End of BJP’s victimhood game?

Must the BJP reinvent itself to become a centrist alternative to the Congress? For over a decade now, the saffron party has lived with regional groupings by obfuscating its core Hindutva ideology. But the mask comes off during election time, as it did after Varun Gandhi’s hate speech and closer to the voting date in Gujarat when it projected Narendra Modi as Prime Minister to the embarrassment of L K Advani and total disregard of alliance partners like the JD (U).

Even as BJP bigwigs feted Varun, Shahnawaz Hussain, the party’s sole Muslim face in the Lok Sabha, was left to fend for himself in Bhagalpur. He was in the witness box not just before Muslim voters revolted by Varun’s splenetic outburst. He simultaneously had to ward off communal insinuations unleashed by a BJP Brahmin in the Bihar government.

Shahnawaz has made it to Parliament despite the BJP, not because of it. The treatment meted out to him is all the more shocking as in the 14th Lok Sabha, he was allocated a seat behind Atal Bihari Vajpayee to remain within the reach of TV cameras as the party’s “token” Muslim face. The former Premier isn’t a member of the new House. It will be interesting to see where Shahnawaz gets to sit this time? Behind Advani, the stopgap Leader of Opposition or Sushma Swaraj, widely tipped to take over from him after a few months.

Talking of Vajpayee, his presence at the helm made the BJP somewhat acceptable to those opposed to its hard line Hindutva pitch. Many “secular” parties gravitated towards it because of the “Vajpayee magic” that’s now missing. JD (U) president Sharad Yadav wistfully spoke of it the other day while blaming the BJP’s defeat and that of the NDA alliance, on its negative campaign.

Quite clearly, the specter of Hindu victim hood the BJP choreographed over the years around the Ram Temple movement, the Kargil war, the terrorist violence and the so-called Muslim appeasement, has lost its appeal among the middle classes. In Maharashtra it lost to the Congress all million plus cities barring Aurangabad and Amravati.

Caste, religion, language and region are relevant. It’s just that voters’ now combine aspiration with identity. That’s where the Congress’s trinity of Manmohan Singh, Sonia Gandhi and Rahul scored over the BJP’s bhajan mandali— or call it the Ramlila brigade if you like.

Moral of the story: The BJP needs a new identity. And the knowledge that family surplus counts as much as the family surname.

(8 votes, average: 3.5 out of 5)

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Posted by Vinod Sharma on Monday, June 1, 2009 at 9:28 pm
Filed under india · Tagged centrist alternative, hindutva, negative campaign, saffron party, shahnawaz, sharad yadav

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Right. But it’s not easy. BJP is RSS ka bachcha. Of the over 150 ministers in various state governments, the BJP has just one Muslim minister–in Yeddy’s Karnataka govt who is in-charge of Muslim affairs. It has to open up and be more inclusive.

[Reply]
Gaurav Tiwari

BJP has done a great deal of harm to ‘Hindu’ word by making it a hate word for other religion. Secularism also means equal treatment to all religions. BJP needs to understand Hinduism and its teachings in true sense. Identity also includes once culture whose practices are largely driven by the caste and religion. Representing a catse or religion in democracy is no crime, but it doesn’t means disparaging other religion. Ultimately, we all are in a race where no one needs to lose for us to win.

[Reply]
vinod Reply:
June 2nd, 2009 at 3:15 pm
Well said Gaurav. I sincerely feel the need of two centrist parties in our country so that we do not support the Congress just to keep out another, the BJP, for its exclusive character. India needs an Opposition party that strengthens its social fabric and keeps the Congress on its toes. Hope the BJP is be able to free itself from obscurantist thoughts to reinvent itself as a modern political force.

[Reply]
mks Reply:
June 2nd, 2009 at 9:40 pm
People have come a long way from voting in a simplistic manner, today’s voter is asking innovation. If we look at things as they stand every party which comes to power executes through a system which is already existing. BJP has alleged that congress did not act against terrorirsm and congress has replied back in equal measures. But if we replace the BJP govt when the hijacking of Indian airlines to Kandhar took place , what do you think the congress govt would have done and similarly if we replace the congress govt at the time of Mumbai attack what action a BJP govt would have taken. Exactly what the other did, because that is what is enshrined in the system. You can fool a person once not every time. We got to be innovative, we are riding upon most of the british system .

BJP should realise that hindutva is not the shortcut to power as the congress realised that the word Gandhi is not the shorcut to success, even Gandhis worked very hard to get the congress this far in this election, so it would be good for BJP that it gets it act right and bring in people who could innovate some kind of innovation into governance of this country and not by childishly opposing issues like nuclear deal which BJP in the heart of its heart supports. Be honest and sincere it takes time for the voter to come to your side but he looks for a hones and faithful leader and not drum beaters.

[Reply]
atul sehgal

this letter was sent by me to Sh. L.K.Advani before elections. I am appending it below.

what BJP needs to doMonday, 30 March, 2009 16:04
From: “atul sehgal” View contact detailsTo: “LK ADVANI” , “shekhar gupta” , “satprakash rana” Cc: “gobind aggarwal” , “kapil bhatia” , “chaitanya” , “ravi harjai” , “mohan sethi” , “satish thareja” … moreBcc: HinduThought@yahoogroups.comWhat BJP needs to do……………

The present elections in India are probably more crucial than any of the preceding general elections. First, these are being held in an atmosphere of global economic meltdown and secondly the present time is witness to a situation where no political party or a coalition front expects to get a majority. Another important feature of the present situation is that all combinations of central government have been tried and tested in the past except a single party BJP Government. We have seen Congress Governments, Janata Party Government, Congress led coalitions, BJP led coalition and Janata Dal led coalition but we have not yet tasted a BJP Government at the centre.

Let us for a moment forget that BJP is a perceived communal outfit and is a touch-me-not for Communists and parties like RJD, SP and BSP.

Why do the above parties call BJP communal when BJP actually has Muslims, Dalits, Christians and persons of variegated caste profiles in its rank and file?

Why is BJP labeled ‘communal’ when it actually is more secular than Congress which has a record of pseudo-secular policies and actions and and also more secular than regional parties who are parochial and opportunistic?

Because it (or its mother organization RSS) uses wrong terms —Hindu, Hindutva and Hindu rashtra in its operations.

Hindu is the most secular and tolerant citizen of the world; Hindutva is the cultural current of the larger Indian nation (Hindusthan) of peoples set across the Hindukush mountains and Sindhu river.

But these terms are wrongly understood by 80 percent of the Indian population and the world at large.

Let BJP abandon the use of terms Hindu, Hindutva and Hindu rashtra.

It should highlight the superiority of the NDA regime ( 1999-2004) marked by controlled inflation at consumer level, better relations with Pakistan and SAARC countries, far better condition of agriculture and farmers, stable rupee and economy compared to what was witnessed during the UPA rule ( 2004-2009).

The notable achievement of UPA regime has been the increase of money supply in the economy by legalizing black money , getting it invested in share and real estate markets and making property unaffordable to common man. It has wrought havoc on agriculture which is the traditional mainstay of our economy as indicated by its negative growth rate and the bourgeoning number of farmer suicides. Its other achievement has been creation of fear – psychosis in citizens because of increase in crime, corruption and terrorist violence.

The only reason that turns the average Hindu or minority Indian from BJP is its perceived communal color which is primarily due to its use of the terms Hindu, Hindutva and Hindu rashtra.

Let BJP go it alone in this election, using the terms Bharatiya, Bharat and Bharatiyata instead of the above terms.

It will come out triumphant either alone or as a coalition leader drawing upon the support of third front constituents or the Communists.

Atul

[Reply]
Singhi KJ Reply:
June 2nd, 2009 at 9:41 pm
OK the BJP needs to learn a lot of lessons. But did Congress really win these elections? Something to ponder?

[Reply]
tasneem Reply:
June 3rd, 2009 at 12:04 pm
I dont think Varun Gandhi really hates Muslims. Why should he…he has no reason to…..they have done him no harm…he himself is not a Hindu technically speaking neither is his ,mother. I personally know that his mother had quite a few Muslims working in her staff. Varun’s venom against Muslim was because of his identity crisis and his desire to be part of politics. He knows Congress is not even an option for him. That leaves BJP and what better way to be a part of it than Muslim bashing. That is the perception of BJO amongst people who want to be part of it so imagine how common man perceives them. And common man is not interested in religion…they want economic growth. Ask how many young Hindus would refuse a job at Wipro..a company owned by Muslim. BJP needs to wake up to this reality

[Reply]
M.shahid Kamal Reply:
June 3rd, 2009 at 10:02 pm
I admire Mr Vinod Sharma’s determination and efforts in his noble cause of bringing Pakistanis and Indians togather however it can not ever happen unless People from both countries are allowed to travel freely and meet each other although I understand present climate but these restrictions were imposed in 1948. As a Pakistani American I want to share an interesting encounter which I had recently in Indian visa granting office at san francisco USA. American citizens can normaly get indian tourist visa for ten years multiple entry so I recently decided to apply after completing all formalities as mentioned on the web site. I am a Physician living in USA for last 15 years. When My turn came in line an Indian lady looked at my US passport and noted my place of birth as Pakistan.She immediately asked me to get out of line and wait. After waiting half an hour I apprached her again asking what’s the matter She asked me if I hold dual citizenship and if I did iam not allowed to apply on Us Passport and must apply on Pakistan passport. when I asked her why they did not put this on thier web site her reply was we don’t put such thing on our web site. I asked her what if I have renonced my Pakistani citizenship and only have us Passport her reply wasd the you can get six months vias but you need your bank statement,hotel resevation in India anad an affidavit that you have renonce your Pakistani citizenship. In these circunstances I don’t know how India and Pakistan can come togather

[Reply]
Nikhil Reply:
June 7th, 2009 at 1:00 am
M. Shahid Kamal,

The visa regime in India and Pakistan is metered with limited access for citizens from across the borders. It’s unfortunate but a reality of the times. But, India is not alone. Many countries have strict visa regimes for its citizens visiting Pakistan. The UK closely monitors travel of British citizens of Pakistani origin after terror links were traced to Pakistan. Post Mumbai attacks, the US mandated the British citizens of Pakistani origin to go through its visa process if they wanted to enter the US.

Shyam Sethi Reply:
June 21st, 2009 at 6:11 pm
I entirely agree with Vinod Sharma. If the BJP wants to come back as a credible political force and retain the support of at least a few amongst its present allies, it has to genuinely renounce Hindu fundamentalism . Otherwise it faces an increasingly bleak future.
2 .Though the writer has not touched upon the question of whether the RSS also needs to rethink its programmes and policies , it is clearly important that the RSS also introspect on its past and review its future course of action. I feel that in the interest of Hindu society and the country as a whole, the RSS should turn away not only from “Hindutava” but from politics of all kinds, re-inventing itself as ‘ a movement to reform Hindu society and cleanse it of the various impurities that have corrupted it ‘.Over the last few centuries, Hindu society has been increasingly plagued with a host of social evils and Hinduism has lost its spiritual core, degenerating into ritual, dogma, superstitious practices, etc.
3.Of all the social evils afflicting Hindu society today, we all know that the centuries-old dowry practice is the most pernicious. It is inflicting terrible suffering on millions of middle class families, causing torture, suicides, burning and “dowry deaths” of young brides; break- up of thousands of marriages; female feticides; lop-sided ratio of female and male child births; etc.(The dowry practice is also the main factor behind the corruption rampant in India).
4. The caste system is the no. 2 on the list of our social evils. By dividing Hindus of one caste—particularly the Dalits – from others, the caste system has caused greater harm to the Hindus than our worst enemy could. In many rural areas, the Dalits are ill-treated, segregated, and cannot draw water from the community wells. They are even denied entry into some “Hindu” temples.
5. Other practices like child marriages ,disapproval of widow-remarriage, devadasi system ( deity-sanctioned prostitution), Sati glorification – though confined to particular areas or states–are also giving Hinduism a bad name.
6. Finally, these social evils have been flourishing – despite being banned under the law—because of the absence of any reform movement in Hindu society dedicated to eradicating these and similar other practices. It is high time, therefore, that the RSS fills this gap by transforming itself into” a movement to reform and re-juvenate Hindu society”.

SHYAM SETHI

Indian Reply:
June 23rd, 2009 at 2:47 pm
Mr. Shyam,

I do agree with some suggestions regarding the needs in the Indian society. However, RSS does all of what you said and more. Perhaps you should do some research before commenting.

It is the largest NGO in the world. It reaches all sites of calamities in India before anyone else and provides the maximum relief work at times even more than the army. Eg. Gujarat earthquake where 35000 workers were helping out, tsunami, bihar floods, etc – and no, they do not care what the affected people’s religion is. They run 1 lac plus schools in tribal and rural areas. They adopted 100’s of children in strife ridden kashmir – most of them muslims. They are the only non-govt. organization to be felicitated at republic day for outstanding services in war efforts during indo-china war. The felicitator was non other than nehru himself.

Second – read wikipedia for hindutva’s definition. It will clarify a lot of your perceptions. Neither RSS nor anyone else needs to abandon hindutva. It is an inclusive idealogy and infact has nothing to do with religion. It is all about the indian ethos and culture and nationalism.

The greatness of Hindu religion is that it evolves. Casteism, discrimination etc are evils that have creeped in. But it is also true that as a religion we have recognized it. people like dayanand saraswati, vivekanand, gandhi, etc have sought to remove of these ills. There is much more to be done, but progress is being made. Urban India today is moving rapidly away from these ills. It is a slow process but the direction is there. Organizations like RSS aid in the process and that is one of the reasons they focus only on nationalism because it removes other identity issues and acts as a unifier.

Shikha Reply:
June 24th, 2009 at 4:51 pm
Indian,

You are spot on here. Actually the question is not about checking the facts related to RSS. The question is why people like Shyam Sethi are not aware of what RSS does to reform Hinduism? For that matter , how do we know anything that is happening around us? It is through media. It could be awareness related to corruption, awareness related to dowry, health, nutritional facts, sports etc. Why did media never bring to the fore what RSS does? And at the same time, why did the psuedo-secular media never bring to the forefront that people like Salman Khurshid have defended SIMI? Why does our media do selective reporting?

The reason why I have raised the polygamy issue in Muslims is because that exposes the double standards of media. What kind of peace and harmony are we trying to promote by supporting such laws exclusively for the Muslims? Vinod, you may argue that such things in a democracy are solved by education. Sure education helps. But then isn’t that the same for untouchability, dowry practices? Then why do we have laws against dowry and untouchability?
The fact is that the laws act as a deterrent for a society. It is a message to the citizens that the nation considers it wrong.

Vinod, could you answer what kind of secularism are we following in India? I hope you are not suggesting that this communal harmony should be at the expense of Muslim women who are equal to any other Indian citizen. And please do not suggest that you reported it in one of your archives. The fact is that even if you reported it, you probably failed to give it an important space.

Indian Reply:
June 24th, 2009 at 6:04 pm
Shikha,

You make a good point about media and in reality the general public discourse in our country. Unfortunately, today the discussion on secularism – communalism is so blatantly off, that nobody wants to openly discuss it. If they do discuss it, then it is always seemingly politically correct.

It is very unfortunate that uniform civil code and Article 370 (talking about making J&K like all other states) is being termed communal. Can there be a bigger farce. People who talk about secularism and the constitution do not even know that both UCC and 370 were one of the key points within our constitution.

The other day, on an india today website, prabhu chawla suggested that what rajiv gandhi did in the shah bano case was the right and secular thing to do. It is a sorry state of affairs. Hopefully, education will help. But I think more important is honesty. Will we see more honesty in public discourse and media? Lets hope for the best.

vinod sharma Reply:
June 25th, 2009 at 10:22 am
Dear Shikha and Indian,
Kindly bear with me for the belated response. Was travelling and couldn’t spare time. Well, Indian, I have nothing to say to someone who calls the RSS an NGO. Its offsprings like the VHP and the Bajrang Dal really did a great job during the Gujarat riots—- burning Muslims alive, cutting open wombs of women who were in the family way. The unprecedented loss of property and human lives ghettoized the Gujarat Muslims, making a mockery thereby of the joint electorate system we have in India.
This is just the tip of the bloody iceberg. Books can be written on Sangh’s devious ways, most notably its expertise in bastardising debate through its minions in the Press, who subserviently accept Babri Mosque as a “disputed” structure and brand liberal democrats as pseudo-secular.
As for Shikha’s arguments, I don’t speak for the Congress or Rajiv Gandhi. But I know that India’s decision to become a non-demoniational secular state gave it a moral high ground vis-a-vis Jinnah’s Pakistan. It also lent strength to our claim on the Muslim majority state of Kashmir. I deeply suspect the RSS because its a Hindu reactionary outfi that, in my view, has sought to appropriate the spokesmanship of my community and my religion. Their big aim is to standardize thought and culture, turn hinduism into a cantonment, single out liberal hindus for character assassination and impose their vision of Indian culture and nationalism on Hindu dissenters who are in a majority. After all the BJP the RSS always backed never got more than 25 per cent vote in a country with over 80 per cent Hindu population. I rest my case.

Indian Reply:
June 25th, 2009 at 12:38 pm
Vinod,

Thank you for the response and no issues regarding the delay. We understand your hectic schedule.

Firstly, you have not countered any of the positive points I have written about RSS to say that I am lying. Please do provide inputs if what I have highlighted as positive about RSS are factually wrong. If not, then they are beyond doubt an NGO and a true one at that. It is an issue if people keep criticising some organization despite the huge body of work they do. Also, it is sad that others are ascribing motives to them. One should perhaps talk to the people who have benefitted from their actions, hindus and muslims alike.
Second – I do not condone the gujarat riots and am fully for punishment of everyone involved. But I have a problem with rhetoric. Please substantiate what you have said. You have written that some ladies womb was split open – pretty strong statement but hasnt the SIT recently said that this particular case never happened and false affidavits were submitted. Why would you then quote that example – I think this is what is hate mongering. Mistake me not, but again, I am not condoning the riots. Third – The case is subjudice but you have decided to be the judge while you proclaim that VHP and BD were responsible for the riots. Please let the court give that verdict and I will be more than happy to condemn them to hell along with you. Did you know that ordinary people, sweeper, office goers were out on the streets during the ahmedbad riots and not all were people of BD. Nevertheless, I do agree that these BD loonies need to be reigned in. Fourth, gujarat has witnessed close to 40 riots post independence. Except 1 or 2 all were during the congress rule, and BJP perhaps was a non-entity for the majority of the period. The record for controlling riots, arresting people, police action, conviction, commissions and actual deaths were much much worse for each of those 38 riots. Again, I do not condone the 2002 riots, so what if it was not even the biggest riots in gujarat. What is important is that we have perspective. The govt. could and should have done better management of the riots (doesnt matter that it was the best handled riots in gujarat’s history) but the cong. govts. were worse. Also, please ask a common man in gujarat on who engineered all those 40 riots – you will be surprised at the answer. Certainly brand the BJP communal if they induge in nonsense but it is surprising that despite the huge evidence against congress, you still call it secular. But that is an other story.

To your point on Shikha – please allow me the liberty to respond. Firstly, how does it matter if BJP got 25% votes. Well India respects the sentiments of 13% muslims and 3% christians as it rightly should, so why would you think that those 25% (who may include muslims and christians) do not represent genuine aspirations? Even congress has got only 28% votes this time.
Second – I think you are doing as much character assination of RSS and 25% of Indian and much more than they do of you. Because I do not see factual assertions, only essays. You also seem to ignore the SC’s verdict of hindutva which spells out RSS’s ideology of inclusive, cultural nationalism. They have a right to have their ideology – please do not grudge it, you have already chosen not to follow it, which is perfectly alright and your fundamental right.

Finally, I do not intend make personal comments so kindly accept my apologies if my tone appeared so. Thanks for the patient reading.

Shyam Sethi Reply:
June 26th, 2009 at 9:55 pm
Dear Indian,
Having read your postings above, I clearly see that you are in denial about the importance of the issue I raised, viz. ‘ That a reform movement is overdue in the present day Hindu society’. U are welcome to yur view. However, for the above reason and because of the tone and tenor of yur contributions, I see no point in carrying on our conversation any further. Our ways finally part here. Bye, bye.
Dear Vinod,
I hope time will come soon enough when Hindu social or religious organizations that are even now working in their own very small ways to bring about the changes discussed in my comment above will come together and that other organizations will also join them, so that they all might produce a significant impact on the situation.
I also hope that many readers of the comments above will, by easily separating the grain from the chaff, feel encouraged to support that effort in whatever ways they possibly could .
I am also optimistic —though not 100% sure — that sooner or later, the RSS will not be averse to be a part of this movement In fact I had discussed the main thrust of my comment above (viz. that RSS and other Hindu organizations should now turn their focus on the burning issues of Hindu society , like the dowry evil, etc) with a friend who has been a long-time member of RSS’s organizational set-up.( Sorry, I won’t give his name, etc.) My friend agreed that that was a good idea.
Finally, one should always hope for the best, shouldn’t one?

vinod sharma Reply:
June 28th, 2009 at 1:12 pm
Dear Shikha,
First things first. I agreed the media as an interface between readers (viewers) has performed a role that’s not without its share of aberrations. But take your comparison between Lalu’s Bihar (Jharkhand) and Narendra Modi’s Gujarat. I find it odious. Now if I write about it, am I forcing my views on an intelligent reader like you? Perhaps not. I am only triggering a dialogue or debate. You see the flip side and decide whether to accept it or reject it.
Now the RSS which, according to you, is an NGO because it runs schools etc in tribal areas. But look at the subtle way they replace temples of “bandar bhagwan” in these areas with Hanuman shrines to press their Hindutva bit among innocent tribals. The same bias— and a very dangerous one at that— comes through the text books they prescribe in these schools. The are fighting for the mind of India. These tools help them catch Indians young to push their exclusive ideology. For your information, the BJP after the election defeat is pretending to be remorseful about Varun Gandhi’s speech. But the VHP’s Praveed Togadia (a student of the RSS school) sees nothing wrong in the venom the “Other Gandhi” spewed in Pilibhit. I have heard the same Togadia (a one time pal of Modi) heaping abuses on Mahatma Gandhi during a poll campaign in Gujarat.
Is it the work of an NGO to defile the Mahatma’s legacy, plant bombs (like in Malegaon) to kill Muslims and train Sadhavi’s like Ritambhara to spread disaffection between communities? The common civil code can be acceptable. But the demand for it must come from saner elements within Muslims and other communities. Not madcaps from the Hindutva stock who want it not out of love for Muslim women but to impose on the country their pernicious cultural nationalism.

Indian Reply:
June 29th, 2009 at 5:05 pm
Dear Mr. Shyam,

Your choice to not continue the conversation is totally yours. It is regrettable, but sorry to say that you did not even bother to debate on the issues I mentioned. Nevertheless, I never denied the need for reforms in the hindu society – not sure how you got that impression. Second, not sure what aspect of my tone did you find not in good taste. If you can counter my points with your facts, I will very humbly accept and correct my misinformation. Thanks!

Shikha Reply:
June 26th, 2009 at 4:32 pm
Vinod,

First let me thank you that you to take out time to reply to our individual postings! Having said that I am somewhat pained to see that you sidestepped answering my question. Uniform civil code has been adopted in some of the most developed and respected democracies in the world. Infact its non-adoption brings shame to us, not pride.

I am also saddened by your statement “I have nothing to say to someone who calls the RSS an NGO. Its offsprings like the VHP and the Bajrang Dal really did a great job during the Gujarat riots.”Dear Vinod, I have been born and brought up in Jharkhand, formerly Bihar. By the same measure I may question one of your earlier columns that spoke glowingly of Lalu. We all know the kind of terror unleashed during his rule. Several people were burnt alive and hacked to death by Lalu’s own partymen. Many starved to death because of extreme poverty. Many got killed because of Lalu’s divisive politics. Perhaps the cries of those who bled are yet to reach you.

As far as the 25% who vote for BJP , a big chunk of those are educated middle class who can see through the media bias and distortion of the word secularism. Many amongst this class condemn Gujrat riots and would never discriminate against Muslims in their day to day life. Yet they vote for BJP largely because of ideological differences with Congress’s brand of communalism.

Vinod, we have four pillars of democracy, Judiciary, Executive, Legislative and independent grassroots journalism. Towards the latter part of the twentieth century, India saw the demise of executive as legislative and the executive became one. Twenty first century is witnessing the slow death of independent media as it tries to push its opinion on people based upon its political affiliations.
sanjay mittal

Vinodji,

I thought this blog was about India – Pakistan. Or have you too given up on the state of Pakistan?

After the release of Hafeez saeed, do you

a) Think that Hafeez Saeed has had a change of heart and become a good boy who would spend the rest of his life promoting HIndu- Muslim relations?

b) That Pakistan had no hand in 26/11 as Pakstani leaders and courts want us to believe. That this was a deeper conspiracy by Hindus and Zionists to give the ISI a bad name, after all we all know ISI is a humantarian organization engaged in uplift of moral standards of humanity.

Can you enlighten me with your views on this?

sanjay

[Reply]
me Reply:
June 3rd, 2009 at 2:20 pm
Strong strategy and good team work made congress win.BJP’S bhajanmandali wala style n wrong projection of the party made them loose even though they have good leaders in the party ,and its different issue that they failed in team building as everybody want’s to be captain an no one to sail the ship,

But Sir every party has soft corner for some or the other religion which they use at the time of elections .
I

[Reply]
vinod Reply:
June 3rd, 2009 at 4:24 pm
Dear Sanjay,
The blog’s title separated at birth is explicit in its meaning and enables me to write about India and Pakistan together or separately. With India in election mode, I thought I’d write on domestic politics for a while before reverting to Pakistan. On Hafeez Saeed your questions are non-serious. I will tackle this subject next week but will respond to your queries only when I am convinced that you really want a serious discussion on it.

[Reply]
Jasmeet Singh Reply:
June 3rd, 2009 at 11:51 pm
The root cause for India Pakistan woes is the basic tenets of Islam. From centuries , their policy has been to convert or kill.
If they cannot forego their mediveal thoughts and behave like humans, there can be no peace.
Hindus over the years have learnt the tactics of mob violence and are now pretty good at it, as we all know.
Mr Kamal’s experience is a reflection of the distrust Indians have for Muslims.

[Reply]
vinod Reply:
June 4th, 2009 at 6:06 pm
Dear Jasmeet Singhji
I think we must desist rubbishing each other’s faith. Suggest you watch the speech Barak Obama delivered today in Cairo. It will be a great idea to debate it in a civilised way. Personally I think he made a great start in reaching out to the Muslims. But as he himself admits, one single speech cannot change mindsets and stereotypes that keep us apart.

Jasmeet Singh Reply:
June 10th, 2009 at 9:02 pm
Dear Mr Sharma,
I’m not rubbishing any one.Belonging to a family of people who have lost people in mob violence in 1947 and 1984, I know what communal hatred means and its effects for generations to come.
Part of the process of reconciliation is accepting the reality and stopping to live and beleive in palaces of glass.
India has a lot of ground to cover in this aspect, but people like yourself can make a difference by acknowledging the facts and not denying them.

vinod Reply:
June 11th, 2009 at 3:30 pm
Dear Jasmeet Singhji,
Yes, we have to cover a lot of ground. And that can be done by beginning to learn to trust each other. Having pre-dilections against people of certain faiths and persuasions will not help.

Atul Reply:
June 5th, 2009 at 9:56 am
Recently I heard some BJP supporters say that the Congress victory in UP was more influenced by anti Mayawati sentiments than Rahul Gandhi’s efforts.

BJP seems to have a lot of infighting. If they have to forge a positive identity, then they should get down to work. I remember how the Jan Sangh used to have a stronhold on delhi even while the Congress had the rest of the country. They had a reputation for delivering on Governance.

BJP seems to have lost its moorings, and desperately needs to go back to its basics.

[Reply]
vinod Reply:
June 5th, 2009 at 6:14 pm
Yes there is this view that Congress gained from the negative vote against Mayawati and the BJP. To convert it into a positive vote will take and wouldn’t perhaps be all that easy for the Congress.

vinod Reply:
June 5th, 2009 at 6:15 pm
Yes there is this view that Congress gained from the negative vote against Mayawati and the BJP. To convert it into a positive vote will take time and wouldn’t perhaps be all that easy for the Congress.

Nikhil Reply:
June 7th, 2009 at 12:46 am
The Congress won, to a great extent, because of the mistakes made by the BJP. Their manifestos in 2009 were not too different. I believe the voters chose the lesser of the two evils.

There are some similarities in the BJP and the Republican party in the US. Post elections, both the parties are suffering from identity crisis, searching for new party leadership and struggling to fight the temporal influence of religion on their agendas.
Shikha

Vinod,

In some of the replies, you have made reference to Obama’s speech. It is true that attitude of confrontation does not help humanity. However, keep in mind that Obama is known to be a good orator and he says things to assuage our feelings. That is certainly one positive step. However Obama has never suggested that people from countries like Iran , Pakistan and North Korea would get visas easily. Obama would not ask govt and non govt institutions in USA to not profile people based upon their Pakistani and Iranian origin. Unlike ruling Congress party , Obama is not going to relax laws for Muslim men and allow them to practice polygamy in order to make them happy. It is ironical that the country is busy debating 33% reservation for women in the parliament when women in one community in India is lawfully expected to share their husband with two other women!

[Reply]
vinod Reply:
June 12th, 2009 at 6:09 pm
Well, yes, much needs to be done. One speech or pious thought makes no difference. But when it comes from the first black President of the US, it does herald a beginning.

[Reply]
jagtar Malhi Reply:
June 14th, 2009 at 1:26 am
I note the exchange between Mr. Sharma and Jasmeet Singh above. I think that part of the problem is that faiths exist beyond question often offering conflicing set of values to the believers. There are extremists strands within all faiths and more so in the faiths that provide some ancient code/law of life. We need to understand the uderlying causes of our social conflict which have claimed the lives of thousands over the years. Simply intellectuallising the issue and offering platitudes to faiths does not help reduce deep rooted prejudices. These need to be articulated, analysed, understood before these can be purged away . By simply suppressing the feelings of someone you can only suppress the issues and cannot begin to deal with them.

[Reply]
Indian Reply:
June 19th, 2009 at 6:52 pm
Vinod,

Obama’s speech was only and only to take care of its own strategic interests. Period. Nothing more and nothing less. While it is agreed that trying to make peace and live peacefully is a noble thought, but international geo-politics is far more complicated and also self-serving. U.S. is in trouble economically, it has problems in afghanistan and iraq and now iran. It wants to garner support from egypt, lebanon, syria etc. against Iran and also neutralize negative sentiments against itself and deny support for organizations like taliban and al-qaeda. It was an address to the arab world (read muslim world) purely and only to address U.S. self interests. Ergo, if it does not suit the U.S. to make peace, it will not. Period.

Slightly moving on a tangent, the other day, Salman Khurshid of the congress mentioned that Obama did not address the muslims of India and indirectly suggested that somehow it was kind of less than desirable. Now this is rank communalism in my humble opinion. Why does he need to classify muslims in India as a distinct identity? Can he not just respect them as Indians? Are they not Indians? We want to be careful of such utterances and more importantly such feelings. Festering identities in the name of religion and inclusiveness is blatantly dangerous and undesirable.

We are all Indians first, irrespective or our religions and all of us should live happily in our country and ofcourse with the rest of the world.

[Reply]
Shikha Reply:
June 23rd, 2009 at 3:21 am
Indian,

While your intentions might be right, I am confused about some of the observations made here.
You seem to be upset about Salman Khursheed’s statement about Indian muslims. But then what else were you expecting? Wasn’t the whole election conducted on the basis of identity politics?
Aren’t the candidates fielded as Muslims, Christians, Hindus, dalits etc based upon the majortiy population in a given constituency. So if we as Indians do not find issues with it, why do we find issues with identity statements from our politicians. Do not forget that it is the likes of Salman Khurshid and Gulam Nabi Azad who had opposed the Supreme Court ruling that required the husband of diviorced muslim lady , Shah Bano to provide her alimony. These Congress politicians oppose the implementation of uniform civil code and support polygamy for Muslim men. We still have a draconian law in India that allows Muslim men to to keep three wives legally.

By voting for Congress and suddenly feigning Indianness, I am not sure what point we are trying to drive here.

Indian Reply:
June 23rd, 2009 at 1:36 pm
Shikha,

Perhaps you did not get my point. I am saying exactly what you are saying. I do find issues with people fielding candidates based on identity rather than merit.

Nevertheless, I was also pointing out that in the name of inclusivenes, by repeatedly talking about “Hindu, Muslim, Sikh, Christians. etc., unity” we keep reminding everyone that they belong to different religions and hence “extend identities over Indianness”. Therefore, I have an issue with what Salman Khurshid said, because it appeared that he was alluding (may not be deliberate) that religion comes first and then everything else.

This applies to many other areas for eg films – A rakesh om prakash mehra film is “on your face” about hindu muslim unity. But in my opinion it only divides more than unites. Whereas a subtle portrayal which is not “on the face” like lagaan expresses Indianness over religion. My two cents.
NRI Indian

The recent election is rigged one, i don’t know why we need an electronic election need to be conducted in a term on 8 weeks or more. and the results are counted in two days.
the machines need to be validated after the election. the vote difference doesn’t make any sense people mandate is agains BJP or any other party but one thing is clear they want some change and made and not decisive of that. Ultimately they end up voting the same dynasty party.

People of India needs to knw who is indian and who is not…being friendly with india or china is impossible unless india beat them in a war and negotiate peace…one or the same as long as indian antinational congress is ruling..

[Reply]
Saif

Hi Every Body,

I would like to clarify about muslims having more than one wife. Islam only allows the man to have 2nd wife if the 1st wife allows her husband to have 2nd wife. This rule simply makes it impossible for a man to have 2nd wife as no woman will allow her husband to have 2nd wife. But if someone is not following this rule, he should be punished.

[Reply]
http://www.national-autotransport.com/ HughHaley@ Auto Transport

This car is definitely a cool car! I like mini cars so I guess this will pass also seeing the photos you have done it gives me a better view in an out of it which is such a fantastic way of doing a review. You are definitely doing a great job with your articles.

[Reply]
Ramesh Talwani

MANMOHAN SING IS WAITING FOR ANOTHER 1962. HE WANTS TO TELL HIS GRANDCHILDERN THAT AS A HONOURLESS PM HE HAD BEEN EVERY NOOK AND CORNER OF THE WORLD INCLUDILG TIMBUKTOO. AND MOMENTOS RECD ARE PROOF.
THE WORST IS TO COME.WRITING IS CLEARCUT ON WALL.

[Reply]
http://nuclearsupremacyforindiaoverus.blogspot.com/ Satish Chandra

November 18, 2011: When I say the new Chief of Air Staff, N. A. K. Browne, is a CIA-RAW man, I mean he literally sits at CIA-supplied terminals to participate in crimes against India. More than a thousand Indian Air Force aircraft have crashed since 1970, the vast majority of the crashes caused by microwaves from U. S. satellites. In his first week in office as Chief of Air Staff, Browne caused two Indian Air Force fighter planes to crash with microwaves from satellites, to give a boost to his bid to buy worse than worthless foreign aircraft for several tens of billions of dollars of which he will get a hefty cut along with the Defence Minister and the Italian woman who gets the largest cut.//

I said on October 11 ‘11 ( IndianAirForcePilotsMurderDOTblogspotDOTcom ) that the ’suicide’ of the chief test pilot Baldev Singh was murder, to facilitate the claim of the fraudulent ‘delay’ in inducting the indigenous Light Combat Aircraft, being used to justify the worse than worthless purchase abroad. India builds Sukhoi-30 MKI aircraft from raw materials; why do you need to buy fighter aircraft from abroad?//

N. A. K. Browne, A. K. Antony and the Italian woman should be booked for the murder of Baldev Singh along with the head of RAW. All former heads of RAW should be booked for the murders of hundreds of Indian Air Force pilots.//

The murders of several politicians by air crash have also been accomplished by microwaves from satellites. A recent example was the murder of the Andhra Pradesh chief minister by air crash. In my blog I have described how Indira Gandhi when prime minister in 1980 went to her kitchen with the then U. S. Vice President and former CIA Director, George Herbert Walker Bush, to arrange for the murder by air crash of her son Sanjay Gandhi who had taken to slapping her in the presence of others under my influence and the then CIA Director, Frank Carlucci, publicly claimed credit for that air crash via a letter that appeared in National Review.//

November 17, 2011: Integrated Circuit chips made in the United States are required to provide for access to the United States National Security Agency so it can monitor and take control of their operations at will. Components and electronic equipment from the United States should be absolutely “haram”; far from lamenting ‘technology denial’, equipment from the United States should be rejected even if it is offered on a platter and free of charge as I have said. India’s bought-up Defence, Atomic Energy, Space and other officials deliberately close their eyes to this threat. This also applies to U. S.- made civilian aircraft, for example. There are two hundred thousand Indian engineers and scientists working in Research & Development for foreign companies in India but instead of putting its money in Research & Development ( in my letter dated January 5, 2004 to the press — see my blog — I had suggested one million Research & Development workers in India in government-sponsored projects), India’s CIA-RAW government buys foreign equipment in all fields to keep India poor, weak and enslaved. India’s government lends hundreds of billions of dollars to the U. S. government in exchange for worthless U. S. paper but seeks foreign investment and World Bank loans for projects in India, giving ownership and control of India to India’s enemies, despite the unlimited capital available to India by simply printing the money; see ‘How India’s Economy Can Grow 30% Per Year Or More’ in my blog; as is described there, the United States has been applying my proposal about money by stealth and now also openly but Manmohan Singh refuses to do so because this bugger — a CIA appointee — does what serves the United States’, not India’s, interests.//

I had asked the Indian Army to arrest the top one thousand or so officers of RAW. It has not done so. But, as I have said, India’s nuclear forces obey Satish Chandra. He does not need India’s conventional forces or the rest of the government and citizenry to defend India which requires the destruction of RAW which will be done by nuclear means, that is, the simultaneous nuclear destruction of New Delhi, Washington and New York, with a warning that additional U. S. cities will be destroyed, with nuclear warheads already emplaced in them by special forces, if there is any retaliation. //

I am India’s expert in strategic defence, the father of India’s strategic program including the Integrated Guided Missile Development Program, the world’s greatest scientist (my biography can be found in Marquis’ Who’s Who in the World, 2011 and earlier editions) and India’s legitimate ruler; for more on the subject above see ‘What You Should Know About RAW’ in my blog titled ‘Nuclear Supremacy For India Over U. S.’ which can be found by a Yahoo/Google search with the title.//

Satish Chandra

[Reply]
Anonymous

It’s only three years of the incident and hopefully we would not forget the same in another 300 years, as we lack more important issues. We have a lot of different names of Islamic terrorist groups to blame for such incidents, but who knows whether they really exist? There might be thousands of such incidents in the past, but the coverage is given to the massacres involving rich and elite class and no one cares to talk for underprivileged dying of starvation throughout the country. Politicians were there on the seats during the incidents and would remain there forever and only difference could be of names or working location because that is the class, which has to be benefitted in all cases and conditions.

Our country and people are in not in a good state and there are lot of more important issues like poverty, inflation, deteriorating condition of roads & water supply, corruption & failure of democracy etc, which media has to raise rather than popping up same old and useless issues like 26/11, incidents of demolition of Babri mosque & Godhra etc.

[Reply]
Anonymous

A very balanced article.

It would be wrong and stupid for us to forget the acrifices our defence personnel have made.

Not to forget, the jehadis i Pakistan are being primed to attack us again…

[Reply]
Rajeev Deveshwar

It is, to say the least, hilarious reading the comments to this article. What the commentators seem to forget, it is they who elected the people in power through the “democratic process” So really it is they who are responsible for the state of affairs.No point in crucifying democracy or hinduism.The parliament is a reflection of its electorate.As a side note,India today is no different from the Roman empire during the reign of Nero, steeped in filth, squalor,corruption,chicanery, debauchery,and, perversion reaching its body and soul. It needs to be cleansed.Democracy won’t cut it.

[Reply]

End of BJP’s victimhood game?

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