stated about the RSS.

    Pankaj#1 Reply:

    Rajeev;
    Agree with you that RSS and BJP should be completely dissociated. I again agree with you that may be RSS ideology is out dated to certain extent, but like fundamental rights of indian constitution, Indian nationalism of RSS is there. what I feel, that you have met people at the very basic level of RSS. I have met Nanaji Deshmukh personally and they are people like JP, and had they compromised with rulers, could have risen to dizzy heights with their talent, but then, they chose different path, out of their conviction. I know, top BJP functionaries of yesteryears rather closely and they were people of sterling qualities. I am not being partial, congress had so many greats too. I had close contacts with congress peole too, in power, real power, as you know from my previous posts. I am out of India but India is not out of me. That is my problem.I can tell you so many anecdotes of power wielding politicians, but that is out of this place. Gandhi and Nehru were great people but not gods. They had their weaknesses as well. Hedgewar was a small fry,but in his conviction, by the way, he was a doctor and could have earned fabulous riches, in those days, when docotrs were not a commonplace people. It looks that you have succumbed to the propaganda of vested interests that RSS is against minorities. give me some evidence. I can give you many. You say they can not handle Digvijay, you know, who is behind digvijay very well, with money power, Coercive power of state and media. Not easy to tackle him, but not impossible. He will meet his natural waterloo as he has no base in his parent state and is merely a hanger on. Yes, we need a centrist nationalist party, where minorities should feel belonging, but present rulers have vested interest in keeping them separate to perpetuate their hegemony. please do not hesitate to exchange further notes. I would like to share my feelings here and if any body has any doubts they may clear with me or change my opinion. I am open here.

    [Reply]

    Pankaj#1 Reply:

    Sorry’ in my haste, I could not differentiate Rajeev and Rajiv and have replied to both of them in one post.

    [Reply]

  • Observer

    @Tajender,

    Shouldn’t we be investigating first the truth about disappearance of Hindus and Sikhs in Pakistan? what happened to them? Are they buried, are they forced into Islam or are their their ashes have fertilized Pakistani soil?

    Prior to partition they were about 30% of the population and being majority or near majority in Karachi and Lahore. Today one has to send a search party find either of them in Pakistan.

    As a champion of human rights you should be the first one to ask that tough questions, rather than indulging in fantacy of conspiracy to kill a stupid and incompetent guy who thought he was 20 years old kid to chase Kasab

    As long as India’s ATS and other security apparatus is filled with such incompetent people Pakistan need not worry. AFTER ALL CQS ARE THE GANG WHO COULDN’T SHOOT STRAIGHT.

    [Reply]

    Observer Reply:

    Tajender,

    Look like you are getting old. Your knowledge of geography is getting rusted.

    we are talking about Sindh and West Punjab, specifically Karachi and Lahore, hundreds of miles away from Jammu.. If Pakistanis did not murdered Hindus and Sikhs over there, they have nothing to fear, as you say, in finding the truth.

    In case of Jammu, there was flooding from Kashmir, Now are you claiming that Kashmiri Pandits in refugee camps in Jammu and Delhi is a myth created by BJP.?

    [Reply]

    Observer Reply:

    TajEnder,

    I have to add that that if India is as much Muslim- free as Pakistan is Hindu-free there would not be be any riots in India. If that was THE case there would be more Sikhs than Muslims in India, like in Pakistan there are more Christians than Hindus.

    You are wrong about conversion. During Sikh and British rule percentage of non-Muslims in Punjab and Sindh rose not reduced.

    The only difference is Hindus have too many CQ monkeys, who bark like JUNKYARD DOGS whenever there is any transgression against Muslims, but keep DINGO like silence, when Hindus are at the receiving end.

    This makes the job of open Pakistanis, like yourself, or hidden Pakistanis, like shan the Punjabi Pakistani wolf under Hindu Bengali sheepskin, much easier to to paint Hindus who are asking for same moral standards to be applied to Hindus as that is to Muslims, as communal. Of course in that project you guys are greatly helped by BAKRIWALA BAMMANS, like Vinod Sharma.

    I consider Muslims and Pakistanis as our brothers, so I do not see any reason, why Hindus and Muslims in South Asia should be subjected to different standards, HIGH or LOW.

    [Reply]

  • http://- Rajeev

    @Gopi,
    Everytime we talk about China, we Indians start flashing our democracy. What is our democracy except for one VOTE that you cast? The final govt. formation is not as per wishes of the people but as per the deals between parties. Does govt. listen to voters in between two elections. The votes are bought in our democracy both from electorate and MPs. Ours is a sham hollow democracy which doesn’t serve any purpose. Today 70% of the Indian make Rs.20 (50 cents) a day. In India you can not afford even breakfast with this money.
    MNREGA is a scheme to loot country at rural level. Our police is corrupt. Our laws biased..e.g. 498A which is gender biased (assumes that man is always guilty). I don’t this you and others voted for this kind of biased law.

    China is one party brutal dictatorship but the chinese standard of living is far better than that of India.

    Have you ever realised whenever natural disasters happen anywhere in the world (Japan recently, China few years back), how many naked people do you see on road eating from trash? But if something of that sort happens in India, we see naked people all around roaming like beggar, running after truck carrying the supply.

    Dil Bahalane ke liye democracy ka lollypop achcha hai, par isse pet nahi bharta gareebon ka.

    [Reply]

    Gopi Thomas Reply:

    Rajeev – Valid points.

    Well, I would say we are moving past “naked” people eating from trash when a disaster strikes.. Last tsunami to hit southern coasts in fact gave the impression of a government machiner y reasonably in control, a populace willing to volunteer and help etc. The Gujrat earthquake response was also exemplary. Now, your vision of naked people may well be true if a disaster strikes UP or MP.

    The question is whether there is a better form of government other than democracy. May be we had it too early; may be the democratic experiment should have been after nation building..

    One thing the world and India understand about Indians now is that Indians are entrepreneurial; they are very good in wealth creation. As you mentioned, our legal system is a leftover from British, even the new ones are absurd.

    The Ramdev and Anna movements are the results of the failures of our democracy. So,we can say that is one type of check–that people eventually organizes against massive failures of govt.

    There are many good rules and money allocated for uplifting the “naked” – however, all that money is looted by the bureaucracy, especially in the northern states. I do believe further growth in GDP, significant improvement in the quality of life for many impoverished etc will happen if the level of corruption can be reduced. A sea change in the attitudes of Indian politicians and bureaucrats will have to happen. Tough enforceable laws, fast courts, a vigilant citizenry, hopefully enhanced by activists sucha s Anna, etc will all help.

    Somewhere I read that a very high percentage of candidates contesting for elections are involved in civil and criminal cases. So, obviuously, they are joining in this “exercise” to expand their gundagiri – I would think simple changes, some fine tuning etc will create better governance. Bihar was looted for many years; a Nitin comes in and starts fixing. The question is, I think as you ascribed, can we go on this way, waiting for a Nitin, or can an early intervention be built in..

    One way to look at us is that we did not turn up like Pakistan. But people who have been to Lahore and Islamabad say they have significantly better roads. Having both – better roads and better govt – seem like an impossible one!

    May be the Chinese model – state controlled capitalism- is a better one to catapult a country at a massive magnitude. If so, how do we implement it in India.. Remeber, Deng started on this path after the utter failure of Maos social ideology — by then millions had already perished.

    I have on and off suggested a policy model of incorporating successes from various state achievements/accomplishments. I think a combined model consisting of Kerala’s social achievements (education, women/men ratio, generally peaceful coexistence among various religious believers, womens health, infant mortalitry etc) and Gujrrat’s economic achievements will be a powerful one that could be implemented in all states. Obviously, political leadership should be there, a demanding ctizenry should be there. Keralas social progress and Gujrats economic progresss have been achieved under current laws and systrems (and traditions may be ). Could we bottle these into one “working template” for all other states with minor channges to accommodate unique situations.

    One thing is sure – it will be visionary chief ministers that will bring the change and uplift their states, and not the central government.

    [Reply]

    shan Reply:

    @Gopi Thomas ,your barmy idea of bottling gujrat and kerala together is like bottling powdered sulphur and pttasium nitrate . it doesn,t work.
    for what will work wait for my next post which will be available later tonight(UK)

    [Reply]

  • Vijay Kumar

    @ Pankaj

    I think this is an interesting quesiton you have raised. frankly speaking the RSS has to speak the modern idiom and use modern technolgy to appeal to youngsters.

    Why the Congress hates is because the RSS provides possible scenario off uniting Hindus as a vote bank an idea whhich could wipe out the COngress for ever.

    You would see a lot of support for the RSS and Hindus on the net. Why? Because the whole world sees that the Congress and the self labelled secular (actually they are communal) have no problems talking to and pushing the agenda of communal Muslim parties and even condoning Islamic terror (as Rahul and Digvinash do), yet immediatley start shouting rape rape even when any HIndu goes to a temple.

    At this stage I would not like to talk about the COngress and the same media being okay with religious parties being made around Christian and Sikh identities. This is also communalism of a milder variety. But since there is no terror, it can be at best called a bad social practice.

    In the end Hindus have started feeling hounded in India.

    Why I have my deifferences with the RSS

    But… we have to remember we are a multireligious country. The RSS should come out as a nationalist body of a Nationalist party

    it should stop talking about akhand bharat which talks about amalgamating Pakistan I think we should thank our stars that violent animals who concieved Pakistan no longer live with us !

    [Reply]

  • Ravi

    Ramdev – What are his Objectives.
    Now Anna Hazare has decided to hold a fast in support of Ramdev. If this blog is anything to go by then one can see that much heat is expended on this issue, yet the light seems to be very dim.
    Can some one clearly state what the Objective of Ramdev is. What needs to happen in order to satisfy him?

    I will make a start on what I think his objective is:

    It is difficult not to conclude that Ramdev – like most sane people – is disgusted by the financial corruption endemic among Ministers of our Government and other people in authority and he wants measures to be taken to curtail it or stop it altogether.

    So what MEASURES can the Govt take to STOP CORRUPTION?

    1) Pass a law which makes taking of Bribes and Kick-backs a crime. Is there no such law or other laws that can be used to this effect? My feeling is that it is not the law that is needed, but the political will to execute existing laws to catch the culprits. Those who take bribes or kick-backs do not leave easy trail for prosecutors to use against them.

    2) Immediately arrest people suspected of having taken bribes/kick-backs and start legal proceedings against them in specially appointed courts for this purpose.

    This is some what idealistic, for the simple reason that some industries, universally function on Kick-Back systems. Mark Thatcher – son of Mrs T – was suspected in the Al Yamama deal. There has been a suspicion on Jonathan Aitkin for years; there are many more examples like this.

    The Pharmaceutics/Airlines/Large Constructions are some of the industries where kick-backs are universally used as inducements and are included in the prices quoted in Tenders.

    So passing laws, arresting and charging corrupt individuals is only a small part of the solution. The greater part of solution lies with large conglomerates and their business practices and these are beyond the reach of Mr Ramdev.

    [Reply]

    Gopi Thomas Reply:

    Ravi-

    Right. As long as human beings are there, there will be corruption; all cannot be avoiuded; but the laws and prosecution will prevent many and punish many. It is interesting that all parties are together when it comes to not to fight corruption!

    [Reply]

  • Balwinder Sandhu

    VINODJI
    VINODJI
    VINODJI

    PL look at this vulgar attack on hinduism and pujaris below. Vijay Kumar noted it and expressed his disgust. Can I register mine.
    WHEN ARE YOU GOING TO BAN HIM?
    Ahindu using such vulgar language against Islam or the prophet would not last 1 day on Pakistani newspapers.
    Has tajender added to your blog or is he driving people away. I have had enough and am going away for now.
    ———-
    tajender Reply:

    June 7th, 2011 at 11:15 pm

    and I am not a terrorist, though I have met two of them on this blog.

    jai jai kunjbihari kee,
    maa kee ch..t pujaree kee
    gale mein latke zhnton kee maala,
    aage latke l..nd kunwara

    [Reply]

    Balwinder Sandhu Reply:

    if others agree- pl just type in one word for VINODJI to read- ban tajender- through email AND ALSO IP identity

    [Reply]

    B.V.SHENOY Reply:

    Vijay Kumar, Balwinderji,

    If Vinodji doesn’t remove this tur.d now, it will only mean that Vinodji is insensitive to the felings of outrage felt by Hindus/Sikhs here on his blog. It will also mean that his kind of secularism is stronger than the combined feeling of outrage we feel.

    [Reply]

    vinod sharma Reply:

    @BV Shenoy
    If you don’t like the comment,. ignore it. That is the way to deal with it. You never uttered a word of protest when even my parentage was questioned on this blog. On the contrary you lauded the fact of those comments being allowed to remain here. Now you are trying to set the agenda on a blog that is not yours. I will resist and not allow that to happen— without meaning to support any abuses of the religous kind hurled by anyone, incluidng your fellow travellers.

    vinod sharma Reply:

    @Balwinder Sandhu
    Why don’t you ignore the lout. You accord him respectability by reacting to his comments. I had had his posts removed from a previous blog. But he is persisting. I am look for a long term solution to this problem and have informed the technicians. That is the best I can do for now.

    [Reply]

  • http://rediffmail.com ram

    It seems Tihar Jail superintendent is the luckiest person

    already he has kalmadi, raj, kani etc.,

    very soon Chidu and dayanidi will reach there

    [Reply]

  • shan

    @Ravi Dadaji(what is the name of your grand daughter)
    Being of the age of a dadaji,I am surprised that you are not conversant with the history of India.
    India was COLONISED by the country WHERE YOU GO FOR A WALK IN THE GREAT PARK WITH A CHADI. Now the people who colonised india wrote all the laws , just as it was in the mother country.
    SO IF BRIBE TAKING IS OFFENCE IN UK IT IS OFFENCE IN INDIA.In fact if I want to know if any law applies to india , I make sure whether that law exists in England, it is that simple.There is also a vigilance dept who time to time nabs CHOTA MOTA clerks in govt office.Also pertiment to note rather sexy kanimozi is breathing the air of TIHAR JAIL. at the moment
    BUT IN INDEPENDENT INDIA NOT A SINGLE HIGH PROFILE POLITICIAN/DALAL/BUREAUCRAT/BUSINESSMAN HAS BEEN SENT BEHIND BARS.
    India doesn’t have a SERIOUS FRUD OFFICE LIKE UK(It needs lots and lots of expertise, INDIANS WOULD RATHER INVEST TIME AND ENERGY IN IPL AND MUNNI AND SHEILA)
    In USA , bernie maddox coffin will be coming out of the prison ,not from his home, so will be host of other crooks. SO CORRUPTION IN INDIA IS NOT A DISCOVERY OF HAZARE OR BABA RAMDEV
    Why suddenly indian masses have become so embroiled IN SWISS BANK ONLY , you may be able to explain with your gaze theory.
    My theory is AAM ADMI in India is living a very very very INSECURE life. The govt hospitals are PIG STYE, and private medicine WILL MAKE YOU SELL FAMILY SILVER
    It is okay for all the bloggers here , they can afford private medicine , AAM ADMI cannot.
    That is why the people who thronged BABA were not blogger class.
    Also because of liberalisation ,all the MEDICAL GOODIES haave flooded the market , doctors use it with impunity (they also get a cut).A small example . There is a drug called MEREPENAM, used with impunity.this drug is IMPORTED .It cost 5000Rs per injection and you three per day.If the drug is used for 10 days , the cost is 150000Rs. Doctors get a 10% cut from the drug stores SO THEY INSIST on using this drug.THIS IS THE REASON INDIA IS CREDITED WITH MAKING THIS DRUG A RESISTANT DRUG TO BACTERIA IN SOME CASES.
    Also the SCHOOLS .Getting your POTHA POTHI admitted is like going on a SPACE TOUR.
    It is as difficult as that . again govt schools are meant to give DOLE MONEY to teachers, for any semblance of teaching you need private schools , with capitation fee running into LAKHS
    same with admission to colleges , ELSE YOU NEED SUPARISH.
    I would pay for the comments of ashish on my above observations.
    TRAVEL, travelling in a bus , if you are a women BE PREPARED TO BE GROPED (exclusively delhi)
    but generally travel is a nightmare

    As for BABA RAMDEV ,it is getting silly , he now wants to raise an army of 15000 people.
    balakrishnan is pufta , most definitely ,?baba ’s wife

    As

    [Reply]

    Ashish Reply:

    @Shan,
    comparisons with advanced nations like UK, Germany, USA are admittedly unfair. But, having some experience of living, working and travelling extensively in the Far East I can say that we have a lot of catching up to do even with some of the less developed countries there- like Indonesia, Thailand.
    Why is that so?
    I will not hide behind the excuse of “oh, we have chosen to be a democracy and China is not” or even, “we are a huge country of 1.1 B people vs only 25 M in Malaysia”. What I have observed and has pained me are some of the things you have alluded to and Rajeev talked about in an earlier post.
    I had briefly talked about this earlier as well; but here goes.
    We blame our political class but, we are all- including the middle class so fond of trashing politicians, complicit in creating this culture of corruption. It is getting worse. From exam results to land deals to contracts- government AND private, things are seldom clean.
    I had talked about how in many DDA housing societies, those who have the 3rd (top) floor, have with impunity built the 4th floor. Who sanctioned it? What if there is an earthquake and those come crashing down like the proverbial pack of cards? Who made money? By the way, no one forced the man on the 3rd floor to build the 4th floor and be compelled to bribe, did some one?
    Students in my daughter’s class routinely cheat with invigilators being passive bystanders. This is one of the more well known schools in Delhi.
    Your observations about the doctors in India are correct- I could relate many more, much more horrific stories, including those of continued chemotherapy beyond any sensible stage.
    It is impossible to register an FIR- my wife had her handbag snatched, within 100 yards of a police patrol, they refused to help.
    Can’t say much about bus travel- I confess to not needing to use them. But, I doubt Delhi-ites have grown more civilized in the decades since I last travelled in a DTC bus.
    In my view, people are fed up. Corruption is so endemic and the state is increasingly seen as being looters and insensitive to the needs of the common man. When some girl got killed while coming back from work, our CM (a lady, would you believe it?) kind of implied that it was somehow her fault. She appealed to women to not go out at night.
    We deserve the government we get, because we are that way.
    Why am I detailing all of this? It is to provide a context behind the Anna/ Baba movements.
    We are fed up, And we blame everyone but ourselves.
    We vote for corrupt politicians; we do not think corruption is an issue. We are not certainly going to work hard to eradicate corruption, heck, we will bribe our way out of trouble and bribe our way into power or wealth.
    Manu Joseph, in a recent op-ed in the Open Magazine said, “if you wish to meet the most corrupt men in India, check out the queue in front of Tirupathi in the morning”. We Hindus like to propitiate our Gods after months of sin (like the Christians go for their weekly tryst with Father Confessor!). We also like to think some “big man” is going to provide salvation- we are a nation of followers. So, we need some Anna, some Bapu or some Baba or some Neta(ji).
    Note that all these people swiftly become larger than life, and their followers will countenance no criticism of their divinities. So, the risk we run is that we mix the man with the message- and if the man is shown to have feet of clay, the message is lost as well.
    Only Gandhi has, to an extent, survived this scrutiny and maintained is “divinity”. Baba or Anna will certainly fall short. The sad part is, by demolishing them, the government will succeed in demolishing the message of anti-corruption.

    [Reply]

    shan Reply:

    @Ashish,OUTSTANDING,just finished operating, I will come back to you later with facts and figures you will appreciate.

    [Reply]

    Ashish Reply:

    did the patient survive? or were you only curing him of ingrown toenails?

    shan Reply:

    @Ashish , stick to running servers ,it is ingrowing toe nails not ingrown toe nails, of which i have done about 100 , under local anaesthesia . Post operative course is bloody painful.
    As for the case ,this was a patient in his 80’s admitted under the medical team with fever and feeling unwell. he was also suffering from renal failure and used to have peritonealdailysis.
    I was asked for an opinion , because his blood pressure had dropped dramatically and he was complaining of abdominal pain. i disgnosed peritonitis . I opened his abdomen through the midline incision ,removed the tenchoff catheter .He had belly full of pus .First impression was that is dialysing fluid probably got infected, Operation was very very hazardous ,intestines all matted together and very friable .However careful inspection revealed he had a perforation of caecum ,vascular in origin , for distal bowel was not distended. Normally one would have resected the caecum ,but given the critial condition he was in , I brought out the caecum on the surface and converted it to a caecostomy.
    We did a POSSOM score with portsmouth correction ,the mortality is above 95%
    so unlikely he will make it, though at the moment he is just about holding.

  • Praveen Saxena

    A lot of noise had been made by Vinod Sharma about Ramdevji’s aide Balkrisna being a Nepali citizen holding a fake Indian pasport and running companies on behalf of Ramdevji. Allegations which Balkrishna has now denied.
    I had exchanged some arguments with Vinod Sharma and he abruptly concluded by saying ” Arguing with your kind is a wasteful excercise” . Such a rude dismissal came as no surprise, knowing that he is an unabashed admirer of the Congress party and the family which runs it. and gets stung when some unpleasant truths are voiced..
    But the question still remains , what does the Congress party has to say about its MP by the name of Subba , in the Parliament , against whom even the Supreme Court has passed Orders. This government of scoundrels , which is out protect its wealth stashed abroad over the years , is only thowing dust into our eyes , and will never take those steps which really bring back that money.

    [Reply]

    Gopi Thomas Reply:

    Now Chidambaram says that in a meeting in March in Puthur, Karnataka, RSS stated that they will support any movement against national corruption. (as if something is wrong in supporting)
    So, Ramdev’s movement, because of that statement from RSS, is a RSS sponsored movement!

    Then he says nobody can challenge Pranab for a debate on corruption..because the debates are done in parliament becoz we are parliamentary democracy…

    I really had some respect for Chidambaram, as a member of liberalization, as one who participated in our econbomic redirection….

    What else can one expect from the cohots of Digvijay Singh..

    [Reply]

    vinod sharma Reply:

    @Praveen Saxena
    Subba is a corrupt man who made a fortune out of the lottery business. He should be hounded out of Indian politics. Now what do you say about BalKrishna who refused to take questions and was a bundle of nerves in a televised presser. When you unabashedly tout BJP arguments you are objective and when others show the flip side they are subjective and agents of the congress. What an argument really. I repeat that engaging with you is a waste of time.
    Thank You

    [Reply]

    Raju Kurien Reply:

    Well , mr congress licker, no respect journalist — Subba is a parliamentarian, Balakrishna is a private citizen

    [Reply]

    vinod sharma Reply:

    @Raju Kurien
    So, an elected man.Go campaign against him in his constituency. Pl don’t misuse my hospitality with the kind of language you use. It is uncivil and unacceptable.

  • Binoy Hegde

    It is interesting to note a few recent prosecutions in USA and compare whether anybody will even acre if Indian politicians ddi something simular.

    - Anthony Weiner, a powerful congressman from Brooklyn, NY is under pressure to resign. He sent lewd messages and pics to five women whom he met online. No woman was underage ; and he did not ahve any body contact with anybody, neither he has ever met them. Although he has said he will not resign, the media and colleague pressure most probably will make him resign.

    - John Edwards, a powerful politician, who was John Kerry’s running mate in 2004 presidential elections, and who was a democratic party primary candidate for the 2008 presidential elections, has just been indicted by the grand jury for election finance violation (he directed close to 1 million dollar from campaign contribution to hide the details about a lover he had). He will go to jail if convicted. (India does not ahve grand jury and district prosecutor system — a very powerful process here in US).

    - John Ensign, a powerful republican senator from Nevada, at one time a “presidential material” , recently resigned from the senate based on ethics investigation conducted by his fellow senators through their “ethics committee”. The issues may not even see the light of the day in India. He had an affair with one of his staff member’s wife, there was a job offer to her son in his staff, and there was a payment of 75,000 dollars by the senator’s father to this woman.

    - Gov Blogowich of Illinois is undergoing prosecution – based on conversation of getting a kickback (not receiving any kickback) for filling an empty senate seat.

    - State of California is investigting whether Arnold Swazenerger used state facilities to continue his liaison with the other woman while he was the governor. He will go to jail if it is found that he used state facilities.

    Now US rules were refined over 200 years. It is possible India will refine its rules (as seems it is happening now) — sixty years while long is not 200 years.

    [Reply]

  • Ravi

    Rape Rape, Modi, Modi, RSS RSS

    I sure some one commented that recently there has been a dirth of “rape rape, Modi Modi and RSS RSS type of contributions”. I am therefore surprised to see te very same people posting a number of contributions about RSS.

    Here is my take on this, the heart of many disagreements here;

    • RSS is a Hindu Right organization with violent values imported from European fascism of the 1930s.

    • RSS is a Hindu Supremacists organization which is NOT prepared to live with others in equal terms and equal respect and it seeks to create a single pure religious and ethnic tradition.

    • Hinduism is plural and tolerant and RSS wants to convert it into an aggressive ideology of homogeneity based around Rama.

    • RSS falsifies and manipulates Indian history.(Hence attack on JNU)

    • RSS does not accept the likely-hood that Hindus are no more indigenous than Indian Muslims.

    • RSS is almost alone in not recognizing that CASTE is the central social problem facing India.

    • Hinduism, in various regions of India means different things to them, and RSS wants to homogenize them against centuries of traditions and even hostilities.

    • RSS is ideologically against any equality given to people who wish to retain their religious and ethnic distinctiveness. As Golwalkar says “”There are only two courses open to the foreign elements, either to merge themselves in the national race and adopt its culture, or to live at the sweet will of the national race.”

    • RSS wishes to change our constitution because it insisted not only on the equal rights of all citizens, but on stringent protections for religious freedom of expression.

    • RSS has a strangle hold over BJP policies and is stopping it deviating from what it thinks are the core Hinuatva policies.

    I can go on.

    [Reply]

    Ashish Reply:

    @Ravi,
    I would not respond to this except to say, this is really off-topic. Unless you are prepared to show that RSS is the fountainhead of corruption in India.
    Let’s stay on corruption and sleaze, uncomfortable as it may be for Congress.

    [Reply]

    Ravi Reply:

    Ashish

    Here, there are many more contributions than just mine here on the RSS and whilst it may be off topic, it is still the single most important source of diagreement here, and dare I say in the country as a whole.

    [Reply]

    Ashish Reply:

    @Ravi,
    Can you share the results of any recently conducted poll that will support the contention that “RSS is the single most source of disagreement in the country as a whole?”
    I fear you are merely “projecting” your biases as something that keeps Indians awake at night.

    Ravi Reply:

    Ashish

    Do you need a poll to tell you that Communal Issues are the very basis of our Paliamentary opposition.

    RSS/BJP are communal Hindu Supermacist organisations.

    All this goading of Vinod is carried out by communal elements here in this blog.

    Ashish Reply:

    @Ravi, opposition from “communal elements” is a card that Digvijay, Manish Tiwari, A M Singhvi (not to forget Vinod) play every day and night in front of TV cameras. Does that make their views creditable?
    Again, you have every right to hold a POV, but we have every right to point out that your POV is self-deluding at best and mass-diversionary at worst.
    The thing is, we are used to it- we the right wingers, those that have never cared for the “sickular” label proudly worn by “oh, tell me what should I tell them?” school of jounalists.
    We have not been schooled in JNU, and are proud of it.

    Ravi Reply:

    Ashish

    What makes a comment creditable or not, is not dependent upon the media where the comment was made, its credibility dependent upon the beholder.

    People who share Vinod’s perspective on life, as well as current issues will find his comments entirely creditable. These may well be Liberal Congress types.

    Contrariwise, as it is abundant clear here, those who have a different perspective on life find his comments lack creditability. They are the BJP and Hindu Fundo type

    I would like to count myself among those who find more of his views agreeable that disagreeable.

    Proud to be Liberal/Secular and JNU type

    Ashish Reply:

    @Ravi,
    I am almost 100% sure you have no idea of what you are talking about- especially when you proclaim your pride at being the JNU type :) Let’s leave it at that.
    And, I find it almost predictable to be called the BJP and Hindu fundo type; it won’t be the first time and I predict not the last time either.
    Not that there is anything wrong with being called a BJP type..

    Raju Kurien Reply:

    The ISI trained loser again at it

    [Reply]

    Pankaj#1 Reply:

    Ravi/ Ashish;
    Yes, I would like to discuss RSS with an open mind as every news item in all the papers, are suggesting that RSS is behind this agitation. RSS is being mentioned ad nauseam.
    Ravi; I would like to answer you point wise.
    1. How you say that RSS philosphy is imported fascist ideology? You mean, only dress and lingo has been changed, otherwise, fascist ideology has been incorporated in toto? disagree. Hindu right organization, yes, that is there. You also agree that right off the centre is not such a bad thing.
    2.Any evidence for your point2?
    3.any evidence for your point 3, Any statement, any book, saying that only hindus can live here as first class citizens, rest should be delegated to second class citizenery?
    4.RSS falsify indian history?? How come you are sure that JNU does not?
    5. Is this RSS saying or communal muslims are saying that we are from Arabia. Not all the muslims say, that they are from Arabia.
    6.Many of the RSS leaders are from OBC or dalits. Brahmins are no longer forming exlusive coterie.
    7. who told you that RSS wants to change local traditions and mould all the indians into a Maharashtra or for that matter, any other particular mould of hindus? any evidence?
    8.Any evidence, where RSS says, change your religion or ethinicity or else…. what it emphasize that , be nationalist and do not have extra territorial loyalities.
    9.Any evidence which suggests that RSS wants to change constitution. RSS philosphy is not caste in stone as some other philosphies are. Golwalkar might have said this thing in particular context, it is not fair to quote him out of context. particularly, when he can not defend himself.
    10. Yes, these two organizations should be separate and BJP should not be manipulated by RSS.
    I am all for our minorities to have equal rights, safety, honour and freedom to practice their religion but not to practice disruptive or anti national activities.
    Ravi, you appear more assertive and dogmatic about your believes. I am no RSS man, nothing to do with them, but when every body is saying, that this movement is RSS backed and even if it is RSS backed, what is wrong here, Mudda, or RSS? How does RSS support make issues raised by Ramdev irrelevant?

    [Reply]

    Ravi Reply:

    Pankaj

    I am sorry to say that the gap between you and I are of Grand Canyon proportions.

    The history of our previous unsatisfactory transactions are a witness to this.

    I see no possible gain between us discussing anything what so ever.

    I put forward my undrstanding of RSS and you have provided your reponse.

    Let’s leave it at that.

    Pankaj#1 Reply:

    OK Ravi, fair enough.

    B.V.SHENOY Reply:

    Pankaj ji,

    you have argued your points very well and cogently. They have the stamp of being factual.

    Please permit me to put forth “A BUNCH OF THOUGHTS”. These are mine own, all of them.

    1. The RSS is accused of being behind both the Anna Hazare led civil society and Baba Ramdev.
    It was the same with JP’s movement too. In fact JP invited the RSS to join join him in his andholan and the sangh was in the forefront. It goes to the credit of the Sangh as well as JP that the movement went on to overthrow the anti-national, fascist, anti-democratic, totalitarian regime of Indira Gandhi.

    2. About wanting to change the constitution: The congress government has altered the constitution more than 100 times, in many cases beyond recognition. They never thought about the sacredness of it while tinkering with it. Most of the directive principles of our constitution remain on paper, un-impemented 60years after it was framed. Reservations for SC/STs was meant to be for the first ten years and now it is a perpetual feature of our democracy.

    3. Guruji Golwalkar is quoted in context and out of context about his bunch of thoughts. If you look at what Gandhiji has said about Hitler and what he wrote to Hitler, it will come as a shock to your liberal being. He also advocated Ramrajya for his Hindustan, whereas the congress party, which claims sole proprietorship for Gandhiji’s legacy, has sworn under oath in the SC that Ram is a fiction and Ram Sethu is a figment of the author’s imagination.

    Pankaj#1 Reply:

    Thanks Shenoy Sahab;
    Truth should be the cornerstone of any discussion, philosphy or endeavors. While, philosophies can not be tested in terms of scientific experiments, bottom line could be, that it should not harm people or communities. It is always a pleasure to have your replies, as every time, some thing new come out of it.

  • http://rediffmail.com ram

    Sadvi Uma Bharathi kicked DIGGY frm MP so hard that he fell in UP, now she will kick him frm UP and he might fall next to Osama in arabian sea

    DIggy sadhu sants shap will ruin ur life same thing applies to VINNU

    [Reply]

  • rajiv

    in HT , Union home minister, Mr Chidambaram is quotd to have said
    “Home minister P Chidambaram today charged the RSS with being behind Baba Ramdev’s anti-corruption campaign, saying the Sangh fountainhead had decided to support anyone raising the corruption issue. ”

    Well thats very good news, if any organization has decided to “support anyone raising the corruption issue”.

    [Reply]

    rajiv Reply:

    @Ravi
    Please make few false assertions at a time.
    Don’t make too many of them , at a time.
    Save them for your other posts.

    [Reply]

    Ravi Reply:

    Rajiv

    I am perfectly balanced. I have a chip on both shoulders.

    [Reply]

    Rajiv Reply:

    @Ravi,
    bye the way, the greatest false assertion you make is by claiming ‘to be a liberal’.

    Liberals don’t make excuses for the vilest, communal, criminal organization of Jinnah’s Muslim league , by finding rational in his political demands of nationality based on religious identity and then wholesalke use of butchery to achive those aims.

    Ravi Reply:

    Rajiv

    Did I make those excuses.

    I must have been on something.

    Proud to be liberal.

  • Pankaj#1

    http://www.indianexpress.com/news/female-war-prisoners-should-be-sex-slaves-for-men-politician/800931/2
    Kuweti legislator calling for legal Sex slaves out of female POWs. In this age and time??
    Unbelievable.

    [Reply]

  • Vijay Kumar

    Ravi

    yeg do ghodon ki sawaari nahi chalegi.

    On the surface you wish to engage poitely with people on this blog. yet you let your chotta paazi Mutandar Hussain Tur-d who blogs under the fake name of Tajendar to spoil the atmosphere here with vile abuses to India and Hindus, Christans and Jews.

    Dont you think he is your real face. If he is not, why dont you critiscize him and ask him to shut up. Every
    one is watching you on this.

    [Reply]

    Ravi Reply:

    Vijay

    If riding two horses is meant to be more skill-full than riding one is, then I thank you for the compliment. I must have inherited it from my Sialkotia Grand Father.

    I think all that needs to be known about Tajender is known, no one needs me to throw any light on that.

    Futhermore, for fear of being misunderstood and/or being rebuked by Ashish, it is better if I keep my Liberal trap shut.

    Don’t you agree that I already have made more enemies here than is healthy for one man, do I need to add one more?

    I suggest we follow the advise given by Vinod. Those who like to read what he says, can continue and those who do not should avoid reading it..

    [Reply]

    Ashish Reply:

    @Ravi,
    I understand you too well :)
    Next time you are in India, when you move around and talk with people, try to keep an open mind.
    India has moved on since you left; the paradigms within which you saw things in 1972 do not hold anymore.
    And, I am very able to keep the attack on the idea separate from the attack on the person.

    [Reply]

    Rajeev Reply:

    Vijay,
    Ravi and Tajender are two faces of same coin. Their only ideology is Islamic terrorism. Don’t reply to these terrorists.

    [Reply]

    Ravi Reply:

    How right you are.

    [Reply]

    Gautam Gulati Reply:

    Ravi critisizing Tajender? He still wishes to live . No way he can do that.
    He doesnt have that courage.

    [Reply]

    Ravi Reply:

    Gautam

    Absolutely correct I have no courage, I am a darpoak and a scoundrel.

    I rather be killed by a Hindu Fundo, than a Pakistani.

    There I hope that makes you happy.

    [Reply]

  • http://- Rajeev

    Now that everyone is raising doubt on eachother’s credentials, it is about time India know the complete background of Sonia Gandhi (Her past life in Italy, her parents, actual wealth, Passports, her dual citizenship).
    Why is SC not entertaining any PIL on this issue? The Indians have right to know everything about the ruler whose background is all murky? We should know everything about foreign born individuals working in our govt., NGOs etc.

    [Reply]

  • http://- Rajeev

    Pankaj,
    Now back to RSS-
    1. Does RSS has minority cell?
    2. Why is it that RSS doesn’t have a PR to project its true image?
    3. Why doesn’t RSS file defamation cases against individuals who blame it for Gandhi’s murder including Fatso Tushar Gandhi?
    4. If RSS wants to fight corruption, why is it not doing in open?
    5. Regarding Sunil Joshi’s murder, we still don’t have RSS side of story?
    6. Why is RSS not asking BJP to drop Yeddy? He is corrupt..morally corrupt as well.
    7. Why is RSS not taking journalists like Vinod Sharma to court for defamation?

    [Reply]

    Pankaj#1 Reply:

    Rajeev;
    1. Do not know.
    2.Do you think so? RSS is having a PRO?, I think some of them issue statements from time to time. kind of spokeperson.
    3. I think, SC has absolved RSS for Mahtma’s murder. It did not find any evidence to link Godse with RSS.
    4.Not a bad idea, indeed why not?
    5. Do not know much about Sunil Joshi. Only heard that this guy, from M-P was killed by some one and there was a CD controversy.
    6. Sure, if BJP listens to RSS in a total manner, which I doubt, When you say corrupt and morally corrupt, are you referring to land allotment, to his relations? That was the practice adopted by his predecessors too, It had a sanction of tradition of previous Chief ministers conduct. Anyway, it looks like, he is making some amends. Certainly, he could do better.
    7. Do not know about that, however, when RSS told the Journalist from Bombay, who said 26/11 was done by RSS, to take him to court, he withdrew his assertions.
    I am not holding a brief for RSS but when every paper, every minister is asserting that Ramdev has RSS support, I become curious to know, what it is that RSS is being projected as poison and its presence is good enough to trash points raised by Ramdev. Even before , I had posted that I am not impressed by RAMDEV. I am asking about points raised by him.

    [Reply]

    Ashish Reply:

    @Rajeev,
    to me, a more fundamental question than the 6th one you ask is to ask, wtf was the RSS thinking when it appointed Nitin Gadkari as the BJP president?
    He celebrated his son’s wedding in the grandest manner possible. With chartered flights and what not.

    [Reply]

    Rajeev Reply:

    Right on the mark. Most of the BJP leaders are disgrace except for may be Jaitley and Modi.

    [Reply]

    Observer Reply:

    Problem is BJP is suffering from Indian malaise. Indians have tendency to pull down successful people. Therefore while there is is lot of opposition to Jaitley and Modi., one term CM of Delhi is made leader of opposition in loksabha.

    it is this infighting and incompetent leaders such as Vajpayee, which allowed people like Rajnath Singh to be promoted, while Kalyan singh removed, which brought down BJP fortune in UP.

    Other Indian malaise it is suffering from is people do not know when to leave, like Nehru dynasty Vajpayee and Adavani do not want to leave and let younger people have opportunity.

    You are right Modi and Jaitley are only two leaders with track record of success.

    What BJP needs is open a leadership convention.

    Rajeev Reply:

    Kalyan Singh lost his position due to his romance with Kusum Rai…Now Kalyan Singh is nowhere whereas Kusum Rai is still in BJP.

    Observer Reply:

    Rajiv,

    Kalyan Singh lost his position due to his justified criticism of Vajpayee.. But BJP with with Rajnath Singh , is reduced to forth party behind BSP, SP and Congress, from ruling party one time.

  • Rajiv

    BJP ( which claims to be ) a political organization, needs to be independent and dis-associate with RSS.

    RSS (which claims to be ) a social , nationalist voluntary organization, needs to be independent and disasociate with religious organization like VHP.

    Unless they do that , none of them can function properly and propogandists ( some even claim to be liberal. I guess Masood Azhar and Aurnagzeb are then the liberal heroes ) , will use any failings of one to tar all.

    [Reply]

    Ravi Reply:

    one mans truth is another mans propaganda

    The trick is not to confuse one for the other.

    Few have mastered that trick.

    [Reply]

  • Vijay Kumar

    @ Ravi

    Knowing Vinodji a bit thru the blog and thru one lovely girl works in his office ( :D ), I have a feeling repeatedly praising him to get marks wont get you anywhere with him.

    However if you were to seriously get into his good books you can curtail this fake Tajendar’s voice. He is your chotta paazi after all. This could definately build your credentials.

    Otherwise people will always doubt you are trying to punch in. Whether you secretly want to harm India and insult Hindus all the time.

    here are two strands you could follow.

    a) In case you are a Muslim, why dont you post something on how Islam truely became liberal when it interactedd with other religions in India. That it can only come out of this dark hour by following a liberal agenda which allows conversions for leaving Islam in case people want to, gives women rights. asks for a common civl code.

    b) In case you are Sikh as sometimes you claim you are. Why dont you revisit the dark days of early eighties when innocents were killed in Punjab when a Khalistani movement was launched under the patronage of teh evil Gen Zia. And how a brave officer called KPS Gill gave bullet to bullet back…

    having lived some years in Punjab during that time and also having swome relatives who became Sikhs when they arrived in India after partition I know it was a difficult time. ( some of my relatives who chose to remain in Lahore and Sialkot were forced to become Muslim just to retain their property )

    Maybe we could also dwell how the Sikh community, despite being prosperous and positive in oultook has given too much value to machismo and created the highest rate of female feoticide…

    You see Ravi, being liberal means looking at killing the devil inside. And not so much finding fualt with others…
    Maybe you also dwell on how

    [Reply]

    Ravi Reply:

    Vijay

    Repeatedly praising him, what me?

    When. I do not want to get anywhere with him or with some one else. I am happy in my skin.

    I am not a keeper of my brother; you are the one who is making me responsible for him.

    You massively misunderstand me. I am against any one being banned. If he insults chastise him by all means, but banning, censorship is not the kind of world I would like to live in, so I do not add my bassoon into the orchestra of sounds braying for his ban.

    I am not a Muslim. But I am very happy for you to continue to think that I am. What ever floats your boat mate. Keep thinking.

    I no longer even care about your abusing, should you resort to abusing me. Go ahead be my guest, each abuse belittles you just as much as it injures me. Don’t be shy, just go right ahead as they say in the US of A

    I have visited the Kahlistani , as well as the issue of Sikh riots. I am not sure what you expect me to do. Beat the drum about them.

    Both sides of my family lost all their property in Sialkot. But we gathered what resource we were able to in Delhi and got on with life. This may sit uncomfortably with your assumed image of me, which is perpetually re-inforced by B.V. Shenoy. Besides telling my better half about it and us having a laugh, I do not care. He, you and others can think what they like. I know who I am.

    Madhania hai way mere dadhia rabba
    Thiyan jamun ton pehlan hi mar janian, hai.

    I cry when I hear this version of a Punjabi Wedding song. It is on my MP3 player.

    I have mentioned about the female foeticide on this very blog, it may have missed your attention as you were probably too busy scan reading for any abuse towards Hindus I may have secretly sneaked in. Keep scanning.

    Whilst the two of us probably have more in common than others on this blog, I feel we are also the most different. I take some solace in that

    Ek shab bulbul-e-betaab ke jaage na naseeb,
    Pehlu-e-gul mein kabhi khar ne soonay na diya.

    Roonay wallon se kaho, unka phi rona roayen
    Jinko tangiaye halat ne kabhi roonay na diya

    [Reply]

    Vijay Kumar Reply:

    @ Ravi

    I have read your post. And honestly after slugging in three shots of Grants ( not my favourite) I feel that SOME Sikhs are still not honest about the one sided killlling of Hindus which took place in Punjab in eighties.

    I remember my grandmom telling me “puttar bach kar jayien…” whenever I would travel between gurdaspur and Bhatinda and Moga and nabha.

    Those are far off days. Maybe I would talk about them some other day…

    [Reply]

    Ravi Reply:

    Vijay

    I felt the same when I mistakenly ventured into a Hispanic area of Los Angeles and in Harlem in New York.

    There was not a Sikh or a Muslim in sight.

  • Mohan Ramchandani

    Digvinash Singh is a Christain ?

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Digvijay_Singh_(politician)

    [Reply]

    Rajeev Reply:

    But Kapil Sibal and Chidambaram are not…What about Antony? He seems to be a decent guy.

    [Reply]

    Gopi Thomas Reply:

    Antony is a christian from Kerala. He is not a corrupt guy; but n ot a strong admin istrator either. However, he has spoken out many times about the undue clout minorities have through organzing on religious basis; and he was ousted from the chief ministership of kerala (by Sonia Gandhi and co) because he made a statement against minorities after the brutal Marad communal riots (Hindu-Muslim riot where Muslims systematically, methodically planned the murder of hindu fishermen in Marad) — Muslim League complained to Sonia and he was sacked as CM.

    [Reply]

    Rajiv Reply:

    @Gopi,
    thats startling. Congress accuses BJP of being a communal party, while it practices the worst form of communalism. BJP needs to pay back Congress in the same coin and expose the communal likns and activities of Congress. I would hate to see, politics in India get communalized and get mired in communal accusations and counter-accusations, but Congress/Sonia.Digvijay scoundrel cabal, is leaving few options.

    Rajiv Reply:

    Christian or not , Digvijay is a first rate scoundrel. Maybe he calls himself liberal too !

    [Reply]

    Vijay Kumar Reply:

    ~~ :D :D ~~ HOW THE WORD LIBERAL HAS BEEN CORRUPTED !! ~~ :D :D ~~

    In India everyone who makews fun of the concept of India and Hinduism calls himself liberal !! :D

    The word liberal has truely been hijacked by anti nationals with an a ‘funny’ agenda. They call themselves liberal. And their only agenda seems to hurt Hindua and Indian feelings.

    SO Digviajy Singh calls himself liberal and tried to make fun of the sacrifices of the 26/11 victims and Inspector MC Sharma. Wah wah kya nautanki liberal hai !! :D :D

    Rahul gandhi may believe he is liberal because he thinks LeT is no threat !!
    Wah Wah !! kya liberal hai…

    On TV many frauds blame everything on RSS and then in the same breath talk about reserving jobs on basis of religion!! Wah waw !! kya liberal hai ! :D

    For these groups Arundhati Roy, advocating breaking India and SAR Gilani wanting Kashmir to be merged with pakistan is signs of liberalism.

    In reality true lieberals like Arif Mohammad khan, Atal bihar Vajpayee and are made fun of…

    [Reply]

    Rajiv Reply:

    If the word liberal is hijacked by scoundrels, that would make ‘liberal’ a dirty word in Indian political context. The point is , people claiming labels on themselves ( ‘liberals” ) and assigning labels to others ( sanghis ) , deserve contempt.

    Observer Reply:

    The reason is CQ Indians are aping west,. therefore Bollywood from Hollywood, and so on.

    The idea of Liberal in India is copy of word MODERATE MUSLIM in west, what it really implies is a pro-western Muslim, basically a western sycophant and against his own people. . it is not surprising that CQs . Monkeys copied the idea ,as they can only copy, they lack mental facility to think original ideas. So LIBERAL in Indian context is one who sycophant of Muslims and is against his own people.

    vinod sharma Reply:

    @nohan ramchandni
    Not, he is not a christian. he is a sindhi :) )

    [Reply]

    Rajeev Reply:

    Was that a joke?

    I know your heart bleeds for Diggi who is no more welcome in his home state.

    [Reply]

  • Gopi Thomas

    Ravi-

    As Ashish stated, people are not losing sleep over “what will happen if RSS takes over”. It is not the first, second, third,–or 10th or 25th priority for many. You seem to be concerned and worried, but that is your prerogative. I wonder why you will drag them in this blog about corruption. Is there any recent financial corruption they are involved in?

    Again as Ashish mentioned people have many other worries. I would say there are national worries – such as widespread corruption, pakistani terrorism attack, better schools (or inability to get into good schools), food price etc. Then there are local/or state specific worries, that may have different dimensions and attributes from place to place.

    I can tell you what is bothering Keralites after the last assembly election. It is not RSS or BJP; they did not win any assembly seats (of the 140 seats).

    6 seats weer added to the assembly, based on population growth in the state. Of this, 4 were added in Muslim majority Malappuram district. Malappuram’s population increased by 13.4% in the last 10 years, where as all Kerala’s population increasd only by 4.5%.

    Muslim League won all the seats it contested in Malappuram (picking up the new four seats also), increasing their seats from 7 in the last election to 20 in this election. Muslim League and its partner won 14 out of the 16 Malappuram seats.

    So Kerala populace is worried about Congress Govt (in reality Muslim league govt) dropping and delaying the terrorist cases the prior Achuthanandan CPM administration had started, they are worried about the unchecked Muslim population growth in Malappuram (that will add another 4-5 seats at the current rate), they are perplexed as to why Congress will include Kunjalikutty, the Muslim League min ister who has been involved in many cases including the death of two girls (although he was “not found guilty”) , how Congress can rule efefctively because they owe to Msulim League about 25% of the seats they won etc etc. – They are worried that Congress and Msulim League will bring Tom Tangcherry, a notorious police IG who is on suspension (based on many refractions including obtaining money from Msulim terrorists in a clandestine meeting in Dubai), back into the police force, they are worried that Saudi “madassisation” and m oney laundering will grow without any check etc etc

    [Reply]

    Ravi Reply:

    Gopi.

    I appreciate your rant against me.

    Since you seem to be allergic to accuracy, here is some evidence.

    I may be out of line with these guys but I am not alone.

    _________________________________________________________

    From Vinod’s initial write up. “5. The buzz is that the RSS and BJP are using Ramdev to whip up an Ayodhya type movement against corruption. Are such fears genuine or is the UPA merely raising the specter of a communal gang up to prevent an anti-Congress front of the kind witnessed after the Emergency in the 1970s and over the Bofors issue in the 1980s?”

    +++++

    Rajeev says:
    June 6, 2011 at 9:15 pm

    5. What is wrong if RSS/BJP are trying to take advantage of this movement? Has congress not done so in past? The political parties are suppose to look for an agenda and work on it. Does Mr.Sharma expect RSS?BJP to stay quiet and do Bhajans? On one had people like Vinod accuse opposition for not being active and when they become active, journos go on hyperdrive to muzzle voice of opposition.

    ++++++

    james Reply:

    June 7th, 2011 at 4:06 pm

    Yes Sir, I am here, aappkkeee ke sewa main…prastut hai
    But Sir, identity itnee imp nahi jitne ke views…
    I hope my recent replies to your post have at least dispelled your notion that I am a BJP/RSS sympthiser. You gave me an occassion, and I wrote against them.

    ++++++

    B.V.SHENOY Reply:

    June 7th, 2011 at 3:03 pm

    Vinodji,

    I accept your point of view. But, Sir, will you tell your readers here, how great a damage Digvijay Singh has caused to his party and government by his incessant attacks on Baba Ramdev’s personal character in the crudest manner?

    Second question: why Sonia Gandhi is still putting up with a person who is causing embarrassment for her on a daily basis?

    Third question: has this Ramdev bungling by an inept MMS government given the RSS a larger than life image, like being capable of shaking this mighty UPAII govrnment to its roots?

    +++++++

    Vijay Kumar says:
    June 6, 2011 at 11:04 pm
    @ Vinod

    This is a more balanced writeup than the stance you had taken sitting next to Shabnam Hashmi on CNN. You will agree for sure that Ramdev commands more respect all over India than Yuvraj, Sibal and Digvijay combined.

    For the crores who follow Ramdev and pranayam he is their father figure. The guy who gave them good health where medicine came to a dead end. And made complex Yoga simple and free. His sermons at the camps wer NOT COMMUNAL.

    The talk is about Bhagat Singh, Sardar Patel, a New India and swadeshi.

    THE PEOLE WHO CAME TO DELHI ALONG WITH RAMDEV DREAMT OF A CORRUPTION FREE INDIA ON SARDAR PATEL”S VISION.

    Unfortunately Digvijay Singh insulted these crores by calling Ramdev a thug. The congress and Sibal arranged a Lathi charge. Cries of rape rape RSS RSS were created thru its supplicant mediapeople.

    +++++++

    jai vaidya says:
    June 7, 2011 at 7:47 am
    Hyperbole par halla bol. The left has learned it’s lesson. It will not join any halla bol.

    This is as centrist as Vinod Sharma can get. without inviting the wrath of yhe Congress. He has mentioned the usual suspects, RSS, Modi , Gujarat,etc.

    ++++++++

    Rakesh Katyal says:
    June 7, 2011 at 10:34 am
    The events are so much similar to 1975. Mr Sharma you know it too well whenever Congress is totally insecure it has nothing else to fall back on but bring in the RSS. I also want to know English press opinion on Does the RSS have a right to raise its voice against corruption ? I think rather than

    +++++++

    B.V.SHENOY says:
    June 7, 2011 at 2:10 pm
    Friends,
    here is an interesting article by Pratap Bhanu Mehta in today’s Indian Express. Worth a look in.

    http://www.indianexpress.com/news/second-time-as-farce/800228/0

    Here is ann excerpt:

    “There is the old RSS canard. The Congress’s use of the RSS card reveals its own bankruptcy. For, in a way it is admitting that it now has nothing to offer by way of an agenda, programme, argument. All it can draw upon is the hope that residual fears of the RSS will somehow mobilise support. It is

    [Reply]

    Gopi Thomas Reply:

    You call this evidence for your drawing of RSS/BJP in this blog. A s usual Vinod imagines there is a BJP/RSS connection (because the protest is against UPA govt)..as usual, because of his congress connection, he says the “buzz is that so and so is behind this”..

    Others have questioned him on this – isnt anybody’s right to organize protest march etc..
    I do not see anybody stating that RSS is planning sabotage in the country other than you.

    [Reply]

    Ashish Reply:

    @Ravi,
    oh, okay. Now I get the context of your urge to list “10 things that are vile and despicable…”. I joined in late and missed so much fun.
    Now, while I admit I missed your context, allow me to say that you have missed the larger context too.
    You see, many of us posting comments here, are exposed to Indian TV channels where Mr Vinod Sharma is in high demand especially on nights the Congress party spokesmen decide they would rather be elsewhere. So, Mr Sharma is well known as a TV personality and his political leanings (he leans so much, he is bent :) ) are no secret.
    This tendency of Congress spokesmen, of juxtaposing “your scam” vs “our scam” and trying to divert all discussion to Modi is irksome. Many posts in this blog, refer to Vinod’s performance in some show or the other the previous night. This constant harping on BJP/RSS. Modi, Yeddi is part of standard issue of journalists and spokesmen of Congress. This is the larger context.

    [Reply]

    Ravi Reply:

    Ashish

    You are correct that I am not exposed to Indian TV and do not watch it on cable either. Simply because I don not have Cable TV in my house.

    Therefore, my submission was probably the 50th post on RSS, after every one else had had their belly full.

    My earlier point to you remains in position.

    In India, the politics is divided along the communal fault line.

    Congress – with all its faults and the occasional foray into communalism, is essentially a secular party and the opposition provided by a myriad of Sangh organisations, are essentially Hindu Supremacists.

    With that being, the case is it surprising that Vinod and other left of centre individuals harp on about the RSS and others of its ilk.

    Ashish Reply:

    @Ravi,
    I submit that the secularism preached and practiced by Congress has actually ensured that the Muslims have fallen behind even Dalits in progress in independent India.
    The proof of the pudding is in the eating; repeatedly, over 60 years of almost unbroken rule.
    Congress has succeeded in injecting the poison of communalism in the body politic (Bhindranwale in north, IUML in Kerala .. not to forget the great Karma Yogi (sorry Gopi :) )- of “hamen kuchh karna hai” who unleashed the most regressive legislation that visited any community in recent memory- the Shah Bano case.
    Congress are masters of spin- very sophisticated. All the government cultural centres and the important univs have long been populated by left leaning “intellectuals”- it will take generations to undo their influence. They perpetuate their reign- by awarding PhDs to only those that toe the line. India is hardly different from Soviet Russia in the way its history was written.
    So, when Digvijay Singh speaks, he can count on support from academics in JNU/ DU, journalists like our friend here.. outside of fringe exceptions like Prasannarajan of India Today, it is difficult to get a jounalist who takes up the right wing viewpoint.
    And, finally, the faultlines are a lot more complex than you think they are.

    vinod sharma Reply:

    @Ashish
    Anybody who attacks the RSS is a congress agent. This argument is the stock RSS argument. Why do you watch the programmes where I go? Gotten used to seeing how I
    rip apart the sanghis and their sidekicks like you? .

    Ashish Reply:

    @Vinod Sharma,
    oh, I do not watch you per se; if you get my drift. We get NDTV and Times Now at home and one has to watch something :)
    See, I knew that was coming-
    Personal abuse is the refuge of those who have no argument; but, I guess you already knew that.

    Vijay Kumar Reply:

    @ Ravi

    I still smell a conspiracy… Vinodji be naal number banan di… :D Arre yaar u will get good marks in case you shut up your HMV called fake Tajendar. Other wise “Rabba di kasam .. sialkotiyan ne puri duniya vich bade pawade paaye…”

    Get to the act of changing ur colors baby… :D

    [Reply]

    Ravi Reply:

    Vijay

    I notice that you spell Sialkot with an “i”.

    I am told that is how Pakistani’s spell it.

    Indian’s according to the recently appointed forensic linguist, spell it as Syalkot.

    On the basis of this indisputable evidence he has designated me to be a Pakistani.

    What does that bit of impeccable logic make you?

    (Dr.) B.N.Anand Reply:

    @ Vinod Sharma

    Sir

    With respect to your post to Mr. Ashish, do you not agree thatthe reverse is equally true.
    I think that is a sort of reflex reaction with both the parties. Even the person who showed the shoe to the congress leader was immediately named an RSS worker with out any facts.
    I think you must have seen tv news clip with policemen charging ladies and old men with lathis and firing tear gas shells in a close pandal. The analogy with Jallianwallah was only symbolic as in both situations, peaceful gathering of people were attacked by police without any warning.That was indeed the fascist face of the ruling party..
    BNA

  • Rajiv

    The lunacy of the scoundrel-liberal can be measured by the folliwng

    in HT , Union home minister, Mr Chidambaram is quoted to have said

    “Home minister P Chidambaram today charged the RSS with being behind Baba Ramdev’s anti-corruption campaign, saying the Sangh fountainhead had decided to support anyone raising the corruption issue. ”

    So can a liberal ( scoundrel or not ), explain whats the point Mr Chidambaram is trying to make ?

    [Reply]

    Pankaj#1 Reply:

    Precisely that is my question. why points raised by Ramdev are not being discussed instead of him being communal. OK, granted that he may be communal, but can he not raise these points in relation to corruption?

    [Reply]

  • Rajiv

    ———————————————————————————
    Pakistan PML bars Punjab interim finance minister from presenting budget, because he is christian..
    ————————————————————————————————————————————
    http://tribune.com.pk/story/184805/a-christian-and-the-punjab-pa/

    Contemptuous, craven and beneath the most elementary standards of basic human dignity. Words fail me when I try to describe the utter moral bankruptcy of the humiliating and disgraceful bow to atavistic hatreds that Punjab Chief Minister Shahbaz Sharif has just taken.

    MPA Kamran Michael was charged with tending the portfolio of finance, after Zulfiqar Khosa of Dera Ghazi Khan found the responsibility too demanding and too thankless for his political tastes. Michael had bravely taken the responsibility to manage the swashbuckling finances of Sharif’s provincial government, but a segment of the party objected to his presenting the budget speech before the provincial assembly, saying that a Christian should not be handed this honour. And now the highest elected official of the province, the chief minister himself, has given these atavistic hatreds his own stamp of approval by bowing to these demands.

    [Reply]

    Gopi Thomas Reply:

    Hehe — that means I can not present a budget there in pakistan!

    [Reply]

  • http://www.indiaandbharat.blogspot.com Shah Alam Khan

    Dear Vinod ji,
    An excellent analysis indeed. I can see that even the “regular ones” on the block have even appreciated you this time around!
    My thoughts on the events of the last week:
    Post Ram Lila ground atrocity, there are two distinct aspects to the anti-corruption protests in the country (who manufactured this distinction and why can be anyones guess). Manufactured or spontaneous, the distinction is a reality whether we like it or not; whether we accept it or not.
    The two aspects are : One, whether we accept the blatant, cruel, “police-state mentality” of the state in curbing any sort of protest and secondly do we accept babas, fakirs, sadhus, pastors et al to run the campaign against corruption with a tinge of white, saffron, green or any damn color of religion?
    I think we all are on the same page as far as the first question is concerned. There is no room for justifying whatever happened at Ramlila Grounds on that fateful night. This time it was Ramdev, another day it could be you or me. Police state is not an option in a democracy. Protests form the basis of dialogue in a democracy. We know whats happening in neighbouring Pakistan in the absence of any thoughtful dialogue.
    As far as religious color to anti-corruption protests go, this is where the contradiction becomes obvious. We all know that Ramdev’s campaign, how so ever pure and vital, was being fuelled by the Sangh Parivar with an agenda which was different than what appeared on stage. Corruption and need to fight it is by no means debatable. What is debatable in this context is the communalisation of corruption. Communalising corruption is dangerous as the the common Indian is a deeply religious being, ready to digest what ever is offered in a holy wrapping. Ironically one of the agenda of the rabid Talibanis is to establish a corrupt free (Islamic) rule in Pakistan….not very different from the establishment of RSS’s (or can I say Ramdev’s) Ram Raj in a Hindu rashtraya.
    It’s time to see the difference between the hawks and the doves in this unfolding power struggle. The Monty-Man Syndrome through which the duo of Montek & Manmohan Singh have put this country is here to stay. Protests to cure any part of this syndrome will be throttled by all available force. Whether we want to fight this as a unified, secular camaraderie or leave it in the hands of agenda setting godmen is our choice.
    Truly,
    Dr.Shah Alam Khan
    AIIMS, New Delhi
    Blog: http://www.indiaandbharat.blogspot.com

    [Reply]

    Observer Reply:

    The key issue is does inflation, corruption etc. affect only Hindutwawadis? Does it affect onlysecular minded people? does it affect only Hindus? does it affect only Muslims?

    If corruption and inflation affect everybody, there is no justification for all these groups not uniting under one umbrella to fight corruption. On the contrary, secular minded jihadist and Hindutwawadis uniting and fighting together may help reduces pervasive prejudice in Indian society. So even if they do not succeed it would have positive influence.

    Only people who should not be allowed to join are people who are agents of dynasty, trying to claim themselves as liberals, who has no interest ing fighting against corruption.

    [Reply]

  • Vijay Kumar

    @ Rajiv

    I am sure the people who barred him will be supported by Indian liberals :D

    [Reply]

    Rajiv Reply:

    Its Congress thats trying to communalize the anti-corruption agiation by calling it communal.

    In Congress eyes, if someone from VHP turns up to support Anna Hazare, that would communalize the cause.
    Bizarre and criminal logic.

    I wonder, if Bukhari of Jama Masjid, turned up at Anna Hazare’s or Ramdev’s meet, would the Congress call the movement a muslim communal movement ?

    If you can answer that , you would know, which is the real communal party in India and you need minimal IQ for that.

    [Reply]

  • Vijay Kumar

    @ Dr Shah Alam khan

    I think you are mistaken in comparing the Ramdev movement to the Taliban. And here is why

    a) He does not talk about removing any religioin which he does not subscribe to

    b) he does not use weapons, suicide bombers or any of the Taliban weapons and thought processes

    c) His was a Yoga movement whi9ch became popular becasue it had visible good effects on the poepl who got the lessons free on TV. Mostly it was secular. THough the use of Hindu imgaery could have been obejectionable to some. But he never rammed any religion theu anybodyps throat.

    At best his solutions caould be calle simplistic and impracical in the global world. When an Indian doctor migrates to the west for more money he is using globalisation to his advantage. And when a white man comes here on medical tourism he too is using globalisation to his advantage.

    To me he was a huge force in getting focus on the corruption in this Congress government. Now the Congress is using the supplicant meddiA TO DEFEAT HIM.

    Funny part is he may win. As he did against Brinda karat and NDTV.

    Then NDTV summoned the most oily Suhel Seth to debate against Ramdev. And Also got some Bengali scientist who used unparliamentary language.

    In theend polling was done.

    Funnily Suhel Seth, ndtv AND THE Scientist got only 3% of the votes. Ramdev got 97%… :D

    [Reply]

    Shah Alam Khan Reply:

    @Vijay Kumar
    Dear Vijay ji,
    Great to hear your comments…..and good to know that you haven’t changed. Your penchant for diverting issues at will is worth a praise. When we last discussed (Ayodhya Verdict) you had commented that I was comparing the Ayodhya issue to the fakir’s demand of a mosque….remember? My friend I have not compared Ramdev to Taliban. I have compared the outcome of a hindutva agenda to the outcome or rather the result in Pakistan.
    Well, your take on Suhail Seths of NDTV are well taken. I watch little of these pseudo debates on most networks (particularly Times Now). You can read my viewpoint on Indian media on my blog. I am surprised you didn’t comment on Man-Monty syndrome which actually should be the point of debate. We all should come forward to struggle for economic, moral and political freedom. What we need is vyavastha parivartan not satta parivartan.
    Good to be in discourse after a long long time.
    Dr.Shah Alam Khan
    AIIMS, New Delhi

    [Reply]

    Vijay Kumar Reply:

    @ Dr Khan

    Well I do visit your blog once a while !!

    I did come across one Dr Ejaz Alam a niero surgeon pf Ram manohar Lohia recently and for a second wondered whther he was related to you !!

    Anyway my cusade against terrorism is really personal also. I have been lucky to have escaped a bomb blast in one of Delhi’s markets some years back. I know my minor injuries were really nothing compared to what many of our soldiers face when terror reaches our shores.

    That is why I am sincelrely and truely against making light of terror which some of our politicans like Rahul and Digvijay tend to do.

    I am also truely apalled at times by the Montek manmohan partnership when it comes to health. Sure I can afford the high cost health requires in our private hospitals. But…

    Can so many of my countrymen??

    I have seen people pay upto 20-30 lakhs just to be alive…

    I feel we will meet one day somwhere !! Well if my thesis on using the structural dynamics of the Human body for designing better and more effective systems is finally accepted by IIT delhi !

    [Reply]

    Shah Alam Khan Reply:

    Dear Vijayji,
    I can understand your pain….to come alive out of a blast is understandably very very fortunate. I only hope that your project goes through in IITD. No I don’t know the gentleman from RML; in fact I have noted that ALAM is probably the commonest Muslim surname in this country more so in UP and Bihar heartland. I also know of some Alams even from Kerala…….no wonder ALAM literally means the WORLD…….true to their name :)
    It would be a pleasure to meet you.
    Truly,
    Shah Alam Khan

  • Dr Mishra, UK

    Dr Shah Alam Khan
    From a former Ansari nagar resident to the current one- namskar and welcome to the blog. Like to see this passion for anti corruption unites us all.
    Regarding comparison of RSS with the Taleban- well it is like comparing Barret’s epithelium with an oesophageal carcinoma.
    However, I respect your unease with the RSS and leave it to that rootless, out of synch organisation to get out of its rut and show the minorities that it is indeed not rabid.
    Does the BB Dikshit library still remains open till 2 am ?

    [Reply]

    Ravi Reply:

    Dr Mishra

    Getting the “ out of synch organisation to get out of its rut and show the minorities that it is indeed not rabid. Is like putting the goose stepper Nazi into the oven and hoping that it would turn out edible.

    [Reply]

    Rajiv Reply:

    Or for that matter to expect to put a liberal-scoundrel in a oven and hoping it would turn out 1/2 decent dog-food.

    [Reply]

    Ravi Reply:

    Dog is happy just chewing you

    Shah Alam Khan Reply:

    Dear Dr. Mishra,
    Great to see someone from Ansari Nagar on this blog!!! Well once I use to be a regular at this blog but couldn’t really keep pace with all the work at the Institute. Which batch are you from? What specialisation?Where about are you in UK?
    Returning back to the topic, you are correct RSS, Taliban, Jama e Islami, Bajrang Dal, etc really make me nervous. There is a very funny definition of secularism which goes around in our country. You can see Rajiv’s reply above. He thinks that I will not call it a communal agenda if Imam Bukhari visited Ramdev’s camp. He and millions of Indians don’t understand that secularism is NOT holding all religions equal; it is the ABSENCE of all religions from state functioning- political, moral or economic. It is this distorted version which governs parties like the BJP and the Congress. The appeasement of Muslims in the Shah Bano case is as blatantly communal as bringing down the Babri structure by the Sanghis. I only hope that we as a nation be mature enough to understand the intricacies and virtues of a democratic set up.
    By the way BB Dixit Library now opens even past 2AM!
    Great to be in touch.
    Truly,
    Dr. Shah Alam Khan
    Associate Professor of Orthopaedics
    AIIMS, New Delhi

    [Reply]

  • Rajiv

    —————————————
    Way beyond hyperbole :
    ————————————–
    To compare a movement , based on non-violent fasting to the violent and brutal methods of Taleban, is way beyond hyperbole.
    Its plainly indecent.

    To compare the goals of Ramdev or Anna Hazare movement , with the goals ( result ) of Taleban movement, even more so.

    [Reply]

  • http://- Rajeev

    After the veiled threat from Chidambaram, media especially NDTV-IBN-HT-TOI have changed tracked and are now calling both Anna and Ramdev Tamasha…
    There goes Indian democracy for toss…
    Gopi, Are you still proud of this condition drive threat driven democracy?

    [Reply]

  • http://- Rajeev

    Bizzare defence of Digvijay by Dilip Padgaonkar…This SOB is negotiating in J&K….
    http://www.ndtv.com/video/player/the-lead/fighting-corruption-has-tamasha-taken-over-the-real-issue/202006

    [Reply]

    Dr Mishra, UK Reply:

    It was shameful that journalists and a politician were kicking the shoe-thrower. It is doubly disgusting that Digvijay was laughing about this thuggery?
    Whither mera bharat

    [Reply]

    Rajiv Reply:

    Let me ask,

    Congress leader, Digvijay Singh, is chief guest at a function to unveil a book, by a known communal thug, following 26/11 Pakistan Govt sponsored, LeT/ISI executed massacre of Indians in Mumbai , titled
    “26/11, RSS ki Saajish”

    Given such negation of facts and such vile pandering to communal elements for political considerations , I wonder, how come , we dont have a , equally credible , book titled

    “Mahatma Gandhi assasination. Nehru ki saajish”

    I mean, you can come of with a rational, motivation and so called facts, that would sound more credible than 26/11 RSS ki saajish.

    People like Dilip Padgaonker, whose constituency is extreme , anti-Indian , regressive elements, get away with it because the opposition to the communal congress party is weak and has muddled thinking.

    [Reply]

    Rajeev Reply:

    Rajiv,
    I am now fully convinced that Saffron terror is fabrication by a group of congressis led by Digvijay. He has time and again defended Islamic terrorism and tried to deflect attention towards so called saffron terror.
    I think next non-congress govt. should investigate this political terrorist and expose him and his master.

    The Ajmer Dargah blast was very similar to blasts happening in sufi shrines across the border (pakistan). The wahabbis are indulged in attacking Sufis and I have a feeling Ajmer blast was one such blast but when blame was labelled on hindus, wahabbis backed off from further blasts as getting hindus stuck in the mess also helped their agenda.

    [Reply]

  • http://- Rajeev

    I can now see glee in the eyes of Congressi journalists who are extremely happy with Congress’s handling of Ramdev. You can see both Brakha Dutt (of Radia fame) and Nidhi Razdan doing exactly that. NDTV for me is modern day Doordarshan working exclusively for congress and dynasty.

    IBN is little subtle in its support to Congress and I feel Rajdeep Sardesai still has some journalist in him but time and again he strays and ends up supporting Congress.

    [Reply]

    vinod sharma Reply:

    @Rajeev
    Who has appointed you the media’s ombudsman you cheeky fellow? Go read the panchjanya or watch sudarshan tv if you don’t like certain newspapers and channels. Ramdev has the right to protest, Tarun Vijay has the right to spew venom but Nidi can’t say what she wants as a journalist. Is that your version of free speech. Really pathetic! You are a closet autocrat though
    I would have liked to call you a fascist.

    [Reply]

    Rajeev Reply:

    Vinod Sharma,
    Your rants don’t affect me anymore because you lost all respect when you became part of Diggi-Amar-Vinod trinity. Your journalistic career is tainted so shut up and take criticism in right spirit.

    Actually your people are fascist who paint all opposition as RSS wallahs. No wonder you worship your fascist mother Sonia.

    [Reply]

  • Observer

    Tajinder.,

    Are you saying Taliban helped build Hindu & Sikhs their temples in Afghanistan rather than force them to wear sign indicating they were Kaffirs?

    [Reply]

    Rajeev Reply:

    Observer,
    This tajender can tomorrow say that he mother was forced on by RSS and he was born…He is mental case.

    [Reply]

    Observer Reply:

    Rajeev

    I like to silence open Pakistani like Tajender the way I like to silence hidden Pakistani SHAN, the Punjabi Pakistani wolf under Hindu Bengali sheepskin.

    Tajender has not responded to my ethnic cleansing of Hindus & Sikhs from Pakistan.

    [Reply]

  • Vijay Kumar

    @ T u r d Tajendar\\

    Eeeks the t u r d is back the t u r d is back. This time Ravi u should fludh the WC ! !:D

    [Reply]

    Ravi Reply:

    Vijay

    How do you expect me to flush the WC, remember I am a super-tur-d.

    Is that not so?

    Regards

    Ravi

    [Reply]

    Vijay Kumar Reply:

    @ Ravi

    Just tell tajemdar that YOU think he is a T U R D if he posts his nonsense.

    I am 100% sure he will shut up !!

    But will you? :D

    [Reply]

  • Observer

    Tajender,

    You still have not responded to Pakistan minority issue. So I am putting that here for you.

    we are talking about Sindh and West Punjab, specifically Karachi and Lahore, hundreds of miles away from Jammu.. If Pakistanis did not murdered Hindus and Sikhs over there, they have nothing to fear, as you say, in finding the truth.

    In case of Jammu, there was flooding from Kashmir, Now are you claiming that Kashmiri Pandits in refugee camps in Jammu and Delhi is a myth created by BJP.?

    [Reply]

    Observer Reply:

    Tajender,

    You mean their case is like Jew mean rich in Gremany after Holocaust ?

    Do you know that in India Urdu is considered language of Muslims, while in Pakistan GUJARATI is considered language of Hindus. If you think every Hindu is stupid like CQs you are mistaken. We know about Pakistan as much, if not more, as you know about India.

    How about Syeed Ahmed of Rai Bareli? His attempt od using Talibani techniques to make Pathans fight Sikhs? Smart Pathans deserting thim in droves and leaving the fanatic to face the music?

    [Reply]

  • http://- Rajeev

    ‘Secret Circular ‘

    In the hand of a pakistani…. :)

    [Reply]

    Rajeev Reply:

    and that dalit MLA works for pakistanis like you…

    [Reply]

  • Rajiv

    I wonder, why the defense in the Tanwaur Hussain Rana trial in Chicago, have not called D Singh and other Congress leaders as their star witness in defense of the 26/11 accused ?

    [Reply]

    Rajiv Reply:

    Ignore the pak-i to interact with ravi and like minded liberals.

    [Reply]

  • http://- Rajeev

    A very pertinent question has been raised by Sanjay Kaul, President Peoples Action.
    Who is civil Society?
    - The one who is in NAC working under Sonia Gandhi’s direction

    or

    - The one who is protesting at Jantar Mantar and Ramlila maidan.

    [Reply]

  • Vijay Kumar

    @ Rajiv

    Will rana and headley sour America’s love afair with the jehadis finally??

    RACIAL DISCRIMINATION IN TREATING TERRORISTS. PAKISTAN[S SHOULD START COMPLAINING!! :D :D

    headley was a CIA agent and then an ISI agent. aBut he had a gori american mother and a triple wifed Pakistani father.

    Rana was a kala Paklistani.

    Rana will get a life ternm and a possible hanging. headley will get 29 yrs.

    Indian liberals should compalin of racial diswcrimination out here !!! :D :D

    [Reply]

    Dr Mishra, UK Reply:

    Vijay, if you are in India, shouldnt you be asleep ?

    [Reply]

    Vijay Kumar Reply:

    @ Dr Mishra

    Watching the Indo west indies match at 2.44, pouring in a shot of scotch every half an hour. And typing out sonmething on the net.

    It is a busy life out here !! :D

    [Reply]

    Dr Mishra, UK Reply:

    and your wife allows this ? no flying beluns a la our beloved balwinder praa

    Vijay Kumar Reply:

    @ DR Mishra

    err lucky bto be a bachelor… I am naujawan rite now. Ballu takes the beluns foir me….

  • Dr Mishra, UK

    but to be fair, I am a quite a bit disappointed by BABA RAMDEV’S suggestion of arming youth with weapons training and getting them to protect him ‘next time at Ramlila’
    He has been quite shaken up by that night and has lost his composure and direction somewhat.
    I hope he takes a week off, regroups and more importantly gets some modern media savvy advisers to modulate his image and message- from Obama to Cameron to Advani- the relentless searchlight of the media can be a very unsettling experience.
    WELCOME TO THE REAL WORLD, KARMAYOGI, THE BATTLE HAS JUST BEGUN…

    [Reply]

    Dr Mishra, UK Reply:

    sadly, with that misguided staement, Ramdev has also reminded everyone why Anna Hazare got the backing of ALL bar some nutters like Saba Naqvi who took exception to his bharat mata symbolism

    [Reply]

    Rajiv Reply:

    @Mishra,
    I agree. Ramdev looks like a novice when it comes to media management and has done severel gaffes in last few days.
    When the police came at midnight, he should have just offered his arrest. The police just intended to dump him outside Delhi so he could have availed of their trasport facility.

    secondly, todays reported statement of training youth in self defense, is ill advised. Non-violent resistence , anashan (fast ) does not go with foreful or armed resistance. Any party in power, loved armed resistance, because it has more force than anyone else.

    Congress ploy is simple. Denigrate the individual and the cause he is fighting for will die a natural death.

    I would like Anna Hazare and company to spear-head the anti-graft movement and for Ramdedv to go back to propogating and popularizing yoga.

    [Reply]

    Rajeev Reply:

    I think Ramdev meant self defence but he kind of got carried away.

    The civil society should stick to non-violent protest as armed revolution is not Indian cup of tea. I don’t think any armed uprising will be supported by majority of Indians.

    I hope we never reach the stage where armed struggle is the only solution.

    [Reply]

    Pankaj#1 Reply:

    Agree with you Rajiv.

    [Reply]

  • Pankaj#1

    Dr. Shah Alam Khan;
    yes, reading you after long time. I am happy to know that you agree with need to fight corruption in first half of your letter. In second half, you say that this protest is being organized by communal forces, RSS etc? Any evidence to this. Did they contribute money, volunteers, any group of say 2-300 RSS savyamsevaks in their conventional dress making arrangements or even as people in mufti? How many RSS people got injured after lathi charge? The people who got injured and admitted anywhere, how many of them were RSS people. Or the bogey of RSS/ VHP manning this agitation is only a figment of imagination. Or even moral support to this agitation is forbidden to them? Have they become third rate citizens of india? One of the most disciplined and selfless people are being castigated as Fascist/ violent people or what not. Any way, Why government left that space for civil society to come on street for fighting corruption, it is because, government was doing nothing for this problem since long, which was particularly seen in last few years. Saw a not so old movie- Wednesday- the message was that if government does not work, Aam Adami will take government functions in his/her hands. Resultant Chaos is responsibility of government as it did not function at first place.

    [Reply]

    Dr Mishra, UK Reply:

    Dr Pankaj, you may have inadvertently hit the nail on the head with that staement- ‘RSS.. One of the most disciplined and selfless people are being castigated as Fascist ..’
    To be blunt, maybe 1% are fascist, but they get all the publicity. The role played by the RSS in the earthquakes and in the murderous Punjab of the 1980’s when hindus were being slaughtered is all but forgotten

    [Reply]

    Rajeev Reply:

    That means RSS needs a dedicated media channel to propogate its work and views.

    Is the pro-congress biased corrupt media responsible for distorting image of RSS?

    [Reply]

    Pankaj#1 Reply:

    Rajeev;
    In my previous incarnation as resident Indian, cost of setting a channel was 1500 crore. This was 2 decades back. You have no idea, how RSS works. Neither I have. Most probably, it is local arrangement with little financial involvement. It is purely voluntary arrangement, and to the best of my knowledge, no money bag is supporting them.
    You are absolutely right, pro congress media and other vested interests, have a hidden agenda to trash RSS. The moment, I perceive, that RSS has become a fascist organization, I will be the first person to oppose them. But my experience of last few decades, tell me, that this organization is selfless, dedicated to India and its well being. just like Edhis of pakistan.

    Pankaj#1 Reply:

    Dr. Mishra;
    I am glad to know that once upon a time you were somewhere in Ansari Nagar. I lived for long in Hauz Khas and know that area pretty well. Many of the senior facuty of AIIMS were well known to me. Particularly, Dr. Gupta and Dr. Hemal in Urology. Dr. Sneh Bhargav, much senior to me, but as she was wife of Dr. Bhargav, who was my colleague in Sir Ganga Ram hospital and Dr. Dash, who was a friend of my friend. There are many more, but I will not bore you with their names.
    Yes, I agree, there may be 1-5% people fascists in RSS. Are they in majority? certainly not. Can you describe Deen Dayal Upadhyay as Fascist, who at the glory of his career, travelling second class sleeper , was , most probably done to death by a petty criminal. He was more a man in Gandhi’s mould than Gadkari, this fatso, who celebrated his son’s wedding on a very lavish scale. shame on him. I am not talking of RSS of 80s, sir, but of 40s and 50s. That was one organization, who despite of animosity of britishers, Die hard Congressis and Communal muslim league, was giving yeoman services to dispossed hindu masses. This, I am saying in all sincereity. people should understand, that I love Muslims, patriotic, talented and not so talented muslims, I have numerous times, highlighted pluses of muslim culture. but I am not ready to support communal, badmash, Muslims of tableegi jamat, owaisi, madini, Bukhari type of muslims, in the name of Secularism.

    [Reply]

    Pankaj#1 Reply:

    Tajender;
    Did not want to respond to you, but, if that is correct, shame on them. Muslims are as much Indian as any body. Minus, their extra territorial loyality and pro pakistan. Unfortunately, you sound like one.

    [Reply]

    Mohan Ramchandani Reply:

    Tajender,

    Rubbish. You are a liar. It actually happened in Pakistan when it was hit by a massive
    earthquake. Mullahs had issued a FARMAN that women should not be saved as
    it is HARAM for man to touch a woman if she is not his mother/wife. Beacause of this
    many women died who could have been easily saved .

    [Reply]

  • Vijay Kumar

    @ Dr Mishra

    we;cp,e pt india which you may have missed in ur years in the UK.

    Ramdev’s comments are basically distorted out of context by a supplicant Congress edia, especially NDTV and Hindustan times.

    hindustan times has a gr8 tradition of supportinmg the Congress as its owners dined with Mrs gandhi the originao Indira during hte licence Raj to get all the licences. :)

    While NDTV with all those seductive and not so seductive anchors is seeking revenge for the Brinda karat turned to dust in 2006 by Ramdev./ hell has no fury as a woman scarned, Dr Mishra. Especially if ur bro in law owns a channel :D

    Ramdev’s prescriptioons are simplistic. NDTV fighting a war for dumb Rahul and anti national Digvinash is more so

    [Reply]

  • shan

    Lots of posts to respond
    Lets start with Pankaj#1
    Your assertion what binds india is Hinduism and sanskrit language is not true.
    THERE WAS NO INDIA AS WE KNOW IT.It is creation of the Brits.
    But it is true the MAJORITY population is HINDU , aethist like me and Ashish , Bobby , probably Rajeev
    ARE STATISTICALLY DISCARDABLE .But this is different to saying Hinduism binds India.
    It cannot FOR THERE IS NO ONE DEFINED CREED CALLED HINDUISM.
    Different gods have differing degree of “market appeal”. Ram in cow belt , Kali in Bengal , krishna in gujrat perhaps , muragan (he is apparently krishna) in tamil nadu, Abhirimala or some mala in kerala.
    Meat with milk (garbarish) is offered by kashmiri pandits. Offering meat to god is like offering pork in EID to Vaishnavites(like mohandas from kathiawar)
    Sanskrit is a north indian language , DRAVIDIAN language have descended from different source , their scripts are different.will come back after my supper.

    [Reply]

    Rajeev Reply:

    I am no aethist. I am against ritualistic religion. I believe in God but in my own way. I have total contempt for priest class from all religions.

    [Reply]

    Binoy Hegde Reply:

    Shan-

    Murugan (one who is widely worshipped in Tamil Nadu) is Subramanya or karthikeya, son of Siva-Parvathi, brother of Ganesh. However, He may fall under the broader Shiva worship. also, Iyers are Shivites, Iyengars are Vaishnavites).

    There is no Abhiri Mala; the place you may be refrring to is Sabari Mala. The diety is Ayyappa or Manikanta, the son of Shiva-Vishnu (a mythologiical story dealing with Vishnu coming as Mohini to disrupt Shiva’s Thapas that would have destroyed the world). Again, from a statistical distribution, more people may be “Krishna” followers than Shiva followers, although there are no strict eiteher/or. The devotee going to Sabari Mala temple at the top of the hills first has to respect the Wavar temple, dedicated to a Muslim, Wavar, who was a companion of prince Manikanta.

    All the South Indian languages except Tamil have a lot of Sanskrit in the language. Kannada, Telugu, and Malayalam are different levels of mixture between Tamil and Sanskrit. The pure Tamil, “Chenthaamil” (red Tamil) is totally devoid of Sanskrit, while later versions had elements of Sanskrit when Brahmins and Books came over from north due to serial invasions.

    The original sanskrit in its live form and expertise in ALL the vedas etc is in a location in central Kerala. The vedic Namboodiris celebrate a function called ” Athirathram” which is something like the ancestral fire worship. Kerala also has the only remaining and continual (for the last two thousand years) Sanskrit theatre/performance called “Kootiyattam”.

    [Reply]

    Pankaj#1 Reply:

    OK Shan;
    Wife and daughter have gone to gym, so i have some respite from their nagging. Though, dog is still barking furiously, do not know, why?
    When you say, India was no entity as we know, this was a creation of British. It is laughable. You are talking about india as 150 or 200 years old? Even the worst enemy of India will not vouch for that. OK, if your objection to word India is concerned, should I say Bharat, will that make you comfortable?
    Now coming to North and South India, as you describe, for me India is whole india, there is nothing like North, South, West and East india. For me, thinking, philosphy, rituals, language, traditions, deities, SHARED, are more important. A Kali puja, at Kali Mandir, near belur math or rituals at Shabri malai are same. I do not feel stranger there. Language may be different, but substance is same. Shankaracharya mandir in Kashmir and Vivekanand temple/ Ashram at kanya kumari are same for me. I will feel proud of the place and will not feel that I do not belong to this place. Most of the languages, spoken in India have liberal contribution from Sanskrit, including Hindi and all the southern and northern languages. Shiva, a Dravidian God has been thoroughly incorporated in Hindu pantheon and enjoy equal status with Ram. Any where, the India, I described, say any state, I do not feel, alien. If I do not understand that language, it is immaterial. If I am a Delhiite, and go 100 kms away from Delhi, language changes and I may not understand them fully. but it does not make them less Indian. I will understand almost 90% of pakistani urdu, but that will not make me feel, I am pakistani. There are so many variables, which will make me feel at home or vise versa. I am at home in every part of present india and that is my concept of a nation, having a subterranian stream of hinduism and sanskrit. Some malayalis told me, that it is almost 40 % sanskrit words, which make Malyali language. I am not sure about it, but that is what I heard. It may take hours of discussion on this topic, but neither you have time, nor I do have.

    [Reply]

    Gopi Thomas Reply:

    Pankaj

    Malayalam may be more than 40% Sanskrit (rest being Tamil).. So also, Kannada and Telugu.

    [Reply]

    Mohan Ramchandani Reply:

    PankaJ#1

    “”There are so many variables, which will make me feel at home or vise versa. I am at home in every part of present india and that is my concept of a nation.”"

    Yes you are right. Very well said. We always feel at home whereever we are in
    India/Bharat/Hindustan .

    [Reply]

    Rajeev Reply:

    Shan,
    May be politically India was never one except for the period of Mauryan empire but culturally GREATER INDIA extended from Afghanistan in west to Indonesia in east for many centuries. Even Germany was never one country before Bismark came on the scene..Even your country UK has never been one entity.
    A country boundary may be political but in terms of cultural impact Indian cultural influence rivals that of US and China.

    [Reply]

    shan Reply:

    @rajeev,what you are talking about is a period in history where VEDIC language and to some extent culture “spread its wings” and had “influenced ” the territories you mention.
    By your logic INDIANS AND IRANIANS ARE SAME, iranians also claim their”grand culture” had pollinated indian culture. Are you aware STONE INSCRIPTION found in Afganistan extolls the virtues of SHIVA in GREEK. Greeks may have taken our BAIGAN (only white country I know which uses baigan in cooking ,the dish is MOUSSAKA) but that’s about it.
    Greek philosophy and indian philosophy , little school kid stuff that I have read is chalk and cheese
    As for UK it is one country FOR THE PURPOSE OF PASSPORT. Scots have fought the english for thousand of years , AND GENETICALLY PURE STOCK than english.English is the GREATEST KHICHRI RACE on planet earthSO ARE PEOPLE OF MODERN INDIA.
    Studies with mitochondrialDNA in delhi’s ICMG , has shown CASTE HAS NO GENETIC BASIS
    There was free movement of women marrying far afield , ENDOGAMY is a recent thing.
    The eastern half of SWITZERLAND is german speaking ,all the signboard of the shops have GERMAN CALLIGRAPHY,but I dont think people from zurich identify themselves as Germans
    I think they will be quite offended

    [Reply]

  • Vijay Kumar

    @ Dr Mishra

    India wins and I go to sleep…

    [Reply]

    Dr Mishra, UK Reply:

    you should get married, Vijay, why should we suffer alone ?!

    [Reply]

  • shan

    Next is dadaji(RAVI FROM SIALKOT)
    dadaji you seem to dig your own grave , when you say you had to leave sialkot AND YOU BLAME HINDU FUNDOOS for it. I would have thought YOUR FAMILY FLED BECAUSE THERE WERE NO HINDU FUNDOOS AS A COUNTERWEIGHT to HALAL loving FUNDOS
    Your constant CARPING about RSS undermines any valid argument you try to make , reinforces all the prejudices and preconceived notions people may have about you.
    Its like me saying all the ill that bedevils islam is due to the practice of male and female circumcision.
    it is something modern surgical practice will advice against unless there is severe phimosis or balano posthitis or BXO(its a long word).BUT CERTAINLY THAT HAS LITTLE(adhering to this practice shows regressive nature) if any if any influence on the general state of the islamic socities.

    Similarly RSS has only come to the fore in last 20yrs. If indira priyadarshini were alive RSS would not have dared to conduct “open” business elsewhere in India.
    ALSO I HAVE NO PROBLEM WITH RSS , AS MUCH I THINK IT IS AN ORGANISATION OF DUMBOS (rajju bhaiya, who wants to stop all foreign trade) BUT IT HAS EVERY RIGHT TO EXIST IN A LIBERALDEMOCRACY, JUST LIKE ALL SORTS OF RIGHT WING GROUPS “DOMINATE” the scene in WHITE WORLD.

    RSS IS A HINDU ORGANISATION , FULL STOP.JUST LIKE DEOBAND IS A MUSLIM ORGANISATION , WHICH ONE IS MORE BIGOTTED , HOW MUCH IS A PIECE OF STRING

    SO next time do not drag RSS in every discussion , IT GIVES MORE internet exposure TO RSS and less weight to your argument
    weight to your

    [Reply]

    Pankaj#1 Reply:

    OK Shan;
    Though, it looks I am quite senior to you, I will say Yaar, you are a strange person. I agree with some of your thought process and I totally disagree with some of your ideas. but that is the beauty of free thinking. I would have liked to respond to Ravi on the same line, which you are taking. Ravi says he is Siyalkoti, I know family, who write siyal as their last name. That is not the only family. I will respond to your other post addressed to me, about hinduism and sanskrit. Sound so archaic, but it is not so. Have to look after work and home as well. I will come back to you soon.

    [Reply]

    Ravi Reply:

    Shan

    Where does it say “I” had to leave Sialkot. I was born after the partition.

    Where do I blame Hindu Fundo’s for my Family leaving Sialkot.

    But please continue attacks for your own very existance here is dependant upon it.

    Imagine what I say, then attack it.

    Wah wah wah

    [Reply]

    Ashish Reply:

    Dear Ravi,
    I read this and even at that time, I thought this was perhaps a rare clumsy turn of phrase from you.

    Quote:
    Ravi Reply:
    June 7th, 2011 at 1:14 am

    Just so you know.

    My parents also had to leave Sialkot and settle in Delhi, prcisely because of Communla Thugs, Hindu supermists like you.

    Now put that in your hooka and smoke it.
    –Unquote–

    [Reply]

    Ravi Reply:

    Ashish

    I stand corrected.

    Not sure what I meant. I was at work at that moment and the blog did not have my full attention.

    Regards

    Ravi

    shan Reply:

    @Ravi(dadaji gustakhi maaf , aap ke liye samosa jalebi from sagoo and thakkar of southall

    Ravi Reply:
    June 8th, 2011 at 10:06 pm

    Vijay

    Repeatedly praising him, what me?

    When. I do not want to get anywhere with him or with some one else. I am happy in my skin.

    I am not a keeper of my brother; you are the one who is making me responsible for him.

    You massively misunderstand me. I am against any one being banned. If he insults chastise him by all means, but banning, censorship is not the kind of world I would like to live in, so I do not add my bassoon into the orchestra of sounds braying for his ban.

    Both sides of my family lost all their property in Sialkot. But we gathered what resource we were able to in Delhi and got on with life. This may sit uncomfortably with your assumed image of me, which is perpetually re-inforced by B.V. Shenoy. Besides telling my better half about it and us having a laugh, I do not care. He, you and others can think what they like. I know wht

    Ek shab bulbul-e-betaab ke jaage na naseeb,
    Pehlu-e-gul mein kabhi khar ne soonay na diya.

    Roonay wallon se kaho, unka phi rona roayen
    Jinko tangiaye halat ne kabhi roonay na diya

    [Reply]

    Ravi Reply:

    Where does this Singharda say “I” left Sialkot.

    It says my family, how did that translate into “I”.

    Ashish Reply:

    @Ravi, I guess Shan was wondering why you ascribe your family’s flight from Sialkot to Hindu supremacists..
    Cool, man! Relax.. take the chill pill., you already said you typed that at work. Let’s move on!

    Raju Kurien Reply:

    Ravi, the ISI man got caught again.. Now he is a free agent since ISI is “fixing” its internal house after bin Laden and Mehran

    Sialkott, my f–t

  • rajiv

    @Pankaj, Binoy, Rajeev etc

    —————————————————
    Whats binds India…
    —————————————————

    Here is my opinion.

    1. Democracy , federalism, plurality, secularism

    Thats the political glue that binds Bengalis, Tamils, Gujratis, Punjabis etc together.
    Their own languags and culture can prosper. There is no forced integration.
    Sates enjoy freedom . The police reports to the state administration.
    Its the comfort level that India and indians have with diversity that binds us all together, irrespective of religion, language, caste etc.
    Thats why India is more united and stronger than ever before.

    2. Hinduism
    There is no one definition of Hinduism. I am sure, my definition of it may match with no one elses and no one cares.
    This is how I understand my definition of God from Hinduism. He is formless, shapeless, infinite, omnipresent and has no gender. He permeates all creation. Since he has no image, a devotee can imagine him in any shape and form he wants and worship.
    In fact you could draw your own image of God, give it a name you desire and worship if you so desire. That would be just fine with Hinduism. In fact, you dont have to be a Hindu to attain salvation. A Muslim who lives his life well is same as a Hindu who lives his life well, as far as after-life rewards or re-incarnation is concerned.
    Hindu philosophy has given rise to other sects or religions like Buddhism, Jainism, Sikhism. Hindus look upon these religions and different religious thoughts as born out of Hinduism.
    If you read mughal literature, including Aurangzeb’s auto-biography, he refers to sikh gurus as ‘Hindu gurus’, Hindu thugs’, Hindu charlatans’ etc. Because the word Sikh was invented with the 10th guru, Goving singh.

    So tolerance and acceptance of diversity is embedded in the Hindu philosophy itself. So we don’t have wars between people who worship Durga with people who worship Krsihna or Kartick or Ganesh etc. People inherently understand, these are just facets or images of the infinite, one entity we call bhagwan.

    3. Sanskrit.
    Sanskrit and Latin are two pillars of indo-european languages. If you study words, you will be startled how similar Sanskrit and Latin are. All the north Indian languages ( from Bengali to Gujrati, Marathi, Punjabi ) are born out of sanskrit. The south Indian languages too have a generous dose of sanskrit derived words. So obviously that provides a common thread to bind all the regions together.

    However, we should always remember that its Democracy, secularism , federalism that provides the legal infrastructure to bind all Indians while Hinduism and Sanskrit prove the spiritual and cultural common denominator.

    [Reply]

    shan Reply:

    @Rajiv, Sorry mate , that is a CONTRIVED version of what binds indians.
    The reality is EACH AND EVERY LINGUISTIC GROUP/STATE in india know that if they seccede they will become bangladesh, THEY CANNOT SURVIVE ON THEIR OWN . SO SELF INTEREST binds them all , that is the reason GURKHAS want separate state but do not want to seccede,
    just like if india merged with usa it would not be for more democracy ,but for all the PHYSICAL AND ECONOMIC SECURITY

    [Reply]

    rajiv Reply:

    You are free to have your opinion and obviously its so different from mine of what binds India together, that I wont even attempt to argue. My experiencs as an Indian have moulded my opinion.

    However, make no mistake, if India had imposed Hindi on Tamils, Malayalees and Bengalis, like criminal Jinnah and his idiot-criminal state tried to force Urdu as the only official language over East Pakistan, then Bengal, Tamil, Kerela etc would have all seceded.

    Anyway, you are entitled to your what I may call fanciful opinion of what binds India.
    The irony is, the fear of becoming a ‘bangladesh’ did not stop east pakistan from seceding!

    [Reply]

    shan Reply:

    @rajiv, It is not an irony IT WAS GOOD SENSE , for EAST PAKISTAN WAS A COLONY , AT LEAST BANGLADESH IS INDEPENDENT AND FAR BETTER MATERIALLY THAN EAST PAKISTAN

  • Binoy Hegde

    Dynamism, dysfunction,corruption, civic action in india…
    NY Times today

    http://www.nytimes.com/2011/06/09/world/asia/09gurgaon.html

    [Reply]

  • shan

    @Ashish , what can i say ..CORRUPTION
    Two points in your post i will pick up. i can write a thesis on this , blog is hardly a place to discuss it seriously.
    First let me recall what the director NATIONAL AUDIT OFFICE of UK said .
    He said there is less corruption in UK because 1.people are paid reasonably 2.PEOPLE ARE GENERALLY HONEST 3. There is checks and balances(NAO SFO etc)
    Today as luck would have it ,there was a discussion in Chanel 4 news. One big shot said ORGANISED CRIME COSTS 40BILLION POUND (yes you have read it correct) per year to the exchequer in lost income. he said these people ARE HIGHLY ORGANISED , SOPHISTICATED AND POWERFUL,that is why govt is putting so much resources in SERIOUS FRAUD OFFICE TO TRACK THEM DOWN
    But India’s problem is at two levels Micro at everyday living , traffic fines , getting certificates etc.
    These can be erased in two ticks by just tweaking the system.Traffic fines should be made payable through internet . Infact I propose internet kiosk LIKE STD KIOSK , and the GOVT BABU /JANATA interface is removed.The people can pay with cash to the kiosk franchisee and he pays from his account (a bit like pay pal or paisa pay as it known in India) a charges a fixed moderate amount for service.
    Regarding cheating in your daughter’s school, this is a very very very sad state of affairs.
    This demands another LENGHTY post from me about EDUCATION system.if you are interested to know about WHITE WORLD , then feel free to ask , it will take at least an hour to reply . I have abiding interest in this I can enlighten you.
    As to the police incompetence , IT NEEDS MAJOR SURGERY.Police force like agriculture is in stone age. In calcutta , after one guy committed suicide in the cell ,police started locking up people NAKED so that they cannot hang themselves.
    The problem is WE SIMPLY LIKE TO LECTURE OTHERS ABOUT THEIR FAULTS, NEVER TRY TO EMPATHISE/UNDERSTAND WHAT LED TO THE FAULT IN THE FIRST PLACE

    POLICE FORCE IS STUCK AT THE ERA OF VICTORIA REGINA
    Just reflect the bungling at ARUSHI HATYAKAND. How much HIGH TECH is needed to CORDON THE CRIME SCENE with PAPER TAPE MARKED DO NOT ENTER.
    Do respond

    [Reply]

  • Pankaj#1

    @ Everyone;
    Tajender is more dangerous then every one thinks. Be aware. Tajender, Your thinking is so warped,that now, I am sure, you are not some weak dalit, it is all sham. I was taking Vijay’ contention that you are pakistani in the garb of Dalit, lightly. I know now, who you are, period.

    [Reply]

    rajiv Reply:

    @Pankaj,
    since Mr Sharma’s ban is not working, let the dog bark. Thats my advise to everyone. Just dont interact with the ****-i cripple.

    [Reply]

    Ravi Reply:

    One more dog in the kennel is not going to make any difference, is it.

    [Reply]

    Rajeev Reply:

    Pankaj,
    I have been on many pakistani forums in last 15 years and have seen many like Tajender and Ravi. This is their modus operandi. Do you remember terrorist who attacked Mumbai CST were wearing Kalava (hindu holy threads)?

    On a separate note, we are yet to hear Digvijay and Mullahs on this Kalava use by Jehadis.

    [Reply]

    Pankaj#1 Reply:

    Rajeev;
    not only that, they tried unsuccesfully to pass on themselves as Indians. Could not produce any sound, mimicking Indians. Came out clearly as people from pakistan. language course for them was below par.

    [Reply]

  • rajiv

    That 4 *’s stood for p-a-k-i

    [Reply]

  • Pankaj#1

    Ravi;
    Again a lie.
    In Harlem, there is nothing like hispanic areas. It used to be a play ground for gangs, mostly black gangs, but Rudy Gulliani has taken good care of it. Los Angeles’ hispanic area is infamous for gang warfare between black and hispanic gangs, but has nothing to do with sikh or hindus. white lie.
    However, in pakistan, you will not see hindus or sikhs in their traditional gears. Any comment?

    [Reply]

    Rajeev Reply:

    Pankaj,
    No point discussing anything with this propagandist. He keeps lying about himself. He is a sikh who ends up defending Islamic terrorism.

    [Reply]

    Pankaj#1 Reply:

    Rajeev;
    They think that they are very smart. They are not wise but certainly otherwise. Will never discuss things in honesty, will go back to singlr track, producing same noise all the time.

    [Reply]

    Ravi Reply:

    Pankaj

    Where did I say that there were Hispanis areas in Harlem.

    You can not read.

    You are so eager and keen to score points against me that you imagine I lie then you go on an attack it.

    No wonder I have no desire to interact with you.

    You will not know honesty if it rolled over you.

    [Reply]

    Pankaj#1 Reply:

    It is both ways Ravi.
    Just for record: Vijay

    I felt the same when I mistakenly ventured into a Hispanic area of Los Angeles and in Harlem in New York.

    There was not a Sikh or a Muslim in sight.
    Do not say it is semantic and I can not read. You have already employed this argument recently.
    Good bye.

    [Reply]

    Ravi Reply:

    You definately can not read.

    I suggest, “eats shhots and leaves”. You will enjoy it.

    Good Bye

  • http://- Rajeev

    Just for comic relief, this song is an ode to Jinnah (it MAY remind you similar song on Gandhi). By the way main child artist is same in both Indian and Pakistani movies.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IdpH69irLfk&feature=related

    [Reply]

    shan Reply:

    @rajeev, poor pakistanis ,uske rahem kar .
    They also made BOBBY AND DEVDAS in pakistan with pakistani artists

    [Reply]

  • http://- Rajeev

    There are two versions of song from film Jagriti and Bedari.
    Jagriti version-
    [[[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4E09twioyfs]]]

    Bedari version (pakistani)-
    [[[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zc_aqd2ZIA0]]]

    I am pretty sure 99% of INDIAN muslims will be comfortable with Bedari (Pakistani) version of song. What does that mean for rest of the Indians? For me it means Indians muslims share their history with pakistani in which hindus are eternal enemy.

    [Reply]

    Pankaj#1 Reply:

    Yes, it is surprising;
    how they could get the same child artist. looks almost same. Difficult but not impossible to find a double. Pradeep’s immortal song has been parodied. Many Indian songs have been copied in this manner. Says lot about counterfeit operations in pakistan including Indian currency notes.

    [Reply]

    Rajeev Reply:

    Pankaj,
    The producer-director and child artist in Jagriti were muslim who MIGRATED to pakistan and produced same film again as BEDARI keeping pakistani Islam as central piece.

    I am just trying to show that muslims have tendency to jump over to communal side in no time. Most of the Indian muslims are exactly like that.

    [Reply]

    Pankaj#1 Reply:

    If that is so, then it is very unfortunate. As, in my childhood, this was the film, which was one of the best Children films. I am saying unfortunate, not because it was produced by a muslim, but, then the same producer, left for pakistan and such a beautiful film was not made by conviction but was a jugglery to earn money from Indian masses.

  • Gopi Thomas

    Ravi-

    I do not understand how you can say, of all the parties, congress is less communal and others are more communal. (I do not have any issue in any party being communal or representing a community, because democracy works and organizes in diff ways).

    Congress formed a partnership with Muslim League in Kerala and Tamil Nadu. Muslim League stands for only Muslims’ interests, at times against natioanl aspirations. So, isnt congress being communal here?

    [Reply]

    Dr Mishra, UK Reply:

    INDIA- HOW OLD IS IT ?
    ———————–
    HOW OLD DO YOU WANT IT TO BE ? How large is the canvas of your mind? How well read are you?
    If you follow Nirad Chowdhury, then you can say the anaemic- India is a creation of the british. But like Dr Pankaj says, that is a laughable idea.
    Or if you follow Nehru’s Discovery of India or Amartya Sen , then your India grows.
    It is immortal- stretching all the way back to Nalanda and Takshila, to Mohenjodara and Harappa, to the origin of zero and perhaps the decimal, to Aryabhata telling the world that the earth is round and revolves around the sun.
    IN 490 AD.
    A lot bound us, from the north to the south, whether it was our religion, our languages or culture.
    And like a phoenix from the ashes we rise again. Indians, with a very strong hindu flavour in our culture, no matter what religion we belong to.
    A flavour that is enriched by all, and should threaten none.

    [Reply]

    Dr Mishra, UK Reply:

    INDIA-AN IDEA
    ———————
    But as India emerges from its long slumber, it discovers a lot of weeds, anthills and brambles in its garden. And two of the biggest anthills are CORRUPTION and POPULATION EXPLOSION, both interlinked.
    And while the majority of bloggers here, all well educated and comfortable if not affluent, blog, just blog- there is an elderly Gandian and a school dropout yogi who is also a CEO, who are in this 40 degrees heat attacking this anthill.
    That is my India, eternal, and if people get threatened by the ‘hindu yogi’ symbolism or the backdrop of ‘bharat mata’, then we have a long way to go yet.
    And to you my friend, India is indeed a petty creation of but a couple of hundred years old.
    To me it is bharat varsha, hindustan, it is AR Rehnman’s ‘maa tujhe salaam’……

    [Reply]

    Pankaj#1 Reply:

    Dr. Mishra;
    Your imagery is enviable.

    shan Reply:

    By the same token GERMANS AND ENGLISH are same , same colour of skin , same protestant religion , OLDE ENGLISH language derived from OLD GERMAN.same fondness for sausage only it is called wurst in german ,SAME DISCIPLINE as contrasted with spain /portugal/greece/italy
    Try telling this to margaret Thatcher who remarked after meeting Helmut kohl “Oh he is so german!!!!”

    [Reply]

    Balwinder Sandhu Reply:

    very well said , Mishraji “”"And to you my friend, India is indeed a petty creation of but a couple of hundred years old. To me it is bharat varsha, hindustan, it is AR Rehnman’s ‘maa tujhe salaam “”"
    personally I favour Gurdas Mann’s ‘boot polishan kariye’ , and this bulky sardar can still teach a move or two to the gabru jawans. I also luv going to these shows to have a laugh at all you brahmins, and bongs and gujjus and south Indians trying to dance the bhangra
    and having insulted Ashish, Shenoy, Mishraji and some chandani etc, I withdraw hehe

    [Reply]

    Ashish Reply:

    @Balwinder Sandhu,
    just how did you insult me? I am seriously at a loss.

  • Dr Mishra, UK

    Dr Shah Alam Khan
    My question about BB Dikshit library to you got lost in the sea of posts by tajender.
    Tajender kabhie to ek break liya karo.
    @dr Pankaj, yes- Dr Sneh Bhargava, Dash, Hemal etc- I know them well. They were my colleagues and teachers.
    Did you ever attend the PULSE festival ?

    [Reply]

    Pankaj#1 Reply:

    Unfortunately, No.

    [Reply]

  • Mohan Ramchandani

    A combination of an educated, iteligent and jihadi is very very dangerous.
    Ex. OBL. We have one such perosn on this forum. Beware of him . Please dont
    engage with him .

    [Reply]

    Observer Reply:

    @ Mohan Ramchandani

    Yes. Like Zulfikar Al Bhutto, Imran Khan and saiyyed Naqvi of Pakistan.

    Because their moral standards are that of Goebbels. Goebbels thought killing done by Russian Army in East Prussia were barbarism, but was silent or supportive of mass murders carried out by German troops in Russia. Reminds me of Tajender.

    [Reply]

  • Praveen Saxena

    Mr Vinod Sharma
    Just Read on the internet , thought I should let u know. The Govt is planning to provide old age pension from the age of 60 years.Earlier it was 65 years.

    [Reply]

    vinod sharma Reply:

    @Praveen Saxena
    I am 55. Have still some time to go. You take the benefit and organise some old age home accommodation for yourself to spare others at home the boredom of your presence. :) )

    [Reply]

    Praveen Saxena Reply:

    But u stand to benefit before I do. As for people at home they are now a little hopeful that ‘Seperated at Birth” may be their saviour.

    [Reply]

    Rajeev Reply:

    Praveen,
    Mr.Sharma doesn’t need pension or old age home. He will probably live in AICC office and as far as money is concerned, both Diggi and Amar will take care of Vinod.

  • Mohan Ramchandani

    This is from our peaceful neighbours

    http://tribune.com.pk/story/185179/targeting-minorities-no-friend-to-ahmadis-in-faisalabad/

    [Reply]

    Rajeev Reply:

    Ahmadis try to present themselves as true muslims by behaving as Kuttar muslims.
    I guess they deserve it…They have chosen slavery of Islam.

    [Reply]

  • B.V.SHENOY

    I think this pest known as Tajender-tur.d2011 has finally been killed by spraying it with a mixture of Endo-sulfan and gomootra heated to 45 degree celsius through the rear *******.

    One more to go.

    [Reply]

    Raju Kurien Reply:

    Vinod-

    I have disagreed with you on several items; however, I want your blog to survive as a vibrant forum for pros and cons of the issue you presented. This tejender will destroy your blog with his constant rantings on brahmins, jews, dalits, christians, westerners , aryans, caste….

    [Reply]

    Observer Reply:

    Tajender,

    Ha kintu tum khud such nahi bolenge.

    [Reply]

  • Vijay Kumar

    @ Shenoy

    These ISI pests are like VD and cockroaches!! :D

    You need to keep guarding yourself against these T U R D S !

    [Reply]

  • B.V.SHENOY

    “@BV Shenoy
    If you don’t like the comment,. ignore it. That is the way to deal with it. You never uttered a word of protest when even my parentage was questioned on this blog. On the contrary you lauded the fact of those comments being allowed to remain here. Now you are trying to set the agenda on a blog that is not yours. I will resist and not allow that to happen— without meaning to support any abuses of the religous kind hurled by anyone, incluidng your fellow travellers”

    Vinodji,

    you are wrong. Both Vijay Kumar and I had advised Rajeev to restrain himself and NOT to use abusive language. In fact, my advice drew an avalanche of abuses directed at me from Shaalu/Malu/Deepak/James/Eena/Meena etc

    If you go back still more, you had warned Rajeev that you are more than a match to him in the use of objectionable expletives. However, most of us on your blog had felt sad and also sorry that ugly spats were going on.

    Now, Vinodji, please let me know what agenda I have tried to set on YOUR BLOG? An accusation of this nature will carry weight if backed by proof.

    Speaking for myself and my “fellow travellers”, most of us have always strived for decency in the language used, despite provocations from two terror-sympathisers to whom you had given almost a free run of YOUR BLOG

    [Reply]

    vinod sharma Reply:

    @BV Shenoy
    Your agenda is to show everybody who attacks saffron as a Pakistani or a Congress agent. You use this forum to propagate all that we have already heard from your ideological minders. You supportively advise one abuser of hospitality and demand that the other be thrown out. Your hypocricy is evident from your comment “….Most of us on your blog felt sad and also sorry that ugly spats were going on. ”
    Crocodile tears really.

    [Reply]

    Pankaj#1 Reply:

    Vinod;
    I am sorry, that you are being unnecessarily harsh on one of the best blogger here. When you can not/ do not ban others, who use vilest language, have total anti indian mindset and have come here just to sink this blog. The most charitable view, I can have is that, you like Shenoy and feel dejected by his irreverance. correct me, if I am wrong.
    @ Shenoy Sahab;
    please avoid personal combats, leave it to younger generation. Your presence here as an adviser and ideologue is more important.

    [Reply]

    B.V.SHENOY Reply:

    Vinodji,

    ghadiyali ansoo bahaane ki kya zaroorat padhi hamein? You have given us all the freedom and some more, to say what we like and what we don’t like. I believe that one needs ideological minders when he is required to say only what is given to him. Here most of us say what we want to say and when we feel strongly about anything.

    The shoe is actually on the wrong foot. In your case, you have to submit your writing to the strait jackets imposed by your paper as well as the party which you are supporting, which also means its “leaders”, while we have no such constraints.

    Therefore, Vinodji, forget about all agendae and let us get on with the mutual recrimination only for which we love your blog and we most certainly love you. Hkuda kasam

    [Reply]

    B.V.SHENOY Reply:

    Typo” Khuda Kasam

    Rajeev Reply:

    Vinod,
    You started it with the casteist abuse. You are just like your friend Amar Singh..a class liar.

    I may not agree with your ideology but that doesn’t mean that you make casteist remark. You have repeated called me ‘Yadav’ as an insult. As I am a non-casteist like you, I don’t care about caste but you showed your ugly casteist face.

    You support congress not because of ideology but because Congress is party of PANDIT jawaharlal.

    Next time you start complaining to others, explain the full context. I ripped you apart in your kind of language. Now that is over, I expect you to behave in a civil manner.

    [Reply]

    Rajeev Reply:

    Vinod,
    No matter how much you provoke me, I’ll not reveal my caste to a fascist like you.

    [Reply]

  • Gopi Thomas

    I have wondered that Congress govt is stupid to shoot the messengers of anti-corruption drives, But, may be, their leaders are smart 1) They do not care about long term viability as a party and want to make as much as possible in the short term , they know that the prospect of corrupt parties are limited in this emerging India of citizen watchdogs2) They want enough time to rearrange the hoardings they and their buddies have made (it may be trillions who knows) because they know that eventually they or the successive govts will be forced to conduct detailed inquiries

    They will deploy all their inside capabilities – they have also started playing with “delegitimization” touching on India’s class/caste divide – Anna is only a “militarry driver” , Ramdev is “illiterate” –

    [Reply]

    S Singh Reply:

    Gopi-

    Well, as you know we are now clsoe to Israel. Israel is the master of “delegitimization” approaches. They delegitimize all palestinian leaders, also Obama, and an ybody who opposes or criticize them

    [Reply]

  • Balwinder Sandhu

    @ ASHISH, it was a light hearted comment on th TOTAL INABILITY of all non Punjabis to dance the bhangra
    this baisakhi, we had played ‘Amplifier’ by the punjabi Imran Khan and it was laughable seeing the genteel gujus tring the bhangra
    We also saw a puny man clutching a copy of Marlowe and Shakespear eyeing our gabru jawan punjabi males on the dance floor- we threw him out- he was so bad. He started ranting at us- I am a doctor from KENT, he said. We thought he looked like a porter from Tashkent more like.
    I think his name was shan or khan , i have forgotten now
    hehe

    [Reply]

    Ashish Reply:

    @Balwinder,
    may I suggest that you and Shan lay off each other? Here’s my offer- take my trip instead. I have a very thick skin and promise to never take offence.
    As you know, I am a Bengali too. So, you won’t have to change your stock of bong jokes- just replace Shan with Ashish; how’s that?

    [Reply]

    Ashish Reply:

    @Shan,
    likewise; you can always take my trip instead of Balwinder’s – having spent almost 30 years in Delhi, I am almost an honorary panjoo; you can also freely call me a cow-belter, khotta or whatever..

    [Reply]

    shan Reply:

    @Ashish, Thanks for the advice , but I have decided to quit . Engaging with these dimwits is doing no good to me . I thought I have lot to pass on to my fellow countrymen ,but as they say Do not cast pearls….
    Anyway before calling quits let me tell you about all those illegal construction of floors with seeking permission and then getting regularised retrospectively.THIS LAW IS NOT INDIAN, nothing is , IT IS A BRITISH LAW STILL IN EXISTENCE IN UK. I know because I am trying to erect an extension to the rear of my house since 2004!!! still fighting with the council.
    These are extreeme measures and it says clearly if found to be in conflict with laws those construction will be pulled down.
    HOWEVER FAR SIMPLER AND AS IS DONE IN UK ,

    THE PLANNING PERMISSION CLEARLY SHOULD STIPULATE THAT YOU CANNOT BUILD ANY MORE STOREYS.
    That is what is done , mine one that was approved stipulated quite a few CONDITIONS, violet them and it will be pulled down.
    Though some amount of backhander may be used in UK where there is asian councillors.
    I used work in a hospital , most of the dept manned by pakistani and indians . as usual infightinng indiscipline , disorder. One black guy from nigeria said
    MR ….. You need a WHITE MAN’S GUIDING HAND TO RUN THINGS SMOOTHLY
    Bidaye Bondhu
    bidaye Anindo

    Rajeev Reply:

    Ashish,
    How many times have you seen Balwinder posting on the topic?

    [Reply]

  • Raju Kurien

    Old people die man– he was 96

    [Reply]

  • Observer

    I would like add a joke from Malayasia

    If you see few people working they must be CHINESE.
    If you see few people arguing they must be INDIANS
    If you see few people sleeping they must be MALAYS

    I consider Chineses and Malays smarter in terms of results. Working is good for making money, while sleeping is good for health. Intellectually I had not realized any benefit of arguing. But there must be some benefits of arguing, otherwise people would not be doing it, particularly educated ones.

    Therefore, I tried these blogs and I have to say that it has the effect of HALLUCINATING DRUGS., may be it can be good for a retired person, who does not have any other hobbies or interests. I would rather spend my spare time with family, friends, drinking, golfing, traveling and reading and also trying something new.

    [Reply]

    shan Reply:

    typical response of a pakistani allegiance person. ARGUMENT is abbhored in one particular religion.
    Have you heard of dialectics ,THESIS ANTITHESIS SYNTHESIS

    [Reply]

    Observer Reply:

    Shan,

    I have to say that even though you are Punjabi Pakistani Muslim, you are playing your role of Hindu Bengali well. But like a well assimilated foreigner can be detected by some minor accent, which only keen observers can notice, i am 100% sure that you are of Punjabi Muslim origin.

    But being free of prejudice that pervade third world, I have no problem you being Punjabi Muslim. I have issue with you only because you are trying to get Hindus addicted to ideas which had made them the receiving end of worst of both worlds, while pretending to be one of them. I have no issues with Tajender or Ravi as they are only using Hindu names, but they are not hiding the fact that they are not Hindus.

    [Reply]

    shan Reply:

    %$£!&^?:;@ 420

  • Vijay Kumar

    :D :D ~ JOKE OF THE DAY ~~ EUREKA ~~~ BREAKING NEWS ~~~ JOKE SUNO BHAIYA ~~ :D :D

    The foreign Minister of India — the one who got trampled by the Pakistani Tur-d called Shah Mehmood Qureshi– Shri SM Krishana has declared his assets. And he claims he has only 15 lakhs of rupees !!! :D :D :D

    Wah WAH WAH !!! :D

    He is the same guy who as CHife Minister distributed Banglore land to his own family and “friends”

    He is the same guy who owns the Coffee cafe day chain,,,,

    He is the same guy who found government accomodation not fit for his standards and stayed in a penthouse of hotel Maurya and spent 44 lakhs in three months. This he said, he would pay from his own pocket !! :D

    Whah… ! with 15 lakhs he can do a lot !! :D :D

    Nobody in the press will give scrutinise Krishana’s assets and his declaration.

    In contrast NDTV and all the papers will swoop on Ramdev who is making a rightful audited declaration of the 600 crores his trust companies own. And who he pays all his taxes.

    Soon the Congress sycophantic media will start their “HOO HAA 600 crores campaign…”

    MAN WE NEED THE LOKPAL BILL SOON. GO FOR IT ANNA

    GO FOR IT RAMDEV !!

    [Reply]

    Paritosh Reply:

    i really dont thing that the Congress is gonna let the bill come into existence , or else it will be their version of the same

    [Reply]

    Paritosh Reply:

    typo “i really dont think” instead of “thing”

    [Reply]

    Rajeev Reply:

    Poor Sonia and Rahul don’t own a Car…Can there be bigger joke than this?

    [Reply]

    S Singh Reply:

    In that sense, Jagan Reddy showed courage and honesty – He did declare that his assets have grown from Rs 3 crores to 400 crores or so in three – four years . (evcen if there are another umpteen crores slashed awasy — the boy is courageous (or “in your face”) when he declared such a huge increase …(may be he paid taxes properly..I do remeber reading somewhere he paid some 30 crores in advamnce income tax or something like that…

    Jagan is going to route Sonia congress in the next election..His congress opponent lost the security deposit

    [Reply]

    Rajeev Reply:

    I think Congress in AP is more or less going to face defeat if TDP and Jagan join ranks but Jagan’s background is a big problem. Some of my friends who know him tell me that he is more corrupt than his father and much bigger goonda. I think such elements should not be entertained by any party even if it means political defeat because such people are bound to hurt you in long run.
    The perfect example of this is Congress-DMK tie up.

  • Vijay Kumar

    @ Rajeev

    Lagta hai Mr Q akele akele saara gulabjamun khaa gaya…. :D

    These sort of declarations as done by SM Krishana who gifted away thousands of crores of land are a joke.

    we surely do need a LokPal now…

    [Reply]

    Rajeev Reply:

    Kuch nahi,..sab maal madam ke paas safe keeping mein rakha hai…

    [Reply]

  • http://- Rajeev

    Vijay,
    You bet Vinod Sharma will defend SM Krishna (till he is in congress) whatever the case may be. These politicians ask everyone else to disclose assets and when they are asked to do it, they turn the whole exercise into a farce.

    We need a dedicated Lokpal just for politicians and one for others.

    [Reply]

    vinod sharma Reply:

    @Rajeev
    Hello, hello,hello …..aap kahan sey bol rahe hain. Gujarat se, Jhandewalan se, Ashoka Road sey ya mental hospital sey. Haridwar kyon nahin gaye. Wahan eik bada Yadvon ka leader nimboo pani aur honey maang raha hai. Wahan jao aur uske pair dabao. Kuch dhan arjit ho jayega.

    [Reply]

  • http://- Rajeev

    MF Husain died due to Heart attack at the age of 96.

    Was he masturbating in the name of Madhuri Dixit or Amrita Rao when he died? Even Osama died watching porn… Digvijay’s ‘JI’…Digvijay addressed Osama as his digvijay was Osama’s male wife.

    [Reply]

    S Singh Reply:

    uncalled for….

    [Reply]

    Rajeev Reply:

    Which comment is uncalled for? MF Hussain or Digvijay’s?

    [Reply]

    S Singh Reply:

    MFH masturbating about ms Dixit

    Rajeev Reply:

    Mr.Singh,
    But you must admit, Mr.Hussain was a class Thurki. Who inspired him to go after females fit to be his great-great-great grand-daughters? There is something called Sunnat…

    vinod sharma Reply:

    @Rajeev
    Do you support Ram Dev because he is a Yadav?

    Pankaj#1 Reply:

    Rajeev;
    Please be respectful to dead people.

    [Reply]

    Rajeev Reply:

    Is world respectable to dead Stalin or Nixon? Hussain doesn’t deserve respect as far as I am concerned. I don’t believe in Indian concept that dead should be respected. The only thing that matters is the action of dead people. I’d never respect dead Rajiv Gandhi for what he did to sikhs in 1984. Rajiv Gandhi stands convicted for 1984 riots.
    If Modi is convicted for 2002, he also doesn’t deserve respect.

    [Reply]

    Pankaj#1 Reply:

    OK, please do not be absusive to them. is this better?

    Rajeev Reply:

    Pankaj,
    Does that include Osama also? :) Sure…I’ll let MF Hussain RIP.

    Observer Reply:

    It would have been good if in his final act of courage he had drawn nude figures of Islamic icons. Then he would have been remembered worldwide for his courage.

    In that case our CQ monkeys would have run in all directions away from his legacy.

    [Reply]

    Observer Reply:

    @Tajender

    He is not Hindu.

    In Islam sexual relations with children are allowed. should I give examples? How would you feel if some Hindu would come and have relationship with one of your 8 or 9 year niece? Would you accept his explanation that it is allowed in Islam so it is OK?

    [Reply]

  • Rajiv

    @Vijay,
    Very valid points regarding SM Krishna and Ramdev.

    I hope the media submits the declarations of assets to close scrutiny.

    Sonia and Rahul will cvontinue to live off party funds, financed by industrialists.

    Regarding Ramdev, he has taken great personal risk by his campaign against black–money and tax evasion, because the FBI and Congress and all its government agencies are workking over-time to find any wrong doing on part of his large business and/or implicate him any trumped up charges.

    The easiest thing for Ramdev personally would have been to keep quiet and as athey say ‘bera ban kay pera khao’.

    [Reply]

  • http://- Rajeev

    I think all journalist of all kinds should also declare their assest plus the gifts they keep getting from political parties.

    [Reply]

    Rajiv Reply:

    How about Mr Vinod Sharma, who sits in judgement of the Congress opposition , while having a congress govt. paid car at his disposal as the ( believe it or not ) ‘representative of Hindus in the minority commission of the Govt of India’ ( yes , reality as they say, is starnger than fiction ) , declaring his assets, free-tickets, dinners, gifts, income etc ?

    Oh , I guess he is busy investigating Ramdev and Yeddy.

    [Reply]

  • Rajiv

    On a different note, the jury id deliberating on the fate of pakistani Tanawar Rana Hussain, in Chicago.

    Daood Gilani has already accepted his role in 26/11 killings. The role of Tanawur Rana Hussain ( TRH ) is mirky, as far as how much knowledge he had about the Mumbai killings.

    As you may know, TRH is a doctors in Pak army for severel years and when he was posted / transferred to Siachen, he fled Pakistan and has been declared a deserter by the Pak army. He could never viosit pakistan again as he would be arrested if he returns to pakistan and has been pleading with pak army , through Daood Gilani’s contacts in ISI to give him a honorable discharge.

    The evidense, presented at the trial, reveals that TRH was aware of Daood Gilani’s involvement in terrorist activities in conjunction with ISI/LeT, but the evidense is not clear about if TRH had information about the Mumbai attacks. So it would be intersting to see how the jury decides.

    If he is exonerated, it would be used by the pak/isi/LeT as a handy propoganda tool.

    For me, the primary use of TRH is to find out who major Iqbal of Pak army is, because TRH wife in an interview referred to Major Iqbal as a family friend.

    [Reply]

    Vijay Kumar Reply:

    @ Rajiv

    India is not showing the will to use this Rana trial to tar Pakistans name in the international community. A huge huge mistake,,,

    [Reply]

  • Rajiv

    @Mr V Sharma,

    Can you please enlighten your readers, about your contribution, as the Congress appointed “representative of Hindus” in the minority commission ?

    ( No, I dont expect an answer, because given the fact that you are just a tool in the congress propoganda machinery, I suspect, your any contribution as a representative of Hindus in minority commission, can only be suspect, negative and damaging. )

    [Reply]

  • http://- Rajeev

    Here is a great article by MJ Akbar on internal politics of Congress…Worth reading-
    http://www.sunday-guardian.com/analysis/party-singh-vs-government-singh
    Party Singh vs Government Singh

    Prime Minister Manmohan Singh with Congress general secretary Digvijay Singh during the Bundelkhand Congress Workers Convention, in Bina last month. PTI
    as the time come for the Congress high command to issue notices to Prime Minister Manmohan Singh, his virtual deputy Pranab Mukherjee and his principal interlocutor for officially unofficial dialogue Kapil Sibal, for gross violation of discipline? If it cannot muster up the courage to censure its own PM, it could always expel general secretary Digvijay Singh. The party Singh wants to send Baba Ramdev to prison or perdition, whichever is nearer. The government Singh believes that acrobatic subservience by four ministers in the VIP lounge of Delhi airport, rather than within the more private environment of a drawing room, before the crusader-Baba, is the way forward to an honest India in which every politician glistens with moral fervour, and anyone giving or taking a bribe gets the noose he deserves.

    It must be the summer. The government’s brain has melted. Whatever else may be your view of Baba Ramdev, you have to be a bit soft to believe he can be bribed by flattery. The Baba has not risen from a bicycle in Haryana to a private jet by being gullible. He is playing for much higher stakes.

    The Prime Minister had two options when confronted by a “fast unto death”. He could either negotiate with a man who had everything to gain by confrontation; or he could have gone over Baba Ramdev’s head, as it were, and spoken directly to the India that was lining up in support of the Baba, not just in Delhi but in every small town. Better still, he could have done both; negotiate at a minimalist level, and address India’s core concern comprehensively, decisively. The multiple negotiations with Ramdev have not only raised the latter’s stature in public life, but also ensured that the credit for any decision will go not to Dr Singh’s government but to the man who generated a midsummer day’s thunderstorm.

    Pressure is guaranteed to ensure mistakes in decision-making. Dr Manmohan Singh would have handled pressure from Opposition parties, but is unable to deal with parallel stress from two different, but inter-linked points. The anger of the people has derailed governance. But his most difficult challenge is neither from the people nor from a crusader; it is from a faction within Congress that derives its power from proximity to Mrs Sonia Gandhi. Digvijay Singh is the main spokesman of this faction, which is why he has the freedom to offer a continuous stream of alternative policy advice, on every matter from Assam to Kashmir, depending on the news of the day. Digvijay Singh has done more to weaken the authority of Dr Manmohan Singh than anyone else; and a mute Prime Minister’s helplessness before this onslaught only confirms the power equations within today’s Congress.

    Mrs Sonia Gandhi has also empowered her parallel Cabinet, the NAC, which believes that Dr Singh’s Cabinet and Parliament should listen to its instructions. Some of its members specialise in pomposity when they are not heckling the Prime Minister. The strategy is transparent: to snatch credit if the government does anything right, and turn stridently accusatory if the government makes a mistake.

    he BJP has to do nothing to destabilize the Manmohan Singh government, which is crumbling under the pressure of internal contradictions. Opposition parties need to do nothing except wait. Once upon a time they did not know how to. Now they have learnt.

    Inevitable question: how long can a dysfunctional government totter around? Technically, forever [caveat: forever comes in 2014, the year of the next scheduled general elections]. The mathematics of this Parliament works in favour of the establishment. M. Karunanidhi may publicly rue the poor choice of friends he has made, meaning the Congress, but politically there is nothing he can do. Potential new allies are in no hurry to touch a DMK toxic with corruption charges. Regional animosities in other states create a curious algebra. It would take some catastrophe, for instance, to bring Mulayam Singh Yadav’s SP and Mayawati’s BSP on the same side of the voting platform in Parliament. But is this impossible?

    Dr Manmohan Singh’s government is not in any danger of being washed away by some sudden flood or devastated by an earthquake; its foundations are being eroded by inbred worms. Dr Singh is flashing a sword, slashing the heart of a former Cabinet colleague here, breaking the arm of a private sector executive, which makes for temporary political theatre. What he needs is very powerful pesticide, to be sprayed at home. The disease of corruption is not limited to enemies or allies who might have become dispensable. The Congress seems to believe that it can get away by speaking in multiple voices, each customised for whichever audience is in the hall.

    Baba Ramdev has a significant advantage over the Congress in this test of wills. He has nothing to lose. The Congress does: it could lose power.

    [Reply]

  • http://- Rajeev

    Of late politicians and their media servants like Vinod have been asking people to stick to their profession and not indulge in politics.

    So can I ask Shahrukh and Shilpa Shetty, what are they doing in cricket when they should be doing dance sequence in bollywood?

    What are Sharad Pawar and Rajiv Shukla doing in ICC and BCCI?

    What is Rahul Gandhi and his Jiju Robert Wadera doing in business when they should be confining themselves to looting nation oops..I mean politics?

    Why are so many journalist in politics and run media channels as business?

    [Reply]

    Rajiv Reply:

    … and what is Mr Vinod Sharma, a congressi reporter, doing as “Representative of Hindus” in the minority commission ???????

    [Reply]

    Rajeev Reply:

    Vinod Sharma representing hindus in minority commission is MS Gill representing sikhs.

    [Reply]

    Rajeev Reply:

    Tajender,
    What do you say about corruption in your pakistan? Is that too because of hindus, zionists etc.? Your leaders made money in Hajj scam just last year.

    Rajeev Reply:

    They are not your leaders…so who are you always defending here?

    What about Gaddafi and Saddam’s corruption or Hosni Mubarak’s? Were they too hindus or under influence of hindus for 3000 years?

    Can you accept that they were corrupt because they followed Quran?

    Rajeev Reply:

    I didn’t know Zardari was Brahmin. Thanks for educating us that all muslims are closet brahmins.

    [Reply]

  • Rajiv

    @Rajeev,

    Mr M J Akbar’s piece, explains a lot when Mr MJ Akbar says that MrDigvijay Singh is the mouth piece of Sonia-Rahul and the hecklers of Manmohan Singh faction in the congress party.

    Our own , Mr Vijay Sharma, could not have been appointed as the “Representative of Hindus” in the minority commission, without the blessings ofthe congressi thug and goon, Digvijay Singh.

    I had alwats wondered , why did Mr Sharma act so submissive and forgiving to the numerous callous , un-civil utterences of Mr Dig Vijay Singh.

    So if Mr DigVijay Singh is the mouth piece of Sonia-Rahul cabal then is Mr Vinod Sharma ( the great representaive of Hindus in minority commission ) the mouth piece of Mr Dig Vijay Singh ?

    [Reply]

    Rajeev Reply:

    ” Mr Vijay Sharma”….I think you meant Vinod Sharma.

    There is no doubt that Mr.Vinod Sharma is not a journalist but congress propagandist working directly under Digvijay. He is always quick to slam bad language but in the case of Diggi, Vinod Sharma ki bolti band hai.

    [Reply]

    vinod sharma Reply:

    @Rajiv
    I am convinced that you are no better than Divijay Singh when it comes to lack of civility.

    [Reply]

  • Rajiv

    @Rajeev,
    Yes you are right. I should stick to referring the Congress/Digvijay appointed “Representative of Hindus” in the minority commission as his holiness, Mr V Sharma.

    [Reply]

  • http://- Rajeev

    Now we have maoist Binayek Sen sitting in a panel (Maoist use arms and violence). Why is everyone quiet on this? What happened to Gandhian values?

    [Reply]

  • http://- Rajeev
  • http://- Rajeev

    I should be buried wherever I die: MF Husain
    http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/india/I-should-be-buried-wherever-I-die-MF-Husain/articleshow/8788643.cms

    I wish MF Hussain had died on a Ship in north arabian sea, he would have been buried in sea and must have enjoyed eternal carnal pleasure with Osama 1000 feet under sea.

    [Reply]

    Rajeev Reply:

    So what stopped him from painiting Mohammad? There was a tradition of painting faceless Mohammad?
    Take Ravi’s advice…Moogle..

    [Reply]

  • Rajiv

    @Rajeev
    let’s leave MF Hussain alone. Not worth discussing in a political blog.

    [Reply]

    Rajeev Reply:

    I agree.

    [Reply]

  • Rajiv

    Guys, have any of you read , the Mahabharata series being published by Bibek Debroy ?

    He has so far published 3 volumes of it ( I think he is compiling the original into 7 volumes ) and I have seen glowing reviews of the 1st 2 volumes . The 3rd volume was just published.

    [Reply]

  • Vijay Kumar

    @ T U R D Fake Tajendar

    Even your bade paazi, Shri Ravi has promised to flush you in the WC when you come here. So why dont u do it yourself :D

    [Reply]

  • Rajiv

    I said ‘guys’, my comment not addressed to ‘pakistani perverts and shameles dogs’

    [Reply]

  • Rajiv

    @Rajeev
    Dont engage the pakistani cripple here. Let him expose what a true pakistani mind thinks here.
    The more he writes, the more you know why pakistan is a cripple thug failed state on earth and subject to ridicule the world over. He gives an insignt into the soul of pakistan and why its known as a criminal entity.

    Please avoid, responding to him, irrespective of how much garbage and filth he can muster. Believe me, you are no match for a pakistani like him, as far as his ability to generate garbage is concerned.

    [Reply]

  • Vijay Kumar

    @ Rajiv

    the so called asset declarations by our elected represntatives are a joke. It would need a Lokpal who does his job to actually point out how wrong they are.

    Pracctically speaking nobody would be able to do it. This is what scares all political parties to go slow on the getting a Lok Pal

    [Reply]

    Rajiv Reply:

    @Vijay
    The asset declaration is just one of the tools and would provide an opportunity to the lokpal to investigate cases of fraudulent declarations.

    Lokpak, as Mr Anna Hazare said, is not going to eliminate corruption, but only help in reducing it significantly.

    Nothing can eliminate corruption, just as you cannot eliminate vice or the vile political ideology of religion defined nationality that gave birth to pak and motivates the criminal minds there.

    The lokpal needs to be independent ( maybe appointed by Supremecourt, from a list of names provided by the govt and opposition ) and should have a machinery like FBI answerable to him.

    [Reply]

  • Vijay Kumar

    ~~ :D :D ~~ SECOND JOKE OF THE DAY— KAMALNATH BECOMES VICTIM DIGVINASH ~~ :D :D ~~

    First I will say a few good things about kamalnath. He was frank in his asset declarations. probably sitll hiding 70% and not 99% like SM Krishana. having stayed at his Span resort in the Manali belt, I still remember a controverys where he had diverted a river to make his hotel.

    But…. Now the same Kamal nath has been vidoegraphed washing Ramdev’s feet !! :D :D

    It would be becasue of the good health he would have recieved thru Pranayam!!

    But the COngress Rotweilers are going to be after him now…

    Digvinash would use this as an opportunity to wipe him in MP :D

    Sonia and Amul baby would expect him to issue a statemtn that Ramdev is communal and anti Indian. This Kamal won’t ,

    The small rotweilers of the party who look for a signal from the Maa beta to get into their jingoistic mode !!

    And their yes boys in the press— all the COngress ki seva dal type of newpeople :D :D wil perform a lot of acrobatics… :D :D

    [Reply]

    Rajiv Reply:

    @Vijay,

    Has the Congress appointed “representative of Hindus” in the minority commission, his holiness Mr V Sharma, issued a declaration condemning Mr Kamal Nath ?

    [Reply]

    Rajeev Reply:

    Rajiv with an I,
    If you maintain this line against Vinod and his employer Congress, you are in the danger of being labelled Sanghi. Tauba Karo Tauba :)

    [Reply]

    Rajiv Reply:

    @Rajeev
    I just cannot get over the fact and grappling with question as to what credibility should be rationally assigned to a reporter like V Sharma, who is appointed by congress and accepts the appointment, of “the representative of Hindus” in the minority commission.

    Rajeev Reply:

    Rajiv,
    I have already given up on Vinod Sharma and his staffer Pankaj Vohra. You can not expect these guys to be rational. I think Vinod Sharma is a committed Congressman working in media. Still wondering when this poor fellow will get Padamshri.

    vinod sharma Reply:

    @Rajeev and Rajiv
    Am quite flattered by your obsession with what I do or where I am aligned. Seems you guys went to the same Shishu Mandir where they teach you how to defacate — not debate. I have just one request: Pl pull the chain once you are through. Badboo aate hai bhai.

    [Reply]

  • Rajiv

    “Wajib-ul-qatl” ( fit-to-be-killed )

    Pamphlets branding members of the minority Ahmadiya community as “wajib-ul-qatl” (fit to be killed) and inciting people to attack them are being openly circulated in Pakistan’s textile industry hub of Faisalabad, according to a media report.

    The pamphlets list the names of several Ahmadiya industrialists, doctors and businesses.

    The first name is that of a cloth house, three owners of which were gunned down in a brazen attack last year, The Express Tribune newspaper reported.

    The pamphlets were issued by the All Pakistan Students Khatm-e-Nubuwat Federation and are being circulated at main shopping plazas and important commercial centres of the city in Punjab province.

    “To shoot such people is an act of jihad and to kill such people is an act of sawab (blessing),” the pamphlets say.

    The Umoor-e-Aama Jama’at Ahmadiyya of Faisalabad, a group representing the community, reacted to the distribution of such literature by saying that the propaganda campaign is being “carried out unhindered by some fanatic religious groups under the patronage of law enforcing agencies and the provincial government”.
    ………..

    http://www.indianexpress.com/news/ahmadiya-community-fit-to-be-killed-say-pamphlets-in-pak/801411/

    [Reply]

    Rajeev Reply:

    Frankly speaking Ahmediyas deserve this. They try to be even Kuttar to pass off as true muslims. They have chosen slavery of Islam on their own will.

    [Reply]

    Rajiv Reply:

    Looks like Islam and pakistan is a “Brahminist ploy” lol

    [Reply]

    Rajiv Reply:

    @Rajeev,
    I wouldn’t say Ahmedias deserve this. No one deserves this. The easiest thing for Ahmedias would be to give of their religion and become sunni pakistanis. In face of death and vulgar violence unleashed on them by Jinnah’s islamic pakistan, they have continued to peacefully resist and not succumb to pakistani criminality. I sympathize with them.

    [Reply]

    Rajeev Reply:

    Rajiv,
    What is need for Ahmedis to call themselves muslims when other muslims don’t accept them. Quaidani (Ahmedis) do not believe that Mohammad was the LAST prophet and this is the sticking point.

    They can start their own religion, may be follow some tenets of Islam but they are hell bent of declaring that they are muslims. Why are they so desperate to become Slave of arabic imperialism called Islam.

    I used to sympathise with them but not anymore because I detest their slavish attitude.

    Rajeev Reply:

    Rajiv,
    It looks like this Tajender is Ahmedi…Now you know why I don’t sympathise with them. They try very hard to be muslims just like our Tajender. Basically Ahmedis are untouchable and fit to be killed in pakistan.
    No wonder this Tajender hangs around in the safety of hindus.

    [Reply]

  • http://- Rajeev

    Never thought I’d ever read such a balanced article. The govt, journalist like Vinod Sharma should learn something from Shobhan SAXENA (who is not a Yadav).

    http://blogs.timesofindia.indiatimes.com/Main-Street/entry/the-congress-party-has-lost-the-plot

    Congress has lost the plot Shobhan Saxena
    08 June 2011, 07:18 PM IST

    At the very beginning, let me make it clear that I am not a fan of yoga guru Ramdev. He may be a good yoga teacher but it’s hard to believe some of his claims. I am sure you can’t grow back your lost hair by rubbing your fingers against each other and you can’t cure diabetes by drinking lauki juice and you can’t get rid of cancer by a few quick swigs of cow urine every day. These are bizarre claims. Ramdev may be Baba Bizarre and maybe he is also involved in shady land deals, but no one – not even the government or Congress party – can deny him the right to raise social and political issues or organize rallies and demonstrations in the national capital. You may or may not agree with his thinking but one can’t take away his right to raise the issues in whatever way he wants. Until and unless he breaks the law, the government can’t take any action against him.

    But last Saturday, the government lost all sense of balance when it sent Delhi Police and Rapid Action Force troopers to break Ramdev’s camp at Ramlila Maidan. Like scabs breaking a union strike with clubs and batons, the government troops moved into the camp in the middle of night and used tear gas, canes and lathis to wake up thousands of people sleeping there. Men and women and children were beaten. Women and children were forced to walk towards the railway station and left on the road. While the yoga guru vanished, the ordinary people who had come here from all parts of the country had to bear the brunt of police brutality. That day Delhi looked like Srinagar.

    The next day, at least five Congress leaders appeared on television giving five different reasons why the police action was “inevitable”. The way this government and Congress party has handled this issue – first sending four ministers to the airport to receive Ramdev and having secret confabulations with him at a hotel to co-opt him and use him as a counter-force against Team Anna Hazare and then cracking down on his camp when they failed to strike a deal with him – it’s clear that this government has lost its direction and the Congress party has lost the plot.

    The Congress leaders are so busy enjoying the fruits of power and so anxious to maintain their hold over power that almost all of them are making a fool of themselves on national television (it makes good TV but bad politics). Speaking on a channel, Congress spokesman Manish Tiwari said the Ramdev camp was attacked because people from the RSS and other right-wing groups were present on the stage and they were actually running the show. This is the same Congress party whose prime minister was sleeping on December 6, 1992, when the Babri Masjid was razed to the ground by fanatics. This is the same Congress party whose prime minister invited a 3500-strong contingent of RSS to take part in the Republic Day parade in 1963. Probably Manish Tiwari should reboot his memory and recall the Emergency days when the Congress’ Prince of Darkness, Sanjay Gandhi, was openly admired by the RSS as government bulldozers rampaged through Muslim slums and bastis. The secret handshake between the Congress and RSS is not a secret anymore. Nor is the fact that for the Congress party the RSS is a Rottweiler on the leash which can be unleashed any time to strike fear into the minds of the minorities and those who are scared of or not comfortable with the RSS philosophy.

    The same day Kapil Sibal, who has become the biggest troubleshooter for the government, appeared on TV, justifying the police action and giving a stern warning to the whole nation. “Let this be a lesson to everybody,” Sibal said with a scowl. “The yoga teacher should teach yoga and not indulge in politics,” he added. So, we have reached such a stage when a Union minister will decide who can do politics in this country. Does it mean that the people of this country now have to take permission from the Congress party and UPA government and Kapil Sibal before forming a political organization or raising a political issue? The government has made its intention very clear by putting the entire capital under Section 144, though not a single violent incident happened in the city. All the violence happened from the government side. The clampdown is not against illegal meetings, it’s a clampdown on politics. If the views and opinions are inconvenient to the government and party, there will be action. “We can rein in”, in the words of Sibal.

    And the next day, when a mentally deranged man, Sunil Kumar, showed a shoe to Congress spokesman Janardan Diwedi at a press briefing, a group of journalists and Congress workers pounced on him and Congress leader Digvijay Singh, who is now become the attack dog of the party, arrived at the scene and punched and slapped the poor sod who did not know what was happening. Later, Digvijay went on TV to claim that the man with the shoe was a RSS worker and he was sent by the organization to disrupt the press briefing. Even if Sunil Kumar was a RSS worker, what right does Digvijay Singh have to slap him? Is it right to inflict violence on a man who needs medical help? Is this the way the Congress party deals with complex situations? Why can’t the Congress party just ban the RSS and dismantle its organization if it’s such a huge threat to the country? No, the party will not do that as it benefits from the the fear of RSS.

    From these incidents and utterances of Congress leaders, it’s clear that the party has decided to hit back hard — at the people. Cornered by a number of corruption cases, the Congress-led government has not done anything to give an impression that it’s serious about tackling corruption. It’s not serious about nothing, only power. This party will do anything to keep itself in power. It’s so cut off from the wants, needs and aspirations of the people that it has no idea about the angry mood in the country. In the second year of its second term, the UPA government and Congress have lost the plot and they are deceiving themselves by being tough. They can deceive themselves but they can’t deceive the country.

    [Reply]

  • Rajiv

    @Rajeev,
    The Ahmedias should have the freedom to define their religion or identity , anyway they want. No one has to like it or approve of it.
    The open victimization and violence , perpetrated on Ahmedias in Islamic republic of Pakistan and sanctioned by their government, is an insight into the criminal state.

    You see, you don’t need a certificate to declare yourself Hindu. If you claim you are hindu, then you are hindu. If you claim you are a christian , then you are a christian. In Pakistan its a state crime, punishable by pakistan criminal code, for an Ahmedia to claim he is a muslim.

    Such a devious plot, could only be a ‘brahmanical ploy’.

    The more I read, I am starting to think that Pakistani Islam, Pakistan state and its criminal ideology and the pakistani retards that visit this blog are all a product of ‘brahminical conspiracy’ .

    [Reply]

    Rajeev Reply:

    Rajiv,
    It is unfortunate that Islam doesn’t give its followers the kind of freedom that other religions give to its followers. So the best solution for Ahmedis is to take Bahai route. There is no need for them to stick to religion that disowns them.
    It is kind of amazing that Sufis are still considered muslims but looking at the blasts in sufi shrines located in pakistan and India (ajmer blast), it is possible that Sufis too will face same fate as Ahmedis in few decades from now.

    I am not a religious person but I still love to be hindu because I have power to think freely and reject any or all aspects of my religion and still live freely among fellow hindus. There is no better democracy than hinduism except for a big hole called casteism.

    [Reply]

    Rajiv Reply:

    @Rajeev,
    A religion, should give freedom to its followers to define the faith , in any way they choose, without someone else dictating it.

    A CULT doesn’t.
    A CULT bans someone from leaving it.
    A CULT dictates, who is a member and who is a outsider.
    A CULT dictates that you marry inside the cult.
    ….

    So there, thats how I would philosophically seperate a religion from a cult.

    [Reply]

    Rajeev Reply:

    Right on the dot…You have a very clear understanding of religion.

    Rajiv Reply:

    forgot to add

    A CULT is a ‘brahministic ploy’ : lol

    Pankaj#1 Reply:

    Rajiv,
    How about Islam and a Gang of New York. Will( Can) you please compare them. Just a mental exercise.

    Rajeev Reply:

    Pankaj,
    You are being cruel..almost on the verge of being officially communal :)

    Pankaj#1 Reply:

    Rajeev;
    No this was serious. Ok, what similarities I see, try to compare this with a mafia gang. 1.Once you are in, you can not leave.2 on the order of mafia, you perpetrate violence.3 Do not tolerate others on your turf 4. Ultimate loyality is towards gang, no body else 5. ready to die for mafia gang.6One mafia head, like khalifa. 7. work more with fear than constructive things. 8. rule with fear of destruction rather than with construction. Leisurely, one can find many more similarities.

    Observer Reply:

    Tajender,

    what about prophet, his adopted son and his……

    Rajeev Reply:

    Ajmer blast was done by Indian wahabbist.

    [Reply]

  • Ravi

    Godbole and Government Listens

    From time to time, the Head of a Religion feels the need to rebuke the Head of a State. Today, the Arch Bishop of Canterbury, Dr Rowan Williams published an article – which is critical of British Government’s policies – in a political magazine called The New Statesman. Whilst the article was in a periodical with very modest circulation, the message was actually aimed at just one person – David Cameron the British PM.

    Within a few hours of its publication, the PM responded with a robust defence.

    The language used by both parties was awfully polite, though its impact was very strong.

    Dr Williams, to drive home his points, used not drama, no street theatre.

    Contrast this with the highly dramatic method used by Ramdev to tell the Indian Government that, the need to control corruption among its ministers has been long over-due.

    My feeling is that the method chosen by Dr Rowan Williams will be significantly more effective in achieving its objective, than the method chosen by Ramdev.

    Perhaps Ramdev’s objectives were different from those of Dr Rown Williams. Maybe Ramdev chose the right method for his hidden objectives.

    [Reply]

    Rajeev Reply:

    Are you posting this from office? Using office computer? Using office cell phone? You seem to be typical pakistani/indian babu.

    [Reply]

    Ravi Reply:

    I am a super TUR-D
    Caught in the vortex of a feeble flush
    Round and round I rotate in a rush
    Fearful of final nudge of toilet brush
    After all I am a super TUR-D

    [Reply]

    Rajeev Reply:

    Finally you are honest about yourself.

    Your lie that you used office cell phone was classic. Congrats, almost everyone believed you.

    B.V.SHENOY Reply:

    Rajiv,

    No, I didn’t believe him a bit. Only Vinod Sharma was taken in by his smooth talk.

    Vijay Kumar Reply:

    @ Ravi

    Good poem But should not stop you from flushing out T U R D Tajendar :D

    Rajiv Reply:

    @Rajeevn
    Dont disturb or intrude upon, the enlightning discussion between Ravi and the pakistani.
    Just watch and enjoy.

    [Reply]

    Rajeev Reply:

    Aur Mohammad was ZERO fail. Islam too is based on Jahalat.

    [Reply]

    Rajiv Reply:

    @Rajeev,
    You have to overcome the temptation to engage the pakistani pervert. To me, pakistani-Islam and everything vile that has come of it, looks like a ‘brahmanical ploy’.

    [Reply]

    Rajiv Reply:

    So archbishop of canterbury is the equivalent of a yoga instructor with strong political views !!

    Must be liberal thought as taught in imerial britain !!

    This is as good as a ‘brahmanical ploy’ !

    [Reply]

    Pankaj#1 Reply:

    Rajiv;
    by the way, costilest marriage in india was done recently by a gujjar, congressi MLA of gurgaon. @250 Crore rupees. One 7 seater helicpter was given as dowry. No Merc or BMW, they are passe. mayawati, has thousands of crores rupees. mulayam is worth thousand of crores. DMK is worth thousands of crores. Innumerable millionaires amongs dalits and OBCs. these stats to puncture one blogger here, who constntly harp on Shudra, muslims, OBCs, Christians, sikhs as deprived.

    [Reply]

    Rajiv Reply:

    @pankaj
    To reason with a pakistani-pervert is a ‘perversion’ in itself. So avoid it. Just watch is to see how the marriage of jinnah to a political cult of nationality defined by religion, produced such perversion.

    Pankaj#1 Reply:

    Puttar;
    I heard a name like Telgi and Hassan Ali, Daud Ibrahim, List is long.

  • http://- Rajeev

    Rajiv,
    I get tempted to puncture Tajender’s propaganda. I’ll control myself from now.

    You are right about Ravi-Tajender discussion…How education!!! but about pakistani minds.

    [Reply]

  • Rajiv

    @Pankaj,

    Well my distinction, between a cult and religion, is self explanatory and we have examples of both.

    Some cults are small and less criminal in the amount of harm done because of their reduced geographic reach ( like the gangs in NY or some poor neighbourhoods ) and come CULTS are big, trans-national and more violent.

    [Reply]

    Rajiv Reply:

    some of these cults have also spawned trans-national terrorist/criminal groups.

    [Reply]

  • Rajiv

    I am also told that these transnational/criminal cult is being controlled by brahministic and zionist agents !

    [Reply]

    Rajeev Reply:

    Those Brahmins and Zionists again :) I hate them.

    [Reply]

  • http://- Rajeev

    Debate on MF Husain…Just watch how Sobha De is talking..”He was longing for Falooda, I asked his son to fly in some Falooda from Crawford market to London”…This is typical socialite trash talk..Same is true with Shabana Azmi “He asked me to smell the sweat of laborers”…What kind of trash is this?

    The fundamental question is why did he not take up the challenge of hindu right and painted Mohammad (faceless, there is tradition of this). He would have not only made hindu right shut up but also proved his true secular face. He failed on this account.

    Think if a hindu paints Mohammad (in a devotional way), how will muslims react? Now coming to Khajurao, it was sculpted by HINDUS not muslims so muslims have no right to depict hindu deities. If they insist on this right, they should allow hindus to paint Mohammad.

    http://www.timesnow.tv/Debate-Wasnt-Husain-above-politics—1/videoshow/4375534.cms

    [Reply]

    Rajiv Reply:

    @Rajeev,

    anyone has a right to paint anything. Only an insane, will say you cannot paint muhammad.
    I can paint any ******* I want.
    similarly mf hussain can paint anything he wants , including nude images of anyone he wants.

    Since we give that fredom to others to paint anything they want, thats why we enjoy the right to call those who oppose those freedoms – like the freedom to paint muhammad or anyone – as cultist thugs and criminals.

    [Reply]

    vinod sharma Reply:

    Comments have been posted here by some taking objection to those appreciating MF in TV appearances. Why is it so? Do we want debate standarised in this country? Here was an atrist hounded out of the country by the right wing fringe agitating violently in 1996 against sketches he drew in the seventies. It was a campaign orchestrated to poliarise public opinion in the run up to the 1998 polls. It was about politics, not religious sentiments. It was the ugliest spectacle in the history of our democracy.

    [Reply]

  • http://- Rajeev

    Here are some painting of Mohammad
    http://www.godweb.org/mohammedpaintings.htm

    [Reply]

  • http://- Rajeev

    Another famous painting of Mohammad-
    http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_GF0KEy-tqTo/SMZifoCjFgI/AAAAAAAAAS4/kqcl5phhHck/s1600-h/buraq.jpg

    [Reply]

    Rajiv Reply:

    @Rajeev,

    just ignore this pakistani pervert. Let him stew in his own filth. You cannot engage him and stay clean.
    Regarding MF Hussain, its his decision, where ever he wants to stay. He is a publicity seeker besides being a painter and obviously he has a political constituency.

    I am all for full intellectual freedom. Le him paint whatever he wants. I would not like to make an issue out of it.

    Remember, we need protection, if you beleive so, from the Gods.
    God does not need protection from us.

    Its only in cults, that a negative word about the founder of the CULT invites ex-communication or even death. We are not a cultist-criminal state.

    [Reply]

    Dr Mishra, UK Reply:

    Rajiv with I
    Benoy Hegde
    Pankaj
    Vijay
    esitate to ask a favour, or preach, but maybe it is better to ignore someone who we all disagree with completely to avoid the blog being swamped by c and p.
    I G N O R E

    [Reply]

    Pankaj#1 Reply:

    Your post was a bit late, I have alredy replied. but will be careful.

    Pankaj#1 Reply:

    Rajiv;
    present dispension look likes God need protection from us, not vice versa. no I am not atheist or any thing such. but, people claiming to be religious, acting like this.

    [Reply]

    Dr Mishra, UK Reply:

    COMPARING ARCHBISHOP OF CANTERBURY vs RAMDEV
    ——————–
    ravi, that was mischievous. Compare like with like. Archb is a highly educated man living in an affluent society with near universal literacy who spends most of his time in exalted company.
    Ramdev is a street fighter with limited education but a limitless dream, a karma yogi who is also a CEO of sorts. Certainly, politically and scientifically challenged at times, but we have not seen the finished product yet. Given the odds stacked against him, he has acheived far more than Arch…
    Your comparison was mischievous- a bit like point scoring when one compares the Great Indian sporting hero Tendulkar (clean family man) with the British counterpart Rooney (kotha frequenting sporting goon). I actually flinched while typing this unnecssary comparison

    Ravi Reply:

    Dr Mishra

    You are right that the comparison can be described as unfair on many angles, not just the ones you mention.

    However, at some simple level the comparison is very valid.

    Ramdev, has probably got more following that the Archbishop does. Before this “fast” Ramdev was not a street fighter but was merely providing a spiritual product to willing buyers.

    Where the comparison is valid is that both individuals are critical of the policies of their government and wish to gain some influence.

    Similarly, why is a comparison between Roony and Tendulkar erroneous. At a very superficial level both are excellent sports men, who make a living from sports. The fact they are different from the POV of life style choices does not hinder a comparison.

    I feel a comparison between the Archbishop and Ramdev, may not be perfect but is perfectly valid.

  • Binoy Hegde

    What world is this stupid guy living?

    I have seen many requesting his removal from this blog.. PAthetic person he is!

    [Reply]

    B.V.SHENOY Reply:

    Binoy Hegde,

    I am very curious to know: where are you from?
    Are you a Kannada Hegde (like Ramakrishna Hegde), a Tulu Hegde (like Dharmasthala Hegde) or Konkani Hegde?

    Please reply.

    [Reply]

    vinod sharma Reply:

    @BV Shenoy
    What connect are you seeking Mr Parochial?

    [Reply]

    Ravi Reply:

    Binoy

    While you are answering these extremely relevant questions.

    Could you also tell if you are a upper caste Hegde or a lower caste Hegde.

    That would influence as to how much abuse I can expect from you.

    [Reply]

  • Pankaj#1

    Mir Zafar?

    [Reply]

  • Pankaj#1

    All BS. who believes in this. Not modern Indians.

    [Reply]

  • Dr Mishra, UK

    WHAT IS SECULARISM
    ———————————
    Dear Dr Shah Alam
    Nice to reconnect. In future please put your reply not below my question, but in the general comments box. Reason being, by the time you post a reply, ppl have posted 50 comments and I almost did miss your post.
    Next time you go to AIIMS hostel 5 cafe, look at the basket ball court. Yours truly was captain there in the seventies and had the court cemented. My claim to fame.
    Now regarding your comment- what is secularism. There are 2 definitions-
    1. The Indian definition is equal respect for all religions.
    2. The western definition is separation of religion from state.
    Mahatma Gandhi is the best example of (1) and Nehru is the best example of (2), and Pakistan sadly is the worst example of both (1) and (2)
    rest later

    [Reply]

    Dr Mishra, UK Reply:

    next time you post, I will relate an anecdote regarding P Chandra and Johri, ha

    [Reply]

  • Pankaj#1

    Bete;
    If you dare to go to a dalit and call him by cast name, you may get 6×10 in isolation. do not attempt that.

    [Reply]

  • Rajiv

    @Mishra,
    If I may quip in, I prefer Nehru’s model of secularism , more than Gandhi’s.

    Separation of church and state : Yes. 100%

    Equal respect to all religions : No

    No one or state should be required to pay equal respect to any ideology or thought because not all political or religious ideologies/cults are equal.

    If that were so, democracy , fascism , jihadi-fundamentalism, obscrutanism would all be deserving of equal respect.

    [Reply]

    B.V.SHENOY Reply:

    Rajiv,

    you are being naive. It was Nehru who first introduced the Hindu code Bill, even while rejecting the demand by the country to bring the Muslim community too under a similar law leading to uniform civil Law. He left it to that community’s leaders to decide whether to have a uniform civil law, which led to their treating themselves as the preferred community, which later converted itself into a permanent vote bank. Thus, Nehru can be justifiably called the pioneer of psedo secularism.

    [Reply]

  • S Singh

    Rajeev

    The big mouth DogVijay has uttered again – that BJP is responsible for MF Hussain’s death.

    Congress has to rein in this stupid guy. Let him contest again in MP and see if he can win a seat.

    I give 45 seats to Congress in the next Lok Sabha election….any takers

    [Reply]

    Rajeev Reply:

    S Singh,
    I bet congress will come back to power in 2014. The corrupt hindus and hinduphobic minorities will make sure congress comes back.

    [Reply]

  • rajiv

    you heard it here first

    ———————————————————————————–
    Pakistani Tahawwur Rana Hussain, found guilt in 2 of the 3 charges
    ———————————————————————————-

    The Chicago jury of 12 citizens , unanimously found him guilty of
    providing material support to Pak terrorist group of Let/ISI for
    1. attack in Mumbai
    2. planning attack in Denmark

    The jury, absolved him of the charge of conspiring to kill 186 people in Mumbai
    However, he is convicted of providing material support to the terrorists involved in Mumbai attack.

    From NY Times

    “The jury reached its verdict after two days of deliberations, finding Tahawwur Rana guilty of providing material support to terrorism in Denmark and to the Pakistani militant group that had claimed responsibility for the three-day siege in India’s largest city that left more than 160 people dead, including six Americans.

    The jurors, who were not identified in court, declined to talk to the media to explain their split verdict. Though the jury found him not guilty of the most serious accusation, Rana still faces up to 30 years in prison on the other two charges. ”

    This is a good verdict.

    [Reply]

  • Pankaj#1

    Congratulatins to all Secularists, including Pseudo Secularists.

    [Reply]

  • rajiv

    Tanawhur Rana Hussain, ex Pak army doctor, now faces upto 30 years ( most like sentence is 10 years ) of prison.
    While, any person going to prison is not an occasion to rejoice, but its good to see that even secondary support to terrorists , is unacceptable.

    Daood Gilani, anathor Pakistani, has already accepted his role as primary support to LeT/ISI and will face sentencing later. He most likely will get 25 years of prison and avoid death penalty as he accepted his guilt.

    [Reply]

  • Pankaj#1

    Ravi;
    Full joke is, when, customer did not pay his bill and drew a gun, fired a shot, and was asked what you are doing? said, I am a Panda(chinese). I eat, shoot and leave. Many Mirpuris are living there since 4 generations and more. Even, British universities breed Terrorists. So do not hide behind good english, Syalkoti( not Siyalkoti). Moogle? Khurana’s constituency was Moti nagar, not paharganj, from the very begining, not told by Moogle. Maut ka saudagar was coined by sonia in 2009 or so, not in seventies. It is not use of a letter in word, but your general behaviour, which betrays you. Think Indians are fools? you have another thing coming to you.
    Ranjish hi Sahi, dil hi….., Pahle se mirasim na sahi, phir bhi kabhi to…. Dile Khush fahami ko hai tujh se ummide, ye Aakhri shamme hi bujhane….

    [Reply]

    Ravi Reply:

    Indian’s are not fools, but you certainly seem to be one.

    [Reply]

  • Pankaj#1

    @ Everyone;
    Is it possible that present Government change National flag?, As they are so much allergic to Safforn colour????

    [Reply]

    rajiv Reply:

    I am shocked that they have not already done so ! What a over sight.

    [Reply]

  • Pankaj#1

    @ Every one;
    M.F. Hussain,
    Pure Sarkari artist, like A. R. Rahman.Iliya Raja was equally talented, but not supported by Government.

    [Reply]

    B.V.SHENOY Reply:

    Pankaj ji,

    Very correctly put. M.F.Husain is a mediocre artist, gifted with one of the shrewdest business senses. He exploited the Hindu sensitivity and also Hindu secularity to sell his paintings by disrobing our Goddesses. His infamy rose with each attack on our culture by his depiction of sex and nudity in the shape of Durga, Bharatmata etc. His refusal to apologise to the Hindu community was also a calculated business promotion tactic, which unfortunately backfired.

    He leaves behind falsely mourning pseudo secular groups of glitterati, chatterati and cultural riff-raff.

    [Reply]

    vinod sharma Reply:

    @BV Shenoy
    You must be a great fan of Raghu Vyas. No? What coloured views you have. And you pontificate here as a great moralist. Where did you get this guile from?

    [Reply]

    B.V.SHENOY Reply:

    Kripa kar ke aap mujhe yeh bataayen ki ye Raghu Vyas hain kaun, thaki main unke fan banoo.

    I am, by the way, a great, die-hard fan of Raghu Rai.

    vinod sharma Reply:

    @BV Shenoy
    Raghu Vyas is a right-wing painter who led the sanghi charge against MF. If you don’t know him then you don’t know what all MF went through before leaving India.

    Ravi Reply:

    B. V. Shenoy

    “He leaves behind falsely mourning pseudo secular groups of glitterati, chatterati and cultural riff-raff.”

    So long as he leaves the goose stepping, Lathi weilding, Kahaki Nikkar wale communal thugs happy, then who cares about the cultural riff raf.

    [Reply]

  • Pankaj#1

    Balwinder and Shan;
    Do you people need another joke to come to blog. It may hurt???? Both of you as I will say, one against Punjabi and one against Bengali. If you agree, then only I will say. As here, we are quite sensitive, not to hurt people’s regional affiliations.

    [Reply]

  • Kaushal Kumar Agrawal

    Is Desh Ke So Called BudhJivio Ka Yah Hall Hal Hai Ki Har Samai Air Condition Mein Rahte Hain Jo Dhup Me Khada Ho Deshbhakti Ki Bat Kare, Kalyan Ki Bat kare woe bayeeman nazar aata hai. Baba ko apne baat inki rai lekar kahni thee. Agar RSS back kar raha hai toe kaun see galat baat hai. RSS wale aap se jyada imandar hain. Aisa Karo ki DESH KE ANDAR KI BLACK MAONEY KE LIYE AAP ANSHAN KARO BHUKHE RAHO HUM APKE SAATH HAIN

    [Reply]

  • Vijay Kumar

    ~~ :D :D :D ~~ BALLE BALLE !! OYE BALLE BALLE… RANA A PAKISTANI FOUND GUILTY ~~ :D :D ~

    Aao jhume gaiyen
    jam kar khushi manayein…

    Rana a Pakistani has been found guilty on some counts for murder and aiding terror. !! And just so fast !! :D

    In contrast the Indian trial after sending 100 crores is still being delayed by the Congress and Digvinash! :D Ha !

    By the way may be we should not rjoice so much.

    Arundhati Roy and Digviajay may just send a firmaan to free Rana. As they freed Gilani in the Parliament case where he was indicted for similar charges.

    :D :D

    [Reply]

  • Vijay Kumar

    @ Ravi and his brother tajendar

    hey brothers. Ravi you promised to flush Tajendar int he WC. Why dont you do it?/ :D

    I think people would know that you are Chngu Mangu– maybe saala -jeeja.

    T U R D Tajendar your saala wants to flush you into the WC. Why do you stop yourself then??

    [Reply]

  • Ravi

    FROM THE BBC HINDU FUNDOs TAKE NOTE

    Indian painter work ‘not obscene’

    A court in the India has dropped legal proceedings in three cases against one of the country’s best-known and controversial artists.

    MF Husain has been accused of obscenity in at least seven cases filed against him in a number of Indian states.

    He is alleged to have offended Hindus with a painting in which he represented India as a nude goddess.

    In dropping criminal proceedings against the painter, the Delhi court said the painting was not obscene.
    Under Indian laws, obscenity is a criminal offence.

    ‘Expression of purity’

    Mr Husain has been living in the Middle East after the rash of cases filed against him.

    “The high court said the 92-year-old painter deserves to be at home, painting his canvases,” said Akhil Sibal, Mr Husain’s lawyer.

    He said Mr Husain had said that the nudity in his painting was an “expression of purity”.

    In 2006, Mr Husain had publicly apologised for the painting.

    He promised to withdraw the controversial painting from a charity auction, after Hindu nationalist groups accused him of hurting their religious sentiments.

    The nude painting sparked off a series of obscenity cases. The cases were all transferred to the high court in Delhi after a request by Mr Husain’s lawyers.

    Mr Husain is one of India’s leading painters.

    His paintings are much sought after and are auctioned for millions of dollars.

    He has also made two Bollywood films, although both failed at the box office.

    [Reply]

  • Vijay Kumar

    @ Raviy

    Your Pal the T U R D Tajendar is turdifying the whole blog. Are you proud of it??

    If you are,,, then you will not say anything.

    And if you are not, you will tell Moot andar Hussain T U R D to disappear back to Pak-shit-stan :D

    [Reply]

    Ravi Reply:

    Vijay

    I think I have made my point in this matter abundantly clear.

    I am not the moderator of this Blog.

    I have never asked for any one else’s removal, and I am not going to start now.

    There is hardly any one here, who is not having a pop at me, defending myself is a job and a half. I do not want any more work.

    If this means that you continue to regard me as a Super TUR-D, then so be it. That is a matter for you and you alone. If it is serving your purpose then I am sure you will continue to use it.

    I am sure you would have noticed overnight a lot of personal stuff thrown at me.

    [Reply]

    Vijay Kumar Reply:

    @ Ravi

    If you are not the moderater of this blog, you are still a visitor. Would you not want your house cleaned?

    And frankly I would say look into your eyes when you look into the mirror tonight.

    Is this T U R D Tajendar not working in tandem with you? SOmehow serving a purpose to attack India, Hindus, Christians and Jews and also spilling filth over lively discussions as a low level ISI agent.

    At least you can answer this for us.

    [Reply]

    Ravi Reply:

    Vijay

    Yes I am a visitor and yes I would like to see this house clean.

    Let’s both stand side by side and look at the mirror together.

    What you will see is Me(a Sialkotia), and You (a Siyalkotia) and that apparently spells a world of difference.

    I will see excesses of Tajender and though I may not say it, but wish he would moderate his contributions.

    You will see that Tajender is not the only person who is creating filth here, there are others too. For as long as you do not chastise them as well, you will dilute your authority and thereby make it in-effective.

    I am not working in Tandem with Tajender or for that matter any one else. I will swear upon my dead mother’s ashes, and she saw Sialkot in real life.

    Are you working in Tandem with B.V. Shenoy? Or is that merely an allusion because birds of a feather flock together.
    I am not an ISI agent or an agent of any kind, except for Shan calling me that. I am not here to spew filth on Hinduism – one of the noblest religions in the world. That does not mean that I share the vision of hard-line Hindu’s. I do not. Yes I will oppose them. It is up to you if you wish to construe from this that I am an anti Hindu and therefore a Pakistani.

    I am not sure why I am saying all this, because it is very evident that what I say is not the issue, the issue remains what you believe, and that I am afraid all within your-self.

    Ravi Reply:

    Tajender

    Against my natural instincts, I am writing this.

    I think it is important that you continue to express your opposition to “rss types”. That is a fair game in this blog.

    Please be a bit sensitive to the fact that people have emotional attachment to their religions and it is not a good behaviour to talk ill of Gods. All scripture were composed in times when values were different and we should not judge them from our modern perspective.

    I know there are others who insult Islam and your instinct is to defend, but that makes for and acrimonious blog.

    Please can you moderate your style and be succinct when you counter some one elses post as well as abuse.

    B.V.SHENOY Reply:

    Vijay Kumar,

    This superturd has addressed his appeal for moderation to the originalturd. I think he is wrong there.
    Ravi should direct his khwayish to the ISI. And if they want their salaries for May, ‘11 they would rather keep quiet and continue with the job of wrecking “SEPARATED AT BIRTH” from within, much like Jyoti Basu had declared, “We will wreck the constitution from within”.

    Raju Kurien Reply:

    All,

    Ravi is a Muslim (nothing wrong) and probably a Pakistani. In an earlier blog, in reference to justifying suicide attack on Westerners, he stated “but just think about what they have done to us” — and in a question on who is us, he said Muslims

    Ravi Reply:

    B.V. Shony

    You should note that you wreck this blog with your sporadic and irrational anti Islam out bursts, because deep down you are an Islamophobe and a Hindu Fundo to the jack boot.

    Ravi Reply:

    Raju Kurien

    Care to post the orignals. Or are you also one of those who accuses and runs.

    Run along now

  • Balwinder Sandhu

    DEAR VINOD SHARMA JI

    Are we Indians that impotent to constantly allow such filth-

    tajender Reply:

    June 10th, 2011 at 1:40 am

    pankaj dont forget that brhama used to fk his 2 daughters padma and swarasti.ayappan is product of homosexuality.

    krishna had 1603 wives inspite of this used to fk his neighbours wife called radha.

    [Reply]

    Balwinder Sandhu Reply:

    BAN TAJENDER
    BAN TAJENDER
    BAN TAJENDER
    PLEASE

    [Reply]

    vinod sharma Reply:

    @tajender
    You are a nuisance on this blog. Pl quit as you have no place in a civilised discussion. The kind of abuses you use are an insult to your own faith. It is a reflection of your upbringing.
    Go or I shall censor you, ban you.

    [Reply]

  • Balwinder Singh

    tajender says why I dont go after others. I have in the past and I will in the future. But right now the most filth and the most repetitive moronic idiocy is posted by you. After I ban you, I will go after others.
    EVERYONE PL IGNORE TAJENDER completely till banned. thanks

    [Reply]

  • Balwinder Singh

    Hussain was a brilliant painter, maybe one of India’s best in the last 50 years.
    He was equally insensitive in ignoring hurt feelings of hindus- he paid a price for that, excessive in my opinion.
    But he was an ***- paint Ayesha in the nude, and Sitaji- then we would respect his artistic stance. Complete and utter idiot, Sir, I missed you in India because of your stupid obstinacy. But I respect old age, and I respect death. You are most welcome to come back to India and be buried there- you are not Kasab. BJP has issued a nice similar statement.
    THIS CONTRASTS WITH VULGARITY THROWN AT THE OLD MAN after his death- tharki, died while master bating over Madhuri etc. -
    NOT on guys, not acceptable

    [Reply]

  • Balwinder Singh

    pankaji, you yourself complimented Mishraji many times on his writing and ‘imagery’ as u called it. I love coming here to read him, you and the other greats. But when I come here there is avalanche by tajender, there is shrill posturing by SHAN and there is vile abuse of the late Hussain- I tell you, THIS BLOG NEEDS censoring like they do in Pakistani newspapers like Dawn, Express Tribune and Pak tea house.
    Even Gautam Chikermane and Kum Kum Chadha here do screening, so I enjoy going there. Chikermane had banned SHAN last month after the idiot said something about rape of Chikermane’s daughter.#
    I tell you- I weep- THIS MAN SHAN IS A DOCTOR

    [Reply]

  • B.V.SHENOY

    Vinodji,

    you said, “@BV Shenoy
    What connect are you seeking Mr Parochial?”

    Of course, I don’t take any offence at your question which, I know you made in pure jest.

    Still, let me reveal to you another part of my visiting card. In fact, a major, unique card.

    I employ about fifty tailors and more than half of them are Muslims.
    I have marries out of my cast, so has my daughter.
    My salah has married a Parsi girl.
    My doctor niece has married a Muslim doctor.
    My nephew has married a Christian.
    My another nephew has married a Jewish girl!

    Do you still think I am parochial? Or a Hindu fundamentalist?

    [Reply]

    Ravi Reply:

    Yes you are.

    Because, we judge you not by what your relatives did but by what you write.

    Your writing clearly corresponds with views one would normally associate with a Hindu Fundamentalist.

    No two views about that.

    [Reply]

    Vijay Kumar Reply:

    @ Ravi

    Now let me ask you a question. What if a Jew/Sikh/Christain were to paint prophet MOhammad in the same manner as Hussain did. Would you call him secular or communal?

    [Reply]

    B.V.SHENOY Reply:

    Fake Ravi,

    Please bear in mind that Indians don’t need certificates of good behaviour or secularism or even cosmopolitanism from Pakistanis on this blog.

    You try to get your last month’s pay from your ISI masters and carry on your work assigned by them.

    Let Vinodji decide to give me the coveted certificate, which I will certainly value, because even if we defer on every issue, I know he is an Indian and a patriot.

    [Reply]

    Ravi Reply:

    B. V. Shenoy the genuine Hindu Fundo

    No one needs any certificates.

    But the chief certificate issuer here in this blog is you.

    I do not need any certificate from you to declare me an Indian or for that matter any one else. All I have to do is give you my passport number, but that would only give you an opportunity to abuse me in other was.

    Vinod Ji is absolutely correct that you use here the crudest of tricks against people you don’t like by labelling them Pseudo Secular, Congress Lover, and Pakistani.

    Well all that does is confirms your crypto fascist credentials and a RSS lover.

    The reason you find it difficult to accept me is not because I am a Pakistani, but because I oppose you personally in every format you care to use. Poetry, Prose, Abuse.

    You are a cypto fascist and you portray yourself as the owner of this blog.

    Guess what you do not own it and this not your personal fiefdom.

    S Singh Reply:

    Ravi-

    Speak for yourself…. Why “we” (“we judge you”)

    [Reply]

    B.V.SHENOY Reply:

    First he gave Vinodji his mobile number, even though it is his company’s number and there is fear that it can be misused by (other) terrorists. Still he gave it, because he wanted to prove to Vinodji, the only one innocent soul here whobelieved the fake, that he is not a Pakistani.

    Now he has offered to give me his passport number, place of issue, date of issue etc., even though there is the fear that it can be misused, again by (other) terrorists.

    Still, nobody believes him that he is not a Pakistani, working on this blog as an ISI mole working to destroy this blog.

    B.V.SHENOY Reply:

    By the way, Vinodji,
    why I asked Binoy Hegde was because a sister of mine had married a Hegde. I wanted to see whether he is by any chance related to me!

    [Reply]

    VIjay Kumar Reply:

    @ Ravi

    You have not answered my question on Hussain and paintings and in case Hindu/sikh/Jew

    were to make the same sort of paintings about the prophet Mohammmad

    [Reply]

    Ravi Reply:

    Vijay

    You question is valid but requires a considered response. I am still working and will answer when I am able to.

    Regards

    Ravi

  • Vijay Kumar

    Oh ! Well … Let me now look at this blog again. With Tajendar gone for the time being…

    Hopefully he will not surface back.

    Ok Ravi. It was a nice appeal you made to him. Everyone has a right to comment and opposing views can be accomodated.

    But down right abuse, taking on fake identities, hidden agendas… well they need to be curbed for the functioning of civil society.

    [Reply]

  • shan

    decided to stay away from blogs , as it was getting silly.and probably will
    HOWEVER THIS “COW BELT” MEDICINE FROM PANDIT SHARMA, WAS TOO MUCH TO TAKE
    His lines
    Regarding comparison of RSS with the Taleban- well it is like comparing Barret’s epithelium with an oesophageal carcinoma.
    Now a tutorial on Barrett’s oesophagus(From Current surgical therpy Ed cameron ,page 47,author Richard Heitmiller, Chief Division of Thoracic surgery, THE JOHN HOPKINS HOSPITAL ,BALTIMORE
    Quote: Patients with Barrett’s HAVE A RISK OF DEVOLOPING CANCER(adenocarinoma) that is 30 to 40 times that of a patient without Barrett’s.
    SOME FEEL ALL OESOPHAGEAL CARCINOMA IS DERIVED FROM BARRETT’S OESOPHAGUS Unquote

    [Reply]

    Balwinder Singh Reply:

    saala SHAAN mujhe budhaapey mein medicine padhwa raha hai. My 5 million pound business will go thup if I spend too much time on this blog.
    STOOPID SHAN- this is what I found on net – http://www.markfuscomd.com/barretts.htm
    7 million americans have barrats problem- are all dying of cancer baby ??
    spank-me-i-love-it-my-name-is-shan khan

    [Reply]

    shan Reply:

    @balls scratcher bhondhu , stick to your culture , that is AGRICULTURE, there is a thing called
    cumulative risk , relative risk etc you wont understand , squares and cabbages dont do science they do kubutar baji.

    [Reply]

    shan Reply:

    Half the india smokes , not all die of lung cancer , but smoking has extreemely strong relationship to lung cancer , clear epidemiologic association was first discoverd by Sir Richard Doll
    GADHEY se kya batt kare

    [Reply]

    Balwinder Singh Reply:

    NO SHAN YOU ARE A MORON.
    even an imbecile would agree that RSS is to smoking what Taleban is to cancer
    everyday this DOCTOR comes abuses others and gets his puny bong as s whipped, even on medical issues

    shan Reply:

    @Balls fondler bhondhu , ONLY A MORON IMBECILE DIMWIT A S S H O L E WILL WRITE AND ABLE TO MAKE SENSE WHAT YOU HAVE WRITTEN

    Time to go back to cheap daru

  • Balwinder Singh

    well SHAN i am no doctor so will keep out of a complex medical debate. but to a layman, whether the RSS will grow into a Taleban is till yet to be seen., like baratts becoming adeno whaetever

    as always, you jump in abuse someone with cow belt bull shit and then say something stoopid. thought doctors were a bit more civilised in their discussions

    [Reply]

  • Balwinder Singh

    SHAN, learn some manners from the other doctor on this blog- DR PANKAJ- SEE WHAT HE SAYS ABOUT YOU AND DOC MISHRA- “”"‘…Mishraji; I am sorry for you to hear such things and it pains me that Shan has unlearnt the lessons, …Even now, at this age, I speak with my seniors, either as Sir . A dignified language has many advantages, as compared to perceived advantages of foul language.
    Shan is losing respect of fellow bloggers, I will describe Shan as loose canon, which may fire here , there and everywhere. I have tried to reason with shan before.
    mishraji, I hold you in high esteem for your views. …’”"”

    [Reply]

  • Balwinder Singh

    and there it is SHAN – THE MOST humiliating public ticking off I have ever seen on net, when the normally docile mishraji exploded. You will remember that others also let rip at you after that- do you want me to post that as well-

    [Reply]

    Balwinder Singh Reply:

    found it-
    1. Dr Mishra, UK says:
    June 4, 2011 at 6:03 pm
    Shan, if you disagree with what I say, then debate it, do not use juvenile language like ‘cow belt intellect’. I became a Consultant in the UK in 1980 at the age of 33, when the average gora was 40 at the time of appointment. At that time it was almost unheard of for Asians to become Consultants here.
    Not like today, when some tutcha graduates make it into the country and get employed. The hours regulations for Junior docs started changing 15 years ago, and in a desperate attempt to fill the gap Uk started importing more docs.
    Today, 50% of trainee surgeons like yourself are from abroad. Most have the humility to realise that they are in the UK because of this stroke of luck regulation change, and not let their head swell up with vanity.
    I have a PhD in addition and the largest private practice in my speciality in Yorkshire. Sorry, but a young pup like you, who has trained in rubbish hospitals like Newham cannot even compare 1% to what I have acheived in the 1970s in hostile Britain.
    I have no desire to get into a MEDICAL debate with a SURGICAL trainee like you, suffice it to say that your treatise on vegetarianism stated above is infantile twaddle.
    Take a look at yourself even on this blog- I seem to have a lot of admirers and friends, and you are the butt of jokes with people repeatedly questioning about whether you got your MBBS on a SC/ST quota or whether you are a Walter Mitty character masquerading to be a doctor.
    And dont give me this **** of -I have passed the plab exam- I presently employ a capitation fee graduate from Tamil Nadu, who is useless and has done the exam.
    Sorry, If I ticked you off, but you need manners of how to address a senior consultant in the UK, wher you train.

    [Reply]

    shan Reply:

    Go back to your Daru , he he

    [Reply]

  • Shoeb K

    I am on a business trip here in US.

    There has been a hardening of people’s attitudes since 9/11; however, the extent to which it has penetrated into political discourse is simply unbelievable.

    Three examples in the last three days – Rick Perry, Governor of Texas, and a rumoured to be candidate for Republican Presidential primaries had a public “christian prayer meeting” to cleanse America and to bless it.

    Herman Cain, a black businessman (and a formal federal reserve governor), who is a candidate for the Republican presidential primary, stated in an interview that he will require any Muslim cabinet member to take a special oath of allegiance.

    Prominent commentators and TV personalities justified both of these with a comment “this is a majority judeo christian country, nothing wrong if there is suspicion and fear about Muslims”

    It looks like that the capture and killing of Bin Laden, and the revelations of dcuments siezed, have caused further hardening in attitrudes and perspectives. A chicken and egg situation

    [Reply]

    rajiv Reply:

    Rick Perry, the Gov of Texas, publicly declared during last election that he believes , as per his pastors sermon on bible, that non-christians are going to hell. Basically citizens of his state, as per him, who are non-christians, are hell-bound.

    [Reply]

  • VIjay Kumar

    @ Rajiv and Shoeb

    Seems US will become Pakistan ! If it hardens its attitude……

    [Reply]

    rajiv Reply:

    No there is no fear of that. However, the perception about Muslims here is very nagative. Sometimes, I come accros American workers, who once they know I am not a muslim, will launch into a tirade about them. One of them , referring to the fact that not all muslims are terrorists, said only 2% of snakes are poisonous. But how do I know which one is poisonous and which not and why should I risk my life trying to figure that out ?
    So I kill them.
    I wonder and laugh, that these same guys, used to lecture India on tolerance, 15 years ago, before some terrorists struck.
    However, the legal protections are strong. There are no restrictions on Muslims or any fear of that. Americans in general are fair minded people and still one of the best countries in the world for non-natives to settle and become part of the country and society.

    [Reply]

  • VIjay Kumar

    @ Rajiv

    I am sure you are right. Where they went wrong was pampering dictators in the middle east and funding of quasi terrorist states like Pakistan.

    [Reply]

  • B.V.SHENOY

    Raju Kurien Reply:

    June 10th, 2011 at 4:06 pm

    All,

    Ravi is a Muslim (nothing wrong) and probably a Pakistani. In an earlier blog, in reference to justifying suicide attack on Westerners, he stated “but just think about what they have done to us” — and in a question on who is us, he said Muslims.

    Now this Islamic fundamentalist-terrorist is trying to pass himself off as a devout Sikh, believing in all scriptures of all religions, all the while remaining firm in his madrasa taught lesson that all kafirs have no religion and they must be put to the sword for the ultimate attainment of the company of 72…….

    [Reply]

  • B.V.SHENOY

    Vinodji,

    you said, “@BV Shenoy
    Raghu Vyas is a right-wing painter who led the sanghi charge against MF. If you don’t know him then you don’t know what all MF went through before leaving India.”

    I never knew that to dislike MFH for what he did to Hindu goddesses, I must also know (and perhaps like too) Raghu Vyas. The more germain issue is: if Husain had had some sensitivity for the feelings of Hindus, he wouldn’t have painted those obscene paintings of Saraswathi and Bharat Mata. He wouldn’t also ahve persisted with the same marketing trick even after apologising to the Hindu community.

    [Reply]

    vinod sharma Reply:

    @BV Shenoy
    You do not own India. Nor does the ideology you represent owns it. People will say and draw what they want. I am also a Hindu and a better one at that. If my religion permits Khajuraho and the Sun Temple in Orissa, It permits Husain’s artistic expression many art historians who are Hindus have no problems with.
    The Sanghis can only patronize blinkered vassals like you and Vyas. But there are enough Hindus and Indians to show you guys your place. Stop bullying and start debating. If you aren’t capable of it, leave this blog. I know you wouldn’t quit because your masters have assigned you the task of vitiating the climate here. You are a pamphleteer.

    [Reply]

    B.V.SHENOY Reply:

    To claim that you are a better Hindu is your arrogance at its height stemming from the feeling that you, as an acknowledged and unabashed congressie, OWN INDIA. If it was in your power, you would have driven us the lesser Hindus out of India a long time ago.

    I will now give you a challenge, my dear Shri Vinod Sharma. The day you really get bold enough to drive away the real bully/bullies from your blog, I will stop visiting or writing on your blog. You have so many times claimed that the tur.d/s is/are out, banished/driven away etc., etc. But you have fallen flat on your face.

    NOW, ACCEPT MY CHALLENGE
    BE A BOLD INDIAN, IF NOT A BOLD HINDU,
    DRIVE AWAY ONCE FOR ALL THE TUR.DS.
    THEN YOU TOO DON’T HAVE TO BULLY ME, I WILL WALK AWAY FROM HERE HAPPILY FOR THE SAKE OF OTHER HARASSED POSTERS.

    DO YOU HAVE IT IN YOU DEAR SHRI VINOD SHARMA?

    [Reply]

    Ravi Reply:

    I think you are the largest TUR-D of them all.

    vinod sharma Reply:

    @BV Shenoy
    So you come here as the RSS’s scavanger. Neither do I speak for you nor for other abusive types who visit this blog. For me both versions are equally despicable. I know that you are a bad Hindu full of the kind of hatred that isn’t taught by my religion. So don’t try your exhortations and challenges on me. I don’t consider you any better than an internet Togadia frothing at his mouth.

    nirav Reply:

    Mr Vinod,

    In that case do you consider the danish cartoon also in same light?
    Do you accept that muslim world should accommodate the cartoon in same way?
    would your opinion be same incase someone drew mother Mary naked or muhammed naked?
    Also by that logic isnt MF hussain (dead or alive) also open to criticism of his works just as he is open for appreciation.(ofcourse by nonviolent means only)

    Tolerance is a virtue only if backed by consistency else it is at best prejudice and at worse cowardice.

    [Reply]

    vinod sharma Reply:

    @BV Shenoy
    Cavemen like you with a medieval mindset can only spew venom. You don’t even spare dead men if they are Muslims. Consider the following: If I draw the way Husain did, what will you do? Send your sena goons to kill me? You can only do that because no Hinduism has no space for excommunication. My gods do not need your defence Mr Faux Hindu.Even your gods don’t.

    [Reply]

    B.V.SHENOY Reply:

    I may be a caveman, but a much more refined cave man than you can ever be.

    Dr.Pankaj has already replied to your pseudo secular threats.

    [Reply]

    Rajeev Reply:

    Shenoy,
    This is true face of Vinod. He did exactly same with me but when I replied in kind, he came to you guys for sympathy. He was the one who spoke ill about my parents followed by caste insult. When I could take it no longer, I used son-in-law word which I regretted later.

    This same guy defamed Bhushans with fake CDs but his arrogance didn’t allow him to apologize. He is the way he is because of congressi geners..morally corrupt and thugs of highest order.

    B.V.SHENOY Reply:

    Rajeev,

    apologising for mistakes and errors of judgement doesn’t come easily for congressmen. The fake CD episode is a glaring example of Vinod Sharma’s “electronic trickery” and his claim to “due diligence” have been shown to be utterly pseudo in the light of later proof. He has also shown in that episode that he was only acting as the mouthpiece of the party he belongs to, in partnership with the infamous dalaal, Amar Singh.

    vinod sharma Reply:

    @BV Shenoy
    Refined caveman? ha ha ha ….just because you have a couple of nodding heads around you? Ever stood in a minority of one Mr Brave Hindu? Or are you always part of a lynch mob?
    PS: How will you draw Krishna’s Gopis after the Lord stole their clothes?

    Vijay Kumar Reply:

    Vinodji

    I am asking you a question which even Ravi has not answered for me.

    What if a Christian, Sikhs or a HIndu drew pictures of prophet Mohammad in a similar way. What would be your reaction?

    [Reply]

  • rajiv

    @Shenoy,

    Who cares if MF Hussain is sensitive to Hindu sentiments ( which themselvs differ from one hindu to next, and thats a very positive thing ) or not ?

    You may be right to think and say, that he would not take the same liberties with the sentiments of his community as he idd with others. He has been paid a large sum of money by , as per public reports, by the Qatari queen, to make paintings on the glories of ‘arab civilization’ . Now what is that ??

    You may say, he is a crook. He may be. You may say, Mr Sharma is knave or duplicitous or a congress propogandist masquendering as a journalistic crook. And he may be.

    But MF Hussain still has the right and freedom to paint whatever he wants in a liberal and free society that we want India to be and you have the right to express what you think of him and his propogandists.

    [Reply]

    Pankaj#1 Reply:

    Rajiv;
    Here I disagree with you. Think about the opposite, A non muslim painter, painting reverred characters of muslims from Arabia, naked. Was that possible in India? Absolutely not. What furor and mayhem it would have generated. In completely free society of Denmark, cartoonist could not paint prophet’s face and you are seeking nude paintings freedom on the basis of Artistic license? By the same token, as a part of freedom, we should not question, tur and supet tur..to write any obscenity?? We should not object to them either. painting of nude Islamic character should be as repugnant as Hindu characters. In a society, as religious as India, these licenses are not possible, not desirable. Just because MF was an international celebrity, actively supported by (GOI) to represent a successful muslim face, like so many others, to prove indian secularism can not be condoned.

    [Reply]

    (Dr.) B.N.Anand Reply:

    Mr. Pankaj #1
    It is amazing that Mr. Vinod sharma has so many double standards on so many topics. Satanic Verses could be banned in the country to take care of sensibilities of minorities in the country. But MFH paintings depicting Hindu Goddesses nude is a piece of art. What a way to play politics even at the cost of one’s religion.
    BNA

    [Reply]

  • Rajiv

    @Pankaj

    My point is just as I demand full freedom of expression for myself, including freedom to hurt the cult-ist sentinments of a primitive, regressive, illeterate cult similarly I do not demand that anyone respect what I believe deserving of respect.

    How can I have control over, how someone’s sentiments may get hurt ?
    Similarly no one has control over my sentiments. That would be giving too much power to regressive and illeterates.

    There are serious questions about MF Hussains motivations.
    But you cannot question his right to say or express anything he wants, in a liberal society.
    That’s my idea.

    Mr Hussain, voluntarily gave up Indian citizenship to get Qatari citizenship.

    Mr Hussain, undertook a project, financed by the Islamic state of Qatar, to draw paintings on the ‘Arab civilization’ and it was precisely then he took the Qatari citizenship. It was a very lucrative project for Mr Hussain.

    Now you may ask ‘Arab civilization’ ? Is Mr Hussain a painter or a inventor ?

    [Reply]

    B.V.SHENOY Reply:

    I am repeating here a quote.

    A western journalist asked Mahatma Gandhi what he thought of western cxulture. The Mahatma replied, ” the idea is good”

    The same holds good for the so called Arab culture.

    [Reply]

    Pankaj#1 Reply:

    Rajiv;
    though I agree with you largely but I am talking about disrespect, I respect the freedom to paint, but even in all the free societies of world, can you paint Mother Mary in nude, or christ in similar bad light. this is about free societies. While personal freedom is totally accepted, your actions,which hurt society and generate animosity is not accepted . You depict any Hispanic or black man, denigrating them on the basis of race or colour, even on radio, not the permanent record as in painting, you will be hauled over coals. Public may or may not lynch you, but courts will be almost ruthless with these abusers, I think, we should make a distinction between personal freedom and freedom to indulge in making fun of Society, race, or religion should be ruthlessly curbed. In Indian context, where religion, any religion has so profound influence on people, you have to respect their sensitivities, as we do here in North America for colour and nationalities.
    On a different optics, the point is not respect but, if your argument is carried forward, then depicting hindu god and goddesses on toilet seat is alright, as it is freedom of that company to use whatever icon it decide upon. Indians in USA should not protest but feel great about this freedom. another company may decide to use, christian motifs in the similar manner and I assure you, result will not be pleasant.

    [Reply]

    Pankaj#1 Reply:

    You speak about Quatari offer to MF, and say that money was the only motive, I disagree. Juxtaposing, MFs saga in India, Quatari said, You have done your Job in India, now come and as opposite to pagan Indian society, paint glory of Arab civilization. That is how I see it.

    [Reply]

    Pankaj#1 Reply:

    Rajiv;
    when you analyze the Cult, you do not refer to their private parts. You largely confine yourself to rituals, or propensity of that cult to do things in a regressive manner. There is no sexual innuendos. By all means criticize hindu religion’s bad practices, because there are many. But one should draw a red line as a self censor.

    [Reply]

  • Rajiv

    @Pankaj, Shenoy,

    What you may be right at is in deriding the filthy duplicity that many congress propogandists and scoundcrel-secularists show. Here is an example.

    It is an irony that Alok Tomar who printed Muhammad’s cartoon had to go to jail without the same group raising any objection to Mr Alok Tomar’s right to freedom of expression.

    Similarly, Mr Hussain fled India in large measure to avoid appearing in court cases filed against him on charges of indecency and hurting religious sentiments.
    You are right in pointing out that the group of people which now vowed that Mr Hussain should enjoy freedom of expression , were either silent or demanding that Mr Alok Tomar be sent to prison.

    There is a reason why I hold thugs in the media, from Mr N Ram to Kuldip Nayar to congress porpogandist Mr Sharma in such open contempt. Its because of their duplicitous standards that do a world of harm to India.

    I would argue that both Mr Alok Tomar and Mt MF Hussain, should enjoy full freedom of expression.
    The irony is Mr Alok Tomar went to prison and Mr Hussain went on to be a paid painter for so called Arab civilization.

    [Reply]

  • Balwinder Singh

    everyone arguing above have missed the most basic point, including, sad to say VINOD SHARMA-

    Hussain has every right to paint Sitaji nude, and every right not to paint the prohet, but once a significant body of people object then under the law of the land the dispute moves to the court.

    After that, it is upto Hussain to either show neutrality and paint prophet’s face and get killed or show some decency for the majority population of the country and withdraw any objectionable paintings, preferably with an apology for these are troubled times we live in
    ————————
    SHAN- you once again avoided answering the main charge against you above and vanished. When the number of people who have admonished you or even abused you in exasperation exceeds 80% you should take heed and change your behaviour.
    These include- Shenoy, Riswan, Dr Pankaj, Ashish, Observer, Vijay, Vinay, Mishraji, Rajiv with I, Nirav, etc etc. The following have hurled vile language at you in the past – ravi, tajender and rajeev
    ————
    although lately you have become so lonely that you have virtually started sucking upto ravi, tajender although you all practically had maa behen ki gaalis in the past

    [Reply]

    Balwinder Singh Reply:

    sorry, regarding hussain- meant to say that beyond all airy fairy liberal arguments there is the Indian law which prohibits any act that hurts religious sentiments

    you offend, i protest peacefully, no apology, I take you to court, court decides if i am loony or whether my case has merit.
    meanwhile, you decide whether showing some insight and respect for a community’s hurt feelings is imp
    you decide it is- we live happily ever after
    you decide to do Rushdie- then life is messy, you run away to Qatar – we miss you, you miss watan- no one happy

    [Reply]

    Balwinder Singh Reply:

    you paint DR paagal SHAN in nude everyone happy.
    we convert painting into dart board- put in my Pub Glassy junction- and everyone throws darts
    you hit left RATIONALIST buttock- you get £ 5
    you hit right HUMANIST buttock , you get £ 10

    SHAN IS ORGIASTIC- I-got-attention-i-love-it-my-name-is-shan-pareshan-ravi-pl-be-my-friend-i-am-lonely

    [Reply]

    shan Reply:

    I love balls i play with dangly balls , my name is balls winder , and also i bleed the sheep’s rear , my surname is sandhu and i am a pucca BHONDHU

    shan Reply:

    @Balls scratcher Bhondhu, you are as fun as a dog’s ****

    shan Reply:

    those **** stands for F A R T

  • Ravi

    Supreme Court of India found M.F. Hussain innocent. “MF Husain has been accused of obscenity in at least seven cases filed against him in a number of Indian states.

    He is alleged to have offended Hindus with a painting in which he represented India as a nude goddess.

    In dropping criminal proceedings against the painter, the Delhi court said the painting was not obscene.
    Under Indian laws, obscenity is a criminal offence. ”

    Hindu Fundos still hunded him for minor political gains.

    [Reply]

  • Ravi

    FROM THE BBC.

    “Mr Husain’s career was marked by controversy when he was accused of obscenity and denounced by hardline Hindus for a painting of a nude goddess.

    His exhibitions were often attacked by hardline Hindu groups.

    In 2006, Mr Husain publicly apologised for his painting, Mother India. It shows a nude woman kneeling on the ground creating the shape of the Indian map.

    He also promised to withdraw the controversial painting from a charity auction.

    In 2008, India’s Supreme Court refused to launch criminal proceedings against Mr Husain saying that his paintings were not obscene and nudity was common in Indian iconography and history. “

    [Reply]

  • Rajiv

    Mr Hussain , should have the freedom to paint any cartoon or nude depiction of any god or goddess of any religion. His freedom is not curtailed by what my religion allows or not allows. Ih his freedom of expressuion was a function of what my religion allows or not then his freedom is restricted and curtailed by anathor religion.

    Similarly, any person, Muslim or non-Muslim, should have the freedom to draw, deride or depict any other religious figure of any religion including a arab called Muhammad. My freedom of expression, should not be curtailed by what the other religion allows to the followers of that religion. If that be so, then my freedom of expression is curtailed by what some other religion preaches. That’s tyranny.

    Its a very simple concept but dishonest men in the media, from Mr N Ram to V Sharma, wont address.

    [Reply]

  • Rajiv

    Its like saying, theft is allowed in one religion and not allowed in anathor, so people who steal, will be judged based on the religion they belong to !

    In many countries, you are sent to prison if you have more than 1 wife. No exception. Does that hurt the religious sentiments as preached by someone from arabia ?

    People , who are argung for duplicitous standards, based on what is allowed in one religion Vs what is not allowed in anathor, are either dumb or wilfully dishonest.

    Right and wrong, as decided by law, should not make any distinction based on your race, ethnicity , religion etc.

    [Reply]

    B.V.SHENOY Reply:

    Hey, Pakiturd,

    The Kerala High court held that he was guilty of hurting the feelings of Hindus with some of his paintings.

    [Reply]

  • Rajiv

    Where are the scoundrel-secularists and scoundrel-liberals ?

    Come on, defend the right of thugs to protest that their sentiments have been violated and those that violated it be sent to prison when someone depicts a person from arabia in a cartoon ?

    Now muhammad may be gods messenger ( who incidentally prohibited any other messenger from ever coming , lol ) for people who believe in him. Thats just fine with me.

    For others he is just a 7th century arab , with many farcical concepts. If he lived today the way he lived in 7th century, he would be sent to prison in many liberal, democratic states. The same applies to religious figures from Hinduism, Christianity etc.

    [Reply]

  • Ravi

    FREEDOMS and RIGHTS

    Are we free to paint Mohammad or not?

    People have argued here that protecting an individual’s freedom of expression is so important that any painter should be allowed to paint what ever they like, including the likeness of Mohammad.
    With freedoms come responsibilities and it is incumbent on every individual to ensure that these freedoms do not contravene other people’s rights.

    My right to play loud music has to be balanced against the right of my neighbour for peaceful sleep.

    Best way to understand these cautions is to look at the Article 10 of Human Rights.

    Article 10: Freedom of Expression

    (1) Everyone has the right of freedom of expression. This right shall include freedom to hold opinions and to receive and impart information and ideas without inference by public authority and regardless of frontiers. This Article shall not prevent States from requiring the licensing of broadcasting, television or cinema enterprises.

    (2) The exercise of these freedoms, since it carries with it duties and responsibilities, may be subject to such formalities, conditions, restrictions or penalties as are prescribed by law and are necessary in a democratic society, in the interests of national security, territorial integrity or public safety, for the prevention of disorder or crime, for the protection of health or morals, for the protection of the reputation or rights of others, for preventing the disclosure of information received in confidence, or for maintaining the authority and impartiality of the judiciary.

    M.F. Husain was persecuted by hardline Hindus on the assumed injury to morals and hurt to their religious sentiments.

    Painting of Gods is not proscribed by Hindu religion, so M. F. Hussain was free to paint Sita. Hardline Hindus considered the painting to be obscene, which the Delhi Court found it to be not obscene.

    Islam prohibits the painting of any being human or animal. This based upon a philosophy that only God can create “beings”. That is why most Islamic art is geometric and abstract. So if when any one paints any “being” then they are doing so in contradiction to the teachings of Islam as well as Plato. Whilst painting of “beings” and ordinary people has been long accepted by Islam, a line has been drawn at drawing the likeness of Mohammad.

    So if some one exercises their right to draw Mohammad then it has to be balanced against the right of Muslims to not be offended.

    Whilst there are a small number of paintings Mohammad in existence by and large this religious taboo has been maintained.

    M.F. Husain did not break any taboo.

    There are no absolute rights and no absolute freedoms.

    [Reply]

    Pankaj#1 Reply:

    Vow;
    Chit bhi meri and patt bhi meri. Great argument.

    [Reply]

    Rajeev Reply:

    This is typical Islamic style of arguments.

    By the way most of the muslim countries have never accepted UN charter on human rights.

    [Reply]

    B.V.SHENOY Reply:

    Mr.Superturd,

    the Kerala High Court stopped the state government from honouring MFH with the Raja Ravi Verma award, for the reason that he has hurt the feelings of vast sections of the majority community (of course, with the exception of pseudos like Vinod Sharma) with some of his paintings. Later efforts by the Lefr Front govenment and also the central government to confer the award on MFH failed.

    [Reply]

    Shoeb K Reply:

    Ravi- I do not know if you are a Pakistani or a Muslim; i do not care; but i do admit you are good at twisting stuff.

    Mohemed Boyuri killed the Dutch film maker Theo Van Gogh in broad daylight, and impaled a five page note (declaring holy war) into his corpse with a knife. Theo Van Gogh’s crime was that he made a film on domestic violence among islamic immigrants in Netherlands. He did not even paint the Prophet.

    During his trial, he turned to Mrs Anneke Von Gogh, Theo’s mother, and said ” I don’t feel your pain, I don’t have any sympathy for you. I don’t feel for you because you are a non-believer”.

    Fast forward a few years; Mohamed Geele tries to axe Kurt Wastergaard, a Danish cartoonist for his cartoon that some muslims fiound offensive. Another episode in the pursuit of the cartoonist just ended in a court room in Chicago yesterday when a Pakistani Muslim businessman Rana was sentenced for funding an attack on this cartoonist. I believe the pipeline of Muslims waiting to kill this cartoonist is fairly long.

    India being a great country, Hussain has all the freedoms as an individual and an artist. You are taking too much “freedom” when you say “painting of Gods is not prohibited by Hindusim’.. My understanding is that there are no dos and donts carefully crafted in Hindu religion, other than an underlying theme of Sanatana Dharma.

    Nobody is arguing on the legality of Hussain painteings. He definitely should have been aware of the hurt and anguish that will cause in a large number of people. If it was just one painting, it could have been dismissed as artistic freedom, imagination gone wild etc. In adddition to his derogatory painting of Bharat mata, he had four other denigrating paintings 1) godess Durga copulating with a tiger 2) Goddess lakshmi perched naked on the elephant head of Lord Ganesha 3) nude painting of Goddess Saraswathi ( the god of “learning”, quite sacred in Hinduism) and 4) naked Sita sitting on Ravana’s thighs. It looks like he was working overtime during a time period just to humiliate Hndu gods and Hindus in general, although that may not have been his inner mission.No recorded paintiter of India has ever drawn these types of paintings. So, the argument that he was simply following the practices in Hinduism is simply false and misleading. (one can stretch about naked statues in stone carved temples; my understanding is there are no temples where there are nude gods and goddesses sculptured, and even if there are it may be only in one or two places, and none of them contemporary and all go back to thousands of years).

    Although an artist is free to paint anything; in Hussain’s case, it adds insult to injury that not only he did not dare to paint the Prophet or Quaranic characters, all portraits of Msulim women in his paintings were fully clothed. A better judgement should have prevailed; if he had the urge to paint nude women, he could have painted zillions of nude women and met his urge. More than an artist, he loved life – wine, women, u name it – so he did not want to die prematurely at the hands of a M uslim man, so he did not paint naything offensive to Muslims.

    MF Hussain should be thankful that he was born in India, and there are no Mohamed Boyuris and Mohamed Gilles and Rana Tanwars in India or among Hindus.

    [Reply]

    Ravi Reply:

    Shoeb K

    I suggest you read what I have written.

    I have not mentioned anything what so ever about any Islamic States, or any deranged individual Muslim terrorists. I was very saddened the day Theo Van Gough was killed. If his killer was sentenced to death punishment by a recognised court of law, I would be happy to volunteer to be his executioner.

    I was arguing it from a theoretical level, mainly on repeated requests from Vijay.

    So you have joined the people, who imagine what I have said and then go on to attack it.

    I do not support the Islamic Republic of Pakistan. It is an extremely bad country. I do not support Saudi Arabia, it is even worse than Pakistan and it is the real source of Islamic radicalism.

    However, all of that; does not add up to Islam as a religion, or it contributes towards an argument that because M.F. Husain was insensitive towards the religious feelings of Hindus, that we should in revenge start supporting those who may want to paint the likeness of Mohammad.

    You may be in competition with Pakistan and/or Saudi Arabia, I am not.

    Feel free to attack me for what I have said, rather than what you imagine I have said.

    [Reply]

    Shoeb K Reply:

    Ravi- You are twisting again.

    I did not say I am in cvopetition with Pakistan or Saudi Arabia.. In fact i did not even mention Saudi Arabia in my response. And Pakistani reference was in connection to Rana, who funded an attack on Kurt Wastergard for drawing an offensive carttoon.

    And I did not say that “we should in revenge start supporting those who may want to paint teh likeness of mohamed”.

    The only thing I said was Hussain should have been more sensitive; one could dismiss if he had painted only one offensive thing, but he painted four or five of them (five on the same God would have been a little Ok than five on five different gods), and that he could live along life because there are no Ranas or Mohamed gilles or Mohamed Biyours in India/or among Hindus.

    Ravi Reply:

    Shoeb K

    I agree that M.F. Husain should have been respectful of Hindu senstivities.

    However, are you ruling out political motives of Hard Line Hindus, in blowing the episode out of proportion.

    The hurt felt among Hindus was not universal.

    shan Reply:

    @ravi Oh really , SO WHAT ABOUT PERSIAN ART , HOW ABOUT MUGHAL ART
    ALSO PAINTING PROPHET’S ARSE SIDE SHOULD BE OKAY SO SHOULD PROPHET ENTERING THE ROOM WHERE 9YR OLD AYESHA IS LYING NUDE WITH HER DOLLS
    ALSO HOW ABOUT PERFUME GARDEN

    [Reply]

    Ashish Reply:

    @Ravi,
    great essay. I totally, totally agree that Hussain had every right to paint what and who he liked because
    a) He did not break any law
    b) He did not break any taboo (accepted for arguments’ sake)
    Now just tell me this.
    If someone painted the Prophet, would he break any law?
    Who decides how many people I must be capable of offending before being proscribed? And, who speaks for all Muslims?
    And, what is the punishment for breaking a taboo; which many artists, scientists have done since ages? Is that prescribed by law on the statutes or law of the scriptures? Should the state be justified in offering protection to the artist -as the state of UK did to Salman Rushdie and the Indian state failed to offer to Hussain? Or, should it refuse, like the state of West Bengal did not to Taslima Nasreen? Or, in a distant past, Galileo or Copernicus?
    If we never break taboo, we will stay stuck where we are today. So, I find your argument centred on “taboo” a little hard to swallow.

    [Reply]

  • Pankaj#1

    Shenoy;
    I am sad that Vinod has attacked you so brutally. He comes out as a very intolerant person. Or his tolerance is for select few.

    [Reply]

    B.V.SHENOY Reply:

    Pankaj ji,

    It was his pseudo secularism that was talking, not he.

    He had said so many things, most of them unpleasant, unparliamentary and abusive, but I have never taken offence to them. But today, he has, in an utterly pseudo outburst, he has crossed all limits of civility and decency.

    But, if he does act on my challenge, I will be truely glad to disappear from here once for all. Till now, I felt wanted here by all of you, but there is a price for everything.

    [Reply]

    vinod sharma Reply:

    @BV Shenoy
    You are welcome to do what you want. Nobody is indispensible.

    [Reply]

    Rajeev Reply:

    Pankaj,
    Vinod does that all the time and when replied back in same language, starts playing victim.

    He is to me lowest of life form as a journalist. This guy has no shame..He never evaluates his action because he is arrogant to the core.

    There is no need for anybody to leave the blog. The pressure should be maintained on sarkari journalists so that their real face is exposed to others.

    Please note that there are many people who read the replies to the blog but never post so we by exposing Vinod are actually educating people about true face of paid media.

    [Reply]

  • Rajiv

    Good so here we have a scoundrel-liberal, arguing exactly the way I expected.
    Lol

    respect cannot be ordained by law. respect is earned. I cannot demand what I respect to be the same as what someone else respects.

    the concept of freedom is also not same in all societies. Display of Nazi symbols is part of political expression in USA but prohibited in Germany.

    In criminal state like Islamic Republic of Saudi Arabia, you are not allowed to build a temple or Church. There are severe restrictions on the right of people to practice and profess other religions.

    The the criminal entity of Pakistan, the state constitution prohibits minorities from becoming president or prime-minister.

    I could go on and on.

    Thug callous and criminal cultist ideologies like that, which deprive others the same rights that they demand, should be opposed by any people claiming to be liberal or secularist. Otherwise they are just dumb-criminal-partners in crime.

    [Reply]

  • Rajiv

    Lets not play dumb here.

    Islamic states, are among the most vile in the world in treatment of minorities and granting equal rights to them.

    Its not ‘taboo’ in Saudi Arabia, to ban Hindus from building a temple in Mecca.

    So if an Arab wants to build a mosque in India, would it be okay for Indian authorities to dis-allow so , because disallowing building public places of worship of other religions is allowed in Islam of Saudi-Arabia and is not a ‘taboo’ ?? No islamic taboo would be broken in that case !!

    I mean, how shameless can this scoundrels be ?

    [Reply]

    Rajeev Reply:

    Saudi king refused to visit Rajghat during his official visit citing that it was against Islam.
    Indian govt, relented despite the fact that it has been a tradition for foreign dignitaries to visit Rajghat.

    There is a clear cut law in Saudi-
    1. Non-mulsims can not pray to their god in both private and public. They can be arrested for breaking this law.
    2. Non-muslims are not allowed to enter Mecca city.
    3. All non-muslims objects of worship such as idols and cross are confiscated at the airports and DESTROYED.

    The true hindu like Vinod Sharma are actually coward who hide their duplicity behind the cover of liberalism. If Mr.Sharma really believes in liberalism, let him post a blog supporting rights of non-muslims to paint Mohammad.

    [Reply]

    Balwinder Singh Reply:

    rajeev, much as i hate the saudis primitivemess, should we in europe or india come down to their level and what- ban islam, when 14% of our population practices it

    [Reply]

    Rajeev Reply:

    Balwinder,
    Usually I don’t interact with you but if you are sticking to the topic, let me tell you almost all 57 Islamic countries including pride of muslim world malaysia do not respect rights of minorities. Is there a single Islamic country that allows non-muslims to become President/PM?

    Do these muslim countries have any kind of level to stoop to?

    No one is saying Ban Islam but what we are demanding is reciprocal respect and rights.

    Rajiv Reply:

    @Balwinder,

    No we should never stoop to the level of crass callousness as practiced in many Islamic states. We should treat all citizens equally. Not because they demand it but because thats what we beleive to be the right thing.
    People are mostly born into a religion. A religion does not make a person good or bad. A muslim or hindu or christian can be the most ethical person on earth or the vilest, irrespective of his religion.
    We all know that.

    But neither should we look the other way round. If we beleive that democracy, freedoms are universal rights then we should demand that Islamic states treat all people equally.

    The world imposed trade sanctions on rascist apartheid state of South Africa. We should impose the same on religious apartheid states and cults.

    Rajiv Reply:

    How about we start ‘respecting Saudi Taboos ‘ about how they treat other minority religions and apply the same treatement to Muslims all over the world, where Islam is the minority religion ? Would that be okay ?

    No we don’t do that. Because we judge what’s right or wrong, based on our concept of what’s right or wrong, not based on what’s common or allowed in one religion and what’s taboo in anathor.

    [Reply]

  • Balwinder Singh

    SHAN- you once again avoided answering the main charge against you above and vanished. When the number of people who have admonished you or even abused you in exasperation exceeds 80% you should take heed and change your behaviour.

    These include- Shenoy, Riswan, Dr Pankaj, Ashish, Observer, Vijay, Vinay, Mishraji, Rajiv with I, Nirav, etc etc. The following have hurled vile language at you in the past – ravi, tajender and rajeev
    ————
    although lately you have become so lonely that you have virtually started sucking upto ravi, tajender although you all had exchanged maa behen ki gaalis in the past
    ——————-
    dont abuse others , i leave you alone SHAN

    [Reply]

    Balwinder Singh Reply:

    ONE OF THE BIGGEST IRONIES IS THAT the one you hurled the vilest abuse against for so long is now your supporter- tajender
    SHAN, how do you spell credibility

    [Reply]

    shan Reply:

    @Balls scratcher bhondhu, reduce daru , stop kabuterbazi , do some reading in english not gurumukhi or khalistan times

    [Reply]

  • http://- Rajeev

    Now I think, Danish paper was fully justified in publishing Mohammad’s cartoons. The freedom of expression can not be conditional.

    [Reply]

  • Rajiv

    A sikh friend of mine, needed to go to Saudi Arabia on a business trip.

    He then found out that he could not carry his symbolic kripan and his guru granth sahib with him. If discovered in his luggage at the airport , where it will be throughly searched, it will be confiscated.

    So do we have to get lectures on tolerance and taboo from practitioners of such vandalism ?

    [Reply]

    Rajeev Reply:

    ” If discovered in his luggage at the airport , where it will be throughly searched, it will be confiscated.”

    also add DETROYED as per Islamic customs.

    [Reply]

    Rajiv Reply:

    How about ‘respecting Islamic laws’ and awarding Islamic punishments to Muslims who steal in England, USA, or non-Islamic states ?

    After all its ‘NOT TABOO’ in Islam to cut off hands and feet and is even practiced today in some Islamic states.

    So should muslims be treated differently , because such treatment is allowed, even encouraged in their religion or do we apply laws irrespective of what a religion allows or dis-allows ?

    I am for equal rights of all citizens, irrespective of any religion. It would be extremely unfair to treat people differently based on religion, race etc.
    I demand that muslims be treated equally, irrespective of how other Islamic states treat non-Muslims.

    But we should call a spade a spade and not indulge in callous, criminal duplicity.

    [Reply]

    Rajeev Reply:

    Actually I had asked same question to one of my muslim classmates who once told me “We will create another pakistan”.

    Why do Indian muslims insist on Sharia based personal laws, how should sharia based criminal law? If criminal Sharia laws are applied, I am sure 90% of muslims in India will be crippled.

    Vijay Kumar Reply:

    @ Rajiv

    A Muslim engineer friedn of mine, who is happily married always jokes that when we talk about Sharia we want *** for multiple marriages…. and never for chopping off hands! :D

  • Rajiv

    @Balwinder

    leave the cripple from pak alone. He is here to show the nature of wahabi-pak-mentality and does not deserve interaction. He should be in arabia serving the ummah-monarchy.

    Regarding Shan, you may argue what he says but leave personal issues aside.

    [Reply]

    Balwinder Singh Reply:

    rajiv, i respect you. I leave SHAN alone till he indulges in name calling or abuse. If you go back one year when these blogs were not that popular, then SHAN used to strut around like a peacock.- he appointed himself the resident medical and UK expert
    Then these blogs became popular and when brilliant minds or good entertainers started coming and he got forgotten- he started lashing out non stop- wants others to leave this blog. He forced AShish out last month for a while.
    so he needs to sort his act

    [Reply]

    Balwinder Singh Reply:

    now tell me rajiv, that this garbage is written by a doctor-
    shan says:
    February 6, 2011 at 11:06 pm
    I have the authority to comment on Indians from different states. OF ALL THE IMMIGRANTS TO UK GUJRATIS ARE THE MOST SUCCESSFUL IN EVERY FRONT. The sikhs are the most corrupt both in private life and in work, LICK WHITES LIKE HELL. Tamils are a two different sorts , the srilankan which are CREEPY, the indian which are PATHOLOGICAL LIARS and white posterior suckers,
    .Now for my own community ,mostly GP’s AND BASICALLY INCORRIGIBLE, suffer from a massive delusion of granduer. As to the bengalees in West bengal ,this is a football team who are losing the game 10-0, thus dropped shoulders , petty , mean and small.In fact I have felt bengalees (that is exclusively WB)
    share a few common traits with english , some aspect of english life is GRAND , beyond description , yet there is is a considerble element which is pure stench.
    Yes I do call other people racist and Fascist.
    ————

    [Reply]

    Rajiv Reply:

    @Balwinder,
    I agree its a self-evident garbage posting. But the response should not be that Bengalis are so and so. Then you are playing the game that Shan wants you to play. Thats not your sport.

    What Mr Shan says there does not say anything about any community but speaks only of what Mr Shan says he thinks. That posting does more harm to Mr Shan’s reputation , more than anything you can ever say.

    Rajiv Reply:

    @Balwinder,

    I am not saying you are wrong. You come accross as fairly liberal and can take a joke and are not hyper-sensitive. You have all those good qualities. But the ongoing exchange with Mr Shan, has only one solution. One of you have to ignore the other. This is not about who is right or who is wrong.

    [Reply]

    Balwinder Singh Reply:

    ITS SIMPLE- IN THE LAST 1 MONTH shan abused- yes- abused and faught with three people whose writings I enjoy or respect- mishraji, shenoy, ashish
    he stops doing that, i stop hitting him
    debate, no name calling or abuse- simple rule

    Ashish Reply:

    Balwinder-paaji,
    ab buss!
    Chhaddo ji; gale milo, Shan se milo aur daru piyo.. split the bill

  • http://- Rajeev
  • http://- Rajeev

    Who was first person to walk on moon?
    Neil Armstrong….No..as per Islam, It was mohammad who went to the moon and sliced in half. This reminds me of Kalidas sitting the branch and cutting it at the same time.

    [Reply]

    Rajiv Reply:

    @Rajeev,
    I have no problem if some people believe so. Its their freedom. All religions have many such mythical concepts. The issue is, you dont tell me whats allowed or not allowed in your religion and then ask me to respect that.

    [Reply]

  • Pankaj#1

    @ Everyone; Similarities between Ramdev and MF
    So Ramdev and MF started from an humble begining. Both went through the hardship in their initial years. Both attained international fame.Both amassed fabulous wealth.
    Now the differences:
    Ramdev’s finance are being questioned, MFs were never.
    Ramdev’s movement started from grass root level, MFs started at that level but soon got the fancy of Priyadarshini as Durga- good business approach.
    Ramdev movement was public supported from very begining, MF got government patronage quite early.
    Ramdev is Hindu, MF is Muslim.
    Ramdev is darling of masses, MF is darling of rich and powerful including in media.
    Ramdev is fighting for Public, government is fighting for MF.
    Ramdev felt acutely about corruption, MF was corruption himself.
    Biggest difference:
    Ramdev took on the government, MF was supporting Government( Flawed Secular ethos) l

    [Reply]

  • Vijay Kumar

    @ Ravi

    The answer on the right of Non Muslims to paint the prophet was very very evasive !

    You can nevver call yourself a liberal if you say one guy has the rights but since Islam forbids idolotary you cannot.

    Ravi… Prpgree in life and religion is only achieved by questioning.

    HOw would the B urka be banned unless you question the texts and burn the robe?

    HOw would the suicde bomber be stopped unless you question the text and kick his butt…

    How would the Ahmadi and the Christians and HIndus saved in Pakistan be saved unless you qustion the maulavi… ?

    So your answer was unsatisfactory…

    [Reply]

    Rajiv Reply:

    @Rajeev,
    Good point. Those who want Islamic law in civil matters should also enjoy and welcome Saudi criminal law in criminal matters.

    Actually there is no end to the fraudulency and bankruptcy of peddlers and apologists of cultist ideology.

    Ofcouse Congress and media men like V Sharma etc have acted an enablers.

    [Reply]

    Ravi Reply:

    Vijay

    I gave you my answer, pity you did not like it or found it satisfactory.

    I am all for questioning, and by the way there many people like us, within Islam who also ask such questions.

    On all issues, Burka, Sucidie Bombers, intolerance towards other religions are all Wahabi dictates and not universally adhered to in all Muslim countries.

    Burka is not very common in Northern African Counties, Turkey, Indonesia, etc.

    So I am with you to question these as well as question why Mohammad can not be painted. But there is a way to indulge in such debates. Breaking Taboos is not one of them.

    [Reply]

  • Raju Kurien

    Vinod-

    How long are you going to allow Tejender to recycle the same garbage and venom ..
    Look what he did to Zia’s blog.. It used to run to 500 plus commenst, now it is 50s!

    [Reply]

  • Rajiv

    I mean those Hindus ( Mr V Sharma ? ) that support seperat civil laws for muslims, should also be subject to saudi-criminal code. Those Muslims, who do not support seperate laws based on Islamic taboos, should not be subject to Islamic laws, but common law.

    That would be fair to all !

    The matter is, the state should not discriminate based on religion and should apply and craft laws that are universally applicable to its citizens. Only scoundrels and frauds argue otherwise.

    [Reply]

  • Balwinder Singh

    rajeev, thank you. you say- “”"No one is saying Ban Islam but what we are demanding is reciprocal respect and rights”"”
    we can demand reciprocal rights, but if saudi does not give, then what can we do realistically. there is still a queue of poor indians desperate for jobs abroad, including saudi.

    you are aggrieved that saudi king did not visit Rajghat- i respect your sentiments. But why do we lose sleep over that- nahi jaata hai, na jai. I feel you get very worked up by what culturally inferior or wierd countries or cultures do.
    India is on a roll, we should look to improving our ties with USA and Europe and Australia, for they benefit our country most, and also other countries like japan etc
    even muslim countries like UAE which supports India security council bid and Turkey

    [Reply]

    Raju Kurien Reply:

    Balwinder/Rajeev/Rajiv

    An inclusive vibrant India is good for Indians and the world.

    A “no ho9lds barred” government, rule of law, fast judicial disposition etc are quite important. So also, no appeasement.

    As an exmple, look at Singapore. Of course, it is a tiny country and things could be impolemented relatively easily. They banned the old Madrassa curriculum (for fear of terrorism breeding); reinstated madrasas with modern syllabii and Muslims did not complaint.

    Congress, to keep their vote bank, has left the Msulims in perennial dependency and ignorance, craeting a huge drag for India.

    Southern Muslims escaped this trap because congress was never popular in South India. Northern Muslims did not;.

    [Reply]

    Rajiv Reply:

    @Balwinder,
    What you do is impose sanctions. However for sanctions to be effective, they have to be universally imposed. In South Africa, the apartheid regime, blacks still went to work ? So what ?

    Once universal sanctions where imposed, the criminal rascist regime crumbled in a few years. The thuggaries in the arab world are crumbling one by one , from Libya to Egypt to Yemen to Syria.
    One of the kings or presidents has fled to Saudi Arabia with burn wounds.

    Sure there is no guarantee that they wont be replaced by equally thug regimes.
    The point is, the world, irrespective of what they can or cannot do, should articulate its opposition to criminal Saudi regime and similar criminally disposed Islamic states like pakistan.

    [Reply]

  • Rajiv

    @Kurien
    Agreed. The government should not pander to any religious thugs from any community.

    [Reply]

    Balwinder Singh Reply:

    CAN i JUST say in this heat and dust- to be fair to MFH- and many people are being cruel-
    1. HOW MANY OF YOU HAVE SEEN THE PAINTINGS
    2. provide the link to each pic and say this one is – okay / mildly offensive / very offensive
    3 does anyone object to khajuraho
    4 does anyone object if Sardar Sir Balwinder Singh paints the prophet and his wife in a similar aesthetic pose

    [Reply]

    Rajiv Reply:

    No his paitings do not effend me. In fact, no paiting , by anyone can offend me. I would give a prize to anyone who can paint something that offends me !
    I would pay MFH if he could offend me ! and he pays me , if he fails to offend me !

    Nor do I object if Sardar Sir Balwindersingh paints the 7th century or so arab with 4 wives in a similar aesthetic pose.

    [Reply]

    Balwinder Sandhu Reply:

    some unbelievably light relief-
    http://blogs.tribune.com.pk/story/6326/shame-on-us-muslims/
    Mutairi suggests that women in prisons and non-Muslim women should be used as sex slaves for men in Kuwait.
    ———she makes UMA BHARTI look benign

    Balwinder Sandhu Reply:

    the most decent pakistani that i know-
    what a GEM brilliant article-
    http://tribune.com.pk/story/186284/land-of-the-impure/
    There is clearly a lack of national pride. There can be no other reason that we worship invaders who raped, looted and sacked our cities. We worship them and name sons after them only because we share the same religion with them”"”
    -sir salman rashid, i salute you

  • Balwinder Singh

    rajiv with I, just read your words- cooled me down. WELL SAID
    Rajiv Reply: “”"@Balwinder,
    I agree its a self-evident garbage posting. ,,,,Then you are playing the game that Shan wants you to play. Thats not your sport.,,,,That posting does more harm to Mr Shan’s reputation , more than anything you can ever say.”"”"

    [Reply]

  • Prabhat

    @All

    Good to see the whole group active on the blog ” as usual “.

    It seems nothing has changed on this blog in these 5 weeks since I took a break and travelled. I thought the blog would be a nicer place like the mountains in Himachal ! But sadly, as I see, nothing has really changed.

    Just a few active participants, yet so many postings !

    Looks like the battle lines are drawn. Positions are really hardening.

    Ravi vs Shenoy & Co.

    Hindu vs Islam.

    But hats off to you guys. You really have capacity to argue relentlessly same way on the same topics for weeks.

    So many brilliant minds prefer to behave so ordinary just because of the positions they have taken in life !

    [Reply]

  • http://- Rajeev

    Here comes the Fauj to protect Vinod (akin to Ramdev’s fauj).

    [Reply]

  • Rajiv

    There is a decent blog on the MFH saga by Vir Sanghvi

    http://blogs.hindustantimes.com/medium-term/2011/06/10/who-brushed-out-husain/

    [Reply]

  • Rajiv

    There is a very good posting by a blogger “Ishwar” in Vir Sanghvi’s blog.

    He has actually quoted Vir Sanghvi himself from one of his earlier blogs.

    I posty it here, because he has articulated my point of view , better than I may have done.

    “Our position as liberals is that an artist has the freedom to paint what he likes. If some Hindus are offended by Husain’s nude Saraswatis, then they can simply look away. They have no right to restrict his creativity or to deny the rest of us the opportunity to view Husain’s work.

    But sceptics (all of whom are not necessarily Muslim-haters or communalists) frequently ask the obvious follow-up question: how would we have responded if Husain had painted Muslim religious figures in the nude?

    The answer is an uncomfortable one. Even if he had painted the Prophet, fully clothed and portrayed with respect, we would not have risen to Husain’s defence with the same vigour. We would have said “Islam prohibits visual representations of the Prophet so Husain should not have offended Muslims”.

    That answer weakens our claims about artistic freedom. Why should Husain’s creative abilities be hampered by some Quranic injunction? Why should non-believers be bound by the dictates of believers? Why do we campaign so hard for Husain and yet condemn the Danish cartoonist who offended Islamists? ”

    NOT MY WORDS… It was written by Vir Sanghvi on 03rd March, 2010. You can still find it in this under “CounterPoint” section of HT Blogs in last few paragraphs.

    Death doesn’t absolve him of his sins… I am happy that this funny painter is no more.

    [Reply]

    Ravi Reply:

    These blogers have expressed what I feel and have done it so much better than I am able to.

    +++

    Ganesh Maitre says:

    June 10, 2011 at 3:47 pm

    Vir — welcome back. That was an informative piece that I enjoyed reading. Yes Mr Husain died a sad, lonely death, longing for his country. While right here, right-wing leaders (with small IQ levels), saw his nude goddess paintings to be a good opportunity to forward their own narrow interests. What was wrong with those paintings? Are we supposed to follow the morals of a few uneducated men? How well do they know our Indian heritage? Would they say that Khajurao was made by Muslim invaders? That is the problem I have with this right-wing low mentality leaders that are springing up. Look at Baba Ramdev — who wants us to return to barbarism by killing anyone who is taking a bribe. Can someone in the 21st century actually speak like this. Apparently so. All I can say is RIP Maqbool Fida Husain. Your country just did not understand you.

    [Reply]

    +++

    isha Reply:

    June 10th, 2011 at 7:54 pm

    lol please read our scriptures before u attempt to proclaim uir self as a hindu. The shiva linga that we worship – what is that ….go and find out . The godesses are sculptured nude not just the apsaras. Shiva is nude everywhere ….. clearly u have not seen the temples. We are not babaric people – we are indians and hinduism is a beautiful religion- please dont malign it .It even accomodates atheists forget about anything else. Let’s evolve and work on our own self and spirit first then proclame ourselves as hindus

    what a beautiful tribute to Husain by u Ganesh. Unfortunately most people commenting on news websites are people who have no knowledge of art, spirituatlity or even hindusim. Yes the nude sculptures and the shiva linga are our culture but anything else is not allowed…..especially since husain was born a muslim .Ha this sort of hinduism is so pseudo. I hear them constantly comparing to other religions and saying blah blah blah . My question is why not our godesses – what is wrong with it ? Nudity is not obscene at all espcially when of the divine – its like the soul – stark and bare Well said Ganesh !!

    [Reply]

    Prabhat Reply:

    @Rajiv

    I never liked Hussain paint Goddesses in nude. I also never appreciated people vandalising his work of Art.

    Though I admired Hussain for achieving so much in life, breaking the conventional rules… I suspect he was selective in breaking those conventional barriers. He painted Hindu Goddesses nude, because he knew he could get away with it. He did not do the same with Islamic icons because he knew he could never get away with it.

    I would admire him if he actually did that with Islamic icons and kept in a vault and left a note to let people see them after his death. That would be truely an artistic expression and bold creative freedom – a real artistic desire to break the conventional mould.

    I am sure while he spent days painting canvas after canvas portraying Hindu Goddesses in nude, he must have wondered if he could really do that with islamic icons. But he was never bold enough to do execute that thought. that was hypocritical of him.

    Nevertheless he was brilliant as a painter.

    [Reply]

    Balwinder Sandhu Reply:

    prabhat – CAN i JUST say in this heat and dust- to be fair to MFH- and many people are being cruel-
    1. HOW MANY OF YOU HAVE SEEN THE PAINTINGS
    2. provide the link to each pic and say this one is – okay / mildly offensive / very offensive

    [Reply]

    Prabhat Reply:

    @Balwinder

    MFH had many series.

    The controversial ones are painting of Hindu Goddesses. My objections are not the paintings per say. But the very fact that MFH was conscious that he was not playing with some regular film icons but hindu religious icons. So while he consciously chose to take liberty with hindu religious icons,he could never dare to do the same with islamic icons.

    We are discussing the subject at a thought level. So there is no point doing a mechanical and statistical survey on MFH’s deviations.

    Vijay Kumar Reply:

    @ Rajiv

    It seems that Vir Sanghvi wants to make a comeback. Especially since the focus has gone of Niira Radia and shifted onto the DMK.

    What better way than to cosy upto the COngress and Kapil Sibal who drives the 2g probe.

    Arre BABA AKHIL SIBAL– WHO WAS HUSSAIN’S LAWYER IS KAPIL’S SON NA :D

    And of course why not take the NDTV stance to come back as an anchor…

    Paapi pate ka sawaal hai na… :D

    [Reply]

  • Rajiv

    @Balwinder,

    Did you post a comment in tribune.com, about Pak history tradition of making heroes out of criminals ?

    http://tribune.com.pk/story/186284/land-of-the-impure/

    Loved the comment
    “sir, again and again I read your works with admiration. sadly you have 1 admirer- me- while zaid hamid has millions”

    [Reply]

  • Rajiv

    Well hard to argue with those who say
    Hinduism is a beautiful religion that gives full freedom to anyone to depict anything in anyway they want.
    So sure, Mr Hussain should have the freedom to paint anything in any manner.

    Sadly cannot say the same thing about a medieval , regressive, uncouth interpretation of an intolerant , bigoted ideology from Saudi arabia.

    [Reply]

  • Balwinder Sandhu

    thank you Rajiv for yr compliment- that comment on Express tribune was indeed the one and only Sardar Sir Balwinder Sandhu
    I am dr jekyll and mr hyde
    on pak newspapers I am vaary serious- I am ambassodor for India
    here i indulge in jokes and spank idiots bottoms
    ps- I have quite a fan following in Pakistan newspapers- they are fascinated with sikhs

    http://tribune.com.pk/story/186284/land-of-the-impure/

    [Reply]

    Rajiv Reply:

    @Balwinder,
    Yes they are. Of the 4 recommenations , one of them is from, you know who.

    Actually, he had written on the same subject about a week ago. That too was illuminating.

    [Reply]

  • shan

    @Bloggers et al, This is my parting gift. I will busy with my studies in coming weeks.
    WHAT WOULD HAVE BEEN THE BEST CASE SCENARIO IN THE MFH SAGA

    MFH draws as per his taste and inclination. NO BODY SAYS ANYTHING, NO PROTEST NOTHING

    This VYAS guy from RSS *** BJP draws prophet entering the room where ayesha is sleeping naked.
    CANT THINK OF A BETTER RESPONSE, then shiv sena , RSS BJP are manned by people whose brain lies between their thighs.
    And this is a template for a future india , same with muslims , if danes draw cartoon , commission the greatest cartoonist for a cartoon fest on jesus .
    For future endevours , a little help from Marlowe , WHO DESCRIBED JESUS AS GAY AS HE HAS BEEN SHOWN IN PAINTINGS RESTING HIS HEAD ON THE CHEST OF JOHN THE BAPTIST
    He also said joseph was cuckold , thus mary was a woman of dubious virtues.
    Now try to understand why ISLAMIC countries are hell hole and england “land of milk and honey”
    Al Bida

    [Reply]

  • Rajiv

    @Prabhat,
    I agrree with most of what you have said. Let me re-phrase what I have said.

    1. Mr Hussain, should have the freedom of expression, irrespective of someone claiming his or her sentiment is hurt. In fact , its prejudicial to say ‘hindus sentiments are hurt’ or ‘muslims sentiments are hurt’ – just as its prejudicial to say ‘muslims are terrorists’.
    All muslims or hindus or christinas do not think and act alike.

    so 1st rule : You do not ascribe qualities to a group of people.

    sentiment is an elusive, subjective thing and no one can legislate on ’sentiments ‘.

    2. The same society and laws that give and protect Mr Hussain’s freedoms, should equally protect the right of those who may draw or depict anything that some people belonging to Mr Hussains faith may construe as ‘hurting their sentiment’.

    Why should sentiments of a believer ( in faith or quackery ), constrain the freedoms of a non-believer and vice-versa.

    Anyway, the fact that Mr Hussain took up citizenship of a theocratic state and took a multi-million dollar assignment from the Queen of the Islamic republic of Qatar to make paintings of ‘Arab civilization’ , give me more clues about Mr MFH than any of his paintings.

    [Reply]

  • Dr Mishra, UK

    wow, Balwinder praa, you HAVE been busy- from medical journals to Pakistani newspapers, haha.
    I thought my staement was quite simple- RSS is like Baretts epithelium, it is not yet, maybe never going to morph into Taleban, a cancer.
    The sentiment of this statement is self evident, as Balwinder you and others commented on it, you did not have to dig up medical websites to justify it. But thanks anyway

    [Reply]

    Pankaj#1 Reply:

    Mishraji;
    I am still in control, and will not let the animal to come out of me, which is buried deep. But these Pseudos, prasing MF( other connotation are usable), about defending him is not tolerable. Still in control of myself. I can speak about lot of Islamic Fascism, but I will not. May be that is for future generation. But I am still active and God forbid, I wish, I do not lose my cool.
    I am a simple folk, but rub me at wrong place and I will defend my self to bitter end. That end may be for psuedos.

    [Reply]

  • Dr Mishra, UK

    and to Rajiv with I, Raju with K (ha), Prabhat, Dr Pankaj, Ravi, Vijay and Shenoy- can I say that all of you missed Balwinder’s probing- perhaps the most IMPORTANT thing said today-
    ———————-
    HAS ANYONE ACTUALLY SEEN THE PHOTOS ?
    —————————————-
    OR ARE WE A BIT LIKE THE INFLAMMATORY ISLAMIC FUNDAMENTALISTS, who we love to despise, in jumping up and down over ? nothing ??

    [Reply]

    Prabhat Reply:

    @ Dr Mishra

    I find this question rather very silly.

    MFH and his paintings are well publicised.

    We are not talking about some unknown artist or remote piece of work.

    If you actually put his works together and see them in totality, you will find Goddess Saraswati, Durga and Laxmi or even a hindu brahmin in Nude abstracts while the paintings of his own mother, daughter , unknown muslim girl, muslim king or even a muslim poet always fully clad .

    MFH said that he painted Hitler nude to humiliate him. So can the same thought be attributed when he painted Hindu Goddesses nude?

    If he could not dare paint a muslim girl nude, can we really expect him to paint an Islamic icon nude ?

    Do we mean there was not a single muslim girl catch his imagination? He could never find Indianness in a single muslim girl ?

    There is a pattern to his thoughts. You try observe that pattern and you will need any further explanation.

    [Reply]

    Prabhat Reply:

    correction:

    There is a pattern to his thoughts. You try observe that pattern and you will not need any further explanation.

    [Reply]

    Pankaj#1 Reply:

    Prabhat,
    Welcome here after some time. I can say with some trepidation, that you are not Vinod. Dr. Mishra was too much politically correct. but he is in UK and I am in North America. I am kind of irreverant. I do not want to bring Ugoslavia to India, that will be darkest day. I love muslims but not aggresive muslims who want to rule the world on their dictates.

    Ravi Reply:

    Just wondering how Pakistani’s spell Yugoslavia. Is it Ugoslavia, or You Go Slavia.

    Just wondering

    Ravi Reply:

    I was also wondering how Pakistani’s spell Qatar, here is one example “You speak about Quatari offer to MF”.

    While we are at forensic linguistics the official spelling of Sialkot is the way I spelt it. The following is from Wikipedia. There are other examples.

    Sialkot (Punjabi, Urdu: سیالکوٹ) is a city in Pakistan situated in the north-east of the Punjab province at the foothills of snow-covered peaks of Kashmir near the Chenab river

    Prabhat Reply:

    @ Ravi

    You must not waste your valuable time and energy in analysing the spelling Ugoslavia or Yugoslavia.

    We broadly understand the context.

    These silly mistakes happen on the blog posting. You should not read too much into these things.

    Ravi Reply:

    Prabhat

    Nice advice, wish you had given it to Pankaj, who on the basis of me spelling Sialkot without a y and the fact that I suggested as a child in Karol Bagh I opposed M. L. Kurana’s political rallies, concluded that I was a Pkistani Faking it as Ravi.

    I merely returned the compliment.

    Dr Mishra, UK Reply:

    I think Prabhat my sentence below sums it up- ‘..And if it gets offended big time, and raises a stink, then I have to junk that champagne glass and ask Mr Hussain to please withdraw the paintings.
    That is the bottom line- I care too much about my fellow countrymen to respect their feelings and not preach to them to swallow their hurt in the name of fine art…’

    [Reply]

  • Dr Mishra, UK

    okay, I have seen most of the photos- and I have to make a confession, it is a mixed bag. I am a product of my family culture (the armed forces), schooling in Delhi and then med school followed by a stint abroad- it stands to reason that my take may be different from yours.
    On Zia’s blog which was dominated by Islamists and pseudo seculars, I was condemned as a hindutwa type. Here on Vinod’s site, which is very sanghi, some have attacked me for being too liberal.
    So lets take the plunge. Some photographs were offensive, but some were aesthetic. The offensive ones may not have offended if viewed purely by a champagne sipping glitterati in an exclusive art gallery in Delhi or London. And that is why life is complex, for the ones I may find offensive may not be the ones you would.
    Also, life is not so neatly compartmentalised, the other India- the more conservative one, the religious one- does peep into the art gallery. And if it gets offended big time, and raises a stink, then I have to junk that champagne glass and ask Mr Hussain to please withdraw the paintings.
    That is the bottom line- I care too much about my fellow countrymen to respect their feelings and not preach to them to swallow their hurt in the name of fine art.

    [Reply]

  • Dr Mishra, UK

    1. is this photo obscene or aesthetic
    http://shilpishukla.blogspot.com/2010/04/mf-hussain-redefining-freedom.html

    [Reply]

    Dr Mishra, UK Reply:

    2. and what about this one
    http://mrmulliner.sulekha.com/blog/post/2007/05/m-f-hussain-of-liberty-libertine.htm
    now here many photos are offensive, but not maybe the one at the bottom- of ganga and yamuna.

    All said and done, art should never be underestimated- it can be very powerful and divisive, as we have seen through the centuries.
    We made khajuraho 1000 years ago, but could not make it today. Times change, values change, but peace should prevail- thats paramount

    [Reply]

  • Dr Mishra, UK

    the point I am making is one of taste- it is a fine line where aesthetic nudity becomes obscene, and this is where local sensitivities are paramount. Where the champagne glasses have to be thrown away if we are all to live together.

    Look at these photos of Peter Crouch and his gf- these pics are commonplace abroad. But of course such behaviour should not be allowed in iNDIA for it would offend bigtime-
    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/tvshowbiz/article-2001484/Abbey-Clancy-Peter-Crouch-kiss-cuddle-pre-wedding-holiday.html?ito=feeds-newsxml

    [Reply]

  • rajiv

    @Mishra,
    I think you are missing the dangers of policing what constitutes hurting the sentiments of any one.
    I would give everyone the right to hurt my sentiments and in turn have the right to hurt their. Thats a even trade.
    That basically means mind your own business and ignore if someone says something that you find offensive.
    Of course libel and slander are treated differently.

    When you try policing , freedom of expression, because it may hurt someone’s sentiment, then who is to define where to draw the line ? It’s dangerous.

    [Reply]

  • rajiv

    Here is a dramatic news story about how the MF Husain controversary began , of all people, started by a communist reporter, to sell newspaper..

    http://blogs.hindustantimes.com/singly-political/2011/06/10/how-husain-was-hounded-out-of-india/

    [Reply]

  • Pankaj#1

    OK sir;
    I am speaking on behalf of Bharat. Does it have any value, beyond high brow people, with their esoteric ideas?. By the way, these high brows have all there privilages because of Bharat. out side India, they will be treated as trash.

    [Reply]

    Prabhat Reply:

    @Pankaj

    That was too abstract for me. I did not get the context and sense of this posting.

    [Reply]

    Pankaj#1 Reply:

    Prabhat;
    Obviously you joined a tad late here. A fierce debate is going on MF paintings, particularly, offending paintings of hindu deities and subsequent escape by MF to Qatar. This was the concept. High Society is defending MF and some of us are saying that sensitivities of masses should also be kept in mind.

    [Reply]

    Mahesh Reply:

    Pankaj,
    “High Society is defending MF and some of us are saying that sensitivities of masses should also be kept in mind.”
    Are you sure ? Has the debate crystallized this well ?
    Me visiting this blog-post after much of the proverbial water has drained down the bridge but a quick lookup of the archived posts hardly concurs your simplified representation of the “debate”.
    - Mahesh.

    Prabhat Reply:

    @ Pankaj

    Interestingly, neither Bharat nor the High Society is interested in the content of MFH’s Art.

    Bharat is too occupied in trying to meet both ends meet to take note of MFH and his art. The High Society is too preoccupied with consumption of wealth to take note of the content of MFH’s art so long it keeps fetching good valuation.

    It’s us ( you and I ) who are busy in dissecting and interpreting MFH’s art and worry too much.

  • rajiv

    ———————————————————————————————————————
    New information on Saleem Shehzad, 26/11 attacks, Pak isi sponsored murders
    ———————————————————————————————————————-

    absolutely interesting
    http://www.thefridaytimes.com/10062011/page2.shtml

    [Reply]

    S Singh Reply:

    Mr Sharma-

    Do you allow these types of people in your blog! Disgusting is putting it mildly!

    [Reply]

    Rizwan Reply:

    INTERESTING BATTLE GOING ON IN zIA.S BLOG

    [Reply]

  • Rizwan

    Mishraji- lovely writing style as always- ” the point I am making is one of taste- it is a fine line where aesthetic nudity becomes obscene, and this is where local sensitivities are paramount. Where the champagne glasses in the art gallery have to be thrown away if we are all to live together ”

    Rajiv with I, society has not evolved well enuff for us to offend each other with impunity. A pastor should not be allowed by Obama to burn a Quran for ignorant and fundamentalist muslims will kill and be killed, as it did happen. Similarly, muslims should not, and did not support MFH. Rest in peace, Hussain saheb, and may you be judged in the hereafter.

    Balwinder paaji and mishraji- you did hit the nail on the head when you questioned- DID ANYONE ACTUALLE SEE THE PAINTINGS

    [Reply]

    B.V.SHENOY Reply:

    Rizwan Bhai, Dr.Mishra and Balwinderji,

    I have seen the objectionable paintings, not the originals, but copies, which didn’t make any difference to the objections. I would, on request, provide the links.

    [Reply]

    (Dr.) B.N.Anand Reply:

    @Mr. Shenoy

    Me too. These are available on the internet. Tarun Vijay had written a complete blog on this topic in TOI sometimes back.
    BNA

    [Reply]

    Vijay Kumar Reply:

    @ Shenoy

    A poem wanted sir…

    On how the government has Ministers who have second hand cars and the Yuvraj does ot evn have one ! :D

  • Rizwan

    Balwinder paaji is now Balwinder bhai, MBBS hahahaha
    so 5 million amerikans have barett epithelium and not all have cancer- wow- this blog is going to new heights. you outwitted and outread shan – paaji, well done.

    on second thoughts that is no achievement

    [Reply]

  • Gautam Gulati

    Guys.I have posted this on Zia’s blog also. If you all have missed there – here it is .

    Isn’t this the TRUTH…???!!!

    Muslims feel bad… !!! ???

    Muslims feel bad in Gaza

    Muslims feel bad in Jordan

    They feel bad in Jerusalem

    They feel bad in Israel (they say they don’t get the same rights)

    They feel bad in EgypThey feel bad in Libya

    They feel bad in Algeria

    They feel bad in Tunisia

    They feel bad in Morocco

    They feel bad in Yemen

    They feel bad in Pakistan

    They feel bad in Lebanon

    They feel bad in Syria

    They feel bad in Sudan

    They feel bad in Iran

    They feel bad in Tchetchenya
    Where do the Muslims feel good?

    They feel good in England
    They feel good in France
    They feel good in Italy
    They feel good in Holland
    They feel good in Germany

    They feel good in Sweden
    They feel good in Denmark
    They feel good in Norway
    They feel good in the USA

    They feel good in Canada
    They feel good in Australia
    They feel good in Rumania

    They feel good in Hungary
    What can we learn from these facts?
    They feel good in all non-Muslim Countries
    They feel bad in all Muslim Countries

    Who they blame for this?

    Not Islam
    Not their leaders

    They blame the countries where they feel good to live in!

    [Reply]

    me Reply:

    Clear as Crystal your lines are.
    With Them its like other side of the grass is not always, but always more green.

    [Reply]

  • VIjay Kumar

    @ Everyone

    I think the debate on Islam can be summed up in a single sentence — Islam needs a Shoeb and a Rizwan and need to flush out the T U R D S like Tajendar who end up silencing dissent :D

    [Reply]

    Balwinder Sandhu Reply:

    rajiv with I, you took your eye off the larger picture. Dr Mishra had called you Sardar Patel of this blog. No sir, you faltered on this issue- read riswan puttar-
    “”" pastor should not be allowed by Obama to burn a Quran for ignorant and fundamentalist muslims will kill and be killed, as it did happen. “”"
    live and let live, there is a line which should not be crossed, itna bhi kya ‘fida’ ho jaana Maqbool Fida par ??

    [Reply]

    Balwinder Sandhu Reply:

    my thoughts entirely, Anna Hazare saheb-
    http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/india/Baba-Ramdev-not-mature-enough-to-lead-Anna-Hazare/articleshow/8809054.cms
    Baba Ramdev not mature enough to lead: Anna Hazare

    [Reply]

  • Balwinder Sandhu

    mishraji, thank you, what this rustic sardar could not say clearly, you articulates so well.
    Dr Pankaj, your anguish is respected
    2 doctors, two points of view-

    Dr Mishra- champagne swilling sailor- “”" And if it gets offended big time, and raises a stink, then I have to junk that champagne glass and ask Mr Hussain to please withdraw the paintings.”"”
    Dr Pankaj and shenoy- the other iNDIA, looking in the gallery “”" am speaking on behalf of Bharat. Does it have any value, beyond high brow people, with their esoteric ideas?. “”"

    and finally riswan puttar, khush keeta , nice words “”"Similarly, muslims should not, and did not support MFH. Rest in peace, Hussain saheb, and may you be judged in the hereafter”"”

    [Reply]

    Balwinder Sandhu Reply:

    what lovely imagery, as Pankaj would say. Right, I am off for 2 weeks, here and there, my posts will be few

    [Reply]

  • VIjay Kumar

    ~~ :D :D ~~ WHY THE ATHEIST and THE NON-CONVERTING BELIEVER IS A NECESSITY FOR………… WORLD PEACE ~~ : D :D ~~~

    Now let us face the truth once a while. Most cadre based religion had an agenda of conversions as they consider the other as lesser beings.

    COuntries were raided with a sword, people were butchered and conversions done, many a time.

    Lies were impregnated in history books. The Red Indians were wiped by the Europeans using plague germs in blankets donated free.

    This tradition was only broken when trade and lust for better living standards drove to different countries before the earlier tradition of “you are a kafir … you need Jahannum and you need to follow my religion to survive.”

    BY THE WAY SEX WAS A MAJOR DRIVER OF MIGRATION AND WARS.

    In my hostel days in India’s topmost engineering college the standard joke among many students was– “It’s not about brain drain…. Its about getting laid with a gori… ” :D

    This was a GROSS and HUGE improvement on the days when wars were fought and women abducted and sold in mandis as Ahmad Shah Abdali did.

    These simple atheists and people who were religious but did not believe in conversions, whose motives were trade, money and good life made the world a better place to live in.

    Well I am not an athiest. But mostly religion comes into my life once a month. Somewhere I find as a Hindu you are at a loss when you dont have an agenda to convert in this world with hidden motives.

    I think that is what makes many people here on the net vey angry when the COngress okays conversions and religious actions by minorites, but wants to destroy it for HIndus… :D

    [Reply]

  • Vijay Kumar

    @ T U R D tajendar

    Go back to Pak-shit-stan u T U R D ! :D

    [Reply]

  • Mohan Ramchandani
  • Mohan Ramchandani

    Mr. Sharma,

    Earlier today I had posted my comments on MF Hussains’s paintings. I am shocked that those
    comments have been removed. I wonder why ? I am sure my language was not at all abusive
    and not a single word in that post would have offended anyone.

    [Reply]

  • Ravi

    Mohan

    I suggest that you post your views once again.

    Regards

    Ravi

    [Reply]

  • B.V.SHENOY

    Vijay Kumar,

    Here is one to MFH:

    Husain was known for his art
    which he bagan on a cinema cart
    as a businessman, he was smart,
    knew how to sell his art in the mart

    He knew all about paints
    but his life was one of taints
    against him courts had umpteen plaints
    the whole world knew of the complaints

    His art had goddesses disrobed
    but, only Hindu goddesses he disrobed
    the reason why, couldn’t be probed
    ’cause he acted as if in his art he was absorbed.

    One fine day he fled the country’s shores,
    settled in the desert with quaint mores
    where it neither rains nor pours
    and when he died, what remained were unsettled scores.

    [Reply]

    Pankaj#1 Reply:

    Lajawab!!!

    [Reply]

    Raju Kurien Reply:

    A zest for life, wine and girls
    So I want to live for long
    Paint and paint, sell and sell
    Nudes in demand, so they say
    Hitler nude, godesses nude
    Calls me icoclastic, sells them more

    i want to live, drink, and be merry
    So no Alla in these pics
    Lest crazies kill me

    For I know no Boyrouni nor Gille here
    Stupid Hindus will not touch me
    For I am free in this free land
    I want to drink, I want to sell
    Not one n ude, not two n ude
    Not three nude, N ot four nude

    I wont draw Muslim girl naked
    But Laxmi– gorgeous on the tusk
    Sita- why not on my man’s thighs
    Oh here is lotus born
    Bengalis for renaissance
    But I m lucky they missed Mar
    So I can draw her nude Oh nude

    Crazy placve this is
    I get rewards and awards
    For denigrading them lefta nd right

    [Reply]

    Pankaj#1 Reply:

    Raju; wanted to reply to Mahesh first but thought, thispoem is so beautiful, that it desearve first attention.
    good poem. capturing essence of whole story.
    Now, one last question.
    Hussain’s claim to the fame was, depicting Priyadarshani as DURGA. having attained prominence, 30 years later he is on auto control. he paints same DURGA, copulating with a Tiger. Hope Not one tiger who was humiliated at 1971. Who is this TIGER?? Hope secularists will answer this.

    [Reply]

    Raju Kurien Reply:

    Pankaj-

    I believe the tiger was a tiger; I think the intent ws to “double” up Durga’s strength/”masculinity” by overpoweringa frocipous tiger.

    MFH was not a genuine, cerative, free artist. He knew how to worship people in power. His first Durga, Priyadarshini, was drwan during the emrgency period; when all the artists and writers in this country were againt the strong handedness and assault on freedoms by Mrs Gandhi. He later demonstrated this again by accepting the MP position, proud that it will get him a lifetime pension.

    A man who ridiculed Raja Ravi Varma as a claendar painter (but whose Shakuntala and urvashi etc were famous for how beautiful they looked while covered) nevertheless knew how to market and self promote. His adoration and fullfledged self promotion with Madhuri Dixit wasone of his self preservation strategy. And the painting controversy and the stupid Sangh Parivar’s indirect promotion of these paintings made him even more opf a darling of the seculars, selling the stupid things like hot cakes.

    Now MFH has the freedom to draw and write and sing anything. I do not think he had an ultreior motive to denigrate Hindus when he painted them. However, I firmly believe he clealtrly knew the financial value of those, especially when controversies are created. I also do not think he was an Islamst or cared for Muslims. He was a self promoter.

    Books, writings, paintings, poems etc have unintended consequences. A 23 page Communist manifesto resulted in unparallelled misreries in the world. The “Germania” , a 40 page history of the quarrels between teh Northern germans and Romans written by the Latin historian Tacitus will become the guiding light for German Nazism centuries later. Similarly, when MFH paints certain things (Hindu goddesses) certain ways (naked or bestial copulation etc) and do not touch certain things at all (prophet or his associates) or paint another group (muslim women) in a totally fifferent way (fully clothed), it gives too much space for questioning motives, biases, intentions…For this the artist and the artist only deserves the blame.

    rajiv Reply:

    —————————————————————————————————————
    For few Hindus/sikhs, not yet killed, asylum may be the only option..
    ————————————————————————————————————-

    In w pakistan, 99% of the Hindu/sikh community has already been wiped out in a worse genocide than Hitler on Jews. Hitler’s policies, did NOT cleanse germany of 99% of its Jews.

    from Pak paper Tribune by Nadir Hasan.
    ———————————————————–

    Tausiq Kumar begins his day with a cup of tea and a phone call to the Indian High Commission in Islamabad. A trader by profession and hailing from the Patel Bagh area of Quetta, Kumar applied for asylum in India after his relative Ramesh was murdered for resisting a kidnapping attempt on February 6.

    Even before Ramesh’s killing, says Kumar, there was a palpable fear among the beleaguered Hindu community in Balochistan. He traces the insecurity among 27,000-strong Hindu community as having started only in the last few years and painfully points out that Hindus have generally had their rights respected in the province, even after the Babri Masjid was destroyed in India in 1992.

    Ramesh’s killing was the final straw that convinced Kumar he would be better off moving to India. He says, “I first became scared when a priest Maharaj Laxmichand Gujri was kidnapped and never found. He was highly respected in our community and after that we couldn’t ignore what was happening.”

    After his relative’s murder, Kumar got in touch with the Indian High Commission, filed his application and waited. A couple of months passed by and he didn’t hear back. So, he decided to come to Islamabad and is now living in a guest house trying to expedite the process. Kumar knows of five people from the town of Mastang, close to Quetta, who have already migrated to India and is hopeful he will be able to move soon.

    Although statistics are hard to come by, Saeed Ahmed Khan, the Balochistan director for the federal human rights ministry, says that he knows of more than two dozen Hindu families that are looking to migrate from Balochistan.

    Quetta-based journalist Abdul Wahab says that at least 43 Hindus have been kidnapped in Balochistan in the last three years, three of whom were later found dead. He adds that whenever the provincial assembly has debated the issue, parliamentarians have either taken a head-in-the-sand approach to the issue or blamed the intelligence agencies for the kidnappings and killings.

    Kumar says Hindus felt safer when Akbar Bugti was alive because he provided religious minorities the protection they needed. He also says that Hindus generally felt safer in the Baloch areas of the province as opposed to the Pakhtun areas.

    Now Kumar is spending his meagre earnings in Islamabad trying to leave the country as soon as possible. He says, “I considered moving to a safer part of the country but I don’t know if there is any safe part. I am not sure if it is just criminals who kidnap Hindus for ransom or a hatred for Hindus but I am not safe here.”

    rajiv Reply:

    sorry, had forgotten to post the link to the story quoted above

    http://tribune.com.pk/story/186683/minority-rights-for-hindu-community-asylum-may-be-the-only-option/

    rajiv Reply:

    Here is what a Pakistani, Abdul Basit has to say in his comments about Pakistan’s state sponsored criminal treatment of Hindus..

    http://tribune.com.pk/story/186683/minority-rights-for-hindu-community-asylum-may-be-the-only-option/

    Abdul Basit :
    —————–
    what can the hindus expect in pakistan when from the start they have to face severe discrimination.I remember when i was in school how my deeniyat books used to extol the virtue of breaking statues in temples and how the men who went in the temples and destryoed their statues were regarded as muslim heroes and on reading this many of my friends were inspired enough to say ‘yar clifton may bhi inka aik temple hai buton wala mai bhi waha ja kar in kay but toronga to mjko bhi sawab milayga” .

    when from childhood we are taught to hate non-muslims to the extent that going into their mandirs and wreaking havoc there are looked upon as good ,heroic things to do.

    we should fee ashamed of ourselves that how low our society has gone by following its obsession with radical islam.

    Irfan Akhtar :
    ———————

    We discriminate horribly against all non-muslims.when our constitution has made it a law that no nonmuslim can be the president or prime minister then why do we cry and scream when the french ban the burka or the swiss ban minarets?

    we’ve told the hindus,christians,ahmadis,parsis that you people are unfit and unworthy of becoming pakistan’s leaders.What ever our islamic fascists might say about america or india atleast they’ve not made a law that discriminates so horribly against its own people.

    What right does our media have about supposed discrimination against muslims when we practise the most vile form of religous hate and bigotry right here in our own country.
    ————————————————————————————————————-

    If we had people like pakistanis like Irfan and Abdul on this blog ( instead of the **** pervert and his mental attorney ) , complete peace , love and civility would prevail !

    Ravi Reply:

    Husain was universally recognised for his art
    He used Indian icons, including a bullock cart
    Business in his life played only a small part
    He was lucky to find buyers in the world mart

    He captured India in vivid paints.
    He found Hindu Fundos making a complaint
    A number of issues did his character taint
    Supreme Court completely dismissed all complaints

    He made a film with Indian icons juxtaposed
    Hindu goddesses and others were disrobed
    The reason why, need not be probed
    All of India was totally in his art absorbed

    He was hounded from his country’s shores
    He found Qatari public gave its love and more
    Price of his paintings went from lakhs to carores
    Ready to give up all to live in motherland once more
    Now that he is dead, we should settle all scores.

    [Reply]

    abhinav Reply:

    Very funny, specially the “Qatari public” part. I was not aware that Qatari public care about him.

    [Reply]

  • http://- Rajeev

    When nutters like Tajender and Ravi were engaged in Jihad, Osama was waging Jihad in the bedroom.
    http://www.samachar.com/Osama-was-a-sex-machine-Wife-lglnJLfageb.html
    Osama ‘was a sex machine’: Wife
    Font Size
    -A+A
    Agencies
    Posted: Jun 11, 2011 at 1102 hrs IST
    Print Email To Editor Post Comments

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    Washington Osama bin Laden’s first wife, Najwa, has revealed that the killed al-Qaeda chief was a ‘sex machine’ who used to vanish into his bedroom for days with her after returning back from waging Jihad.
    On being asked by a journalist during an interview about her favourite time when living with bin Laden, Najwa replied: ‘The sleeping time’.

    She was interviewed by US investigative reporter Jean Sasson for her biography, but the journalist revealed details yesterday, which have not come out before, the Daily Mail reports.

    “When I asked Najwa what her favourite time of day was, she admitted that it was ‘the sleeping time,” Sasson said, adding that Najwa was not referring to actually going to sleep, but “that’s when he (bin Laden) was giving her all his attention.”

    “Omar (her son) said that when he was a child, Osama would come home from Afghanistan and take Najwa into the bedroom and they wouldn’t come out for days,” she added.

    When bin Laden was killed by US Special Forces, he was living with three of his wives in a compound in Abbottabad, Pakistan, where the forces had reportedly found herbal Viagra.

    Sasson said she ‘wouldn’t be surprised’ if the news was true.

    “He had a younger wife, plus two other wives there. I remember that on the day a clinic opened in Saudi Arabia for men who were impotent, cars lined up through Riyadh waiting,” Sasson said.

    ‘And most of the men were elderly, and they were very concerned because they had four wives, and they said they could only do it twice a day. Some of these men were, like, 80,’ she added

    [Reply]

  • Vijay Kumar

    :D :D ~~ THE SEXUAK REASONS FOR JEHAD AND SUICIDE BOMBERS ~~ :D :D

    Watching porno. eating viagra. and keeping 5 wives!! :D :D

    This is the Osamaji the Congress leader Digvinash loves. Since he used the word ji one can cconclude he would want all Congress Seva Dal Workers to emulate Osamaji as a true shining example of what a Congress man should be , :D :D :D

    I swould also pity the four men left unmarried bcos T U R D S like Osama JI keep 5 wives and deny 4 Pak shit stanis the chance of getting married and having sex. Maybe one or two of those four will become a suicide bomebr :D

    is our T U R D tajendar one of them??? :D :D

    [Reply]

  • Vijay Kumar

    @ Ravi

    T U R D Tajendar is now claiming that he will emerge from between your trouser pockets or something. Do something.. :D

    He is also trying his hand at poetry. However the ISI guy using his ID seems to be pretty pathetic

    I hope you would also give us a poem on how the genral reaction would be in case a hussain were to draw something similar on religious figurs of your own community.

    [Reply]

  • Ravi

    Maan yeh dey rahen hain MF Husain ko gali

    Maan yeh dey rahen hain MF Husain ko gali
    VHP, ne galat kahanian sunaa sunaa kar
    Dekho kar rakha hai in sab ka bheja khali
    Maan yeh dey rahen hain MF Husain ko gali

    Bharat ki har pratima ko jord jord kar,
    Un ne parosi humare desh ke matlab ki thali
    Maan yeh dey rahen hain MF Husain ko gali

    Devi kay nange chitron ko pakard pakard kar
    Sanghion ne thi gardbardi karne ki dhani
    Maan yeh dey rahen hain MF Husain ko gali

    Ab chale gain hain wo sab nate tord tord kar
    Bharatiye smajh kar, hum deingay unhe salami
    Maan insay kaho ab na dein MF Husain ko gali

    [Reply]

  • Vijay Kumar

    @ Ravi

    Poetry is fine. But u have not answered my question on how reations would hav e been in your own religious community in case Hussain would have drawn simiar paintings of your community?

    [Reply]

    Ravi Reply:

    My religious community is the same as yours, so I am sure you are just as well placed to guess as I am.

    [Reply]

    Vijay Kumar Reply:

    @ Ravi

    I think there is an element of duplicity in this reply. You very well know I am a Hindu.

    At a personal level I have no problems with the paintings. I also concede the right of people to object in cae they do.

    But the question starts troubling me when other communities start calling Hindus communal if they object and yet are not willing to let their own religious figures be depicted in the same manner..

    [Reply]

    Ravi Reply:

    Vijay

    I did not wish to be duplicitous, I have told you that I am a mona Sikh. Sikhs in Indian constitution are treated as Hindus. The Hindu Marriage act applies to Sikhs.

    I think if you look at archives above, I have provided all the comments about painting Mohammad’s likeness, as I possible can.

    I have nothing new to add, bar repeating myself.

    Ravi Reply:

    Vijay

    If you genuinely have an open mind the please read this.

    It expresses what I feel, and does it tons better than I could ever have.


    Manish Sharma says:

    June 11, 2011 at 9:40 am

    Hussain did not paint Mohammed nude because there is no such tradition in Islamic art, of either depicting Muhammed, or indeed the human or celestial figure.

    In our Hinduism, however nude and semi-nude depictions of our deities, especially in the case of Ma Shakti is not unusual. Go take a look at any South Indian bronze depictions of Parvati or others.

    This is because our Hinduism, at a deep philosophical level, recognizes the fundamental power and nature of Parashakti, which is manifested in the naked human form or in sexuality.

    So these depictions by Husain were nothing more than incorporations of existing ideas in Hinduism, both philosophy and actual art and history. Hindus should be flattered that a Muslim painter paid tribute to these deeply Hindu philosophical ideas.

    If Husain had indeed been a Hindu hating devout Muslim, he would never have painted the human form, because to do so is forbidden in Islam as being ‘haram’. That he did sol and was willing to go against his own religion, Islam, is testament to his bravery and love of his Hindu art. Remember, that he used Hindu references, would likely have got him in jail or maybe even a death sentence in Saudi Arabia, Iran, Pakistan or Afghanistan.

    If we are simply irritated and annoyed and jealous that an acclaimed Indian genius happens to be a Muslim, why not come out and say declare it? Vilifying his art and his intentions is underhanded and political in nature, because to spread the lie that he hated us Hindus, and insulted us, is a more readily spread idea amongst our uninformed fellow Hindus. Alas, human nature is to be small-minded.

    Husain did no harm to Hinduism or Hindu art. The reality is quite the opposite.

    Shoeb K Reply:

    Ravi/Vijay

    Two days ago, here in a court toom in Chicago, Rana ,a Pakistani Muslim businessman was sentenced for planning and funding the murder of the Danish cartoonist Kurt Wastergaard for drawing cartoons on the prophet.

    A few years ago, Mohamed Biyouri hacked and murdered the movie director Theo Von Gogh in broad daylight. He impaled a five page note onto his corpse with a knife. The note declared holy war against infidels.

    Theo’s crime was that he made a film on domestic violence among Muslim immigrants in Netherlands. Mohamed believed the film is a blasphemy. Mohamed also wanted to verbally attack Theo’s mother who attended the court proceedings. On questioning him whether he has any sympathy for the old mother Anneke Von Gogh, Mohamed answered “I do not ahve any sympathy for you..I dont feel your pain..I dont feel for you because you are a non-believer”.

    Danish artist Kurt Wastergaard has been lucky. He is alive in spite of the many murder attempts at him ; the last one being from Mohamed Gile who tried to axe him with a machetti.

    These realties are even more bizarre because Mohameds were immigrants, living a good life, feeding off the state, in Netherlands and Denmark.

    What does it have to do with Husain?

    Manish (to whichh Ravi subscribes) is full of s—–. First of all, if Husain is a great artist, where does the question and jsutifiation of “not having an Islamic tradition of painting the prophet or depicting human figure” comes? Are painters and artists limited by not having a tradition..Aren’t they supposed to go where no man has gone..Arent they supposed to take imagination wild? Especially for a “great” artist like Husain?

    “In our Hindusim” (is liike “our sikhism” and “our Hinduism” some fellow bloggers declare in this blog) “there is a tradition of nude and seminude depiction” — where? No painter, recent or in ancestral of India, has ever drawn a nude painting or picture of the dieties. No Indian temple has nude statues and sculptures of Gods, be it in Khajuraho or South Indian temples as Manish says. (there are nude staues, but not gods) Now , assuming there is one or two old temples who do have nude sculptures of Parvathi, nobody knows the dateline of them, it very well may be thousands of years ago. No famous modern sculptors such as Anish Kapoor or Satish Gujral (or for that matter not so famous sculpptors also) have done nude sculptures of dieties.

    “He went against Islam in painting human forms…..” what a crock….

    Now, for a moment, I do not believe he was anti Hindu, or a devout fundamentalist extremist muslim, or for that matter he wanted to hurt Hindus through these paintings. A fame accrues when these things get discussed as a break-away, a new view of old things.. In that view, Saraswathi, the lordess of knowledge, becomes even more an authority on knowledge unencumbered by clothing. He could do it without worrying about anybody killing him; no Mohamed Gil or Biyouri in India or among Hindus.

    The reason why his so called creativity and proclavity for “different” did not make him to test the Islamic tradition (an artist has only artistic traditions , beliefs, fredoms) was that he very well knew the dangers – that Rana, Gile, Boyuri, and thousands more will stalk him; ayatollahs will put a price on his head as they did for Salman Rushdie, and more recently on the Bangla Deshi writer Tasleema nAsreen.

    That MFH settled for safe bets to enrich himself will always be a negative on him. That he was a psychophant will be a negative on him – the shameless admiration he exhibited for Mrs Indira Gandhi during emergencey, for most part a lone supporter among the artists of those times. when all other artists chose jail..

    If there is one conclusion that could be made from his nude paintings of Hindu Gods, this is it – He knew the controversy will bring money, he knew no hidden killer will wait for him, and frankly he never expected the controversy will be there at all. The artist in him (if there is an artist) should have succumbed to the humanist (if there is) in him – nude painting of Durga and Lakshmi etc is bad; it is even worse and criminal when you add beastial copulation and monster titillation..

    He is not a proud son of India. He was a coward . Had he stayed in India, he had a chance of martyrdom (if some crazies killed him; I put only a 1% probabilioty for that). The zest for vain glorious life even at the age of 88 was too tempting for him. So, he moves out.

    Ravi Reply:

    Shoeb K

    I can feel the heat of your anger towards me coming through your words.

    For the sake of accuracy about Tradions in India. I suggest that you read this.

    Ravi Reply:

    June 11th, 2011 at 1:54 am

    Within this I have C&P some excellant submissions made by others.

    Just so that there is no doubt. I 100% disagree with you.

    MFH was a great artist and a great Indian.

    B.V.SHENOY Reply:

    Vijay Kumar,

    he is being triplicitous. Duplicity was when he called himself (fake, of course) Ravi. Triplicity is when he calls himself a Mona Sikh.

    Mahesh Reply:

    Ravi,
    It is not at all clear what you intend to say. Try a re-post with reference.
    - Mahesh.

    [Reply]

  • http://- Rajeev

    Ravi is unique sikh who ends up defending Islamic terror.

    Is this the reason innocents sikhs get attacked by red necks who mistake them as talibanis?

    [Reply]

    rajiv Reply:

    About 20 years ago. The west , used to often lecture India on tolerance. India that has suffered more than a 1000 years of religion inspired invasions and brutality originating from the west, had gone on to establsih a secular , democratic state with equal rights for all.

    And just 20, years of few terrorist attacks by Islamic extrimists, and the west has stopped lecturing and you can see a sea change in their attitude. Just 20 small years.

    However, I wonder, what they would have done, if they had suffered 1000 years of invasions and attacks , by Islamic militants coming from outside their shores ?

    [Reply]

    rajiv Reply:

    @Rajeev,
    Its a wrong generalization of sikhs. Ravi comes accross as an intellectual fraud. What he considers himself, hindu, mona-sikh , sunni, shia whatever is besids the point. I have more sikhs as friends than even many sikhs have. To me , his arguments look more like that you would expect from a new convert to wahabi sunni sect.

    [Reply]

    Rajeev Reply:

    You got me wrong here. What I am saying is that sikhs like Ravi MAY be responsible for attacks by rednecks on sikhs.

    May be sikhs like Ravi spend too much time with Jehadi kind of muslims.

    [Reply]

    Rajeev Reply:

    Rajiv,
    We all know Ravi is not what he claims to be but let us consider that he is actually a sikh but it looks like he has far more fundamentalist position on ISLAMIC issues compared to other sikhs. What is the reason behind that? A sikh who defends genocide of sikhs at the hands of muslims must be truly unique.

    [Reply]

    rajiv Reply:

    @Rajeev,
    mental diease can result in any anamoly. You cannot reason.

    Mahesh Reply:

    Rajeev,
    Try not to “second-guess” poster’s communal Identity. Doing that merely ends up wasting the discussion.
    - Mahesh.

    [Reply]

  • rajiv

    Sarmad saad ( from tribune )

    http://tribune.com.pk/story/186683/minority-rights-for-hindu-community-asylum-may-be-the-only-option/

    why doesn’t our media cover the stories of the hindu girls who are regularly kidnapped in interior sindh every year?

    we’ve had hundreds of cases in which muslim men kidnap young hindu girls,rape them and after they’ve been raped force them to convert to islam.i’ve myself heard maulvis exclaim to such men ‘ subhanallah ,tum ne kaafiro ki tadaad may kami aur musalmano ki tadaad may izafa kia hai,allah tmko jannat naseeb karega” .

    i always thought that religion was spread through setting good examples ,but what is this trend of spreading religion through rape??

    [Reply]

  • Dr Mishra, UK

    rajiv with I
    Normally I like your style, but occasionally this emerges – ‘…However, I wonder, what they would have done, if they had suffered 1000 years of invasions and attacks , by Islamic militants coming from outside their shores ? …’

    Can I say something as a cyber friend and maybe even as a cyber-? buzurg- it is not healthy to brood too much on this brutal history. Makes one bitter, colours one’s perception of life. Perhaps, for all our protestations to the contrary, makes us jaundiced and prejudiced against the average muslim one meets on the street.
    Fight SIMI, fight Bukhari, fight the self hating pseudo secularists, but free yourself from the burden of this poisoned history. Otherwise it is like Naipaul’s- India, a million mutinies now

    [Reply]

    Dr Mishra, UK Reply:

    Back in med school, we had an SC candidate who carried this massive chip on his shoulder. Very bitter, despite socialising with us- would occ rant about 5000 years of slavery- his words. He did his MBBS, MD and later DM – all on reservation.
    And then he did something strange. If there was any reserved Consultant job in the country in his speciality, he would turn up, accept the job and then simply stay on in his regular job. The new center would waste months in babugiri sending him letters, then maybe 1 year later they would give it to a ‘general’ candidate- FOR AD-HOC 1 year appointments only !!

    This guy got vicarious pleasure out of seeing the ‘forward castes’ suffer at his hands till the professional bodies started boycotiing him socially. Then he stopped.

    [Reply]

    Dr Mishra, UK Reply:

    The point I am making Rajiv, is dont let the weight of our poisoned history weigh us down, maybe our ancestors did similar stuff against the SCs
    rant over, preaching over

    [Reply]

    Dr Mishra, UK Reply:

    incidentally, just read Raju Kurien’s and Shoeb ’s opinion of Hussain’s controversy- different from mine above, but very readable

    rajiv Reply:

    @Mishra,

    Your point is valid. I asked myself after posting that comment, that should I be thinking about next 1000 years or past 1000 years ?

    Then I asked myself, what if majority of people who lived in India , 1000 years ago, had asked themselves this question and thought of next 1000 years ? How different would be our history then ?

    In the time-line of world-history, I do not know at what point we in India are. How will Indians 1000 years from now, looking back at our political history, judge us ?
    Is it time to forget history and look forward or take lessons from history and march forward ?

    None of these are easy questions.
    On an intellectual level, I would do the utmost I can to prevent gross injustice to a person, irrespective of religion. I mean, if a muslim stranger and a hindu friend are involved in a quarell and if I know that the muslim is right, I would support him , over my friend. Because I look upon people individually and not as communities and nothing pains me as much as to see injustice on the weak or poor.

    [Reply]

    Pankaj#1 Reply:

    Mishraji;
    Agree with you. One should not carry historical burdens. they may be different times. However, lesssons of history should not be forgotten either.

    [Reply]

  • http://- Rajeev

    It is not history. It is happening as we speak. The hindu girls are being kidnapped even now.

    [Reply]

  • Dr Mishra, UK

    rajiv with I, thanks.
    I visit India 2-3 times a year. On one of these visits I went to Mussourie and took a cable car to the top. In the cab, was a young attractive lower middle class couple from UP, very obviously enjoying their first hill vacation.
    I was playing with their children and the talk was banal- families, kids, education etc. Since my driver was calling me Mishraji and some of my friends were calling me doc saheb, the couple knew a bit about me.Then I asked for the kids names.
    The mother became a bit resrved, hesitated a bit and said a bit defensively- Saba and Irfan. Maybe the muslims are subjected to subliminal discrimination, maybe it was a class thing- but she was suddenly putting up walls, anticipating some rejection.
    I said- bahut sundar naam hain, and insisted on buying her kids some ice cream.
    ——————–carrying too much poison in my head would have prevented the spontaneity. got to build bridges…………

    [Reply]

    Dr Mishra, UK Reply:

    I was not always like this, I had some very right wing thoughts in my childhood, I carried too much burden on my shoulders- was very anti colonial and very anti Islamic- then slowly life changed me.
    I studied 3 years in Allahabad, my biology teacher who put the love of medicine in my head, was a brilliant teacher from a humble background. He was Mr Khan. The 2 PE teachers were SINGH and Qazmi, the more dynamic one was qazmi.
    Then later in the ninetees I got a bit of poison in my head, all thgis Babri and bomb blasts, Kashmir issue etc affected me. I rectified it by remembering Khan and Qazmi, and by making sure that the memories of the young couple from Mussourie stayed with me and not of the ? 15 fundamantalists.
    still, i am human, occ I relapse

    [Reply]

    shan Reply:

    Then i applied to be granted a british citizenship, I said I will sell my soul , and become more english than english, suck up to them just like in colonial india, but when I will come across a fellow indian sc/st , I will take a bath when I go home .
    I am eternally grateful to her majesty for giving me a british passport, that I am shouted at leeds town centre as **** , is a minor mistake by the genteel english.**** and me , even amongst indians I am not an Indian I am The indian
    If I am shunned by the english or the english defence league throws leaflets through my door
    asking me to go back to india , I turn to blogging , I get my release through the punchbag pakistan and I conjure up my dream india , everything is nice , everything is at present , everything is so just.

    [Reply]

    rajiv Reply:

    @Shan,
    Thats a uncalled for remarks. I dont see any immediate provocation. I thought you were busy preparing for exams.

    Rajeev Reply:

    Rajiv,
    You have to agree that was a great follow up story by Shan.
    This Mishra seems to be a bit of a fake to me.

    rajiv Reply:

    @Mishra,
    I have , what you may say, a very liberal upbringing. I will explain when I get some time.

    [Reply]

    Prabhat Reply:

    From Shan’s response to Dr Mishra’s posting, it looks like there is a history.

    Though uncalled for, the response has some sense of humour laced with a pinch of sarcasm and surely makes a great follow up in terms of tone, pitch and story telling. Hope Dr Mishra takes Shan’s humorous take in his strides.

    [Reply]

  • Pankaj#1

    Mahesh;
    Really speaking, could not understand your comments about archieved post did not reveal or confirm to my simplistic conclusion about debate. please elaborate. also would like to know your contribution to this debate, whether MF was right in depicting hindu deities in nude. will be out for few days, but would join you after that.

    [Reply]

  • Pankaj#1

    Prabhat;
    Your contention that higher strata of society is gazing at these paintings, drawing some masochistic pleasure, reestablishing and proclaiming its secular credentials and probably investing its ill gotten wealth in these paintings.
    Lower strata has no time to look at these paintings, busy in its livelyhood and it is people like you and me, who are worried.
    Yes, I think, it is middle class, who look after such matters, as they still have some values left and have come to understand subtle mischieves of english speaking urbanites and their pretensions. I read some where, that india is probably only country in world, where an enemy force could have marched on the road, while the peasant is serenely ploughing his farm. This non involvement in matters of state or its welfare was of no concern to toiling masses and this was the reason for downfall of india numerous times. These subtle attacks on the sensivities of predominant section of India by vested interests and their supporters is slow poison, which will destroy this nation in not far off future. No proud or independent country in world is so base in its approach, when people, who should be protectors of nation, start colloborating in its destruction of ethos, values and wellbeing. Only material progress without moorings of your culture and blind aping of psuedosecularism is sure receipe for destruction of a nation.

    [Reply]

    Ravi Reply:

    Prabhat

    This is nothing short than delusional paranoia.

    “These subtle attacks on the sensivities of predominant section of India by vested interests and their supporters is slow poison, which will destroy this nation in not far off future.”

    I mature democracies such as Canada, The USA, Australia, New Zealand and Most of Europe, its own indigenous populations criticise their own culture, traditions, Religion and Polotics in stronger terms that any blogers here could imagine. Yet these countries are thriving and not slowly dieing from subtle attacks.

    What is surely dying is the unsustainable dream of a purely Hindu Homogeneous India the Hindu Right seem to hallucinate about.

    A plural India with its inclusive policies is able to take any criticism that can be thrown at it.

    [Reply]

  • Rajiv

    @Shoeb,
    Some excellent points made by you in a very effective way.

    [Reply]

  • rajiv

    @tajinder,
    I never read or engage you as you are beneath contempt and of most vile mind.
    I could forgive you for your vile comments about India and hindus if you were a pakistani muslim. You claim you are an indian. muslim. If that be the case, for a person who has lived in India and enjoyed the equal rights that India has given to all its citizens, I dont have enough words to describe what a lowly person you are.
    you are vilest of the vile and I am sure 99.99% of Indian muslims will be ashamed of you.
    Its good that you dont use a muslim name however its equally sad that you defame Sikhs by using a sikh sounding name.
    To call you a spineles, shameless, fraud and a scum will only demonstrate how weak those words are to describe you.

    [Reply]

    Rajeev Reply:

    Rajiv,
    It is becoming clearer that both Tajender and Ravi know each other well or may be they are same person.

    [Reply]

  • Rizwan

    No Rajeev, it takes courage to write from the heart as Mishraji did. I admire his candour and his honesty. rather than the put on psedo secularism of many
    Shan’s comment is cheap, not witty and reminds me of Balwinder’s assertion that Shan deeply resents being upstaged by the new bloggers.
    A year ago he used to swan around here sickeningly quoting vile stuff like Nirad Chowdhry as if it was bible. Also the very public dressing down he got from doc last week must still hurt. If it was my personality and credibility that was so badly demolished i wud hide my face forever

    [Reply]

    Rizwan Reply:

    just read again the exchange between mishraji and rajiv- the words ‘gentlemen’ spring to mind

    [Reply]

  • Rizwan

    Prabhat, think you are new to shan. this is an example of his intellect – I have always doubted that he is a doctor. That he represents my country in UK is depressing. enjoy (apologies to paaji, copied his post) ++++++++++
    shan says:
    February 6, 2011 at 11:06 pm
    I have the authority to comment on Indians from different states. The sikhs are the most corrupt both in private life and in work, LICK WHITES LIKE HELL. Tamils are a two different sorts , the srilankan which are CREEPY, the indian which are PATHOLOGICAL LIARS and white posterior suckers,
    .Now for my own community ,mostly GP’s AND BASICALLY INCORRIGIBLE, suffer from a massive delusion of granduer. As to the bengalees in West bengal …, petty , mean and small…, some aspect of english life is GRAND , beyond description , yet there is is a considerble element which is pure stench.
    Yes I do call other people racist and Fascist.+++++++++++
    his IQ and EQ MUST BE EQUAL TO HIS AGE

    [Reply]

  • Rizwan

    Prabhat, another thing about shan, whenever I try to debate him he universally attacks Islam in filthy language or calls me kattuay, circumcised etc. I have never attacked hinduism, never will

    [Reply]

    rajiv Reply:

    @rizwan,
    you have shown great maturity and self-control on this blog. My respects.

    [Reply]

    Prabhat Reply:

    @Rizwan

    That’s sad. Because what I could make out from Shan’s last posting, he has ability to raise the bar.

    [Reply]

    Observer Reply:

    Rizwan,

    Shan is Punjabi Muslim. It is part of their game to make Hindus and Muslim fight.. You would think some Hindu are attacking your religion and feel angry at Hindus, while in reality it is not the case.

    [Reply]

  • Rizwan

    hate it when you hv just posted and page turns !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
    repeat-
    Prabhat, think you are new to shan. this is an example of his intellect – I have always doubted that he is a doctor. That he represents my country in UK is depressing. enjoy (apologies to paaji, copied his post) ++++++++++
    shan says:
    February 6, 2011 at 11:06 pm
    I have the authority to comment on Indians from different states. The sikhs are the most corrupt both in private life and in work, LICK WHITES LIKE HELL. Tamils are a two different sorts , the srilankan which are CREEPY, the indian which are PATHOLOGICAL LIARS and white posterior suckers,
    .Now for my own community ,mostly GP’s AND BASICALLY INCORRIGIBLE, suffer from a massive delusion of granduer. As to the bengalees in West bengal …, petty , mean and small…, some aspect of english life is GRAND , beyond description , yet there is is a considerble element which is pure stench.
    Yes I do call other people racist and Fascist.+++++++++++
    his IQ and EQ MUST BE EQUAL TO HIS AGE

    [Reply]

    Raju Kurien Reply:

    Rizwan

    Do not get discouraged.. Participate annd expose. Try not to attack the person; but the message

    [Reply]

    Prabhat Reply:

    @Rizwan

    I detaste discussing religions.

    I could have been born as a Muslim or Christian or Sikh or Lower Caste or even Dalit . But I was born to Hindu parents. So I am a Hindu “by chance”.

    What I prefer to debate or discuss is the possibilities in life, what I could be “by choice” or what I could do “by choice”.

    My political affiliation is by choice. My professional occupation is by choice. I prefer to debate or discuss possibilities in those areas.

    I also know that every religion has strengths as well as weaknesses.

    By showing somebody’s religion down, I will not achieve anything. I find all these columns of religious debate futile. There will never be full convergence of religious views as their value systems are different.

    You said Shan tends to attack islam and call you names. I can not figure out why Shan, a Punjabi Muslim, can attack Islam ? Or, like tejender, Shan is he also using a fake name ?

    Undoubtedly, all of you are brilliant with your arguments. I wish you guys stopped taking such extreme positions. This blog could really benefit from your continuous engagements.

    Let there be the battle of wits. Not religious showdowns.

    [Reply]

  • B.Vajiv, .SHENOY

    When MF Husain ran away from India, was it because he was afraid of Hindu fundamentalists?
    No, in fact he had taken the entire Hindu community for granted and knew they cannot touch a single hair of his thick mane.

    Was he afraid of the Muslim secularists?
    No, because they are so few in number that they are scared of themselves and the Muslim fundamentalists.

    Was Husain scared of the Hindu secularists?
    yes, he must have been. Because, most of them, he knew, were mostly pseudos and at other times fair weather seculars; Taslima Nasreen had made that quite obvious. Hindu secularists had to constantly look over their shoulders, lest their vote banks would threaten to leave them.
    He also knew that by acting the martyr to the cause of secularism, he was, besides getting a fat cheque from the Qatari Sultan, also getting his own martyrdom insured, free of cost. And he was nothing if not farsighted. Now our seculars are holding candle light shok- sabhas at India Gate, Gateway of India etc.

    [Reply]

    Raju Kurien Reply:

    Shenoy-
    Agree. As Shoeb mentioned, he is a coward who knew how to manipulate and make money.
    He also mentioned that he was the only prominent artist/writer who lonely supported Mrs Gandhi during her emergency. So much for “FREEDOM”!

    [Reply]

    Ravi Reply:

    M. F. Husian was HOUNDED out of India

    From the BBC

    Mr Husain’s career was marked by controversy when he was accused of obscenity and denounced by hardline Hindus for a painting of a nude goddess.

    His exhibitions were often attacked by hardline Hindu groups.

    HardLine Hindu’s just like you Mr Shenoy.

    In 2006, Mr Husain publicly apologised for his painting, Mother India. It shows a nude woman kneeling on the ground creating the shape of the Indian map.

    He also promised to withdraw the controversial painting from a charity auction.

    In 2008, India’s Supreme Court refused to launch criminal proceedings against Mr Husain saying that his paintings were not obscene and nudity was common in Indian iconography and history.

    This is what the news paper HINDU said.

    “impending change of nationality brings to a close one of the sorriest chapters in independent India’s secular history”. Correspondents say that Mr Husain – who has been forced to flee the country - is one of India’s most pre-eminent artists.

    M. F. Husain did not leave India it was HOUNDED out by Hardline Hindu’s just like B.V. Shenoy.

    [Reply]

    Raju Kurien Reply:

    nobody forced him to flee. He wanted to enjoy his zest, lust , whatever without the halla bole.

    And he knew the “palayan” will bring more attention…just like his discarding the slippers/chappals.

    He is not an artist, neither an advocate for freedom. Because if he was a believer in freedom, he would not have “worshipped” Indira Gandhi. So what freedom was the man talking about..

    Listen he is dead and gone. Hope he gets women and wine wherever he is (I guess he wont qualify for 78 virgins)

    [Reply]

    B.V.SHENOY Reply:

    Raju,

    you have increased the number by six. Was it because you thought he is a special Indian Muslim, hounded by Hindu fundamentalists (like fake Ravi) and 95 years old? You also must have thought, let him have six more, what difference is it going to make, after all even when he was alive, he had only platonic love with all the damsels who were falling over him, if we are to believe Anjolie Ila Menon.

    Raju, will you please clarify?

    Ravi Reply:

    M. F. Husian was HOUNDED out of India

    From New York Times

    In May 2008 an Indian court quashed three obscenity cases against Mr. Husain, the BBC reported. The charges contended that Mr. Husain, 93, offended Hindus with a work representing India as a nude goddess. The court in Delhi ruled that the painting was not obscene. Mr. Husain, who has been accused of obscenity in at least seven cases, apologized for the painting, which he declared an ”expression of purity.”

    That year, Mr. Husain’s paintings were attacked by members of Bajrang Dal, a right-wing Hindu group, at an event in New Delhi. Religious hardliners have also filed more than 800 court cases against him and vandalized his house.

    Mr Shenoy more than 800 court cases. I CALL THAT HOUNDING

    [Reply]

    Raju Kurien Reply:

    Well, I dont call it hounding because nobody threatened him with his life.. Filing cases is the right way democratic countries deal with differences.

    and bhatrat mata is not the only nude one he did — Saraswathi, Lakshmi, Durga, Sita… and he also had Ganesh in a negative connotation…

    I do not think he did it because he hated Hindus. He did it to create controversy and make money.

    [Reply]

    Pankaj#1 Reply:

    Raju;
    Title should have been: Hindustan pe halla Bole:.

    Ravi Reply:

    Washington Post June the 9th 2011

    He did receive death threats.

    Hussain had lived in Dubai since 2006 after receiving death threats from Hindu hard-liners in India for a nude painting of a woman shaped like India’s map, often depicted as “Mother India” in popular arts, folklore and literature. A nude of Hindu goddess Saraswati also angered the hard-liners.

  • Ravi

    There is nothing wrong in what Dr Mishra says or does

    It is completely wrong to suggest that Dr Mishra has “sold out” to western society.

    Dr Mishra has lived in the UK long enough to have imbibed all the goodness that the British society has to offer. I am sure that he has gained these values without diluting his Indian essence. To present this as white arse licking is just being baselessly vindictive.

    Those that are having a pop at him are doing so because of their malignant magnanimity.

    [Reply]

  • rajiv

    ——————————————————————————————————————————–
    One of the best comments by an Indian in Pak tribune..on news story about atrocious treatment of minoritis in Islamic Republic of Pakistan
    ———————————————————————————————————————————-

    By Rifaye(indian)

    OK ! Since there are talks abt indian minority. its approprite that i should comment here, as i am an south indian tamil muslim..

    to be very honest, this country has been so kind and grace enough to all its citizen,( i hate to be called as minority, as i am very much indian and belong to larger part of society) be it christian, muslim or buddhist.. just an example, in my province, chief minister is a hindu, high court chief justice is a muslim and my governor is a sikh.. or in central ministry, our speaker is a dalit, our pm is sikh, our vice president is a muslim.. so the message is minorities represent every part of job and every system in place.

    in our 60 year of independence we have had 3 muslim president and 2 muslim vice presidents..and we have so many indian muslim promience who have been awarded bharat ratna, viz a viz, bismillah khan, abdul kalam zakir hussian, khan abdul gaffar khan, abul kalam azad ( out of 41 receipients 5 are muslims)… perhaps with just mere 12 % of muslim population, i could confidently say that india is the only country in the whole world, where there is a goverment subsidy for hai pilgrimage..even the mighty uk or usa would never do it..

    if you gonnna talk abt gujarat massacre or ayodhya issue, yes those are few blackmarks in our system. we learnt our lesson and moved on.. tell me which country havent had such a bad past.. be it america or britan.. yet they all learnt their lesson..

    being born to lower middle class muslim family, with my sheer education, we are moved up to average middle class family..and good things is much of muslim community have realized the imp of education.. and for the record, the last year civic service exam topper was a kashmiri muslim boy,and now been posted in kashmir as per his wish.. so i am say with confidence, the minorities are very well taken care than the majority of pakistanis are taken care by your own goverment.

    The problem with pakistan is, that they think, they are the saviours and guardians for all muslim around the world. i am indian, a muslim. to me, my country and the welfare of my people are my utmost importance..so better look after yourself, and the other will take care of themself too..

    [Reply]

    rajiv Reply:

    Here is the link to above posting

    http://tribune.com.pk/story/186683/minority-rights-for-hindu-community-asylum-may-be-the-only-option/

    [Reply]

    L Mirza Reply:

    Rajiv

    Pakistan is a goner not a keeper. iI will bet bet 20% if i i were a better in vegas.

    Educarion, participation, accomplishments etc are the keys to upliftment and success, whether one is Hindu, christian, Sikh, Muslim..

    North indian Muslims will better if they follow South indian muslims organizations, involvement etc. Kerala has 5 Muslim ministers in their cabinet including the dy CM. Their educational societies like MES focused on education a long time ago.

    Wanting carve-outs, set-asides, special privileges etc are counter ptroductive. While pockets of backwardnesss and majority or otehr communities dislikes may be there, it will be stupid and foolish for any muslim in India to declare theya re discriminated etc.

    An optimistic, confident, fowrward looking india needs everybody to accomplish its goals.

    [Reply]

    Ravi Reply:

    L. Mirza

    I agree with you.

    However, do you not agree that there are some people here, for whom the objective of Hindu community and its progress take higher priority than does the progress of India as a nation.

    Resources are required to ensure progress, and if at ground level, such political realities are created, that a disproportionate amount of these resources are directed towards one community, causing disadvantage to other communities then that is where the problem arises.

    In other words there are political movements in India, whose declared objectives is to create Hindu Supremacy by subjugating other communities.

    Positive discrimination is a device to ensure that some degree of level playing field can be created, where there is differential among communities due to historical discriminations

    [Reply]

    L Mirza Reply:

    Ravi=

    No, i do not think so. There are vested interests in alls ections.

    To be frank, even if there are some who want “upliftment” of Hindus, should nt the country be better off if 85% people do better than worse?

    If at all there is a “disproprtionate” amount directed by government on any community, it is the disproprtionate amount that govt spends on minorities, and most of that falls on Muslims.

    There are no political”movements” in Indis with the whole aim of subjugating other communities. May be you and I are in different Indias.

    If you are referring to BJP, they have never stated taht subjugating Muslims is their aim

    B.V.SHENOY Reply:

    Mirza,

    First of all, let me congratulate you for joining this blog fraternity under your own name, unlike some of the Pakistanis who dump stinking garbage here under Hindu/Sikh names.

    Though you have mentioned Dr. Abdul Kalam as the recipient of national honour, let me proudly inform our other bloggers here that we love and respect this sambar drinking, rasam sipping, idli gulping vegetarian South Indian and former president of India.

    [Reply]

    Prabhat Reply:

    And devoted Maa Saraswati worshipper

  • Rizwan

    since Balwinder paaji mentioned it, I have started blogging on Express tribune and PTH. I hv come across rifaye before, and on PTH came across bade miyan, vidyut, no- communal, vasan, Anoop, Tony Singh etc. they are a mixed bag- some Indians some Pakistanis.
    THE MOST DISTURBING ASPECT WAS COMING ACROSS FEMALE PAK BLOGGERS LIKE MARYAM, SANA ETC, their approach to life was very aggressive borne out of paranoia. Normally one associates women with gentleness so it was quite a shock to my system !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
    rifaye writes very well. like Gopi THOMAS here I was completely unaware of the strength of south Indian muslims, their unique south Indian cultural identity. We are planning a trip to Mahabalipuram, Chennai and Hampi later this year, there is so much of India I hv yet to see……….

    [Reply]

    Gopi Thomas Reply:

    Rizwan-

    travel is a great learning and observational opportunity.

    You will enjoy Mahabalipuram – great sculptures and temples carved out from single rock. Pallava kings had artists perform in front of these sculptures on cool November – January montnths under moonlight..

    As you move from one southern state to another, you will also understand how different (and better off) are Muslims in various south Indian states.

    Muslims in Kerala used to be called (and now also) “mappila”. Mappila is son-in-law in Tamil (the ancient language of kerala/malabar region ). The origin goes back to 650s, when traders came from Arabian coast and settled in Malabar coast. They were invited by Hindus to be their son-in-laws.. Most of Kerala Msulims are descendents of this cross-breeding, although there were some forced conversions by Tipu Sultan and his father Hyder Ali during several Mysore invasions,

    Before devotees can enter the Ayyappa temple in Sabari Malai (tthe most famous temple of Kerala, and one of the important temples of South india) , they have to give their respect to Vavar, at his temple. Vavar was a Muslim, the clsoe friend of Manikanta, the God of Sabarinmali, the adopted son of the King of Pantalam —

    Hope you get to see mnay interesting and useful things.

    [Reply]

  • Mohan Ramchandani

    Can someone from Congress party tell us that why SoniaG and RahulG are in
    Switzerland ? Are they bringing their money back ?

    [Reply]

    rajiv Reply:

    They may have gone to deposit more. Who knows.

    [Reply]

    B.V.SHENOY Reply:

    or to show zero balance in their existing accounts.

    [Reply]

  • Mahesh

    Pankaj,
    Responding here as there was a Page flip…..
    You said :
    “Really speaking, could not understand your comments about archieved post did not reveal or confirm to my simplistic conclusion about debate. please elaborate. also would like to know your contribution to this debate, whether MF was right in depicting hindu deities in nude. will be out for few days, but would join you after that.”
    Was hinting at name calling and trash that constituted most part of discussion both on the topics of Ramdev Baba and MFH. Your summing up of contentions on MFH veered clear of it.
    On MFH…..
    Let me start with Bal Thackeray’s statement…..
    “As an artist, everyone has a domain and Husain handled his modern art with zeal. However, he slipped while drawing paintings of Hindu gods and goddesses”
    My own thinking is congruent with the statement (just the statement, to be precise). Despite being atheist I didn’t like it when MFH painted Hindu deities in Nude. Plus, there was this nagging feeling of the co-relation between controversy and Painting’s Price. And yet, I hated it when there were death threats on him. From my perspective – it is these death threats that are more worrisome as they represent a lunatic fringe appropriating the representation on behalf of majority and deciding what is right and what is wrong. The last thing we want is some lunatic fringe deciding on democratic rights.
    - Mahesh.

    [Reply]

    Dr Mishra, UK Reply:

    @Mirza, I enjoyed your post. And yes, to get ahead in life one must not bleat discrimination all the time for otherwise one gets nihilistic and non productive.
    But if I was a national leader in India, then in private I would admit that discrimination on many grounds, incl religion is rife at lower levels in India.
    I would want to devote the next 20 years, like UK has done in the last 20 years, to slowly weed out discrimination both from the mind and through tough legislation.
    Trouble is, India has bigger problems like hunger and poverty to sort out first.

    [Reply]

    shamik Reply:

    The United Kingdom has been accused of “sleepwalking toward apartheid” by Trevor Phillips, chair of that country’s Commission for Racial Equality. Philips has said that Britain is fragmenting into isolated racial communities: “literal black holes into which no one goes without fear and trepidation and nobody escapes undamaged”. Philips believes that racial segregation in Britain is approaching that of the United States. “You can get to the point as they have in the U.S. where things are so divided that there is no turning back.”[8]

    The BBC has reported that the latest crime statistics appear to support Phillips’ concerns. They show that race-hate crimes increased by almost 600 per cent in London in the month after the July 7 bomb attacks, with 269 more offences allegedly “motivated by religious hatred” reported to the Metropolitan Police, compared to the same period last year.[8]

    In 2007 racist remarks made by contestants on the Celebrity Big Brother TV series against Bollywood actress Shilpa Shetty caused widespread outrage, not least in the UK with the British public phoning in to make Shetty the series winner and the other ethnic minority contestant Jermaine Jackson the runner up. Demonstrators in Bangalore burned effigies of the TV Channel’s directors.[9]
    [edit] England

    One wonders what that UK stands for in Dr Mishra’s reply

    [Reply]

    Dr Mishra, UK Reply:

    Shamik, thanks. I lok at the progress in the last 20 years. Till about 1985, Indians could work at registrar levels all their lives and never become Consultants. Now forget the NHS, even the top private hospitals are flooded with Indian Consultants. Forget Consultants, Indians have become top academic professors and are national figures in the dept of health.

    In the seventies, a Indian family moving into a new home would surely get a welcome home present from the neighbours- broken windows. Today, the most expensive houses backing onto golf courses are owned by Indians.
    Regarding a particular survey, 50% of the partners of black men were white women. There is a lot of black-white and asian- white marriages. Lewis Hamilton, Daley Thompson and Leona Lewis are but everyday examples. Unheard of in the 1970s.
    I could go on and on.
    My comment above was on discrimination in the work place in particular. Besides influencing ppl’s minds through schools, party manifestoes and debates about racism, there is rock solid tribunls in place which can give employers a very tough time.
    I should know- a Kenyan once sued me and a white colleague- the tribunal was nasty, but thorough

    Dr Mishra, UK Reply:

    Trevor Phillips’s comments did not deal with discrimination, it dealt more with the rise of black and muslim crime and with ghettoes. Certainly 911 and 7/7 London bombings and the absolutely alarming rise in Islamic fundamentalism threatens to undo the work of the last 20 years.
    Big brother is a program which encourages fights and vulgarity among C grade contestants for viewership- it is like a Victorian freak show. The fact that upper class Shilpa, for the sake of £ 350,000 agreed to appear in a veritable ‘trailer park trash’ show left us all aghast here.

    Dr Mishra, UK Reply:

    shamik, would be interested in your opinion of the painting referred to below

  • Dr Mishra, UK

    I see that after I have given my opinion in the previous page, I am being quoted again by some, not very accurately.
    Look at this painting-
    http://shilpishukla.blogspot.com/2010/04/mf-hussain-redefining-freedom.html
    I think it is a powerful painting, in my opinion not obscene. My opinion is coloured by my upbringing. I think India shown here is a beautiful woman, the himalayas on the northern border are majestic and the sunrise above them speaks of a new dawn.
    The lady’s breasts are visible, but then so is a lot of beautiful aesthetic temple architecture, or lovely paintings of women breast feeding.
    In the present context of our former brother country to the west spinning hopelessly out of control where a national painting would almost certainly involve an AK 47, the beauty of India is a powerful reposte to 2611.
    But if it offends ‘big time’ then it should be withdrawn. Problem is how do you define big time- ???

    [Reply]

    Dr Mishra, UK Reply:

    others have stated their positions. I am particularly interested in the opinion of the following on the Indian painting refd above, seeing that I have put my own head on the line-

    First and foremost, Mr Vinod Sharma

    Dr Pankaj, Vijay, Dr BNA
    Rajiv with I, Balwinder praa
    Shenoy, Mahesh, Prabhat, Mohan
    Raju k, Gopi T, Dr Shah Alam, L Mirza, Shoeb K, Benoy H

    [Reply]

    Dr Mishra, UK Reply:

    questions are- is it obscene, would you buy it, would you protest against it ?

    [Reply]

    B.V.SHENOY Reply:

    Dr.Mishra,

    You seem to be very popular in Pakistan, because even when you have not invited them, the ISI agents are ready with their two penny worth of “opinions”.

    This also shows that even when their butts are getting bombed they worry about how Husain is being ‘treated’ by the Indians.

    Ravi Reply:

    Dr Mishra

    Most of these people have already expressed their opinions on this topic, here in this blog.

    They are all visible in previous pages.

    [Reply]

    Mahesh Reply:

    Mishraji,
    To answer your questions….
    Obscene – NO
    Buy it – NO (I don’t have a good “aesthetic sense”).
    Protest against it – NO !!!!!!
    - Mahesh.

    [Reply]

    rajiv Reply:

    I think I have replied,
    Neither MF Hussain or anyone is capable of painting any thing that can offend me.

    What offends me is just not in the control of anyone, expect me.
    So
    Obscene : irrelevent/No
    Buy It : I have Better use of money. My brother is a great artist
    Protest : I have better use of my time

    Dr Mishra, UK Reply:

    whew, I thought I would get lynched. Thanks Rajiv and Mahesh.
    Waiting for the others

    Prabhat Reply:

    Obscene : No
    Buy it : If it was not signed “Hussain”, I would consider it an amaturish work by a “lazy” artist
    Protest : Not worth it

    Ravi Reply:

    B.V. Shenoy

    Any opinion is better than your two paisa worth of drivel.

    [Reply]

    Vijay Kumar Reply:

    @ Dr mishra

    I think it was a lovely painting !

    Being bare breasted is a special French tradtion. The cold and uninviting French beaches only get illuminated with this tradtion.

    Carla bruni who sportingly reveals all the french secrets only carries forward this tradtion…

    But then what is good for France may be debatable for india in case religious feelings are riled…

    [Reply]

    (Dr.) B.N.Anand Reply:

    Hello Dr. Mishra, U.K

    Thanks for asking.
    Obscene—-yes
    Purchase—-No
    Protest—-Yes, but in a way that it can be seen.
    Must I add that religious issues are not debatable. If at all to be debated, the sensitivities of every one to be taken care of. Mr. MFH may be big artist but only in the elite section of the society.
    BNA

    [Reply]

  • Prabhat

    I personally think Ramdev to be a cunning and scheming type of person. There is something odd about him. Something that has not come to fore yet, but is there…

    Inspite of my personal prejudices, I believe Ramdev could achieved in just few days what Advani could not do in years.

    This itself reinforces my feeling that Advani chose wrong means to achieve his political goals. I always believed and argued with my friends that the path Advani took was wrong and would harm the Indian polity and it did.

    As Ramdev clearly demonstrates there could be alternative methods to achieve the political prominence other than the path Advani chose.

    Just that we always take the extreme position at the very first opportunity – take the brahmastra out at the very first go !

    Impatience in every sphere in life is leading to more chaos, the very anti-thesis of the objective that we set out to achieve !

    [Reply]

    Ravi Reply:

    Prabhat.

    Did you mean Advani’s Path, or Advani’s Rath

    [Reply]

    Prabhat Reply:

    @Ravi

    I meant the path Advani took to achieve his political goal…which is Rath yatra to Ayodhya and inciting people etc.

    [Reply]

  • http://- Rajeev

    Is their any artist on this forum? If yes, I suggest a project for the person.
    1. Create an image where MF Husain is orally copulating with Shabana Azmi.
    2. Sonia Gandhi holding erect little MF Hussain and flying over alps.
    Many more…I think it is time we create some image and use freedom of expression.
    I would also like Husain imposing himself on bent Bukhari performing Namaaz.

    [Reply]

  • Praveen Saxena

    Shenoy Saab, Rajeev
    Whereas the death of MF Hussain in UK and his burial there is a non event for most in the country . But for some , it is a God sent opportunity as they can reclaim some media space and go back to the usual chant “Amit Shah Amit Shah”. Beneath all that breast beating and the wailing on Hussain’s death did you not see the sense of relief . This is what these fakes have been trying . To counter the charge mounted by the Aam Admi , Anna Hazare and Baba Ramdevji ,keep yelling “RSS , RSS , BJP” Fakes and spurious as they are , if you ask them , they would never have heard the name of Taslima Nasreen.

    [Reply]

    B.Vajiv, .SHENOY Reply:

    Praveen Saxenaji,

    short of taking out julooses, wailing slogans like “MF Husai amar rahe”, “Husain saab, lage raho, hum thumhare saath hain” the secular fundos have done everything conceivable. I just received an SMS from a friend that Mumbai traders have run out of mombatti stock and the rent-a-funeral crowd are buying candles in the black-market. A few days back these same elites were screaming against corruption.

    [Reply]

  • Vijay Kumar

    @ Ravi

    I was not on the net yesterday but now replying to you.

    Why I consider your comments dupliciious:

    a) T U R D Tajendar has been posting vile and anti Hindu, anti Indian postings taking up 33% of the space here. He believes that he is the product of some sperm dropped by a flying Arab and thus superior in blood :D :D HA HA

    Obviously the low grade ISI agent (s) who use his ID are serving Pakistani and Muslim fundamantalist agenda…

    he looks at you for support and you dont reprive him but fight for his right to insult Hinduism, Sikhism, AhemaDIS, Christians and Jews. Even the feeble reprive you gave him under constant prompting by me does not convince me that you actually meant it…

    b) You claim you are mona sikh. Now going back to Punjab of the eighties, if you remembder Lala Jagat narain was killed just because his paper– Punjab Kesari– printed a calendar with a picture of Guru Gobind Singh! Killed just for printing a picture of the great guru with no insult but reverance…

    What do you call that sort of behaviour?

    c) Lately a Sikh who has started a cult called Dera Sacha Sauda and calls himself Ram Rahim Singh is being chased by Akalis and Sikhs in general for just wearing similar to what one Sikh guru wore.

    No insult just wearing clothes,

    What do you call this sort of behaviour?

    d) What I am trying to get at is some Hindus have a right to get angry. More so because fingers are being pointed at them and insults being heaped by people who would not allow the same to be done to their own religious figures.

    Also having Some Sikh relatives and also hanging around mostly with two SIkhs in our group, i for sure know how Sikhs would have reacted in case some religious icon of the Sikh faith would have been depicted in the same way.

    You should honestly answer that for all of us here …

    wILL YOU?

    [Reply]

  • Balwinder Sandhu

    shenoy saheb, very dry humour, I like it – “”"Dr.Mishra, You seem to be very popular in Pakistan, because even when you have not invited them, the ISI agents are ready with their two penny worth of “opinions”.
    This also shows that even when their butts are getting bombed they worry about how Husain is being ‘treated’ by the Indians.”"”

    [Reply]

  • shan

    @shenoy , stick to your **** poetry , anything else will see the stick going up yours
    and now read
    n discussing the long range effects of circumcision, Dr. Goldman (Circumcision: The Hidden Trauma by Ronald Goldman Ph.D., 1997, Vanguard Publications, Boston, MA) writes that the circumcised adult loses sexual sensitivity in the glans of the penis because of continual rubbing of the unprotected glans against clothing and that the intact penis’ foreskin has many nerve endings which contribute to sexual enjoyment. Furthermore, the foreskin minimizes friction during intercourse and thus eliminates the need for supplementary lubrication. Very few individuals who make circumcision decisions are familiar with this information, he claims. The author writes that “Parents do not know what they are choosing, and physicians do not feel what they are doing.” Thus both are in denial as to the real effects of this procedure.

    The loss of penile sensitivity is due to the following:

    1. Loss of the foreskin nerves. The inner foreskin possesses a greater density of nerve endings and is probably more erogenous than even the glans. This tremendous amount of sensitivity is lost completely when the foreskin is amputated. Also, the most sensitive part of the penis, the frenulum of the foreskin, is removed in most infant circumcisions. The frenulum is the continuation of the inner foreskin which attaches to the underside of the glans. Thus, circumcision robs us of a large percentage, if not the majority, of erogenous nerve endings to the penis.

    2. Damage to the glans. The erogenous sensitivity that remains after circumcision is primarily in the glans. This is further reduced by the removal of the protective foreskin which leaves the glans permanently exposed. The penis head developed over millions of years of evolution as an internal organ, meant to be safely enclosed by the prepuce. The skin covering of the glans IS the foreskin. The glans becomes artificially keratinized (dry, hardened, discolored, and wrinkled) as a result of permanent exposure, and thus significantly less sensitive.

    3. Loss of skin mobility. The nerve endings in the glans are best stimulated by a rolling massage action. Direct friction tends to fire off pain receptors causing irritation and also causes further keratinization of the glans. With the skin system of the penis significantly reduced by circumcision, the mobility is essentially gone and now the penis is a static mass with no dynamic self stimulation mechanism. Direct friction is now the primary form of stimulation. So circumcision further reduces erogenous sensitivity in the penis by reducing skin mobility and thus the ability to use the foreskin to massage the glans

    [Reply]

  • Balwinder Sandhu

    spank- me- I – love-it- my-name-is -shan khan
    now vaary pareshan hehe

    [Reply]

  • Balwinder Sandhu

    doc mishraji
    Is the painting obscene- no
    would I buy it- maybe yes, but only if it was for 200-300 £. but now after such contoroversy, maybe not.
    protest against it- no, but yes against the more graphic ones- goddess with animals in ? indecent pose.
    again- how would I protest- maybe just electronically, but then I have to full a life to wave flags on street
    ————-
    i was supposed to take 2 weeks off and conc on health and business, but this blog pulls me back.
    If I heart attack, you VINOD SHARMAJI will be sent hosp bills
    hehe

    [Reply]

  • Prabhat

    Sachin Tendulkar is anti-national !!!

    “Sachin Tendulkar is anti-national and takes money to compromise his country. This is evident from the fact that he is a campaigner for egg-eating, having appeared in ads that proclaim ‘ande hi ande, Sunday ho ya Monday’

    [Reply]

    Prabhat Reply:

    Sorry. Forgot to mention the source.

    - It’s from BABA RAMDEV CAMP, Hardwar

    [Reply]

  • Balwinder Sandhu

    Shenoy saheb, your joke on SHAN’s sunnat and my joke back has been deleted. surprisingly, SHAN’s reply to shenoy on circumcision has not been deleted. why ???

    Maybe jokes have been sent to Indian embassy to see who is getting padma shree, Sardar Sir Sandhu or Shri Shri Shri Shenoy Shankar

    but i am peeved, the jokes were excellent, yours and mine. funny world, Hussains paintings and Tajender’s boli is not banned but mild jokes are

    [Reply]

  • Anonymous

    Now that Sujata’s Party has lost BMC election and her favorite Kripa Shankar Singh disgraced, she has chosen to write about Gujarat and indirectly bash BJP.

    Should we be surprised?

    [Reply]

  • Abu Ahmed

    My sympathies are with you and your reporter of 10 years ago in Gujarat – I begin to understand your pain that you feel upon watching the perpetrators of those inhuman crimes in Gujarat continuing to remain above law till now and probably for a long time to come, if at all they are ever booked for the same. Krishna had said in Gita that he would come into the world whenever attrocities go beyond limits. Now its time for him to visit Gujarat and take care of its victims and the culprits. Otherwise, as Gujarat is so near to Pakistan as well as Iran, some nuclear bombs may simply fall on it accidentally of course, by a modern-day Ghori or Ghazni. Before such a thing happens, the culprits should better be booked and justice done to the victims.

    [Reply]

  • Anonymous

    OMG this dynasty slave is still around..

    [Reply]

  • Anonymous

    Guest,
    Do you even have a name forget any common sense?

    [Reply]

  • AshishC

    The answer is evident, is it not?
    Very soon, all HT staffers will start blogging about Pakistan or even Timbuctoo.

    [Reply]

  • http://www.facebook.com/people/Janak-Makavana/100003635221339 Janak Makavana

    When article is published for remembering decade old riots, we should see articles being published for other riot cases (84 Sikhs massacre http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1984_anti-Sikh_riots ) and ethnic cleansing of Kashmiri pundits http://www.satp.org/satporgtp/kpsgill/2003/chapter9.htm . Lets keep journalism unbiased.

    [Reply]

  • vinay pandey

    S.P won congress lost and to say that Akhilesh won Rahul lost is rubbish and foolish at best. The lack of organizational base what did in congress and voters knew that congress is in no position to form government hence went for S.P.
    Lok shabha election 2014 is where we will see the impact of all the hard work done by Rahul.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Rahul Gandhi will not be able to repeat 2009 UP Lok Sabha results. Akhilesh Yadav will see to that. SP will encroach Congress seats by widening its support base and Mayawati/BSP too will be back in reckoning. The RSS will work silently to enhance BJP’s performance but BJP may still not improve much. Congress is certainly in for hard times and will deteriorate further. Rahul Gandhi will be shy of exposing himself further in UP in case it backfires again.

    [Reply]

    Saron Reply:

    Man proposes , God disposes– In SP’s case we can say Akhilesh proposes his cadre disposes– so lets watch

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    You are right, SP’s cadre may mar its performance. Hopefully Mulayam, Akhilesh and co. will rein them in.

    Saron Reply:

    Do your think the organisational network would improve in two years time

    [Reply]

  • anil

    If Akilesh can build up the impression that he is serious about tackling corruption, maintaining law and order and confronting religious/caste divides created by Congress he will make a good PM candidate in days to come.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    At this point of time, even a non SP person like me is rather optimistic about Akhilesh Yadav. He has certainly made a good first impression. I hope his arrival will help to throw over rated guys like Rahul Gandhi into history’s dustbin.

    [Reply]

    Saron Reply:

    Yes, there is optimism and expectations

    [Reply]

    Saron Reply:

    He has to prove himself as CM first

    [Reply]

  • http://www.desibits.com/ Avinash

    SP was/is never the choice of UP voters, rather they did not have any other option. What a common voter think about a common politician of today, sorry I will not be able to write because of decency and if at all I dare to write, HT will not publish saying I am writing vulgar language. People had only choice. There two “……..” in the fray contesting elections and we have to choose who is little less “…….” knowing well both are not competent to run the show.

    [Reply]

    Saron Reply:

    People had expectations

    [Reply]

  • Saron

    Lets watch six months

    [Reply]

  • Saron

    Agreed

    [Reply]

  • Saron

    Thanks — I think new leaders should be given a chance

    [Reply]

  • Saron

    Thanks— He has good intentions , sounds positive

    [Reply]

  • Saron

    you are forgetting the carnage

    [Reply]

  • Parmanu

    “Nothing in my experience of the country has made me euphoric. In fact, it’s the opposite. It’s just been growing cynicism by the day.”

    You’ve been focussing on the negative things, perhaps? How about looking at the arts, for instance? If you were working for a magazine like Sruti (http://www.sruti.com/), would your view have been different, I wonder.

    A fascinating thought experiment, though. I enjoyed it.

    [Reply]

  • Sumit Bose

    Mr Vir Sanghvi, there is absolutely no reason for this, not only, rabidly corrupt , but also stupidly inept government to be concerned about “criticism” from within the country; the “journalists” as you and your tribe of pseudo-secularists have long been “dalals” of the Corrupt Party. This is not a recent phenomenon, but there are just a few journalists who did not drink from the Corrupt Party’s poisoned chalice, and they are Firoze Gandhi, Ramnath Goenka and C.R Irani, the rest of your tribe just were worms feeding on the waste of the Corrupt Party.
    Sadly, the power-brokers in the Corrupt party had not “budgeted” for the International media and since the corruption levels have breached stratospheric levels, it has caught the attention of many all around the world.
    A small example, Britain just hosted the Olympics and did a fantastic job within US$ 40 billion, our CWG which requires less than 1/6th the resources in comparison to the Olympics, bled our exchequer slightly over US$120 billion.
    But in the scale of CAG exposures, the CWG’s loot is loose change to the real grand sceme of looting of the treasury.
    Is it then any surprise that our beloved Italian ex-maid has been named as the 4th wealthiest politician in the world? Dalals as you and your illustrious tribe will be silent, but would all else not react to the sudden windfall riches of one particular family?

    [Reply]

  • Bijal Shah

    Hi Vir, There is undying of the fact that a comment from west is considered much more worthy than one from within. Not only a comment on politics but on many other aspects like economy, social aspect and entertainment amongst others. Most of the Indians and Indian corporations like to flaunt praise from west, collaboration with western companies, invitation to an overseas event. Most of Indians have deep craving to know what foreigners think of India. This also evident from the fact that any interaction with foreigners either on TV or elsewhere include a question that what he thinks of India or a specific aspect of India. Every first time visitor to India is asked did he like India (though there is little be like about). This questions are more rhetoric in nature – asking foreigner to praise at least something about India. Probably we Indians deep down in our hearts still think whites are superior.

    However, reading you blog I felt that as an Indian journalist you feel jealous about foreign press getting more attention than Indian. I agree that with you that PMO has paid needless heed to Washington Post’s article. But journalist like you should first criticize Indian media for making it a headline. All big stories on India in the western media (Modi on Time, Underachiever title by Time, Washington post article, etc. etc.) have become headline in Indian media (print or television). Does it indicated that our journalist fraternity also has high respect for foreign media and their views? I think you should first criticize your profession before talking about political class. Especially, as media is expected to be at the forefront of change and its thinking & writing should not be embroiled by colonial era.

    [Reply]

  • damnright

    Sorry, Stop using “we”. Indians cannot take criticisms, and cannot support freedom of speech and talking the truth if it is not favorable to us. So stop complaining and fix this country full of bugs and thugs!

    [Reply]

  • Guest

    Even journalists defer to a fair skin. Just a few days back, there was a TV show, two very senior Indian journalists, one of whom had earlier held the second most important job in the country, two goras, one the author of the piece discussed in this column, both middle order stringers, and the Indians, were truly deferential and on best behaviour, far less combative than if they had been interacting with two relatively junior Indian colleagues with a nice suntan.

    [Reply]

  • Manish

    Sir,
    The way the title was put, I thought I could find an answer, but you have actually given a history, without answers. If you are really thinking the answers lie within ourselves, then this article was actually meaningless.

    [Reply]

  • dr.joji cherian

    Almost all the main line American media are tools of Neo Cons. They churn out reports and articles in the garb of “news”..At times blatent lies as in the case of their “discovery” of WMDs in Iraq forcing that hapless nation called America into a war.You only need to attach that much credibility to these American “news” outfits.the latest article is another attempt to malign browbeat the prime minister who is trying to take an independent stand such as attending the NAM meeting in Iran.Learn to dismiss the motivated reports and articles with the contempt they deserve

    [Reply]

  • Anonymous

    Vir Sanghvi knows who and what Pankaj Pachauri is and why he was selected to become the Press Adviser to the PM. I shall not go into that. But I do not understand why a person of Pachauri’s capabilities (and there must have been many for his to be selected) and his background in journalism, does not read the writing on the walls and hear the voices in the streets with a common refrain – India is disappointed with Dr. Manmohan Singh’s second tenure as PM.

    It would have behoved Pankaj Pachauri’s intellect, had he advised (now, isn’t that his job) the PM that reacting to the WP article would only highlight the PM’s failures and gradual but precipitate drop from a person of high personal integrity to someone who does not care or cannot take care that India does not hurtle down the path of economic and moral decline.

    [Reply]

  • Dr. Mustafa Kamal Sherwani

    An Advice to Dr. Manmohan Singh
    ***************************
    Your innocent look, your unblemished past,
    Invokes my pity, Dear Dr. Manmohan Singh;!
    When I see the dust gathering around you,
    That blurs your glory as an honest king.
    At the head of this corrupt and dishonest gang,
    Do you think, you are safe from their dirt;?
    When I find you on the defensive plank,
    I always feel anguished, I always feel hurt.
    I have a deep regard and respect for you,
    To save your image, leave these vices’ heaps;
    The history will judge you by a single norm,
    ‘A man is known by the company, he keeps.’
    Dr. Mustafa Kamal Sherwani,LL.D.

    [Reply]

  • Critical Appraisal

    Despite and inspite of western criticism, ‘we’ still go outdoors for our bare necessities and use water for washing up! This only means we don’t give a shit to their thoughts – while the PMO which remains indoors for emptying its bowels and use may be tissue paper for the cleaning act, do give a shit to it. Therein lies a lesson – going outdoors & using water to wash away or remaining indoors and using the toilet paper to dry out!

    [Reply]

  • J.Sandhu

    Very good analysis, I agree with you entirely, military support for Afghan is a must, it will have international support and lead to isolation of Pak. The US will then have no need to fund the Pak Army and this will give strength to the political parties who may start asserting themselves. I see your suggestions as a win win situation. It is about time India paid more attention to this region, it should use its goodwill with Iran who could prove to be an invaluable ally in supporting a search for a viable form of Government in Afghan.

    [Reply]

  • balaji

    in pakistan there are nearly unregistered 10 lakh fully trained militants and 50 lakh untrained militants which are brainwashed to fight and die against india and their master minds continuously working out for various differet perfect plans to assolt india……

    [Reply]

  • balaji

    imp note : indian army, government authorities, people should count this informaion :–
    in pakistan there are nearly unregistered 10 lakh fully trained militants and 50 lakh untrained militants which are brainwashed to fight and die against india and their master minds continuously working out for various differet perfect plans to assolt india……

    [Reply]

  • Sumit Bose

    Engrich mian, did you even bother to read what i opined on this Muslim’s recurring one sided spin on the Israeli occupation of Palestine? I made no mention of NM or any Hindu Gods.
    It was just a stark contrast with the Bengalis, Punjabis and Sindhis who were dispossessed, just as the Arabs from the current Palestinian lands, at around the same time, and just look at what, with a constructive mind-set, they have achieved as a community! They are all so productive inspite of having to escape in most tragic circumstances.

    i am very aware of you, Indian pseudo-arabs, memorizing your scriptures without even a farthing’s comprehension of Arabic, but to sleep walk as a somnambulist in English takes the cake and the bakery!
    Mian, get a life with some capacity to reflect independently and do not shame the institutions where you obtained your literacy from.

    [Reply]

    engrich Reply:

    i will awnser ur idiocy tommorow.

    [Reply]

    Sumit Bose Reply:

    @ Engrich Mian, why tomorrow, is the brain shop is closed today?

    [Reply]

    engrich Reply:

    i have someother fools like u.wait.keep grease and vaseline ready.

    Sumit Bose Reply:

    @Engrich Mian, Thanks for advertising your preference of the 23 pre-puberty boys over 72 virgins!.What would your preference be for the sexes of the 80,000 servants, please?

    ehgrich Reply:

    KRISHNA HAD 16003 WIFES,as per rajneesh 15003 were kidnapped and
    married.brhmns were helping the kidnapping and used to convince their
    husbands that if u will give their wives to bhagwan krishna ,u will go
    heaven or will suffer in neven 7 janms.
    apart from so many wives and
    concubines he used to fk his neighbours wife called radha.this immoral
    act is celeberated by u people.brhmn makes good money out of this.so i
    pray,

    Urvashi – the daughter of Lord Vishnu – is a pro. Vashitha is the
    son of this pro. He in turn married his own Mother. Such a degraded
    person is the Guru of the Hindu God Rama. (page 48)

    ? When Krishna himself is wallowing in darkness of hell, how can he
    enlighten others? Since Krishna himself is a shady character, there is a
    need for us to liberate his misled followers. (page 50)

    ? It was Brahma himself who kidnapped Sita. Since Brahma, Vishnu
    and Shiva were themselves the victims of l**t, it is a sin to consider
    them as Gods. (page 39)

    ? When the Trinity of Hinduism (Brahma, Vishnu and Shiva) are
    consumed by l**t and anger, how can they liberate others. Their
    projection as Gods is nothing but a joke. (page 39).

    ? When Vishnu asked Brahma to commit a sin, he immediately did so.
    How can such a “evil brahma” be a Creator of this Universe? How is it
    possible for both the sinner and the entity which provoked the sin to be
    gods? (page 39)

    ? God, please liberate the sinful people of India who are
    worshipping False Gods that believe in the pleasures of illicit
    ‘Vyabichari’ relationships. (Page 39).

    so u know how fool u people are.young cpm cdres ********** on durga picture.tell me how she became goddess.from shanghai one kayasth brought her picture in 18th century and u idiots started worshipping her.what she can do to you.

    Sumit Bose Reply:

    @EngrichMIAN, you have totally lost the plot! This Zia Mian has put out a “poem” on the “sufferings” of the Palestinians. I responded to his being “blind” to Hindus who suffered as much or much more at around the same year and had to escape from Islamic Republic of Pakistan. The Kashmiri Hindus had to suffer the same fate in 1989, this Zia Mian has never bothered to write about their pain and angst, and as a bi-monthly feature brings up Palestine regularly.

    If the stark contrast to the determination and mind-set of the Hindus vis-a-vis that of the muslims, who have chosen to survive on hand-outs and abstain from education, reside on the fringes of their dispossessed land and live only to disrupt peace by becoming martyrs and jihadis, inflicting more misery and suffering on themselves.

    The Hindus ( Bengalis, Punjabis, Sindhis and now Kashmiris) have moved on and restarted life with education, humility and forbearance. This Muslim has never registered on his radar this stark contrast, but just remains in the “mataam” mode, blinded by the torpor of Islamic supremacy.
    As if, not to be outdone by this ZiaMian, you are on a rant on a totally unrelated topic. Mian, by shouting that the other person is ugly, does the hide the fact that you have no nose! (and brains, too)

    BSS Reply:

    LMAO! Grease sounds better for this fool. Vaseline would not be worth it!

    BSS Reply:

    Woops I guess he was at the madarsa with me! Poor fellow!

    BSS Reply:

    “sleep walk as a somnambulist” Only a bong could have done this! LMAO. Get an education dude!

    [Reply]

    Sumit Bose Reply:

    @BSS Mian, get an english dictionary and try to learn some new words/concepts for self-improvement, that would be much more constructive than being an “internet jihadi”… that is no different from the typical jihadi-nutcase; honours after a complete “madrassa brainscrub”..

    [Reply]

  • Dr.Raj

    Yes, they carry weapons to the brim, but you tend to forget that they also have two hands blessing the devotes. And those two hands are what make Hindus humble and followers of non violence, but it also tells that if we take to violence, we create history.
    And the less we discuss about your god the better, the whole world knows about it, and when some one points it out to you, you guys cannot take it, as they say “truth hurts”.

    [Reply]

    engrich Reply:

    that is why india had 1200 anti-muslim riots after partition.from jabalpur to ahmadabad shows ur humblenes.for 3000 years of vedic rule 98%of indians were allowed to go to school.can u name one university college hospital or library opened by u.budhhdist were not hindus.dont take their achievement in your account.

    [Reply]

    engrich Reply:

    vedic rule 98%of indians were allowed to go to

    please read,

    vedic rule 98%of indians were not allowed to go to

    [Reply]

  • Faulitics

    This blind and irrational support for “Palestinian” Arabs. Another sign of arabization. Religious network has been used to inform the “believers” about which side to take in political fights over land even though it may have nothing to do with the believers geographical location , local culture or other relevant circumstances. A thoroughly politicized religion. Not sure where religious beliefs end and politics begins. It’s all a mishmash.

    [Reply]

  • Kaul

    How about plight of native Hindus in Kashmir and Islamic republic of Pakistan? Notice there have been no Hindu terrorists there despite their horrific plight and decimation. Only Muslim terrorists there as well.

    [Reply]

  • Raul

    New York Times is writing today that aid to refugees of Muslim on Muslim genocide in Syria is mostly provided by E.U. and USA. It specifically mentions Muslim nations – rich Persian Gulf- as not providing enough aid for fellow Muslim refugees.

    [Reply]

    vanchoo Reply:

    problem over there is created by france and rich arab countries supported by america and britain.the way they have destroyed syria,their aid is not even peanut.

    [Reply]

  • agnivesh

    ndia’s Narendra Modi and the Tale of Two Rapes

    By Shikha Dalmia Jan 17, 2013 7:42 AM PT

    http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2013-01-17/india-s-narendra-modi-and-the-tale-of-two-rapes.html

    One of the most obscene moments after the death of the gang-rape victim in New Delhi was a tweet by Narendra Modi, the chief minister of the Indian state of Gujarat, offering regret and condolences to the dead woman’s family.

    Modi,
    who has quelled restive minorities by allowing attackers to subject
    women to unspeakable horrors, has done more than any man to numb his
    prudish country to sexual violence. Yet he was elected to a third term
    last month and is the presumptive front-runner of the Bharatiya Janata Party, the main Hindu opposition party, for prime minister in next year’s national elections.

    So
    long as Indians keep rewarding politicos such as Modi, the country’s
    collective outrage after the New Delhi case won’t change the culture that makes such atrocities common in India.

    The attack on the 23-year-old physiotherapy student was depraved.
    Five men and a teenager in a private bus are accused of kidnapping,
    beating, raping and violating her with an iron rod — and then dumping
    her and her semi-conscious boyfriend on a highway, where they also
    allegedly tried to run her over. But as monstrous as this crime was,
    consider what happened in Gujarat in February 2002, a few months after
    Modi assumed office.

    Organized
    bands of well-armed Hindus — some from groups tied to Modi’s party —
    fanned across the state seeking revenge against Muslims for allegedly
    burning a train full of Hindu pilgrims a few weeks earlier. The Hindu
    rioters systematically sought out and destroyed Muslim homes and businesses, killing more than 1,000 people.

    Extreme Violence

    Muslim women were singled out. According to many Indian and foreign sources, including a Human Rights Watch account and a report by
    an international research team called “Threatened Existence: A Feminist
    Analysis of the Genocide in Gujarat,” women were stripped, gang-raped,
    often publicly, and in almost all cases then burned or hacked to death.

    The
    reason the violence reached such extremes was that the state police
    stood back and didn’t intervene to stop the Hindu attacks and even told
    victims that it couldn’t protect them. As if the bloodletting wasn’t
    horrific enough, Modi subsequently dismantled the shelters constructed by private organizations for dispossessed Muslims, calling them “child-breeding centers.”

    Compared
    with the New Delhi rape, which has triggered a protest movement in
    India calling for the castration and execution of the suspects, the
    Gujarat rapes and pogrom elicited barely a whimper. Many Hindus either
    deny that the horror even occurred or, if they accept it, claim it
    wasn’t as grisly as news accounts suggest. And if they believe the
    accounts, they say Muslims had it coming. Fewer than 100 out of the
    thousands accused — among them only one state minister and one Bharatiya Janata Party leader — were convicted,
    and that was a decade later. Modi himself was exonerated.

    Whatever
    public disgust there was against him has dissipated, given the stellar
    economic growth that Gujarat has seen on his watch. Business leaders and
    corporations, from India and overseas, turn a blind eye to Modi’s role
    in allowing the bloodshed, and praise his economic stewardship. His
    business backers have already managed to
    get the U.K. government to reverse its long-standing ban on him and to
    give him a visa. Now they are trying to persuade the U.S. government to
    follow suit.

    What accounts for the wide gulf in the Indian public response to the single crime in New Delhi and the mass crimes in Gujarat?

    On a positive side, attitudes toward women have evolved considerably
    since the Gujarat atrocity 11 years ago. Indian women’s aspirations and
    opportunities have increased, especially in big cities, and they are
    demanding that the governing classes keep pace and create an environment
    in which they are free to move around safely.

    Changed Attitudes

    After
    the New Delhi attack, any politician or even religious guru — no
    matter how revered — who suggested that women need to circumscribe
    their lives and choices for their own protection was condemned and
    lampooned, something scarcely imaginable when I was growing up in New
    Delhi (in a Hindu household) in the 1970s.

    But
    the darker reality is that the young woman’s rape and murder outraged
    the country’s Hindu urban middle class because it was a random and
    senseless act that could have just as easily victimized their daughters.
    Not so with attacks on the Muslim women in Gujarat. The premeditated
    and programmatic violence against them meant that the broader Hindu
    majority was insulated from it. If the New Delhi woman’s fate made every
    Indian feel more
    vulnerable, the attack on the Muslim women made Hindus feel more secure.

    There
    are other reasons for India’s apathy toward Modi’s misdeeds. India is a
    democracy and has its share of human-rights activists and watchdog
    groups keeping an eye on government brutality. Yet the public at large
    has little appreciation of the dangers associated with overly muscular
    government. Indians complain constantly about government dysfunction and
    corruption. Yet they have little compunction about giving draconian
    powers to their rulers in the name of security. The upshot, tragically,
    is that Indians care less about state-fueled rape than when perpetrated
    by individuals.

    The
    scale of the sexual violence in Gujarat was unprecedented in India. But
    smaller episodes are a matter of routine. The Indian army has been accused of using rape as
    a weapon to crush secessionist movements in Kashmir and Manipur. After
    one particularly heinous case eight years ago, Manipuri women stripped
    naked and stormed the army headquarters with placards plaintively
    protesting: “Indian Army Rapes Us.”

    Tolerating
    sexual violence for any purpose erodes the overall stigma against it,
    opening a moral space where hoodlums can run amok. The lack of national
    outrage against the mass rapes perpetrated under Modi reduces their true
    cruelty, breaking down the psychological walls that would at least
    prevent nonsociopaths from going on a rampage. Hindus who turn a blind
    eye to the rape of Muslim women can’t ultimately protect their own.

    How
    India can restore moral boundaries is a difficult issue, but it
    certainly won’t be solved by electing Modi to higher office — even if
    he were Adam Smith himself. Protesters shouldn’t just seek justice against the six accused in New Delhi. Modi, too, has much to atone.

    (Shikha
    Dalmia is a contributor to Bloomberg View and a Detroit-based senior
    analyst at Reason Foundation. The opinions expressed are her own.)

    To contact the writer of this article: Shikha Dalmia in Detroit at shikhadalmia62@gmail.com.


    Teesta Setalvad
    ‘Nirant’, Juhu Tara Road,
    Juhu, Mumbai – 400 049

    http://teestasetalvad.blogspot.com/http://www.cjponline.org/
    http://www.gujarat-riots.com/
    http://www.sabrang.com/

    [Reply]

  • BSS

    So you’ve now come here to display your rank ignorance! Nice!!

    [Reply]

    Sumit Bose Reply:

    @BSS, peddlers of darkness run scared of illumination! I dont know in which millennium you have arisen from, to presume that your “madrassa brainscrub” is the only education worth having!

    [Reply]

    BSS Reply:

    I KNOW that my madarsa brainscrub is the only education worth having. I am especially convinced after picking your lies apart in the other thread. You were fumbling without anything to answer back! Learn something at your RSS shakha. Don’t they teach you anything apart from bomb making? :P

    [Reply]

    Sumit Bose Reply:

    Bomb making and becoming martyrs as ‘human bombs: are all the hall-marks of the madrassa brainscrub.Your ’secular” education is a squandered resource, it would have enriched the life of one motivated to improve oneself or society, but with that resource wasted by you , it will only be put to the use of pseudo- arabs and anti-nationalists. Besides, I have never advocated anything in favour of the RSS, RSS are not the only people in the country firm about making our Bharat stronger and better.

  • agnivesh

    ndia’s Narendra Modi and the Tale of Two Rapes

    By Shikha Dalmia Jan 17, 2013 7:42 AM PT

    http://www.bloomberg.com/news/...

    One of the most obscene moments after the death of the gang-rape victim in
    New Delhi was a tweet by Narendra Modi, the chief minister of the Indian state
    of Gujarat, offering regret and condolences to the dead woman’s family.

    Modi,
    who has quelled restive minorities by allowing attackers to
    subject
    women to unspeakable horrors, has done more than any man to numb
    his
    prudish country to sexual violence. Yet he was elected to a third
    term
    last month and is the presumptive front-runner of the Bharatiya Janata
    Party, the main Hindu opposition party, for prime minister in next year’s
    national elections.

    So
    long as Indians keep rewarding politicos such as Modi, the
    country’s
    collective outrage after the New Delhi case won’t change the
    culture that makes such atrocities common in India.

    The attack on the 23-year-old physiotherapy student was depraved.
    Five men
    and a teenager in a private bus are accused of kidnapping,
    beating, raping
    and violating her with an iron rod — and then dumping
    her and her
    semi-conscious boyfriend on a highway, where they also
    allegedly tried to run
    her over. But as monstrous as this crime was,
    consider what happened in
    Gujarat in February 2002, a few months after
    Modi assumed office.

    Organized
    bands of well-armed Hindus — some from groups tied to Modi’s
    party –
    fanned across the state seeking revenge against Muslims for
    allegedly
    burning a train full of Hindu pilgrims a few weeks earlier. The
    Hindu
    rioters systematically sought out and destroyed Muslim homes and
    businesses, killing more than 1,000 people.

    Extreme Violence

    Muslim women were singled out. According to many Indian and foreign sources,
    including a Human Rights Watch account and a report by
    an international
    research team called “Threatened Existence: A Feminist
    Analysis of the
    Genocide in Gujarat,” women were stripped, gang-raped,
    often publicly, and in
    almost all cases then burned or hacked to death.

    The
    reason the violence reached such extremes was that the state
    police
    stood back and didn’t intervene to stop the Hindu attacks and even
    told
    victims that it couldn’t protect them. As if the bloodletting
    wasn’t
    horrific enough, Modi subsequently dismantled the shelters constructed
    by private organizations for dispossessed Muslims, calling them “child-breeding
    centers.”

    Compared
    with the New Delhi rape, which has triggered a protest movement
    in
    India calling for the castration and execution of the suspects,
    the
    Gujarat rapes and pogrom elicited barely a whimper. Many Hindus
    either
    deny that the horror even occurred or, if they accept it, claim
    it
    wasn’t as grisly as news accounts suggest. And if they believe
    the
    accounts, they say Muslims had it coming. Fewer than 100 out of
    the
    thousands accused — among them only one state minister and one Bharatiya
    Janata Party leader — were convicted,
    and that was a decade later. Modi
    himself was exonerated.

    Whatever
    public disgust there was against him has dissipated, given the
    stellar
    economic growth that Gujarat has seen on his watch. Business leaders
    and
    corporations, from India and overseas, turn a blind eye to Modi’s
    role
    in allowing the bloodshed, and praise his economic stewardship.
    His
    business backers have already managed to
    get the U.K. government to
    reverse its long-standing ban on him and to
    give him a visa. Now they are
    trying to persuade the U.S. government to
    follow suit.

    What accounts for the wide gulf in the Indian public response to the single
    crime in New Delhi and the mass crimes in Gujarat?

    On a positive side, attitudes toward women have evolved considerably
    since
    the Gujarat atrocity 11 years ago. Indian women’s aspirations
    and
    opportunities have increased, especially in big cities, and they
    are
    demanding that the governing classes keep pace and create an
    environment
    in which they are free to move around safely.

    Changed Attitudes

    After
    the New Delhi attack, any politician or even religious guru —
    no
    matter how revered — who suggested that women need to
    circumscribe
    their lives and choices for their own protection was condemned
    and
    lampooned, something scarcely imaginable when I was growing up in
    New
    Delhi (in a Hindu household) in the 1970s.

    But
    the darker reality is that the young woman’s rape and murder
    outraged
    the country’s Hindu urban middle class because it was a random
    and
    senseless act that could have just as easily victimized their
    daughters.
    Not so with attacks on the Muslim women in Gujarat. The
    premeditated
    and programmatic violence against them meant that the broader
    Hindu
    majority was insulated from it. If the New Delhi woman’s fate made
    every
    Indian feel more
    vulnerable, the attack on the Muslim women made
    Hindus feel more secure.

    There
    are other reasons for India’s apathy toward Modi’s misdeeds. India
    is a
    democracy and has its share of human-rights activists and
    watchdog
    groups keeping an eye on government brutality. Yet the public at
    large
    has little appreciation of the dangers associated with overly
    muscular
    government. Indians complain constantly about government dysfunction
    and
    corruption. Yet they have little compunction about giving
    draconian
    powers to their rulers in the name of security. The upshot,
    tragically,
    is that Indians care less about state-fueled rape than when
    perpetrated
    by individuals.

    The
    scale of the sexual violence in Gujarat was unprecedented in India.
    But
    smaller episodes are a matter of routine. The Indian army has been
    accused of using rape as
    a weapon to crush secessionist movements in Kashmir
    and Manipur. After
    one particularly heinous case eight years ago, Manipuri
    women stripped
    naked and stormed the army headquarters with placards
    plaintively
    protesting: “Indian Army Rapes Us.”

    Tolerating
    sexual violence for any purpose erodes the overall stigma
    against it,
    opening a moral space where hoodlums can run amok. The lack of
    national
    outrage against the mass rapes perpetrated under Modi reduces their
    true
    cruelty, breaking down the psychological walls that would at
    least
    prevent nonsociopaths from going on a rampage. Hindus who turn a
    blind
    eye to the rape of Muslim women can’t ultimately protect their own.

    How
    India can restore moral boundaries is a difficult issue, but
    it
    certainly won’t be solved by electing Modi to higher office — even
    if
    he were Adam Smith himself. Protesters shouldn’t just seek justice against
    the six accused in New Delhi. Modi, too, has much to atone.

    (Shikha
    Dalmia is a contributor to Bloomberg View and a Detroit-based
    senior
    analyst at Reason Foundation. The opinions expressed are her own.)

    To contact the writer of this article: Shikha Dalmia in Detroit at shikhadalmia62@gmail.com.


    Teesta Setalvad
    ‘Nirant’, Juhu Tara Road,
    Juhu, Mumbai – 400
    049

    http://teestasetalvad.blogspot...
    http://www.gujarat-riots.com/
    http://www.sabrang.com/

    [Reply]

    Sumit Bose Reply:

    Teesta, Your “selective outrage” is disgusting. For all your activism for justice, One never gets to hear anything done by you for the over 350 Hindus who dies in the same post-Godhra riots. We have no news of how many women were raped how many houses and businesses burnt. Hindus are not taking our pseudo-secularists on “tours” to exhibit their wounds as beggars. Hindus who had to escape from newly created Islamic republic of Pakistan, came quietly and went about with the serious business of rebuilding their lives, not living in the fringes of the newly created Islamic republic of Pakistan to become human bombs to attain martyrdom and get “married” to 72 virgins.

    As there has been no Arab or English-media sponsorship of Hindu “suffering” during the post-Godhra riots, there has been a total ‘black-out” of the rape and deaths of Hindus. Not one main-stream news source published any report or article that brought to the public domain the killings, rapes and vandalism on Hindus. you have proved your blatant partisanship by not bring to justice a single killer of the many Hindus who died or was raped then

    There have been thousands of violent incidents in post-partition India and almost all are “erupt” as people come out of Friday congregations. We “coward” Hindus have learnt to take the brunt of these vandals, till the police “receive” orders to restore law and order and this always suspiciously, coincides when Hindus have banded together to defend and retaliate.

    If NM has backers in USA , why does that get your “goat”? Al-Qaida, Osama Bin Laden, Hafeez Said, Owaisis, all have their backers for their agendas. NM’s agenda is development and ones geared to that will back him for his track record, period.

    While rapes in Manipur seem to be genuine and does need to be addressed, rapes in Kashmir are total fabrications, inquiries after inquires have not been able to match the fantastic claims of the islamic jihadis. I recall with bemused wonder, a telecast of one grieving father of a “stone-thrower” , killed by police bullets, saying that his son was not doing anything, he had only gone to get some milk! This is wonderful as Mohammad Atta’s father ( the main leader of the 9/11 gang) screaming vociferously on CNN a day after, that his son was alive and he had spoken to his son just 4 hours ago, swearing obscenities on USA. This is in no way any effort to “trivialize” the personal grief each of these fathers had to contend with, but to invert the personal grief into a political move is reprehensible and must not be tolerated or encouraged, and that is precisely what you have been at for years!

    [Reply]

    engrich Reply:

    u are bloody liar.all ur argument are bullshit bunch of lies and untruth.dont require any awnser.

    [Reply]

    vanchoo Reply:

    u are bose means kayasth.kayasths are illegimate sons of brhmn.ur mothers were raped brhns.u have slave blood write non sense for money.

    ur forefathers were boot polishers and a$$ lickers of british empire.

    u and ur bitish masters converted sonar bangla to bhootbanla.still u are showing ur ******* to them for few dollars.

    [Reply]

  • Anonymous

    This Zia guy has all the attributes of to-be-terrorist. No wonder he was refused entry in US.

    Shame on HT for employing a Jihadi as journalist.

    [Reply]

  • engrich

    http://www.opinion-maker.org/2013/01/why-the-palestinian-diaspora/

    good article by allen hart.read and take knowledge.u bengalee are myopic self centred highly rascist community.

    [Reply]

  • peace

    Such a nice piece of literature. Beautiful poem. Surprised to see the comments section, no wonder how intolerant indians are!! Hindu or muslim killing innocent civilians is an inhumane act!

    [Reply]

    engrich Reply:

    few of them like idiot bose is paid.otherwise indians are tolerant.but there are hindu zoinist like christian zoinists.they are brhmnst.they are expert in lying moulding the facts.they follow their old scripture which is as follows,

    Brahmin punishment to shudras
    Christening:
    Good and auspicious names should be given to the Brahmins only.
    Kshatriyas should be given names connoting braveness and valour.
    Vaisyas’s name should be based on articles.

    Sudras alone should be given names meaning disgrace and
    degradation. Further the word “Dasan” should be the suffix for all the
    sudra names. (Chap.2, S.31 and 32).

    A Brahmin’s “Poonul” (thread) should be made of cotton. Khatriyas
    Poonul should be made 3 of janappa threads. Vaisyas Poonul should be
    made of goat’s hair. (Chap. 2.S.44).

    Pigs & sudras: Any eatable article becomes polluted and unfit for consumption when:

    (1) A pig dashes against, (2) hens and **** fly over, (3) when a dog looks at, (4) when a sudra touches. (Chap.3.S.241).

    Any one, who offers anything eatable to a sudra after the ceremony
    will go to hell. Such a fool will be punished there. He will have to
    live there upside down. (Chap.3.S.249).

    If the Brahmins happen to eat anything that has been tasted or
    touched by a sudra, that Brahmin should have intercourse with his wife
    that night and the dead will live in the motion of the wife for a month
    (Chap.3.S.250).

    There are seven varieties of sudras:

    (1) He who retreats in a war. (2) A prisoner in a war. (3) One who
    serves a Brahmin out of devotion. (4) Son of a prostitute. (5) One who
    is purchased. (6) One who is adopted. (7) One who is a traditional
    worker. (Chap.8.S.415).

    Duties of the sudra: A sudra worships a Brahmin either for
    salvation or for his livelihood. It will be a good thing for him if he
    calls all others inferior to Brahmins. (Chap.10.S.122).

    As the Kshatriyas have failed to perform rituals and as they
    neglected to worship the Brahmins, they are becoming sudras
    (Chap.10.S.43).

    In any congregation, the Brahmin alone should eat first. If there
    is balance of food, that alone should be given to others. New clothes
    should be worn by Brahmins only and when they become old and torn they
    should be given to others. A sudra is entitled to receive only these.
    (Chap.8.S.125)

    It is the duty of the king to order the sudra to serve the
    Brahmins. If the sudra refuses he should be punished and forced.
    (Chap.10.S.235).

    A Brahmin could extract work from the sudra paying or without
    paying. Brahma has created the sudra only to work for the Brahmins.
    (Chap.8.S.413).

    It is the main duty of the sudra to serve the other communities
    without jealousy. For his service he may get wages. (Chap.1.S.91).

    Exploitation: The wealth of the sudra who does not perform yagna is
    to be deemed as the property of the Asuras. So his wealth could be
    plundered.. (Chap.7.S.248).

    The wealth of the sudra could be forcibly plundered. No consent is needed. There need not be any hesitation. (Chap.11.S.13).

    Even if a sudra is in a position to earn, he should not earn
    anything more than what is needed to his family. If any sudra does so,
    he may go against the Brahmins and be tortured. (Chap.10.S.126).

    Punishment to sudras: If a sudra talks ill of a Brahmin his tongue should be cut off. (Chap.8.S.270).

    If a sudra pronounces the name of a Brahmin or talks of his caste
    or accuses him, an iron rod ten inches long should be heated red-hot and
    thrust into the mouth of the sudra. (Chap.8.S.271).

    If the sudra dictates the Brahmin to do a particular thing, boiled
    oil should be poured into the mouth and ears of the sudra.
    (Chap.8.S.272).

    If the sudra hits at Brahmin’s hair beard, legs, neck, penis, his hands must be cut off. (Chap.8.S.283).

    If the sudra sits in a seat along with a Brahmin, his hips should
    be scorched or he should be driven away from the town. (Chap.8.s.281).

    like european zoinist they most blood thirsty peopl of world..through hate they make money and pauperize indians.we are 137 in living standards.while singapore is 6th.it is because of them 70%on indians eat once in 2 days.

    [Reply]

  • peace

    I love brother Zia’s columns. It seems he has in-depth knowledge of Islam. I feel sorry for all those ignorants who judge this peaceful religion through the eyes of media. These ignorants see talibans as representatives of islam. My request kindly read about the practices and teachings of last prophet(pbuh) or atleast have a look at his last sermon. Its a masterpiece.

    [Reply]

  • peace

    Also, Talibans are just a bunch of people who have no knowledge of islam either!!

    [Reply]

    engrich Reply:

    the hindu fascist are 10 times more voilent than talibans.talibans are fighting against americans.they are robbing and killing their own people and country.

    [Reply]

  • peace

    “….O People, it is true that you have certain rights with regard to your women, but they also have right over you. If they abide by your right then to them belongs the right to be fed and clothed in kindness. Do treat your women well and be kind to them for they are your partners and comitted helpers….
    Remember, one day you will appear before ALLAH and answer for your
    deeds. So beware, do not astray from the path of righteousness
    after I am gone…
    Hurt no one so that no one may hurt you. Remember that
    you will indeed meet your LORD, and that HE will indeed reckon
    your deeds…
    O People, NO PROPHET OR APOSTLE WILL COME AFTER ME AND NO NEW FAITH WILL BE BORN. Reason well, therefore, O People, and understand my words which I convey to you. I leave behind me two things, the QUR’AN and my example, the SUNNAH and if you follow these you will never go astray. All those who listen to me shall pass on my words to others and those to others again; and may the last ones understand my words better than those who listen to me direcly. BE MY WITNESS O ALLAH THAT I HAVE CONVEYED YOUR MESSAGE TO YOUR PEOPLE.”
    -Prophet Muhammad(PBUH)

    [Reply]

    Sumit Bose Reply:

    @peace thanks for your copy/paste. Did you know that there are 624 su-ras that specifically command the faithful to inflict violence on kuffurs. There are certainly a few su-ras and H@dhiths that do advocate tolerance, but rounding up on just a ***-bit of a fragment and ignoring a whole mountains of exhortations of doing exactly the opposite, is stupidity of the highest order.

    If i went on to copy/paste those, this page would run into voloumes; but please go to Ali Sina’s website faithfreedom dot org and get a full read of it all. He has authoritatively and without any spin/deception translated from the Arabic and Bukhari’s collection. M.A. Khan has translated from the authentic chronicles of each of those scoundrels who almost vaporized India, right from Mohmad of Ghori , through to the Slave Dynasty butchers , Babur ( he kept his won records:Baburnamah), right down to Tipu Sultan, how these bands of brigands/rulers brutalized and terroized Indians as an article of faith

    Disowning this and that sect is no defense from a terribly brutal terror-manual. Your faith is known by its actions and actions are far more eloquent than words can ever be. besides you are in a state of total amnesia as you do not even know that all these “jihadis” are actively following the example of just one historical man!

    [Reply]

    engrich Reply:

    right from Mohmad of Ghori , through to the Slave Dynasty butchers ,
    Babur ( he kept his won records:Baburnamah), right down to Tipu Sultan,
    how these bands of brigands/rulers brutalized and terroized Indians as
    an article of faith

    HINDU IS ONLY RELIGION WHERE MAN IS BORN UNEQUAL.

    GHORI GHAZNI AND BABUR BROUGHT THE LIGHT OF JUSTICE AND EQUALITY IN INDIA.

    YOU VEDICS NEVER ALLOWED ANY MOOLNIVASI TO GO TO SCHOOL.U NEVER OPENED ANY SCHOOL LIBRARY HOSPITAL

    UNIVERSITY.

    U VEDICS KEPTINDIA jahil FOR 3000 YEARS AND FOOLED AND ROBBED THEM BY SELLING 33 CRORES DEVTAS TO THEM.

    U ARE FASCIST APARTHEID BY NATURE AND ACTION.lie is your staple food while hate is a duty.

    [Reply]

    Sumit Bose Reply:

    @EngrichMian, you keep tom-tomminmg this same drivel as a parrot for long. “lower classes were denied education”. Wrong! Education was common and widespread in ancient India, the Buddhists were Indians and they followed the Hindu traditions and continued Hindu methods of education. They were not pseudo-arabs or pseudo-romans.

    If education was denied to 99% of the population in ancient India, how can you explain a bandit/hunter named Ratnakar from the woods become the sage Valmiki and write out the Ramayan in chaste Sanskrit?

    This is just one example.Kalidas was another, and tehre a re so many many more; but are you ever going to absorb, no, you just need to assuage your inferiority complex of being born in a terribly brutal and debased belief system; as I mentioned earlier truth is something you have no stomach for, that is the defining characteristic of an Islamic-nuthead!

    engrich Reply:

    budhdhism is nemesis of hinduism.

    give me name of one library or school built by vedics which was open to all indians.

    peace Reply:

    My non muslim Brother there are only 114 surahs. This shows your lack of knowledge.
    May almighty God guide u to straight path. As of now u r groping in dark.

    [Reply]

    peace Reply:

    Brother Bose, what do u say about mass hysteria during durga puja (idol worshipping… making idols from hands given to u by allah the almighty ) and dancing to the loud tunes of drum beats. And finally trashing the idols in river. What a waste of time, energy, natural and human resources!! I haven’t touched the topic of pollution yet.

    Anyway, I m still passing a smile to you for i’ll get reward for it.
    It is our Historical messenger’s sunnah(practice) to just pass a smile to someone as sadaqah(charity).

    Brother save your skin for the day of judgement. Allah likes those who are of good conduct. And the historical messenger has taught
    ‘the best among you are the ones who are of good morals’ and ‘the best among you are the ones who are good their families’…

    [Reply]

    Sumit Bose Reply:

    @peace, i just do not revel in the “shifting goalposts” that you Islamic-nutheads always resort to. This blog page is supposedly on the plight of dispossessed people and being a Mian, our ZiaMian is blinkered only to do “maatam” for the Arabs. But you are in Indian convert, it is a pity having resided in the Indian body,all your life, you have been so very successful in insulating your intellect and whatever you see, hear or do is strictly blinkered by the Islamic skull-cap that rests on your brains, not skull. you have not viewed dispassionately why the Hindus get into a celebratory frenzy each year.

    According to tradition, Goddess Durga was married to Lord Shiva, who resided in the celestial abode, she returns to earth ( her parental home during those 10 days each year, also linked with Lord Ram’s prayers to Ma Durga, at the outset of the battle with Ravan’s army)

    It also coincides with the time after the kharif harvest, all rural families have a fresh infusion of funds and this occasion is used to celebrate joy and life. Talents of different sections of society are pooled together to make images of Ma Durga. The prevailing mood is one of celebration, joy and exchange; a brief interlude before all get back to the grind of working for the next growing season.

    Once the celebratory days are past, the idol is symbolically and with honour sent back to the celestial abode of her husband, Lord Shiva, by the act of immersing in water. This seems more aesthetic than burning or smashing the idol created.

    I do understand how difficult is is for you to comprehend that the hands should be used to make and dress up idols, play music and beat drums etc, but you have to understand that the arms and hands are not to be used only for caravan-raiding, piercing hot metal in captive’s eyes, chopping fingers or necks of prisoners, slitting the neck of a mother breast-feeding her infant etc etc.

    Celebrations are in order not only to mark a new marriage or for slave-capturing. To you these latter examples are just what are meant to be done with your arms and hands.

    I am passing no judgement on the elevated state of consciousness you dwell in, You have never even wondered what tragedy made some ancestor of yours to kiss the feet of marauding invaders and become a pseudo-arab. You probably delude yourself in believing you are an appendage of the Quraish tribe or Persian or Turko-Asian ancestry.

    Many thanks for cautioning me of the day of judgement and about Allah. If you are referring to the same Allah that “spoke” to your “most exalted human ever” that the earth is laid out as a carpet and the mountains are placed to hold (the earth ) firm, or that the sun settles each evening under the throne of that Almighty, only to begin its journey on command from Allah…. (i can go on and on and on)…. then, i have to dismiss your “threats” as patently hollow and mischievous.

    Any entity/person that demands respect on basis of ignorance and threats is no different from a street-side gangster or hoodlum.

  • Aaloke

    Dear Sumit Bose,

    Very good and articulate comments and replies. But who are you engaging? These creatures are Islamic zombies. They have no independent brain . You will never be able to make them see light even after so much articulation. However I request you to continue writing as it is read by many other people who have brains to understand.

    [Reply]

  • rich

    Quran is a divine book. The whole world knows that everything in there is 100% scientifically evident.

    [Reply]

    Faulitics Reply:

    Hahaha….amarchitrkatha is more divine than the Arab Koran. Atleast its not as violent and barbaric as the Arab Koran.

    [Reply]

    rex minor Reply:

    I do not take you or the other riffrafs seriously, but people from your part
    of the world may. Most Indians are expert in polemics, ignorance of past history
    and have not the ability to appreciate the present nor have the foresight for
    the future. They have not the appeciation of what the arabs gave to the European
    continent at the time when people lived in our part of the world like
    barbarians, most were peasants but did not know how to till the land or irrigate
    it economicaly and were illetrates and few of the rich class were barons and
    land owners whose life was with courtisans and several mistresses, wine and sex
    on the menu and every now and then on the prowl to plunder others from their
    land and property.

    Inquisition is the term which comes to my mind which the cathlolic chuch
    embarked on against muslims and jews in Spain and the many crusades it
    proclaimed and organised against the so called Barbarian Arabs. The Byzantinian
    empire had to be defeated and the military advancement in the European lands had
    to continue until the time the Habsburger holy empire offered to pay the
    tributes to the Turkish sultan who then agreed to lift the siege at Wien.

    The inquisition of the christian church never stopped todate, within the
    christian community and outside, the jews and the muslims in the forefront. It
    was the last samurai Pope Bendict who under the influence of the evangelist
    christians of the USA and his intensive love of history books, reminded the
    muslims that the war of the clergy against Islam is stil on. It was King
    Abdullah of Saudi Arabia who paid a visit to the Vatican to remind the Benedict
    sixteen that he is also the head of the state and should use common sense if the
    intellect cannot keep up with his age and failing health and he should
    concentrate on reforming his institution as well as perform his missionary
    obligations to sprea the word of God in the world of non-believers. He warned
    him that the society will not survive as we are used to if God, the creator is
    no longer in the middle of our communities. The social gaps without the belief
    shall widen and so on. The Pope was invited to Istanbol, where he prayed
    together with the muslim Priest in the blue mosque, thereby taking a step
    towards reconciiation.

    The unending story goes on

    [Reply]

  • Sumit Bose

    @peace, devoid of substance and logic, you are doing exactly what all other Islamic-nutheads do, prompted by your “most exalted human ever”…to curse! While fountain-heads of other religions as Chr1st or Buddh@ or Swami Vivekananda blessed all people..believers or non-believers; your fountain-head is on record to curse dogs, pigs, even entire tribes of humans. Following in his wake, you have resorted to “cursing” ; why, because you cannot marshal any ‘lies” or honest facts to second your debased ideology of ignorance wrapped in terror.
    Death is certain, not only for all living creatures, even for planets, universes and constellations. In our world view, death is release from the misery of this life and in this birth, the “holocaust” on Hindus by a very brutal band of ignorant supremacists and their remnants, as yourself and your ilk has been a very painful realization.

    Please clean up the mirror of your perception and please desist from “cursing” there is a saying in the Bengali language: The cow does not die on curses from the vultures”.

    [Reply]

  • Sumit Bose

    @peace, devoid of substance and logic, you are doing exactly what all other Islamic-nutheads do, prompted by your “most exalted human ever”…to curse! While fountain-heads of other religions as Chr1st or Buddh@ or Swami Vivekananda blessed all people..believers or non-believers; your fountain-head is on record to curse dogs, pigs, even entire tribes of humans. Following in his wake, you have resorted to “cursing” ; why, because you cannot marshal any ‘lies” or honest facts to second your debased ideology of ignorance wrapped in terror.
    Death is certain, not only for all living creatures, even for planets, universes and constellations. In our world view, death is release from the misery of this life and in this birth, the “holocaust” on Hindus by a very brutal band of ignorant supremacists and their remnants, as yourself and your ilk has been a very painful realization.

    Please clean up the mirror of your perception and please desist from “cursing” there is a saying in the Bengali language: The cow does not die on curses from the vultures”.

    [Reply]

  • Faulitics

    Next article from Zia will be “Egypt 2012, a poem” where he will praise the righteous nature of the Muslim brotherhood and how they islamic ally won “freedom” for Egypt from the “Zionist oppresser” Mubarak . Haha..One thing I am sure of is there won’t be one word about his ummah “brothers” turning into tools of the jaya amma government against an actor, one of the few who really worked to be called an “actor”.

    [Reply]