Honey Singh: why he must face the music



I had not intended to get involved in the controversy over the Honey Singh concert at Gurgaon’s Bristol Hotel on New Year’s eve. Truth be told, I was only dimly aware that Honey Singh existed. But when I saw the online petition asking the Bristol to call off the show and read the tweets from Nilanjana Roy, Raheel Khursheed and others, I was sufficiently intrigued to check out the lyrics of Honey Singh’s songs.

What I found was truly shocking. I am not one of those who minds sexual references in popular culture so I was not offended by the sexual content of the lyrics. What outraged me was that one of the songs was written from the perspective of a rapist and glorified the manner in which he intended to humiliate women, to urinate in their mouths and to assault them.

I was angry enough to join the campaign, sign the petition and to tweet about it, encouraging others to sign too. I also tweeted that if the Bristol did not cancel the show then all decent people should boycott the hotel. (Which is not such a huge sacrifice, if we are to be honest…)

I know much has been said about the power of on-line protest but my conclusion, at least in this case, is that while on-line activity can force the mainstream media to take note of our views, it lacks the weight to force intransigent organisations to review their positions.

In this case, even as the campaign gathered storm and became the subject of stories in mainstream media, the Bristol refused to cancel the show. It was only late in the evening, after an IPS officer filed an FIR against Honey Singh, that the hotel finally caved in.

Since then, there has been a lot of muddled and ill-informed debate in the media about the incident. Those of us who signed the petition have been accused of moral policing, of demanding censorship and of picking on soft targets. Some of the confusion comes from the inability of the commentators to distinguish between three kinds of objections to sexual content in popular culture.

The first objection relates to ‘vulgarity’. Most people who are normally accused of moral policing take the line that overt sexual content or even sexual innuendo falls outside the boundaries of what is considered as acceptable in our society.

This objection is subjective in nature. The boundaries of what is acceptable and what is not acceptable change by the year. There was a time when it was considered almost pornographic to show couples kissing on the screen in Hindi movies. Or, to take an example from abroad, the Rolling Stones song, Let’s Spend The Night Together, was banned by many radio and TV stations in the US.

The history of freedom of expression in our society is a story of people striving to go beyond these boundaries and of others trying to prevent them. Most times, however, artists have succeeded in breaching the barricades. Nobody minds that there is kissing in Hindi movies these days. And it is hard to understand why Let’s Spend The Night Together was ever banned.

Generally, I am on the side of those who would breach the barricades. I do not see myself as a moral policeman or as the sort of person who demands censorship.

The second objection is a feminist one. It is interesting that most people who complain about vulgarity in media focus on women. The complaint is never framed in terms of why Salman Khan takes his shirt off in every movie. Instead, the focus is usually on the skimpiness of the heroine’s costume or the item girl’s pelvic thrusts.

Feminists object to the same sorts of things but they have a different perspective. They say that the emphasis on scantily-clad gyrating women amounts to a commodification of women. They argue that because popular culture treats women as mere sex objects, it promotes a society where men cease to see women as complete human beings but treat them only as receptacles for the sexual urges.

I do not necessarily dispute all of this. But I tend not to take a feminist view of life so these are not my objections to sexual content in media.

But there is a third category of objection. And it is one that I subscribe to. Popular culture must never be used to incite anger, hatred or violence. To see how offensive Honey Singh’s lyrics are just imagine that he was singing not about a woman but about assaulting a Dalit or a tribal. All of us would be appalled and would immediately demand action against him. No civilised society can approve of popular culture in which performers urge their audiences to go out and commit rape, assault or other kinds of sick violence. The problem with Honey Singh’s lyrics is not that they are lewd. It is that they are a celebration of sexual violence and rape.

The controversy over the Honey Singh song has been muddied by those who fail to appreciate these distinctions. To disapprove of a man who issues calls for rape and genital mutilation is not to function as a moral policeman or to take a feminist view of the world. It is only to ask for a society in which popular culture does not turn into an incitement to violence.

One more issue needs to be clarified. Critics have alleged that all of us who signed the on-line petition were asking for a ban on the show. We were not. If that had been our intention the petition would have been sent to the Haryana Government or the Haryana Police. Instead, we were simply asking the Bristol Hotel to desist from hosting the show on the grounds that it was promoting a man who glorified rape.

It is a sad commentary on the standards of our public life that the Bristol ignored this peaceful and civilised request but promptly buckled under once the police filed an FIR.

I could go on. I could tell you that one reason why women are routinely molested in our cities is because popular culture sometimes suggests that this is a macho and entirely acceptable sort of thing to do. But then, I imagine you know that already.

So finally, here’s my message. We are not moral policemen. We don’t want bans on all sexual content. But as citizens of India, we have the right to protest against those who glorify rape and violence against women.

And, in the aftermath of the Delhi gang rape, we would be failing in our duties as citizens, if we did not protest.

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  • Viv

    Vir, you might have heard that honey Singh claims that these so gs have not been composed by him. I believe that in the interest of fair disclosure, at least his claim, whatever may be its merit, should have been mentioned by you.

    [Reply]

    name1 Reply:

    hw is it possible that for years he sells his videos under his names n when an FIR gets registered on his name he says that he never wrote these songs. It is like Vishal Dadlani saying he never composed the music of Om Shanti Om even though it got sold under his name.

    [Reply]

    Javed Reply:

    dont you read – he didnt sell those. the production company is responsible legally

    anyways since there is no evidence whethere he penned it or not and given it is an old video ignored even then – legally the case against him will fall flat

    Viv’s point is right – as a journalist Sanghvi must abide by facts. Whether Honey singh really penned them or not – we dont know? But he is denying them now – is a fact

    [Reply]

  • vinta nanda

    A point I would like to add in your observations is that we also have to take into account the audience to which most explicit sexual innuendo is targeted to. How discerning are those people to whom most popular Indian Cinema is reaching out to, how they perceive attitudes of men and of women in item numbers and which way do they react to the lyrics and the visuals of the songs you are talking about? Basically in which way does it all reflect in their behaviors in general life.

    [Reply]

  • Deepti

    wow.. Sanghvi wants to be in the limelight by asking people to boycott honey singh… y?? because this so called track was an underground song back in 2003.. and not a public release..??

    its just a measure of people taking their stupidity to new heights .. if you see the pettitioners profile on causes you will c she is happily posing in the recent Delhi protests with a friend.. thats how bothered she is with women emancipation…

    Honey Singh is a performer.. lyrics might be atrocious.. but it came from a 20 year old at the time.. n we all know how 20 year olds behave n swear..

    get a life and do something contructive Mr Sanghvi.. like taking a pro-govt stand as seems to be the official policy of the tabloid tr@sh competitor to ToI

    [Reply]

    Desi Canadian Reply:

    are you for real?? I don’t know any 20 year olds who use this type of language. have you even heard the songs? if you can justify these lyrics you probably think that that poor girl on the bus deserved it too. shame on you. your comments seem to be targeted at the tabloid but you picked the wrong topic to take out your anger. it’s about time you grew up a little.

    [Reply]

    Javed Reply:

    lagta hain tu kabhi jawaan hua hi nahi ae uncle

    you must have spend your whole life only with geriatrics. anyways dumba88 here is something for you to ponder

    you say you dont think young ppl are capable of such filthy lyrics just because in your pathetic existence you havent come across anyone like that? well i say read news more carefully – the juvenile was in the forefront and far ahead of other adult criminals while commiting this most heinous crime

    a 20 yr old penning these lewd lyrics is a picnic in comparison. it pretty universal

    [Reply]

    Rue Reply:

    May be you don’t understand punjabi very well. Or may be you’re just dumb! Have you listened to his lyrics?!! oh or may be, you just like those things DONE TO YOU!!!! GOOD FOR YOU!!!!

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    When a Punjabi talks….looks like saying Jokes or lewd….
    So it is not their fault…..
    When they call a persons name…miss first alphabet….

    [Reply]

    name1 Reply:

    Ridiculous! if u like those songs. They are insulting n outright derogatory. I read the lyrics when all this hullabaloo started and I cud nt understand how have ppl not reacted against these yet.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Bhajan ….man …best…Kabirdas!….yr salvation

    [Reply]

    Alok Desai Reply:

    20 year old is not young. He was old enough to be sane. Such attitude are for life. Get a life girl.
    Can’t expect such views from a woman atleast. We don’t need such “peformers”

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Two ways …either castrate all….no population problem solved plus this
    OR compulsary marriage at 16 yrs of age….but then population problem

    [Reply]

    Natasha Reply:

    Seriously, the ol’ good for nothing fellows are just trying to get the publicity by pointing the gun at Honey Singh. Honey Singh is India’s best rapper and he will be more popular after this incident.

    [Reply]

    Garima Sharma Reply:

    Can’t believe the way u’re talking! just coz he was a 20 yr old, he’s excused from taking responsibility for his actions?? well, if anyone says that lyrics mean nothing, I have myself seen the youth getting affected by such ****. It was imperative to take some action about this. Its time that people like Honey Singh changed their attitude towards women.

    [Reply]

  • LK

    Vir – you have explained why Honey must face the music..fine…but can you tell us why u should not face the music on Nira Radia calls? your brother Rahul baccha and your step mom Sonia have done nothing in last 10-15 days so you may want to talk to Nira and make a conference call with them. After all everyone knows that you are a CON-gressi

    [Reply]

    Rue Reply:

    are you high on weed or something?!?!?! how can you even compare the two issues! SMH

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Free society….man!

    [Reply]

    Impi Reply:

    I bet Honey Singh thought the same!

    Har Gobind Bhukkal Reply:

    Very well said. Honey singh is r aping music and Vir Sanghvi is r aping our democracy. Both of them should face music for their respective crimes. Infact all the Queen maino’s gang should face the music for loot and plunder of our democracy and the people of India are left to face the music ultimately.

    [Reply]

    aam aadmi Reply:

    this man is paid bjp wala.I’m following his comments for last few weeks. His dirty mind is full of political shit.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Have you tried political shit?….same taste?
    You call yr self Aam? and Aami too.
    seek others opinion

  • Rue

    I’m SO glad you wrote about this, Vir. I’m with you about sexual references in popular culture. I came across the song in question some 3-4 years ago on youtube when he was still a nobody (he still is a nobody to me). I was shocked and appalled and could not believe my ears when i listened to the lyrics (they are BAD. specially if you understand the crude punjabi he uses in it). Then like 2 years ago, he became this famous punjabi rapper and all that and people went crazy on him. I was like WTH, do people not know about ‘those’ songs? How can anyone in their right mind be a ‘fan’ of his music. I refused to go to his concerts in Melbourne. And I bagged my friends who listened to his music for their bad taste. I’m SO SO SO happy that his songs’ lyrics have been brought into spotlight. I just hope he doesn’t try to cash-in on his notoriety now. Those lyrics should hound him for the rest of his life! Period.

    [Reply]

    Javed Reply:

    Even your friends don’t agree with you and do not see things the way you want to force everyone
    Why should we listen to your bakwaas?

    [Reply]

    alok desai Reply:

    So you think that the “rapist” lyrics he wrote are good for the society?

    [Reply]

    TRUE.HUMAN Reply:

    Man, can a song change the society? I mean, do u want to say that had honey singh not sang the songs, there won’t hav been any rape cases in India? Did Honey Singh exist during Draupadi time? Man, I respect women and I respect music too. Can’t you take it in musical point of view?

    Anonymous Reply:

    He should restrict to Bhajan….or Natya
    Dont eat for three days and all sex drives will drown!

    Alok desai Reply:

    A song reaches lakhs of ears and can affect thousands of curious young minds who may find this ‘cool’. So it does matter. I am an aspiring musician and I respect music.
    But every single such thing matters and you never know whom or how many it mite affect.

    Impi Reply:

    Okay..Read the article above and repeat until you understand it.

    Javed Reply:

    shows us some evidence that they caused harm. then we wont protest like sissies with candles in hand. we shall file a criminal case – something concrete

    but show us some evidence. else your emotive drivel is just hot air. It is not taking this fight against crime forward – at best it is a fruitless distraction

    Anonymous Reply:

    What is Bakwaas…other than what u blog!! Liston at this place…no audio

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    If lyrics arouse you then what will happen if you go to Seashore!!!
    where cloths means nothing!

    [Reply]

  • Suren singh Sahni

    How many politicians and police and their children are rapists and murderers VS you are barking at the wrong tree. What deterrence is in the streets when girls and women are humiliated daily

    [Reply]

  • Javed

    Of all the serious issues you have chosen to flag this softy issue. You are so lazy Mr columnist. leave honey Singh in peace and write something substantial to make us think. Not this fluffy drivel
    There are so many logical flaws with your struggling make believe arguments. What if honey Singh says in court he did not pen lyrics? Or he says the song is not written for women but on female mannequins? He will either not end up in court or acquitted. And then what will say about the damage to the cause when this poster boy target of feminist Ire walks free respectfully. Goes back to his fans even more well known. Tera to ch00tiya katt jaayega na!

    [Reply]

    Animal Reply:

    dats wot I am professing from so many days !!! U penned it well,man !!!

    [Reply]

    Rohit Reply:

    awesome comment.. instead of blaming the culture of daarubaazi that prevails in north india and punjab in particular these elitist and drunkards themselves are blaming a singer.. Please stop this.. we dont need your advice as you dont need our advice on banning sunny leone an adult star on prime time in India.. how away from reality these JNU fed columunists can become..

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    tell him…when aroused
    Apna haath Jagnath

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Tera to ch00tiya katt jaayega na! which school teacher you had…male? 2002 me Modi ke log kiye…kaat di…Baccho ko naize par uchhala…..Shaitan envied…he could not do better…

    Forget lyrics…first find these Detyas

    Bhajan soona kar …sala kab marega aur kide khayene

    [Reply]

  • http://www.alokdesai.in/ Alok Desai

    Rightly said!

    [Reply]

  • Pradeep

    He should come out publicly and apologize for what he has done so far and promise that he will try to be a role model for all the young adults. Let him do that and I will not have issues with him; thats my personal opinion though.

    [Reply]

    Rphit Reply:

    why dont you ask for an apology from the sunny the leone… why only honey singh who has more female fans than you can as fb friends :)

    [Reply]

    Javed Reply:

    I am sure he is not stupid to get dragged into what is already controversy. But you sir are certainly stupid. Of all the useful things you can demand from the govt for better policing, judicial reforms etc see what you have demanded

    no wonder such ghastly crimes happen and no fear of law

    [Reply]

  • Rakesh Kadian

    I never had this hotel in high esteem anyway. But now I have decided to boycott it as my single small step for a better society.

    [Reply]

    Javed Reply:

    I shall custom this hotel it it provides value for money. As regards better society I already contribute in a concrete way & dont believe token gestures do any good

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Brothel connection in hotel?

    [Reply]

  • Rohit

    I cant believe that Honey Singh is being made the scapegoat by a society that welcomed sunny leone as is she is the reincarnation of mother teressa.. That song is 6 years old and no one needs to take action against him now.. Its the songs like CHIKNI.. ya CHIKNI chameli, HALKAT jawani, o la la oo la laa that needs to be banned not Honey Singh alone… The feminists and men apologists who are blaming a rising star again.. Punjabi singers are just plain jealous of him .. MIka singh is singing DUNIYA MERE IS PE etc… Sunny Leone is entertaining people through Jism – 2 and you are blaming this awesome singer… I would say his songs Gabru is an awesome song.. HONEY SINGH all the way…

    [Reply]

  • Dev

    Mr Sanghivi can you highlight the awful TV serial PHIR SUBHA HOGI its notorious portraying woman Dev from Toronto

    [Reply]

  • DR, Toronto

    Dear Friend,

    Before you discuss anything this intellectual says. Please have a look the following link.

    http://www.outlookindia.com/article.aspx?268066

    After reading this you will find that you are wasting your time, discussing about what he says. These intellectuals are paid journalist without any ethics.

    And it is shame that media like HT is giving these people still space to carry on.

    [Reply]

    Anonymous Reply:

    Heard about Kaljug in Canada?….they dont care what they see at swimming pool…..
    Western europe….porno for all but no rape still….it is dirty mind!!!

    [Reply]

  • Ashok

    I believe you guys are wasting your time by paying attention to this paid journalist. If you do not believe me. Please have a look at bellow link.

    http://www.outlookindia.com/article.aspx?268066

    I am not sure if you will see my post as I believe HT is also doing censorship on post as my last post did not get published. Anyway I believe I will keep on trying as we believe in India, we have freedom of expression.

    As long as people like Lalu (politics) Azhar (Cricket) and Vir, Prabhu Chawla are there in their respective fields, India can not be on right track.

    [Reply]

  • sky mikon

    I will not buy any Honey Singh Music nor will I even download any MP3 or music in any form of his……………..

    [Reply]

  • Anonymous

    Where there is honey….there are bees

    [Reply]

  • http://www.facebook.com/drabhishekkhurana Abhishek Khurana

    when will u finally understand that my brother u were good- now u have lost it, character above talent- thoda time lagega par samajh jaaoge

    [Reply]

  • [主页]

    [主页]…

    Honey Singh: why he must face the music : Medium Term…

  • Anonymous

    Highly speculative theory
    I believe if Chinese don’t end incurssion, Chinese premier’s visit this month will be a sour one, which will set deteriorating relations on steeper downward spiral.

    [Reply]

  • Anonymous

    But that cannot be a reason to blatently intrude India’s terretory. There are many countries superior, richer than us. That does not give them a right to challenge our soverignty.

    [Reply]

  • Amar

    I LOVE IT HOW COWARD INDIANS FIND EXCUSES WHY CHINA INVADED INDIAN LAND, EXCUSES AFTER EXCUSES, VERY DISGUSTING.

    PURE AND SIMPLE, INDIANS AND INDIAN LEADERS ARE WEAK, COWARDS, ALWAYS BACK DOWN, CHINESE ARE EVERY DAY FINDING OUT HOW EASILY IT CAN BULLY INDIA AND INDIA PROVIDES EXCUSES TO HERSELF WHY THEY SHOULDN’T CONFRONT CHINESE AND GET RID OF THEM…… I DON’T THINK CHINESE KNEW IT WOULD BE THIS EASY…. EVEN LOT OF CITIZENS EVEN THIS WRITER FINDS EXCUSES WHY IT’S NOT HEAVY AGGRESSION..

    [Reply]

  • Tarun

    Times of India, Everytime I click on Chinese incursion in Ladakh news headlines on Times of India, it takes me to this webpage, (( htt*****ww6(DOT)adspdl(DOT)com/ )). Any other news links are woking fine, only Chinese border incursion in Ladhak related news lines on Times of India. Anyone else experience this?? IS IT CHINESE HACKERS’ VIRUS?? And is Times of India aware of this??

    PLEASE REPLY IF ANYONE ELSE EXPERIENCING THE SAME PROBLEM..

    [Reply]

    Anonemus Reply:

    that is an AD posting link which TOI uses to post ads on their website, it is just a technical problem.

    [Reply]

  • Indian_Abroad

    India is suffering from too much thinking
    and doing nothing.

    [Reply]

  • Indian Army

    very good analysis….India must immediately construct two helipads and move Bofors guns to the site, encircling the 40 chinese troops

    [Reply]

  • balaji

    for improving security one must look and follow bigger than self so india has look to and follow china , unlike looking at pakistan or other smallers to compare security force system and get satisfied/happy himself ediotically,

    as per security force capacity system india and pakistan are at similar stage, so that means pakistans politicians and defense forces are more intelligient or more aware towards security than indians politicians or security/defence forces….

    [Reply]

  • balaji

    for improving security one must look and follow bigger than self so india(125) has to look and follow china(135) , unlike looking at pakistan(20) or other smallers to compare security force system and get satisfied/happy himself ediotically,

    as per security force capacity system india and pakistan are at similar stage, so that means pakistans politicians and defense forces are more intelligient or more aware towards security than indians politicians or security/defence forces….

    [Reply]

  • Truly Anonymous

    We Indians basically have guts to harm our own people within our country like people from different religion, caste, and sex, but we just do not have GUTS to confront our others outside our country, be it china, dawood, pakistan. We always give the reins to rule this country into wrong hands like sonia ji, raul ji, gujral ji, laloo ji, mulayam ji, my *** ji…etc…Until and unless we as Indians dont realize that we are Indians first and then hindus or muslims or other things, we are not going to get guts to dare these situations. Jai Hind.

    [Reply]

  • Gohram Rind

    this is really far fetched to the point of hallucination…

    gawadar is close to iran not to india.. if china was looking to squeeze india then it would establish a base at karachi not almost 700 miles away from indian soil…. any geo-strategist worth his salt knows that this string of pearl thoery is a baloney..(it wouldnt hurt if you can consult maps once in a while).

    chinese investment in gawadar is for three reasons

    1. to cricumvent long shipping haul for oil through perilous waters of indian ocean . this port could also help western regions of china.

    2. china is investing heavily in mining sector in afghanistan and gawadar is short distance from afghanistan…

    (india is doing the same and developing an iranian port since investing in a pakistani port would be madness,… it would rob indian strategists of their favorite string of pearl theory…and god forbid it might even lead to greater trust and peace between the neighbors)

    3 this investment would also help pakistan develop an economically backward region. (ah .. we cant have that. can we?)

    nevertheless, if your objective was to raise the usual bogey of china-pakistan ganging up on india… then you dont need facts for that … any theory no matter how imaginary would work.

    [Reply]

  • Sumit Bose

    After reading through the hadiths and each and every Surah ,
    I would divide “Muslim liberals” into three categories. The first, and by far the largest category, consists of liars, opportunists and taqiyya; people who want to infiltrate our societies rather than reform Islam. The second category consists of people who may be well-meaning but simply don’t understand the issues involved. They are people, who have terrible knowledge or access to the brutal innards of not only the life of the Prophet himself, leave alone, the history of the conquest and the spread of Islam; or , they are ready to invert the bare facts to provide cover to this brutal cult. The third and smallest category consists of people who are knowledgeable and genuinely desire reform.The German-Syrian scholar Bassam Tibi could be placed here. I find some of his work interesting, but even he is incoherent and unconvincing in presenting the case for how a moderate Islam should look like or live like.

    Muslims during the early Mecca phase invited people to accept Islam. When some of them refused to do so, Muslims took upon themselves the right to start killing people and force them to accept Islam. Look all around the world, right from Morocco till Malaysia, this leit-motiff is yet consistent and persistent.
    There is absoloutely no difference between the Jihadis from Philippines,
    or Thailand or Pakistan, or Palestine, or Egypt, or Iraq, or Syria, or Chechnia,or Dagestan etc etc .
    All Muslims have to concur that the definition of “freedom” is identical with sharia, and that those who abuse their freedom by not living according to sharia should face armed Jihad until they do. It’s for their own good because the shariah is God-given!!!!

    What good is it to grant any person the label of “liberal muslim”
    when moderate Islam supports slavery ( there are several suras and Hadiths that state that the prophet himself was a slave trader and abused slaves), stoning people to death for adultery, whipping those who enjoy a glass of wine or beer and massacring those who disagree, or beheading for converting from Islam to any other religion?

    One question really arises about this “ghatiya Taqqiyaa” and his blurb that his “need to know” transformed into his “need to tell” and all that he is farting is at the best “ardh satya” and at its usual , just outright deception. Islam is just what Islamic societies have been doing, are doing and by the looks of it will continue to do, only a hardcore shameless person would spin any apologies for it.

    [Reply]

    Firoz Reply:

    Get your facts right. With people like you who have no knowledge on how Islam came into being are the ones who spread rumours. Go, learn, enlighten yourself with the facts and not something that you made up while shitting in the morning.

    [Reply]

    Sumit Bose Reply:

    The deletion of my post is the “political correctness” that is being abused by the Islamists, to keep under wraps their devious motives of imposing shariah all over the world.
    Firoz,, your barking is noted, but you have not had the wherewithal to find any inaccuracies in my post. All that you stated is a spiteful angry bark. Not surprising, one cannot expect more from you cutlets.

    [Reply]

  • Waltair

    Like any text, the message is a matter of perception. There is slowly developing a modern universal school of thought of what constitutes civilised behaviour and society is moving to this new set of rules. Most religious texts were written a long time ago to maintain order in a completely different society and which are in part not relevant today. These texts are now being used as a political weapon to subjugate society. Secularism is not a religion, it is tolerance. The most dangerous social criminals in the world today are those that condemn secularism. I may not like a particular religion but respect your right to practice it peacefully. No one should push their religion down anyone else’s throat.

    [Reply]

    Navaz Reply:

    Thumbs up for Waltair !!! Absolutely true!!! GREAT!!! BRILLIANTLY SAID!!! This message shall be focused into each and every extremist Indian mind.

    [Reply]

  • Bhupendra Singhal

    My dear Mr Zia Haq,

    Islam is a religion most misunderstood by Muslims only. Non-mMuslims, in general, have no business to understand their religion but rather judge them by their actions as is the case with every religion. So please don’t blame others for (mis)understanding Islam.

    As you mentioned in your article that “The concept of ‘ummah’, for example, is primarily that of solidarity among Muslims, and by extension, equality among [Muslim] men, regardless of their social class, race or colour.” This is where the problem lies. If you talk of solidarity among Muslims, which pan beyond the national boundaries (which practically is the case), is in direct conflict with nationalistic sentiments, and causes conflict with other parts of the society/ religions in a nation. Fundamental problem is that a Muslim’s solidarity lies not with fellow non-Muslim citizens but with unfriendly Muslim foreigners. This conflict causes massive bitterness especially when neighbourly foreign Muslim countries are enemies! It is in this context that non-muslims look up to in anticipation and brand some muslims as ‘liberal’ rightly or wrongly!

    For all practical purposes, I and everybody should accept that there will always be differences among religions/sects and we all do and should continue to respect that while working towards narrowing them.

    All the names you mentioned like Subramanian Swamy in your article, react to this problem. He is not a bigot but a thoughtful intelligent man though I may not agree with his views always. I will urge Muslims to do some introspection as to why is it that their status has become more precarious than other religions in the rest of non-Muslim world.

    Please remember this bitterness is caused by a vicious cycle of reactions between muslims and non-muslims

    [Reply]

  • tasneem

    Why are you assuming that Muslims who drink are not liberal..and in your words “The concept of ‘ummah’, for example, is primarily that of solidarity among Muslims, and by extension, equality among men, regardless of their social class, race or colour”..where do non muslims fit in

    [Reply]

  • Debasish

    Since you claim that Islam values can be liberal in their own ways, why don’t you argue for a uniform civil code based on humanity and liberal values and equal rights for ALL irrespective of religion, caste, creed or gender. I guess you must be aware that in India, a woman has been given equal rights to property as long as she is NOT a Muslim. Wouldn’t you like to change that?

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  • Fazal

    Vey factually correct article

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  • Maurya

    There is no such thing as a fundamentalist Muslim or a liberal Muslim- there is only a Muslim- said, Zakir Naik!!!According to Zakir Naik,only one type of muslims that is HIS type- and we all know what type he is…. Mr Zia Haq here argues the same thing, old wine, in a new bottle…..wine is haram or not is irrelevant here !
    Now Zia, if you care to answer I have a question-
    What do you call the Muslims like Hafiz Zaeed Ji, Osamaji and Kasab Jee? Can they be called Fundamentalist Muslims?- Surely they are muslims , (since they believe in no god but Allah and prophet Mohammad is his last messenger?)..So if they are fundamentalist muslims, there must be liberal Muslims too? What do you call a muslim who does NOT support the actions of fundamentalist muslims? Surely they can be called moderate or liberal muslims? But truth is as I suspect, you too believe all other people who does not agree with the REAL muslims (aka hafiz Zaeed ji) are Munafiques :) Don’t you? Accept it man. We all know your real color by now- did not you once claim Popular Front of India (Kerala Taliban) is a left leaning organisation(classic taqeeya)? Did not you claim that Burqa protects women?

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    Jeen71 Reply:

    The terrorists you are quoting are not really following the teachings of Islam as are the people of other faiths- Hindus, Sikhs, Buddhists, Christians who kill innocent human beings.

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  • Navaz

    Reading comments of extremists make me laugh. All your views would be contradictory if you were born with opposite family names. so its nothing but personal fury against each others religion. But why? is the main questions. Religion is a code of conduct in whatever way, but it is always misinterpret by counterparts and sometime leads to crime. All we need is to calibrate our self learning humanity and not religion. So instead of evaluating statistics and history better we concentrate on present and future for better outcome of next generation. BE GOOD HUMAN not good Hindu or Muslim is my humble request.

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    Sumit Bose Reply:

    The accident of birth should never strip one from the human values of respect and peaceful co-existence.
    Hindus have been co-existing peacefully, according full rights to all adherents of all other faiths.
    Over a millennium and half of Islamic rule, all over the world, bears witness to the profound intolerance and barbarity of Islamic rule and that merits no recounting. Intolerance of the muslims emanates from the verses in your terror manual.

    But, it is not just the 624 verses that exhort believers to commit violence to non-believers, but the terrible record of the life history of the most exalted human ever for one group that is instrumental for one group to be so convinced that perpetrating similar brutalities will ensure quick loot in this worlds and 72 vir gins in the next along with 80,000 slaves etc etc.
    How can members of a certain cult think straight when they get gems as this as Lord Almighty’s own command?
    4:76: “Those who believe fight in the cause of God, and those who reject Faith fight in the cause of Evil: so fight ye against the friends of Satan: feeble indeed is the cunning of Satan.”

    No wonder people all over the world are plain sick of the same cult members who have been so very successful in ridding their lands of all other belief systems, and then blame every one else for their own failings.

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  • Anonymous

    he should have hit a nail in the head of Abdul Karim Tunda instead

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  • max

    I have always maintained that, whether in the media, university classrooms or public
    discussions, there’s a lot of confusion about what Islam is and what it isn’t.

    —– confusions in/from/following the book of god, oh my god !!!!
    who is confused ? if written by god , why confusion in first place.
    – egypt wants to ban muslim brotherhood, what type of muslims are they.

    – according to book, god will judge the person, if he is good or bad,so, why do you waste time / trying to do here. (other than personal remarks on swamy ).

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  • max

    when Muslims quarrel in this way (and I use the term quarrel in a liberal way) they are only being characteristically Muslim.

    — tell that to shias killed in iraq & pakistan
    —- tell that to ahamadias killed by shia & sunnia

    —- tell that to kurds killed in iraq
    —- so killing is liberal or illeberal

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  • max

    Debate is an inherent part of Islam

    —- but on its own terms & conditions. mostly ending with peices of opponent

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  • Sumit Bose

    Zia Mian, there are legions of Taqqiyyas all around in the Islamic world and there is a very good reason,They have a very huge and important task to do. The complete turnaround of the fortunes of the Popat, from rags in Mecca (with around 70 followers) to riches in Medina, not by by honest trade or labour but by caravan raiding, hostage taking for ransom and selling slaves (captured in raids of the infidel villages).

    Likewise, the “revelations” to the Popat changed with his “successes”.

    A sampling below:

    Meccan Early Verses
    2:256There is no compulsion in religion.
    Medinan Later verses
    9:123Oh ye who believe! Murder those of the disbelievers
    and let them find harshness in you.

    Meccan Early Verses
    73:10Be patient with what they say, and part from them
    courteously.
    Medinan Later verses
    8:12 I will instill terror into the hearts of the
    unbelievers: smite ye above their necks and smite all their finger-tips off.

    Meccan Early Verses
    109:6 To you be your religion, and to me my religion”
    Medinan Later verses
    3:85 Who so desires another religion than Islam, it shall
    not be accepted of him; in the next world he shall be among the losers.”

    Meccan Early Verses
    20:103 Therefore be patient with what they say, and
    celebrate (constantly) the praises of thy Lord,
    Medinan Later verses
    2:191 kill them wherever you find them, and drive them out
    from wherever they drove you out

    Meccan Early Verses
    2:83 Speak good to men…
    Medinan Later verses
    9:5 Slay the idolaters wherever you find them

    Meccan Early Verses
    50:45 We well know what the infidels say: but you are not to compel them.
    Medinan later Verses
    9:14 Fight them, and Allah will punish them by your hands, cover them with shame, help you (to victory) over them, heal the breasts of Believers.

    The list can go on and on.
    Now Mr Zia Mian, but this is a very large topic. In short, you who has made it your (supposed) mission to “tell” is spinning outright lies about this “most exalted human ever” and the God given “terror manual”..
    You right totally off the mark when you equate Denmark with Saudi Arabia.The first mosque in Denmark was built in 1967 and there are several more all over. But putting your lies on your face is of no use, you will come back again and again with even more lies.
    But is so doing you are being a very good Taqqiyaa and can lay stake to your 72 vir_gins, 80,000 slaves, endless wines, but as a human being are a ghatiya from the gutters, whose secular education is a total waste

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  • Sumit Bose

    The happy co-existence of the Parsi, Jews and Christians since 2 millennia is proof enough for the peaceful co-existence. The “crimes and horrors” of Shudras and Dalits are primarily economic in nature, not as a result of divine instructions with bountiful rewards in a debauched after-life in a unpaid “brothel”.
    Look all around the world, Islamic societies hold the perverse record of ridding multiculturalism as a fundamental cornerstone.

    Post partition of India, Muslims of Papistan has been successful in reducing Hindus to be statistically invisible, they do not even make 1% of the population today form 28.7% of the population. And the Bengali converts were also busy doing the same, from 43% in East Bengal, Hindus are down to 7%.

    In case if you are ignorant of history, this is the most comprehensive extirpation of humans since the dawn of mankind.
    Besides, you should have the honesty to look, why Muslims are a constant source of “crime and problems” in all countries of the world, once they are over 2% of the population.
    Sameera, if you have any sense of identity, you would look to find the reason, why you are “thinking” as a Pseudo-Arab and delve into your family’s authentic history to find out what was the brutal reason for your ancestor’s conversion into being a boot-!icker of the Arabs.
    One resource would be this book, “Islamic Jihad” by M A Khan.
    It is so well researched with straight translations from the chronicler’s records of the marauding scoundrels right from Muhamad of Ghazni right upto our great “freedom fighter” Tipu Sultan, to know first hand from their own records, what terrible bestiality they inflicted on us Indians in the name of that inhuman brutal cult named Islam.

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  • Sumit Bose

    In your perverted world-view, any one who is able to show (from your own hallowed records) that your holy book is actually a “terror-manual” and your “most exalted ever” was no different from a ……, well you know what…… is a a “hater” !!!!!!

    How conveniently you have snatched even truth as a defense, from the kuffurs, hence, they have to be looted. tortured and beheaded.
    And you have the temerity to brand almost 6 billions of this planet as “haters”!
    No wonder your cult members are filled with so much hate, violence and are the scourge in almost all nations that you reside in, and are always disproportionately in almost all the developed and under-developed countries of the world.

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    Sumit Bose Reply:

    please add “convicted” after disproportionately. Thanks.

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  • pankaj#1

    Zia;
    It looks like that you want your readership back and that is why you are writing such absurd articles. Islam and liberalism?? what non sense. I can discuss any aspect of this religion, with emphasis of it being the most toxic ideology in present woorld, and its followers chanting that not even a comma can be changed in it. Faithful taking each and every word of it as supreme truth?? what an irony.

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  • pankaj#1

    So by this definition, who is a muslim? Are Pakistanis Muslims? Are Talibans Muslims?? Is there any real Muslims, who follow each and every word of Quran???
    And if any one claiming to be a muslim, as most of the pakistanis do from roof top, then, they are not fit for present century as in this century and henceforth, humanrace will have to coexist, tolerate each other, respect each other and most important, not try to spread its ideology by hooks or crooks. At present, Pakistani muslims in general and Indian Muslims, where ever they are in majority, are intolerant persons and not fit for modern world.

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